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Below the Surface is a show about what the world's best companies are doing right now to build high-performing teams. Each episode, Joelle Emerson (co-founder and CEO of Paradigm) talks with a leader who's rethinking people, talent, and culture. Conversations consider how AI is reshaping work, what hiring should look like as organizations evolve, and how to create the conditions for performance. If your work touches people, talent, or culture, this one's for you.
Kind: captions
Language: en
We<00:00:00.880> want<00:00:01.040> to<00:00:01.199> hire<00:00:01.600> only<00:00:02.399> really<00:00:02.720> great<00:00:02.960> people
We want to hire only really great people
We want to hire only really great people
and<00:00:03.919> we<00:00:04.160> don't<00:00:04.319> want<00:00:04.400> to<00:00:04.560> hire<00:00:05.120> just<00:00:05.440> bodies<00:00:05.920> to
and we don't want to hire just bodies to
and we don't want to hire just bodies to
fill<00:00:06.400> seats.<00:00:06.879> For<00:00:07.120> us,<00:00:07.279> it's<00:00:07.520> not<00:00:07.680> just<00:00:07.839> like
fill seats. For us, it's not just like
fill seats. For us, it's not just like
did<00:00:08.320> we<00:00:08.480> ship<00:00:08.720> more,<00:00:09.040> did<00:00:09.200> we<00:00:09.280> do<00:00:09.440> more,<00:00:09.840> but
did we ship more, did we do more, but
did we ship more, did we do more, but
like<00:00:10.320> did<00:00:10.559> we<00:00:10.719> actually<00:00:11.040> ship<00:00:11.280> the<00:00:11.599> right
like did we actually ship the right
like did we actually ship the right
things?<00:00:12.800> And<00:00:13.040> so<00:00:13.519> for<00:00:13.759> us,<00:00:14.080> I<00:00:14.320> think<00:00:14.480> it's
things? And so for us, I think it's
things? And so for us, I think it's
always<00:00:15.200> been<00:00:15.360> about<00:00:15.759> focus,<00:00:16.400> like<00:00:16.640> did<00:00:16.800> we
always been about focus, like did we
always been about focus, like did we
work<00:00:17.039> on<00:00:17.199> the<00:00:17.359> right<00:00:17.520> things<00:00:17.680> this<00:00:18.000> year<00:00:18.320> and
work on the right things this year and
work on the right things this year and
did<00:00:18.720> we<00:00:18.880> do<00:00:19.039> them<00:00:19.520> well?<00:00:20.080> So<00:00:20.320> I<00:00:20.560> think<00:00:20.640> there's
did we do them well? So I think there's
did we do them well? So I think there's
ultimately<00:00:21.520> like<00:00:21.760> a<00:00:22.000> trust<00:00:22.560> in<00:00:23.119> remote
ultimately like a trust in remote
ultimately like a trust in remote
culture<00:00:24.080> that<00:00:24.400> exists<00:00:25.039> around<00:00:25.439> how<00:00:25.680> people
culture that exists around how people
culture that exists around how people
work<00:00:26.240> and<00:00:26.480> working<00:00:26.960> for<00:00:27.279> whatever<00:00:27.760> schedule
work and working for whatever schedule
work and working for whatever schedule
kind<00:00:28.640> of<00:00:28.800> makes<00:00:29.039> sense<00:00:29.199> for<00:00:29.359> them.<00:00:29.840> While<00:00:30.160> all
kind of makes sense for them. While all
kind of makes sense for them. While all
of<00:00:30.400> these<00:00:30.640> AI<00:00:31.039> tools<00:00:31.359> are<00:00:31.519> great,<00:00:32.000> I<00:00:32.320> think
of these AI tools are great, I think
of these AI tools are great, I think
they're<00:00:32.960> creating<00:00:33.360> just<00:00:33.600> like<00:00:33.840> more<00:00:34.239> and<00:00:34.559> more
they're creating just like more and more
they're creating just like more and more
and<00:00:35.680> sometimes<00:00:36.239> actually<00:00:36.559> what<00:00:36.800> you<00:00:37.040> need<00:00:37.200> is
and sometimes actually what you need is
and sometimes actually what you need is
less.<00:00:37.920> I<00:00:38.160> think<00:00:38.239> we'll<00:00:38.480> look<00:00:38.640> back<00:00:38.800> on<00:00:38.960> that
less. I think we'll look back on that
less. I think we'll look back on that
and<00:00:39.280> and<00:00:39.600> think<00:00:39.840> very<00:00:40.079> differently<00:00:40.559> about
and and think very differently about
and and think very differently about
like<00:00:41.520> wanting<00:00:41.840> to<00:00:42.000> build<00:00:42.160> a<00:00:42.320> company<00:00:42.559> where
like wanting to build a company where
like wanting to build a company where
people<00:00:43.200> can<00:00:43.440> spend<00:00:44.239> their<00:00:44.559> lives<00:00:44.960> and<00:00:45.360> do
people can spend their lives and do
people can spend their lives and do
great<00:00:46.320> work<00:00:46.640> that<00:00:46.960> they're<00:00:47.200> going<00:00:47.280> to<00:00:47.440> be
great work that they're going to be
great work that they're going to be
proud<00:00:47.760> of<00:00:47.920> for<00:00:48.160> years<00:00:48.719> rather<00:00:49.039> than<00:00:49.360> spinning
proud of for years rather than spinning
proud of for years rather than spinning
through<00:00:49.920> companies<00:00:50.399> in<00:00:50.719> like<00:00:51.360> 12<00:00:51.600> to<00:00:51.840> 18<00:00:52.239> month
through companies in like 12 to 18 month
through companies in like 12 to 18 month
cycles<00:00:52.800> and<00:00:52.960> getting<00:00:53.199> burned<00:00:53.440> out<00:00:53.520> and<00:00:53.680> then
cycles and getting burned out and then
cycles and getting burned out and then
moving<00:00:54.000> on<00:00:54.160> to<00:00:54.320> the<00:00:54.480> next<00:00:54.640> one.
moving on to the next one.
moving on to the next one.
I'm<00:00:57.280> Joel<00:00:57.680> Emerson<00:00:58.320> and<00:00:58.559> this<00:00:58.800> is<00:00:59.039> Below<00:00:59.359> the
I'm Joel Emerson and this is Below the
I'm Joel Emerson and this is Below the
Surface<00:01:00.320> where<00:01:00.559> we<00:01:00.719> dig<00:01:00.879> into<00:01:01.120> what<00:01:01.280> the<00:01:01.520> most
Surface where we dig into what the most
Surface where we dig into what the most
innovative<00:01:02.320> companies<00:01:02.719> in<00:01:02.879> the<00:01:03.039> world<00:01:03.359> are
innovative companies in the world are
innovative companies in the world are
doing<00:01:03.920> to<00:01:04.159> build<00:01:04.400> high<00:01:04.640> performing<00:01:05.040> cultures
doing to build high performing cultures
doing to build high performing cultures
right<00:01:06.159> now.<00:01:06.720> My<00:01:06.960> guest<00:01:07.119> today<00:01:07.360> is<00:01:07.600> Christina
right now. My guest today is Christina
right now. My guest today is Christina
Cordova.<00:01:08.880> Christina<00:01:09.520> built<00:01:09.840> partnerships<00:01:10.479> as
Cordova. Christina built partnerships as
Cordova. Christina built partnerships as
an<00:01:10.880> early<00:01:11.119> employee<00:01:11.439> at<00:01:11.680> Stripe<00:01:12.159> and<00:01:12.479> Notion,
an early employee at Stripe and Notion,
an early employee at Stripe and Notion,
and<00:01:13.520> she's<00:01:13.840> now<00:01:14.159> COO<00:01:14.640> of<00:01:14.880> Linear,<00:01:15.680> the<00:01:15.920> product
and she's now COO of Linear, the product
and she's now COO of Linear, the product
development<00:01:16.720> system<00:01:16.960> for<00:01:17.200> teams<00:01:17.600> and<00:01:17.759> agents.
development system for teams and agents.
development system for teams and agents.
Linear<00:01:19.200> famously<00:01:19.759> hit<00:01:20.000> a<00:01:20.320> 1.25<00:01:21.119> billion
Linear famously hit a 1.25 billion
Linear famously hit a 1.25 billion
valuation<00:01:22.799> with<00:01:23.040> only<00:01:23.520> 100<00:01:23.920> employees.<00:01:24.560> Now,
valuation with only 100 employees. Now,
valuation with only 100 employees. Now,
you<00:01:24.960> might<00:01:25.040> assume<00:01:25.280> that<00:01:25.520> achieving<00:01:25.920> this
you might assume that achieving this
you might assume that achieving this
kind<00:01:26.320> of<00:01:26.479> growth<00:01:26.720> with<00:01:26.960> such<00:01:27.200> a<00:01:27.360> small
kind of growth with such a small
kind of growth with such a small
headcount<00:01:28.400> means<00:01:28.640> a<00:01:28.880> brutal<00:01:29.439> 24/7<00:01:30.159> work
headcount means a brutal 24/7 work
headcount means a brutal 24/7 work
culture,<00:01:30.960> but<00:01:31.119> Linear<00:01:31.520> is<00:01:31.680> the<00:01:31.840> opposite.
culture, but Linear is the opposite.
culture, but Linear is the opposite.
They<00:01:32.799> are<00:01:33.040> famously<00:01:33.759> anti<00:01:34.320> burnout.<00:01:34.960> So,<00:01:35.119> how
They are famously anti burnout. So, how
They are famously anti burnout. So, how
do<00:01:35.360> they<00:01:35.520> do<00:01:35.680> it?<00:01:36.400> I'm<00:01:36.720> excited<00:01:37.040> to<00:01:37.280> talk<00:01:37.439> with
do they do it? I'm excited to talk with
do they do it? I'm excited to talk with
Christina<00:01:38.159> and<00:01:38.479> find<00:01:38.640> out.<00:01:39.439> Christina,
Christina and find out. Christina,
Christina and find out. Christina,
welcome<00:01:40.640> to<00:01:40.960> Below<00:01:41.200> the<00:01:41.360> Surface.
welcome to Below the Surface.
welcome to Below the Surface.
Thanks<00:01:42.320> for<00:01:42.479> having<00:01:42.720> me.
Thanks for having me.
Thanks for having me.
So<00:01:43.759> many<00:01:44.000> questions<00:01:44.320> to<00:01:44.560> dive<00:01:44.720> into<00:01:45.439> uh<00:01:45.520> into
So many questions to dive into uh into
So many questions to dive into uh into
today.<00:01:46.560> So,<00:01:46.799> one<00:01:46.960> thing<00:01:47.040> that's<00:01:47.280> been<00:01:47.439> top<00:01:47.600> of
today. So, one thing that's been top of
today. So, one thing that's been top of
mind<00:01:47.920> for<00:01:48.079> me,<00:01:48.880> Linear<00:01:49.439> recently<00:01:49.840> waited<00:01:50.240> into
mind for me, Linear recently waited into
mind for me, Linear recently waited into
a<00:01:51.360> sort<00:01:51.600> of<00:01:51.759> online<00:01:52.240> debate.<00:01:53.280> You<00:01:53.439> know,<00:01:53.600> a<00:01:53.840> lot
a sort of online debate. You know, a lot
a sort of online debate. You know, a lot
of<00:01:54.159> San<00:01:54.399> Francisco<00:01:54.799> startups<00:01:55.200> these<00:01:55.520> days<00:01:55.680> are
of San Francisco startups these days are
of San Francisco startups these days are
like<00:01:56.079> really<00:01:56.240> big<00:01:56.479> into<00:01:56.720> this<00:01:56.880> idea<00:01:57.119> of<00:01:57.680> 996
like really big into this idea of 996
like really big into this idea of 996
culture<00:01:58.960> and<00:01:59.360> you<00:01:59.520> know,<00:01:59.759> hard<00:02:00.000> work<00:02:00.159> is
culture and you know, hard work is
culture and you know, hard work is
proven<00:02:00.640> by<00:02:00.880> like<00:02:01.119> sleeping<00:02:01.439> at<00:02:01.600> the<00:02:01.759> office
proven by like sleeping at the office
proven by like sleeping at the office
and<00:02:02.640> mattress<00:02:02.960> on<00:02:03.200> the<00:02:03.360> floor.<00:02:04.240> And<00:02:04.399> you<00:02:04.640> all
and mattress on the floor. And you all
and mattress on the floor. And you all
have<00:02:05.280> very<00:02:05.600> explicitly<00:02:06.240> and<00:02:06.560> intentionally
have very explicitly and intentionally
have very explicitly and intentionally
talked<00:02:08.479> about<00:02:08.720> taking<00:02:09.039> the<00:02:09.599> opposite
talked about taking the opposite
talked about taking the opposite
approach.<00:02:10.239> That<00:02:10.479> doesn't<00:02:10.640> seem<00:02:10.800> to<00:02:10.879> be<00:02:11.039> your
approach. That doesn't seem to be your
approach. That doesn't seem to be your
philosophy.<00:02:11.760> So<00:02:11.920> tell<00:02:12.160> me<00:02:12.319> more<00:02:12.640> about<00:02:13.520> what
philosophy. So tell me more about what
philosophy. So tell me more about what
work<00:02:14.480> culture<00:02:15.120> and<00:02:15.280> approach<00:02:15.599> to<00:02:15.840> like<00:02:16.080> hard
work culture and approach to like hard
work culture and approach to like hard
work<00:02:17.280> means<00:02:17.920> at<00:02:18.319> linear.<00:02:18.800> What<00:02:18.959> is<00:02:19.040> the
work means at linear. What is the
work means at linear. What is the
culture<00:02:19.440> that<00:02:19.680> is<00:02:19.840> allowing<00:02:20.160> you<00:02:20.319> all<00:02:20.560> to
culture that is allowing you all to
culture that is allowing you all to
achieve<00:02:21.440> so<00:02:21.760> much<00:02:21.920> success?
achieve so much success?
achieve so much success?
Yeah,<00:02:23.280> I<00:02:23.520> guess<00:02:23.599> I'd<00:02:23.920> say<00:02:24.080> a<00:02:24.319> lot<00:02:24.400> of<00:02:24.560> this<00:02:24.800> is,
Yeah, I guess I'd say a lot of this is,
Yeah, I guess I'd say a lot of this is,
you<00:02:25.360> know,<00:02:25.520> by<00:02:25.760> virtue<00:02:26.080> of<00:02:26.400> how<00:02:26.720> our<00:02:27.040> culture
you know, by virtue of how our culture
you know, by virtue of how our culture
started.<00:02:27.920> You<00:02:28.080> know,<00:02:28.160> we<00:02:28.400> started<00:02:28.640> as<00:02:28.879> a
started. You know, we started as a
started. You know, we started as a
remote<00:02:29.680> company<00:02:30.160> with<00:02:30.480> people<00:02:31.120> all<00:02:31.360> over<00:02:31.599> the
remote company with people all over the
remote company with people all over the
world,<00:02:32.319> right?<00:02:33.040> And<00:02:33.360> so,<00:02:34.000> you<00:02:34.160> know,<00:02:34.319> even<00:02:34.560> our
world, right? And so, you know, even our
world, right? And so, you know, even our
three<00:02:35.040> founders,<00:02:35.599> you<00:02:35.680> know,<00:02:35.840> one<00:02:36.080> being<00:02:36.239> in
three founders, you know, one being in
three founders, you know, one being in
Europe,<00:02:36.720> one<00:02:36.879> being<00:02:37.040> in<00:02:37.200> New<00:02:37.280> York,<00:02:37.599> one<00:02:37.760> being
Europe, one being in New York, one being
Europe, one being in New York, one being
in<00:02:38.480> San<00:02:38.720> Diego,<00:02:39.360> and<00:02:39.519> you're<00:02:39.680> like,<00:02:39.840> okay,
in San Diego, and you're like, okay,
in San Diego, and you're like, okay,
well,<00:02:40.319> there<00:02:40.480> aren't<00:02:41.040> uh<00:02:41.360> hours<00:02:42.000> that<00:02:42.239> kind<00:02:42.400> of
well, there aren't uh hours that kind of
well, there aren't uh hours that kind of
work,<00:02:43.200> you<00:02:43.280> know,<00:02:43.440> for<00:02:43.599> our<00:02:43.760> lives<00:02:44.000> where
work, you know, for our lives where
work, you know, for our lives where
we're<00:02:44.400> all<00:02:44.560> going<00:02:44.640> to<00:02:44.800> be<00:02:44.959> working,<00:02:45.680> you<00:02:45.760> know,
we're all going to be working, you know,
we're all going to be working, you know,
at<00:02:46.160> the<00:02:46.400> same<00:02:46.640> time.<00:02:47.599> And,<00:02:48.160> you<00:02:48.319> know,<00:02:48.480> so<00:02:48.640> I
at the same time. And, you know, so I
at the same time. And, you know, so I
think<00:02:48.959> there's<00:02:49.440> ultimately<00:02:49.840> like<00:02:50.080> a<00:02:50.319> trust<00:02:50.879> in
think there's ultimately like a trust in
think there's ultimately like a trust in
remote<00:02:51.920> culture<00:02:52.640> that<00:02:52.959> exists<00:02:53.840> uh<00:02:54.160> around<00:02:54.480> how
remote culture that exists uh around how
remote culture that exists uh around how
people<00:02:55.040> work<00:02:55.280> and<00:02:55.519> working<00:02:56.000> for<00:02:56.319> whatever
people work and working for whatever
people work and working for whatever
schedule<00:02:57.519> kind<00:02:57.680> of<00:02:57.840> makes<00:02:58.080> sense<00:02:58.239> for<00:02:58.480> them.
schedule kind of makes sense for them.
schedule kind of makes sense for them.
So<00:02:59.280> at<00:02:59.519> this<00:02:59.680> point<00:02:59.920> now<00:03:00.080> that<00:03:00.319> we<00:03:00.480> have<00:03:00.640> people
So at this point now that we have people
So at this point now that we have people
in<00:03:02.239> every<00:03:02.720> geography<00:03:03.840> including<00:03:04.239> now<00:03:04.560> not
in every geography including now not
in every geography including now not
just<00:03:04.959> like<00:03:05.120> Europe<00:03:05.360> and<00:03:05.680> North<00:03:05.840> America<00:03:06.159> but
just like Europe and North America but
just like Europe and North America but
like<00:03:06.560> Apac<00:03:07.040> as<00:03:07.200> well<00:03:07.920> people<00:03:08.159> are<00:03:08.400> just<00:03:08.560> going
like Apac as well people are just going
like Apac as well people are just going
to<00:03:08.800> be<00:03:08.959> working<00:03:09.280> at<00:03:09.599> all<00:03:09.760> times<00:03:10.640> and<00:03:10.879> so<00:03:11.519> you
to be working at all times and so you
to be working at all times and so you
know<00:03:11.840> someone<00:03:12.080> is<00:03:12.239> awake<00:03:12.640> doing<00:03:12.959> work<00:03:13.360> at<00:03:13.599> some
know someone is awake doing work at some
know someone is awake doing work at some
time<00:03:14.400> of<00:03:14.640> the<00:03:14.800> day.<00:03:15.360> Um<00:03:15.920> and<00:03:16.159> so<00:03:16.640> facilitating
time of the day. Um and so facilitating
time of the day. Um and so facilitating
a<00:03:17.680> culture<00:03:18.000> where<00:03:18.319> everyone<00:03:18.720> is<00:03:18.879> like<00:03:19.120> in<00:03:19.280> the
a culture where everyone is like in the
a culture where everyone is like in the
in<00:03:19.920> the<00:03:20.159> office<00:03:20.879> for<00:03:21.120> a<00:03:21.360> particular<00:03:21.840> set<00:03:22.000> of
in the office for a particular set of
in the office for a particular set of
hours<00:03:22.720> every<00:03:23.120> single<00:03:23.440> day<00:03:23.680> or<00:03:24.000> 6<00:03:24.319> days<00:03:24.560> or
hours every single day or 6 days or
hours every single day or 6 days or
whatever<00:03:25.519> is<00:03:25.760> just<00:03:25.920> like<00:03:26.080> not<00:03:26.319> something<00:03:26.640> that
whatever is just like not something that
whatever is just like not something that
would<00:03:27.040> ever<00:03:27.440> work<00:03:27.840> for<00:03:28.159> how<00:03:28.400> we<00:03:28.560> started<00:03:28.879> the
would ever work for how we started the
would ever work for how we started the
company,<00:03:29.440> right?<00:03:29.760> So<00:03:29.920> I<00:03:30.080> think<00:03:30.159> you<00:03:30.319> have<00:03:30.400> to
company, right? So I think you have to
company, right? So I think you have to
start<00:03:30.640> with<00:03:30.799> like<00:03:30.959> the<00:03:31.200> foundation<00:03:31.680> of<00:03:31.920> like
start with like the foundation of like
start with like the foundation of like
why<00:03:32.640> it<00:03:32.799> is<00:03:33.040> this<00:03:33.280> way,<00:03:33.680> right?<00:03:34.400> And<00:03:34.640> then<00:03:34.879> I
why it is this way, right? And then I
why it is this way, right? And then I
think<00:03:35.280> a<00:03:35.519> lot<00:03:35.599> of<00:03:35.680> it<00:03:35.920> goes<00:03:36.480> back<00:03:36.799> to<00:03:37.760> a<00:03:38.080> feeling
think a lot of it goes back to a feeling
think a lot of it goes back to a feeling
that<00:03:39.360> different<00:03:39.680> people<00:03:40.000> bring<00:03:40.239> different
that different people bring different
that different people bring different
things<00:03:40.799> to<00:03:41.040> the<00:03:41.280> table,<00:03:41.840> right?<00:03:42.560> Um,<00:03:43.120> if<00:03:43.360> you
things to the table, right? Um, if you
things to the table, right? Um, if you
look<00:03:43.680> at<00:03:43.920> all<00:03:44.159> three<00:03:44.319> of<00:03:44.480> our<00:03:44.640> founders,<00:03:45.200> they
look at all three of our founders, they
look at all three of our founders, they
had<00:03:45.599> all<00:03:45.760> worked<00:03:46.000> at<00:03:46.239> like,<00:03:47.040> you<00:03:47.200> know,
had all worked at like, you know,
had all worked at like, you know,
hyperrowth<00:03:48.080> companies<00:03:48.879> in<00:03:49.519> San<00:03:49.760> Francisco,
hyperrowth companies in San Francisco,
hyperrowth companies in San Francisco,
um,<00:03:51.599> you<00:03:51.760> know,<00:03:52.000> Coinbase,<00:03:52.799> Airbnb,<00:03:53.680> Uber.
um, you know, Coinbase, Airbnb, Uber.
um, you know, Coinbase, Airbnb, Uber.
Um,<00:03:55.120> so<00:03:55.280> they<00:03:55.760> had<00:03:55.920> a<00:03:56.159> sense<00:03:56.400> of<00:03:56.640> like
Um, so they had a sense of like
Um, so they had a sense of like
basically<00:03:57.840> all<00:03:58.000> the<00:03:58.080> ways<00:03:58.319> explode,
basically all the ways explode,
basically all the ways explode,
right?<00:03:59.280> Like<00:03:59.439> what<00:03:59.680> these<00:04:00.000> kinds<00:04:00.159> of
right? Like what these kinds of
right? Like what these kinds of
companies<00:04:00.720> were<00:04:00.959> like,<00:04:01.360> right?<00:04:02.319> And<00:04:02.959> in<00:04:03.200> a<00:04:03.360> lot
companies were like, right? And in a lot
companies were like, right? And in a lot
of<00:04:03.599> ways,<00:04:04.080> I<00:04:04.319> think<00:04:04.640> they<00:04:05.519> thought<00:04:05.760> about<00:04:06.799> um
of ways, I think they thought about um
of ways, I think they thought about um
aspects<00:04:07.920> of<00:04:08.560> their<00:04:08.879> work<00:04:09.599> and<00:04:10.080> said,<00:04:10.480> "Well,
aspects of their work and said, "Well,
aspects of their work and said, "Well,
okay,<00:04:11.519> if<00:04:11.760> we're<00:04:11.920> going<00:04:12.000> to<00:04:12.080> actually<00:04:12.319> start<00:04:12.480> a
okay, if we're going to actually start a
okay, if we're going to actually start a
company<00:04:12.879> of<00:04:13.040> our<00:04:13.200> own,<00:04:13.599> like<00:04:13.840> what<00:04:14.000> do<00:04:14.080> we<00:04:14.239> want
company of our own, like what do we want
company of our own, like what do we want
the<00:04:14.560> culture<00:04:14.879> to<00:04:15.120> look<00:04:15.360> like<00:04:15.519> and<00:04:15.760> to<00:04:16.000> feel
the culture to look like and to feel
the culture to look like and to feel
like?"<00:04:16.799> And<00:04:16.959> then<00:04:17.120> I<00:04:17.280> think<00:04:17.359> they<00:04:17.680> were<00:04:17.759> very
like?" And then I think they were very
like?" And then I think they were very
intentional<00:04:18.720> about<00:04:19.280> how<00:04:19.519> they<00:04:19.759> wanted<00:04:19.919> that
intentional about how they wanted that
intentional about how they wanted that
to<00:04:20.239> be<00:04:20.400> different<00:04:20.959> in<00:04:21.199> some<00:04:21.359> ways<00:04:22.000> uh<00:04:22.160> from
to be different in some ways uh from
to be different in some ways uh from
what<00:04:22.560> they<00:04:22.720> had<00:04:22.880> experienced<00:04:23.360> before<00:04:23.680> and
what they had experienced before and
what they had experienced before and
similar<00:04:24.960> um<00:04:25.120> in<00:04:25.360> other<00:04:25.520> ways.<00:04:26.000> So,<00:04:26.560> I<00:04:26.800> think<00:04:26.880> we
similar um in other ways. So, I think we
similar um in other ways. So, I think we
took<00:04:27.360> out<00:04:27.919> some<00:04:28.160> of<00:04:28.240> the<00:04:28.479> feeling<00:04:28.800> around
took out some of the feeling around
took out some of the feeling around
like,<00:04:29.759> okay,<00:04:30.000> you're<00:04:30.320> expected<00:04:30.639> to<00:04:30.800> work<00:04:30.960> a
like, okay, you're expected to work a
like, okay, you're expected to work a
certain<00:04:31.360> number<00:04:31.520> of<00:04:31.680> hours<00:04:32.080> and<00:04:32.880> uh<00:04:33.040> do<00:04:33.280> these
certain number of hours and uh do these
certain number of hours and uh do these
things<00:04:33.600> a<00:04:33.840> certain<00:04:34.080> way<00:04:34.320> because<00:04:34.800> all<00:04:35.040> three
things a certain way because all three
things a certain way because all three
of<00:04:35.440> our<00:04:35.680> founders<00:04:36.240> have<00:04:36.560> families<00:04:37.199> and<00:04:37.520> want
of our founders have families and want
of our founders have families and want
to<00:04:37.840> spend<00:04:38.080> time<00:04:38.160> with<00:04:38.320> their<00:04:38.560> families<00:04:39.199> and
to spend time with their families and
to spend time with their families and
are<00:04:39.680> doing<00:04:39.840> a<00:04:40.000> startup<00:04:40.320> like<00:04:40.479> later<00:04:40.720> in<00:04:40.960> life,
are doing a startup like later in life,
are doing a startup like later in life,
then<00:04:41.440> maybe<00:04:42.160> you<00:04:42.479> see<00:04:43.360> early<00:04:43.840> 20s<00:04:44.800> uh<00:04:44.960> startup
then maybe you see early 20s uh startup
then maybe you see early 20s uh startup
founders<00:04:45.840> with<00:04:46.080> like<00:04:46.479> no<00:04:46.800> families<00:04:47.280> or<00:04:47.520> no
founders with like no families or no
founders with like no families or no
other<00:04:48.080> responsibilities
other responsibilities
other responsibilities
um<00:04:50.000> running<00:04:50.240> their<00:04:50.560> companies,<00:04:51.040> right?<00:04:51.600> And<00:04:51.840> I
um running their companies, right? And I
um running their companies, right? And I
think<00:04:52.160> that's<00:04:52.400> also<00:04:52.880> indicative<00:04:53.280> of<00:04:53.440> who<00:04:53.600> we
think that's also indicative of who we
think that's also indicative of who we
attract<00:04:54.240> to<00:04:54.479> the<00:04:54.720> company,<00:04:55.120> right?<00:04:55.600> So
attract to the company, right? So
attract to the company, right? So
company<00:04:56.720> leaders<00:04:57.919> um<00:04:58.160> individual
company leaders um individual
company leaders um individual
contributors<00:04:59.680> etc<00:05:00.000> who<00:05:00.240> are<00:05:00.400> probably<00:05:00.720> like<00:05:01.120> a
contributors etc who are probably like a
contributors etc who are probably like a
little<00:05:01.520> bit<00:05:01.600> later<00:05:01.919> in<00:05:02.080> life<00:05:02.560> and<00:05:02.960> you<00:05:03.120> know
little bit later in life and you know
little bit later in life and you know
have<00:05:03.600> like<00:05:03.840> obligations<00:05:04.479> and<00:05:04.800> families<00:05:05.120> and
have like obligations and families and
have like obligations and families and
things<00:05:05.600> that<00:05:05.759> they<00:05:05.919> want<00:05:06.000> to<00:05:06.080> pursue<00:05:06.880> while
things that they want to pursue while
things that they want to pursue while
also<00:05:07.520> wanting<00:05:07.759> to<00:05:07.919> build<00:05:08.160> a<00:05:08.320> great<00:05:08.479> company
also wanting to build a great company
also wanting to build a great company
and<00:05:09.039> build<00:05:09.199> a<00:05:09.440> great<00:05:09.680> product<00:05:10.160> right<00:05:10.800> so<00:05:11.199> I
and build a great product right so I
and build a great product right so I
think<00:05:11.600> all<00:05:11.840> of<00:05:11.919> that<00:05:12.240> leads<00:05:12.560> to<00:05:12.960> a<00:05:13.199> culture
think all of that leads to a culture
think all of that leads to a culture
that<00:05:13.759> just<00:05:14.000> doesn't<00:05:14.320> subscribe<00:05:14.800> to<00:05:15.600> the<00:05:15.840> 996
that just doesn't subscribe to the 996
that just doesn't subscribe to the 996
like<00:05:16.960> format<00:05:17.840> and<00:05:18.080> very<00:05:18.320> much<00:05:18.560> believes<00:05:19.039> that
like format and very much believes that
like format and very much believes that
you<00:05:20.000> know<00:05:20.240> you<00:05:20.479> should<00:05:20.720> be<00:05:20.880> looking<00:05:21.199> at<00:05:22.000> work
you know you should be looking at work
you know you should be looking at work
as<00:05:22.880> its<00:05:23.199> own<00:05:23.680> like<00:05:24.080> product<00:05:24.720> in<00:05:24.960> a<00:05:25.199> way<00:05:26.240> and<00:05:26.479> for
as its own like product in a way and for
as its own like product in a way and for
everyone<00:05:27.039> that's<00:05:27.360> going<00:05:27.440> to<00:05:27.600> look<00:05:27.759> a<00:05:28.000> little
everyone that's going to look a little
everyone that's going to look a little
bit<00:05:28.240> different<00:05:28.800> and<00:05:29.199> you<00:05:29.360> know<00:05:29.520> what<00:05:29.680> I
bit different and you know what I
bit different and you know what I
brought<00:05:30.160> to<00:05:30.960> an<00:05:31.199> early<00:05:31.520> stage<00:05:31.759> startup<00:05:32.240> in<00:05:32.560> my
brought to an early stage startup in my
brought to an early stage startup in my
20s<00:05:33.199> was<00:05:33.440> like<00:05:33.840> a<00:05:34.160> lot<00:05:34.240> of<00:05:34.400> just<00:05:34.639> like<00:05:34.880> raw
20s was like a lot of just like raw
20s was like a lot of just like raw
hours<00:05:36.160> at<00:05:36.400> the<00:05:36.560> job<00:05:37.120> and<00:05:37.360> what<00:05:37.520> I<00:05:37.759> bring<00:05:37.919> to<00:05:38.160> a
hours at the job and what I bring to a
hours at the job and what I bring to a
startup<00:05:38.800> now<00:05:39.680> in<00:05:39.919> my<00:05:40.160> late<00:05:40.560> 30s<00:05:41.440> and<00:05:42.320> in<00:05:42.479> a<00:05:42.639> very
startup now in my late 30s and in a very
startup now in my late 30s and in a very
different<00:05:43.120> stage<00:05:43.440> of<00:05:43.600> life<00:05:44.639> um<00:05:44.880> is<00:05:45.199> looking<00:05:45.360> at
different stage of life um is looking at
different stage of life um is looking at
things<00:05:45.759> in<00:05:45.919> a<00:05:46.080> very<00:05:46.240> different<00:05:46.400> way<00:05:46.560> like<00:05:46.720> I
things in a very different way like I
things in a very different way like I
have<00:05:47.039> a<00:05:47.280> network<00:05:47.600> of<00:05:47.840> people<00:05:48.720> who<00:05:48.960> I<00:05:49.120> can<00:05:49.360> ask
have a network of people who I can ask
have a network of people who I can ask
for<00:05:49.919> advice<00:05:50.160> from<00:05:50.560> so<00:05:50.720> I'm<00:05:50.880> like<00:05:51.120> cutting
for advice from so I'm like cutting
for advice from so I'm like cutting
through<00:05:51.759> things<00:05:52.000> a<00:05:52.320> lot<00:05:52.400> faster<00:05:52.880> rather<00:05:53.199> than
through things a lot faster rather than
through things a lot faster rather than
having<00:05:53.600> to<00:05:53.840> like<00:05:54.479> iterate<00:05:55.120> on<00:05:55.360> my<00:05:55.520> own,<00:05:56.000> right?
having to like iterate on my own, right?
having to like iterate on my own, right?
Um,<00:05:57.039> and<00:05:57.280> then<00:05:57.440> I<00:05:57.600> also<00:05:57.840> have<00:05:58.000> like
Um, and then I also have like
Um, and then I also have like
connections<00:05:58.720> and<00:05:58.880> a<00:05:59.120> network<00:05:59.280> of<00:05:59.440> people<00:05:59.600> who
connections and a network of people who
connections and a network of people who
can<00:05:59.919> be<00:06:00.080> our<00:06:00.240> customers<00:06:00.560> or<00:06:00.720> our<00:06:00.960> partners<00:06:01.280> or
can be our customers or our partners or
can be our customers or our partners or
what<00:06:01.759> have<00:06:01.840> you,<00:06:02.160> right?<00:06:02.400> And<00:06:02.560> that<00:06:02.720> makes
what have you, right? And that makes
what have you, right? And that makes
things<00:06:03.199> easier<00:06:03.520> for<00:06:03.680> us<00:06:03.919> and<00:06:04.160> for<00:06:04.319> our
things easier for us and for our
things easier for us and for our
business,<00:06:04.960> right?<00:06:05.520> And<00:06:05.840> I<00:06:06.160> also<00:06:06.400> have
business, right? And I also have
business, right? And I also have
experience<00:06:07.199> so<00:06:07.360> that<00:06:07.600> I<00:06:07.759> don't<00:06:07.840> have<00:06:08.000> to
experience so that I don't have to
experience so that I don't have to
necessarily<00:06:08.639> feel<00:06:08.800> like<00:06:08.960> I'm<00:06:09.120> doing<00:06:09.360> things
necessarily feel like I'm doing things
necessarily feel like I'm doing things
for<00:06:09.759> the<00:06:09.919> first<00:06:10.080> time.<00:06:10.800> And<00:06:11.039> so<00:06:11.520> all<00:06:11.680> of<00:06:11.840> those
for the first time. And so all of those
for the first time. And so all of those
things<00:06:12.319> add<00:06:12.560> up<00:06:12.720> in<00:06:12.880> a<00:06:13.039> way<00:06:13.120> where<00:06:13.440> I<00:06:13.840> can<00:06:14.080> come
things add up in a way where I can come
things add up in a way where I can come
to<00:06:14.560> the<00:06:14.800> table<00:06:15.199> and<00:06:15.520> bring<00:06:15.759> something<00:06:16.160> more
to the table and bring something more
to the table and bring something more
than<00:06:16.720> just<00:06:16.960> my<00:06:17.199> hourly<00:06:17.680> output.<00:06:18.639> Um<00:06:19.039> and<00:06:19.199> I
than just my hourly output. Um and I
than just my hourly output. Um and I
think<00:06:19.520> if<00:06:19.759> you<00:06:19.840> look<00:06:20.000> at<00:06:20.080> a<00:06:20.319> lot<00:06:20.400> of<00:06:20.560> other
think if you look at a lot of other
think if you look at a lot of other
corollaries<00:06:22.800> in<00:06:23.039> other<00:06:23.280> industries<00:06:24.240> like
corollaries in other industries like
corollaries in other industries like
legal<00:06:24.960> as<00:06:25.199> an<00:06:25.280> example<00:06:25.840> where<00:06:26.240> people<00:06:26.639> bill<00:06:26.960> in
legal as an example where people bill in
legal as an example where people bill in
like<00:06:27.360> six<00:06:27.680> minute<00:06:27.919> increments<00:06:29.039> um
like six minute increments um
like six minute increments um
familiar<00:06:30.080> familiar<00:06:30.479> with<00:06:30.639> this<00:06:30.960> didn't<00:06:31.199> like
familiar familiar with this didn't like
familiar familiar with this didn't like
it<00:06:31.600> like
it like
it like
yeah<00:06:32.319> yes<00:06:33.280> um<00:06:33.600> you<00:06:33.759> know<00:06:34.000> like<00:06:34.240> if<00:06:34.479> you<00:06:34.639> talk<00:06:34.800> to
yeah yes um you know like if you talk to
yeah yes um you know like if you talk to
someone<00:06:35.280> who's<00:06:35.520> been<00:06:35.600> in<00:06:35.759> the<00:06:35.840> legal<00:06:36.080> field
someone who's been in the legal field
someone who's been in the legal field
for<00:06:36.720> their<00:06:37.039> entire<00:06:37.360> career<00:06:38.080> you<00:06:38.240> know<00:06:38.400> they
for their entire career you know they
for their entire career you know they
look<00:06:38.880> at<00:06:39.280> like<00:06:39.840> billable<00:06:40.319> hours<00:06:40.720> is<00:06:41.120> when<00:06:41.440> the
look at like billable hours is when the
look at like billable hours is when the
industry<00:06:42.080> started<00:06:42.319> to<00:06:42.479> die<00:06:42.800> and<00:06:43.120> started<00:06:43.360> to
industry started to die and started to
industry started to die and started to
kind<00:06:43.680> of<00:06:43.759> feel<00:06:44.319> so<00:06:44.560> much<00:06:44.720> more<00:06:45.039> like
kind of feel so much more like
kind of feel so much more like
transactional<00:06:46.240> and<00:06:46.479> less<00:06:46.720> humane<00:06:47.120> and<00:06:47.840> And<00:06:48.319> I
transactional and less humane and And I
transactional and less humane and And I
kind<00:06:48.720> of<00:06:48.960> look<00:06:49.199> at<00:06:49.520> maybe<00:06:49.840> some<00:06:50.080> things<00:06:50.240> that
kind of look at maybe some things that
kind of look at maybe some things that
are<00:06:50.560> happening<00:06:50.800> now<00:06:50.960> in<00:06:51.120> tech<00:06:51.360> in<00:06:51.440> a<00:06:51.600> in<00:06:51.759> a<00:06:51.840> very
are happening now in tech in a in a very
are happening now in tech in a in a very
similar<00:06:52.240> way.<00:06:52.400> I<00:06:52.560> think<00:06:52.639> we'll<00:06:52.880> look<00:06:53.039> back<00:06:53.120> on
similar way. I think we'll look back on
similar way. I think we'll look back on
that<00:06:53.520> and<00:06:53.919> and<00:06:54.240> think<00:06:54.479> very<00:06:54.800> differently
that and and think very differently
that and and think very differently
about<00:06:55.919> like<00:06:56.240> wanting<00:06:56.479> to<00:06:56.639> build<00:06:56.800> a<00:06:57.039> company
about like wanting to build a company
about like wanting to build a company
where<00:06:57.600> people<00:06:57.840> can<00:06:58.080> spend<00:06:58.880> their<00:06:59.199> lives<00:06:59.680> and
where people can spend their lives and
where people can spend their lives and
do<00:07:01.039> um<00:07:01.759> great<00:07:02.160> work<00:07:02.479> that<00:07:02.800> they're<00:07:03.039> going<00:07:03.120> to
do um great work that they're going to
do um great work that they're going to
be<00:07:03.360> proud<00:07:03.599> of<00:07:03.759> for<00:07:04.000> years<00:07:05.039> um<00:07:05.360> rather<00:07:05.680> than
be proud of for years um rather than
be proud of for years um rather than
spinning<00:07:06.319> through<00:07:06.560> companies<00:07:07.039> in<00:07:07.360> like<00:07:08.000> 12<00:07:08.240> to
spinning through companies in like 12 to
spinning through companies in like 12 to
18<00:07:08.800> month<00:07:09.039> cycles<00:07:09.360> and<00:07:09.599> getting<00:07:09.759> burned<00:07:10.080> out
18 month cycles and getting burned out
18 month cycles and getting burned out
and<00:07:10.319> then<00:07:10.479> moving<00:07:10.639> on<00:07:10.800> to<00:07:10.880> the<00:07:11.039> next<00:07:11.199> one.
and then moving on to the next one.
and then moving on to the next one.
Do<00:07:12.319> you<00:07:12.479> feel<00:07:12.639> like<00:07:13.039> any<00:07:13.280> of<00:07:13.440> that<00:07:13.680> dynamic<00:07:14.160> is
Do you feel like any of that dynamic is
Do you feel like any of that dynamic is
changing<00:07:14.720> at<00:07:14.960> all<00:07:15.120> with<00:07:15.440> the<00:07:15.680> pace?<00:07:16.080> So,<00:07:16.240> like
changing at all with the pace? So, like
changing at all with the pace? So, like
how<00:07:16.720> I<00:07:16.960> feel<00:07:17.039> like<00:07:17.440> the<00:07:17.680> kind<00:07:17.840> of<00:07:18.000> 996<00:07:18.720> dynamic
how I feel like the kind of 996 dynamic
how I feel like the kind of 996 dynamic
really<00:07:19.360> seemed<00:07:19.599> to<00:07:19.759> pick<00:07:19.919> up<00:07:20.479> with<00:07:20.800> AI<00:07:21.199> and<00:07:21.440> it
really seemed to pick up with AI and it
really seemed to pick up with AI and it
just<00:07:21.840> seems<00:07:22.080> like<00:07:22.479> everyone's<00:07:22.960> trying<00:07:23.120> to
just seems like everyone's trying to
just seems like everyone's trying to
move<00:07:23.440> so<00:07:23.680> fast.<00:07:24.080> Everything's<00:07:24.560> become<00:07:24.880> so
move so fast. Everything's become so
move so fast. Everything's become so
competitive.<00:07:25.919> People<00:07:26.240> feel<00:07:26.479> like<00:07:26.720> they<00:07:26.960> can't
competitive. People feel like they can't
competitive. People feel like they can't
take<00:07:27.440> time<00:07:27.680> off<00:07:27.840> because<00:07:28.160> someone<00:07:28.479> else<00:07:28.800> is
take time off because someone else is
take time off because someone else is
just<00:07:29.360> going<00:07:29.440> to<00:07:29.599> be<00:07:29.759> outworking<00:07:30.240> them.<00:07:30.400> And<00:07:30.479> I
just going to be outworking them. And I
just going to be outworking them. And I
hear<00:07:30.800> everything<00:07:31.039> you're<00:07:31.280> saying<00:07:31.440> about,<00:07:32.160> you
hear everything you're saying about, you
hear everything you're saying about, you
know,<00:07:33.120> you're<00:07:33.360> looking<00:07:33.520> for<00:07:33.680> other<00:07:33.919> things
know, you're looking for other things
know, you're looking for other things
and<00:07:34.240> you're<00:07:34.479> competing<00:07:34.720> on<00:07:34.880> other<00:07:35.120> things.
and you're competing on other things.
and you're competing on other things.
