Vitalerium: Descent into the Void Part 1 - Nicholas Keating Casbarro - Sci-fi Cyberpunk Dystopian Book

Hey Side Questers! Sorry about the late upload. Today, we dive into the first part of our discussion of Nicholas Keating Casbarro's Vitalerium: Descent into the Void.

ABOUT THE BOOK

Nearly six centuries have passed since humanity discovered vitalerium, which ushered in a golden age of space exploration and colonization. Planet Deorum’s society is centered around this illustrious, gravity-bending blue crystal. The year is 2701.

Following a near-fatal disaster, roughneck freelancer Roman Matthews becomes unwittingly trapped at the center of a harrowing conspiracy. Hunted by Deorum’s government, the Coalition for Prosperity, Roman must use his deadly skillset to survive against all odds.

Roman and his band of unlikely allies will discover that the Coalition’s indiscretions threaten the delicate balance of advanced civilization. As a sect of the Coalition prepares to implement its Machiavellian vision of utopia, the proverbial pendulum begins to swing toward chaos

Vitalerium World:
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Twitter: https://x.com/vitalerium 
Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@vitaleriumseries 

-Publicist - Eve Bailey / Flo Agency: https://flo.agency/  
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If you’re a reader looking for something deeper or an indie author working on your book, The Side Quest Book Club is for you. We skip the usual book reviews and ratings. Each episode turns fun side quests into real lessons, so you’ll leave not just entertained, but with a better understanding of why storytelling matters.

The majority of the Valyrian novel was written at 36,000 feet. He has seven books planned for the Valyrian series and continues to craft the narrative of Roman Matthews. Seven books, I can't even count that high, that's amazing.

But they're so much more sinister than the taste allows for you to experience right now. Nicholas, the way this is his first book, I am sure he's thought about bringing it back because the way he described it in our interview is he's building out the whole world, building out the character of Roman. That's what I told him.

I told him chef's kiss guy. Well, I didn't call him guy. Hombre.

I'm not your guy, pal. Beautifully written. Nicholas, when he was on the show, mentioned that he wanted Roman to have side quests that he's going on and make it feel like a video game.

Did you feel like it was a video game when you guys were reading it? Coming to you from an endless library where every book is read and every spoiler discussed. Join us as we dig into the lives of fictional people who cannot defend themselves. This is the side quest book club.

Welcome back side questers to one of the books that I've been absolutely looking forward to, Videlirium. We had the author on recently and we're going to have him on again as our guest episode. But before we do, I want to welcome back Matt and Spencer joining us today for the journey.

Good to be beer. Good to be beer. Good to be here.

That's what I heard. Good to be beer. Good to be beer.

Good to be beer. Good to be beer, Matt. Welcome back.

Glad to be back as well. Glad to be beer back. Glad to be beer stick.

Beer stick. You guys should have heard what was being talked about before the episode. Good God.

Oh man. We'll talk about that book another day. Milk will never taste the same.

Slava, can you give us a quick rundown about the author and the book we're covering today? Well, the book we're covering is Videlirium, Descend into the Void. It's sans milk, thank God. And the author, Nicholas Keating-Casbaro, who, as Jonathan mentioned, we've had on, I think that episode dropped a week ago or two weeks ago.

But for those who don't know, Nicholas was born in Providence, Rhode Island in 1990. He attended Northeastern University's Doctor of Physical Therapy program in Boston, class of 2013. Though he never practiced, he maintained his curiosity and love for the sciences.

After college, he worked in the medical device field with a specialty in wound healing and burn treatment. In 2021, he joined a regenerative medicine company where he would spend five days a week on a plane, traveling the country to work with burn surgeons and victims. While flying, he experienced a spark of inspiration and decided to follow the thread.

Since childhood, he had a deep love for science fiction, growing to appreciate the greats in sci-fi like Aldous Huxley, George Orwell, Frank Herbert, Isaac Isimov, and many others. Nicholas used his time on countless flights to create the Videlirium series and its universe. The majority of the Videlirium novel was written at 36,000 feet.

He has seven books planned for the Videlirium series and continues to craft the narrative of Roman Matthews. Seven books? I can't even count that high. That's amazing.

I know. Seven crayons, Matt. Oh, seven crayons? Okay, fantastic.

Which flavor? The rainbow colors plus one and minus one. I don't know. Yeah, it's probably, I don't know.

I'm just being a dum-dum. But that is our author and the book. A quick recap of its plot.

In the year 2701, humanity's prosperity and exploration of the cosmos hinge upon the discovery of Videlirium, a gravity-bending blue crystal. On planet Diorum, the coalition of prosperity revolves around this precious element. Roman Matthews, a rugged flail lancer with ties to shady organizations, receives a call from an old mentor.

Reluctantly, he agrees to a dangerous job that dredges up past trauma and fuels his thirst for revenge. However, a near-fatal disaster thrusts him into a treacherous political conspiracy. Hunted by overseer Zerus Agenon, the Galactic Alliance's second most powerful figure, Roman navigates a world of corruption and danger.

Along the way, he finds unexpected allies in unlikely places. As Roman fights for survival and searches for his true purpose, he discovers he's part of the larger conflict, one that could plunge advanced civilization into chaos. With Zerus Agenon's sinister plans threatening to disrupt a delicate balance, Roman must confront his past and forge a new future.

Dun dun dun. Tell me you're a healthy individual as an author without telling me you're a healthy individual as an author by making your absolutely effed up character basically go through therapy. Space opera, baby.

Space opera. Yeah. I love it.