You're<00:07:35.520> not<00:07:35.599> competing<00:07:35.919> on<00:07:36.080> hours<00:07:36.319> in<00:07:36.479> the
You're not competing on hours in the
You're not competing on hours in the
day,<00:07:36.720> but<00:07:36.880> I<00:07:37.039> just<00:07:37.120> wonder<00:07:37.280> if<00:07:37.440> it<00:07:37.599> feels<00:07:37.919> any
day, but I just wonder if it feels any
day, but I just wonder if it feels any
different<00:07:38.720> for<00:07:38.960> you<00:07:39.199> even<00:07:39.520> over<00:07:39.759> the<00:07:40.000> last
different for you even over the last
different for you even over the last
year<00:07:40.960> with<00:07:41.199> the<00:07:41.520> just<00:07:41.759> the<00:07:42.319> pace<00:07:42.560> that<00:07:42.800> the
year with the just the pace that the
year with the just the pace that the
world<00:07:43.120> is<00:07:43.280> moving.<00:07:43.680> Do<00:07:43.840> you<00:07:43.919> feel<00:07:44.080> like<00:07:44.240> you
world is moving. Do you feel like you
world is moving. Do you feel like you
have<00:07:44.479> to<00:07:44.639> put<00:07:44.800> in<00:07:44.960> more<00:07:45.120> hours<00:07:45.360> or<00:07:45.599> do<00:07:45.759> you
have to put in more hours or do you
have to put in more hours or do you
still<00:07:46.080> think<00:07:47.360> both<00:07:47.680> you<00:07:48.000> and<00:07:48.160> and<00:07:48.639> Linear<00:07:49.039> as<00:07:49.199> a
still think both you and and Linear as a
still think both you and and Linear as a
company<00:07:49.520> are<00:07:49.680> just<00:07:49.840> like<00:07:50.000> competing<00:07:50.319> on<00:07:50.479> a
company are just like competing on a
company are just like competing on a
different<00:07:50.800> dimension?
different dimension?
different dimension?
I<00:07:52.000> definitely<00:07:52.319> don't<00:07:52.479> think<00:07:52.639> that's<00:07:52.880> like<00:07:53.039> a
I definitely don't think that's like a
I definitely don't think that's like a
like<00:07:53.440> a<00:07:53.680> wrong<00:07:53.919> approach<00:07:54.240> or<00:07:54.560> diff<00:07:54.960> like<00:07:55.280> wrong
like a wrong approach or diff like wrong
like a wrong approach or diff like wrong
way<00:07:55.759> to<00:07:55.919> see<00:07:56.160> what's<00:07:56.479> happening.<00:07:57.199> I<00:07:57.360> do<00:07:57.599> think
way to see what's happening. I do think
way to see what's happening. I do think
it's<00:07:58.000> true<00:07:58.240> that<00:07:58.639> like<00:07:59.759> uh<00:08:00.000> you<00:08:00.240> can<00:08:00.400> build
it's true that like uh you can build
it's true that like uh you can build
things<00:08:00.879> faster<00:08:01.199> than<00:08:01.440> ever.<00:08:02.000> So<00:08:02.400> in<00:08:02.560> a<00:08:02.720> lot<00:08:02.879> of
things faster than ever. So in a lot of
things faster than ever. So in a lot of
ways<00:08:03.360> like<00:08:03.599> this<00:08:03.919> great<00:08:04.160> idea<00:08:04.400> that<00:08:04.639> you<00:08:04.800> came
ways like this great idea that you came
ways like this great idea that you came
up<00:08:05.039> with<00:08:05.280> six<00:08:05.440> months<00:08:05.599> ago<00:08:05.919> someone<00:08:06.160> could
up with six months ago someone could
up with six months ago someone could
very<00:08:06.560> easily<00:08:07.039> replicate<00:08:07.680> pretty<00:08:08.000> quickly.<00:08:09.039> Um
very easily replicate pretty quickly. Um
very easily replicate pretty quickly. Um
there<00:08:09.680> is<00:08:09.840> a<00:08:10.000> lot<00:08:10.080> more<00:08:10.319> competition,<00:08:11.199> right?
there is a lot more competition, right?
there is a lot more competition, right?
All<00:08:11.919> of<00:08:12.080> those<00:08:12.240> things<00:08:12.479> are<00:08:12.720> true.<00:08:13.680> I<00:08:13.919> think
All of those things are true. I think
All of those things are true. I think
you<00:08:14.240> just<00:08:14.400> have<00:08:14.479> to<00:08:14.639> look<00:08:14.720> at<00:08:14.879> it<00:08:15.039> from<00:08:15.280> a<00:08:15.759> well,
you just have to look at it from a well,
you just have to look at it from a well,
what<00:08:17.039> makes<00:08:17.280> us<00:08:17.440> different?<00:08:17.840> What<00:08:18.080> makes<00:08:18.319> us
what makes us different? What makes us
what makes us different? What makes us
special?<00:08:18.879> And<00:08:19.039> then<00:08:19.280> how<00:08:19.360> do<00:08:19.440> we<00:08:19.680> continue<00:08:19.919> to
special? And then how do we continue to
special? And then how do we continue to
like<00:08:20.400> iterate<00:08:20.800> on<00:08:21.039> that,<00:08:21.440> right?<00:08:22.160> And<00:08:22.560> is<00:08:22.960> what
like iterate on that, right? And is what
like iterate on that, right? And is what
makes<00:08:23.440> us<00:08:23.680> different<00:08:24.000> and<00:08:24.240> special<00:08:25.360> purely
makes us different and special purely
makes us different and special purely
going<00:08:26.639> to<00:08:27.360> increase<00:08:27.759> in<00:08:28.000> its<00:08:28.240> output<00:08:28.879> by
going to increase in its output by
going to increase in its output by
putting<00:08:29.440> more<00:08:29.680> hours<00:08:30.160> behind<00:08:30.560> it?<00:08:31.360> Um,<00:08:31.840> and<00:08:32.080> I
putting more hours behind it? Um, and I
putting more hours behind it? Um, and I
and<00:08:32.399> I<00:08:32.560> think<00:08:32.640> that's<00:08:32.800> a<00:08:32.959> question<00:08:33.120> for<00:08:33.279> most
and I think that's a question for most
and I think that's a question for most
companies.<00:08:33.839> And<00:08:34.000> I<00:08:34.159> think<00:08:34.240> if<00:08:34.479> you<00:08:34.640> are<00:08:34.959> you
companies. And I think if you are you
companies. And I think if you are you
know<00:08:35.279> for<00:08:35.360> example<00:08:36.479> in<00:08:36.800> a<00:08:37.200> like
know for example in a like
know for example in a like
operationsshheavy
operationsshheavy
operationsshheavy
logisticsheavy<00:08:41.039> type<00:08:41.279> of<00:08:41.519> industry<00:08:42.959> um<00:08:43.120> with
logisticsheavy type of industry um with
logisticsheavy type of industry um with
very<00:08:43.839> little<00:08:44.480> moat<00:08:45.360> and<00:08:45.680> very<00:08:46.720> undescerning
very little moat and very undescerning
very little moat and very undescerning
customers<00:08:48.720> right
customers right
customers right
yeah<00:08:50.959> it<00:08:51.200> is<00:08:51.360> probably<00:08:51.680> going<00:08:51.760> to<00:08:51.839> be<00:08:52.000> really
yeah it is probably going to be really
yeah it is probably going to be really
tough<00:08:52.399> and<00:08:52.640> you<00:08:52.800> might<00:08:52.959> have<00:08:53.120> to<00:08:53.279> approach<00:08:53.519> it
tough and you might have to approach it
tough and you might have to approach it
this<00:08:54.000> way<00:08:54.399> right<00:08:55.040> I<00:08:55.279> think<00:08:55.600> some<00:08:56.000> in<00:08:56.240> some<00:08:56.399> ways
this way right I think some in some ways
this way right I think some in some ways
like<00:08:56.959> our<00:08:57.279> response<00:08:57.680> is<00:08:57.920> like<00:08:59.360> a<00:08:59.680> reflection
like our response is like a reflection
like our response is like a reflection
of<00:09:00.080> the<00:09:00.320> business<00:09:00.480> that<00:09:00.720> they're<00:09:00.959> that<00:09:01.200> we're
of the business that they're that we're
of the business that they're that we're
in<00:09:01.600> and<00:09:01.839> the<00:09:02.080> customers<00:09:02.399> that<00:09:02.640> we<00:09:02.959> have<00:09:03.519> who
in and the customers that we have who
in and the customers that we have who
are<00:09:04.000> very<00:09:04.240> discerning,<00:09:05.120> who<00:09:05.360> care<00:09:05.519> a<00:09:05.680> lot
are very discerning, who care a lot
are very discerning, who care a lot
about<00:09:06.160> product<00:09:06.480> quality,<00:09:07.360> who<00:09:07.519> are<00:09:07.760> not
about product quality, who are not
about product quality, who are not
necessarily<00:09:08.399> just<00:09:08.640> looking<00:09:08.880> for<00:09:09.120> like<00:09:09.360> raw
necessarily just looking for like raw
necessarily just looking for like raw
output<00:09:10.080> of<00:09:10.240> just<00:09:10.399> like<00:09:10.560> did<00:09:10.800> you<00:09:10.959> build<00:09:11.200> more
output of just like did you build more
output of just like did you build more
features<00:09:11.760> this<00:09:12.000> year<00:09:12.160> than<00:09:12.399> last<00:09:12.640> year,<00:09:12.880> but
features this year than last year, but
features this year than last year, but
like<00:09:13.600> are<00:09:13.839> they<00:09:14.000> higher<00:09:14.399> quality,<00:09:15.040> are<00:09:15.279> they
like are they higher quality, are they
like are they higher quality, are they
better<00:09:15.680> to<00:09:15.920> use,<00:09:16.480> right?<00:09:16.959> Um<00:09:17.360> does<00:09:17.519> this<00:09:17.680> make
better to use, right? Um does this make
better to use, right? Um does this make
my<00:09:18.000> full<00:09:18.240> endto-end<00:09:18.720> experience<00:09:19.200> better,
my full endto-end experience better,
my full endto-end experience better,
right?<00:09:20.080> Whereas<00:09:20.399> I<00:09:20.560> think<00:09:20.640> for<00:09:20.800> us<00:09:21.040> it's<00:09:21.200> not
right? Whereas I think for us it's not
right? Whereas I think for us it's not
just<00:09:21.600> like<00:09:21.839> did<00:09:22.000> we<00:09:22.160> ship<00:09:22.480> more,<00:09:22.880> did<00:09:23.120> we<00:09:23.279> do
just like did we ship more, did we do
just like did we ship more, did we do
more,<00:09:23.839> right?<00:09:24.399> But<00:09:24.560> like<00:09:24.800> did<00:09:25.040> we<00:09:25.200> actually
more, right? But like did we actually
more, right? But like did we actually
ship<00:09:25.839> the<00:09:26.080> right<00:09:26.320> things?<00:09:27.200> And<00:09:27.519> so<00:09:28.000> for<00:09:28.240> us,<00:09:28.640> I
ship the right things? And so for us, I
ship the right things? And so for us, I
think<00:09:28.959> it's<00:09:29.279> always<00:09:29.680> been<00:09:29.920> about<00:09:30.240> focus,<00:09:31.519> like
think it's always been about focus, like
think it's always been about focus, like
did<00:09:31.920> we<00:09:32.080> work<00:09:32.240> on<00:09:32.320> the<00:09:32.560> right<00:09:32.640> things<00:09:32.880> this
did we work on the right things this
did we work on the right things this
year<00:09:33.680> and<00:09:33.920> did<00:09:34.160> we<00:09:34.320> do<00:09:34.480> them<00:09:34.959> well,<00:09:35.760> right?<00:09:36.560> Um,
year and did we do them well, right? Um,
year and did we do them well, right? Um,
and<00:09:37.440> I<00:09:37.600> think<00:09:37.680> that's<00:09:37.839> a<00:09:38.000> very<00:09:38.320> different<00:09:38.720> look
and I think that's a very different look
and I think that's a very different look
at<00:09:40.320> the<00:09:40.640> problem<00:09:40.959> set<00:09:41.360> in<00:09:41.600> front<00:09:41.760> of<00:09:41.839> us
at the problem set in front of us
at the problem set in front of us
compared<00:09:42.640> to<00:09:43.040> other<00:09:43.360> businesses<00:09:43.920> where<00:09:44.560> maybe
compared to other businesses where maybe
compared to other businesses where maybe
those<00:09:45.040> things<00:09:45.279> just<00:09:45.440> don't<00:09:45.680> matter<00:09:45.920> as<00:09:46.240> much,
those things just don't matter as much,
those things just don't matter as much,
right?<00:09:47.120> So<00:09:47.279> I<00:09:47.519> think<00:09:47.680> everyone<00:09:48.000> has<00:09:48.160> to<00:09:48.320> do
right? So I think everyone has to do
right? So I think everyone has to do
this<00:09:48.640> differently.<00:09:49.120> Like<00:09:49.360> I'm<00:09:49.760> speaking<00:09:50.240> the
this differently. Like I'm speaking the
this differently. Like I'm speaking the
I'm<00:09:51.600> talking<00:09:51.839> the<00:09:52.000> linear<00:09:52.320> book<00:09:52.640> in<00:09:52.880> in<00:09:53.120> a<00:09:53.279> way.
I'm talking the linear book in in a way.
I'm talking the linear book in in a way.
And<00:09:54.560> for<00:09:54.959> another<00:09:55.360> business<00:09:55.680> that<00:09:55.920> operates
And for another business that operates
And for another business that operates
in<00:09:56.480> a<00:09:56.640> different<00:09:56.880> field,<00:09:57.600> it<00:09:57.920> might<00:09:58.160> be,<00:09:58.640> you
in a different field, it might be, you
in a different field, it might be, you
know,<00:09:58.959> quite<00:09:59.279> different.<00:09:59.680> But<00:09:59.760> I<00:09:59.920> think,<00:10:00.240> you
know, quite different. But I think, you
know, quite different. But I think, you
know,<00:10:00.560> we've<00:10:00.880> been<00:10:02.080> coming<00:10:02.560> from<00:10:03.279> behind
know, we've been coming from behind
know, we've been coming from behind
already<00:10:04.160> like<00:10:04.399> we're<00:10:04.560> not<00:10:04.720> the<00:10:04.959> first<00:10:05.360> like,
already like we're not the first like,
already like we're not the first like,
you<00:10:06.160> know,<00:10:06.800> project<00:10:07.279> management<00:10:07.839> system<00:10:08.560> for
you know, project management system for
you know, project management system for
people<00:10:09.839> who<00:10:10.080> build<00:10:10.320> software<00:10:10.720> that's<00:10:11.040> ever
people who build software that's ever
people who build software that's ever
existed<00:10:11.600> in<00:10:11.839> the<00:10:11.920> world.<00:10:12.240> So,<00:10:12.560> you<00:10:12.720> know,<00:10:12.800> we
existed in the world. So, you know, we
existed in the world. So, you know, we
were<00:10:13.120> already<00:10:13.440> like<00:10:13.600> in<00:10:13.760> a<00:10:13.920> way<00:10:14.079> behind<00:10:15.200> other
were already like in a way behind other
were already like in a way behind other
tools<00:10:16.079> that<00:10:16.320> are<00:10:16.399> in<00:10:16.560> the<00:10:16.720> space.<00:10:17.680> So<00:10:18.079> you<00:10:18.320> look
tools that are in the space. So you look
tools that are in the space. So you look
at<00:10:18.480> these<00:10:18.800> companies,<00:10:19.120> these<00:10:19.360> legacy
at these companies, these legacy
at these companies, these legacy
companies<00:10:19.920> in<00:10:20.079> our<00:10:20.240> space<00:10:20.399> that<00:10:20.640> have<00:10:20.720> been
companies in our space that have been
companies in our space that have been
around<00:10:21.040> for<00:10:21.200> 20,<00:10:21.519> 25<00:10:21.920> years<00:10:22.560> and<00:10:22.880> of<00:10:23.120> course
around for 20, 25 years and of course
around for 20, 25 years and of course
they<00:10:23.440> have<00:10:23.600> more<00:10:23.760> features.<00:10:24.240> Like<00:10:24.560> of<00:10:24.640> course
they have more features. Like of course
they have more features. Like of course
when<00:10:25.040> you<00:10:25.120> look<00:10:25.200> at<00:10:25.279> like<00:10:25.440> a<00:10:25.600> box<00:10:25.839> checking
when you look at like a box checking
when you look at like a box checking
exercise,<00:10:26.640> they<00:10:26.880> check<00:10:27.120> more<00:10:27.360> boxes.
exercise, they check more boxes.
exercise, they check more boxes.
Yes.<00:10:28.480> That's<00:10:28.720> never<00:10:28.880> been<00:10:28.959> the<00:10:29.120> dimension
Yes. That's never been the dimension
Yes. That's never been the dimension
you've<00:10:29.600> competed<00:10:29.839> on<00:10:30.000> is<00:10:30.480> raw<00:10:30.800> output.<00:10:31.279> You
you've competed on is raw output. You
you've competed on is raw output. You
have<00:10:32.079> always<00:10:32.240> had<00:10:32.480> to<00:10:32.640> have<00:10:32.800> your<00:10:33.440> kind<00:10:33.600> of
have always had to have your kind of
have always had to have your kind of
competitive<00:10:34.160> mop<00:10:34.959> focus<00:10:35.440> quality<00:10:35.920> doing
competitive mop focus quality doing
competitive mop focus quality doing
things<00:10:36.320> the<00:10:36.560> right<00:10:36.640> way<00:10:36.880> a<00:10:37.120> different<00:10:37.279> way<00:10:37.839> and
things the right way a different way and
things the right way a different way and
that<00:10:38.320> doesn't<00:10:38.640> sort<00:10:38.880> of<00:10:39.120> necessarily<00:10:39.680> just
that doesn't sort of necessarily just
that doesn't sort of necessarily just
come<00:10:40.000> from<00:10:40.160> more<00:10:40.399> hours<00:10:40.560> in<00:10:40.720> the<00:10:40.800> day.
come from more hours in the day.
come from more hours in the day.
Yes.<00:10:41.360> And<00:10:41.519> innovating<00:10:42.000> in<00:10:42.160> the<00:10:42.320> right<00:10:42.480> places.
Yes. And innovating in the right places.
Yes. And innovating in the right places.
So<00:10:43.360> now,<00:10:44.079> funny<00:10:44.399> enough,<00:10:44.880> we're<00:10:45.200> seeing<00:10:45.600> that
So now, funny enough, we're seeing that
So now, funny enough, we're seeing that
like<00:10:46.399> things<00:10:46.640> that<00:10:46.800> we<00:10:47.040> built<00:10:47.360> a<00:10:47.680> year<00:10:47.760> ago<00:10:48.240> are
like things that we built a year ago are
like things that we built a year ago are
now<00:10:48.800> being<00:10:49.279> copied<00:10:49.760> by<00:10:50.160> our<00:10:50.480> competitors.<00:10:51.440> And
now being copied by our competitors. And
now being copied by our competitors. And
you're<00:10:51.839> kind<00:10:52.000> of<00:10:52.079> looking<00:10:52.240> at<00:10:52.399> it<00:10:52.480> and<00:10:52.640> you're
you're kind of looking at it and you're
you're kind of looking at it and you're
saying<00:10:52.959> like,<00:10:53.120> "Huh,<00:10:54.079> wow,<00:10:54.480> that's<00:10:54.720> kind<00:10:54.880> of
saying like, "Huh, wow, that's kind of
saying like, "Huh, wow, that's kind of
nice,<00:10:55.760> you<00:10:55.920> know,
nice, you know,
nice, you know,
from<00:10:58.160> us,<00:10:58.560> you<00:10:58.720> know,<00:10:58.880> feeling<00:10:59.200> like<00:10:59.440> we<00:10:59.680> were
from us, you know, feeling like we were
from us, you know, feeling like we were
playing<00:11:00.079> catch-up<00:11:00.560> to<00:11:00.880> now<00:11:01.040> being<00:11:01.200> in<00:11:01.360> a<00:11:01.600> place
playing catch-up to now being in a place
playing catch-up to now being in a place
where<00:11:02.079> it<00:11:02.240> feels<00:11:02.480> like<00:11:02.720> they're<00:11:03.040> playing
where it feels like they're playing
where it feels like they're playing
catch-up<00:11:03.680> to<00:11:03.920> us,<00:11:04.560> right?<00:11:05.040> And<00:11:05.200> I<00:11:05.360> think
catch-up to us, right? And I think
catch-up to us, right? And I think
that's<00:11:05.680> because<00:11:05.839> we<00:11:06.160> made<00:11:06.320> the<00:11:06.560> right<00:11:06.720> choices
that's because we made the right choices
that's because we made the right choices
a<00:11:07.519> year<00:11:07.680> ago,<00:11:08.079> right?<00:11:08.480> Even<00:11:08.720> though<00:11:08.959> those
a year ago, right? Even though those
a year ago, right? Even though those
companies<00:11:09.519> have<00:11:09.839> like<00:11:10.079> if<00:11:10.240> you<00:11:10.399> look<00:11:10.480> at<00:11:10.640> the
companies have like if you look at the
companies have like if you look at the
sheer<00:11:11.120> number<00:11:11.279> of<00:11:11.440> output<00:11:11.920> number<00:11:12.160> of<00:11:12.399> people
sheer number of output number of people
sheer number of output number of people
times<00:11:13.519> hours<00:11:14.000> they<00:11:14.240> have<00:11:14.480> worked<00:11:14.959> right<00:11:15.760> they
times hours they have worked right they
times hours they have worked right they
should<00:11:16.240> be<00:11:16.480> so<00:11:16.720> far<00:11:16.800> ahead<00:11:17.120> of<00:11:17.200> us<00:11:17.600> right<00:11:18.800> um<00:11:19.120> so
should be so far ahead of us right um so
should be so far ahead of us right um so
you<00:11:19.600> know<00:11:19.760> there<00:11:19.920> are<00:11:20.160> many<00:11:20.480> examples<00:11:21.200> of
you know there are many examples of
you know there are many examples of
those<00:11:21.760> kinds<00:11:22.000> of<00:11:22.160> companies<00:11:22.880> and<00:11:23.120> I<00:11:23.440> think
those kinds of companies and I think
those kinds of companies and I think
it's<00:11:23.760> because<00:11:24.000> they<00:11:24.240> strategically<00:11:24.880> just<00:11:25.120> are
it's because they strategically just are
it's because they strategically just are
making<00:11:25.519> the<00:11:25.760> wrong<00:11:26.000> choices<00:11:26.800> not<00:11:27.040> necessarily
making the wrong choices not necessarily
making the wrong choices not necessarily
because<00:11:27.920> they're<00:11:28.160> working<00:11:28.560> any<00:11:28.880> less<00:11:29.440> hard<00:11:30.320> or
because they're working any less hard or
because they're working any less hard or
more<00:11:30.800> hard<00:11:31.120> than<00:11:31.279> we<00:11:31.519> are<00:11:31.760> right
more hard than we are right
more hard than we are right
one<00:11:32.240> of<00:11:32.320> those<00:11:32.480> choices<00:11:32.720> is<00:11:32.959> around<00:11:33.279> number<00:11:33.440> of
one of those choices is around number of
one of those choices is around number of
people<00:11:33.839> so<00:11:34.079> you're<00:11:34.240> still<00:11:34.480> sub<00:11:34.880> 200<00:11:35.360> people
people so you're still sub 200 people
people so you're still sub 200 people
that<00:11:36.880> at<00:11:37.360> your<00:11:38.240> valuation<00:11:39.200> and<00:11:39.680> revenue<00:11:40.320> is
that at your valuation and revenue is
that at your valuation and revenue is
pretty<00:11:41.680> unprecedented.<00:11:42.800> And<00:11:42.959> so<00:11:43.120> when<00:11:43.279> you
pretty unprecedented. And so when you
pretty unprecedented. And so when you
talk<00:11:43.519> about<00:11:43.680> focus,<00:11:44.079> it<00:11:44.240> seems<00:11:44.399> like<00:11:44.480> this<00:11:44.720> is
talk about focus, it seems like this is
talk about focus, it seems like this is
another<00:11:45.200> area<00:11:45.440> where<00:11:45.600> you've<00:11:45.839> had<00:11:46.000> sort<00:11:46.160> of
another area where you've had sort of
another area where you've had sort of
ruthless<00:11:46.880> and<00:11:47.120> intentional<00:11:47.600> focus,<00:11:48.000> which<00:11:48.240> is
ruthless and intentional focus, which is
ruthless and intentional focus, which is
you<00:11:49.120> you<00:11:49.440> don't<00:11:49.600> see<00:11:49.760> headcount<00:11:50.240> as<00:11:50.399> a
you you don't see headcount as a
you you don't see headcount as a
function<00:11:50.720> of<00:11:50.880> growth.<00:11:51.279> Like<00:11:51.440> you<00:11:51.920> have<00:11:52.160> sort
function of growth. Like you have sort
function of growth. Like you have sort
of<00:11:52.399> disagregated<00:11:53.040> those<00:11:53.279> two<00:11:53.440> things.
of disagregated those two things.
of disagregated those two things.
They're<00:11:53.839> not<00:11:53.920> connected<00:11:54.240> to<00:11:54.399> one<00:11:54.560> another.
They're not connected to one another.
They're not connected to one another.
So<00:11:56.000> talk<00:11:56.240> to<00:11:56.320> me<00:11:56.399> about<00:11:56.560> how<00:11:56.800> you<00:11:56.959> do<00:11:57.040> see
So talk to me about how you do see
So talk to me about how you do see
headcount.<00:11:57.760> Like<00:11:57.920> when<00:11:58.160> do<00:11:58.320> you<00:11:58.480> decide<00:11:58.880> it<00:11:59.120> is
headcount. Like when do you decide it is
headcount. Like when do you decide it is
time<00:11:59.440> to<00:11:59.680> add<00:11:59.839> another<00:12:00.079> role?<00:12:00.399> When<00:12:00.560> do<00:12:00.640> you
time to add another role? When do you
time to add another role? When do you
need<00:12:00.959> more<00:12:01.200> humans?<00:12:02.000> What<00:12:02.240> threshold<00:12:02.800> do<00:12:02.959> you
need more humans? What threshold do you
need more humans? What threshold do you
have<00:12:03.200> to<00:12:03.360> hit<00:12:03.600> to<00:12:03.760> decide<00:12:04.000> you<00:12:04.240> want<00:12:04.320> to<00:12:04.399> hire
have to hit to decide you want to hire
have to hit to decide you want to hire
someone?<00:12:05.680> And<00:12:06.320> like<00:12:06.639> what<00:12:06.800> are<00:12:06.959> your<00:12:07.279> general
someone? And like what are your general
someone? And like what are your general
what's<00:12:07.920> the<00:12:08.160> company's<00:12:08.480> general<00:12:08.800> philosophy
what's the company's general philosophy
what's the company's general philosophy
on<00:12:10.800> headcount<00:12:11.360> growth?
on headcount growth?
on headcount growth?
Yeah,<00:12:12.480> I<00:12:12.720> think<00:12:12.880> when<00:12:13.040> I<00:12:13.279> joined<00:12:13.519> the<00:12:13.760> company,
Yeah, I think when I joined the company,
Yeah, I think when I joined the company,
you<00:12:14.720> know,<00:12:14.800> it's<00:12:15.120> very<00:12:15.279> much<00:12:15.440> an<00:12:15.680> assessment
you know, it's very much an assessment
you know, it's very much an assessment
of<00:12:16.480> like<00:12:16.800> where<00:12:17.040> are<00:12:17.279> things<00:12:17.680> where<00:12:17.839> do<00:12:18.000> we
of like where are things where do we
of like where are things where do we
want<00:12:18.320> them<00:12:18.480> to<00:12:18.639> be?<00:12:19.200> Um,<00:12:20.480> and<00:12:20.959> I<00:12:21.279> remembered
want them to be? Um, and I remembered
want them to be? Um, and I remembered
coming<00:12:22.399> into<00:12:22.639> the<00:12:22.800> company<00:12:22.959> and<00:12:23.200> seeing<00:12:23.440> there
coming into the company and seeing there
coming into the company and seeing there
was<00:12:23.760> this<00:12:24.000> goal<00:12:24.240> like,<00:12:24.560> you<00:12:24.639> know,<00:12:24.800> go<00:12:24.959> up
was this goal like, you know, go up
was this goal like, you know, go up
market<00:12:25.440> to<00:12:25.680> enterprise<00:12:26.240> in<00:12:26.560> 2023.<00:12:28.000> And<00:12:28.560> I<00:12:28.959> look
market to enterprise in 2023. And I look
market to enterprise in 2023. And I look
at<00:12:29.279> our<00:12:29.760> team<00:12:30.800> team<00:12:31.600> and<00:12:31.920> it<00:12:32.160> was<00:12:32.399> like<00:12:32.639> we<00:12:32.880> have
at our team team and it was like we have
at our team team and it was like we have
like<00:12:33.200> one<00:12:33.440> salesperson<00:12:33.920> and<00:12:34.160> a<00:12:34.320> second<00:12:34.480> one
like one salesperson and a second one
like one salesperson and a second one
who<00:12:34.800> had<00:12:34.959> just<00:12:35.120> joined<00:12:35.839> and<00:12:36.079> I<00:12:36.320> was<00:12:36.399> like<00:12:36.959> so
who had just joined and I was like so
who had just joined and I was like so
like<00:12:38.079> how<00:12:38.240> are<00:12:38.399> we<00:12:38.560> going<00:12:38.639> to<00:12:38.720> go<00:12:38.880> up<00:12:39.040> market<00:12:39.279> to
like how are we going to go up market to
like how are we going to go up market to
enterprise<00:12:39.839> with<00:12:40.160> two<00:12:40.399> salespeople<00:12:41.279> like
enterprise with two salespeople like
enterprise with two salespeople like
like<00:12:42.320> so<00:12:42.480> I<00:12:42.720> immediately<00:12:43.200> like<00:12:43.440> crossed<00:12:43.680> that
like so I immediately like crossed that
like so I immediately like crossed that
goal<00:12:44.240> off<00:12:44.399> the<00:12:44.720> the<00:12:45.040> list<00:12:45.200> and<00:12:45.440> it<00:12:45.600> was<00:12:45.680> just
goal off the the list and it was just
goal off the the list and it was just
like<00:12:46.079> no<00:12:46.320> I'm<00:12:46.480> not<00:12:46.639> signing<00:12:46.880> up<00:12:47.040> for<00:12:47.120> this<00:12:47.440> like
like no I'm not signing up for this like
like no I'm not signing up for this like
we<00:12:47.839> don't<00:12:47.920> have<00:12:48.000> a<00:12:48.240> team<00:12:48.560> to<00:12:48.800> go<00:12:48.959> do<00:12:49.120> it<00:12:49.519> right
we don't have a team to go do it right
we don't have a team to go do it right
and<00:12:50.160> so<00:12:50.320> then<00:12:50.480> we<00:12:50.639> need<00:12:50.720> to<00:12:50.880> have<00:12:50.959> like<00:12:51.120> a<00:12:51.360> hard
and so then we need to have like a hard
and so then we need to have like a hard
conversation<00:12:52.240> about<00:12:52.560> like<00:12:52.800> focus<00:12:53.200> and<00:12:53.519> what
conversation about like focus and what
conversation about like focus and what
are<00:12:53.839> we<00:12:54.000> going<00:12:54.079> to<00:12:54.160> be<00:12:54.320> good<00:12:54.399> at<00:12:54.639> this<00:12:54.800> year
are we going to be good at this year
are we going to be good at this year
right<00:12:55.200> and<00:12:55.360> what<00:12:55.519> are<00:12:55.680> we<00:12:55.760> going<00:12:55.839> to<00:12:55.920> do<00:12:56.000> with
right and what are we going to do with
right and what are we going to do with
the<00:12:56.320> team<00:12:56.399> that<00:12:56.639> we<00:12:56.800> have<00:12:57.279> and<00:12:57.440> And<00:12:57.519> then<00:12:57.760> also
the team that we have and And then also
the team that we have and And then also
having<00:12:58.160> a<00:12:58.320> conversation<00:12:58.639> about<00:12:58.800> like<00:12:59.040> I<00:12:59.200> think
having a conversation about like I think
having a conversation about like I think
we<00:12:59.440> need<00:12:59.600> to<00:12:59.839> grow<00:13:00.079> this<00:13:00.320> business<00:13:00.639> because<00:13:00.880> in
we need to grow this business because in
we need to grow this business because in
some<00:13:01.279> ways<00:13:01.600> you<00:13:01.760> know<00:13:02.160> we<00:13:02.399> were<00:13:02.560> almost
some ways you know we were almost
some ways you know we were almost
strangling<00:13:05.279> you<00:13:05.440> know<00:13:05.600> what<00:13:05.839> could<00:13:06.079> have<00:13:06.320> been
strangling you know what could have been
strangling you know what could have been
by<00:13:07.279> not<00:13:07.519> hiring<00:13:08.079> fast<00:13:08.399> enough<00:13:08.959> right<00:13:09.839> so<00:13:10.320> in
by not hiring fast enough right so in
by not hiring fast enough right so in
some<00:13:10.800> ways<00:13:11.279> I<00:13:11.519> came<00:13:11.680> in<00:13:11.839> and<00:13:12.000> was<00:13:12.079> like<00:13:12.320> we<00:13:12.480> need
some ways I came in and was like we need
some ways I came in and was like we need
to<00:13:12.639> hire<00:13:12.880> more<00:13:13.120> people<00:13:13.600> right<00:13:14.800> that<00:13:15.040> doesn't
to hire more people right that doesn't
to hire more people right that doesn't
necessarily<00:13:15.760> mean<00:13:16.000> hiring<00:13:16.399> like<00:13:16.560> a<00:13:16.800> 100
necessarily mean hiring like a 100
necessarily mean hiring like a 100
person<00:13:17.519> sales<00:13:17.839> team<00:13:18.320> tomorrow<00:13:19.040> right<00:13:19.360> but
person sales team tomorrow right but
person sales team tomorrow right but
let's<00:13:19.760> talk<00:13:20.000> about<00:13:20.480> like<00:13:20.720> what<00:13:20.880> that<00:13:21.120> looks
let's talk about like what that looks
let's talk about like what that looks
like<00:13:21.600> right<00:13:21.839> so<00:13:22.000> at<00:13:22.160> the<00:13:22.320> beginning<00:13:23.040> it<00:13:23.360> was
like right so at the beginning it was
like right so at the beginning it was
very<00:13:23.760> much<00:13:24.000> like<00:13:24.320> okay<00:13:24.639> let's<00:13:24.959> hire<00:13:26.160> you<00:13:26.320> know
very much like okay let's hire you know
very much like okay let's hire you know
two<00:13:26.720> or<00:13:26.880> three<00:13:26.959> sales<00:13:27.200> people<00:13:27.440> at<00:13:27.519> a<00:13:27.760> time<00:13:28.079> as
two or three sales people at a time as
two or three sales people at a time as
an<00:13:28.399> example<00:13:29.200> and<00:13:29.360> then<00:13:29.600> just<00:13:29.760> like<00:13:30.000> see<00:13:30.240> how<00:13:30.560> we
an example and then just like see how we
an example and then just like see how we
feel,<00:13:31.360> right?<00:13:31.920> Because<00:13:32.079> I'<00:13:32.320> I've<00:13:32.639> seen<00:13:32.800> it<00:13:33.200> so
feel, right? Because I' I've seen it so
feel, right? Because I' I've seen it so
many<00:13:33.680> times<00:13:34.000> before<00:13:34.320> where<00:13:34.639> you<00:13:34.800> hire<00:13:35.040> these
many times before where you hire these
many times before where you hire these
like<00:13:35.680> massive<00:13:36.079> sales<00:13:36.320> teams<00:13:36.639> and<00:13:36.800> you<00:13:36.880> have<00:13:36.959> a
like massive sales teams and you have a
like massive sales teams and you have a
bunch<00:13:37.120> of<00:13:37.200> people<00:13:37.360> going<00:13:37.519> around,<00:13:37.680> they<00:13:37.839> don't
bunch of people going around, they don't
bunch of people going around, they don't
know<00:13:38.079> how<00:13:38.160> to<00:13:38.240> sell<00:13:38.399> anything,<00:13:38.720> they<00:13:38.880> don't
know how to sell anything, they don't
know how to sell anything, they don't
know<00:13:39.120> the<00:13:39.279> product,<00:13:40.160> they're<00:13:40.800> selling<00:13:41.040> things
know the product, they're selling things
know the product, they're selling things
that<00:13:41.440> don't<00:13:41.680> exist<00:13:42.079> with<00:13:42.320> the<00:13:42.480> hope<00:13:42.639> that<00:13:42.800> the
that don't exist with the hope that the
that don't exist with the hope that the
product<00:13:43.120> team<00:13:43.279> will<00:13:43.519> build<00:13:43.680> it.<00:13:44.240> Um,<00:13:44.639> you
product team will build it. Um, you
product team will build it. Um, you
know,<00:13:44.880> and<00:13:45.040> all<00:13:45.200> of<00:13:45.279> these<00:13:45.440> like<00:13:45.600> bad<00:13:45.839> things
know, and all of these like bad things
know, and all of these like bad things
can<00:13:46.240> happen,<00:13:46.560> right?<00:13:46.720> So,<00:13:46.880> like<00:13:47.040> just<00:13:47.200> kind<00:13:47.360> of
can happen, right? So, like just kind of
can happen, right? So, like just kind of
like<00:13:47.600> starting<00:13:47.920> slow<00:13:48.160> and<00:13:48.399> building<00:13:48.560> up<00:13:48.800> your
like starting slow and building up your
like starting slow and building up your
kind<00:13:49.200> of<00:13:49.279> like<00:13:49.600> base<00:13:50.079> organization<00:13:51.519> and<00:13:51.760> then
kind of like base organization and then
kind of like base organization and then
feeling<00:13:52.240> like,<00:13:52.560> okay,<00:13:52.800> great.<00:13:53.120> there's<00:13:53.440> like
feeling like, okay, great. there's like
feeling like, okay, great. there's like
a<00:13:54.079> lot<00:13:54.240> of<00:13:54.320> opportunity<00:13:54.800> here<00:13:54.959> and<00:13:55.120> now<00:13:55.279> that
a lot of opportunity here and now that
a lot of opportunity here and now that
we're<00:13:55.600> talking<00:13:55.760> to<00:13:55.920> customers<00:13:56.320> we<00:13:56.480> have<00:13:56.560> a
we're talking to customers we have a
we're talking to customers we have a
better<00:13:56.880> sense<00:13:56.959> of<00:13:57.120> what<00:13:57.279> that<00:13:57.440> opportunity<00:13:58.000> is
better sense of what that opportunity is
better sense of what that opportunity is
especially<00:13:59.600> you<00:13:59.680> know<00:13:59.839> as<00:14:00.000> we<00:14:00.160> go<00:14:00.320> up<00:14:00.480> market
especially you know as we go up market
especially you know as we go up market
and<00:14:01.360> then<00:14:01.600> you<00:14:01.760> know<00:14:01.839> in<00:14:02.000> 2025<00:14:02.800> was<00:14:03.040> the<00:14:03.279> first
and then you know in 2025 was the first
and then you know in 2025 was the first
year<00:14:03.680> that<00:14:03.920> I<00:14:04.079> was<00:14:04.160> like<00:14:04.320> okay<00:14:04.480> we<00:14:04.639> can<00:14:04.720> add
year that I was like okay we can add
year that I was like okay we can add
this<00:14:05.040> goal<00:14:05.279> back<00:14:05.600> right<00:14:06.320> um<00:14:06.480> we<00:14:06.720> have<00:14:06.800> a<00:14:06.959> team
this goal back right um we have a team
this goal back right um we have a team
to<00:14:07.519> actually<00:14:07.839> do<00:14:08.079> this<00:14:08.720> you<00:14:08.880> know<00:14:09.040> go<00:14:09.199> further
to actually do this you know go further
to actually do this you know go further
up<00:14:09.680> market<00:14:09.839> to<00:14:10.000> enterprise<00:14:11.279> um<00:14:11.519> we're<00:14:11.760> going
up market to enterprise um we're going
up market to enterprise um we're going
to<00:14:11.920> introduce<00:14:12.399> like<00:14:12.880> a<00:14:13.120> segment<00:14:14.480> um<00:14:15.519> called
to introduce like a segment um called
to introduce like a segment um called
enterprise<00:14:16.320> and<00:14:16.480> we're<00:14:16.639> going<00:14:16.639> to<00:14:16.720> have
enterprise and we're going to have
enterprise and we're going to have
people<00:14:17.120> like<00:14:17.360> solely<00:14:17.760> dedicated<00:14:18.240> to<00:14:18.399> that
people like solely dedicated to that
people like solely dedicated to that
effort<00:14:19.199> we're<00:14:19.360> going<00:14:19.440> to<00:14:19.519> have<00:14:19.680> enough<00:14:19.839> people
effort we're going to have enough people
effort we're going to have enough people
in<00:14:20.240> marketing<00:14:20.560> to<00:14:20.800> support<00:14:21.040> it<00:14:21.920> um<00:14:22.160> and<00:14:22.399> we<00:14:22.560> can
in marketing to support it um and we can
in marketing to support it um and we can
actually<00:14:23.040> do<00:14:23.279> that,<00:14:23.680> right?<00:14:23.920> But<00:14:24.000> I<00:14:24.160> think<00:14:24.240> you
actually do that, right? But I think you
actually do that, right? But I think you
just<00:14:24.560> have<00:14:24.720> to<00:14:24.800> be<00:14:24.880> realistic<00:14:25.279> with<00:14:25.600> like
just have to be realistic with like
just have to be realistic with like
where<00:14:26.079> the<00:14:26.240> company<00:14:26.480> is<00:14:26.639> at<00:14:26.880> a<00:14:27.040> given<00:14:27.199> point<00:14:27.279> in
where the company is at a given point in
where the company is at a given point in
time.<00:14:28.240> But<00:14:28.399> I<00:14:28.560> think<00:14:28.720> like<00:14:29.199> philosophically
time. But I think like philosophically
time. But I think like philosophically
it<00:14:30.480> always<00:14:30.800> came<00:14:30.959> from<00:14:31.199> this<00:14:31.440> place<00:14:31.600> of<00:14:31.839> like
it always came from this place of like
it always came from this place of like
we<00:14:33.440> want<00:14:33.600> to<00:14:33.760> hire<00:14:34.240> only<00:14:34.959> really<00:14:35.279> great
we want to hire only really great
we want to hire only really great
people.<00:14:36.160> Um<00:14:36.399> and<00:14:36.639> we<00:14:36.880> don't<00:14:37.040> want<00:14:37.120> to<00:14:37.279> hire,
people. Um and we don't want to hire,
people. Um and we don't want to hire,
you<00:14:38.320> know,<00:14:38.480> just<00:14:38.720> bodies<00:14:39.440> to<00:14:39.760> to<00:14:40.079> fill<00:14:40.320> seats,
you know, just bodies to to fill seats,
you know, just bodies to to fill seats,
right?<00:14:41.440> And<00:14:41.680> that's<00:14:41.920> really<00:14:42.240> important<00:14:42.480> to
right? And that's really important to
right? And that's really important to
us.<00:14:43.040> And<00:14:43.199> then<00:14:43.440> also<00:14:44.000> feeling<00:14:44.399> like<00:14:45.199> we<00:14:45.519> could
us. And then also feeling like we could
us. And then also feeling like we could
grow<00:14:45.920> the<00:14:46.240> company<00:14:46.560> but<00:14:46.800> not<00:14:47.040> necessarily
grow the company but not necessarily
grow the company but not necessarily
have<00:14:47.920> to<00:14:48.079> grow<00:14:48.240> it<00:14:48.560> purely<00:14:49.120> just<00:14:49.360> through
have to grow it purely just through
have to grow it purely just through
headcount,<00:14:50.160> right?<00:14:50.399> though,<00:14:50.959> you<00:14:51.120> know,
headcount, right? though, you know,
headcount, right? though, you know,
linear<00:14:52.160> not<00:14:52.399> growing<00:14:52.800> linearly.<00:14:54.000> Um,<00:14:55.040> and<00:14:55.680> so
linear not growing linearly. Um, and so
linear not growing linearly. Um, and so
what<00:14:56.079> does<00:14:56.240> that<00:14:56.399> require?<00:14:56.720> If<00:14:56.880> you<00:14:56.959> think
what does that require? If you think
what does that require? If you think
about<00:14:57.360> support,<00:14:57.839> right?<00:14:58.480> Often<00:14:58.880> as<00:14:59.199> you<00:14:59.360> grow
about support, right? Often as you grow
about support, right? Often as you grow
more<00:15:00.079> and<00:15:00.240> more<00:15:00.399> users,<00:15:00.720> they<00:15:01.040> write<00:15:01.279> into
more and more users, they write into
more and more users, they write into
support<00:15:02.480> and<00:15:02.720> and<00:15:03.120> so<00:15:03.360> that<00:15:03.680> team<00:15:03.920> kind<00:15:04.160> of
support and and so that team kind of
support and and so that team kind of
grows<00:15:04.480> linearly.<00:15:05.199> But<00:15:05.360> for,<00:15:05.760> you<00:15:05.920> know,<00:15:06.079> the
grows linearly. But for, you know, the
grows linearly. But for, you know, the
first<00:15:06.560> couple<00:15:06.720> years<00:15:06.880> that<00:15:07.040> I<00:15:07.199> was<00:15:07.279> at<00:15:07.360> the
first couple years that I was at the
first couple years that I was at the
company,<00:15:07.760> we<00:15:07.920> didn't<00:15:08.079> really<00:15:08.320> have<00:15:08.560> to<00:15:08.720> grow
company, we didn't really have to grow
company, we didn't really have to grow
that<00:15:09.199> team<00:15:09.600> that<00:15:10.000> much.<00:15:10.480> So<00:15:10.720> the<00:15:10.959> question<00:15:11.120> was
that team that much. So the question was
that team that much. So the question was
like<00:15:11.680> how<00:15:11.920> could<00:15:12.079> we<00:15:12.560> gain<00:15:12.959> in<00:15:13.360> efficiencies
like how could we gain in efficiencies
like how could we gain in efficiencies
with<00:15:14.160> like<00:15:14.639> better<00:15:14.959> tooling<00:15:16.000> uh<00:15:16.160> better
with like better tooling uh better
with like better tooling uh better
connection<00:15:17.040> between<00:15:17.360> like<00:15:17.600> our<00:15:17.839> support<00:15:18.079> team
connection between like our support team
connection between like our support team
and<00:15:18.480> engineering<00:15:18.959> so<00:15:19.120> that<00:15:19.279> we<00:15:19.440> can<00:15:19.600> fix
and engineering so that we can fix
and engineering so that we can fix
things<00:15:20.639> um<00:15:20.720> that<00:15:20.880> are<00:15:21.040> clearly<00:15:21.680> causing<00:15:22.240> more
things um that are clearly causing more
things um that are clearly causing more
tickets<00:15:22.800> to<00:15:22.880> come<00:15:23.040> in<00:15:23.360> right<00:15:23.839> what<00:15:24.079> are<00:15:24.160> the
tickets to come in right what are the
tickets to come in right what are the
ways<00:15:24.560> that<00:15:24.800> we<00:15:25.040> can<00:15:25.279> make<00:15:25.519> gains<00:15:25.839> on<00:15:26.079> some<00:15:26.240> of
ways that we can make gains on some of
ways that we can make gains on some of
these<00:15:26.639> things<00:15:27.199> now<00:15:27.440> you<00:15:27.680> have<00:15:27.839> like<00:15:28.079> AI<00:15:28.480> and
these things now you have like AI and
these things now you have like AI and
other<00:15:28.880> types<00:15:29.120> of<00:15:29.279> tools<00:15:29.600> that<00:15:29.920> hopefully
other types of tools that hopefully
other types of tools that hopefully
helps<00:15:30.720> your<00:15:30.959> team<00:15:31.440> ultimately<00:15:31.760> become<00:15:32.079> more
helps your team ultimately become more
helps your team ultimately become more
efficient<00:15:33.120> um<00:15:33.279> ways<00:15:33.519> that<00:15:33.760> your<00:15:33.920> own<00:15:34.079> internal
efficient um ways that your own internal
efficient um ways that your own internal
teams<00:15:34.800> can<00:15:34.959> build<00:15:35.199> tools<00:15:36.000> for<00:15:36.240> themselves
teams can build tools for themselves
teams can build tools for themselves
where<00:15:37.199> historically<00:15:37.519> they<00:15:37.760> would<00:15:37.839> have
where historically they would have
where historically they would have
needed<00:15:38.160> an<00:15:38.399> engineer<00:15:38.720> to<00:15:38.800> go<00:15:39.040> build<00:15:39.199> that<00:15:39.360> tool
needed an engineer to go build that tool
needed an engineer to go build that tool
for
for
for
Right.<00:15:40.720> So,<00:15:41.120> I<00:15:41.279> I<00:15:41.519> look<00:15:41.680> at<00:15:41.760> it<00:15:41.920> very<00:15:42.160> much<00:15:42.240> as<00:15:42.399> a
Right. So, I I look at it very much as a
Right. So, I I look at it very much as a
like<00:15:43.199> ideally<00:15:43.760> the<00:15:44.079> like<00:15:44.320> number<00:15:44.560> of<00:15:44.800> tickets
like ideally the like number of tickets
like ideally the like number of tickets
per<00:15:45.600> support<00:15:46.079> rep<00:15:46.399> is<00:15:46.639> going<00:15:46.880> up<00:15:47.360> over<00:15:47.760> time<00:15:48.880> so
per support rep is going up over time so
per support rep is going up over time so
that<00:15:49.279> we're<00:15:49.519> not<00:15:49.680> just<00:15:50.240> simply<00:15:50.639> adding<00:15:51.040> bodies
that we're not just simply adding bodies
that we're not just simply adding bodies
to<00:15:51.680> like<00:15:52.000> solve<00:15:52.320> problems.<00:15:53.360> Um,<00:15:54.079> and<00:15:54.480> you
to like solve problems. Um, and you
to like solve problems. Um, and you
know,<00:15:54.720> I<00:15:54.880> think<00:15:54.959> you<00:15:55.199> can<00:15:55.279> do<00:15:55.360> that<00:15:55.600> as<00:15:55.839> long<00:15:55.920> as
know, I think you can do that as long as
know, I think you can do that as long as
you're<00:15:56.320> continuously<00:15:56.959> being<00:15:58.000> um<00:15:58.240> cognizant
you're continuously being um cognizant
you're continuously being um cognizant
of<00:15:58.959> like<00:15:59.199> what's<00:15:59.600> coming<00:15:59.839> for<00:16:00.079> you<00:16:00.720> in<00:16:00.959> the
of like what's coming for you in the
of like what's coming for you in the
future.<00:16:01.519> And<00:16:01.680> we've<00:16:02.000> also<00:16:02.240> had<00:16:02.480> really<00:16:02.720> strong
future. And we've also had really strong
future. And we've also had really strong
points<00:16:03.680> of<00:16:03.839> view<00:16:04.000> around<00:16:04.560> like<00:16:04.800> not
points of view around like not
points of view around like not
outsourcing<00:16:05.759> as<00:16:05.920> an<00:16:06.079> example.<00:16:06.639> So,<00:16:06.800> that's
outsourcing as an example. So, that's
outsourcing as an example. So, that's
one<00:16:07.279> way<00:16:07.440> to<00:16:07.680> not<00:16:07.920> grow<00:16:08.160> headcount<00:16:08.720> is<00:16:08.959> that
one way to not grow headcount is that
one way to not grow headcount is that
you<00:16:09.440> hire<00:16:09.680> a<00:16:09.759> bunch<00:16:09.920> of<00:16:10.079> contractors<00:16:11.279> um<00:16:11.440> who
you hire a bunch of contractors um who
you hire a bunch of contractors um who
aren't<00:16:11.839> full-time<00:16:12.240> employees.<00:16:13.040> We've
aren't full-time employees. We've
aren't full-time employees. We've
explicitly<00:16:13.839> said<00:16:14.079> we<00:16:14.320> don't<00:16:14.560> want<00:16:14.639> to<00:16:14.800> do<00:16:14.880> that
explicitly said we don't want to do that
explicitly said we don't want to do that
when<00:16:15.360> it<00:16:15.440> comes<00:16:15.600> to<00:16:15.759> things<00:16:16.000> like<00:16:16.240> support<00:16:16.560> and
when it comes to things like support and
when it comes to things like support and
sales.<00:16:17.279> And<00:16:17.600> we<00:16:17.920> want<00:16:18.000> to<00:16:18.160> feel<00:16:18.320> like<00:16:18.480> we<00:16:18.639> own
sales. And we want to feel like we own
sales. And we want to feel like we own
the<00:16:19.120> experience<00:16:19.759> and<00:16:20.000> that<00:16:20.160> we<00:16:20.320> provide<00:16:20.560> a
the experience and that we provide a
the experience and that we provide a
really<00:16:20.880> high<00:16:21.040> quality<00:16:21.440> experience<00:16:21.839> not<00:16:22.000> just
really high quality experience not just
really high quality experience not just
in<00:16:22.320> the<00:16:22.560> product,<00:16:22.800> but<00:16:23.040> in<00:16:23.519> the<00:16:23.839> people<00:16:24.079> who
in the product, but in the people who
in the product, but in the people who
help<00:16:24.720> serve<00:16:24.959> you<00:16:25.199> when<00:16:25.360> you<00:16:25.440> have<00:16:25.600> a<00:16:25.759> question
help serve you when you have a question
help serve you when you have a question
um<00:16:26.720> and<00:16:26.959> you<00:16:27.120> want<00:16:27.199> to<00:16:27.279> talk<00:16:27.440> to<00:16:27.600> someone.<00:16:28.240> So,
um and you want to talk to someone. So,
um and you want to talk to someone. So,
making<00:16:28.800> sure<00:16:28.880> that<00:16:29.040> we<00:16:29.199> kind<00:16:29.360> of<00:16:29.440> hold<00:16:29.680> true<00:16:29.920> to
making sure that we kind of hold true to
making sure that we kind of hold true to
those<00:16:30.320> values<00:16:30.800> and<00:16:31.040> and<00:16:31.360> what<00:16:31.519> those<00:16:31.759> bring.