Do you guys feel like the summary is living up to the first 10 chapters that you've gotten to? I'm waiting on the allies portion because it seems like everybody we meet either hates Roman or Roman hates them. Or dies. Or dies, right.

Like Jarek. Jarek? Yeah, Jarek is his name, I think, is his friend. But I think they've already had a flashback or two, so they might expand on that relationship, I think, so.

Feels pretty... Gets me excited. Yeah, yeah. Feels pretty relevant to the book so far.

I mean, I think, kind of like to echo Matt a bit, still kind of waiting on some of that stuff to happen. I mean, we're still pretty early on in the book here, so. I haven't met the allies.

I feel like Roman really hasn't had a chance to confront his past yet. It almost feels like it's still kind of plaguing him maybe a little bit. And I think we kind of see that just kind of based on who he is in the first... so far in the first 10 chapters.

Yeah, because you guys haven't finished the book. I have. So the allies... There's... I'm not spoiling anything for anybody.

There's two of them, specifically, that I would call allies. And then towards the end of the book, some of the people that kind of hate him, you know, a little bit less than the other people hate him, they become allies again. But that's completely spoiler-free for our guests in the audience.

So you'll meet them, and it's a fun ride, let me tell you. Since you've already completed the books, Slava, does that preface cover the series as a whole, or just the first book? Just the first book. The last few chapters, he realizes there's something bigger going on on Dior, and then towards the very last pages of the book, he realizes he has to do something about it, and that there's no escape for him.

And that's him confronting the past, and certain things that happened after Chapter 10, and him finding himself in that place where he must respond as the responsible, you know, person. Like, as a human that needs to do something about the stuff that Zerus is unleashing in the world. So the plot that we read, it's book-specific, not world-specific.

He's got a lot of character development then, because right now he still just seems like an a**hole. Yeah, yeah. Like Spencer said, he's plagued by his past, for sure.

It's definitely developed his personality, but right now, boy, what a d**k. I was thinking the same thing. He's a little d**k, though.

He's like a Han Solo mixed with a little bit more a**hole. Yeah, actually, that's pretty on point. Yeah, I feel like he just kind of treats everybody the same way, whether they're his boss, or whoever he gets his jobs from, or, you know, like the one scene where he goes to get his payment for a job, and he just, like, kills everyone, except the one guy who beats him up.

Makes him choke on his finger, yeah. Yeah, I was like, okay, I feel like that was unnecessary. And you feeling like that was unnecessary, Spencer, means that you wouldn't make it in the grind.

Yeah, yeah, I would not make it. Yeah, you're right on that. The more I analyze Roman as a character, too, and now learning, I guess I didn't know that Casbaro was in psychology and stuff.

Roman is written to the T of a character who is, like, keeping everybody as far away from him as possible. Arms length is not long enough, and you can tell by the way he acts, and as we have just described him as a character, he's a bit of a d**k. We don't know.

We know some reasons why, based on his past, but there's definitely a huge gap that we still have to fill in between his childhood, when he leaves the orphanage, which we'll talk about, or I don't even know if you'd call it an orphanage. Kids prison. Orphanage adjacent.

It's a kid's prison. Actually, he calls it an orphanage, and then in the book, when he's talking to somebody, he does call it an orphanage, so we can go with that. We'll just say orphanage.

It's the more PC thing, but that big gap between when he leaves there and to when we pick up with him later on in life, there's a huge gap there. I think it's like 16 years. Yeah, it's 10, I think.

10 years. 10 to 15, I would say. I thought it was 10 years.

10 orbits. Yeah, 10 orbits. Something like that.

I actually don't feel like the summary does the book justice. I'm on chapter 22? 22? Not in a bad way. I think that the book's actually better than the summary, is what I'm saying.

Well, that's typically what you hope for when you write a summary. Yeah. You don't want to give away the whole book in the summary, Jonathan.

I'm not asking for the whole book to be given away in the summary. You just want more in the summary, is what you're saying. Just most of the book.

It's the intention. Just a major plot point. I don't know who is in this book, but they sound cool.

Can you paste the summary for me real quick, Soph? There's a couple things that you read that I want to... You want me to do what now? Explicit things you can't put on camera. Do you want me to paste it for you? I got an only chance for you, Slava. I'll sponsor you.

I can pay you in lasagna. Brought to you by ragu sauce. So, where do you want me to paste this, Jonathan? Exactly where I sent you a message.

Up your button around the corner. Oh, look at that. Look at that.

My DMs. Just slid into my DMs. I'm trying to make it family-friendly, although today that's probably violence in terms of language.

I'm on your podcast. It's not family-friendly anymore. That's right.

That's right. So, the year is fine. Rugged freelancer.

That's fine. It's this part where he... Let's see. Agrees to dangerous job that dresses up his past trauma.

That's fine. Near fatal disaster. Okay, check.

So far, we're all fine. Yeah, maybe I'm actually making this up in my head, and I just don't like you, Slava. Sounds about right.

Just like Jarek. Along the way, he finds unlikely allies. What? What? There's like a thing that stood out to me.

Larger conflict. Plunge advanced civilization. You know what? It's a great summary.

And that's the only question I had, because so far up to chapter 10, we've experienced everything except for the allies portion. And, Matt, you haven't experienced the sinister plans. Well, we have a taste.

You do have a taste, but they're so much more sinister than the taste allows for you to experience right now. Oh, all right. So, Slava, you can tell me if we get the answer to this.

I think the thing that I had an issue with, and as I'm rereading this, because I'm checking these boxes off for the show and realizing it's actually a pretty good summary. So, internal Jonathan. Oh, weird.

I was questioning this. That's the episode. That's it.