those values and and what those bring.
those values and and what those bring.
Um,<00:16:32.720> and<00:16:32.880> then<00:16:33.120> making<00:16:33.279> sure<00:16:33.440> that<00:16:33.600> we're<00:16:33.759> like
Um, and then making sure that we're like
Um, and then making sure that we're like
making<00:16:34.160> efficiency<00:16:34.720> gains<00:16:34.959> as<00:16:35.199> we<00:16:35.360> grow<00:16:35.839> and
making efficiency gains as we grow and
making efficiency gains as we grow and
not<00:16:36.320> just<00:16:36.639> necessarily<00:16:37.360> like<00:16:37.600> bringing<00:16:37.920> more
not just necessarily like bringing more
not just necessarily like bringing more
people<00:16:38.399> on<00:16:38.720> to<00:16:38.959> solve<00:16:39.759> problems<00:16:40.560> um<00:16:40.639> that
people on to solve problems um that
people on to solve problems um that
could<00:16:41.040> very<00:16:41.279> easily<00:16:41.600> be<00:16:41.759> solved<00:16:42.079> by,<00:16:42.720> you
could very easily be solved by, you
could very easily be solved by, you
know,<00:16:43.120> tooling<00:16:43.680> or<00:16:44.160> software.<00:16:44.800> Like<00:16:45.199> I<00:16:45.519> always
know, tooling or software. Like I always
know, tooling or software. Like I always
am<00:16:46.079> like,<00:16:46.480> can<00:16:46.639> we<00:16:46.880> buy<00:16:47.120> software<00:16:47.440> to<00:16:47.600> solve
am like, can we buy software to solve
am like, can we buy software to solve
this<00:16:47.920> problem?<00:16:48.240> Do<00:16:48.399> we<00:16:48.560> need<00:16:48.639> to
this problem? Do we need to
this problem? Do we need to
hire<00:16:49.759> someone<00:16:50.079> to<00:16:50.240> do<00:16:50.399> this?<00:16:50.639> Is<00:16:50.800> this<00:16:50.959> is<00:16:51.199> this
hire someone to do this? Is this is this
hire someone to do this? Is this is this
a<00:16:51.519> job?<00:16:51.839> Like<00:16:52.000> those<00:16:52.160> are<00:16:52.320> all<00:16:52.480> questions<00:16:52.800> I
a job? Like those are all questions I
a job? Like those are all questions I
think<00:16:53.120> that<00:16:53.279> we<00:16:53.360> should<00:16:53.519> be<00:16:53.600> asking<00:16:53.920> ourselves
think that we should be asking ourselves
think that we should be asking ourselves
before<00:16:55.040> we<00:16:55.199> just<00:16:55.440> like<00:16:55.680> unlock<00:16:56.079> headcount<00:16:56.639> and
before we just like unlock headcount and
before we just like unlock headcount and
let<00:16:57.040> people<00:16:57.519> hire<00:16:57.759> willy-nilly.<00:16:59.120> Do<00:16:59.360> you
let people hire willy-nilly. Do you
let people hire willy-nilly. Do you
think<00:16:59.680> that<00:17:00.160> this<00:17:00.560> approach<00:17:00.880> and<00:17:01.120> philosophy
think that this approach and philosophy
think that this approach and philosophy
like<00:17:02.079> I<00:17:02.320> think<00:17:02.639> thinking<00:17:02.959> about<00:17:03.199> are<00:17:03.360> there
like I think thinking about are there
like I think thinking about are there
other<00:17:03.680> ways<00:17:03.839> to<00:17:04.000> solve<00:17:04.240> problems<00:17:04.480> other<00:17:04.720> than
other ways to solve problems other than
other ways to solve problems other than
other<00:17:05.280> than<00:17:05.360> headcount<00:17:06.079> probably<00:17:06.400> scales
other than headcount probably scales
other than headcount probably scales
forever<00:17:07.199> but<00:17:07.919> you've<00:17:09.120> seen<00:17:09.439> in<00:17:09.919> your<00:17:10.319> past
forever but you've seen in your past
forever but you've seen in your past
roles<00:17:10.880> and<00:17:11.120> you<00:17:11.199> know<00:17:11.280> at<00:17:11.439> Stripe<00:17:11.760> which<00:17:11.919> I
roles and you know at Stripe which I
roles and you know at Stripe which I
want<00:17:12.160> to<00:17:12.240> talk<00:17:12.400> about<00:17:12.640> like<00:17:13.199> massive<00:17:13.919> scaling.
want to talk about like massive scaling.
want to talk about like massive scaling.
Do<00:17:14.559> you<00:17:14.640> think<00:17:14.880> this<00:17:15.120> approach<00:17:15.360> that<00:17:15.520> you're
Do you think this approach that you're
Do you think this approach that you're
taking<00:17:15.919> now<00:17:16.720> doesn't<00:17:17.039> work<00:17:17.199> at<00:17:17.439> any<00:17:17.600> point<00:17:17.919> or
taking now doesn't work at any point or
taking now doesn't work at any point or
at<00:17:18.319> some<00:17:18.480> point<00:17:18.640> you'll<00:17:18.880> be<00:17:19.039> trading<00:17:19.360> off
at some point you'll be trading off
at some point you'll be trading off
actual<00:17:20.079> ability<00:17:20.400> to<00:17:20.559> grow<00:17:20.880> because<00:17:21.280> you<00:17:21.439> know
actual ability to grow because you know
actual ability to grow because you know
maybe<00:17:22.319> you<00:17:22.559> could<00:17:22.720> have<00:17:22.880> gone<00:17:23.039> up<00:17:23.280> market<00:17:23.520> a
maybe you could have gone up market a
maybe you could have gone up market a
few<00:17:23.839> years<00:17:24.000> ago<00:17:24.160> if<00:17:24.319> you'd<00:17:24.559> been<00:17:24.640> willing<00:17:24.880> to
few years ago if you'd been willing to
few years ago if you'd been willing to
just<00:17:25.199> hire<00:17:25.839> 100<00:17:26.000> reps<00:17:26.319> and<00:17:26.480> obviously<00:17:26.720> you
just hire 100 reps and obviously you
just hire 100 reps and obviously you
decided<00:17:27.120> that<00:17:27.360> wasn't<00:17:27.520> worth<00:17:27.679> the<00:17:27.919> downsides
decided that wasn't worth the downsides
decided that wasn't worth the downsides
of<00:17:28.400> doing<00:17:28.559> that<00:17:28.799> but<00:17:28.960> like<00:17:29.360> at<00:17:29.679> some<00:17:29.840> point<00:17:30.080> are
of doing that but like at some point are
of doing that but like at some point are
you<00:17:30.400> going<00:17:30.480> to<00:17:30.559> be<00:17:30.720> constraining<00:17:31.120> your<00:17:31.280> own
you going to be constraining your own
you going to be constraining your own
growth<00:17:31.760> by<00:17:32.480> continuing<00:17:32.960> to<00:17:33.120> hold<00:17:33.360> this<00:17:33.679> bar<00:17:34.559> or
growth by continuing to hold this bar or
growth by continuing to hold this bar or
is<00:17:35.679> this<00:17:35.919> bar<00:17:36.160> what's<00:17:36.480> going<00:17:36.559> to<00:17:36.640> contribute
is this bar what's going to contribute
is this bar what's going to contribute
to<00:17:37.039> your<00:17:37.200> growth<00:17:37.520> because<00:17:38.480> you<00:17:38.720> just
to your growth because you just
to your growth because you just
fundamentally<00:17:39.520> believe<00:17:39.760> that<00:17:40.480> the<00:17:40.799> craft<00:17:41.200> can
fundamentally believe that the craft can
fundamentally believe that the craft can
only<00:17:41.679> come<00:17:41.919> if<00:17:42.160> you<00:17:42.320> continue<00:17:42.640> to<00:17:43.280> hold<00:17:43.520> this
only come if you continue to hold this
only come if you continue to hold this
are.<00:17:44.080> Yeah,<00:17:45.039> I<00:17:45.280> think<00:17:45.440> it's<00:17:45.600> a<00:17:45.760> little<00:17:45.840> bit<00:17:46.000> of
are. Yeah, I think it's a little bit of
are. Yeah, I think it's a little bit of
both.<00:17:46.559> Like<00:17:47.120> I<00:17:48.320> firmly<00:17:48.880> believe<00:17:49.520> that<00:17:49.840> we<00:17:50.080> have
both. Like I firmly believe that we have
both. Like I firmly believe that we have
to<00:17:50.480> continue<00:17:50.720> to<00:17:50.960> hire<00:17:51.360> like<00:17:51.600> really
to continue to hire like really
to continue to hire like really
highquality<00:17:52.559> people<00:17:53.200> and<00:17:53.600> you<00:17:53.840> know<00:17:54.400> we<00:17:54.720> work
highquality people and you know we work
highquality people and you know we work
with<00:17:55.120> customers,<00:17:55.840> developers<00:17:56.400> who<00:17:56.640> normally
with customers, developers who normally
with customers, developers who normally
don't<00:17:57.280> like<00:17:57.520> talking<00:17:57.760> to<00:17:58.000> sales<00:17:58.240> people<00:17:58.480> as<00:17:58.720> an
don't like talking to sales people as an
don't like talking to sales people as an
example,<00:17:59.360> right?<00:18:00.160> So<00:18:00.880> often<00:18:01.120> when<00:18:01.360> you<00:18:01.520> talk
example, right? So often when you talk
example, right? So often when you talk
about<00:18:01.760> companies<00:18:02.080> that<00:18:02.240> build<00:18:02.400> in<00:18:02.640> like
about companies that build in like
about companies that build in like
developer<00:18:03.200> tools<00:18:03.840> like<00:18:04.000> people<00:18:04.240> are<00:18:04.320> like<00:18:04.480> why
developer tools like people are like why
developer tools like people are like why
do<00:18:04.720> you<00:18:04.799> even<00:18:04.880> need<00:18:05.039> sales<00:18:05.280> people?<00:18:05.440> The
do you even need sales people? The
do you even need sales people? The
product<00:18:05.840> should<00:18:06.000> just<00:18:06.080> like<00:18:06.240> sell<00:18:06.480> itself.
product should just like sell itself.
product should just like sell itself.
Then<00:18:07.039> I'm<00:18:07.200> like,<00:18:07.360> h<00:18:07.679> yeah,<00:18:07.919> we<00:18:08.320> I've<00:18:08.559> tried
Then I'm like, h yeah, we I've tried
Then I'm like, h yeah, we I've tried
that<00:18:08.880> at<00:18:09.120> other<00:18:09.280> companies,<00:18:09.600> but<00:18:09.760> it<00:18:09.919> doesn't
that at other companies, but it doesn't
that at other companies, but it doesn't
doesn't<00:18:10.400> always<00:18:10.640> work<00:18:10.799> that<00:18:10.960> way,<00:18:11.280> right?<00:18:12.080> And
doesn't always work that way, right? And
doesn't always work that way, right? And
you<00:18:12.799> know,<00:18:13.039> eventually<00:18:13.600> you<00:18:13.840> need<00:18:14.160> someone
you know, eventually you need someone
you know, eventually you need someone
who<00:18:15.600> is<00:18:16.000> like<00:18:16.320> convincing<00:18:16.960> and<00:18:17.280> thoughtful
who is like convincing and thoughtful
who is like convincing and thoughtful
and<00:18:18.240> consultative<00:18:19.200> to<00:18:19.520> come<00:18:19.679> into<00:18:19.919> the
and consultative to come into the
and consultative to come into the
equation<00:18:20.559> and<00:18:20.799> help<00:18:20.960> a<00:18:21.280> customer<00:18:21.760> make<00:18:21.919> that
equation and help a customer make that
equation and help a customer make that
decision<00:18:22.559> and<00:18:22.880> sometimes<00:18:23.280> like<00:18:23.760> navigate
decision and sometimes like navigate
decision and sometimes like navigate
their<00:18:24.559> own<00:18:24.880> organization.<00:18:26.320> And<00:18:26.880> you<00:18:27.039> know,
their own organization. And you know,
their own organization. And you know,
it's<00:18:27.520> not<00:18:27.679> in<00:18:28.080> like<00:18:28.880> we're<00:18:29.120> a<00:18:29.360> harder<00:18:29.679> cell
it's not in like we're a harder cell
it's not in like we're a harder cell
than<00:18:30.160> most<00:18:30.559> other<00:18:30.880> products<00:18:31.280> I've<00:18:31.520> worked
than most other products I've worked
than most other products I've worked
with<00:18:31.919> in<00:18:32.160> the<00:18:32.320> past.<00:18:32.799> like<00:18:33.280> you<00:18:33.440> know<00:18:33.600> there's
with in the past. like you know there's
with in the past. like you know there's
a<00:18:34.000> whole<00:18:34.240> set<00:18:34.400> of<00:18:34.559> like<00:18:34.720> organizational
a whole set of like organizational
a whole set of like organizational
change<00:18:36.240> elements<00:18:36.640> that<00:18:36.960> need<00:18:37.120> to<00:18:37.360> take<00:18:37.520> place
change elements that need to take place
change elements that need to take place
before<00:18:38.720> every<00:18:39.039> single<00:18:39.280> person<00:18:39.520> in<00:18:39.760> your
before every single person in your
before every single person in your
company<00:18:40.160> is<00:18:40.400> using<00:18:40.559> a<00:18:40.720> tool<00:18:41.039> like<00:18:41.280> ours<00:18:41.760> right
company is using a tool like ours right
company is using a tool like ours right
and<00:18:42.640> so<00:18:43.600> for<00:18:43.919> us<00:18:44.320> that<00:18:44.640> can<00:18:44.799> be<00:18:45.039> really
and so for us that can be really
and so for us that can be really
difficult<00:18:46.960> for
difficult for
difficult for
a<00:18:48.880> lot<00:18:48.960> of<00:18:49.120> people<00:18:50.160> um<00:18:50.320> and<00:18:50.559> so<00:18:50.720> I<00:18:50.880> I<00:18:51.200> really
a lot of people um and so I I really
a lot of people um and so I I really
value<00:18:52.080> like<00:18:52.400> holding<00:18:52.640> a<00:18:52.880> really<00:18:53.039> high<00:18:53.280> bar<00:18:53.600> for
value like holding a really high bar for
value like holding a really high bar for
salespeople<00:18:54.880> but<00:18:55.440> you<00:18:55.600> know<00:18:55.760> what's<00:18:56.080> required
salespeople but you know what's required
salespeople but you know what's required
of<00:18:56.720> like<00:18:57.280> someone<00:18:57.600> who<00:18:57.760> works<00:18:57.919> with<00:18:58.160> startups
of like someone who works with startups
of like someone who works with startups
as<00:18:58.880> an<00:18:58.960> example<00:18:59.440> and<00:18:59.760> someone<00:18:59.919> who<00:19:00.160> works<00:19:00.320> with
as an example and someone who works with
as an example and someone who works with
very<00:19:00.720> large<00:19:01.039> enterprises<00:19:02.080> is<00:19:02.400> different,
very large enterprises is different,
very large enterprises is different,
right?<00:19:03.760> Not<00:19:04.000> everyone<00:19:04.400> needs<00:19:04.640> to<00:19:04.799> necessarily
right? Not everyone needs to necessarily
right? Not everyone needs to necessarily
have<00:19:05.520> the<00:19:05.840> same<00:19:06.000> skill.<00:19:06.400> So,<00:19:06.559> while<00:19:06.799> I<00:19:06.960> still
have the same skill. So, while I still
have the same skill. So, while I still
feel<00:19:07.360> like<00:19:07.600> I<00:19:07.760> want<00:19:07.840> to<00:19:08.000> hold<00:19:08.160> a<00:19:08.320> really<00:19:08.559> high
feel like I want to hold a really high
feel like I want to hold a really high
bar,<00:19:09.919> um,<00:19:10.400> naturally<00:19:10.960> as<00:19:11.120> the<00:19:11.280> organization
bar, um, naturally as the organization
bar, um, naturally as the organization
grows,<00:19:12.559> you<00:19:12.720> know,<00:19:12.960> you<00:19:13.200> start<00:19:13.440> to<00:19:14.080> kind<00:19:14.320> of
grows, you know, you start to kind of
grows, you know, you start to kind of
narrow<00:19:14.960> the<00:19:15.200> scope<00:19:15.440> of<00:19:15.679> some<00:19:15.919> certain<00:19:16.480> roles
narrow the scope of some certain roles
narrow the scope of some certain roles
on<00:19:17.039> the<00:19:17.200> team<00:19:17.760> and<00:19:18.080> that<00:19:18.400> shifts<00:19:18.720> what<00:19:18.880> you're
on the team and that shifts what you're
on the team and that shifts what you're
looking<00:19:19.280> for<00:19:19.919> and<00:19:20.320> also<00:19:20.640> enables<00:19:20.960> you<00:19:21.120> to<00:19:21.280> take
looking for and also enables you to take
looking for and also enables you to take
more<00:19:21.600> chances<00:19:22.000> and<00:19:22.240> take<00:19:22.400> risks.<00:19:22.880> And<00:19:23.280> one<00:19:23.520> of
more chances and take risks. And one of
more chances and take risks. And one of
the<00:19:23.840> things<00:19:24.080> I've,<00:19:24.640> you<00:19:24.799> know,<00:19:24.960> worried<00:19:25.280> about
the things I've, you know, worried about
the things I've, you know, worried about
historically<00:19:26.000> is<00:19:26.160> like,<00:19:26.320> are<00:19:26.400> we<00:19:26.559> taking
historically is like, are we taking
historically is like, are we taking
enough<00:19:26.880> risks<00:19:27.120> when<00:19:27.280> it<00:19:27.440> comes<00:19:27.600> to<00:19:27.679> like
enough risks when it comes to like
enough risks when it comes to like
hiring,<00:19:28.640> right?<00:19:29.039> because<00:19:29.280> I<00:19:29.440> think<00:19:29.600> for<00:19:29.840> a<00:19:30.000> lot
hiring, right? because I think for a lot
hiring, right? because I think for a lot
of<00:19:30.240> companies<00:19:30.480> that<00:19:30.799> like<00:19:31.120> claim<00:19:31.360> to<00:19:31.520> hold<00:19:31.679> a
of companies that like claim to hold a
of companies that like claim to hold a
really<00:19:32.000> high<00:19:32.240> bar,<00:19:32.559> you<00:19:32.720> tend<00:19:32.880> to<00:19:33.039> find<00:19:33.120> that
really high bar, you tend to find that
really high bar, you tend to find that
they're<00:19:33.520> not<00:19:33.760> always<00:19:33.919> the<00:19:34.160> most<00:19:34.320> risk-taking,
they're not always the most risk-taking,
they're not always the most risk-taking,
right?<00:19:35.440> Um<00:19:35.919> when<00:19:36.160> hiring<00:19:36.640> people<00:19:36.960> or<00:19:37.200> it's
right? Um when hiring people or it's
right? Um when hiring people or it's
like,<00:19:37.919> you<00:19:38.080> know,<00:19:38.559> risk-taking<00:19:39.039> in<00:19:39.280> some
like, you know, risk-taking in some
like, you know, risk-taking in some
areas<00:19:39.679> but<00:19:39.919> not<00:19:40.080> in<00:19:40.240> others,<00:19:40.559> right?<00:19:40.720> And<00:19:40.880> it's
areas but not in others, right? And it's
areas but not in others, right? And it's
so<00:19:41.280> it's<00:19:41.520> uneven<00:19:42.000> across<00:19:42.240> the<00:19:42.480> organization.
so it's uneven across the organization.
so it's uneven across the organization.
And<00:19:43.520> so<00:19:43.679> that's<00:19:43.919> one<00:19:44.080> thing<00:19:44.240> I've<00:19:44.559> always
And so that's one thing I've always
And so that's one thing I've always
wanted<00:19:45.039> to<00:19:45.200> push<00:19:45.440> on<00:19:45.760> a<00:19:46.000> little<00:19:46.080> bit<00:19:46.240> more.
wanted to push on a little bit more.
wanted to push on a little bit more.
It's<00:19:46.720> like,<00:19:46.960> oh,<00:19:47.120> we<00:19:47.360> only<00:19:47.520> hire<00:19:47.840> people<00:19:48.000> who
It's like, oh, we only hire people who
It's like, oh, we only hire people who
have<00:19:48.320> sold<00:19:48.480> a<00:19:48.720> technical<00:19:49.039> tool<00:19:49.360> before,
have sold a technical tool before,
have sold a technical tool before,
right?<00:19:50.559> So<00:19:50.640> they<00:19:50.880> know<00:19:51.039> our<00:19:51.280> customer,<00:19:51.760> they
right? So they know our customer, they
right? So they know our customer, they
know<00:19:52.000> the<00:19:52.160> space,<00:19:52.400> they<00:19:52.559> just<00:19:52.640> have<00:19:52.720> to<00:19:52.880> learn
know the space, they just have to learn
know the space, they just have to learn
linear.<00:19:53.440> And<00:19:53.520> it's<00:19:53.679> like,<00:19:53.919> well,<00:19:54.320> could<00:19:54.480> we
linear. And it's like, well, could we
linear. And it's like, well, could we
take<00:19:54.799> a<00:19:54.960> chance<00:19:55.120> on<00:19:55.360> this<00:19:55.520> person<00:19:55.919> who<00:19:56.160> I<00:19:56.400> think
take a chance on this person who I think
take a chance on this person who I think
you<00:19:56.960> know<00:19:57.120> could<00:19:57.360> learn<00:19:57.600> it,<00:19:58.000> right?<00:19:58.559> who<00:19:58.799> I
you know could learn it, right? who I
you know could learn it, right? who I
think<00:19:59.039> could<00:19:59.280> get<00:19:59.440> there<00:19:59.840> and<00:20:00.160> you<00:20:00.320> know<00:20:00.480> we're
think could get there and you know we're
think could get there and you know we're
starting<00:20:00.880> to<00:20:01.039> kind<00:20:01.200> of<00:20:01.360> take<00:20:01.919> some<00:20:02.160> of<00:20:02.320> those
starting to kind of take some of those
starting to kind of take some of those
chances<00:20:03.039> right<00:20:03.520> doesn't<00:20:03.840> necessarily<00:20:04.400> to<00:20:04.559> me
chances right doesn't necessarily to me
chances right doesn't necessarily to me
feel<00:20:05.120> like<00:20:05.280> we're<00:20:05.440> lowering<00:20:05.840> the<00:20:06.000> bar<00:20:06.640> let's
feel like we're lowering the bar let's
feel like we're lowering the bar let's
say<00:20:07.520> but<00:20:07.679> it's<00:20:07.919> more<00:20:08.320> just<00:20:08.559> saying<00:20:08.880> like<00:20:09.120> as<00:20:09.360> we
say but it's more just saying like as we
say but it's more just saying like as we
start<00:20:09.679> to<00:20:09.840> grow<00:20:10.160> we're<00:20:10.320> going<00:20:10.400> to<00:20:10.480> need<00:20:10.640> to
start to grow we're going to need to
start to grow we're going to need to
learn<00:20:10.960> how<00:20:11.120> to<00:20:11.360> grow<00:20:11.760> people
learn how to grow people
learn how to grow people
right<00:20:12.400> cuz<00:20:12.640> those<00:20:12.960> people<00:20:13.120> that<00:20:13.280> had<00:20:13.520> that
right cuz those people that had that
right cuz those people that had that
selling<00:20:14.000> experience<00:20:14.720> at<00:20:14.960> some<00:20:15.039> point<00:20:15.280> didn't
selling experience at some point didn't
selling experience at some point didn't
their<00:20:16.559> first<00:20:16.799> job<00:20:17.039> like<00:20:17.280> top<00:20:17.840> so<00:20:18.000> they
their first job like top so they
their first job like top so they
obviously<00:20:18.480> learned<00:20:18.640> it<00:20:18.799> at<00:20:18.960> some<00:20:19.039> point<00:20:19.280> so
obviously learned it at some point so
obviously learned it at some point so
maybe<00:20:19.919> this<00:20:20.160> other<00:20:20.400> person<00:20:20.559> can<00:20:20.799> too
maybe this other person can too
maybe this other person can too
exactly<00:20:21.440> so<00:20:21.600> we're<00:20:21.840> not<00:20:22.240> you<00:20:22.400> know<00:20:22.720> we're<00:20:22.960> not
exactly so we're not you know we're not
exactly so we're not you know we're not
tomorrow<00:20:23.520> going<00:20:23.760> to<00:20:23.919> like<00:20:24.240> hire<00:20:24.480> new<00:20:24.720> grads
tomorrow going to like hire new grads
tomorrow going to like hire new grads
who've<00:20:25.280> never<00:20:25.440> sold<00:20:25.679> anything<00:20:25.919> before<00:20:26.080> in
who've never sold anything before in
who've never sold anything before in
their<00:20:26.480> lives<00:20:27.039> and<00:20:27.280> like<00:20:27.679> train<00:20:28.080> them<00:20:28.240> to<00:20:28.480> both
their lives and like train them to both
their lives and like train them to both
like<00:20:29.840> sell<00:20:30.400> and<00:20:30.720> like<00:20:30.960> learn<00:20:31.200> linear,<00:20:31.919> but
like sell and like learn linear, but
like sell and like learn linear, but
like<00:20:32.720> can<00:20:32.960> they<00:20:33.440> learn<00:20:33.679> how<00:20:33.840> to<00:20:34.080> roughly<00:20:34.480> like
like can they learn how to roughly like
like can they learn how to roughly like
sell<00:20:35.280> some<00:20:35.520> of<00:20:35.600> these<00:20:36.080> things,<00:20:36.720> you<00:20:36.880> know,<00:20:37.440> uh
sell some of these things, you know, uh
sell some of these things, you know, uh
based<00:20:37.840> on<00:20:38.000> some<00:20:38.240> prior<00:20:38.480> sales<00:20:38.799> experience?
based on some prior sales experience?
based on some prior sales experience?
Like<00:20:39.360> yeah,<00:20:39.520> I<00:20:39.679> think<00:20:39.840> so.<00:20:40.320> And<00:20:40.799> you<00:20:40.880> know,<00:20:41.039> I
Like yeah, I think so. And you know, I
Like yeah, I think so. And you know, I
think<00:20:41.280> it's<00:20:41.520> about<00:20:41.840> figuring<00:20:42.159> out<00:20:42.320> how<00:20:42.559> you
think it's about figuring out how you
think it's about figuring out how you
evaluate<00:20:43.679> for<00:20:43.919> those<00:20:44.240> things<00:20:44.480> and<00:20:44.720> like<00:20:44.960> what
evaluate for those things and like what
evaluate for those things and like what
your<00:20:45.280> rubric<00:20:45.679> is<00:20:45.840> and<00:20:46.159> making<00:20:46.400> sure<00:20:46.480> that<00:20:46.799> like
your rubric is and making sure that like
your rubric is and making sure that like
culturally<00:20:48.080> you<00:20:48.320> still<00:20:48.480> hold<00:20:48.640> a<00:20:48.799> really<00:20:48.960> high
culturally you still hold a really high
culturally you still hold a really high
bar<00:20:49.919> and<00:20:50.240> you<00:20:50.640> hold<00:20:50.799> a<00:20:51.039> really<00:20:51.200> high<00:20:51.360> bar<00:20:51.600> for
bar and you hold a really high bar for
bar and you hold a really high bar for
things<00:20:52.080> like,<00:20:52.480> you<00:20:52.640> know,<00:20:52.880> ability<00:20:53.440> to<00:20:53.679> to
things like, you know, ability to to
things like, you know, ability to to
learn,<00:20:54.559> ability<00:20:54.960> to<00:20:55.200> scale<00:20:55.440> with<00:20:55.600> the
learn, ability to scale with the
learn, ability to scale with the
company.<00:20:56.480> And<00:20:56.640> then<00:20:56.880> other<00:20:57.120> things<00:20:57.360> that
company. And then other things that
company. And then other things that
were,
were,
were,
you<00:20:59.360> know,<00:21:00.000> resume<00:21:00.400> filters<00:21:01.360> or<00:21:02.559> brand
you know, resume filters or brand
you know, resume filters or brand
checks,<00:21:03.600> you<00:21:03.760> know,<00:21:04.000> in<00:21:04.159> a<00:21:04.320> lot<00:21:04.400> of<00:21:04.559> ways,
checks, you know, in a lot of ways,
checks, you know, in a lot of ways,
those<00:21:05.440> can<00:21:05.600> go<00:21:05.760> away<00:21:05.919> over<00:21:06.240> time.<00:21:07.039> I<00:21:07.200> want<00:21:07.280> to
those can go away over time. I want to
those can go away over time. I want to
talk<00:21:07.600> more<00:21:07.679> about<00:21:07.840> your<00:21:08.000> hiring<00:21:08.400> process
talk more about your hiring process
talk more about your hiring process
because<00:21:08.960> I<00:21:09.120> find<00:21:09.280> it<00:21:09.600> so<00:21:10.000> interesting.<00:21:10.799> I
because I find it so interesting. I
because I find it so interesting. I
guess<00:21:11.360> just<00:21:11.760> is<00:21:12.400> thinking<00:21:12.640> about<00:21:12.799> how<00:21:13.039> linear
guess just is thinking about how linear
guess just is thinking about how linear
works,<00:21:13.760> how<00:21:13.919> small<00:21:14.159> you<00:21:14.400> are<00:21:14.640> for<00:21:15.360> every
works, how small you are for every
works, how small you are for every
dollar<00:21:15.919> of<00:21:16.159> revenue<00:21:16.480> you<00:21:16.640> generate.<00:21:17.520> Has<00:21:18.240> the
dollar of revenue you generate. Has the
dollar of revenue you generate. Has the
rest<00:21:18.640> of<00:21:18.799> corporate<00:21:19.200> America<00:21:19.600> overhired?
rest of corporate America overhired?
rest of corporate America overhired?
Like<00:21:20.799> has<00:21:21.120> everyone<00:21:21.520> just<00:21:21.760> hired<00:21:22.240> way<00:21:22.480> too
Like has everyone just hired way too
Like has everyone just hired way too
many<00:21:22.960> people?<00:21:23.679> And<00:21:23.919> if<00:21:24.080> they<00:21:24.320> thought<00:21:24.480> about
many people? And if they thought about
many people? And if they thought about
things<00:21:24.880> the<00:21:25.200> way<00:21:25.280> you<00:21:25.520> did,<00:21:25.840> if<00:21:25.919> they<00:21:26.080> had<00:21:26.240> a
things the way you did, if they had a
things the way you did, if they had a
goal<00:21:26.640> that,<00:21:27.200> you<00:21:27.280> know,<00:21:27.440> the<00:21:27.600> number<00:21:27.760> of
goal that, you know, the number of
goal that, you know, the number of
tickets<00:21:28.240> per<00:21:28.480> rep<00:21:28.799> should<00:21:29.039> be<00:21:29.200> going<00:21:29.360> up<00:21:29.600> as
tickets per rep should be going up as
tickets per rep should be going up as
we're<00:21:30.080> bringing<00:21:30.320> on<00:21:30.400> the<00:21:30.559> right<00:21:30.720> software<00:21:30.960> and
we're bringing on the right software and
we're bringing on the right software and
becoming<00:21:31.440> more<00:21:31.600> efficient,<00:21:32.559> could<00:21:32.799> every
becoming more efficient, could every
becoming more efficient, could every
company<00:21:33.440> be<00:21:34.640> 50%<00:21:35.280> smaller,<00:21:36.400> 80%<00:21:37.120> smaller?
company be 50% smaller, 80% smaller?
company be 50% smaller, 80% smaller?