Thanks for joining us today, guys. This has been Vidalirium part one, where we discussed the I'm supposed to be the antagonist, but actually I've decided that I don't want to be the antagonist, and it's just a good summary. Hot take.

Summary sucks. Actually, I reread it. It's pretty good.

And it's one of those shorts where it goes, directed by Larry David. Okay. He fights for survival, but this idea of him addressing his morals and going, I actually care about humanity across the known universe, and I want to help.

What is his motivation there? And I'm only on chapter 20 or 22 or something like that. Oh, you should know. You should know, then, why he does that.

Because those unlikely allies, one of them kind of shakes him out of his funk. Well, okay. For lack of a better term.

All right. All right. All right.

Let's not get too far into the weeds past chapter 10, because I want to read it for my own self. I know. The Wookiee gives him the old... This anthropomorphic cow comes out of nowhere.

It takes a really weird turn here, and we're going to ask Nicholas about it. Wow Changes pretty quickly, huh? Okay, I think I'm I'm actually like a chapter away from that's lava because I think I know what you're talking about. Yes.

Yes But all right. Well, I don't dislike the well, I'll tell you this also you're about a chapter or two away I think from what's what we just discussed but also There is a moment in the book where he helps a little street girl Who's like, I think she's like 10 years old Yeah, her description and he feels for her because he knows what she's going through because he was a street kid So he's this asshole because you guys have called him, but he does care about people He doesn't care about the people that he thinks are Causing all the ills on the orm so anyway to That's point. Let's not get into the weeds.

I reneg my strong opinion Just this once though Let the record show just once. Okay, so let's talk about space Batman Roman Matthews You mean space cloth He's not Batman. He's more like a cloth.

He was not a traveling Troubadour, he's Batman in childhood events only, okay That's true. He does. He's not a billionaire out of billionaire playboy Philanthropist he's definitely not Batman the Batman.

He's just a dude that bites people's fingers off He's more akin to Ozzy Osbourne than he is Batman. I don't think he bit the finger off. I think you need to reread that chapter He made as well somebody else ate the finger milk and handmaids or something like that.

I Enjoyed that scene as much as I enjoyed which was a lot on a scale of 1 to 10 It was like a 15 where he gets revenge on his bully that was a very you did love that very satisfying takes me back to a full metal jacket when they when they put the sheets over him and start beating him with pillows and Joker is sitting there and you can see it he hits him once and then you can see his like demeanor change and he hits him again and then again and again and it's Just full of all this venom just beaten on it. Oh, yeah, and I'm just like, okay That's what played in my head when I was reading the that part when they were beaten up on this bully Very meditated Absolutely when we had Nick on I told him I Don't like when authors put their characters Through what seems to me at least like too much Trauma and too much heartache and then the payoff seems so weak and in this book, you know, you know that Roman's life of that orphanage was horrible and that this douchebag was just a menace to all the kids and to see him humbled in such a vibrant like visceral way Was a great payoff for me as the reader Yeah And then obviously Roman had other troubles and certain events from the orphanage that we don't know about stayed with him So it's not like he got off the hook There was still more for Roman to grow out of or Advance as a character and then we get that towards the end of the book But that moment where he does get some reprieve and that bully gets exactly what he deserves Beautiful beautiful Piece of literature and the fact that was so violent. I love that I love that they did he didn't linger like you said they didn't just give him so much trauma in childhood We brought him to the orphanage a couple things happened over those a couple of days and then a year goes by a whole orbit goes by and then you see him and they start describing him as like this little like resistance leader of like the weaker people there and The plan is executed to the T and then they just go right into it and he escapes.

It's just like wow Okay, so we know bad stuff happened in that year but it built he built his alliances or he built his team or whatever up to Wherever it got him to now and then the payoff Chef's kiss. That was fantastic. Absolutely.

Yeah, and so I told Nick like that's what I told him I told him chef's kiss guy. Well, I didn't call him guy I called me right but I'm like They beautifully written Beautifully written 100% I would have actually liked a little bit more of like during that year just to kind of see a little bit of Like the process of him Gathering up his own Friends or you know, like the guys who he Helped and beat up his bully Just cuz to me it felt the build-up slightly rushed it was like all of a sudden a year later I just beat up this guy And I was like, oh, okay cool But it was like there there was it I kind of had to just Take his word for it that you know All of this like he built these relationships with these other guys And then you know went to beat up the bully But I like it was a good scene, but I just I think it would have been nice to have just maybe a little bit more You know of that build-up spending chapter jumping through certain like a couple of events in that year. Yeah I just kind of get that Spencer's taking a ride in the Jonathan wagon.

I like both. I like both Both options. I like the way he did it and if he would have done it like spend a chapter of diving a little bit Yeah, I think it would have added to the book Made him maybe a little bit more relatable to people who have had pretty rough childhoods psychologically, but I think that also leaves room though Because there's a lot of books that I've read where there's that big old Space in time where they just leap through and then later on he can call back to that in like flashbacks Yeah stuff like that.

I don't know if that happens later on in the book yet or not. It does Okay, it does there's a flashback to a happier time. So he flashes back to a moment with his father At one point in the book.

So I thought the same thing Matt when I read that Flashback, I was like, oh, I think Nicholas might come back and do some flashbacks in book two and three To the orphanage because he still has stuff to you know to deal with he he Was the word for it? He reek not recalls, but there's calls back. Let's do it this way There's callbacks to the orphanage throughout the book Especially when he talks to those allies or one ally specifically and he even in his mind There's moments where he's faced with something and the first thing that he thinks about is his time at the orphanage so there's more to explore and Judging on this is his first book as I am sure he's thought about bringing it back is it the way he described it in our interview is he's building out the whole world and Building out the character of Roman currently, so this is just a taste of the world Yeah, so there's definitely room for more flashbacks of all the horrible that he went through at the orphanage Yeah, that's good to know Yeah, just kind of Yeah based on obviously where I'm at. There's not much there isn't any of that so far.

So yeah, but yeah No, I I'm glad to hear that Yeah, it's good to see that character development Audio book has this trailer for the book and that's fun. But what I want to really talk about is the The history and then the prologue how that sets up the whole world for us I think Nicholas did a fantastic job world building and I think what's 20 pages at most before we get right into the world and you get the slice of life with Roman him playing the game and then Them going home or going to the store that their parents own right before that. There's this prologue which is literally just commentary from some unknown Character somebody who's outside of this world looking in and he gives us a commentary on humanity, but before that we have the history of How vital area and came to be and I wanted just to chat maybe for five minutes ten minutes on that I thought I was fabulously done I took some notes even as as I was reading it because it was such it was just enough for me Let me put it this way.

It was just enough for me to have the full scope of the world We're going into so when I'm reading about Roman in the store and his parents getting killed and all that stuff I already understand the world we're in so the the notes I had here is commentary pulls you in keeps you intrigued and For me, it was akin to Stephen King or Sanderson's interludes Specifically Stephen King's it because you have these Historical story within a story these historical interludes and it which tells the history of dairy in between all the sequences and in Sanderson's way of Kings You also have flashbacks or you have stories that are kind of adjacent to what's happening in the way of Kings And so if it was akin to that for me, and I thought it was wonderful But I want to open it up to you gents. What do you think? It definitely went it didn't stay too long, which was good for like prefaces and stuff for like world-building like the gold standard is for me is What's our work? No, actually Lord of the Rings. So Peter Jackson's intro Lord of the Rings It's it gives a millennia of information in four or five different events and then it When Galadriel's narrating it and then the ring goes away It's just and la la la la la and then it was picked up By the most unlikely creature a lot and then it just goes jumps right into the story because men we know right where we're at We know events prior and the the preface the intro whatever you want to call it was not as good as that obviously But it gave me the same feeling of okay.

There is a huge amount of space space opera stuff and I know what's happened in like the events of like the wars and How much time has passed and then it just slowly whittles down into all right, and here we go Off on the off and running on the adventure Yeah, yep, exactly Yeah, I I agree with that Matt. I really liked I really liked the inclusion of the history, you know, especially of it Illyrium and and how Humanity found it. It's nice to to have that because I've I've read sci-fi books Where You you just jump to the main character and they reference things in the in the history of the world or the universe or whatever and you're and it's like you just kind of have to make Assumptions or guesses kind of based on on what what you think the character might be talking about and you just don't know What's going on? And it feels like you're It feels like you're on the outside of an inside joke sort of feeling when When you hear stuff that's referenced and you just don't know what it's about So I really like the fact that we get this history of you know in 2083 NASA went, you know sent a you know probe or whatever outside the solar system to find, you know new new things and And then obviously all the events leading up.

So yeah, I really appreciated The inclusion of that at the beginning it takes us a place from where we are right now in our time in real lives NASA we know NASA and then it takes us right into the world like it's a believable Transition from the world that we live into this cyberpunk dystopian Whatever. He wants to call it this neon dynasty that it is is Not Roman cause I'm mixing up my books now. What's the name of the world? Do you know? Thank you.

Yes to deorum and I know I I Gave the description of like Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings Like that's a good description of how to like bring it in and then you have the rudimentary Star Wars opening text crawl just words It's the it's a really good blend between those two I think Yeah Yeah, the context he put together to give us that jump was helpful because if if you know If you skip that and you just start reading the book, you're like, okay Who's this guy? What's going on? You just don't have the context Yeah And I think when you're gonna do an epic of any kind sci-fi fantasy or otherwise I would even call it a bit of an epic honestly If I don't have the context then I don't care and I've complained about this with China Mayville I'm Here to make China famous for my dislike of one of his books just one haven't read anything else Just you gotta have a you gotta have a setting without a setting like it takes place in the 60s 70s Whenever it is or 80s 50s and then 80s 80s. Okay, so you you already have that frame of reference We know what the 50s was like, we know what the 80s Yeah, like there's your setting he doesn't have to spend too long describing that whereas now if you're building this new universe You take from where we are where we know space is like NASA. I love how we reference I just thought that was cool that he said NASA so I know what NASA is.

I know Earth I know that and you can see all right, so things are starting to change jumps to wherever we are now in Diorum And it's it's I I don't I thoroughly enjoyed the the sequence there for the for the description of the setting and everything like that I thought it was very well done Yeah, and then the prologue adds to it now. I've finished the book. So the prologue The things that are described there and that what I call the commentary we come back to in the epilogue and Again, I've been waiting to complain about the epilogue here.

You haven't finished Yeah Stop keep going. No, you're fine booty cheeks Richard the epilogue revisits the prologue, but I've also found the prologue Captivating right because then you have this voice that's outside the world talking about Humanity and so you have this history you have some commentary within the history about how you know humans Fractured like all the all the things that brought them together around vitilarium There are fractures and there were wars and all that stuff, but the commentary So for example, here's what I highlighted in the Kindle edition whether it's culture religion money and resources or a simple idea It makes no difference Humanity has always found a way to bait itself into conflict in the name of Scratching that primitive itch of psychic disturbance they mistake for progress There is little faith in them or among them. It would seem the chosen champions of humanity have proven Uninspiring and there's numerous other ones like that, but that commentary that was another Setup, so you have this history you have the commentary of this God figure if you will or somebody looking inside the world from from from the outside and so when you get to chapter one Roman wasn't built in a day and You you're with this little kid.