Like<00:21:37.840> what<00:21:38.000> do<00:21:38.080> you<00:21:38.159> see<00:21:38.320> when<00:21:38.480> you<00:21:38.559> look<00:21:38.640> at
Like what do you see when you look at
Like what do you see when you look at
other<00:21:38.960> companies<00:21:39.280> now<00:21:39.520> operating<00:21:39.840> from<00:21:40.080> this
other companies now operating from this
other companies now operating from this
vantage<00:21:40.720> point<00:21:40.880> of<00:21:41.039> linear?<00:21:41.840> Or<00:21:42.080> do<00:21:42.240> you<00:21:42.320> think
vantage point of linear? Or do you think
vantage point of linear? Or do you think
this<00:21:42.640> is<00:21:42.720> just<00:21:42.960> something<00:21:43.280> that<00:21:43.520> is<00:21:43.760> so<00:21:44.000> unique
this is just something that is so unique
this is just something that is so unique
to<00:21:44.400> you<00:21:44.559> all<00:21:44.799> because<00:21:44.960> of<00:21:45.120> your<00:21:45.280> culture,
to you all because of your culture,
to you all because of your culture,
because<00:21:45.919> of<00:21:46.000> your<00:21:46.159> founders,<00:21:46.720> because<00:21:46.880> of<00:21:47.039> the
because of your founders, because of the
because of your founders, because of the
product<00:21:47.360> that<00:21:47.520> you're<00:21:47.679> selling<00:21:47.840> and<00:21:48.000> the<00:21:48.080> way
product that you're selling and the way
product that you're selling and the way
you're<00:21:48.320> building<00:21:48.559> it?
you're building it?
you're building it?
I<00:21:49.039> think<00:21:49.200> it's<00:21:49.360> a<00:21:49.440> little<00:21:49.520> bit<00:21:49.600> of<00:21:49.760> both.<00:21:50.000> I
I think it's a little bit of both. I
I think it's a little bit of both. I
think<00:21:50.320> some<00:21:50.559> of<00:21:50.640> it<00:21:50.799> is<00:21:51.760> uh<00:21:52.480> oriented<00:21:52.960> around
think some of it is uh oriented around
think some of it is uh oriented around
what<00:21:53.440> we<00:21:53.679> do.<00:21:54.000> So,<00:21:54.880> you<00:21:55.039> know,<00:21:55.280> we're<00:21:56.000> a<00:21:56.320> team
what we do. So, you know, we're a team
what we do. So, you know, we're a team
of<00:21:56.720> like<00:21:57.440> engineers<00:21:58.240> building<00:21:58.559> for<00:21:58.880> mostly
of like engineers building for mostly
of like engineers building for mostly
engineers,<00:22:01.039> right?<00:22:01.440> Engineers,<00:22:02.000> designers,
engineers, right? Engineers, designers,
engineers, right? Engineers, designers,
and<00:22:02.480> PMs.<00:22:03.120> Then<00:22:03.440> building<00:22:03.679> for<00:22:03.840> engineers,
and PMs. Then building for engineers,
and PMs. Then building for engineers,
designers,<00:22:04.640> and<00:22:04.799> PMs<00:22:05.760> that,<00:22:06.480> you<00:22:06.640> know,<00:22:06.799> can
designers, and PMs that, you know, can
designers, and PMs that, you know, can
scale<00:22:07.360> up<00:22:07.600> to<00:22:07.760> a<00:22:07.919> certain<00:22:08.159> point.<00:22:08.720> But<00:22:08.799> I
scale up to a certain point. But I
scale up to a certain point. But I
remember<00:22:09.200> when<00:22:09.360> I<00:22:09.520> was<00:22:09.600> at<00:22:09.760> Stripe<00:22:10.080> and<00:22:10.240> early
remember when I was at Stripe and early
remember when I was at Stripe and early
on<00:22:10.640> we<00:22:10.880> were<00:22:11.039> building<00:22:11.360> like<00:22:11.679> it's<00:22:11.919> payments
on we were building like it's payments
on we were building like it's payments
for<00:22:12.400> developers.<00:22:12.799> Well,<00:22:12.960> we're<00:22:13.200> developers.
for developers. Well, we're developers.
for developers. Well, we're developers.
Great.<00:22:14.400> Like<00:22:14.640> we<00:22:14.880> know<00:22:15.039> what<00:22:15.200> developers
Great. Like we know what developers
Great. Like we know what developers
want,<00:22:16.159> right?<00:22:16.880> Uh<00:22:17.120> it<00:22:17.440> makes<00:22:17.600> things<00:22:17.840> really
want, right? Uh it makes things really
want, right? Uh it makes things really
easy,<00:22:18.640> right?<00:22:19.440> And<00:22:19.679> then<00:22:20.480> eventually<00:22:21.120> Stripe
easy, right? And then eventually Stripe
easy, right? And then eventually Stripe
starts<00:22:21.840> to<00:22:22.000> sell<00:22:22.240> to<00:22:22.559> like<00:22:22.799> your<00:22:23.039> mom<00:22:23.280> and<00:22:23.600> pop
starts to sell to like your mom and pop
starts to sell to like your mom and pop
like<00:22:24.960> shop<00:22:25.360> selling<00:22:25.600> t-shirts<00:22:26.000> on<00:22:26.240> the
like shop selling t-shirts on the
like shop selling t-shirts on the
internet<00:22:26.640> and<00:22:26.799> you're<00:22:27.039> like,<00:22:27.200> "Whoa,<00:22:27.679> I<00:22:27.840> don't
internet and you're like, "Whoa, I don't
internet and you're like, "Whoa, I don't
I<00:22:28.240> don't<00:22:28.320> really<00:22:28.480> know<00:22:28.640> what<00:22:29.200> you<00:22:30.000> this<00:22:30.240> store
I don't really know what you this store
I don't really know what you this store
needs,<00:22:31.039> right?"<00:22:31.760> Um,<00:22:32.240> and<00:22:32.480> so<00:22:32.640> then<00:22:32.880> you<00:22:33.039> need
needs, right?" Um, and so then you need
needs, right?" Um, and so then you need
to<00:22:33.280> hire<00:22:33.600> like<00:22:33.919> product<00:22:34.240> managers<00:22:34.799> and
to hire like product managers and
to hire like product managers and
operations<00:22:35.679> folks<00:22:36.080> to<00:22:36.400> start<00:22:36.640> to<00:22:36.799> like<00:22:37.039> expand
operations folks to start to like expand
operations folks to start to like expand
into<00:22:37.760> this<00:22:37.919> new<00:22:38.080> market<00:22:38.320> because<00:22:38.559> you<00:22:38.799> don't
into this new market because you don't
into this new market because you don't
understand<00:22:39.280> them<00:22:39.520> really<00:22:39.760> well.<00:22:40.320> you're
understand them really well. you're
understand them really well. you're
starting<00:22:40.799> to<00:22:40.960> sell<00:22:41.200> stripe<00:22:41.600> in<00:22:41.760> Brazil<00:22:42.240> like
starting to sell stripe in Brazil like
starting to sell stripe in Brazil like
well<00:22:43.039> oh<00:22:43.440> it's<00:22:43.760> not<00:22:44.000> exactly<00:22:44.320> just<00:22:44.559> like
well oh it's not exactly just like
well oh it's not exactly just like
porting<00:22:45.200> over<00:22:46.000> like<00:22:46.320> you<00:22:46.400> know<00:22:46.480> the<00:22:46.720> product
porting over like you know the product
porting over like you know the product
from<00:22:47.039> the<00:22:47.200> US<00:22:47.440> to<00:22:47.679> this<00:22:47.919> new<00:22:48.080> country<00:22:48.559> like
from the US to this new country like
from the US to this new country like
there's<00:22:48.960> a<00:22:49.120> whole<00:22:49.280> different<00:22:49.440> set<00:22:49.600> of<00:22:49.760> needs
there's a whole different set of needs
there's a whole different set of needs
there<00:22:50.559> so<00:22:51.200> that<00:22:51.600> requires<00:22:52.000> a<00:22:52.159> whole<00:22:52.320> new<00:22:52.480> way
there so that requires a whole new way
there so that requires a whole new way
of<00:22:52.799> thinking<00:22:53.039> and<00:22:53.280> a<00:22:53.360> whole<00:22:53.520> new<00:22:53.679> set<00:22:53.840> of
of thinking and a whole new set of
of thinking and a whole new set of
people<00:22:54.400> right<00:22:55.039> in<00:22:55.360> a<00:22:55.520> lot<00:22:55.600> of<00:22:55.679> ways<00:22:55.840> we<00:22:56.080> don't
people right in a lot of ways we don't
people right in a lot of ways we don't
have<00:22:56.320> those<00:22:56.559> problems<00:22:57.200> right<00:22:58.080> um<00:22:58.559> building
have those problems right um building
have those problems right um building
here<00:22:59.360> is<00:22:59.679> not<00:23:00.080> too<00:23:00.400> dissimilar<00:23:01.200> from<00:23:02.480> building
here is not too dissimilar from building
here is not too dissimilar from building
in<00:23:03.039> Europe<00:23:03.360> as<00:23:03.520> an<00:23:03.600> example<00:23:04.320> like<00:23:04.559> maybe<00:23:04.720> you
in Europe as an example like maybe you
in Europe as an example like maybe you
want<00:23:04.960> to<00:23:05.039> store<00:23:05.280> your<00:23:05.440> data<00:23:05.679> there<00:23:06.000> instead<00:23:06.320> of
want to store your data there instead of
want to store your data there instead of
storing<00:23:06.799> your<00:23:06.960> data<00:23:07.200> here<00:23:08.000> u<00:23:08.080> maybe<00:23:08.320> you<00:23:08.480> have
storing your data here u maybe you have
storing your data here u maybe you have
certain<00:23:08.799> regulations<00:23:09.280> or<00:23:09.520> other<00:23:09.679> things<00:23:09.840> that
certain regulations or other things that
certain regulations or other things that
you<00:23:10.159> care<00:23:10.320> about,<00:23:10.640> but<00:23:11.200> generally<00:23:11.840> building
you care about, but generally building
you care about, but generally building
products<00:23:12.559> in<00:23:12.880> software<00:23:13.200> is<00:23:13.440> like<00:23:13.600> pretty
products in software is like pretty
products in software is like pretty
similar.<00:23:14.480> Um,<00:23:14.799> so<00:23:14.960> it's<00:23:15.200> really<00:23:15.360> easy<00:23:15.600> for<00:23:15.840> us
similar. Um, so it's really easy for us
similar. Um, so it's really easy for us
to<00:23:16.320> go<00:23:16.559> to<00:23:16.720> new<00:23:17.120> markets<00:23:17.440> with<00:23:17.679> the<00:23:17.840> same<00:23:18.000> team
to go to new markets with the same team
to go to new markets with the same team
and<00:23:18.480> the<00:23:18.640> same<00:23:18.799> product,<00:23:19.280> right?<00:23:20.000> We<00:23:20.159> don't
and the same product, right? We don't
and the same product, right? We don't
necessarily<00:23:21.360> yet<00:23:21.840> have<00:23:22.080> to<00:23:22.320> think<00:23:22.480> about<00:23:23.120> new
necessarily yet have to think about new
necessarily yet have to think about new
types<00:23:23.679> of<00:23:23.840> like<00:23:24.080> personas<00:23:24.559> to<00:23:24.720> sell<00:23:24.960> to,
types of like personas to sell to,
types of like personas to sell to,
right?<00:23:26.240> So,<00:23:26.640> I<00:23:26.960> think<00:23:27.039> it<00:23:27.280> keeps<00:23:27.520> us<00:23:27.760> really
right? So, I think it keeps us really
right? So, I think it keeps us really
focused<00:23:28.640> on<00:23:29.440> what<00:23:29.760> matters<00:23:30.159> most<00:23:30.480> to<00:23:30.640> the
focused on what matters most to the
focused on what matters most to the
business<00:23:31.200> right<00:23:31.440> now,<00:23:32.240> uh,<00:23:32.400> as<00:23:32.559> we<00:23:32.720> start<00:23:32.880> to
business right now, uh, as we start to
business right now, uh, as we start to
expand<00:23:33.360> to<00:23:33.520> like<00:23:33.679> more<00:23:33.760> and<00:23:34.000> more<00:23:34.240> software
expand to like more and more software
expand to like more and more software
teams.<00:23:35.360> Um,<00:23:36.320> and<00:23:37.039> you<00:23:37.280> know,<00:23:37.440> I<00:23:37.679> think<00:23:37.840> what's
teams. Um, and you know, I think what's
teams. Um, and you know, I think what's
changed<00:23:38.480> and<00:23:38.720> what's<00:23:38.960> interesting<00:23:39.200> is<00:23:39.440> like
changed and what's interesting is like
changed and what's interesting is like
we're<00:23:39.760> now<00:23:39.919> working<00:23:40.080> with<00:23:40.240> teams<00:23:40.480> that<00:23:40.640> are
we're now working with teams that are
we're now working with teams that are
like<00:23:41.039> building<00:23:41.360> hardware<00:23:42.000> as<00:23:42.240> an<00:23:42.320> example.<00:23:42.799> So
like building hardware as an example. So
like building hardware as an example. So
it's<00:23:43.120> like<00:23:43.200> you're<00:23:43.360> selling<00:23:43.600> to<00:23:43.760> like<00:23:44.000> boom
it's like you're selling to like boom
it's like you're selling to like boom
aerospace<00:23:44.880> and<00:23:45.039> you're<00:23:45.200> like,<00:23:45.440> well,<00:23:45.919> I've
aerospace and you're like, well, I've
aerospace and you're like, well, I've
never<00:23:46.480> built<00:23:46.640> a<00:23:46.960> supersonic<00:23:47.600> plane<00:23:47.919> before.
never built a supersonic plane before.
never built a supersonic plane before.
Like<00:23:48.640> what<00:23:48.799> is<00:23:48.960> that<00:23:49.120> like?<00:23:49.440> And<00:23:49.760> you<00:23:49.919> know,
Like what is that like? And you know,
Like what is that like? And you know,
how<00:23:50.240> does<00:23:50.400> that<00:23:50.640> work<00:23:50.799> with<00:23:51.120> what<00:23:51.360> we<00:23:51.679> have<00:23:51.840> to
how does that work with what we have to
how does that work with what we have to
offer,<00:23:52.480> right?<00:23:53.200> So<00:23:53.600> sometimes<00:23:54.400> that<00:23:54.799> deserves
offer, right? So sometimes that deserves
offer, right? So sometimes that deserves
like<00:23:56.640> more<00:23:57.120> research,<00:23:57.679> more<00:23:58.159> work,<00:23:58.720> more
like more research, more work, more
like more research, more work, more
understanding<00:23:59.440> of<00:23:59.600> like<00:23:59.840> what<00:24:00.000> that<00:24:00.240> customer
understanding of like what that customer
understanding of like what that customer
needs.<00:24:01.120> And<00:24:01.360> so<00:24:01.520> I<00:24:01.760> expect<00:24:02.159> that<00:24:02.640> over<00:24:02.960> time<00:24:03.360> we
needs. And so I expect that over time we
needs. And so I expect that over time we
will<00:24:03.760> start<00:24:03.919> to<00:24:04.159> grow<00:24:04.400> the<00:24:04.640> like<00:24:04.799> surface<00:24:05.120> area
will start to grow the like surface area
will start to grow the like surface area
of<00:24:05.520> who<00:24:05.679> we<00:24:05.840> serve<00:24:06.320> and<00:24:06.559> that<00:24:06.720> will<00:24:06.880> start<00:24:07.039> to
of who we serve and that will start to
of who we serve and that will start to
look<00:24:07.280> less<00:24:07.440> and<00:24:07.600> less<00:24:07.840> like<00:24:08.080> our<00:24:08.320> team<00:24:08.799> and
look less and less like our team and
look less and less like our team and
more<00:24:09.200> and<00:24:09.360> more<00:24:09.520> like<00:24:09.679> other<00:24:09.919> teams<00:24:10.080> that<00:24:10.240> we
more and more like other teams that we
more and more like other teams that we
need<00:24:10.480> to<00:24:10.640> like<00:24:10.880> explore<00:24:11.200> and<00:24:11.440> discover.
need to like explore and discover.
need to like explore and discover.
So<00:24:12.720> I<00:24:12.960> think<00:24:13.120> in<00:24:13.279> some<00:24:13.440> ways<00:24:13.679> there<00:24:13.840> are<00:24:14.080> things
So I think in some ways there are things
So I think in some ways there are things
that<00:24:14.400> are<00:24:14.480> like<00:24:14.720> special<00:24:15.120> about<00:24:15.440> us<00:24:15.760> and<00:24:15.919> our
that are like special about us and our
that are like special about us and our
business<00:24:16.400> that<00:24:16.720> enables<00:24:17.120> us<00:24:17.279> to<00:24:17.440> stay<00:24:17.679> small.
business that enables us to stay small.
business that enables us to stay small.
Um,<00:24:19.679> but<00:24:19.919> at<00:24:20.080> the<00:24:20.240> same<00:24:20.480> time,<00:24:21.039> I<00:24:21.279> think<00:24:21.360> there
Um, but at the same time, I think there
Um, but at the same time, I think there
are<00:24:21.679> a<00:24:21.840> lot<00:24:21.919> of<00:24:22.080> companies<00:24:22.400> out<00:24:22.640> there<00:24:23.200> that<00:24:23.440> if
are a lot of companies out there that if
are a lot of companies out there that if
they<00:24:23.840> really<00:24:24.080> asked<00:24:24.320> themselves<00:24:24.880> like<00:24:25.520> are
they really asked themselves like are
they really asked themselves like are
they<00:24:25.919> focused<00:24:26.240> on<00:24:26.400> what<00:24:26.640> really<00:24:26.880> matters<00:24:27.600> and
they focused on what really matters and
they focused on what really matters and
if<00:24:28.000> they<00:24:28.159> had<00:24:28.480> to,<00:24:29.039> you<00:24:29.279> know,<00:24:29.520> cut<00:24:29.760> back<00:24:30.240> and
if they had to, you know, cut back and
if they had to, you know, cut back and
you're<00:24:30.640> seeing<00:24:30.799> this<00:24:30.960> with<00:24:31.120> a<00:24:31.200> lot<00:24:31.360> of
you're seeing this with a lot of
you're seeing this with a lot of
companies<00:24:31.679> that<00:24:31.840> are<00:24:32.000> choosing<00:24:32.320> to<00:24:32.400> do
companies that are choosing to do
companies that are choosing to do
layoffs,<00:24:33.039> they<00:24:33.279> probably<00:24:34.159> more<00:24:34.480> easily<00:24:34.880> than
layoffs, they probably more easily than
layoffs, they probably more easily than
they<00:24:35.679> than<00:24:35.919> they<00:24:36.159> thought,<00:24:36.640> you<00:24:36.799> know,<00:24:36.960> could
they than they thought, you know, could
they than they thought, you know, could
do<00:24:37.360> these<00:24:37.679> things.<00:24:38.480> Um,<00:24:39.520> but<00:24:39.919> I<00:24:40.159> it<00:24:40.400> requires
do these things. Um, but I it requires
do these things. Um, but I it requires
focus<00:24:42.000> in<00:24:42.159> a<00:24:42.320> way<00:24:42.400> that<00:24:42.640> I<00:24:42.799> think<00:24:42.880> a<00:24:43.120> lot<00:24:43.200> of
focus in a way that I think a lot of
focus in a way that I think a lot of
companies<00:24:43.600> that<00:24:43.840> are<00:24:44.000> quite<00:24:44.240> large<00:24:44.640> like
companies that are quite large like
companies that are quite large like
historically<00:24:45.440> have<00:24:45.600> not<00:24:45.840> operated<00:24:46.240> that<00:24:46.480> way.
historically have not operated that way.
historically have not operated that way.
M
M
M
so<00:24:47.440> I<00:24:47.600> I<00:24:47.840> think<00:24:47.919> it<00:24:48.159> requires<00:24:48.480> a<00:24:48.720> lot<00:24:48.880> of
so I I think it requires a lot of
so I I think it requires a lot of
cultural<00:24:50.000> change<00:24:50.320> and<00:24:50.559> like<00:24:50.720> a<00:24:50.960> big<00:24:51.120> shift<00:24:51.840> in
cultural change and like a big shift in
cultural change and like a big shift in
in<00:24:52.320> how<00:24:52.480> a<00:24:52.640> lot<00:24:52.720> of<00:24:52.880> companies<00:24:53.200> work.
in how a lot of companies work.
in how a lot of companies work.
You<00:24:55.039> joined<00:24:55.520> Stripe<00:24:56.000> sub<00:24:56.559> employee<00:24:57.039> 30<00:24:57.360> I
You joined Stripe sub employee 30 I
You joined Stripe sub employee 30 I
think<00:24:57.600> you<00:24:57.760> were<00:24:58.159> 27<00:24:58.720> 28<00:24:59.120> I've<00:24:59.279> read<00:24:59.520> very<00:24:59.760> very
think you were 27 28 I've read very very
think you were 27 28 I've read very very
very<00:25:00.559> early<00:25:01.760> and<00:25:02.960> scaled<00:25:03.360> with<00:25:03.440> the<00:25:03.600> company
very early and scaled with the company
very early and scaled with the company
over<00:25:04.240> 10x<00:25:04.799> headcount<00:25:05.279> I<00:25:05.440> think<00:25:05.520> to<00:25:05.679> over<00:25:05.919> 3,000
over 10x headcount I think to over 3,000
over 10x headcount I think to over 3,000
people.<00:25:06.880> Is<00:25:07.120> there<00:25:07.279> anything<00:25:07.440> that<00:25:07.600> you<00:25:07.679> saw
people. Is there anything that you saw
people. Is there anything that you saw
in<00:25:08.080> that<00:25:08.240> process<00:25:08.960> that<00:25:09.279> as<00:25:09.600> you<00:25:10.080> start<00:25:10.320> to
in that process that as you start to
in that process that as you start to
scale<00:25:11.039> in<00:25:11.200> some<00:25:11.360> of<00:25:11.440> these<00:25:11.600> ways<00:25:11.760> at<00:25:11.919> linear
scale in some of these ways at linear
scale in some of these ways at linear
you<00:25:13.760> wouldn't<00:25:14.080> replicate<00:25:14.559> or<00:25:14.799> anything<00:25:15.039> that
you wouldn't replicate or anything that
you wouldn't replicate or anything that
you've<00:25:15.440> seen<00:25:15.600> that<00:25:15.760> you're<00:25:15.919> like<00:25:16.159> you<00:25:16.240> know
you've seen that you're like you know
you've seen that you're like you know
now<00:25:16.640> that<00:25:16.880> I'm<00:25:17.039> in<00:25:17.200> a<00:25:17.279> different<00:25:17.440> culture<00:25:17.760> and
now that I'm in a different culture and
now that I'm in a different culture and
a<00:25:18.000> different<00:25:18.159> type<00:25:18.240> of<00:25:18.400> organization<00:25:19.200> I<00:25:19.440> would
a different type of organization I would
a different type of organization I would
actually<00:25:19.760> do<00:25:19.919> this<00:25:20.159> differently<00:25:20.640> as<00:25:20.880> we<00:25:21.120> as<00:25:21.360> we
actually do this differently as we as we
actually do this differently as we as we
start<00:25:21.679> to<00:25:22.080> scale<00:25:22.400> into<00:25:22.799> new<00:25:23.039> sectors<00:25:23.440> and<00:25:23.600> and
start to scale into new sectors and and
start to scale into new sectors and and
have<00:25:24.320> more<00:25:24.480> headcount<00:25:24.880> growth.<00:25:25.600> I<00:25:25.919> think
have more headcount growth. I think
have more headcount growth. I think
one<00:25:27.760> of<00:25:27.919> the<00:25:28.080> things<00:25:28.240> that<00:25:28.480> I<00:25:28.640> think<00:25:28.799> was
one of the things that I think was
one of the things that I think was
harder<00:25:29.600> for<00:25:29.840> Stripe<00:25:30.240> at<00:25:30.400> a<00:25:30.559> certain<00:25:31.279> scale
harder for Stripe at a certain scale
harder for Stripe at a certain scale
um<00:25:34.559> was,<00:25:35.679> you<00:25:35.919> know,<00:25:36.159> moving<00:25:36.480> into<00:25:36.720> these<00:25:36.960> new
um was, you know, moving into these new
um was, you know, moving into these new
kind<00:25:37.440> of<00:25:37.520> like<00:25:37.840> echelons<00:25:38.480> of<00:25:38.640> how<00:25:38.799> the<00:25:39.039> company
kind of like echelons of how the company
kind of like echelons of how the company
thought<00:25:39.840> about<00:25:40.080> itself,<00:25:40.640> right?<00:25:41.039> Um<00:25:41.840> you
thought about itself, right? Um you
thought about itself, right? Um you
know,<00:25:42.159> you<00:25:42.320> go<00:25:42.480> from<00:25:42.720> like<00:25:43.039> oo<00:25:43.200> we're<00:25:43.360> a
know, you go from like oo we're a
know, you go from like oo we're a
billion<00:25:43.760> dollar<00:25:43.919> company<00:25:44.159> to<00:25:44.480> oo<00:25:44.640> we're<00:25:44.720> a<00:25:44.799> 10
billion dollar company to oo we're a 10
billion dollar company to oo we're a 10
billion.<00:25:45.520> Oo,<00:25:45.760> we're<00:25:45.919> a<00:25:46.080> $50<00:25:46.240> billion
billion. Oo, we're a $50 billion
billion. Oo, we're a $50 billion
company.<00:25:47.039> And<00:25:47.279> you<00:25:47.360> know,<00:25:47.440> and<00:25:47.600> then<00:25:47.760> it<00:25:48.000> keeps
company. And you know, and then it keeps
company. And you know, and then it keeps
going.<00:25:49.120> I
going. I
going. I
Nobody<00:25:49.760> listening<00:25:50.000> to<00:25:50.080> this<00:25:50.240> is<00:25:50.400> like<00:25:50.559> yes,
Nobody listening to this is like yes,
Nobody listening to this is like yes,
I've<00:25:50.960> had<00:25:51.039> that<00:25:51.120> experience.<00:25:51.760> Everyone's
I've had that experience. Everyone's
I've had that experience. Everyone's
like,
like,
like,
okay,<00:25:53.600> I<00:25:53.840> wish.<00:25:54.320> Right.<00:25:55.039> So,<00:25:55.520> you<00:25:55.679> know,<00:25:56.000> in<00:25:56.159> a
okay, I wish. Right. So, you know, in a
okay, I wish. Right. So, you know, in a
lot<00:25:56.400> of<00:25:56.480> ways,<00:25:56.640> I<00:25:56.799> feel<00:25:56.960> really<00:25:57.200> lucky<00:25:57.520> to<00:25:57.840> have
lot of ways, I feel really lucky to have
lot of ways, I feel really lucky to have
been<00:25:58.480> along<00:25:58.960> for<00:25:59.200> that<00:25:59.440> ride.<00:25:59.679> I<00:25:59.840> was,<00:26:00.159> you
been along for that ride. I was, you
been along for that ride. I was, you
know,<00:26:00.480> there<00:26:00.720> from<00:26:00.960> just<00:26:01.200> under<00:26:01.440> 30<00:26:01.679> people<00:26:01.840> to
know, there from just under 30 people to
know, there from just under 30 people to
3,000<00:26:02.640> people,<00:26:03.200> right?<00:26:04.080> And<00:26:04.880> I<00:26:05.120> think<00:26:05.360> in<00:26:05.679> that
3,000 people, right? And I think in that
3,000 people, right? And I think in that
journey,<00:26:07.120> I<00:26:07.360> look<00:26:07.600> back<00:26:07.760> on<00:26:08.000> a<00:26:08.240> lot<00:26:08.400> of
journey, I look back on a lot of
journey, I look back on a lot of
decisions<00:26:10.159> um<00:26:10.720> that<00:26:11.039> were<00:26:11.200> made<00:26:11.360> over<00:26:11.679> time<00:26:12.960> um
decisions um that were made over time um
decisions um that were made over time um
where<00:26:14.559> we<00:26:14.880> optimized<00:26:15.520> almost<00:26:16.000> for<00:26:16.480> who<00:26:16.720> we
where we optimized almost for who we
where we optimized almost for who we
could<00:26:17.200> get
could get
could get
rather<00:26:18.320> than<00:26:18.559> like<00:26:18.799> who<00:26:19.120> was<00:26:19.200> on<00:26:19.440> the<00:26:19.600> team
rather than like who was on the team
rather than like who was on the team
specifically<00:26:21.279> because<00:26:22.000> and<00:26:22.159> and<00:26:22.480> I<00:26:22.559> think
specifically because and and I think
specifically because and and I think
it's<00:26:22.799> a<00:26:22.960> very<00:26:23.120> reasonable<00:26:23.520> thing<00:26:23.919> like<00:26:24.320> you
it's a very reasonable thing like you
it's a very reasonable thing like you
know<00:26:24.880> you're<00:26:25.200> building<00:26:25.360> a<00:26:25.600> company<00:26:26.480> someone's
know you're building a company someone's
know you're building a company someone's
like<00:26:27.279> there's<00:26:27.600> this<00:26:27.840> amazing<00:26:28.320> hire<00:26:28.799> out<00:26:28.960> there
like there's this amazing hire out there
like there's this amazing hire out there
you<00:26:29.919> know<00:26:30.320> and<00:26:30.799> I<00:26:31.039> think<00:26:31.120> they<00:26:31.360> would<00:26:31.440> be<00:26:31.600> a
you know and I think they would be a
you know and I think they would be a
great<00:26:31.919> fit<00:26:32.080> for<00:26:32.240> the<00:26:32.400> company<00:26:32.640> right<00:26:32.880> and<00:26:33.360> It's
great fit for the company right and It's
great fit for the company right and It's
like,<00:26:33.679> okay,<00:26:33.919> great.<00:26:34.159> Well,<00:26:34.559> we<00:26:34.720> don't<00:26:34.880> have<00:26:34.960> a
like, okay, great. Well, we don't have a
like, okay, great. Well, we don't have a
role<00:26:35.279> for<00:26:35.360> them<00:26:35.520> or<00:26:35.760> we<00:26:36.000> have<00:26:36.080> to<00:26:36.240> figure<00:26:36.320> out<00:26:36.400> a
role for them or we have to figure out a
role for them or we have to figure out a
role<00:26:36.720> for<00:26:36.880> them<00:26:37.120> or<00:26:37.520> we'll<00:26:37.760> slot<00:26:38.000> them<00:26:38.080> in<00:26:38.320> here
role for them or we'll slot them in here
role for them or we'll slot them in here
or<00:26:38.720> whatever.<00:26:39.520> Um,<00:26:40.159> and<00:26:40.559> what<00:26:40.799> that<00:26:41.120> does<00:26:41.440> to
or whatever. Um, and what that does to
or whatever. Um, and what that does to
the<00:26:41.919> team<00:26:42.240> that<00:26:42.559> has<00:26:42.799> to
the team that has to
the team that has to
absorb<00:26:44.880> that
absorb that
absorb that
absorb<00:26:45.679> that,<00:26:46.000> right?<00:26:46.320> So,<00:26:46.880> we<00:26:47.120> had,<00:26:47.360> I<00:26:47.520> would
absorb that, right? So, we had, I would
absorb that, right? So, we had, I would
say,<00:26:47.840> a<00:26:48.080> lot<00:26:48.159> more<00:26:48.400> like<00:26:48.640> organ<00:26:49.039> rejection<00:26:50.320> of
say, a lot more like organ rejection of
say, a lot more like organ rejection of
leaders<00:26:51.440> that<00:26:51.679> were<00:26:51.840> brought<00:26:52.000> into<00:26:52.240> the
leaders that were brought into the
leaders that were brought into the
company
company
company
um<00:26:54.559> than<00:26:54.799> I<00:26:54.960> would<00:26:55.120> have<00:26:55.360> liked<00:26:56.240> and<00:26:56.480> I<00:26:56.720> think
um than I would have liked and I think
um than I would have liked and I think
other<00:26:58.400> leaders<00:26:58.880> probably<00:26:59.200> would<00:26:59.440> have<00:26:59.520> agreed
other leaders probably would have agreed
other leaders probably would have agreed
with<00:27:00.000> that.<00:27:00.799> Um,<00:27:01.679> and<00:27:01.919> it<00:27:02.240> just<00:27:02.400> creates<00:27:02.720> a<00:27:02.880> lot
with that. Um, and it just creates a lot
with that. Um, and it just creates a lot
of<00:27:03.120> churn<00:27:03.440> because<00:27:03.679> I<00:27:04.000> think<00:27:04.400> you<00:27:04.720> have<00:27:04.880> a<00:27:05.039> lot
of churn because I think you have a lot
of churn because I think you have a lot
of<00:27:05.200> people<00:27:05.279> at<00:27:05.520> the<00:27:05.679> company<00:27:06.480> who<00:27:06.720> take<00:27:06.880> that
of people at the company who take that
of people at the company who take that
in<00:27:07.200> one<00:27:07.360> of<00:27:07.520> two<00:27:07.679> ways.<00:27:08.400> Uh,<00:27:09.679> a<00:27:09.919> lot<00:27:10.000> of<00:27:10.159> people
in one of two ways. Uh, a lot of people
in one of two ways. Uh, a lot of people
who<00:27:10.640> were<00:27:10.799> early<00:27:11.120> to<00:27:11.279> the<00:27:11.360> team<00:27:11.600> were<00:27:11.760> just
who were early to the team were just
who were early to the team were just
like,<00:27:12.320> "We<00:27:12.559> have<00:27:12.640> the<00:27:12.799> same<00:27:13.039> person.<00:27:13.679> They're
like, "We have the same person. They're
like, "We have the same person. They're
not<00:27:14.000> a<00:27:14.159> fit.<00:27:14.559> Whatever.<00:27:14.880> I'm<00:27:15.120> leaving."
not a fit. Whatever. I'm leaving."
not a fit. Whatever. I'm leaving."
Right?<00:27:16.240> So,<00:27:16.400> you<00:27:16.640> lose<00:27:16.880> great<00:27:17.200> talent<00:27:17.600> because
Right? So, you lose great talent because
Right? So, you lose great talent because
you<00:27:18.159> brought<00:27:18.320> in<00:27:18.559> someone<00:27:18.799> from<00:27:18.960> the<00:27:19.200> outside
you brought in someone from the outside
you brought in someone from the outside
and<00:27:19.919> like<00:27:20.320> layered<00:27:20.640> when<00:27:20.799> you<00:27:20.960> didn't<00:27:21.200> really
and like layered when you didn't really
and like layered when you didn't really
need<00:27:21.600> to<00:27:22.159> and<00:27:22.400> they<00:27:22.559> weren't<00:27:22.720> the<00:27:22.880> right<00:27:23.120> fit
need to and they weren't the right fit
need to and they weren't the right fit
anyway.<00:27:24.480> Right?<00:27:24.960> And<00:27:25.120> then<00:27:25.279> sometimes<00:27:25.679> you
anyway. Right? And then sometimes you
anyway. Right? And then sometimes you
bring<00:27:26.000> in<00:27:26.159> someone<00:27:26.400> who's<00:27:26.720> like<00:27:27.279> really
bring in someone who's like really
bring in someone who's like really
spectacular<00:27:28.240> and<00:27:28.400> it<00:27:28.640> was<00:27:28.720> totally<00:27:29.039> worth<00:27:29.200> it
spectacular and it was totally worth it
spectacular and it was totally worth it
regardless<00:27:29.919> of<00:27:30.080> whether<00:27:30.320> people<00:27:30.559> left<00:27:30.799> or
regardless of whether people left or
regardless of whether people left or
not,<00:27:31.200> right?<00:27:32.159> And<00:27:33.120> so<00:27:33.360> it's<00:27:33.679> really<00:27:33.840> hard<00:27:34.000> to
not, right? And so it's really hard to
not, right? And so it's really hard to
make<00:27:34.320> those<00:27:34.559> decisions<00:27:35.279> and<00:27:35.919> you<00:27:36.080> know<00:27:36.159> as
make those decisions and you know as
make those decisions and you know as
someone<00:27:36.559> who<00:27:36.720> now<00:27:36.880> has<00:27:37.039> to<00:27:37.200> make<00:27:37.279> them.<00:27:37.520> I'm
someone who now has to make them. I'm
someone who now has to make them. I'm
like
like
like
I<00:27:40.000> get<00:27:40.080> it.<00:27:40.240> I<00:27:40.480> get<00:27:40.559> it<00:27:40.799> how<00:27:41.279> like<00:27:41.840> why<00:27:42.159> it's<00:27:42.400> so
I get it. I get it how like why it's so
I get it. I get it how like why it's so
hard.<00:27:43.600> But<00:27:43.840> I<00:27:44.080> probably<00:27:44.720> orient<00:27:45.279> myself
hard. But I probably orient myself
hard. But I probably orient myself
personally<00:27:47.200> now<00:27:48.000> to<00:27:48.400> thinking<00:27:48.640> a<00:27:48.799> lot<00:27:48.960> more
personally now to thinking a lot more
personally now to thinking a lot more
about<00:27:49.360> how<00:27:49.600> we<00:27:49.760> can<00:27:50.000> grow<00:27:50.320> people
about how we can grow people
about how we can grow people
uh<00:27:52.000> as<00:27:52.320> the<00:27:52.480> organization<00:27:53.120> grows<00:27:54.000> rather<00:27:54.399> than
uh as the organization grows rather than
uh as the organization grows rather than
automatically<00:27:55.440> thinking<00:27:55.760> that<00:27:56.480> because
automatically thinking that because
automatically thinking that because
there's<00:27:56.960> a<00:27:57.200> great<00:27:57.360> person<00:27:57.600> out<00:27:57.760> there,<00:27:58.480> we
there's a great person out there, we
there's a great person out there, we
should<00:27:58.799> just<00:27:58.960> hire<00:27:59.200> them<00:27:59.360> because
should just hire them because
should just hire them because
or<00:27:59.840> because<00:27:59.919> you're<00:28:00.080> at<00:28:00.240> a<00:28:00.399> next<00:28:00.480> phase<00:28:00.640> of
or because you're at a next phase of
or because you're at a next phase of
your<00:28:01.039> growth,<00:28:01.279> you<00:28:01.440> need<00:28:01.600> the<00:28:01.760> next<00:28:02.000> level
your growth, you need the next level
your growth, you need the next level
person<00:28:03.120> that<00:28:03.440> might<00:28:03.600> be<00:28:03.760> external.<00:28:04.480> You're
person that might be external. You're
person that might be external. You're
kind<00:28:04.880> of<00:28:04.960> thinking<00:28:05.279> we<00:28:05.520> might<00:28:05.679> be<00:28:05.760> able<00:28:05.919> to
kind of thinking we might be able to
kind of thinking we might be able to
grow<00:28:06.240> these<00:28:06.480> amazing<00:28:06.720> people<00:28:06.880> that<00:28:07.039> we've
grow these amazing people that we've
grow these amazing people that we've
hired<00:28:07.520> to<00:28:07.760> meet<00:28:08.000> our<00:28:08.240> needs<00:28:08.480> for<00:28:08.640> the<00:28:08.799> next
hired to meet our needs for the next
hired to meet our needs for the next
phase<00:28:09.120> of<00:28:09.279> growth.
phase of growth.
phase of growth.
Exactly.<00:28:10.080> And<00:28:10.240> I<00:28:10.399> and<00:28:10.640> I<00:28:10.799> think<00:28:10.880> it's<00:28:11.360> it's<00:28:11.760> so
Exactly. And I and I think it's it's so
Exactly. And I and I think it's it's so
reasonable<00:28:12.880> to<00:28:13.120> think<00:28:13.600> that<00:28:13.919> like<00:28:14.320> all<00:28:14.720> oh
reasonable to think that like all oh
reasonable to think that like all oh
this<00:28:15.200> like<00:28:15.919> you<00:28:16.080> know<00:28:16.399> executive<00:28:17.200> at<00:28:18.000> you<00:28:18.159> know
this like you know executive at you know
this like you know executive at you know
all<00:28:18.480> of<00:28:18.640> these<00:28:18.880> amazing<00:28:19.279> companies<00:28:19.760> like<00:28:20.000> of
all of these amazing companies like of
all of these amazing companies like of
course<00:28:20.320> it<00:28:20.559> would<00:28:20.640> be<00:28:20.720> a<00:28:20.880> great<00:28:21.039> fit<00:28:21.200> here<00:28:21.919> and
course it would be a great fit here and
course it would be a great fit here and
you<00:28:22.880> know<00:28:23.279> not<00:28:23.520> every<00:28:23.919> you<00:28:24.159> can't<00:28:24.320> just<00:28:24.720> you
you know not every you can't just you
you know not every you can't just you
know<00:28:25.279> take<00:28:25.520> a<00:28:25.760> square<00:28:26.159> peg<00:28:26.320> and<00:28:26.480> try<00:28:26.559> to<00:28:26.640> fit<00:28:26.799> it
know take a square peg and try to fit it
know take a square peg and try to fit it
into<00:28:27.039> a<00:28:27.200> round<00:28:27.360> hole<00:28:27.679> sometimes<00:28:28.159> right<00:28:28.880> and<00:28:29.360> I
into a round hole sometimes right and I
into a round hole sometimes right and I
think<00:28:29.679> it's<00:28:29.919> really<00:28:30.159> hard<00:28:31.039> um<00:28:31.120> to<00:28:31.440> make<00:28:31.600> those
think it's really hard um to make those
think it's really hard um to make those
decisions<00:28:32.320> about<00:28:32.640> people<00:28:33.120> so<00:28:34.159> um<00:28:34.720> you<00:28:34.880> know
decisions about people so um you know
decisions about people so um you know
you<00:28:35.440> have<00:28:35.600> to<00:28:35.679> give<00:28:35.840> everyone<00:28:36.159> some<00:28:36.399> grace<00:28:36.640> for
you have to give everyone some grace for
you have to give everyone some grace for
like<00:28:37.200> poor<00:28:37.520> decisions<00:28:37.919> that<00:28:38.159> get<00:28:38.320> made<00:28:38.480> in
like poor decisions that get made in
like poor decisions that get made in
companies<00:28:39.120> like<00:28:39.520> 2020<00:28:40.000> on<00:28:40.399> all<00:28:40.559> these<00:28:40.799> things,
companies like 2020 on all these things,
companies like 2020 on all these things,
all<00:28:41.679> of<00:28:41.840> those<00:28:42.080> things.<00:28:42.480> But,<00:28:42.960> you<00:28:43.039> know,<00:28:43.200> I
all of those things. But, you know, I
all of those things. But, you know, I
look<00:28:43.520> at<00:28:43.600> some<00:28:43.919> companies<00:28:44.320> now.<00:28:44.960> Figma<00:28:45.440> is
look at some companies now. Figma is
look at some companies now. Figma is
actually<00:28:45.679> a<00:28:45.919> great<00:28:46.159> example<00:28:47.279> of<00:28:48.240> a<00:28:48.559> company
actually a great example of a company
actually a great example of a company
that<00:28:49.440> brought<00:28:49.679> in<00:28:50.559> leaders<00:28:51.679> early<00:28:52.000> on.<00:28:52.880> And,
that brought in leaders early on. And,
that brought in leaders early on. And,
you<00:28:53.760> know,<00:28:54.080> eventually<00:28:54.559> those<00:28:54.880> leaders<00:28:55.200> were
you know, eventually those leaders were
you know, eventually those leaders were
like<00:28:55.679> the<00:28:55.919> sea<00:28:56.159> level<00:28:56.399> executives<00:28:56.960> running
like the sea level executives running
like the sea level executives running
finance<00:28:58.640> and<00:28:59.520> product<00:29:00.880> um<00:29:01.520> and<00:29:02.080> sales<00:29:02.559> and
finance and product um and sales and
finance and product um and sales and
like<00:29:03.679> huge<00:29:04.080> chunks<00:29:04.399> of<00:29:04.559> the<00:29:04.720> company<00:29:05.679> um<00:29:05.840> from
like huge chunks of the company um from
like huge chunks of the company um from
very<00:29:06.399> early<00:29:06.640> on.<00:29:07.279> And<00:29:08.080> I<00:29:08.399> think<00:29:08.720> I<00:29:08.960> have<00:29:09.039> to
very early on. And I think I have to
very early on. And I think I have to
give<00:29:09.279> like<00:29:09.520> Dylan<00:29:09.919> a<00:29:10.080> lot<00:29:10.159> of<00:29:10.320> credit<00:29:10.559> for<00:29:10.799> that
give like Dylan a lot of credit for that
give like Dylan a lot of credit for that
as<00:29:11.279> an<00:29:11.440> example<00:29:12.000> of<00:29:12.480> people<00:29:12.880> who,<00:29:13.919> you<00:29:14.080> know,
as an example of people who, you know,
as an example of people who, you know,
he<00:29:14.480> was<00:29:14.640> probably<00:29:14.960> told<00:29:15.279> time<00:29:15.440> and<00:29:15.600> time<00:29:15.840> again
he was probably told time and time again
he was probably told time and time again
like<00:29:16.320> you<00:29:16.559> can<00:29:16.640> hire<00:29:16.880> someone<00:29:17.120> better.
like you can hire someone better.
like you can hire someone better.