You're like, oh, so this world is very messed up and I'm already anticipating something horrible happening to Roman and then for a little bit You're kind of lulled into the sense of like ah, it's a happy family. Nothing bad is gonna happen. Oh the cops are here Well, I guess something bad is gonna happen.

Maybe his dad's gonna be arrested There's gonna be some sort of scuffle and that's what's gonna give Roman his hatred for Cop some kind of thinking and that's gonna thrust him into some sort of you know Chaotic adventure and then, you know eventually, you know, he grows up to be an adult and something happens and he's gonna be a freelancer But in like ten ten pages like oh, wow, both of his parents are Yeah, but I was prepared for it because of the history and then that prologue Commentary so like oh wow, that is intense and you know that something has to happen to you know Thrust our character. Yes, you yeah awful despair a main character a good family does not make No, somebody's always gotta die That would be that would be an interesting challenge though of like, okay, cuz he had a great childhood, right? Like he's he plays sports. He's like the captain of the sports team.

He does all the cool stuff his parents own a shop He just gets a really cool knife. His mom and dad love the piss out of each other and then this happens Assassin's or something. He used to be like a government agent.

Yeah the dad Yep, but the wife was also played with the blade and he was like, yeah I remember her like there was a moment that they had and so like she also had some sort of weapons training Which is not normal. Yeah, I'm sure that so my theory is they met they met somewhere in The husband's service or something like that Yeah, or if there's some kind of like hybrid, I don't know if she's like a different type of Human or race or something like that or like a celestial or something, you know some kind of crazy blood. I don't know There's there's lots of stuff swimming around in my head Yeah Mm-hmm.

So Matt in in terms of a comparison Oh Spencer. Did you have a final thought on the same? Well, I was just gonna ask you guys about like what what your thoughts were on the sequence of his his parents Getting murdered and like how that whole situation went down Out of the way the way it happened I didn't like just because I thought the way his dad handled that situation He like his dad could have done it a lot better and he wouldn't have gotten murdered It just felt very I felt a little bit Just like off to me and just the way that he he decided to handle the situation I I thought like to me I felt like there maybe could have been a sequence where you kind of need the the death of the parents for Romans backstory But to me, it's just kind of the way it all went down. I felt like could have been handled better, but Just the way that he acted it felt like he wasn't protecting his family.

I think the way that he should have but So I'm that's my opinion I'm good curious to hear what you guys think about that I think the dad had just finally had enough of the way he'd been treated by and From like the local or the police or the government whatever it is Cuz I think he was he was forcibly retired. I think or like he was forced out It's basically like when somebody else fires somebody and they're just like we mutually parted ways. It's just like no There's more to it, but we don't know yeah So then he's already got the background of these people are assholes and then they come in disrupt his business interrupt his family time It's the son's birthday and he's just like, all right.

I've had enough. It's been a long day I'm sweating to the gills with these guys picking on me and my family I gotta be a little bit more of a man here and maybe he thought he had a better chance against him But it also gives the author the ability to describe. All right, so this is the government You're not supposed to like these are the people that are in power This is why we need to have you know, I I wish they wouldn't have killed off the officer so early just so he could have like I don't maybe met him in a later on in life or something like that just to See that that yeah villainy a little bit more.

He'd be like a mini-boss pretty much, right? So instead he just comes in he's just dripping with you know assholery quote me on that and he's just You really want him to die like a King Joffrey you want him to just die the most painful way possible because he spends so long in that being an asshole phase to the family kills the parents and then they start chasing the kid and Then he gets you know, his neck shivved in a billion times, but I don't know. I enjoyed it I thought it was a good way to kind of segue into alright child Dead with dead parents now we get to move on to building the character that we're gonna know throughout the rest of the series Roman the parentless so Matt you made the connection of this guy potentially being a mini-boss and Nicholas when he was on the show mentioned that he Wanted Roman to have side quests that he's going on and make it feel like a video game Right, so did you feel like it was a video game when you guys were reading it it In some sense in some sense, yes, um, so like when I play I I'm the sci-fi expert, right? Yes why you brought me on I've got a lot of issues like Star Wars Mass Effect all of those great giant space operas whenever I watched Star Wars whenever I played Mass Effect stuff like that I didn't feel like I was watching a movie or I was playing a video game I was participating in the narrative of that setting of that world So as far as like vitilirium, I didn't feel like I was reading a book or playing a video game I feel like I was I was immersed in The world and participating and experiencing all of the events with Roman at my side I was just you know The little dude on his shoulder watching everything happen and I really like the way that he's written this so far because I can tell what he's doing like why he why he's writing the way That he is like you said he even said he wants him to go on like a video gaming adventure and side quests and stuff Like that being a freelancer. That's a great opportunity to do that You get all people throughout this ten years that can be like, yeah, we met three orbits ago And you did a job for me.