This<00:29:18.159> person<00:29:18.399> has<00:29:18.640> never<00:29:18.880> run<00:29:19.120> a<00:29:19.360> product
This person has never run a product
This person has never run a product
organization<00:29:20.320> of,<00:29:20.799> you<00:29:20.880> know,<00:29:21.360> 150,<00:29:22.000> you
organization of, you know, 150, you
organization of, you know, 150, you
know,<00:29:22.240> or<00:29:22.399> whatever.<00:29:23.120> Um,<00:29:23.520> so<00:29:23.679> you<00:29:23.840> should
know, or whatever. Um, so you should
know, or whatever. Um, so you should
hire<00:29:24.240> someone<00:29:24.399> who<00:29:24.640> has,<00:29:25.039> right?<00:29:25.440> And<00:29:26.000> just
hire someone who has, right? And just
hire someone who has, right? And just
feeling<00:29:26.640> confident<00:29:27.120> in<00:29:27.520> who<00:29:27.760> he<00:29:28.000> hired<00:29:28.320> and
feeling confident in who he hired and
feeling confident in who he hired and
their<00:29:28.799> ability<00:29:29.039> to<00:29:29.279> grow.<00:29:30.080> And<00:29:30.320> I<00:29:30.559> hope<00:29:30.640> we
their ability to grow. And I hope we
their ability to grow. And I hope we
start<00:29:31.120> seeing<00:29:31.600> more<00:29:31.840> of<00:29:32.000> that<00:29:32.480> in<00:29:32.720> technology.
start seeing more of that in technology.
start seeing more of that in technology.
And<00:29:33.360> I<00:29:33.520> hope<00:29:33.760> Linear<00:29:34.240> is<00:29:34.480> an<00:29:34.640> example<00:29:34.960> of<00:29:35.120> that.
And I hope Linear is an example of that.
And I hope Linear is an example of that.
So<00:29:36.159> much<00:29:36.240> of<00:29:36.399> that<00:29:36.559> then<00:29:36.799> has<00:29:36.960> to<00:29:37.120> come<00:29:37.279> to<00:29:37.520> your
So much of that then has to come to your
So much of that then has to come to your
hiring<00:29:38.080> process<00:29:38.320> and<00:29:38.480> that<00:29:38.640> you've<00:29:38.880> brought
hiring process and that you've brought
hiring process and that you've brought
the<00:29:39.360> right<00:29:39.679> amazing<00:29:40.080> people<00:29:40.399> in<00:29:41.360> to<00:29:41.760> that<00:29:42.000> you
the right amazing people in to that you
the right amazing people in to that you
can<00:29:42.320> grow<00:29:42.480> and<00:29:42.640> that<00:29:42.799> you<00:29:42.880> can<00:29:43.039> grow<00:29:43.120> to<00:29:43.279> these
can grow and that you can grow to these
can grow and that you can grow to these
next<00:29:43.600> stages.<00:29:44.080> And<00:29:44.559> you<00:29:44.799> all<00:29:45.600> are<00:29:45.919> well<00:29:46.159> known
next stages. And you all are well known
next stages. And you all are well known
for<00:29:46.640> having<00:29:46.960> a<00:29:47.360> very<00:29:47.679> unique<00:29:48.080> hiring<00:29:48.480> process
for having a very unique hiring process
for having a very unique hiring process
for<00:29:49.360> I<00:29:49.520> think<00:29:49.760> pretty<00:29:50.000> much<00:29:50.159> every<00:29:50.480> role.<00:29:50.960> You
for I think pretty much every role. You
for I think pretty much every role. You
do<00:29:51.360> these<00:29:51.679> lengthy<00:29:52.640> on-site<00:29:53.279> projects.<00:29:54.480> You
do these lengthy on-site projects. You
do these lengthy on-site projects. You
pay<00:29:54.880> people<00:29:55.200> for<00:29:55.440> them<00:29:55.840> and<00:29:56.080> your<00:29:56.399> goal<00:29:56.640> is<00:29:56.799> to
pay people for them and your goal is to
pay people for them and your goal is to
actually<00:29:57.440> see<00:29:58.159> how<00:29:58.399> people<00:29:58.720> work.<00:29:59.120> Not<00:29:59.360> just
actually see how people work. Not just
actually see how people work. Not just
the<00:29:59.919> output<00:30:00.240> they<00:30:00.880> you<00:30:01.120> know<00:30:01.279> deliver<00:30:01.520> but
the output they you know deliver but
the output they you know deliver but
like<00:30:01.840> the<00:30:02.000> approach<00:30:02.159> and<00:30:02.320> how<00:30:02.480> does<00:30:02.559> it<00:30:02.640> feel
like the approach and how does it feel
like the approach and how does it feel
to<00:30:02.880> work<00:30:03.039> with<00:30:03.200> someone.<00:30:03.840> And<00:30:04.080> I<00:30:04.240> the<00:30:04.480> first
to work with someone. And I the first
to work with someone. And I the first
time<00:30:04.640> I<00:30:04.720> heard<00:30:04.880> about<00:30:04.960> this,<00:30:05.200> it<00:30:05.279> blew<00:30:05.440> me<00:30:05.600> away
time I heard about this, it blew me away
time I heard about this, it blew me away
because<00:30:06.320> I've<00:30:06.559> been<00:30:06.720> trying<00:30:06.799> to<00:30:07.039> get
because I've been trying to get
because I've been trying to get
companies<00:30:07.600> to<00:30:07.679> do<00:30:07.840> this<00:30:08.000> for<00:30:08.080> like<00:30:08.240> a<00:30:08.399> decade.
companies to do this for like a decade.
companies to do this for like a decade.
There's<00:30:09.200> so<00:30:09.440> much<00:30:09.600> research<00:30:09.919> that<00:30:10.159> shows<00:30:10.399> that
There's so much research that shows that
There's so much research that shows that
this<00:30:10.720> is<00:30:10.799> far<00:30:11.039> more<00:30:11.200> predictive<00:30:11.520> of<00:30:11.760> ultimate
this is far more predictive of ultimate
this is far more predictive of ultimate
success<00:30:12.320> in<00:30:12.480> the<00:30:12.640> role.<00:30:13.039> It's<00:30:13.279> the<00:30:13.440> way<00:30:13.520> we
success in the role. It's the way we
success in the role. It's the way we
would<00:30:13.840> all<00:30:14.000> be<00:30:14.080> hiring<00:30:14.399> for<00:30:14.559> if<00:30:14.720> we<00:30:14.880> had<00:30:15.039> the
would all be hiring for if we had the
would all be hiring for if we had the
ability<00:30:15.520> to<00:30:15.679> do<00:30:15.760> it.<00:30:16.320> But<00:30:16.480> the<00:30:16.640> reason<00:30:16.799> most
ability to do it. But the reason most
ability to do it. But the reason most
companies<00:30:17.520> don't<00:30:17.760> is<00:30:18.000> because<00:30:18.159> of<00:30:18.320> the
companies don't is because of the
companies don't is because of the
operational<00:30:18.960> constraints.<00:30:19.440> Candidates
operational constraints. Candidates
operational constraints. Candidates
don't<00:30:19.919> want<00:30:20.000> to<00:30:20.080> do<00:30:20.159> it.<00:30:20.399> People<00:30:20.559> don't<00:30:20.720> have
don't want to do it. People don't have
don't want to do it. People don't have
time<00:30:21.039> to<00:30:21.200> go<00:30:21.360> do<00:30:21.440> this<00:30:21.600> paid<00:30:21.840> thing.<00:30:22.559> It's<00:30:22.799> a
time to go do this paid thing. It's a
time to go do this paid thing. It's a
huge<00:30:23.200> investment<00:30:23.679> from<00:30:23.919> the<00:30:24.159> team<00:30:25.279> from
huge investment from the team from
huge investment from the team from
linear's<00:30:26.000> team<00:30:26.240> to<00:30:26.480> like<00:30:27.039> you're<00:30:27.360> spending
linear's team to like you're spending
linear's team to like you're spending
days<00:30:28.000> with<00:30:28.240> someone<00:30:28.399> that<00:30:28.640> might<00:30:28.799> not<00:30:28.960> be<00:30:29.039> the
days with someone that might not be the
days with someone that might not be the
person<00:30:29.360> you<00:30:29.600> hire.<00:30:30.159> Y
person you hire. Y
person you hire. Y
so<00:30:30.880> I<00:30:31.120> would<00:30:31.279> love<00:30:31.360> to<00:30:31.520> hear<00:30:31.600> from<00:30:31.760> you<00:30:31.919> more
so I would love to hear from you more
so I would love to hear from you more
about<00:30:32.320> the<00:30:32.480> philosophy,
about the philosophy,
about the philosophy,
how<00:30:34.320> you<00:30:35.200> you<00:30:35.360> know<00:30:35.679> make<00:30:35.919> this<00:30:36.159> happen,<00:30:36.480> how
how you you know make this happen, how
how you you know make this happen, how
you<00:30:36.880> justify<00:30:37.440> the<00:30:37.840> time<00:30:38.159> investment<00:30:38.960> and<00:30:39.120> then
you justify the time investment and then
you justify the time investment and then
what<00:30:39.440> you<00:30:39.600> see<00:30:39.760> as<00:30:40.000> the<00:30:40.159> sort<00:30:40.320> of<00:30:40.399> ROI<00:30:40.960> on<00:30:41.120> it.
what you see as the sort of ROI on it.
what you see as the sort of ROI on it.
Yeah.<00:30:42.720> Um<00:30:43.440> so<00:30:43.919> when<00:30:44.320> I<00:30:44.640> joined<00:30:44.880> the<00:30:45.039> company,<00:30:45.600> I
Yeah. Um so when I joined the company, I
Yeah. Um so when I joined the company, I
was<00:30:45.919> able<00:30:46.080> to<00:30:46.240> see<00:30:46.320> this<00:30:46.480> firsthand<00:30:46.960> cuz<00:30:47.200> I<00:30:47.520> had
was able to see this firsthand cuz I had
was able to see this firsthand cuz I had
to<00:30:47.840> partake<00:30:48.240> in<00:30:48.399> a<00:30:48.559> work<00:30:48.720> trial.<00:30:49.600> I<00:30:49.840> think<00:30:50.080> the
to partake in a work trial. I think the
to partake in a work trial. I think the
early<00:30:50.720> parts<00:30:50.960> of<00:30:51.120> our<00:30:51.279> recruiting<00:30:51.679> process
early parts of our recruiting process
early parts of our recruiting process
are<00:30:52.240> pretty<00:30:52.399> standard.<00:30:52.880> You<00:30:53.039> know,<00:30:53.200> recruiter
are pretty standard. You know, recruiter
are pretty standard. You know, recruiter
screen,<00:30:55.120> uh<00:30:55.440> engineering<00:30:55.919> roles,<00:30:56.159> you'll
screen, uh engineering roles, you'll
screen, uh engineering roles, you'll
have<00:30:56.480> a<00:30:56.640> couple<00:30:56.720> of<00:30:56.880> like<00:30:57.120> technical<00:30:58.320> uh
have a couple of like technical uh
have a couple of like technical uh
screens.<00:30:59.760> nontechnical<00:31:00.399> roles,<00:31:01.120> interviews,
screens. nontechnical roles, interviews,
screens. nontechnical roles, interviews,
traditional<00:31:02.080> interviews.<00:31:02.960> Maybe<00:31:03.200> there<00:31:03.360> will
traditional interviews. Maybe there will
traditional interviews. Maybe there will
be<00:31:03.679> some<00:31:03.840> kind<00:31:04.000> of<00:31:04.159> like<00:31:04.559> written<00:31:04.960> project<00:31:05.279> or
be some kind of like written project or
be some kind of like written project or
assignment<00:31:07.039> um<00:31:07.360> of<00:31:07.679> some<00:31:07.919> sort<00:31:08.320> and<00:31:08.480> then<00:31:08.640> you
assignment um of some sort and then you
assignment um of some sort and then you
get<00:31:08.880> to<00:31:08.960> the<00:31:09.120> work<00:31:09.279> trial.<00:31:10.000> Um<00:31:10.559> and<00:31:10.799> so<00:31:10.960> this
get to the work trial. Um and so this
get to the work trial. Um and so this
can<00:31:11.279> last<00:31:11.520> anywhere<00:31:11.840> from<00:31:12.159> two<00:31:12.960> days<00:31:13.360> to<00:31:13.679> like
can last anywhere from two days to like
can last anywhere from two days to like
5<00:31:14.240> days<00:31:14.480> typically<00:31:14.720> for<00:31:14.880> like<00:31:15.039> a<00:31:15.200> leadership
5 days typically for like a leadership
5 days typically for like a leadership
role.<00:31:16.080> We've<00:31:16.320> worked<00:31:16.559> our<00:31:16.880> engineering<00:31:17.600> work
role. We've worked our engineering work
role. We've worked our engineering work
trial<00:31:18.080> down<00:31:18.320> to<00:31:18.559> 3<00:31:18.799> days.<00:31:19.360> Um<00:31:20.320> and<00:31:20.720> you<00:31:20.799> know,
trial down to 3 days. Um and you know,
trial down to 3 days. Um and you know,
our<00:31:21.120> goal<00:31:21.279> is<00:31:21.440> to<00:31:21.600> keep<00:31:21.679> it<00:31:21.840> as<00:31:22.080> tight<00:31:22.320> as
our goal is to keep it as tight as
our goal is to keep it as tight as
possible<00:31:22.960> so<00:31:23.200> that<00:31:23.360> we<00:31:23.520> can<00:31:23.679> get<00:31:24.320> uh<00:31:24.399> the
possible so that we can get uh the
possible so that we can get uh the
signal<00:31:25.120> that<00:31:25.440> we<00:31:25.600> need<00:31:25.840> and<00:31:26.080> that<00:31:26.240> hopefully
signal that we need and that hopefully
signal that we need and that hopefully
the<00:31:26.720> candidate<00:31:27.120> needs.<00:31:27.840> But<00:31:28.080> I<00:31:28.320> think<00:31:28.399> the
the candidate needs. But I think the
the candidate needs. But I think the
great<00:31:28.880> thing<00:31:29.039> is<00:31:29.360> that,<00:31:29.760> you<00:31:29.840> know,<00:31:30.000> I<00:31:30.159> talk<00:31:30.320> to
great thing is that, you know, I talk to
great thing is that, you know, I talk to
people<00:31:30.720> all<00:31:30.880> the<00:31:31.039> time<00:31:32.000> about<00:31:32.559> how<00:31:32.799> they're
people all the time about how they're
people all the time about how they're
looking<00:31:33.200> at<00:31:33.360> new<00:31:33.520> opportunities<00:31:34.000> and<00:31:34.240> they're
looking at new opportunities and they're
looking at new opportunities and they're
just<00:31:34.559> like,<00:31:34.640> "Yeah,<00:31:34.960> I<00:31:35.120> just<00:31:35.279> don't<00:31:35.440> know<00:31:35.679> if
just like, "Yeah, I just don't know if
just like, "Yeah, I just don't know if
this<00:31:36.080> is,<00:31:36.399> you<00:31:36.559> know,<00:31:36.640> the<00:31:36.880> right<00:31:37.039> fit<00:31:37.279> for
this is, you know, the right fit for
this is, you know, the right fit for
me."<00:31:37.679> And<00:31:37.840> and<00:31:38.080> it's<00:31:38.159> like,<00:31:38.240> "Well,<00:31:38.559> yeah,<00:31:38.720> how
me." And and it's like, "Well, yeah, how
me." And and it's like, "Well, yeah, how
would<00:31:39.039> you<00:31:39.120> know?<00:31:39.279> You<00:31:39.440> spent<00:31:39.679> five<00:31:39.840> hours
would you know? You spent five hours
would you know? You spent five hours
with,<00:31:40.720> you<00:31:40.799> know,<00:31:40.960> people<00:31:41.120> at<00:31:41.360> this<00:31:41.519> company
with, you know, people at this company
with, you know, people at this company
and<00:31:41.919> now<00:31:42.000> you<00:31:42.159> need<00:31:42.320> to<00:31:42.480> decide<00:31:42.799> on<00:31:43.120> where
and now you need to decide on where
and now you need to decide on where
you're<00:31:43.440> going<00:31:43.519> to<00:31:43.600> spend<00:31:43.760> the<00:31:43.919> next<00:31:44.080> like<00:31:44.240> four
you're going to spend the next like four
you're going to spend the next like four
or<00:31:44.640> five<00:31:44.799> years<00:31:44.960> of<00:31:45.120> your<00:31:45.279> life.<00:31:45.919> It<00:31:46.159> feels<00:31:46.399> a
or five years of your life. It feels a
or five years of your life. It feels a
little<00:31:46.720> crazy."<00:31:47.519> Um,<00:31:48.080> and<00:31:48.320> this<00:31:48.480> is<00:31:48.559> a<00:31:48.720> great
little crazy." Um, and this is a great
little crazy." Um, and this is a great
way,<00:31:49.039> I<00:31:49.200> think,<00:31:49.360> for<00:31:49.600> candidates<00:31:50.080> who<00:31:50.399> are
way, I think, for candidates who are
way, I think, for candidates who are
more<00:31:51.760> thoughtful<00:31:52.320> in<00:31:52.559> a<00:31:52.799> lot<00:31:52.880> of<00:31:52.960> ways<00:31:53.360> about
more thoughtful in a lot of ways about
more thoughtful in a lot of ways about
their<00:31:54.000> careers<00:31:54.399> and<00:31:54.720> where<00:31:54.880> they<00:31:55.039> want<00:31:55.120> to<00:31:55.279> be,
their careers and where they want to be,
their careers and where they want to be,
um,<00:31:56.480> to<00:31:56.799> spend<00:31:57.120> that<00:31:57.360> time<00:31:57.600> to<00:31:57.840> figure<00:31:58.080> out<00:31:58.240> if
um, to spend that time to figure out if
um, to spend that time to figure out if
linear<00:31:58.799> is<00:31:58.880> the<00:31:59.039> right<00:31:59.120> fit<00:31:59.360> for<00:31:59.519> them.<00:32:00.080> And<00:32:00.320> we
linear is the right fit for them. And we
linear is the right fit for them. And we
try<00:32:00.640> to<00:32:00.799> give<00:32:00.960> people<00:32:01.519> a<00:32:01.840> real<00:32:02.240> project.<00:32:02.799> Like
try to give people a real project. Like
try to give people a real project. Like
my<00:32:03.600> my<00:32:04.080> project<00:32:04.480> as<00:32:04.720> an<00:32:04.799> example<00:32:05.440> was<00:32:05.760> like
my my project as an example was like
my my project as an example was like
build<00:32:06.159> the<00:32:06.320> go<00:32:06.480> to<00:32:06.640> market<00:32:06.880> plan<00:32:07.039> for<00:32:07.200> Linear.
build the go to market plan for Linear.
build the go to market plan for Linear.
And<00:32:08.240> it's<00:32:08.480> like,<00:32:08.720> well,<00:32:08.880> yeah,<00:32:09.200> that<00:32:09.440> that
And it's like, well, yeah, that that
And it's like, well, yeah, that that
would<00:32:09.840> be<00:32:09.919> my<00:32:10.080> job.
would be my job.
would be my job.
I<00:32:10.559> paid<00:32:10.720> you<00:32:10.799> a<00:32:10.960> lot<00:32:11.039> for<00:32:11.279> that.
I paid you a lot for that.
I paid you a lot for that.
Yeah.<00:32:13.279> Um,<00:32:13.600> and<00:32:13.760> so<00:32:13.919> I<00:32:14.000> was<00:32:14.080> like,<00:32:14.240> okay,<00:32:14.640> like
Yeah. Um, and so I was like, okay, like
Yeah. Um, and so I was like, okay, like
I'll<00:32:15.200> I'll<00:32:15.519> do<00:32:15.600> what<00:32:15.760> I<00:32:15.919> can,<00:32:16.159> right?<00:32:16.559> I'm
I'll I'll do what I can, right? I'm
I'll I'll do what I can, right? I'm
coming<00:32:16.880> up<00:32:17.039> with<00:32:17.200> like<00:32:17.360> a<00:32:17.600> 6<00:32:17.840> to<00:32:18.080> 12<00:32:18.320> month<00:32:18.720> plan
coming up with like a 6 to 12 month plan
coming up with like a 6 to 12 month plan
of<00:32:19.279> what<00:32:19.440> I<00:32:19.600> would<00:32:19.760> do,<00:32:20.480> right?<00:32:20.799> And<00:32:20.960> of
of what I would do, right? And of
of what I would do, right? And of
course,<00:32:21.360> like<00:32:21.519> if<00:32:21.679> you<00:32:21.840> don't<00:32:22.000> like<00:32:22.159> it,<00:32:22.399> if
course, like if you don't like it, if
course, like if you don't like it, if
you<00:32:22.640> don't<00:32:22.720> think<00:32:22.880> this<00:32:23.039> is<00:32:23.120> the<00:32:23.279> right<00:32:23.440> plan,
you don't think this is the right plan,
you don't think this is the right plan,
then<00:32:24.080> yeah,<00:32:24.399> maybe<00:32:24.640> I'm<00:32:24.799> not<00:32:24.960> the<00:32:25.120> right<00:32:25.279> fit
then yeah, maybe I'm not the right fit
then yeah, maybe I'm not the right fit
for<00:32:25.600> you,<00:32:25.919> right?<00:32:26.399> So,<00:32:26.559> I<00:32:26.799> think<00:32:26.880> it<00:32:27.120> gives
for you, right? So, I think it gives
for you, right? So, I think it gives
both<00:32:27.600> sides<00:32:28.240> a<00:32:28.480> lot<00:32:28.640> of<00:32:28.720> signal<00:32:30.080> and<00:32:31.519> um<00:32:31.760> this
both sides a lot of signal and um this
both sides a lot of signal and um this
was<00:32:32.159> actually<00:32:32.399> something<00:32:32.640> that<00:32:32.799> we<00:32:32.960> borrowed
was actually something that we borrowed
was actually something that we borrowed
from<00:32:33.679> Coinbase,<00:32:34.240> which<00:32:34.399> is<00:32:34.480> where<00:32:34.640> two<00:32:34.880> of<00:32:34.960> our
from Coinbase, which is where two of our
from Coinbase, which is where two of our
founders<00:32:35.440> had<00:32:35.679> worked<00:32:35.919> previously,<00:32:36.320> and
founders had worked previously, and
founders had worked previously, and
Coinbase<00:32:37.039> did<00:32:37.200> this<00:32:37.360> in<00:32:37.519> the<00:32:37.760> early<00:32:38.000> days<00:32:38.240> as
Coinbase did this in the early days as
Coinbase did this in the early days as
well,<00:32:39.039> and<00:32:39.279> they,<00:32:40.240> you<00:32:40.399> know,<00:32:40.559> had<00:32:40.799> seen<00:32:40.960> it
well, and they, you know, had seen it
well, and they, you know, had seen it
before,<00:32:41.360> and<00:32:41.600> they<00:32:41.760> were<00:32:41.840> like,<00:32:41.919> "Yeah,
before, and they were like, "Yeah,
before, and they were like, "Yeah,
didn't<00:32:42.399> we<00:32:42.559> hire<00:32:42.799> some<00:32:43.039> like<00:32:43.279> great<00:32:43.600> people
didn't we hire some like great people
didn't we hire some like great people
when<00:32:44.559> we<00:32:44.720> did<00:32:44.880> work<00:32:45.120> trials?"<00:32:45.760> Um,<00:32:46.399> and<00:32:46.720> you
when we did work trials?" Um, and you
when we did work trials?" Um, and you
know,<00:32:46.960> eventually<00:32:47.279> the<00:32:47.440> company<00:32:47.600> was<00:32:47.760> scaling
know, eventually the company was scaling
know, eventually the company was scaling
to<00:32:48.159> a<00:32:48.240> point<00:32:48.399> they<00:32:48.559> couldn't<00:32:48.720> do<00:32:48.799> work<00:32:49.039> trials
to a point they couldn't do work trials
to a point they couldn't do work trials
anymore.<00:32:50.240> So,<00:32:50.559> I<00:32:50.799> don't<00:32:50.880> know<00:32:50.960> if<00:32:51.120> it's<00:32:51.279> a
anymore. So, I don't know if it's a
anymore. So, I don't know if it's a
forever<00:32:52.159> thing<00:32:52.399> for<00:32:52.640> us,<00:32:52.960> but<00:32:53.200> in<00:32:53.440> terms<00:32:53.600> of
forever thing for us, but in terms of
forever thing for us, but in terms of
like<00:32:54.000> how<00:32:54.480> quickly<00:32:54.880> we're<00:32:55.120> scaling<00:32:55.519> now,<00:32:56.159> it's
like how quickly we're scaling now, it's
like how quickly we're scaling now, it's
still<00:32:56.720> workable.<00:32:57.200> Again,<00:32:57.519> we're<00:32:57.679> trying<00:32:57.840> to
still workable. Again, we're trying to
still workable. Again, we're trying to
get<00:32:58.000> the<00:32:58.159> work<00:32:58.320> trials<00:32:58.720> down<00:32:59.120> and<00:32:59.440> try<00:32:59.600> to<00:32:59.760> make
get the work trials down and try to make
get the work trials down and try to make
them<00:33:00.000> more<00:33:00.159> compact<00:33:00.559> both<00:33:00.799> for<00:33:00.880> the<00:33:01.039> candidate
them more compact both for the candidate
them more compact both for the candidate
and<00:33:01.519> for<00:33:01.679> us.<00:33:01.919> It's<00:33:02.080> hard<00:33:02.159> for<00:33:02.320> anyone<00:33:02.559> to<00:33:02.720> take
and for us. It's hard for anyone to take
and for us. It's hard for anyone to take
a<00:33:03.039> full<00:33:03.279> week<00:33:03.440> off.<00:33:04.240> So,<00:33:04.960> um,<00:33:05.279> keeping<00:33:05.519> those
a full week off. So, um, keeping those
a full week off. So, um, keeping those
down<00:33:05.919> to<00:33:06.159> just<00:33:06.320> a<00:33:06.480> few<00:33:06.559> days,<00:33:06.880> I<00:33:07.120> think,<00:33:07.200> is
down to just a few days, I think, is
down to just a few days, I think, is
really<00:33:07.600> helpful.<00:33:08.480> And<00:33:08.720> then<00:33:09.519> I<00:33:09.760> think<00:33:09.840> from
really helpful. And then I think from
really helpful. And then I think from
our<00:33:10.320> perspective<00:33:11.200> like<00:33:11.519> we<00:33:11.760> have<00:33:11.840> a<00:33:12.080> really
our perspective like we have a really
our perspective like we have a really
high<00:33:12.720> like<00:33:13.039> offer<00:33:13.360> accept<00:33:13.679> rate<00:33:14.080> because<00:33:14.799> you
high like offer accept rate because you
high like offer accept rate because you
know<00:33:15.200> some<00:33:15.440> somewhat<00:33:15.760> of<00:33:15.840> it<00:33:16.080> is<00:33:16.240> is<00:33:16.559> self-
know some somewhat of it is is self-
know some somewhat of it is is self-
selecting.<00:33:17.279> You<00:33:17.519> probably<00:33:17.679> wouldn't<00:33:17.919> do<00:33:18.080> a
selecting. You probably wouldn't do a
selecting. You probably wouldn't do a
work<00:33:18.480> trial<00:33:19.039> company
work trial company
work trial company
if<00:33:19.440> you<00:33:19.519> weren't<00:33:19.679> going<00:33:19.760> to<00:33:19.919> accept<00:33:20.240> if<00:33:20.399> you
if you weren't going to accept if you
if you weren't going to accept if you
got<00:33:20.559> the<00:33:20.720> offer
got the offer
got the offer
if<00:33:21.279> you<00:33:21.440> weren't<00:33:21.679> interested<00:33:22.399> really<00:33:22.640> working
if you weren't interested really working
if you weren't interested really working
at<00:33:23.039> the<00:33:23.200> company.<00:33:23.840> So<00:33:24.080> there's<00:33:24.240> a<00:33:24.399> little<00:33:24.480> bit
at the company. So there's a little bit
at the company. So there's a little bit
of<00:33:24.720> a<00:33:24.880> filter<00:33:25.519> uh<00:33:25.600> that<00:33:25.840> comes<00:33:26.000> with<00:33:26.159> that.<00:33:26.559> But
of a filter uh that comes with that. But
of a filter uh that comes with that. But
I<00:33:26.880> think<00:33:26.960> we<00:33:27.200> end<00:33:27.360> up<00:33:27.600> coming<00:33:27.840> out<00:33:28.080> like<00:33:28.240> so
I think we end up coming out like so
I think we end up coming out like so
much<00:33:28.640> more<00:33:28.799> confident<00:33:29.679> um<00:33:29.840> in<00:33:30.080> our<00:33:30.240> decisions.
much more confident um in our decisions.
much more confident um in our decisions.
And<00:33:31.600> there<00:33:31.760> have<00:33:31.919> been<00:33:32.080> so<00:33:32.320> many<00:33:32.480> times<00:33:32.799> where
And there have been so many times where
And there have been so many times where
I've<00:33:33.279> looked<00:33:33.679> at<00:33:33.919> candidates<00:33:34.559> and<00:33:35.360> we<00:33:35.600> we
I've looked at candidates and we we
I've looked at candidates and we we
typically<00:33:36.240> have<00:33:36.399> like<00:33:36.559> a<00:33:36.720> kickoff<00:33:37.679> on<00:33:37.919> the
typically have like a kickoff on the
typically have like a kickoff on the
first<00:33:38.240> day<00:33:38.399> of<00:33:38.480> the<00:33:38.640> work<00:33:38.880> trial<00:33:39.279> where<00:33:39.519> the
first day of the work trial where the
first day of the work trial where the
whole<00:33:40.000> team<00:33:40.240> gets<00:33:40.480> together<00:33:40.799> and<00:33:41.360> you<00:33:41.440> know<00:33:41.600> we
whole team gets together and you know we
whole team gets together and you know we
walk<00:33:41.919> through<00:33:42.080> the<00:33:42.240> prompt<00:33:42.559> and<00:33:43.039> candidate
walk through the prompt and candidate
walk through the prompt and candidate
asks<00:33:43.679> any<00:33:43.840> questions<00:33:44.080> that<00:33:44.240> they<00:33:44.399> might<00:33:44.559> have
asks any questions that they might have
asks any questions that they might have
and<00:33:45.200> then<00:33:45.360> we<00:33:45.519> have<00:33:45.600> like<00:33:45.760> a<00:33:45.919> check-in<00:33:46.320> and<00:33:46.480> the
and then we have like a check-in and the
and then we have like a check-in and the
check-in<00:33:47.519> is<00:33:48.000> you<00:33:48.240> know<00:33:48.480> a<00:33:48.720> day<00:33:48.799> later,<00:33:49.200> two
check-in is you know a day later, two
check-in is you know a day later, two
days<00:33:49.600> later<00:33:50.240> and<00:33:50.480> typically<00:33:50.799> the<00:33:51.039> candidate
days later and typically the candidate
days later and typically the candidate
is<00:33:51.519> supposed<00:33:51.679> to<00:33:51.840> use<00:33:51.919> that<00:33:52.159> as<00:33:52.320> their<00:33:52.559> time<00:33:52.799> to
is supposed to use that as their time to
is supposed to use that as their time to
like<00:33:53.200> get<00:33:53.360> feedback<00:33:53.760> on<00:33:54.000> what<00:33:54.159> they've<00:33:54.320> come
like get feedback on what they've come
like get feedback on what they've come
up<00:33:54.640> with<00:33:55.360> and<00:33:56.240> it's<00:33:56.640> usually<00:33:57.039> my<00:33:57.360> first<00:33:57.600> signal
up with and it's usually my first signal
up with and it's usually my first signal
of<00:33:58.080> like<00:33:58.399> is<00:33:58.559> this<00:33:58.880> going<00:33:59.039> to<00:33:59.200> go<00:33:59.360> well<00:33:59.519> or<00:33:59.840> is
of like is this going to go well or is
of like is this going to go well or is
it<00:34:00.240> not<00:34:00.399> going<00:34:00.559> to<00:34:00.720> go<00:34:00.960> Well,<00:34:01.360> and<00:34:01.519> you'd<00:34:01.760> be
it not going to go Well, and you'd be
it not going to go Well, and you'd be
surprised<00:34:02.080> at<00:34:02.240> how<00:34:02.399> many<00:34:02.559> candidates<00:34:03.039> come<00:34:03.440> to
surprised at how many candidates come to
surprised at how many candidates come to
that<00:34:04.240> check-in<00:34:04.720> and<00:34:04.960> like<00:34:05.600> don't<00:34:05.840> have<00:34:05.919> a<00:34:06.159> plan
that check-in and like don't have a plan
that check-in and like don't have a plan
for<00:34:07.360> how<00:34:07.519> they're<00:34:07.679> going<00:34:07.760> to<00:34:07.840> use<00:34:08.000> their<00:34:08.240> time.
for how they're going to use their time.
for how they're going to use their time.
And<00:34:08.560> I'm<00:34:08.720> like,<00:34:09.040> you<00:34:09.200> have<00:34:09.359> like<00:34:10.240> five<00:34:10.560> people
And I'm like, you have like five people
And I'm like, you have like five people
from<00:34:11.119> the
from the
from the
needed<00:34:11.919> at<00:34:12.079> that<00:34:12.240> time<00:34:12.320> or<00:34:12.639> you<00:34:13.359> do<00:34:13.440> you<00:34:13.599> ever
needed at that time or you do you ever
needed at that time or you do you ever
just<00:34:13.919> be<00:34:14.000> like<00:34:14.320> typically<00:34:14.960> trial<00:34:15.119> is<00:34:15.280> shorter
just be like typically trial is shorter
just be like typically trial is shorter
than<00:34:15.839> planned.
than planned.
than planned.
Typically<00:34:17.280> not.<00:34:18.240> Uh,<00:34:18.800> you<00:34:18.960> know,<00:34:19.919> I<00:34:20.240> think<00:34:20.399> I
Typically not. Uh, you know, I think I
Typically not. Uh, you know, I think I
always<00:34:20.879> leave<00:34:21.679> like<00:34:22.079> open<00:34:22.399> for<00:34:22.639> possibility
always leave like open for possibility
always leave like open for possibility
that<00:34:23.599> maybe<00:34:23.919> the<00:34:24.159> format<00:34:24.480> of<00:34:24.560> the<00:34:24.720> work<00:34:24.879> trial
that maybe the format of the work trial
that maybe the format of the work trial
itself<00:34:25.599> doesn't<00:34:25.919> always<00:34:26.159> work<00:34:26.399> for<00:34:26.639> everyone.
itself doesn't always work for everyone.
itself doesn't always work for everyone.
They'll<00:34:27.520> show<00:34:27.599> up<00:34:27.760> later<00:34:28.000> in<00:34:28.079> the<00:34:28.240> work<00:34:28.399> trial,
They'll show up later in the work trial,
They'll show up later in the work trial,
earlier.
earlier.
earlier.
Yeah,<00:34:29.919> exactly.<00:34:30.399> like<00:34:30.560> maybe<00:34:30.720> they're<00:34:30.879> better
Yeah, exactly. like maybe they're better
Yeah, exactly. like maybe they're better
in<00:34:31.119> a<00:34:31.280> one-on-one<00:34:31.679> format<00:34:32.159> versus<00:34:32.560> like<00:34:32.800> a
in a one-on-one format versus like a
in a one-on-one format versus like a
one-on-one,<00:34:34.000> right?<00:34:34.240> And<00:34:34.720> you<00:34:34.879> know,<00:34:34.960> so<00:34:35.200> just
one-on-one, right? And you know, so just
one-on-one, right? And you know, so just
kind<00:34:35.520> of<00:34:35.599> giving<00:34:35.839> people<00:34:36.079> some<00:34:36.320> grace<00:34:36.560> for
kind of giving people some grace for
kind of giving people some grace for
that.<00:34:37.440> Um,<00:34:38.000> but<00:34:38.720> it<00:34:38.800> it<00:34:38.960> is<00:34:39.119> really<00:34:39.359> hard<00:34:39.599> to<00:34:39.760> be
that. Um, but it it is really hard to be
that. Um, but it it is really hard to be
able<00:34:40.079> to<00:34:40.320> say<00:34:40.480> like,<00:34:40.800> okay,<00:34:41.119> like<00:34:41.359> now<00:34:41.520> you're
able to say like, okay, like now you're
able to say like, okay, like now you're
kind<00:34:41.919> of<00:34:42.000> leading<00:34:42.240> a<00:34:42.480> meeting<00:34:43.040> around<00:34:43.359> how
kind of leading a meeting around how
kind of leading a meeting around how
you're<00:34:43.760> going<00:34:43.839> to<00:34:43.919> work<00:34:44.079> on<00:34:44.240> this<00:34:44.480> project<00:34:45.119> and
you're going to work on this project and
you're going to work on this project and
like<00:34:45.679> does<00:34:45.919> someone<00:34:46.159> have<00:34:46.320> the<00:34:46.480> ability<00:34:46.800> to<00:34:47.040> do
like does someone have the ability to do
like does someone have the ability to do
that,<00:34:47.599> right?<00:34:48.079> But<00:34:48.240> that's<00:34:48.480> going<00:34:48.560> to<00:34:48.639> be<00:34:48.720> a
that, right? But that's going to be a
that, right? But that's going to be a
really<00:34:49.119> core<00:34:49.440> part<00:34:49.679> of<00:34:49.919> potentially<00:34:50.480> working
really core part of potentially working
really core part of potentially working
at<00:34:51.200> linear<00:34:51.679> for<00:34:51.919> certain<00:34:52.159> kinds<00:34:52.399> of<00:34:52.560> roles,
at linear for certain kinds of roles,
at linear for certain kinds of roles,
right?<00:34:53.599> So<00:34:53.760> it's<00:34:54.000> a<00:34:54.159> really<00:34:54.320> good<00:34:54.480> signal<00:34:54.879> for
right? So it's a really good signal for
right? So it's a really good signal for
how<00:34:55.520> someone<00:34:55.760> is<00:34:56.000> doing.<00:34:56.320> And<00:34:56.480> then<00:34:56.639> of<00:34:56.800> course
how someone is doing. And then of course
how someone is doing. And then of course
there's<00:34:57.359> like<00:34:57.440> a<00:34:57.599> final<00:34:57.839> presentation.<00:34:58.240> And
there's like a final presentation. And
there's like a final presentation. And
if<00:34:58.480> you're<00:34:58.640> an<00:34:58.800> engineer,<00:34:59.119> you're<00:34:59.440> like<00:35:00.000> um
if you're an engineer, you're like um
if you're an engineer, you're like um
showcasing<00:35:00.640> the<00:35:01.040> feature<00:35:01.359> that<00:35:01.520> you<00:35:01.680> built
showcasing the feature that you built
showcasing the feature that you built
and<00:35:02.480> you<00:35:02.640> know,<00:35:02.720> you<00:35:02.880> get<00:35:03.119> asked<00:35:03.359> questions
and you know, you get asked questions
and you know, you get asked questions
about<00:35:03.920> it.<00:35:04.560> Um<00:35:04.960> and<00:35:05.200> the<00:35:05.359> questions<00:35:05.599> aren't
about it. Um and the questions aren't
about it. Um and the questions aren't
always<00:35:06.240> like,<00:35:06.560> "Oh,<00:35:06.880> wow.<00:35:07.200> You<00:35:07.359> did<00:35:07.520> such<00:35:07.680> an
always like, "Oh, wow. You did such an
always like, "Oh, wow. You did such an
amazing<00:35:08.160> job.<00:35:08.480> Like,<00:35:08.720> how<00:35:08.880> did<00:35:09.040> you<00:35:09.200> do<00:35:09.280> it?"
amazing job. Like, how did you do it?"
amazing job. Like, how did you do it?"
Often<00:35:10.960> it's<00:35:11.200> like<00:35:11.440> challenging.<00:35:11.839> Well,<00:35:12.079> yeah.
Often it's like challenging. Well, yeah.
Often it's like challenging. Well, yeah.
Like,<00:35:12.480> I<00:35:12.640> wouldn't<00:35:12.800> have<00:35:12.960> done<00:35:13.040> it<00:35:13.200> that<00:35:13.359> way.
Like, I wouldn't have done it that way.
Like, I wouldn't have done it that way.
Why<00:35:13.920> didn't<00:35:14.079> you<00:35:14.240> do<00:35:14.320> it<00:35:14.400> this<00:35:14.640> other<00:35:14.800> way?<00:35:14.960> Or
Why didn't you do it this other way? Or
Why didn't you do it this other way? Or
did<00:35:15.280> you<00:35:15.440> think<00:35:15.599> about<00:35:15.760> this<00:35:16.079> or<00:35:16.480> that,<00:35:16.880> right?
did you think about this or that, right?
did you think about this or that, right?
Instead<00:35:17.599> of<00:35:17.680> the<00:35:17.920> approach<00:35:18.160> that<00:35:18.320> you<00:35:18.480> took.
Instead of the approach that you took.
Instead of the approach that you took.