He's like, oh, yeah, sweet. I Got another job for you, and then you can go on like another side quest and that's the cool thing about like why I like D&D being a dungeon master is because you can do that a character makes a decision you introduce a character and They just go off instead of going and fighting the BBG They end up going this way in a completely different direction and you can find ways to tie that back into the main adventure, too And I think that's very well written so far as like all of these little adventures and stuff like that Yeah, I'd agree with that Matt I I don't feel like I'm in the sense I Don't feel like this is a video game to me. It feels more like a movie where there are seen you are inserted into a scene and then You watch that scene kind of play out and then it's there's like a cut and then you kind of get the next scene And so so on Yeah to me it feels more like like I'm in a like I'm watching a movie It almost feels like it was kind of written and in the way of like this is kind of how he would want a movie to be made about about this book But like the little like a scene wipe like scene and then the conversation trails off scene wipe into another scene Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, exactly But I think that also Sets it up to be you know that it could be made into a video game It would be you can kind of see like how you would have to You know maybe in the orphanage you kind of have to level up To where you and then the the the boss of the first level is is the bully, right? And then you know the next scene obviously maybe there's a time skip, you know where you're now you're in the the grind and Your next boss is you know, the guy where he makes me his finger, you know that sort of thing But or and like, you know, some of the levels would be him doing the job You know grinding to get the job So Nicholas if we need someone to help with the video game Spencer's got a lot of ideas I don't know. I'm just kind of going off of what was But yeah, so so but for right now I feel like we're more in a movie versus a video game But I can definitely see the potential for it for a game What if the video game started in something like a prologue where you have to be the evil guy or the evil team or the? evil people and You are the one like smashing the button of whatever the thing is I know that that's not exactly how the prologue goes but like if the intro to the video game is you're evil as The start and then you become Roman so funny you say that there's a Star Wars video game Where you it's called the force unleashed you start the game the very first level as Darth Vader You go through and you're you're running through Kashyyyk You're killing Wookiees and stuff like that and you're just blowing shit up and then you find at the very end It's a Jedi you fight the Jedi you kill the Jedi or maybe you don't kill him yet but then you find out he has a son a force-sensitive son, and then you literally like Kill the dad in front of him and see like alright You're my son now and then he goes and like has a secret apprentice. That's the that's that's the intro So something like that I think would be pretty cool if this turned into like a video game you play as like There's some bad guy that goes and kills who's Darth Vader.

Oh, he's he's uh he's a big black guy Big black guy Those are Big sword, but that's swinging the sword around What's a star we're gonna need that gonna need that editing Booty cheeks Richard go ahead and just go ahead and insert that for you, man Yeah, it's just Spencer every time Matt says something to a flammatory, it's just Spencer saying booty cheeks So I'm sorry I took some a side question you wanted to mention something earlier Yeah, so I wanted to respond to Spencer and Matt When they were talking about whether or not the scene with the parents were rushed and specifically the dad Not doing his best to protect his family in the dad's defense When he says neither are you to the captain's quip about who's a patriot or not? he thought that The captain was far away and not an earshot But because the guy didn't have his fat face on he heard face face on the fact that he didn't have his face mask on He heard him. That's the only reason that They're both dead so quickly So that was gonna be my response where I think The dad did everything that he could and when he was making a smart-ass comment He thought he was out of your shot out of your shot. Yes That That's a good point.

That's a little little detail. I forgot but That tips the situation like it was fine. And then not Just from a couple words.

Just a bubble. Yeah, what did you say? What do you say and that goes back to Matt's point about this is the government you're supposed to hate Because a little comment like that Does not end up and you being arrested or Reprimanded I've been punched by the cop or something. You made it made an example of made an example of you get Shot in the face Richard.

Yep. Yeah. Yeah.

No, I that's that's a great point Yeah, it's definitely this sort of Nazi esque government that that I feel like he's trying to Yeah, get us to to hate And yeah, that's that's yeah, it's a great example. Are you enjoying today's side quest? Make sure you're subscribed so you never miss an episode We are available on YouTube and all major platforms so you can listen to us anywhere Now back to the show. So as the story moves forward we See the death of the parents we have our time in the orphanage I agree with Spencer in terms of like it didn't feel long enough the story keeps going to Roman doing a job, right? He finishes one job.

We see him shove a finger down a guy's throat. He gets a call for another job High payout high profile job, and then he's sent over to meet this Really derpy scientist, but he can't even get to the scientists This is a part that I felt like was a video game where it's like, you know that you're supposed to be in this building You know You're supposed to get past the guard the guy who's got the code word and he's like Fan into the flame got the objectives right here leave building You're like at the location and it says yeah go into this door and you're like I'm at the door I did Or it's like in Fallout and Fallout and Mass Effect where you have to choose a for one response X for another response Or whatever and then keep choosing the wrong one Yeah Quick save Sam's kind of a dick should a quick Sam can go pound rocks or eat a Don't know Out of the fire and into the flame can't Dragon force action. Yeah, that was that was a funny sequence.

I I enjoyed that little bit there the guy being just a complete jerk about Being a stickler for the actual word, but there are moments like that throughout the book. The first one is when? dr My jar son my jar son. I'm gonna mispronounce that name.

I forgot what it is. We are Mjartansson Mjartansson. He was yeah, he was bummed out that It was a named after him like the common name So it technically is named after him but no one calls that because It's the Twitter Nobody calls X. It's in Twitter.

Okay, it's Never gonna be X Yeah, and even in my office Even when we talk about X we call it X like he goes, can you go tweet this on X? Like yeah, this is as a marketer. This is literally a thing where it's like hey, can you go X this on X? What what does that mean? Yeah? You tweet it it's it that is an action thing because Twitter's been around forever right like, you know musk whatever but like Give us you know, send can you go post a message on X for it? Like no. No, it's a tweet.

Yeah Yeah, it's a tweet. You could have just did what Facebook did when they rebranded is like it's Facebook by meta. It's not meta Facebook yeah, I met it.

Yeah, it's it's still Facebook But by meta he should have done that it's like booty cheeks by It's it's X or it's Twitter by X or I don't know whatever You know the parent company when they do that most companies like especially in reconstruction when they rebrand like What we have around us is Anderson Anderson windows. They've been renewal by Anderson. They've been Anderson renewal They've been renewal Anderson windows that they just change or add a couple different words, but it's the same But just very it's varied ever so small they've been windows by renewed Anderson, yes, I'm sure they have they've been Halfway house Anderson got yeah Anderson got renewed and now he sells windows.