Um<00:35:19.680> and<00:35:19.839> so<00:35:20.079> it<00:35:20.320> also<00:35:20.640> kind<00:35:20.880> of<00:35:21.119> gives<00:35:21.359> you<00:35:21.520> a
Um and so it also kind of gives you a
Um and so it also kind of gives you a
sense<00:35:21.839> of<00:35:22.000> like,<00:35:22.240> well,<00:35:22.480> how<00:35:22.640> does<00:35:22.800> someone
sense of like, well, how does someone
sense of like, well, how does someone
like<00:35:23.200> defend<00:35:23.520> their<00:35:23.760> own<00:35:23.920> ideas,<00:35:24.480> right?<00:35:24.960> or
like defend their own ideas, right? or
like defend their own ideas, right? or
come<00:35:25.359> up<00:35:25.520> with<00:35:25.680> new<00:35:26.000> proposals<00:35:26.640> and<00:35:27.119> different
come up with new proposals and different
come up with new proposals and different
ways<00:35:27.599> they<00:35:27.839> could<00:35:28.000> have<00:35:28.079> approached<00:35:28.400> it,
ways they could have approached it,
ways they could have approached it,
right?<00:35:29.119> This<00:35:29.280> also<00:35:29.520> gives<00:35:29.680> you<00:35:29.760> a<00:35:29.839> sense<00:35:30.000> of
right? This also gives you a sense of
right? This also gives you a sense of
how<00:35:30.240> someone<00:35:30.480> handles<00:35:30.800> like<00:35:30.960> feedback<00:35:31.440> and
how someone handles like feedback and
how someone handles like feedback and
and<00:35:31.920> other<00:35:32.079> types<00:35:32.320> of<00:35:32.400> things<00:35:32.560> as<00:35:32.800> well.<00:35:32.960> So,<00:35:33.200> I
and other types of things as well. So, I
and other types of things as well. So, I
find<00:35:33.520> it<00:35:33.760> like<00:35:34.079> incredibly<00:35:35.040> informative<00:35:35.680> and
find it like incredibly informative and
find it like incredibly informative and
I<00:35:36.160> feel<00:35:36.320> like<00:35:36.880> I<00:35:37.200> probably<00:35:37.520> would<00:35:37.680> have<00:35:37.839> made
I feel like I probably would have made
I feel like I probably would have made
many<00:35:39.680> poor<00:35:40.079> decisions
many poor decisions
many poor decisions
uh<00:35:41.760> in<00:35:42.000> terms<00:35:42.160> of<00:35:42.320> hiring<00:35:42.880> had<00:35:43.119> we<00:35:43.280> not<00:35:43.520> had
uh in terms of hiring had we not had
uh in terms of hiring had we not had
work<00:35:44.240> trials.<00:35:45.359> And<00:35:46.000> you<00:35:46.160> know,<00:35:46.400> again,<00:35:46.720> like
work trials. And you know, again, like
work trials. And you know, again, like
it's<00:35:47.119> working<00:35:47.359> for<00:35:47.520> us<00:35:47.760> now.<00:35:48.400> I<00:35:48.640> hope<00:35:48.720> that<00:35:48.960> it
it's working for us now. I hope that it
it's working for us now. I hope that it
continues<00:35:49.520> working.<00:35:50.160> It<00:35:50.400> also<00:35:50.640> requires<00:35:51.119> that
continues working. It also requires that
continues working. It also requires that
you<00:35:51.520> have<00:35:52.160> like<00:35:52.400> a<00:35:52.560> a<00:35:52.960> bigger<00:35:53.280> team.<00:35:53.520> Like<00:35:53.680> when
you have like a a bigger team. Like when
you have like a a bigger team. Like when
I<00:35:54.000> joined<00:35:54.320> Linear,<00:35:54.720> it<00:35:54.800> was<00:35:54.960> actually<00:35:55.119> the
I joined Linear, it was actually the
I joined Linear, it was actually the
first<00:35:55.440> time<00:35:55.520> I<00:35:55.920> had<00:35:56.160> a<00:35:57.119> like<00:35:57.359> a<00:35:58.079> people<00:35:58.480> and
first time I had a like a people and
first time I had a like a people and
talent<00:35:59.599> team<00:36:00.720> that<00:36:01.040> existed<00:36:01.520> at<00:36:01.760> a<00:36:01.920> company
talent team that existed at a company
talent team that existed at a company
when<00:36:02.320> I<00:36:02.480> joined.<00:36:03.520> Uh<00:36:03.839> you<00:36:03.920> know,<00:36:04.000> I<00:36:04.240> joined
when I joined. Uh you know, I joined
when I joined. Uh you know, I joined
Stripe<00:36:04.800> at<00:36:04.960> the<00:36:05.040> same<00:36:05.200> size,<00:36:06.079> didn't<00:36:06.400> have
Stripe at the same size, didn't have
Stripe at the same size, didn't have
anyone.<00:36:07.680> Uh<00:36:08.160> and<00:36:08.320> I<00:36:08.480> joined<00:36:08.720> Notion<00:36:09.119> at<00:36:09.280> around
anyone. Uh and I joined Notion at around
anyone. Uh and I joined Notion at around
the<00:36:09.680> same<00:36:09.760> size,<00:36:10.160> didn't<00:36:10.320> have<00:36:10.480> anyone<00:36:11.200> uh<00:36:11.359> on
the same size, didn't have anyone uh on
the same size, didn't have anyone uh on
like<00:36:12.000> recruiting<00:36:12.560> or<00:36:13.040> on<00:36:13.440> people<00:36:13.920> really.<00:36:14.800> And
like recruiting or on people really. And
like recruiting or on people really. And
so<00:36:15.680> when<00:36:15.920> I<00:36:16.079> joined<00:36:16.480> Linear,<00:36:16.880> we<00:36:17.040> had<00:36:17.280> three
so when I joined Linear, we had three
so when I joined Linear, we had three
full-time<00:36:18.480> recruiters.<00:36:18.960> Mhm.
full-time recruiters. Mhm.
full-time recruiters. Mhm.
Um<00:36:20.079> and<00:36:20.320> we<00:36:20.480> had<00:36:20.640> like<00:36:20.880> one<00:36:21.119> dedicated<00:36:22.240> uh<00:36:22.400> like
Um and we had like one dedicated uh like
Um and we had like one dedicated uh like
people<00:36:22.800> ops<00:36:23.119> generalist
people ops generalist
people ops generalist
and<00:36:24.079> it's<00:36:24.320> because<00:36:24.560> like<00:36:25.200> it<00:36:25.440> takes<00:36:25.599> a<00:36:25.839> lot<00:36:26.240> to
and it's because like it takes a lot to
and it's because like it takes a lot to
run<00:36:27.599> this<00:36:27.920> process<00:36:28.560> right<00:36:29.440> um<00:36:29.599> in<00:36:29.839> terms<00:36:30.000> of
run this process right um in terms of
run this process right um in terms of
like<00:36:30.320> shephering<00:36:30.800> candidates<00:36:31.200> through<00:36:31.440> the
like shephering candidates through the
like shephering candidates through the
process<00:36:32.079> as<00:36:32.400> well<00:36:32.480> as<00:36:33.040> you<00:36:33.200> know<00:36:33.359> making<00:36:33.680> sure
process as well as you know making sure
process as well as you know making sure
that<00:36:34.480> logistically<00:36:35.119> we're<00:36:35.359> able<00:36:35.520> to<00:36:35.599> handle
that logistically we're able to handle
that logistically we're able to handle
everything<00:36:36.240> spinning<00:36:36.560> up<00:36:36.720> like<00:36:37.119> Slack
everything spinning up like Slack
everything spinning up like Slack
channels<00:36:38.079> and<00:36:38.720> getting<00:36:38.960> NDAs<00:36:39.520> signed<00:36:40.079> and<00:36:40.560> you
channels and getting NDAs signed and you
channels and getting NDAs signed and you
know<00:36:41.040> contractor<00:36:41.599> agreements<00:36:42.079> and<00:36:42.400> all<00:36:42.560> of
know contractor agreements and all of
know contractor agreements and all of
these<00:36:42.960> kinds<00:36:43.119> of<00:36:43.200> things<00:36:43.359> to<00:36:43.599> make<00:36:43.760> sure<00:36:43.839> that
these kinds of things to make sure that
these kinds of things to make sure that
we<00:36:44.160> can<00:36:44.240> do<00:36:44.400> this.
we can do this.
we can do this.
Yeah.<00:36:45.280> This<00:36:45.359> is<00:36:45.440> not<00:36:45.599> an<00:36:45.760> area<00:36:45.839> that<00:36:46.000> you're
Yeah. This is not an area that you're
Yeah. This is not an area that you're
like<00:36:46.560> optimizing<00:36:47.040> yet<00:36:47.280> for<00:36:47.440> efficiency.<00:36:48.000> Like
like optimizing yet for efficiency. Like
like optimizing yet for efficiency. Like
you<00:36:48.400> are<00:36:48.880> spending<00:36:49.200> a<00:36:49.440> lot<00:36:49.520> of<00:36:49.680> time<00:36:50.079> because
you are spending a lot of time because
you are spending a lot of time because
you<00:36:51.040> believe<00:36:51.440> obviously<00:36:51.760> that<00:36:51.920> this<00:36:52.079> upfront
you believe obviously that this upfront
you believe obviously that this upfront
investment<00:36:53.280> in<00:36:53.599> really<00:36:53.920> getting<00:36:54.160> to<00:36:54.320> know
investment in really getting to know
investment in really getting to know
people<00:36:54.720> is<00:36:54.960> going<00:36:55.040> to<00:36:55.119> pay<00:36:55.280> off<00:36:55.520> in<00:36:55.920> their
people is going to pay off in their
people is going to pay off in their
performance<00:36:56.640> and<00:36:57.440> them<00:36:57.680> staying<00:36:57.920> and<00:36:58.160> then
performance and them staying and then
performance and them staying and then
everything<00:36:58.880> you<00:36:59.119> hope<00:36:59.280> they'll<00:36:59.520> be.
everything you hope they'll be.
everything you hope they'll be.
Yes.<00:37:00.240> And<00:37:00.720> you<00:37:00.880> know<00:37:01.119> I<00:37:01.440> it's<00:37:01.760> hard<00:37:02.000> to<00:37:02.160> get
Yes. And you know I it's hard to get
Yes. And you know I it's hard to get
like<00:37:02.640> firm<00:37:03.040> attrition<00:37:03.839> data<00:37:04.480> you<00:37:04.640> know<00:37:04.800> for
like firm attrition data you know for
like firm attrition data you know for
companies<00:37:05.520> of<00:37:05.839> our<00:37:06.079> size<00:37:06.480> and<00:37:06.800> scale<00:37:07.280> but<00:37:07.760> I
companies of our size and scale but I
companies of our size and scale but I
generally<00:37:08.480> think<00:37:08.640> that<00:37:08.960> we<00:37:09.280> tend<00:37:09.520> to<00:37:09.680> have
generally think that we tend to have
generally think that we tend to have
people<00:37:10.240> for<00:37:10.720> longer
people for longer
people for longer
than<00:37:12.800> most<00:37:13.040> companies.
than most companies.
than most companies.
Yeah.<00:37:13.760> No.<00:37:13.920> And<00:37:14.079> no<00:37:14.160> one's<00:37:14.320> going<00:37:14.400> to<00:37:14.480> go
Yeah. No. And no one's going to go
Yeah. No. And no one's going to go
through<00:37:14.720> that<00:37:14.880> interview<00:37:15.200> process<00:37:15.440> if<00:37:15.680> they
through that interview process if they
through that interview process if they
aren't<00:37:16.480> planning<00:37:16.800> to<00:37:17.040> stay<00:37:17.280> a<00:37:17.440> little<00:37:17.520> bit
aren't planning to stay a little bit
aren't planning to stay a little bit
longer.<00:37:18.000> Like<00:37:18.240> the<00:37:18.480> personal<00:37:19.359> ROI<00:37:19.839> wouldn't
longer. Like the personal ROI wouldn't
longer. Like the personal ROI wouldn't
wouldn't<00:37:20.400> make<00:37:20.560> sense.<00:37:20.880> So,<00:37:21.119> you<00:37:21.200> know,<00:37:21.359> you
wouldn't make sense. So, you know, you
wouldn't make sense. So, you know, you
see<00:37:21.599> a<00:37:21.760> lot<00:37:21.839> of<00:37:21.920> jumpiness<00:37:22.400> at<00:37:22.640> at<00:37:23.040> earlier
see a lot of jumpiness at at earlier
see a lot of jumpiness at at earlier
stage<00:37:23.760> tech<00:37:24.000> companies<00:37:24.240> that<00:37:24.480> I<00:37:24.640> imagine<00:37:25.359> you
stage tech companies that I imagine you
stage tech companies that I imagine you
might<00:37:25.920> not<00:37:26.079> get<00:37:26.240> as<00:37:26.400> much<00:37:26.560> of.
might not get as much of.
might not get as much of.
Totally.<00:37:27.359> Yeah.<00:37:27.520> I<00:37:27.760> mean,<00:37:27.839> sometimes<00:37:28.160> we'll
Totally. Yeah. I mean, sometimes we'll
Totally. Yeah. I mean, sometimes we'll
have<00:37:28.480> candidates<00:37:28.960> come<00:37:29.040> to<00:37:29.200> us<00:37:29.280> and<00:37:29.520> they'll
have candidates come to us and they'll
have candidates come to us and they'll
be<00:37:29.839> like,<00:37:29.920> "So,<00:37:30.240> I've<00:37:30.560> got<00:37:30.720> four<00:37:30.960> or<00:37:31.200> five
be like, "So, I've got four or five
be like, "So, I've got four or five
offers,<00:37:32.160> you<00:37:32.320> know,<00:37:33.200> from<00:37:33.520> all<00:37:33.680> the<00:37:33.920> like<00:37:34.160> you
offers, you know, from all the like you
offers, you know, from all the like you
name<00:37:34.480> it<00:37:34.720> companies<00:37:35.440> right<00:37:35.680> now,<00:37:36.400> but<00:37:36.800> maybe<00:37:36.960> I
name it companies right now, but maybe I
name it companies right now, but maybe I
could<00:37:37.280> still<00:37:37.440> interview<00:37:37.680> at<00:37:37.839> Lier."<00:37:38.160> And<00:37:38.240> then
could still interview at Lier." And then
could still interview at Lier." And then
we're<00:37:38.480> like,<00:37:38.560> "Well,<00:37:39.440> let's<00:37:39.760> pause."<00:37:40.160> Like,
we're like, "Well, let's pause." Like,
we're like, "Well, let's pause." Like,
what<00:37:40.960> are<00:37:41.040> you<00:37:41.200> really<00:37:41.440> looking<00:37:41.599> for?<00:37:42.240> like
what are you really looking for? like
what are you really looking for? like
and<00:37:43.200> why<00:37:43.440> are<00:37:43.599> you<00:37:44.000> trying<00:37:44.240> to<00:37:44.480> get<00:37:44.720> like<00:37:45.200> your
and why are you trying to get like your
and why are you trying to get like your
sixth<00:37:46.000> offer,<00:37:46.640> right?<00:37:47.280> So,<00:37:47.440> a<00:37:47.599> lot<00:37:47.680> of<00:37:47.760> it<00:37:47.920> is
sixth offer, right? So, a lot of it is
sixth offer, right? So, a lot of it is
just<00:37:48.240> kind<00:37:48.320> of<00:37:48.480> understanding<00:37:48.960> like<00:37:49.200> the
just kind of understanding like the
just kind of understanding like the
candidate<00:37:49.839> and<00:37:50.240> where<00:37:50.480> they're<00:37:50.800> coming<00:37:50.960> from
candidate and where they're coming from
candidate and where they're coming from
and<00:37:51.920> what<00:37:52.160> motivates<00:37:52.640> them<00:37:52.960> and<00:37:53.280> trying<00:37:53.440> to
and what motivates them and trying to
and what motivates them and trying to
figure<00:37:53.680> out<00:37:53.839> if<00:37:54.079> that<00:37:54.320> aligns,<00:37:55.040> right?<00:37:55.839> Um
figure out if that aligns, right? Um
figure out if that aligns, right? Um
with<00:37:56.480> what<00:37:56.720> we<00:37:56.880> have<00:37:56.960> to<00:37:57.119> offer.<00:37:57.760> Um<00:37:58.000> so
with what we have to offer. Um so
with what we have to offer. Um so
sometimes<00:37:58.640> it's<00:37:58.880> a<00:37:59.040> good<00:37:59.359> forcing<00:37:59.760> function
sometimes it's a good forcing function
sometimes it's a good forcing function
for<00:38:00.240> that<00:38:00.480> conversation<00:38:01.119> too.
for that conversation too.
for that conversation too.
Yeah.<00:38:01.920> To<00:38:02.160> kind<00:38:02.320> of<00:38:02.480> and<00:38:02.720> to<00:38:02.880> filter<00:38:03.119> out
Yeah. To kind of and to filter out
Yeah. To kind of and to filter out
people<00:38:03.440> that<00:38:03.599> are<00:38:03.760> just<00:38:03.920> trying<00:38:04.079> to<00:38:04.160> get
people that are just trying to get
people that are just trying to get
another<00:38:04.800> offer<00:38:05.119> in<00:38:05.280> their<00:38:05.680> gather<00:38:05.920> in<00:38:06.079> their
another offer in their gather in their
another offer in their gather in their
cap.<00:38:06.800> What<00:38:07.040> would<00:38:07.200> you<00:38:07.280> say<00:38:07.440> to<00:38:07.599> like<00:38:07.839> chief
cap. What would you say to like chief
cap. What would you say to like chief
people<00:38:08.240> officer<00:38:08.560> of<00:38:08.640> a<00:38:08.800> 2,000<00:38:09.119> person<00:38:09.440> company
people officer of a 2,000 person company
people officer of a 2,000 person company
that's<00:38:09.920> like<00:38:10.079> all<00:38:10.160> right<00:38:10.960> can't<00:38:11.200> do<00:38:11.359> it<00:38:11.760> fully
that's like all right can't do it fully
that's like all right can't do it fully
the<00:38:12.320> way<00:38:12.400> you<00:38:12.560> do<00:38:12.640> it<00:38:12.880> my<00:38:13.040> candidates<00:38:13.599> can't
the way you do it my candidates can't
the way you do it my candidates can't
take<00:38:14.079> 3<00:38:14.320> days<00:38:14.480> off<00:38:14.720> work<00:38:15.040> or<00:38:15.280> our<00:38:15.440> scale<00:38:15.680> is<00:38:15.920> too
take 3 days off work or our scale is too
take 3 days off work or our scale is too
big<00:38:16.640> are<00:38:16.800> there<00:38:17.040> lessons<00:38:17.520> from<00:38:17.680> what<00:38:17.839> you're
big are there lessons from what you're
big are there lessons from what you're
doing<00:38:18.160> that<00:38:18.400> are<00:38:18.560> applicable<00:38:18.960> at<00:38:19.119> a<00:38:19.280> larger
doing that are applicable at a larger
doing that are applicable at a larger
stage<00:38:19.839> even<00:38:20.000> if<00:38:20.160> it's<00:38:20.320> not<00:38:20.480> a<00:38:20.640> 5day<00:38:21.119> work<00:38:21.280> trial
stage even if it's not a 5day work trial
stage even if it's not a 5day work trial
yeah<00:38:22.400> I<00:38:22.720> mean<00:38:23.200> even<00:38:23.440> if<00:38:23.680> we<00:38:23.920> had<00:38:24.160> to<00:38:24.320> get<00:38:24.480> rid<00:38:24.720> of
yeah I mean even if we had to get rid of
yeah I mean even if we had to get rid of
this<00:38:25.119> at<00:38:25.280> a<00:38:25.440> certain<00:38:25.760> scale<00:38:27.040> I<00:38:27.760> would
this at a certain scale I would
this at a certain scale I would
definitely<00:38:28.400> still<00:38:28.640> look<00:38:28.800> to<00:38:28.960> do<00:38:29.119> it<00:38:29.280> for<00:38:29.680> like
definitely still look to do it for like
definitely still look to do it for like
leadership<00:38:30.480> candidates<00:38:31.200> at<00:38:31.440> the<00:38:31.520> very<00:38:31.760> least
leadership candidates at the very least
leadership candidates at the very least
as<00:38:32.240> an<00:38:32.320> example<00:38:33.200> and<00:38:33.440> I<00:38:33.680> think<00:38:34.640> the<00:38:35.040> reason<00:38:35.680> for
as an example and I think the reason for
as an example and I think the reason for
that<00:38:36.240> is<00:38:36.720> is<00:38:36.800> is<00:38:37.280> actually<00:38:37.520> like<00:38:37.839> I<00:38:38.079> do<00:38:38.240> know<00:38:38.320> a
that is is is actually like I do know a
that is is is actually like I do know a
lot<00:38:38.640> of<00:38:38.720> leadership<00:38:39.119> candidates<00:38:39.440> that<00:38:39.680> go
lot of leadership candidates that go
lot of leadership candidates that go
through<00:38:40.079> maybe<00:38:40.400> not<00:38:40.560> exactly<00:38:40.880> a<00:38:41.040> work<00:38:41.280> trial
through maybe not exactly a work trial
through maybe not exactly a work trial
but<00:38:41.760> something<00:38:42.160> similar.<00:38:43.119> Uh<00:38:43.440> Claire<00:38:43.760> Hughes
but something similar. Uh Claire Hughes
but something similar. Uh Claire Hughes
Johnson<00:38:44.320> when<00:38:44.560> she<00:38:44.800> was<00:38:45.359> um<00:38:45.680> thinking<00:38:45.920> about
Johnson when she was um thinking about
Johnson when she was um thinking about
joining<00:38:46.720> Stripe<00:38:47.760> would,<00:38:48.800> you<00:38:48.960> know,<00:38:49.119> after
joining Stripe would, you know, after
joining Stripe would, you know, after
she<00:38:49.599> finished<00:38:49.839> up<00:38:50.160> or<00:38:50.320> work<00:38:50.480> at<00:38:50.720> Google,<00:38:51.280> you
she finished up or work at Google, you
she finished up or work at Google, you
know,<00:38:51.760> take<00:38:51.920> a<00:38:52.160> car<00:38:52.560> up<00:38:52.800> to<00:38:53.040> the<00:38:53.599> Stripe<00:38:53.920> San
know, take a car up to the Stripe San
know, take a car up to the Stripe San
Francisco<00:38:54.560> office<00:38:54.960> and<00:38:55.200> just<00:38:55.760> spend<00:38:56.079> a<00:38:56.320> few
Francisco office and just spend a few
Francisco office and just spend a few
hours<00:38:56.800> in<00:38:56.960> a<00:38:57.200> conference<00:38:57.520> room<00:38:58.160> with<00:38:58.400> the
hours in a conference room with the
hours in a conference room with the
Stripe<00:38:58.880> founders<00:38:59.440> and<00:38:59.760> just<00:38:59.920> kind<00:39:00.079> of<00:39:00.480> be
Stripe founders and just kind of be
Stripe founders and just kind of be
like,<00:39:00.800> "Okay,<00:39:01.200> what<00:39:01.359> are<00:39:01.440> your<00:39:01.599> problems?
like, "Okay, what are your problems?
like, "Okay, what are your problems?
Like,<00:39:02.320> let's<00:39:02.560> talk<00:39:02.720> through<00:39:02.960> them<00:39:03.200> and<00:39:03.520> let's,
Like, let's talk through them and let's,
Like, let's talk through them and let's,
you<00:39:04.160> know,<00:39:04.320> think<00:39:04.480> through<00:39:04.640> how<00:39:04.800> we<00:39:04.960> would
you know, think through how we would
you know, think through how we would
solve<00:39:05.359> them,<00:39:05.680> right?"<00:39:05.920> And<00:39:06.560> so,<00:39:06.880> you<00:39:07.040> know,
solve them, right?" And so, you know,
solve them, right?" And so, you know,
whatever<00:39:07.680> variant<00:39:08.560> kind<00:39:08.800> of<00:39:08.960> makes<00:39:09.200> sense.<00:39:09.839> I
whatever variant kind of makes sense. I
whatever variant kind of makes sense. I
would<00:39:10.320> say<00:39:11.680> for<00:39:13.040> roles<00:39:13.440> like<00:39:13.680> IC<00:39:14.079> roles,<00:39:14.400> first
would say for roles like IC roles, first
would say for roles like IC roles, first
level<00:39:14.960> management<00:39:15.200> roles,<00:39:15.760> etc.<00:39:16.480> You<00:39:16.640> know,
level management roles, etc. You know,
level management roles, etc. You know,
starting<00:39:17.119> with<00:39:17.359> like<00:39:17.760> how<00:39:17.920> do<00:39:18.079> you<00:39:19.200> transition
starting with like how do you transition
starting with like how do you transition
your<00:39:19.920> recruiting<00:39:20.400> process<00:39:20.800> to<00:39:21.040> be<00:39:21.200> as<00:39:21.440> similar
your recruiting process to be as similar
your recruiting process to be as similar
to<00:39:21.920> the<00:39:22.160> real<00:39:22.400> work<00:39:22.640> environment<00:39:23.440> as<00:39:23.760> possible
to the real work environment as possible
to the real work environment as possible
and<00:39:24.800> think<00:39:24.960> about<00:39:25.119> the<00:39:25.280> things<00:39:25.440> that<00:39:25.599> you
and think about the things that you
and think about the things that you
really<00:39:25.920> care<00:39:26.160> about,<00:39:26.640> you<00:39:26.720> know,
really care about, you know,
really care about, you know,
collaboration?<00:39:27.839> Is<00:39:28.000> it<00:39:28.160> feedback?<00:39:28.640> Are<00:39:28.800> you
collaboration? Is it feedback? Are you
collaboration? Is it feedback? Are you
really<00:39:29.200> like<00:39:29.920> assessing<00:39:30.400> those<00:39:30.800> in<00:39:31.040> the
really like assessing those in the
really like assessing those in the
process<00:39:31.520> that<00:39:31.760> you<00:39:32.000> have?<00:39:32.560> Um,<00:39:32.880> one<00:39:33.040> of<00:39:33.040> the
process that you have? Um, one of the
process that you have? Um, one of the
things<00:39:33.280> that<00:39:33.440> I<00:39:33.599> think<00:39:33.680> Stripe<00:39:34.079> did<00:39:34.240> really
things that I think Stripe did really
things that I think Stripe did really
well<00:39:34.480> when<00:39:34.640> we<00:39:34.800> were<00:39:34.880> hiring<00:39:35.200> for<00:39:35.359> managers
well when we were hiring for managers
well when we were hiring for managers
was<00:39:36.400> um,<00:39:36.480> there<00:39:36.640> was<00:39:36.720> a<00:39:36.960> manager<00:39:37.359> roleplay
was um, there was a manager roleplay
was um, there was a manager roleplay
exercise<00:39:38.480> that<00:39:38.720> we<00:39:38.880> had<00:39:39.119> as<00:39:39.359> part<00:39:39.440> of<00:39:39.599> our
exercise that we had as part of our
exercise that we had as part of our
manager<00:39:40.800> recruiting<00:39:41.200> process.<00:39:41.680> And<00:39:41.839> that's
manager recruiting process. And that's
manager recruiting process. And that's
always<00:39:42.320> like<00:39:42.640> a<00:39:42.880> very<00:39:43.119> awkward<00:39:44.480> thing
always like a very awkward thing
always like a very awkward thing
thing<00:39:46.160> to<00:39:46.400> do,<00:39:46.880> but<00:39:47.040> it's<00:39:47.280> like,<00:39:47.520> okay,<00:39:47.920> like
thing to do, but it's like, okay, like
thing to do, but it's like, okay, like
we're<00:39:48.400> going<00:39:48.480> to<00:39:48.560> get<00:39:48.640> you<00:39:48.800> in<00:39:48.880> a<00:39:49.040> room<00:39:49.119> and
we're going to get you in a room and
we're going to get you in a room and
this<00:39:49.680> these<00:39:50.079> two<00:39:50.240> people<00:39:50.560> are<00:39:50.800> going<00:39:50.960> to
this these two people are going to
this these two people are going to
pretend<00:39:51.839> to<00:39:52.079> be<00:39:52.240> engineers<00:39:52.960> who<00:39:53.359> are<00:39:54.000> who
pretend to be engineers who are who
pretend to be engineers who are who
disagree<00:39:54.720> on<00:39:54.880> the<00:39:55.119> approach<00:39:55.440> for<00:39:55.680> how<00:39:55.839> to
disagree on the approach for how to
disagree on the approach for how to
handle<00:39:56.240> this<00:39:56.960> product<00:39:57.280> and<00:39:57.599> you're<00:39:57.839> going<00:39:57.920> to
handle this product and you're going to
handle this product and you're going to
be<00:39:58.560> the<00:39:58.880> manager<00:39:59.280> that<00:39:59.520> like<00:39:59.760> talks<00:40:00.079> them
be the manager that like talks them
be the manager that like talks them
through<00:40:00.400> this<00:40:00.480> and<00:40:00.720> tries<00:40:00.880> to<00:40:00.960> get<00:40:01.119> to<00:40:01.200> a
through this and tries to get to a
through this and tries to get to a
resolution.<00:40:02.000> That's<00:40:02.240> like<00:40:02.400> a<00:40:02.640> very<00:40:03.040> real<00:40:03.760> life
resolution. That's like a very real life
resolution. That's like a very real life
example.<00:40:04.880> And<00:40:05.040> so<00:40:05.760> trying<00:40:06.000> to<00:40:06.240> like
example. And so trying to like
example. And so trying to like
understand<00:40:06.880> how<00:40:07.119> someone<00:40:07.440> was<00:40:07.680> going<00:40:07.760> to
understand how someone was going to
understand how someone was going to
handle<00:40:08.320> like<00:40:08.640> conflict<00:40:09.119> between<00:40:09.440> people<00:40:09.599> on
handle like conflict between people on
handle like conflict between people on
their<00:40:10.000> teams<00:40:10.320> is<00:40:10.560> really<00:40:10.800> important.<00:40:11.280> Right.
their teams is really important. Right.
their teams is really important. Right.
So<00:40:12.000> if<00:40:12.160> you<00:40:12.320> can't<00:40:12.480> do<00:40:12.560> the<00:40:12.720> full<00:40:12.880> work<00:40:13.040> trial,
So if you can't do the full work trial,
So if you can't do the full work trial,
you're<00:40:13.520> approximating<00:40:14.560> a<00:40:14.800> scenario<00:40:15.200> they
you're approximating a scenario they
you're approximating a scenario they
would<00:40:15.520> run<00:40:15.599> into<00:40:15.839> and<00:40:16.000> you're<00:40:16.160> seeing<00:40:16.320> how
would run into and you're seeing how
would run into and you're seeing how
they<00:40:16.720> would<00:40:17.280> solve<00:40:17.520> that.
they would solve that.
they would solve that.
Exactly.<00:40:18.400> Exactly.<00:40:18.880> So<00:40:19.040> I<00:40:19.200> think<00:40:19.359> you<00:40:19.520> should
Exactly. Exactly. So I think you should
Exactly. Exactly. So I think you should
be<00:40:19.760> bringing<00:40:20.000> that<00:40:20.160> into<00:40:20.400> like<00:40:20.960> every<00:40:21.680> process
be bringing that into like every process
be bringing that into like every process
uh<00:40:23.359> where<00:40:24.000> you<00:40:24.320> can<00:40:25.119> and<00:40:25.280> then<00:40:25.440> I<00:40:25.680> think<00:40:25.760> for<00:40:25.920> a
uh where you can and then I think for a
uh where you can and then I think for a
leadership<00:40:26.480> candidate<00:40:26.800> it's<00:40:27.040> like
leadership candidate it's like
leadership candidate it's like
approximating<00:40:28.079> some<00:40:28.640> kind<00:40:28.880> of<00:40:29.280> similar<00:40:30.160> we're
approximating some kind of similar we're
approximating some kind of similar we're
going<00:40:30.560> to<00:40:30.640> give<00:40:30.800> you<00:40:31.280> something<00:40:31.680> that<00:40:32.560> we're
going to give you something that we're
going to give you something that we're
facing<00:40:33.440> you<00:40:33.599> know<00:40:33.760> we<00:40:34.079> don't<00:40:34.240> really<00:40:34.880> you<00:40:35.040> know
facing you know we don't really you know
facing you know we don't really you know
understand<00:40:35.680> how<00:40:35.839> to<00:40:36.000> handle<00:40:36.240> it<00:40:36.400> yet<00:40:36.640> or<00:40:36.880> know
understand how to handle it yet or know
understand how to handle it yet or know
what<00:40:37.200> to<00:40:37.359> do<00:40:37.760> and<00:40:38.000> we<00:40:38.640> want<00:40:38.960> you<00:40:39.520> to<00:40:39.760> like
what to do and we want you to like
what to do and we want you to like
workshop<00:40:40.480> it<00:40:40.640> with<00:40:40.800> us<00:40:41.200> right<00:40:41.599> or<00:40:41.920> come<00:40:42.079> up
workshop it with us right or come up
workshop it with us right or come up
with<00:40:42.400> something<00:40:42.960> right<00:40:43.920> um<00:40:44.240> I'm<00:40:44.560> always
with something right um I'm always
with something right um I'm always
surprised<00:40:45.119> at<00:40:45.359> how<00:40:46.320> difficult<00:40:46.720> it<00:40:46.960> is
surprised at how difficult it is
surprised at how difficult it is
sometimes<00:40:47.440> for<00:40:47.680> leaders<00:40:48.000> to<00:40:48.320> like<00:40:49.280> come<00:40:49.839> up
sometimes for leaders to like come up
sometimes for leaders to like come up
with<00:40:50.480> like<00:40:51.920> a
with like a
with like a
like<00:40:54.000> a<00:40:54.320> real<00:40:54.560> work<00:40:54.800> product.
like a real work product.
like a real work product.
Yeah.<00:40:56.319> Because<00:40:56.480> they've<00:40:56.720> had<00:40:57.200> 10<00:40:57.599> layers
Yeah. Because they've had 10 layers
Yeah. Because they've had 10 layers
below<00:40:58.240> them<00:40:58.800> doing<00:40:59.040> that.<00:40:59.359> Like<00:40:59.599> sometimes
below them doing that. Like sometimes
below them doing that. Like sometimes
people<00:41:00.319> just<00:41:00.560> can't<00:41:01.040> like<00:41:01.359> make<00:41:01.599> their<00:41:01.839> own
people just can't like make their own
people just can't like make their own
deck<00:41:02.480> and<00:41:02.720> it's<00:41:02.960> really<00:41:03.359> incredible.<00:41:03.760> And<00:41:03.920> if
deck and it's really incredible. And if
deck and it's really incredible. And if
you're<00:41:04.160> in<00:41:04.319> a<00:41:04.400> culture<00:41:04.640> where<00:41:04.880> that's
you're in a culture where that's
you're in a culture where that's
required,
required,
required,
I<00:41:06.160> think<00:41:06.319> making<00:41:06.640> people<00:41:07.040> put<00:41:07.440> words<00:41:07.760> down<00:41:08.000> on
I think making people put words down on
I think making people put words down on
paper<00:41:08.800> that<00:41:09.040> they<00:41:09.200> have<00:41:09.359> written<00:41:09.599> themselves
paper that they have written themselves
paper that they have written themselves
is<00:41:10.400> a<00:41:10.640> really<00:41:10.800> good<00:41:11.040> test<00:41:11.359> of<00:41:11.520> whether<00:41:11.839> people
is a really good test of whether people
is a really good test of whether people
can<00:41:12.240> do<00:41:12.800> certain<00:41:13.040> jobs.
can do certain jobs.
can do certain jobs.
Yes.<00:41:13.920> And<00:41:14.160> we<00:41:14.319> had<00:41:14.400> this<00:41:14.560> at<00:41:14.720> Stripe<00:41:15.040> where
Yes. And we had this at Stripe where
Yes. And we had this at Stripe where
there<00:41:15.359> was<00:41:15.440> a<00:41:15.599> certain<00:41:15.920> I<00:41:16.160> remember<00:41:16.400> there<00:41:16.560> was
there was a certain I remember there was
there was a certain I remember there was
a<00:41:16.880> certain<00:41:17.119> person<00:41:17.359> we<00:41:17.599> hired<00:41:17.920> and<00:41:18.640> I<00:41:18.880> think<00:41:19.040> a
a certain person we hired and I think a
a certain person we hired and I think a
lot<00:41:19.359> of<00:41:19.440> times<00:41:19.680> when<00:41:19.920> you're<00:41:20.160> hiring<00:41:21.440> like<00:41:21.760> a
lot of times when you're hiring like a
lot of times when you're hiring like a
senior<00:41:22.400> leader<00:41:22.880> you<00:41:23.119> have<00:41:23.280> like<00:41:23.920> people<00:41:24.319> who
senior leader you have like people who
senior leader you have like people who
would<00:41:24.880> be<00:41:25.040> managed<00:41:25.359> by<00:41:25.520> them<00:41:25.839> interview<00:41:26.319> them
would be managed by them interview them
would be managed by them interview them
and<00:41:26.960> then<00:41:27.200> sometimes<00:41:27.599> you<00:41:27.920> have<00:41:28.160> that<00:41:28.400> happen
and then sometimes you have that happen
and then sometimes you have that happen
the<00:41:29.040> feedback<00:41:29.359> isn't<00:41:29.680> good<00:41:29.760> and<00:41:29.920> you<00:41:30.079> hire
the feedback isn't good and you hire
the feedback isn't good and you hire
them<00:41:30.400> anyway
them anyway
them anyway
right<00:41:33.119> and<00:41:33.359> so<00:41:33.599> sometimes<00:41:33.920> when<00:41:34.160> you're<00:41:34.400> like
right and so sometimes when you're like
right and so sometimes when you're like
the<00:41:35.040> people<00:41:35.200> on<00:41:35.359> the<00:41:35.440> team<00:41:35.599> you're<00:41:35.760> like<00:41:35.920> well
the people on the team you're like well
the people on the team you're like well
so<00:41:36.400> why<00:41:36.560> did<00:41:36.640> I<00:41:36.800> even<00:41:36.960> interview<00:41:37.359> them<00:41:37.520> at<00:41:37.760> all
so why did I even interview them at all
so why did I even interview them at all
right<00:41:38.720> at<00:41:38.880> the<00:41:39.040> same<00:41:39.200> time<00:41:39.599> not<00:41:39.839> everyone's
right at the same time not everyone's
right at the same time not everyone's
going<00:41:40.480> to<00:41:40.640> give<00:41:41.839> the<00:41:42.640> most<00:41:43.040> relevant
going to give the most relevant
going to give the most relevant
and<00:41:44.400> honest<00:41:44.720> feedback<00:41:45.440> on<00:41:45.760> anyone<00:41:46.240> like<00:41:46.640> you
and honest feedback on anyone like you
and honest feedback on anyone like you
might<00:41:47.200> have<00:41:47.440> people<00:41:47.599> who<00:41:47.760> are<00:41:47.920> just<00:41:48.000> like<00:41:48.160> I
might have people who are just like I
might have people who are just like I
hate<00:41:48.480> everyone<00:41:48.720> who's<00:41:48.960> going<00:41:49.040> to<00:41:49.119> interview
hate everyone who's going to interview
hate everyone who's going to interview
for<00:41:49.599> my<00:41:49.839> manager<00:41:50.160> role<00:41:51.119> you<00:41:51.200> know<00:41:51.520> and<00:41:51.680> then
for my manager role you know and then
for my manager role you know and then
you'll<00:41:52.079> end<00:41:52.160> up<00:41:52.319> never<00:41:52.560> hiring<00:41:52.880> anyone<00:41:53.440> so<00:41:54.000> you
you'll end up never hiring anyone so you
you'll end up never hiring anyone so you
know<00:41:54.240> I<00:41:54.480> think<00:41:54.560> you<00:41:54.720> have<00:41:54.880> to<00:41:55.040> find<00:41:55.280> the<00:41:55.520> right
know I think you have to find the right
know I think you have to find the right
balance<00:41:56.079> but<00:41:56.319> I<00:41:56.400> I<00:41:56.720> look<00:41:56.880> back<00:41:57.040> on<00:41:57.200> that
balance but I I look back on that
balance but I I look back on that
particular<00:41:58.000> situation<00:41:58.480> and<00:41:58.640> I'm<00:41:58.800> like<00:41:59.599> that
particular situation and I'm like that
particular situation and I'm like that
person<00:42:00.160> didn't<00:42:00.480> produce<00:42:00.800> anything<00:42:01.359> before
person didn't produce anything before
person didn't produce anything before
they<00:42:02.079> before<00:42:02.319> they<00:42:02.560> came<00:42:02.720> in<00:42:03.040> and<00:42:03.200> I<00:42:03.359> think
they before they came in and I think
they before they came in and I think
immediately<00:42:04.400> we're<00:42:04.640> like<00:42:04.800> I<00:42:04.960> need<00:42:05.119> a<00:42:05.200> chief<00:42:05.440> of
immediately we're like I need a chief of
immediately we're like I need a chief of
staff<00:42:06.240> I<00:42:06.400> need<00:42:06.480> a<00:42:06.640> strategy<00:42:06.960> and<00:42:07.200> operations
staff I need a strategy and operations
staff I need a strategy and operations
person<00:42:08.480> I<00:42:08.640> need<00:42:08.800> this<00:42:09.040> other<00:42:09.200> person<00:42:09.599> because
person I need this other person because
person I need this other person because
they<00:42:10.319> need<00:42:10.480> someone<00:42:10.720> to<00:42:10.960> go<00:42:11.200> do<00:42:11.359> the<00:42:11.520> work<00:42:11.680> for
they need someone to go do the work for
they need someone to go do the work for
I'm<00:42:13.200> more<00:42:13.359> of<00:42:13.440> an<00:42:13.680> ideas<00:42:14.079> guy.
I'm more of an ideas guy.
I'm more of an ideas guy.
Right.<00:42:15.040> Exactly.<00:42:16.000> And<00:42:16.319> so<00:42:16.640> I<00:42:16.960> look<00:42:17.119> back<00:42:17.280> and
Right. Exactly. And so I look back and
Right. Exactly. And so I look back and
I'm<00:42:17.599> like<00:42:17.760> I<00:42:17.920> feel<00:42:18.000> like<00:42:18.160> we<00:42:18.319> could<00:42:18.480> have<00:42:18.640> saved
I'm like I feel like we could have saved
I'm like I feel like we could have saved
ourselves<00:42:19.359> like<00:42:19.599> so<00:42:19.839> much<00:42:20.000> time.
ourselves like so much time.
ourselves like so much time.
Some<00:42:20.640> kind<00:42:20.720> of<00:42:20.880> work<00:42:21.200> sample<00:42:21.680> work.
Some kind of work sample work.
Some kind of work sample work.
Right.<00:42:22.240> And<00:42:22.400> and<00:42:22.720> I<00:42:23.040> again<00:42:23.520> maybe<00:42:23.839> that<00:42:24.079> person
Right. And and I again maybe that person
Right. And and I again maybe that person
flies<00:42:24.800> at<00:42:25.040> a<00:42:25.119> different<00:42:25.359> kind<00:42:25.440> of<00:42:25.599> company.
flies at a different kind of company.
flies at a different kind of company.
But<00:42:26.160> I<00:42:26.400> think<00:42:27.040> Stripe<00:42:27.520> at<00:42:27.599> least<00:42:27.839> at<00:42:28.079> that
But I think Stripe at least at that
But I think Stripe at least at that
point<00:42:28.400> in<00:42:28.640> time<00:42:28.880> was<00:42:29.200> still<00:42:29.440> like<00:42:29.760> no<00:42:30.079> you<00:42:30.319> got
point in time was still like no you got
point in time was still like no you got
to<00:42:30.480> like<00:42:30.720> dig<00:42:30.880> in<00:42:31.119> and<00:42:31.440> like<00:42:31.680> know<00:42:31.920> the<00:42:32.079> details
to like dig in and like know the details
to like dig in and like know the details
of<00:42:32.560> the<00:42:32.720> work<00:42:33.119> and
of the work and
of the work and
it's<00:42:33.599> also<00:42:33.760> a<00:42:33.920> very<00:42:34.079> writingheavy<00:42:35.119> culture.
it's also a very writingheavy culture.
it's also a very writingheavy culture.
Yes.<00:42:36.240> Exactly.
Yes. Exactly.
Yes. Exactly.
So<00:42:36.720> I<00:42:36.800> would<00:42:36.880> imagine<00:42:37.200> people<00:42:37.359> have<00:42:37.440> to<00:42:37.520> be
So I would imagine people have to be
So I would imagine people have to be
able<00:42:37.760> to<00:42:37.839> write<00:42:38.079> things.
able to write things.
able to write things.
Exactly.<00:42:39.280> Exactly.<00:42:39.920> So,<00:42:40.319> you<00:42:40.480> know,<00:42:40.640> things
Exactly. Exactly. So, you know, things
Exactly. Exactly. So, you know, things
like<00:42:40.960> that,<00:42:41.280> figuring<00:42:41.599> out<00:42:41.760> what<00:42:42.000> to<00:42:42.160> test
like that, figuring out what to test
like that, figuring out what to test
that<00:42:42.800> matters<00:42:43.440> in<00:42:43.920> your<00:42:44.240> organization.
that matters in your organization.
that matters in your organization.
Linear,<00:42:45.760> not<00:42:46.079> a<00:42:46.319> super<00:42:46.560> writing<00:42:46.960> heavy
Linear, not a super writing heavy
Linear, not a super writing heavy
culture.<00:42:48.160> We<00:42:48.319> try<00:42:48.480> to<00:42:48.640> get<00:42:48.800> everything<00:42:49.040> down
culture. We try to get everything down
culture. We try to get everything down
to<00:42:49.440> like<00:42:49.680> bullets<00:42:50.079> in<00:42:50.160> the<00:42:50.319> Slack<00:42:50.640> message<00:42:51.040> and
to like bullets in the Slack message and
to like bullets in the Slack message and
keep<00:42:51.920> it<00:42:52.079> very<00:42:52.640> concise.<00:42:53.599> So,<00:42:53.839> very<00:42:54.079> different
keep it very concise. So, very different
keep it very concise. So, very different
from<00:42:54.480> like<00:42:54.800> at<00:42:54.960> Stripe,<00:42:55.280> you're<00:42:55.440> expected<00:42:55.680> to
from like at Stripe, you're expected to
from like at Stripe, you're expected to
write<00:42:55.920> a<00:42:56.079> five-page<00:42:56.480> memo<00:42:56.880> if<00:42:57.119> you<00:42:57.280> expect<00:42:57.520> to
write a five-page memo if you expect to
write a five-page memo if you expect to
like<00:42:58.160> start<00:42:58.480> anything<00:42:58.800> new<00:42:59.119> or<00:42:59.359> get<00:42:59.520> anything
like start anything new or get anything
like start anything new or get anything
off<00:42:59.920> the<00:43:00.079> ground,<00:43:00.400> right?<00:43:01.280> So,<00:43:01.599> different
off the ground, right? So, different
off the ground, right? So, different
cultures<00:43:02.240> need<00:43:02.400> different<00:43:02.640> things<00:43:02.880> and<00:43:03.359> you
cultures need different things and you
cultures need different things and you
know,<00:43:03.760> testing<00:43:04.079> for<00:43:04.240> what<00:43:04.480> matters<00:43:04.720> I<00:43:04.960> think
know, testing for what matters I think
know, testing for what matters I think
is<00:43:05.200> the<00:43:05.359> most<00:43:05.520> important.<00:43:06.640> You<00:43:06.960> also<00:43:07.200> have<00:43:07.520> So,
is the most important. You also have So,
is the most important. You also have So,
I've<00:43:08.000> read<00:43:08.160> something<00:43:08.400> about<00:43:08.560> your<00:43:08.720> org
I've read something about your org
I've read something about your org
design.<00:43:09.119> Tell<00:43:09.280> me<00:43:09.359> if<00:43:09.520> this<00:43:09.680> is<00:43:09.760> true<00:43:09.839> that<00:43:10.079> you
design. Tell me if this is true that you
design. Tell me if this is true that you
have<00:43:10.400> like<00:43:10.800> I<00:43:11.040> read<00:43:11.200> about<00:43:11.440> it<00:43:11.680> kind<00:43:11.920> of<00:43:12.000> titled
have like I read about it kind of titled
have like I read about it kind of titled
as<00:43:12.560> collapsible<00:43:13.119> teams<00:43:13.440> but<00:43:13.599> this<00:43:13.760> idea<00:43:13.920> that
as collapsible teams but this idea that
as collapsible teams but this idea that
you<00:43:14.319> create<00:43:15.040> teams<00:43:15.359> for<00:43:15.680> urgent<00:43:15.920> projects<00:43:16.240> and
you create teams for urgent projects and
you create teams for urgent projects and
then<00:43:16.560> you<00:43:16.640> can<00:43:16.720> dissolve<00:43:17.119> those<00:43:17.280> teams<00:43:17.599> and
then you can dissolve those teams and
then you can dissolve those teams and
put<00:43:18.240> people<00:43:18.480> on<00:43:18.880> different<00:43:19.280> things<00:43:19.760> that<00:43:20.000> are
put people on different things that are
put people on different things that are
next<00:43:20.640> highest<00:43:21.040> priority.
next highest priority.
next highest priority.
Is<00:43:22.720> that<00:43:22.880> true?<00:43:23.119> And<00:43:23.280> then<00:43:23.440> how<00:43:23.599> does<00:43:23.680> that
Is that true? And then how does that
Is that true? And then how does that
work<00:43:24.000> for<00:43:24.160> how<00:43:24.319> people<00:43:24.560> think<00:43:24.720> about<00:43:24.880> like
work for how people think about like
work for how people think about like
their<00:43:25.599> career<00:43:25.920> growth<00:43:26.240> if<00:43:26.480> people<00:43:26.720> are<00:43:26.880> sort
their career growth if people are sort
their career growth if people are sort
of<00:43:27.599> if<00:43:27.760> it's<00:43:28.000> maybe<00:43:28.160> not<00:43:28.319> so<00:43:28.560> linear<00:43:28.800> and
of if it's maybe not so linear and
of if it's maybe not so linear and
people<00:43:29.200> are<00:43:29.359> just<00:43:29.520> like<00:43:29.680> moving<00:43:29.920> around<00:43:30.160> to
people are just like moving around to
people are just like moving around to
different<00:43:30.560> projects<00:43:30.880> more<00:43:31.119> like<00:43:31.280> jungle<00:43:31.599> gym
different projects more like jungle gym
different projects more like jungle gym
style.
style.
style.
I<00:43:33.520> would<00:43:33.680> love<00:43:33.760> to<00:43:33.839> hear<00:43:34.000> more<00:43:34.160> about<00:43:34.319> that.
I would love to hear more about that.
I would love to hear more about that.
Yeah.<00:43:35.040> Yeah.<00:43:35.359> So<00:43:35.520> this<00:43:35.599> is<00:43:35.680> what<00:43:35.839> we<00:43:35.920> do<00:43:36.079> for
Yeah. Yeah. So this is what we do for
Yeah. Yeah. So this is what we do for
engineering<00:43:37.200> um<00:43:38.560> specifically<00:43:39.839> uh<00:43:40.160> well
engineering um specifically uh well
engineering um specifically uh well
engineering<00:43:40.800> and<00:43:41.040> product<00:43:41.359> design<00:43:41.839> and
engineering and product design and
engineering and product design and
product<00:43:43.040> management<00:43:43.520> as<00:43:43.760> well.<00:43:44.079> So<00:43:44.640> any<00:43:44.880> teams
product management as well. So any teams
product management as well. So any teams
that<00:43:45.359> are<00:43:45.599> working<00:43:45.760> on<00:43:46.160> the<00:43:46.400> build<00:43:46.640> out<00:43:46.800> of
that are working on the build out of
that are working on the build out of
products<00:43:47.200> with<00:43:47.440> the<00:43:47.599> exception<00:43:47.920> of<00:43:48.319> our
products with the exception of our
products with the exception of our
infrastructure<00:43:49.200> teams<00:43:50.160> uh<00:43:50.240> and<00:43:50.400> our<00:43:50.640> mobile
infrastructure teams uh and our mobile
infrastructure teams uh and our mobile
teams<00:43:51.280> specifically<00:43:51.680> because<00:43:51.920> those<00:43:52.160> require
teams specifically because those require
teams specifically because those require
like<00:43:52.960> specialized<00:43:53.680> skill<00:43:53.920> sets<00:43:54.800> and
like specialized skill sets and
like specialized skill sets and
knowledge<00:43:55.760> right<00:43:56.079> like<00:43:56.319> you<00:43:56.480> have<00:43:56.640> to<00:43:56.720> know
knowledge right like you have to know
knowledge right like you have to know
you<00:43:57.440> know<00:43:57.599> certain<00:43:57.920> languages<00:43:58.400> to<00:43:59.280> code<00:43:59.599> for
you know certain languages to code for
you know certain languages to code for
iOS<00:44:00.640> applications<00:44:01.200> or<00:44:01.520> Android<00:44:01.839> or<00:44:02.079> whatever.
iOS applications or Android or whatever.
iOS applications or Android or whatever.
Um<00:44:02.880> so<00:44:03.040> those<00:44:03.280> require<00:44:03.599> I<00:44:03.760> think<00:44:03.920> a<00:44:04.160> specific
Um so those require I think a specific
Um so those require I think a specific
set<00:44:04.640> of<00:44:04.800> skills.<00:44:05.280> So<00:44:05.599> those<00:44:05.839> are<00:44:06.000> their<00:44:06.240> own
set of skills. So those are their own
set of skills. So those are their own
kind<00:44:07.040> of<00:44:07.200> non-olapsible<00:44:08.160> teams,<00:44:08.880> enduring
kind of non-olapsible teams, enduring
kind of non-olapsible teams, enduring
teams.<00:44:10.079> Um<00:44:10.319> and<00:44:10.480> then<00:44:10.640> everything<00:44:10.960> else
teams. Um and then everything else
teams. Um and then everything else
within<00:44:12.079> um<00:44:12.319> engineering,<00:44:13.119> product<00:44:13.440> design
within um engineering, product design
within um engineering, product design
and<00:44:14.000> product<00:44:14.319> management<00:44:14.800> is<00:44:15.280> collapsible.
and product management is collapsible.
and product management is collapsible.
So<00:44:16.720> uh<00:44:16.880> you<00:44:17.119> as<00:44:17.280> an<00:44:17.520> engineer<00:44:17.920> will<00:44:18.160> get
So uh you as an engineer will get
So uh you as an engineer will get
assigned<00:44:18.800> to<00:44:19.680> uh<00:44:19.839> a<00:44:20.079> particular<00:44:20.480> project<00:44:21.520> um
assigned to uh a particular project um
assigned to uh a particular project um
and<00:44:21.920> when<00:44:22.160> that<00:44:22.640> project<00:44:22.960> is<00:44:23.200> done<00:44:23.440> and<00:44:23.680> in
and when that project is done and in
and when that project is done and in
maintenance<00:44:24.319> mode,<00:44:24.800> you'll<00:44:25.119> spin<00:44:25.359> down<00:44:25.920> and
maintenance mode, you'll spin down and
maintenance mode, you'll spin down and
you'll<00:44:26.720> go<00:44:26.880> and<00:44:27.040> work<00:44:27.200> on<00:44:27.359> something<00:44:27.599> else.<00:44:27.839> It
you'll go and work on something else. It
you'll go and work on something else. It
could<00:44:28.079> be<00:44:28.160> with<00:44:28.319> that<00:44:28.560> same<00:44:28.720> team,<00:44:29.119> could<00:44:29.280> be
could be with that same team, could be
could be with that same team, could be
with<00:44:29.520> a<00:44:29.680> completely<00:44:29.920> different<00:44:30.079> team.
with a completely different team.
with a completely different team.
And<00:44:30.480> I<00:44:30.480> might<00:44:30.560> get<00:44:30.720> a<00:44:30.800> different<00:44:30.960> manager.<00:44:31.280> I'm
And I might get a different manager. I'm
And I might get a different manager. I'm
like<00:44:31.839> moving<00:44:32.079> around<00:44:32.240> with<00:44:32.400> different
like moving around with different
like moving around with different
typically<00:44:33.200> typically<00:44:33.520> the<00:44:33.760> manager<00:44:34.240> stays
typically typically the manager stays
typically typically the manager stays
the<00:44:34.720> same.<00:44:35.040> Okay.
the same. Okay.
the same. Okay.
Um<00:44:35.520> so<00:44:35.680> that<00:44:35.920> you<00:44:36.079> have<00:44:36.240> like<00:44:36.480> a<00:44:36.720> single<00:44:36.960> person
Um so that you have like a single person
Um so that you have like a single person
who<00:44:37.359> kind<00:44:37.520> of<00:44:37.680> knows<00:44:38.000> you<00:44:38.319> and<00:44:38.640> your<00:44:38.880> history
who kind of knows you and your history
who kind of knows you and your history
but<00:44:40.160> the<00:44:40.400> team<00:44:40.880> can<00:44:41.200> definitely<00:44:41.599> change.<00:44:42.319> Um
but the team can definitely change. Um
but the team can definitely change. Um
and<00:44:43.040> so<00:44:43.520> I<00:44:43.839> think<00:44:43.920> the<00:44:44.160> way<00:44:44.319> that<00:44:44.480> we've<00:44:44.800> looked
and so I think the way that we've looked
and so I think the way that we've looked
at<00:44:45.200> it<00:44:45.440> is<00:44:45.680> that<00:44:46.720> um<00:44:47.440> we<00:44:47.760> have<00:44:48.000> yet<00:44:48.240> to<00:44:48.480> have
at it is that um we have yet to have
at it is that um we have yet to have
specific<00:44:49.920> product<00:44:50.319> areas<00:44:50.800> that<00:44:51.200> are<00:44:51.920> always
specific product areas that are always
specific product areas that are always
like<00:44:53.680> high<00:44:54.000> priority<00:44:54.400> and<00:44:54.640> always<00:44:55.119> worked<00:44:55.359> on.
like high priority and always worked on.
like high priority and always worked on.
And<00:44:57.040> I<00:44:57.280> think<00:44:57.440> that's<00:44:57.680> because<00:44:58.000> things<00:44:58.240> are
And I think that's because things are
And I think that's because things are
just<00:44:58.560> so<00:44:58.880> fluid<00:44:59.359> and<00:44:59.599> like<00:44:59.839> we<00:45:00.000> kind<00:45:00.160> of<00:45:00.240> talked
just so fluid and like we kind of talked
just so fluid and like we kind of talked
about<00:45:00.560> this<00:45:00.880> earlier<00:45:01.359> when<00:45:01.599> it<00:45:01.839> comes<00:45:02.079> to<00:45:02.319> like
about this earlier when it comes to like
about this earlier when it comes to like
AI<00:45:03.440> and<00:45:03.760> product<00:45:04.000> development<00:45:04.560> and<00:45:04.800> it's<00:45:05.040> like
AI and product development and it's like
AI and product development and it's like
I<00:45:05.520> think<00:45:05.680> you<00:45:05.920> can<00:45:06.079> only<00:45:06.240> have<00:45:06.319> a<00:45:06.480> road<00:45:06.640> map
I think you can only have a road map
I think you can only have a road map
that<00:45:07.040> goes<00:45:07.200> out<00:45:07.440> maybe<00:45:07.839> 6<00:45:08.000> months<00:45:08.400> in<00:45:08.640> our
that goes out maybe 6 months in our
that goes out maybe 6 months in our
industry<00:45:09.440> right<00:45:09.760> now.<00:45:10.560> Um<00:45:11.280> and<00:45:11.520> so<00:45:12.319> maybe<00:45:12.560> if
industry right now. Um and so maybe if
industry right now. Um and so maybe if
you<00:45:12.960> had<00:45:13.760> a<00:45:14.079> team<00:45:14.400> that<00:45:14.640> could<00:45:14.800> see<00:45:15.040> 18<00:45:15.280> months
you had a team that could see 18 months
you had a team that could see 18 months
out<00:45:15.920> right<00:45:16.560> then<00:45:17.040> enduring<00:45:17.520> teams<00:45:18.000> would<00:45:18.319> make
out right then enduring teams would make
out right then enduring teams would make
more<00:45:18.720> sense.<00:45:19.040> But<00:45:19.280> I<00:45:19.440> think<00:45:19.599> for<00:45:19.760> us,<00:45:20.400> the
more sense. But I think for us, the
more sense. But I think for us, the
collapsible<00:45:21.119> teams<00:45:21.359> work<00:45:21.520> really<00:45:21.760> well<00:45:22.000> when
collapsible teams work really well when
collapsible teams work really well when
we<00:45:22.640> only<00:45:22.880> know<00:45:23.119> what<00:45:23.280> the<00:45:23.520> product<00:45:23.760> roadmap<00:45:24.319> is
we only know what the product roadmap is
we only know what the product roadmap is
for<00:45:25.119> the<00:45:25.280> next<00:45:25.440> six<00:45:25.680> months.<00:45:26.480> Um,<00:45:26.960> and<00:45:27.280> I<00:45:27.440> think
for the next six months. Um, and I think
for the next six months. Um, and I think
for<00:45:27.839> us<00:45:28.079> on<00:45:28.400> the<00:45:28.640> engineering<00:45:29.200> team,<00:45:29.920> like
for us on the engineering team, like
for us on the engineering team, like
it's<00:45:30.400> actually<00:45:30.560> one<00:45:30.720> of<00:45:30.800> the<00:45:30.960> most<00:45:31.119> exciting
it's actually one of the most exciting
it's actually one of the most exciting
and<00:45:31.680> attractive<00:45:32.319> things<00:45:32.560> to<00:45:32.800> people<00:45:33.200> because
and attractive things to people because
and attractive things to people because
sometimes<00:45:34.000> you<00:45:34.480> get<00:45:34.720> placed<00:45:34.960> on<00:45:35.119> a<00:45:35.280> team<00:45:35.359> as<00:45:35.599> an
sometimes you get placed on a team as an
sometimes you get placed on a team as an
engineer.<00:45:36.560> Well,<00:45:36.800> first<00:45:37.040> sometimes<00:45:37.280> you<00:45:37.359> get
engineer. Well, first sometimes you get
engineer. Well, first sometimes you get
hired<00:45:37.680> at<00:45:37.839> companies<00:45:38.079> you<00:45:38.160> don't<00:45:38.240> even<00:45:38.400> know
hired at companies you don't even know
hired at companies you don't even know
what<00:45:38.640> team<00:45:38.800> you're<00:45:39.040> going<00:45:39.200> to.<00:45:39.760> You're<00:45:39.920> like,
what team you're going to. You're like,
what team you're going to. You're like,
I'm<00:45:40.319> going<00:45:40.400> to<00:45:40.480> be<00:45:40.560> an<00:45:40.720> engineer<00:45:41.040> at<00:45:41.440> X<00:45:41.599> company
I'm going to be an engineer at X company
I'm going to be an engineer at X company
and<00:45:42.000> you're<00:45:42.160> like,<00:45:42.400> uh,<00:45:42.640> okay.<00:45:43.359> Um,<00:45:43.839> and<00:45:44.000> then
and you're like, uh, okay. Um, and then
and you're like, uh, okay. Um, and then
you<00:45:44.240> get<00:45:44.400> assigned<00:45:44.720> to<00:45:44.800> a<00:45:44.960> team<00:45:45.040> and<00:45:45.200> you're
you get assigned to a team and you're
you get assigned to a team and you're
like,<00:45:45.440> "Oh,<00:45:46.000> that's<00:45:46.319> kind<00:45:46.400> of<00:45:46.560> unexiting<00:45:47.119> and
like, "Oh, that's kind of unexiting and
like, "Oh, that's kind of unexiting and
now<00:45:47.440> I'm<00:45:47.680> stuck<00:45:47.839> on<00:45:48.079> this<00:45:48.240> team<00:45:48.880> for,<00:45:49.520> you
now I'm stuck on this team for, you
now I'm stuck on this team for, you
know,<00:45:49.920> at<00:45:49.920> least<00:45:50.240> a<00:45:50.400> year,<00:45:50.720> maybe<00:45:50.960> a<00:45:51.119> year<00:45:51.280> and
know, at least a year, maybe a year and
know, at least a year, maybe a year and
a<00:45:51.520> half<00:45:51.680> until<00:45:52.000> I<00:45:52.160> can<00:45:52.240> move<00:45:52.400> to<00:45:52.560> another<00:45:52.880> one."
a half until I can move to another one."
a half until I can move to another one."
Right?<00:45:54.000> So,<00:45:54.560> I've<00:45:54.960> found<00:45:55.280> that<00:45:55.599> often<00:45:55.920> for
Right? So, I've found that often for
Right? So, I've found that often for
engineers<00:45:56.880> like<00:45:57.200> you<00:45:57.520> get<00:45:57.680> assigned<00:45:58.000> a<00:45:58.160> team
engineers like you get assigned a team
engineers like you get assigned a team
and<00:45:58.480> then<00:45:58.640> your<00:45:58.800> scope<00:45:59.359> really<00:45:59.680> narrows.<00:46:00.800> And
and then your scope really narrows. And
and then your scope really narrows. And
I<00:46:01.520> think<00:46:01.599> the<00:46:01.839> opposite<00:46:02.079> is<00:46:02.319> true<00:46:02.640> for<00:46:02.960> us
I think the opposite is true for us
I think the opposite is true for us
where<00:46:03.920> you<00:46:04.079> know<00:46:04.560> you<00:46:05.119> get<00:46:05.359> assigned<00:46:05.839> a
where you know you get assigned a
where you know you get assigned a
project<00:46:06.880> and<00:46:07.200> then<00:46:07.520> after<00:46:07.839> that<00:46:08.400> like<00:46:08.960> you
project and then after that like you
project and then after that like you
could<00:46:09.359> be<00:46:09.599> working<00:46:09.760> on<00:46:10.480> literally<00:46:10.960> anything
could be working on literally anything
could be working on literally anything
within<00:46:11.680> the<00:46:11.920> company.<00:46:12.400> So<00:46:13.040> you<00:46:13.280> have<00:46:13.440> the<00:46:13.680> full
within the company. So you have the full
within the company. So you have the full
product<00:46:14.240> surface<00:46:14.560> area<00:46:15.040> to<00:46:15.280> work<00:46:15.440> on.<00:46:16.240> So<00:46:16.400> I
product surface area to work on. So I
product surface area to work on. So I
think<00:46:17.200> one<00:46:17.440> thing<00:46:18.079> that's<00:46:18.400> really<00:46:18.640> exciting
think one thing that's really exciting
think one thing that's really exciting
is<00:46:19.280> that<00:46:19.920> you<00:46:20.079> know<00:46:20.480> you<00:46:20.800> could<00:46:21.040> work<00:46:21.280> on
is that you know you could work on
is that you know you could work on
literally<00:46:22.079> anything.<00:46:22.720> So<00:46:23.040> maybe<00:46:23.280> you<00:46:23.440> don't
literally anything. So maybe you don't
literally anything. So maybe you don't
like<00:46:23.680> this<00:46:23.839> project.<00:46:24.160> Okay,<00:46:24.400> that's<00:46:24.560> fine.
like this project. Okay, that's fine.
like this project. Okay, that's fine.
You're<00:46:24.880> probably<00:46:25.040> going<00:46:25.119> to<00:46:25.200> work<00:46:25.359> on<00:46:25.599> a
You're probably going to work on a
You're probably going to work on a
completely<00:46:26.160> different<00:46:26.400> part<00:46:26.560> of<00:46:26.640> the<00:46:26.800> product
completely different part of the product
completely different part of the product
surface<00:46:27.359> area<00:46:28.240> you<00:46:28.319> know<00:46:28.480> in<00:46:28.720> the<00:46:28.880> next<00:46:29.119> month.
surface area you know in the next month.
surface area you know in the next month.
And<00:46:29.760> so<00:46:30.720> any<00:46:30.960> given<00:46:31.359> project<00:46:31.760> I<00:46:32.000> think<00:46:32.079> is<00:46:32.319> not
And so any given project I think is not
And so any given project I think is not
too<00:46:33.119> high<00:46:33.440> pressure<00:46:33.920> or<00:46:34.480> feel<00:46:34.800> too
too high pressure or feel too
too high pressure or feel too
constraining<00:46:36.640> in<00:46:36.880> in<00:46:37.040> a<00:46:37.280> way.<00:46:37.839> And<00:46:38.079> then<00:46:38.240> I
constraining in in a way. And then I
constraining in in a way. And then I
think<00:46:38.560> the<00:46:38.800> next<00:46:38.960> piece<00:46:39.200> is<00:46:39.440> that<00:46:39.920> you<00:46:40.160> feel<00:46:40.319> a
think the next piece is that you feel a
think the next piece is that you feel a
responsibility<00:46:41.280> to<00:46:41.520> kind<00:46:41.680> of<00:46:41.839> fix<00:46:42.160> anything
responsibility to kind of fix anything
responsibility to kind of fix anything
that<00:46:42.720> is<00:46:42.960> broken<00:46:43.839> because<00:46:44.480> anything<00:46:45.599> could<00:46:45.839> be
that is broken because anything could be
that is broken because anything could be
what<00:46:46.480> you<00:46:46.720> work<00:46:46.880> on<00:46:47.119> tomorrow,<00:46:47.760> right?<00:46:48.319> And
what you work on tomorrow, right? And
what you work on tomorrow, right? And
everyone<00:46:48.960> has<00:46:49.359> knowledge<00:46:49.680> and<00:46:49.920> awareness<00:46:50.480> of
everyone has knowledge and awareness of
everyone has knowledge and awareness of
different<00:46:51.280> parts<00:46:51.520> of<00:46:51.680> the<00:46:51.839> product<00:46:52.480> versus,
different parts of the product versus,
different parts of the product versus,
you<00:46:53.280> know,<00:46:53.520> if<00:46:53.760> you're<00:46:53.920> at<00:46:54.160> Stripe,<00:46:54.560> for
you know, if you're at Stripe, for
you know, if you're at Stripe, for
example,<00:46:54.960> and<00:46:55.119> you<00:46:55.280> only<00:46:55.440> work<00:46:55.520> on<00:46:55.680> billing,
example, and you only work on billing,
example, and you only work on billing,
it's<00:46:56.160> like,<00:46:56.319> well,<00:46:56.480> I<00:46:56.720> have<00:46:56.800> no<00:46:57.040> idea<00:46:57.280> how
it's like, well, I have no idea how
it's like, well, I have no idea how
checkout<00:46:58.000> works.
checkout works.
checkout works.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I<00:46:58.880> only<00:46:59.040> know<00:46:59.200> how<00:46:59.359> billing<00:46:59.760> works,<00:47:00.240> right?
I only know how billing works, right?
I only know how billing works, right?
Um,<00:47:01.599> and<00:47:01.920> so,<00:47:02.720> uh,<00:47:02.880> it<00:47:03.200> it<00:47:03.440> creates<00:47:03.680> a<00:47:03.920> really
Um, and so, uh, it it creates a really
Um, and so, uh, it it creates a really
great<00:47:04.240> culture<00:47:04.640> around<00:47:05.280> things<00:47:05.440> that<00:47:05.680> we<00:47:05.839> have
great culture around things that we have
great culture around things that we have
like<00:47:06.800> a<00:47:07.040> rotation<00:47:07.599> every<00:47:07.920> week<00:47:08.240> where<00:47:08.560> people
like a rotation every week where people
like a rotation every week where people
are<00:47:09.040> responsible<00:47:09.359> for<00:47:09.520> fixing<00:47:09.839> bugs<00:47:10.160> that
are responsible for fixing bugs that
are responsible for fixing bugs that
come<00:47:10.400> in.<00:47:10.960> So,<00:47:11.359> bugs<00:47:11.760> could<00:47:11.920> be<00:47:12.000> coming<00:47:12.160> in
come in. So, bugs could be coming in
come in. So, bugs could be coming in
from<00:47:12.640> literally<00:47:13.119> anywhere<00:47:13.839> on<00:47:14.079> the<00:47:14.240> product
from literally anywhere on the product
from literally anywhere on the product
surface<00:47:14.880> area<00:47:15.359> and<00:47:16.160> uh,<00:47:16.319> we<00:47:16.480> have<00:47:16.560> like<00:47:16.720> a
surface area and uh, we have like a
surface area and uh, we have like a
goalie<00:47:17.280> who<00:47:17.520> was<00:47:17.920> assigned<00:47:18.880> uh,<00:47:19.040> typically
goalie who was assigned uh, typically
goalie who was assigned uh, typically
two<00:47:19.760> now<00:47:20.240> uh,<00:47:20.400> per<00:47:20.640> week<00:47:21.200> uh,<00:47:21.280> to<00:47:21.520> fixing<00:47:21.839> those
two now uh, per week uh, to fixing those
two now uh, per week uh, to fixing those
issues<00:47:22.240> as<00:47:22.560> they<00:47:22.720> come<00:47:22.800> in.<00:47:23.359> Um,<00:47:23.680> and<00:47:23.839> so<00:47:24.000> they
issues as they come in. Um, and so they
issues as they come in. Um, and so they
get<00:47:24.319> to<00:47:24.400> fix<00:47:24.560> anything<00:47:24.880> across<00:47:25.200> the<00:47:25.359> entire
get to fix anything across the entire
get to fix anything across the entire
product<00:47:26.000> surface<00:47:26.319> area,<00:47:26.560> you<00:47:26.640> know,<00:47:26.720> with<00:47:26.880> the
product surface area, you know, with the
product surface area, you know, with the
exception<00:47:27.280> of<00:47:27.599> infrastructure<00:47:28.160> and<00:47:28.400> mobile.
exception of infrastructure and mobile.
exception of infrastructure and mobile.
And<00:47:29.760> I<00:47:30.079> think<00:47:30.160> that's<00:47:30.400> really<00:47:30.560> exciting<00:47:30.800> for
And I think that's really exciting for
And I think that's really exciting for
people<00:47:31.359> ownership<00:47:32.240> where<00:47:32.560> people<00:47:32.800> really
people ownership where people really
people ownership where people really
have<00:47:33.280> a<00:47:33.520> sense<00:47:33.599> of<00:47:33.760> the<00:47:33.839> whole<00:47:34.000> span<00:47:34.240> of<00:47:34.319> the
have a sense of the whole span of the
have a sense of the whole span of the
product<00:47:34.640> and<00:47:34.800> are<00:47:35.040> touching<00:47:35.280> every<00:47:35.440> piece<00:47:35.680> of
product and are touching every piece of
product and are touching every piece of
it.<00:47:36.319> So<00:47:36.480> I<00:47:36.800> imagine<00:47:37.119> it<00:47:37.280> creates<00:47:37.520> sort<00:47:37.599> of<00:47:37.680> an
it. So I imagine it creates sort of an
it. So I imagine it creates sort of an
ownership<00:47:38.240> mindset
ownership mindset
ownership mindset
exactly
exactly
exactly
in<00:47:39.440> the<00:47:39.599> team.<00:47:40.079> So<00:47:40.400> you<00:47:40.640> have<00:47:40.880> now<00:47:41.040> helped
in the team. So you have now helped
in the team. So you have now helped
build<00:47:41.920> three<00:47:42.160> of<00:47:42.319> the<00:47:42.480> most<00:47:42.960> successful
build three of the most successful
build three of the most successful
companies<00:47:43.920> in<00:47:44.160> Silicon<00:47:44.560> Valley.<00:47:45.040> Stripe,
companies in Silicon Valley. Stripe,
companies in Silicon Valley. Stripe,
notion,<00:47:45.760> and<00:47:45.920> now<00:47:46.160> linear.<00:47:47.119> What<00:47:47.359> is
notion, and now linear. What is
notion, and now linear. What is
something<00:47:47.760> that<00:47:48.079> you<00:47:48.319> see<00:47:48.720> companies<00:47:50.160> doing
something that you see companies doing
something that you see companies doing
today<00:47:50.960> commonly<00:47:51.520> that<00:47:51.760> you<00:47:52.000> think<00:47:52.240> maybe
today commonly that you think maybe
today commonly that you think maybe
we'll<00:47:53.119> all<00:47:53.359> look<00:47:53.599> back<00:47:53.839> on<00:47:54.319> in<00:47:54.560> a<00:47:54.720> couple<00:47:54.800> of
we'll all look back on in a couple of
we'll all look back on in a couple of
years<00:47:55.119> and<00:47:55.280> think<00:47:55.440> was<00:47:55.680> obviously<00:47:56.160> wrong?
years and think was obviously wrong?
years and think was obviously wrong?
something<00:47:56.720> that<00:47:56.800> you've<00:47:56.960> seen<00:47:57.119> the<00:47:57.359> best
something that you've seen the best
something that you've seen the best
companies<00:47:57.920> do<00:47:58.160> well<00:47:58.560> and<00:47:58.800> that<00:47:58.960> you<00:47:59.119> think
companies do well and that you think
companies do well and that you think
maybe<00:47:59.680> some<00:47:59.839> of<00:47:59.920> the<00:48:00.079> companies<00:48:00.319> that<00:48:00.480> aren't
maybe some of the companies that aren't
maybe some of the companies that aren't
going<00:48:00.800> to<00:48:00.880> be<00:48:00.960> as<00:48:01.119> successful<00:48:01.599> maybe<00:48:02.000> maybe
going to be as successful maybe maybe
going to be as successful maybe maybe
missing<00:48:03.200> you<00:48:03.359> know<00:48:03.440> a<00:48:03.599> thread<00:48:03.920> that<00:48:04.079> maybe<00:48:04.319> is
missing you know a thread that maybe is
missing you know a thread that maybe is
consistent<00:48:04.880> across<00:48:05.119> the<00:48:05.359> three<00:48:05.599> companies<00:48:06.640> uh
consistent across the three companies uh
consistent across the three companies uh
that<00:48:06.960> not<00:48:07.119> everyone's<00:48:07.520> picking<00:48:07.760> up<00:48:07.839> on
that not everyone's picking up on
that not everyone's picking up on
I<00:48:09.040> think<00:48:09.280> more<00:48:09.599> people<00:48:09.839> are<00:48:10.079> picking<00:48:10.400> up<00:48:10.560> on
I think more people are picking up on
I think more people are picking up on
this<00:48:11.839> than<00:48:12.160> ever<00:48:13.280> because<00:48:13.599> of<00:48:13.760> what<00:48:13.920> we<00:48:14.079> talked
this than ever because of what we talked
this than ever because of what we talked
about<00:48:14.400> earlier<00:48:14.720> with<00:48:15.040> the<00:48:15.359> crazy<00:48:15.680> competition
about earlier with the crazy competition
about earlier with the crazy competition
um<00:48:17.440> but<00:48:17.680> I<00:48:17.920> think<00:48:18.160> building<00:48:18.640> a<00:48:18.960> really<00:48:19.200> strong
um but I think building a really strong
um but I think building a really strong
brand<00:48:20.240> early<00:48:20.560> on<00:48:21.839> um<00:48:22.160> matters<00:48:22.559> so<00:48:22.880> much<00:48:23.200> both
brand early on um matters so much both
brand early on um matters so much both
in<00:48:23.680> terms<00:48:23.920> of<00:48:24.240> like<00:48:24.480> your<00:48:24.720> ability<00:48:25.040> to<00:48:25.280> like
in terms of like your ability to like
in terms of like your ability to like
build<00:48:26.240> like<00:48:26.400> a<00:48:26.800> recruiting<00:48:27.280> brand,<00:48:27.680> talent
build like a recruiting brand, talent
build like a recruiting brand, talent
brand,<00:48:28.720> right?<00:48:29.440> And<00:48:29.680> recruit<00:48:30.079> people<00:48:30.240> who
brand, right? And recruit people who
brand, right? And recruit people who
want<00:48:30.559> to<00:48:30.720> work<00:48:30.800> for<00:48:30.960> your<00:48:31.200> company.<00:48:32.079> Uh<00:48:33.040> to<00:48:34.240> uh
want to work for your company. Uh to uh
want to work for your company. Uh to uh
being<00:48:34.800> able<00:48:34.960> to<00:48:35.200> stand<00:48:35.440> out<00:48:35.599> in<00:48:35.839> what<00:48:36.000> feels
being able to stand out in what feels
being able to stand out in what feels
like<00:48:36.400> this<00:48:36.640> like<00:48:36.880> endless<00:48:37.680> sea<00:48:38.160> of
like this like endless sea of
like this like endless sea of
information<00:48:39.280> that<00:48:39.599> is<00:48:39.839> hitting<00:48:40.160> you<00:48:40.720> in<00:48:41.040> your
information that is hitting you in your
information that is hitting you in your
Twitter<00:48:41.599> feed<00:48:42.000> or<00:48:42.240> in<00:48:42.480> other<00:48:42.640> places<00:48:43.520> and<00:48:43.760> when
Twitter feed or in other places and when
Twitter feed or in other places and when
it<00:48:44.079> feels<00:48:44.240> like<00:48:44.480> everyone's<00:48:44.880> starting<00:48:45.119> a
it feels like everyone's starting a
it feels like everyone's starting a
company<00:48:45.520> or<00:48:45.839> everyone<00:48:46.160> has<00:48:46.400> like<00:48:46.559> a<00:48:46.800> tool<00:48:47.040> that
company or everyone has like a tool that
company or everyone has like a tool that
can<00:48:47.359> do<00:48:47.520> X<00:48:47.920> Y<00:48:48.160> or<00:48:48.400> Z.<00:48:49.200> Um<00:48:50.160> investing<00:48:50.559> in<00:48:50.800> that
can do X Y or Z. Um investing in that
can do X Y or Z. Um investing in that
early<00:48:51.440> on.<00:48:52.240> I<00:48:52.480> still<00:48:52.720> don't<00:48:52.880> think<00:48:53.359> everyone
early on. I still don't think everyone
early on. I still don't think everyone
is<00:48:54.000> necessarily<00:48:54.640> doing<00:48:54.880> it,<00:48:55.200> but<00:48:56.000> putting<00:48:56.240> a
is necessarily doing it, but putting a
is necessarily doing it, but putting a
lot<00:48:56.720> of<00:48:57.680> effort<00:48:58.160> and<00:48:58.720> quality<00:48:59.280> into<00:48:59.599> that
lot of effort and quality into that
lot of effort and quality into that
motion,<00:49:00.720> I<00:49:00.960> think,<00:49:01.040> is<00:49:01.280> going<00:49:01.520> to<00:49:01.680> be<00:49:02.400> very
motion, I think, is going to be very
motion, I think, is going to be very
important<00:49:03.119> for<00:49:03.440> companies.<00:49:04.000> And<00:49:05.119> um<00:49:05.280> you<00:49:05.520> see
important for companies. And um you see
important for companies. And um you see
a<00:49:05.839> lot<00:49:05.920> of<00:49:06.000> companies<00:49:06.319> out<00:49:06.559> there<00:49:06.720> that<00:49:06.960> are
a lot of companies out there that are
a lot of companies out there that are
just<00:49:07.280> like<00:49:07.520> kind<00:49:07.760> of<00:49:07.920> unable<00:49:08.400> to<00:49:08.720> gain
just like kind of unable to gain
just like kind of unable to gain
traction<00:49:10.720> um<00:49:10.960> or<00:49:11.280> find<00:49:11.520> it<00:49:11.760> really<00:49:12.000> difficult
traction um or find it really difficult
traction um or find it really difficult
to<00:49:12.960> kind<00:49:13.200> of<00:49:13.359> stay<00:49:13.680> top<00:49:13.920> of<00:49:14.079> mind.<00:49:14.960> Um<00:49:15.200> and<00:49:15.359> I
to kind of stay top of mind. Um and I
to kind of stay top of mind. Um and I
think<00:49:15.599> a<00:49:15.760> lot<00:49:15.839> of<00:49:15.920> that's<00:49:16.160> just<00:49:16.319> because<00:49:16.480> they
think a lot of that's just because they
think a lot of that's just because they
didn't<00:49:16.960> invest<00:49:17.520> early<00:49:17.839> on<00:49:18.720> um<00:49:18.800> in<00:49:19.040> building<00:49:19.280> a
didn't invest early on um in building a
didn't invest early on um in building a
brand.<00:49:19.760> But<00:49:19.839> it<00:49:20.000> was<00:49:20.079> one<00:49:20.240> of<00:49:20.240> the<00:49:20.400> things<00:49:20.559> that
brand. But it was one of the things that
brand. But it was one of the things that
for<00:49:20.960> me<00:49:21.200> was<00:49:21.440> really<00:49:21.760> attractive<00:49:22.400> about<00:49:23.200> both
for me was really attractive about both
for me was really attractive about both
Stripe<00:49:24.960> and<00:49:25.920> Notion.<00:49:26.800> Stripe<00:49:27.119> did<00:49:27.280> it<00:49:27.440> in<00:49:27.599> its
Stripe and Notion. Stripe did it in its
Stripe and Notion. Stripe did it in its
kind<00:49:27.920> of<00:49:28.000> very<00:49:28.240> own<00:49:29.359> unique<00:49:29.760> way<00:49:29.920> of<00:49:30.160> like,<00:49:30.480> oh,
kind of very own unique way of like, oh,
kind of very own unique way of like, oh,
we're<00:49:30.880> going<00:49:30.960> to<00:49:31.839> post<00:49:32.160> a<00:49:32.319> lot<00:49:32.480> on<00:49:32.640> hacker<00:49:33.040> news
we're going to post a lot on hacker news
we're going to post a lot on hacker news
and<00:49:33.680> we're<00:49:33.920> going<00:49:34.000> to<00:49:34.079> get<00:49:34.319> up,<00:49:34.640> you<00:49:34.720> know,
and we're going to get up, you know,
and we're going to get up, you know,
onto<00:49:35.119> the<00:49:35.280> front<00:49:35.440> page<00:49:35.920> and<00:49:36.960> uh<00:49:37.200> we're<00:49:37.440> going
onto the front page and uh we're going
onto the front page and uh we're going
to<00:49:37.680> build<00:49:38.400> like<00:49:38.880> a<00:49:39.200> developer<00:49:40.000> brand<00:49:40.720> very
to build like a developer brand very
to build like a developer brand very
specifically<00:49:41.839> this<00:49:42.160> way.<00:49:42.800> And<00:49:42.960> then<00:49:43.200> we<00:49:43.440> were
specifically this way. And then we were
specifically this way. And then we were
able<00:49:43.760> to<00:49:43.839> kind<00:49:44.000> of<00:49:44.079> transition<00:49:44.480> that<00:49:44.720> into
able to kind of transition that into
able to kind of transition that into
like<00:49:45.040> a<00:49:45.200> broader<00:49:45.520> brand.<00:49:46.480> Notion<00:49:46.880> was<00:49:47.119> almost
like a broader brand. Notion was almost
like a broader brand. Notion was almost
like<00:49:47.520> a<00:49:47.680> hybridy<00:49:48.319> like<00:49:48.720> consumer<00:49:50.000> B2B<00:49:50.559> brand
like a hybridy like consumer B2B brand
like a hybridy like consumer B2B brand
in<00:49:51.040> a<00:49:51.200> way.<00:49:51.440> So<00:49:51.680> very<00:49:51.920> different.<00:49:52.880> Um<00:49:53.520> and<00:49:53.920> you
in a way. So very different. Um and you
in a way. So very different. Um and you
know<00:49:54.240> I<00:49:54.480> think<00:49:54.800> every<00:49:55.119> company<00:49:55.440> that<00:49:55.760> chose<00:49:56.079> to
know I think every company that chose to
know I think every company that chose to
invest<00:49:56.720> in<00:49:57.040> this<00:49:57.280> way<00:49:57.839> like<00:49:58.160> gets<00:49:58.480> to<00:49:58.960> reap<00:49:59.280> the
invest in this way like gets to reap the
invest in this way like gets to reap the
rewards<00:49:59.920> for<00:50:00.319> a<00:50:00.640> really<00:50:00.800> long<00:50:01.119> period<00:50:01.440> of<00:50:01.680> time
rewards for a really long period of time
rewards for a really long period of time
after<00:50:02.319> that.<00:50:02.960> But,<00:50:03.359> you<00:50:03.520> know,<00:50:03.599> I<00:50:03.839> think<00:50:04.000> a<00:50:04.240> lot
after that. But, you know, I think a lot
after that. But, you know, I think a lot
of<00:50:04.480> companies<00:50:04.800> are<00:50:05.440> going<00:50:05.599> to<00:50:05.839> struggle<00:50:06.079> if
of companies are going to struggle if
of companies are going to struggle if
they<00:50:06.480> don't<00:50:06.640> come<00:50:06.800> up<00:50:06.960> with<00:50:07.520> a<00:50:07.839> way<00:50:08.000> to<00:50:08.240> do<00:50:08.400> that
they don't come up with a way to do that
they don't come up with a way to do that
and<00:50:08.960> like<00:50:09.119> a<00:50:09.280> way<00:50:09.440> to<00:50:09.680> stand<00:50:09.920> out<00:50:10.559> in<00:50:10.800> a<00:50:11.040> world
and like a way to stand out in a world
and like a way to stand out in a world
where<00:50:11.440> it's<00:50:11.680> like,<00:50:12.000> you<00:50:12.160> know,<00:50:12.319> the<00:50:12.559> number
where it's like, you know, the number
where it's like, you know, the number
one<00:50:13.040> reaction<00:50:13.599> to<00:50:13.839> like<00:50:14.000> a<00:50:14.240> product<00:50:14.559> launch<00:50:14.800> is
one reaction to like a product launch is
one reaction to like a product launch is
like,<00:50:15.520> well,<00:50:15.760> I<00:50:16.000> could<00:50:16.160> build<00:50:16.400> this<00:50:16.559> in<00:50:16.880> 10
like, well, I could build this in 10
like, well, I could build this in 10
minutes<00:50:17.440> with<00:50:17.680> cloud<00:50:18.079> code<00:50:18.400> or,<00:50:18.800> you<00:50:18.960> know,
minutes with cloud code or, you know,
minutes with cloud code or, you know,
why<00:50:19.280> should<00:50:19.440> I<00:50:19.599> care,<00:50:20.400> right?<00:50:20.800> Um,<00:50:21.200> and<00:50:21.440> I
why should I care, right? Um, and I
why should I care, right? Um, and I
think<00:50:21.760> that's<00:50:22.000> going<00:50:22.079> to<00:50:22.160> be<00:50:22.240> a<00:50:22.400> really
think that's going to be a really
think that's going to be a really
important<00:50:22.960> piece<00:50:23.200> for<00:50:23.599> for<00:50:23.920> most<00:50:24.160> companies.
important piece for for most companies.
important piece for for most companies.