Yeah, the subscription got canceled and then they re up kinky What Anderson Farms Anderson Farms windows by milking Anderson. Yes milking the Anderson windows There it is look they used to Argonne in that middle they still do they still do they use are they're using No, now they're using milk How do you see? Guys, I think we found quest. I think we we found our marketing pitch for them.

I'm sure they're gonna love it Morning glory milking farm. Okay That's I mean, that's really actually factual you didn't you didn't think ahead. It was just I'm gonna do something here Yeah, you are on you are with Slava and Jonathan and you bring up something that's called morning glory milking Like we are not grown men, I can't wait to take this side quest Well, and and our editor is probably just gonna drop it into your frame I just have me where those the cow face the cow For the entire episode from here on out.

This is gonna be a short Your editor's gonna ask for a new job Yeah, I'll do any other episode except this he's gonna be like what did I sign up for Sorry, dude be better This segment first ten chapters it ends where he gets to chat with Norval Did you guys have any comments on like Norval escaping his? His scientist lab prison basically from Zerus. I mean, we haven't even talked about Zerus actually either So yeah, you guys have some commentary there Zerus reminds me so much of Like a Palpatine character Only a little bit more Angry like not in control of his anger and emotions. He's very sinister.

He's very plotting and there's this this underlying Plot I guess his plan is We don't we know the breadth of it. I think in a couple of chapters after ten We know exactly not exactly what he's planning but why he's doing what he's doing what he wants to accomplish, right? And it's very Palpatine ask because they have the political discourse in the the courtroom or whatever and the talk with that other senator And then he's got his talking with the doctor is like an evil genius speaking with his R&D department like I Thought it was pretty cool. I Appreciate Zerus, even though I hate his guts Zerus was the guy who when he was a kid his father killed a man in front of him or made him kill the man Right, very gangster.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah huge mob.

Yep It kind of gave me an insight into his head, but I still hate the guy that I don't have any sympathy Yeah, little bastard I do like that and we've done it over as a as a generation over the last couple of I don't maybe decade Where every villain has to be sympathized with and it got kind of old because I want to hate something Yeah, I want to hate a villain like Thanos did it really really well because a lot of people I'm not saying it's right or I agree with it there. They're just like, all right Yeah, there's not enough resources and too many people the answer kill a bunch of people. We have plenty of resources No rhyme or reason that's just his motive, but people sympathize with that And Everybody after that villain after villains just like you have to have some sort of sympathy for the villain.

No Give me give me an evil thing to hate so I can root for the villain because if you make the villain too Sympathetic and cool. I'm gonna root for the villain. That's not what you write.

Yeah Yeah the only villain Outside of the world that has been created by our maybe our generation or whatever the thing that you just talking about Matt The only villain I've ever rooted for or felt sympathetic to is Magneto, yeah Yeah, like Xavier X. He's more like I don't find him hero. Yeah, I don't find him, you know Appealing. Yeah, like I just don't care like shut up.

I Like Magneto That's it Like some of his characters his characters his sidekicks or his team a lot of them are kind of assholes But Magneto by himself is my favorite Marvel character Like very well, maybe maybe Wolverine because everybody likes Wolverine But Magneto is the one that I truly truly enjoy as a character and sympathize with yeah Well, I think to part of the reason for that is is to show that you know Life isn't just these black and white. Yeah evil versus good situations It's the fact of like life a lot of times life is gray and You know a character can have you know, a villain character can have good motivations But just go about things in the wrong way. So like Thanos, right? He has feels like good motivations.

You want to save the resources and whatnot But just obviously killing off half the population of the universe is not how you go about that You know, it's so you go about that that's the Right. He has the power to destroy half of the universe Instead of create enough resources for the people in the universe. Yep.

Yep, and so so Yeah, so in vitilirium here where where's there's? you know, I So far, I guess I haven't really seen a motive or like what's there's is trying to accomplish with creating this this mega weapon obviously, we we just see this sort of To what I feel this, you know, this sort of Hitler esque Character where we're just supposed to hate him and he's written that way And I'm sure there's a reason We just as far as you know, chapter 10 goes why I haven't seen that yet. There's a Power struggle because there's still somebody above Zerus and it's why Zerus is doing the things that he wants to do That's and like chapter 10 is a great point to talk about and break this up because after chapter 10 Shit starts to pop off because I'm only a couple chapters after 10, but even then just those couple chapters a lot Has happened a lot you figure out a lot more about there's a Basically you figure out a little bit more about vitilirium as a substance or an element you figure out more about the Romans past and stuff like that, too. There's a lot like in chapter 11 12 13 there is more in those three chapters I think that I enjoyed than in the entire first ten chapters those three chapters I I stopped after 13 cuz like alright I'm gonna read this once we start doing the podcast so I can actually like Not forget anything and be able to talk about it all because as soon as I got to that I was like, okay I'm so excited to read the rest of this book in the series and it's it's so good.

So good I'm excited for you to read it Spencer. I really am. Yeah.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to it So, yeah, I'm just getting my perspective based on the limited knowledge that I have. So But yeah, and that's one of the reasons I haven't really read too far ahead either Matt is because I want to you know in the next episode, I kind of want to be able to have my my Have that fresh in my memory of what I just read and and be able to give my reactions and opinions, you know Based on that. So yeah But yeah, yeah I am looking forward to it and I can kind of tell I feel like chapter 2 even just stopping at chapter 10 I can tell it's a sort of I Don't know what the tipping point in a sense of like, okay now after this I can kind of tell things things are about to Get wild the crazy start to a main quest if you want to put it in terms It's just like you get handed.