No,<00:50:24.880> that's<00:50:25.040> such<00:50:25.280> great<00:50:25.440> advice.<00:50:26.160> Um,<00:50:26.400> all
No, that's such great advice. Um, all
No, that's such great advice. Um, all
right,<00:50:26.720> I'm<00:50:26.880> going<00:50:26.960> to<00:50:27.040> do<00:50:27.200> a<00:50:27.359> final<00:50:28.160> lightning
right, I'm going to do a final lightning
right, I'm going to do a final lightning
round<00:50:28.880> with<00:50:29.040> like<00:50:29.200> a<00:50:29.440> few<00:50:29.760> quick<00:50:30.160> questions
round with like a few quick questions
round with like a few quick questions
for<00:50:30.880> you.<00:50:31.440> So<00:50:31.680> the<00:50:31.839> first<00:50:32.079> question<00:50:32.240> is<00:50:32.559> okay
for you. So the first question is okay
for you. So the first question is okay
this<00:50:33.040> is<00:50:33.200> your<00:50:33.520> preference<00:50:34.240> remote<00:50:34.880> hybrid<00:50:35.680> or
this is your preference remote hybrid or
this is your preference remote hybrid or
in<00:50:36.240> office
in office
in office
personally<00:50:38.319> hybrid
personally hybrid
personally hybrid
and<00:50:39.520> that<00:50:39.760> is<00:50:39.839> how<00:50:40.079> you<00:50:40.319> all<00:50:40.720> work<00:50:40.960> at<00:50:41.200> linear
and that is how you all work at linear
and that is how you all work at linear
but<00:50:41.760> you're<00:50:41.920> remote<00:50:42.240> first.
but you're remote first.
but you're remote first.
Yeah<00:50:43.200> so<00:50:43.760> remote<00:50:44.160> first<00:50:45.040> um<00:50:45.440> we<00:50:45.680> do<00:50:45.920> have<00:50:46.640> uh
Yeah so remote first um we do have uh
Yeah so remote first um we do have uh
offices<00:50:47.599> right<00:50:47.839> now<00:50:48.640> um<00:50:48.800> in<00:50:49.599> uh<00:50:49.680> we<00:50:49.920> call<00:50:50.000> them
offices right now um in uh we call them
offices right now um in uh we call them
kind<00:50:50.319> of<00:50:50.400> co-working<00:50:50.880> hubs<00:50:51.119> so<00:50:51.359> place<00:50:51.599> that
kind of co-working hubs so place that
kind of co-working hubs so place that
you<00:50:51.839> can<00:50:52.000> work<00:50:52.079> with<00:50:52.240> other<00:50:52.480> people<00:50:52.880> in<00:50:53.119> your
you can work with other people in your
you can work with other people in your
location<00:50:53.760> in<00:50:54.000> San<00:50:54.160> Francisco,<00:50:54.640> New<00:50:54.800> York<00:50:54.960> and
location in San Francisco, New York and
location in San Francisco, New York and
Berlin<00:50:56.000> uh<00:50:56.079> and<00:50:56.240> London.<00:50:57.119> So,<00:50:57.920> um<00:50:58.319> I<00:50:58.559> think
Berlin uh and London. So, um I think
Berlin uh and London. So, um I think
we'll<00:50:58.880> have<00:50:58.960> more<00:50:59.119> of<00:50:59.280> that,<00:50:59.599> but<00:50:59.920> like<00:51:00.079> those
we'll have more of that, but like those
we'll have more of that, but like those
are<00:51:00.559> are<00:51:00.880> where<00:51:01.119> our<00:51:01.440> like<00:51:01.760> highest
are are where our like highest
are are where our like highest
concentration<00:51:02.800> of<00:51:03.040> people<00:51:03.280> are.
concentration of people are.
concentration of people are.
What's<00:51:03.920> your<00:51:04.079> dream<00:51:04.319> schedule?<00:51:04.720> Like<00:51:05.119> 2<00:51:05.280> days
What's your dream schedule? Like 2 days
What's your dream schedule? Like 2 days
in<00:51:05.760> the<00:51:05.839> office,<00:51:06.160> 3<00:51:06.400> days<00:51:06.559> at<00:51:06.720> home?
in the office, 3 days at home?
in the office, 3 days at home?
Probably<00:51:08.240> 3<00:51:08.559> days<00:51:08.800> in<00:51:09.040> the<00:51:09.280> office.
Probably 3 days in the office.
Probably 3 days in the office.
Okay.<00:51:09.920> Three<00:51:10.079> and<00:51:10.319> two.
Okay. Three and two.
Okay. Three and two.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I<00:51:11.119> know<00:51:11.200> I<00:51:11.359> promised<00:51:11.599> lightning<00:51:11.920> round,<00:51:12.160> but
I know I promised lightning round, but
I know I promised lightning round, but
I'm<00:51:12.400> just<00:51:12.800> I<00:51:12.960> had<00:51:13.040> to<00:51:13.200> ask<00:51:13.280> the<00:51:13.440> followup
I'm just I had to ask the followup
I'm just I had to ask the followup
question.
question.
question.
Um<00:51:15.040> if<00:51:15.200> you<00:51:15.280> could<00:51:15.440> only<00:51:15.680> ask<00:51:15.920> one<00:51:16.240> interview
Um if you could only ask one interview
Um if you could only ask one interview
question<00:51:16.960> of<00:51:17.200> a<00:51:17.440> candidate,<00:51:18.240> what<00:51:18.400> would<00:51:18.559> it
question of a candidate, what would it
question of a candidate, what would it
be?
be?
be?
I<00:51:19.520> usually<00:51:19.920> like<00:51:20.160> to<00:51:20.319> ask<00:51:20.559> candidates<00:51:21.119> to<00:51:22.319> uh
I usually like to ask candidates to uh
I usually like to ask candidates to uh
like<00:51:23.119> brag<00:51:23.599> about<00:51:23.920> themselves.<00:51:24.559> So,<00:51:24.800> this
like brag about themselves. So, this
like brag about themselves. So, this
will<00:51:25.599> I<00:51:25.839> I'll<00:51:26.079> take<00:51:26.240> a<00:51:26.480> different<00:51:26.880> tactic
will I I'll take a different tactic
will I I'll take a different tactic
depending<00:51:27.760> on<00:51:27.920> where<00:51:28.160> the<00:51:28.480> interview<00:51:28.800> is
depending on where the interview is
depending on where the interview is
going<00:51:29.119> and<00:51:29.359> how<00:51:29.520> much<00:51:29.680> time<00:51:29.920> I<00:51:30.240> have.<00:51:30.720> But
going and how much time I have. But
going and how much time I have. But
usually<00:51:31.599> I'll<00:51:31.839> I'll<00:51:32.160> try<00:51:32.319> to<00:51:32.400> ask<00:51:32.640> someone
usually I'll I'll try to ask someone
usually I'll I'll try to ask someone
like<00:51:34.160> what<00:51:34.400> was<00:51:34.640> the<00:51:34.880> most<00:51:35.119> impactful<00:51:35.680> thing
like what was the most impactful thing
like what was the most impactful thing
that<00:51:36.079> they<00:51:36.800> think<00:51:37.040> that<00:51:37.200> they've<00:51:37.520> worked<00:51:37.680> on
that they think that they've worked on
that they think that they've worked on
or<00:51:38.240> I'll<00:51:38.480> ask<00:51:38.720> sometimes<00:51:39.119> like<00:51:39.839> what<00:51:40.079> do<00:51:40.240> they
or I'll ask sometimes like what do they
or I'll ask sometimes like what do they
think<00:51:41.119> their<00:51:41.359> superpower<00:51:41.920> is<00:51:42.319> as<00:51:42.480> an<00:51:42.559> example
think their superpower is as an example
think their superpower is as an example
cuz<00:51:43.520> like<00:51:43.760> you<00:51:44.160> as<00:51:44.319> an<00:51:44.480> example<00:51:44.720> when<00:51:44.880> you<00:51:44.960> ask
cuz like you as an example when you ask
cuz like you as an example when you ask
sales<00:51:45.440> people<00:51:45.680> it's<00:51:45.920> always<00:51:46.079> like<00:51:46.240> well<00:51:46.400> it's
sales people it's always like well it's
sales people it's always like well it's
the<00:51:46.640> biggest<00:51:46.880> deal<00:51:47.119> I've<00:51:47.359> ever<00:51:47.520> closed<00:51:47.760> and
the biggest deal I've ever closed and
the biggest deal I've ever closed and
I'm<00:51:48.000> like<00:51:48.160> okay<00:51:48.400> well<00:51:48.720> eventually<00:51:49.040> that<00:51:49.280> gets
I'm like okay well eventually that gets
I'm like okay well eventually that gets
sold.<00:51:50.720> So,<00:51:50.960> I<00:51:51.280> try<00:51:51.440> to<00:51:51.599> ask<00:51:51.839> like<00:51:52.160> what<00:51:52.480> they're
sold. So, I try to ask like what they're
sold. So, I try to ask like what they're
really<00:51:52.960> great<00:51:53.119> at<00:51:53.359> kind<00:51:53.520> of<00:51:53.599> innately,<00:51:54.480> right?
really great at kind of innately, right?
really great at kind of innately, right?
And<00:51:56.400> kind<00:51:56.559> of<00:51:56.720> trying<00:51:56.960> to<00:51:57.200> understand<00:51:58.160> then
And kind of trying to understand then
And kind of trying to understand then
like<00:51:58.720> through<00:51:59.040> follow-up<00:51:59.520> questions<00:51:59.839> from
like through follow-up questions from
like through follow-up questions from
there<00:52:00.559> like<00:52:00.960> why<00:52:01.200> that<00:52:01.440> is<00:52:01.599> or<00:52:01.920> where<00:52:02.079> did<00:52:02.240> that
there like why that is or where did that
there like why that is or where did that
come<00:52:02.559> from<00:52:02.720> or<00:52:02.960> where<00:52:03.119> did<00:52:03.200> they<00:52:03.359> learn<00:52:03.599> that
come from or where did they learn that
come from or where did they learn that
just<00:52:04.400> to<00:52:04.640> kind<00:52:04.720> of<00:52:04.880> understand<00:52:05.520> like<00:52:06.160> what
just to kind of understand like what
just to kind of understand like what
motivates<00:52:06.880> them<00:52:07.119> and<00:52:07.440> what<00:52:07.680> makes<00:52:07.920> them
motivates them and what makes them
motivates them and what makes them
special.
special.
special.
So<00:52:10.000> you
So you
So you
talent<00:52:12.000> people<00:52:12.319> report<00:52:12.559> to<00:52:12.800> you.<00:52:13.760> Um<00:52:14.240> what<00:52:14.480> is
talent people report to you. Um what is
talent people report to you. Um what is
something<00:52:14.800> that<00:52:14.960> you<00:52:15.119> think<00:52:15.440> HR<00:52:15.839> teams<00:52:16.160> in
something that you think HR teams in
something that you think HR teams in
general<00:52:16.640> waste<00:52:16.960> time<00:52:17.200> on?
general waste time on?
general waste time on?
I<00:52:20.480> would<00:52:20.720> say
creating<00:52:24.319> a<00:52:24.559> lot<00:52:24.720> of<00:52:24.880> rules<00:52:25.520> around<00:52:26.000> things
creating a lot of rules around things
creating a lot of rules around things
that<00:52:26.720> have<00:52:26.960> yet<00:52:27.280> to<00:52:28.640> become<00:52:29.040> a<00:52:29.359> problem.
that have yet to become a problem.
that have yet to become a problem.
So<00:52:31.119> too<00:52:31.359> much<00:52:31.520> structure
So too much structure
So too much structure
in<00:52:33.119> advance.<00:52:33.839> You're<00:52:34.079> not<00:52:34.240> even<00:52:34.400> trying<00:52:34.559> to
in advance. You're not even trying to
in advance. You're not even trying to
solve<00:52:34.880> anything.<00:52:35.200> You're<00:52:35.359> just<00:52:35.520> sort<00:52:35.680> of
solve anything. You're just sort of
solve anything. You're just sort of
taking<00:52:36.240> a<00:52:36.480> kind<00:52:36.559> of<00:52:36.640> bureaucratic<00:52:37.280> approach
taking a kind of bureaucratic approach
taking a kind of bureaucratic approach
because<00:52:37.760> you<00:52:37.920> feel<00:52:38.000> like<00:52:38.160> you<00:52:38.319> need<00:52:38.480> to.
because you feel like you need to.
because you feel like you need to.
Yes.<00:52:39.680> um<00:52:40.160> with<00:52:40.400> the<00:52:40.640> approach<00:52:40.960> being<00:52:41.440> like
Yes. um with the approach being like
Yes. um with the approach being like
coming<00:52:41.920> from<00:52:42.079> a<00:52:42.319> very<00:52:42.559> reasonable<00:52:43.040> place<00:52:43.280> of
coming from a very reasonable place of
coming from a very reasonable place of
like<00:52:44.160> well<00:52:44.400> at<00:52:44.640> my<00:52:44.880> last<00:52:45.040> company<00:52:45.440> which<00:52:45.760> was
like well at my last company which was
like well at my last company which was
three<00:52:46.079> times<00:52:46.319> the<00:52:46.559> size<00:52:47.040> like<00:52:47.280> this<00:52:47.440> was<00:52:47.599> a
three times the size like this was a
three times the size like this was a
problem<00:52:48.000> at<00:52:48.240> this<00:52:48.640> scale<00:52:48.880> or<00:52:49.119> this<00:52:49.280> was<00:52:49.440> the
problem at this scale or this was the
problem at this scale or this was the
problem<00:52:49.839> and<00:52:50.000> I<00:52:50.160> think<00:52:50.400> anticipating<00:52:51.040> things
problem and I think anticipating things
problem and I think anticipating things
is<00:52:51.520> always<00:52:51.839> great<00:52:52.720> you<00:52:52.880> know<00:52:53.040> but<00:52:53.280> I<00:52:53.520> think
is always great you know but I think
is always great you know but I think
often
often
often
uh<00:52:56.319> the<00:52:56.559> best<00:52:56.800> things<00:52:56.960> that<00:52:57.200> I<00:52:57.440> find<00:52:57.599> when
uh the best things that I find when
uh the best things that I find when
you're<00:52:58.000> trying<00:52:58.160> to<00:52:58.319> introduce<00:52:58.720> these<00:52:59.040> things
you're trying to introduce these things
you're trying to introduce these things
for<00:52:59.440> the<00:52:59.599> first<00:52:59.680> time<00:53:00.000> like<00:53:00.800> levels<00:53:01.280> and
for the first time like levels and
for the first time like levels and
ladders<00:53:02.319> or<00:53:03.359> um<00:53:03.920> you<00:53:04.160> know<00:53:04.480> performance
ladders or um you know performance
ladders or um you know performance
reviews<00:53:05.760> or<00:53:06.319> you<00:53:06.480> know<00:53:06.640> every<00:53:06.880> company<00:53:07.119> has<00:53:07.280> to
reviews or you know every company has to
reviews or you know every company has to
introduce<00:53:07.760> these<00:53:08.319> for<00:53:08.559> the<00:53:08.720> first<00:53:08.960> time<00:53:09.200> at
introduce these for the first time at
introduce these for the first time at
some<00:53:09.599> point,<00:53:09.920> right?<00:53:10.319> Equity<00:53:10.800> refreshers,
some point, right? Equity refreshers,
some point, right? Equity refreshers,
just<00:53:11.599> like<00:53:11.760> all<00:53:11.920> these<00:53:12.079> things,<00:53:12.400> right?<00:53:13.119> Like
just like all these things, right? Like
just like all these things, right? Like
you<00:53:13.839> want<00:53:13.920> it<00:53:14.079> to<00:53:14.240> come<00:53:14.400> from<00:53:14.559> a<00:53:14.720> place<00:53:14.960> where
you want it to come from a place where
you want it to come from a place where
you<00:53:15.359> kind<00:53:15.599> of<00:53:15.760> understand<00:53:16.800> like<00:53:17.040> what<00:53:17.280> the
you kind of understand like what the
you kind of understand like what the
perception<00:53:18.079> of<00:53:18.480> that<00:53:19.200> topic<00:53:19.599> area<00:53:19.920> is<00:53:20.160> at<00:53:20.559> this
perception of that topic area is at this
perception of that topic area is at this
company<00:53:21.839> versus<00:53:22.319> coming<00:53:22.640> in<00:53:22.960> and<00:53:23.280> saying,
company versus coming in and saying,
company versus coming in and saying,
well,<00:53:24.400> the<00:53:24.640> best<00:53:24.800> way<00:53:24.880> to<00:53:25.040> do<00:53:25.200> equity
well, the best way to do equity
well, the best way to do equity
refreshers<00:53:26.160> is<00:53:26.480> XYZ<00:53:27.119> from<00:53:27.359> my<00:53:27.520> prior
refreshers is XYZ from my prior
refreshers is XYZ from my prior
experience<00:53:28.319> at<00:53:28.640> ABC.<00:53:29.599> And<00:53:30.400> you<00:53:30.559> know,<00:53:30.720> I<00:53:31.040> think
experience at ABC. And you know, I think
experience at ABC. And you know, I think
not<00:53:31.520> every<00:53:31.760> company<00:53:32.880> is<00:53:33.119> the<00:53:33.359> same.<00:53:34.079> A<00:53:34.319> classic
not every company is the same. A classic
not every company is the same. A classic
example<00:53:35.040> in<00:53:35.280> that<00:53:35.520> area<00:53:35.760> for<00:53:36.000> us<00:53:36.160> is<00:53:36.400> like<00:53:37.359> um
example in that area for us is like um
example in that area for us is like um
you<00:53:37.920> know<00:53:38.079> people<00:53:38.400> value<00:53:38.720> equity<00:53:39.119> differently
you know people value equity differently
you know people value equity differently
in<00:53:39.680> different<00:53:40.000> countries.<00:53:40.640> We<00:53:40.880> have<00:53:41.040> people
in different countries. We have people
in different countries. We have people
all<00:53:41.520> over<00:53:41.680> the<00:53:41.839> world.<00:53:42.480> We<00:53:42.720> tend<00:53:42.880> to<00:53:43.040> find<00:53:43.280> that
all over the world. We tend to find that
all over the world. We tend to find that
people<00:53:44.160> here<00:53:44.400> in<00:53:44.640> the<00:53:44.800> United<00:53:45.040> States<00:53:45.760> really
people here in the United States really
people here in the United States really
value<00:53:46.480> equity<00:53:46.880> because<00:53:47.200> they<00:53:47.440> see<00:53:47.599> what<00:53:47.760> the
value equity because they see what the
value equity because they see what the
impact<00:53:48.400> could<00:53:48.640> be.<00:53:49.280> A<00:53:49.440> lot<00:53:49.520> of<00:53:49.599> our<00:53:49.839> employees
impact could be. A lot of our employees
impact could be. A lot of our employees
in<00:53:50.880> Europe<00:53:51.440> don't<00:53:51.680> value<00:53:52.000> it<00:53:52.160> as<00:53:52.319> much<00:53:52.559> because
in Europe don't value it as much because
in Europe don't value it as much because
often<00:53:53.440> they<00:53:53.760> don't<00:53:54.000> see<00:53:54.319> companies<00:53:54.880> make<00:53:55.040> it
often they don't see companies make it
often they don't see companies make it
to<00:53:55.359> IPO<00:53:55.920> and<00:53:56.240> then<00:53:56.559> make<00:53:56.880> all<00:53:57.040> of<00:53:57.200> their
to IPO and then make all of their
to IPO and then make all of their
employees<00:53:58.640> uh<00:53:58.960> financially<00:53:59.520> well<00:53:59.760> off<00:54:00.000> as<00:54:00.240> a
employees uh financially well off as a
employees uh financially well off as a
result.<00:54:01.119> Um<00:54:01.599> so<00:54:01.760> they<00:54:02.000> don't<00:54:02.079> value<00:54:02.319> it<00:54:02.480> as
result. Um so they don't value it as
result. Um so they don't value it as
much.<00:54:02.960> Right?<00:54:03.359> So<00:54:03.599> I<00:54:03.839> think<00:54:03.920> you<00:54:04.079> have<00:54:04.240> to
much. Right? So I think you have to
much. Right? So I think you have to
think<00:54:04.480> a<00:54:04.720> little<00:54:04.800> bit<00:54:04.960> differently<00:54:05.440> about
think a little bit differently about
think a little bit differently about
what<00:54:06.160> your<00:54:06.400> approach<00:54:06.720> is<00:54:07.040> to<00:54:07.280> different
what your approach is to different
what your approach is to different
people<00:54:07.920> in<00:54:08.160> different<00:54:08.400> contexts<00:54:08.800> and
people in different contexts and
people in different contexts and
environments.<00:54:10.000> And<00:54:10.559> I<00:54:10.880> think<00:54:11.200> generally
environments. And I think generally
environments. And I think generally
coming<00:54:11.839> in<00:54:12.079> with<00:54:12.319> like<00:54:13.040> a<00:54:13.280> playbook<00:54:13.839> and<00:54:14.079> a<00:54:14.319> lot
coming in with like a playbook and a lot
coming in with like a playbook and a lot
of<00:54:14.480> structure<00:54:14.960> before<00:54:15.280> you<00:54:15.440> really
of structure before you really
of structure before you really
understand<00:54:17.119> people<00:54:17.440> and<00:54:17.760> what<00:54:17.920> they<00:54:18.079> care
understand people and what they care
understand people and what they care
about<00:54:18.480> is<00:54:18.720> is<00:54:19.200> often<00:54:19.839> usually<00:54:20.240> taking<00:54:21.359> uh<00:54:21.680> the
about is is often usually taking uh the
about is is often usually taking uh the
wrong<00:54:22.160> approach<00:54:22.559> or<00:54:22.800> like<00:54:23.040> introducing
wrong approach or like introducing
wrong approach or like introducing
performance<00:54:24.240> reviews<00:54:24.720> when<00:54:25.280> seems<00:54:25.599> like
performance reviews when seems like
performance reviews when seems like
everyone's<00:54:26.160> getting<00:54:26.400> a<00:54:26.559> lot<00:54:26.640> of<00:54:26.800> feedback<00:54:27.119> and
everyone's getting a lot of feedback and
everyone's getting a lot of feedback and
you<00:54:27.520> don't<00:54:27.680> really<00:54:27.839> need<00:54:27.920> to<00:54:28.160> yet.<00:54:28.720> So<00:54:28.800> then
you don't really need to yet. So then
you don't really need to yet. So then
people<00:54:29.200> are<00:54:30.240> solving<00:54:30.480> for<00:54:30.720> yeah<00:54:30.880> like<00:54:31.040> why<00:54:31.119> am
people are solving for yeah like why am
people are solving for yeah like why am
I<00:54:31.359> doing<00:54:31.599> why<00:54:31.760> am<00:54:31.839> I<00:54:32.000> filling<00:54:32.160> this<00:54:32.319> out?<00:54:32.559> Why
I doing why am I filling this out? Why
I doing why am I filling this out? Why
am<00:54:32.800> I<00:54:32.880> writing<00:54:33.040> a<00:54:33.200> peer<00:54:33.440> review<00:54:33.599> for<00:54:33.760> this
am I writing a peer review for this
am I writing a peer review for this
person?
person?
person?
Right?<00:54:36.319> But<00:54:36.480> it's<00:54:36.720> much<00:54:36.880> easier<00:54:37.440> when<00:54:37.680> it's
Right? But it's much easier when it's
Right? But it's much easier when it's
like,<00:54:38.079> oh,<00:54:38.319> we<00:54:38.480> did<00:54:38.640> we<00:54:38.880> did<00:54:39.040> a<00:54:39.599> uh<00:54:39.839> like<00:54:40.319> survey
like, oh, we did we did a uh like survey
like, oh, we did we did a uh like survey
and<00:54:41.760> half<00:54:42.000> the<00:54:42.160> employees<00:54:42.400> of<00:54:42.559> the<00:54:42.720> company
and half the employees of the company
and half the employees of the company
said<00:54:43.040> they<00:54:43.200> hadn't<00:54:43.440> received<00:54:43.760> any<00:54:44.240> like
said they hadn't received any like
said they hadn't received any like
feedback<00:54:44.960> in<00:54:45.200> the<00:54:45.359> last<00:54:45.599> 6<00:54:45.839> months,
feedback in the last 6 months,
feedback in the last 6 months,
right?
right?
right?
And<00:54:47.839> and<00:54:48.160> they<00:54:48.319> want<00:54:48.480> more<00:54:48.640> feedback.<00:54:49.280> So
And and they want more feedback. So
And and they want more feedback. So
that's<00:54:49.680> a<00:54:49.839> problem.<00:54:50.319> So<00:54:50.559> now<00:54:50.720> we<00:54:50.880> have<00:54:50.960> a
that's a problem. So now we have a
that's a problem. So now we have a
reason<00:54:51.280> to<00:54:51.440> say<00:54:51.680> like,<00:54:51.920> oh,<00:54:52.240> here's<00:54:52.480> why<00:54:52.960> we're
reason to say like, oh, here's why we're
reason to say like, oh, here's why we're
introducing<00:54:53.599> this.<00:54:53.920> not<00:54:54.160> because<00:54:54.400> we're<00:54:54.640> like
introducing this. not because we're like
introducing this. not because we're like
becoming<00:54:55.200> like<00:54:55.839> corpory<00:54:56.480> and<00:54:56.720> annoying<00:54:57.680> and
becoming like corpory and annoying and
becoming like corpory and annoying and
want<00:54:58.559> to<00:54:58.640> give<00:54:58.800> you<00:54:58.960> a<00:54:59.119> bunch<00:54:59.280> of<00:54:59.520> work<00:54:59.839> that
want to give you a bunch of work that
want to give you a bunch of work that
that<00:55:00.400> feels<00:55:00.720> meaningless,<00:55:01.359> but<00:55:01.599> actually<00:55:01.839> you
that feels meaningless, but actually you
that feels meaningless, but actually you
asked<00:55:02.319> for<00:55:02.480> this,<00:55:02.960> right?<00:55:03.359> And<00:55:03.520> like<00:55:03.760> let's
asked for this, right? And like let's
asked for this, right? And like let's
show<00:55:04.160> you<00:55:04.319> why<00:55:04.480> and<00:55:04.720> let's<00:55:04.880> like<00:55:05.040> use<00:55:05.200> your<00:55:05.440> own
show you why and let's like use your own
show you why and let's like use your own
words<00:55:06.160> to<00:55:06.480> like<00:55:06.640> explain<00:55:07.040> why<00:55:07.200> we're<00:55:07.440> doing
words to like explain why we're doing
words to like explain why we're doing
this<00:55:08.000> and<00:55:08.160> and<00:55:08.480> so<00:55:08.640> I<00:55:08.880> think<00:55:09.119> a<00:55:09.359> lot<00:55:09.440> of<00:55:09.520> the
this and and so I think a lot of the
this and and so I think a lot of the
introduction<00:55:10.559> to<00:55:10.720> these<00:55:11.040> like<00:55:11.440> programs<00:55:12.160> can
introduction to these like programs can
introduction to these like programs can
go<00:55:13.040> a<00:55:13.359> lot<00:55:13.440> better<00:55:14.319> if<00:55:14.800> they<00:55:15.040> almost<00:55:15.280> like
go a lot better if they almost like
go a lot better if they almost like
originate<00:55:16.160> from<00:55:16.400> the<00:55:16.559> employees<00:55:16.960> in<00:55:17.119> a<00:55:17.280> way.
originate from the employees in a way.
originate from the employees in a way.
Yeah,<00:55:17.920> absolutely.<00:55:18.559> Sounds<00:55:18.800> like<00:55:18.960> overall<00:55:19.280> a
Yeah, absolutely. Sounds like overall a
Yeah, absolutely. Sounds like overall a
people<00:55:19.680> strategy<00:55:19.920> that's<00:55:20.160> more<00:55:20.319> data<00:55:20.559> driven
people strategy that's more data driven
people strategy that's more data driven
and<00:55:20.960> context<00:55:21.359> specific<00:55:21.760> and<00:55:22.000> then<00:55:22.240> anytime
and context specific and then anytime
and context specific and then anytime
you're<00:55:22.800> rolling<00:55:23.040> something<00:55:23.200> out<00:55:23.440> it's
you're rolling something out it's
you're rolling something out it's
responsive<00:55:24.160> to<00:55:24.319> what<00:55:24.480> people<00:55:24.640> have<00:55:24.800> asked<00:55:24.960> for
responsive to what people have asked for
responsive to what people have asked for
it's<00:55:25.359> going<00:55:25.440> to<00:55:25.599> go<00:55:25.760> better.<00:55:26.400> Okay,<00:55:26.800> last
it's going to go better. Okay, last
it's going to go better. Okay, last
question.<00:55:27.359> The<00:55:27.520> companies<00:55:27.760> that<00:55:27.920> are<00:55:28.079> most
question. The companies that are most
question. The companies that are most
successful<00:55:28.960> over<00:55:29.200> the<00:55:29.440> next<00:55:29.760> 5<00:55:30.079> years<00:55:30.960> will<00:55:31.280> be
successful over the next 5 years will be
successful over the next 5 years will be
those<00:55:31.760> that<00:55:32.720> what<00:55:33.760> I'll<00:55:34.000> say<00:55:34.240> focus
those that what I'll say focus
those that what I'll say focus
while<00:55:36.880> all<00:55:37.040> of<00:55:37.119> these<00:55:37.359> AI<00:55:37.680> tools<00:55:38.000> are<00:55:38.240> great.
while all of these AI tools are great.
while all of these AI tools are great.
Um,<00:55:39.760> you<00:55:40.000> know,<00:55:40.160> I<00:55:40.400> think<00:55:40.559> they're<00:55:41.839> creating
Um, you know, I think they're creating
Um, you know, I think they're creating
just<00:55:42.559> like<00:55:42.800> more<00:55:43.200> and<00:55:43.520> more.<00:55:44.160> And<00:55:44.960> sometimes
just like more and more. And sometimes
just like more and more. And sometimes
actually<00:55:45.839> what<00:55:46.079> you<00:55:46.319> need<00:55:46.480> is<00:55:46.800> less.
actually what you need is less.
actually what you need is less.
Um,<00:55:48.960> in<00:55:49.200> a<00:55:49.440> lot<00:55:49.520> of<00:55:49.839> contexts,<00:55:51.040> you<00:55:51.200> know,<00:55:51.440> I<00:55:51.599> I
Um, in a lot of contexts, you know, I I
Um, in a lot of contexts, you know, I I
use<00:55:52.079> AI<00:55:52.480> for<00:55:52.720> writing<00:55:53.040> and<00:55:53.280> I'm<00:55:53.440> just<00:55:53.599> like,<00:55:53.839> I
use AI for writing and I'm just like, I
use AI for writing and I'm just like, I
didn't<00:55:54.240> need<00:55:54.480> that.<00:55:54.799> I<00:55:55.040> didn't<00:55:55.200> need<00:55:55.280> that
didn't need that. I didn't need that
didn't need that. I didn't need that
whole<00:55:55.760> page,<00:55:56.640> right?<00:55:57.280> I<00:55:57.599> just<00:55:57.760> needed<00:55:58.640> like
whole page, right? I just needed like
whole page, right? I just needed like
succinct,<00:55:59.920> concise<00:56:00.640> thoughts<00:56:01.280> that<00:56:01.520> we<00:56:01.760> can,
succinct, concise thoughts that we can,
succinct, concise thoughts that we can,
you<00:56:02.240> know,<00:56:02.400> convey<00:56:03.359> or<00:56:03.920> I<00:56:04.160> didn't<00:56:04.319> need<00:56:04.640> all
you know, convey or I didn't need all
you know, convey or I didn't need all
those<00:56:05.359> features,<00:56:06.160> right?<00:56:06.480> I<00:56:06.799> actually<00:56:07.040> just
those features, right? I actually just
those features, right? I actually just
needed<00:56:07.599> like<00:56:07.920> a<00:56:08.160> simplified<00:56:08.720> view,<00:56:10.000> right,<00:56:10.400> of
needed like a simplified view, right, of
needed like a simplified view, right, of
this<00:56:11.440> thing<00:56:11.599> in<00:56:11.839> the<00:56:12.000> product.<00:56:12.400> And<00:56:12.559> so
this thing in the product. And so
this thing in the product. And so
sometimes<00:56:13.200> I<00:56:13.520> think<00:56:13.760> these<00:56:14.160> tools<00:56:14.799> help<00:56:15.040> you
sometimes I think these tools help you
sometimes I think these tools help you
create<00:56:15.599> more,<00:56:16.160> but<00:56:16.480> more<00:56:16.720> is<00:56:16.880> not<00:56:17.119> actually
create more, but more is not actually
create more, but more is not actually
what<00:56:18.240> you<00:56:18.400> need.<00:56:19.280> And<00:56:19.440> so<00:56:19.599> I<00:56:19.839> think<00:56:20.000> companies
what you need. And so I think companies
what you need. And so I think companies
that<00:56:20.640> are<00:56:20.799> able<00:56:21.040> to<00:56:21.359> focus<00:56:21.839> and<00:56:22.160> use<00:56:22.319> these
that are able to focus and use these
that are able to focus and use these
tools<00:56:23.520> to<00:56:23.839> their<00:56:24.079> benefit.<00:56:24.559> And<00:56:24.720> I<00:56:24.880> think
tools to their benefit. And I think
tools to their benefit. And I think
there<00:56:25.119> are<00:56:25.200> a<00:56:25.359> lot<00:56:25.440> of,<00:56:25.760> you<00:56:25.839> know,<00:56:26.079> amazing
there are a lot of, you know, amazing
there are a lot of, you know, amazing
use<00:56:26.720> cases<00:56:27.119> for<00:56:27.359> them,<00:56:28.000> but<00:56:28.319> you<00:56:28.480> have<00:56:28.640> to<00:56:28.799> have
use cases for them, but you have to have
use cases for them, but you have to have
taste
taste
taste
with<00:56:31.200> them<00:56:32.240> um<00:56:32.400> and<00:56:32.640> use<00:56:32.880> them<00:56:33.119> judiciously.
with them um and use them judiciously.
with them um and use them judiciously.
When<00:56:35.040> I<00:56:35.359> think<00:56:35.599> about<00:56:35.760> how<00:56:36.000> you<00:56:36.240> all<00:56:36.559> approach
When I think about how you all approach
When I think about how you all approach
hiring<00:56:37.520> and<00:56:37.760> how<00:56:37.920> you<00:56:38.079> approach<00:56:38.480> product
hiring and how you approach product
hiring and how you approach product
development<00:56:39.119> and<00:56:39.359> how<00:56:39.440> you<00:56:39.599> approach<00:56:39.839> so<00:56:40.000> many
development and how you approach so many
development and how you approach so many
things,<00:56:40.400> I<00:56:40.559> think<00:56:40.720> this<00:56:41.200> point<00:56:41.440> of<00:56:41.599> more<00:56:41.920> isn't
things, I think this point of more isn't
things, I think this point of more isn't
always<00:56:42.400> better<00:56:42.799> seems<00:56:43.040> like<00:56:43.200> sort<00:56:43.440> of<00:56:43.520> a
always better seems like sort of a
always better seems like sort of a
undercurrent<00:56:44.720> in<00:56:45.040> everything<00:56:45.280> that<00:56:45.520> that<00:56:45.839> you
undercurrent in everything that that you
undercurrent in everything that that you
all<00:56:46.160> are<00:56:46.319> doing.<00:56:46.559> The<00:56:46.720> focus<00:56:46.880> on<00:56:47.119> taste<00:56:47.359> and
all are doing. The focus on taste and
all are doing. The focus on taste and
the<00:56:47.680> focus<00:56:47.839> on<00:56:48.079> quality<00:56:48.799> versus<00:56:49.200> just<00:56:50.000> numbers
the focus on quality versus just numbers
the focus on quality versus just numbers
and<00:56:50.720> hours<00:56:51.040> and<00:56:51.359> people.<00:56:52.079> So<00:56:52.240> I<00:56:52.319> think<00:56:52.400> that's
and hours and people. So I think that's
and hours and people. So I think that's
a<00:56:52.799> really<00:56:52.880> good<00:56:53.119> a<00:56:53.359> good<00:56:53.520> takeaway<00:56:53.920> from
a really good a good takeaway from
a really good a good takeaway from
everything<00:56:54.319> that<00:56:54.480> you've<00:56:54.640> shared.
everything that you've shared.
everything that you've shared.
Christina,<00:56:55.680> I've<00:56:55.920> learned<00:56:56.160> so<00:56:56.400> much.<00:56:56.720> Thank
Christina, I've learned so much. Thank
Christina, I've learned so much. Thank
you<00:56:57.200> so<00:56:57.440> much<00:56:57.520> for<00:56:57.680> your<00:56:57.839> time<00:56:58.079> today.
you so much for your time today.
you so much for your time today.
Thanks<00:56:58.720> for<00:56:58.880> having<00:56:59.119> me.
Thanks for having me.
Thanks for having me.
That<00:57:00.240> was<00:57:00.319> Christina<00:57:00.799> Cordova.<00:57:01.680> What<00:57:01.920> I<00:57:02.079> keep
That was Christina Cordova. What I keep
That was Christina Cordova. What I keep
thinking<00:57:02.480> about<00:57:02.640> is<00:57:02.880> how<00:57:03.119> much<00:57:03.359> linear<00:57:03.839> story
thinking about is how much linear story
thinking about is how much linear story
runs<00:57:04.400> in<00:57:04.559> the<00:57:04.720> opposite<00:57:05.119> direction<00:57:05.440> from<00:57:05.680> the
runs in the opposite direction from the
runs in the opposite direction from the
usual<00:57:06.160> playbook.<00:57:06.880> The<00:57:07.119> idea<00:57:07.280> that<00:57:07.520> you<00:57:07.680> can
usual playbook. The idea that you can
usual playbook. The idea that you can
build<00:57:08.000> something<00:57:08.240> huge<00:57:08.720> with<00:57:08.960> a<00:57:09.119> small<00:57:09.359> team.
build something huge with a small team.
build something huge with a small team.
And<00:57:10.160> the<00:57:10.319> way<00:57:10.480> you<00:57:10.559> get<00:57:10.720> there<00:57:10.960> maybe<00:57:11.200> isn't
And the way you get there maybe isn't
And the way you get there maybe isn't
more<00:57:11.760> hours<00:57:12.079> or<00:57:12.319> more<00:57:12.480> hires.<00:57:13.280> It's<00:57:13.520> being
more hours or more hires. It's being
more hours or more hires. It's being
relentlessly<00:57:14.640> deliberate<00:57:15.119> about<00:57:15.520> every
relentlessly deliberate about every
relentlessly deliberate about every
decision<00:57:16.160> you<00:57:16.400> make.<00:57:16.960> Conversations<00:57:17.520> like
decision you make. Conversations like
decision you make. Conversations like
this<00:57:17.920> one<00:57:18.079> are<00:57:18.319> the<00:57:18.559> whole<00:57:18.799> reason<00:57:18.960> I<00:57:19.280> started
this one are the whole reason I started
this one are the whole reason I started
building<00:57:20.000> surface<00:57:20.960> because<00:57:21.280> company<00:57:21.680> culture
building surface because company culture
building surface because company culture
has<00:57:22.160> a<00:57:22.400> huge<00:57:22.640> impact<00:57:22.880> on<00:57:23.119> performance<00:57:24.000> and<00:57:24.240> for
has a huge impact on performance and for
has a huge impact on performance and for
too<00:57:24.720> long<00:57:25.280> talent<00:57:25.599> and<00:57:25.760> people<00:57:26.000> leaders
too long talent and people leaders
too long talent and people leaders
haven't<00:57:26.640> had<00:57:26.799> the<00:57:26.960> data<00:57:27.280> to<00:57:27.520> prove<00:57:27.680> it<00:57:27.839> or<00:57:28.160> act
haven't had the data to prove it or act
haven't had the data to prove it or act
on<00:57:28.480> it.<00:57:28.799> That's<00:57:29.040> the<00:57:29.200> gap<00:57:29.359> we're<00:57:29.599> trying<00:57:29.760> to
on it. That's the gap we're trying to
on it. That's the gap we're trying to
close.<00:57:30.559> I'm<00:57:30.799> Joelle<00:57:31.200> Emerson<00:57:31.680> and<00:57:31.920> this<00:57:32.160> is
close. I'm Joelle Emerson and this is
close. I'm Joelle Emerson and this is
Below<00:57:32.720> the<00:57:32.960> Surface,<00:57:33.680> where<00:57:33.920> we<00:57:34.079> find<00:57:34.240> out<00:57:34.400> how
Below the Surface, where we find out how
Below the Surface, where we find out how
category<00:57:35.280> defining<00:57:35.760> companies<00:57:36.160> are
category defining companies are
category defining companies are
approaching<00:57:36.880> people,<00:57:37.359> talent,<00:57:37.680> and<00:57:37.920> culture
approaching people, talent, and culture
approaching people, talent, and culture
right<00:57:38.640> now.<00:57:39.200> Subscribe<00:57:39.680> wherever<00:57:40.000> you<00:57:40.160> get
right now. Subscribe wherever you get
right now. Subscribe wherever you get
your<00:57:40.480> podcasts<00:57:41.119> and<00:57:41.359> I'll<00:57:41.599> see<00:57:41.680> you<00:57:41.839> next
your podcasts and I'll see you next
your podcasts and I'll see you next
time.