Oh, you're finally awake. Alduin comes. Yes.

We're on our grand adventure now Yep. Yeah, and that's exactly what it felt like when I when he got the job from from the from Norville the scientists I could kind of like okay. This is a big deal like this this new Crystal I think or this new vitilirium Shard or whatever they're trying to find Yeah, yeah, like like I can tell that's like the big deal for this for this weapon to be undocumented deposit Gotcha.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and so I could kind of tell it's like, okay Yeah, this is definitely setting up for like a big, you know big showdown at some point Yeah, the first so I'm glad He I'm glad Alex wrote this the way Apologies, it's a power move right there I'm gonna give him a new name Alex Casparo.

Anyways, Nicholas, that's what he that's what he lets me call it I know and we're tight a month from now when he's on the show I really would love if you remembered a callback like oh, hey, great to meet you Alex, and you just look at the camera. Yeah Anyway, um, I forgot I was gonna say rats when Nicholas wrote Right. So when he wrote this some some people when they when they write these giant Universes they want it to be like the next big IP or universe or world they spend which he does Right, but instead of spending an entire book or two like most authors do building the world He spends ten chapters of the first book a really good preface a really good prologue and then we jump right into the fucking story I Love that and I'm super excited because he said he's got a bunch more books.

I'm like, okay, so he's not wasting time He's not mincing words. We're getting into it and we're getting into it fast and we're going We're off and running and I'm so excited. He's got comics.

Look at he's got comic books coming out now like the IP itself I am beyond stoked for for this. I am super super excited to keep reading to keep experiencing and to meet meet Mr. Kasparov to that's gonna be awesome Matt something really cool If you guys haven't checked out the episode with the author you absolutely should I asked him at one point during the show If he had any like really cool marketing things he's done yet because he's first book trying to get things, you know Off the ground or whatever and he told us a quick story He had a guerrilla marketing campaign that he did where he was at a con and he So conference for those who aren't who aren't in the know Uh, and he was like, oh man, I can't wait till one day when someone's gonna cosplay one of my characters and then he was like Why can't that be today? And so he talked to a few of them and was like, hey Can I can I sponsor you to be one of my characters and they said yes And one of them is actually even like a big I don't know who she is, but I think she was one of the characters you're about to meet And she won a contest as his character. No way put so much.

Oh, yeah It's super you got to go check out the actual uh, send me some links or put links in the description of that That sounds really cool. Yeah, we'll put it up here or in an end in the description So you guys will be able just to click and listen to that episode Yeah, I think I think 10 as the stepping off point Um for the rest of this adventure and roman as a character, I think is it's really really well done And norvel's norvel's written really cool, too I know we were talking about what we want to or what we think about norvel and stuff like that But go ahead. I want to talk about normal.

He reminds me of the scientist from metal gear metal gear solid Yeah A little bit he has like traces of him And that's just because I play video games and I read sci-fi and I i'm in this nerdy world. And so for me the way the my brain works in addition to that is I often make these webbed connections in my head of characters that remind me of a different character that's constantly Playing in my head and each time norvel talked I am reminded of metal gear solid The first one playing well the first one's actually the second one on ps1. I remember playing that into three o'clock in the morning.

Yeah And well before that before sons of patriots because he's in the first one and well So that's the first one on ps1. And then the second one for ps2 Is sons, uh sons of patriots or would you say sons of patriots? Yeah. Yeah, but the very first one Uh that came out in the playstation, uh council He just reminds me of that Uh that kind of squirt not squirmy but Mousy smarmy little smarmy little scientist dude.

Yeah, I had to go get a tool to iron out the issues with my guests Okay, so it's it's metal gear metal gear solid metal gear solid two um solid snake Sons of liberty not sons of patriotism or whatever. I said sons of sons of liberty Yep. No, I agree.

I think that's a good. Uh, good cross reference with kind of the personality of Yeah, the doctor Jonathan we were just talking about the scientist norval and I was saying that he reminds me of the scientist from the metal gear series games Like what's your take on the on the character because just like you just heard us say matt and I That he's smarmy. He's a mousy But he does have a little bit of spunk to him But he's also kind of a cowardly little weakling at the same time.

So he's this complex little ball of uh, characteristics to me Well, uh, I haven't played those couple metal gear i've played metal gear but what's like ps1? Yeah, that's what i'm talking about The scientist. Oh, all right. Well, then I don't I don't really remember all the details.

What's up? And what's a metal gear who's a solid on the metal gear Um, it's pre star wars. It's the world before star wars. Oh, okay great um, what do they call him, uh captain kirk crocodile eyes Yes, anyway, not as funny.

It's funnier in my head. Uh He's gonna just put little crocodile guys called goat eyes they're weirder Oh baphomet they are absolutely weird. Goat eyes are goat eyes.

They're sideways slits with bubbles in them It's yeah, it's weird. Anyways side quest. Yeah Yeah, oh man, um horrifying so the the scientist i'm, not sure if mirin His is his wife or his girlfriend or his sister? or there's a very deep connection between the two of them, but yeah, I don't think it says if it's like His lover his family member or anything like that I don't I don't know if it does or just his friend or just or just a friend.

Yeah, I don't know Yeah Could be like a doctor strange and his whatever that that girl's name is relationship Maybe they had something in the past, but they still work together and are close. I don't know What i'd love to see and this is not the question you asked, but it's a question i'm answering is See the scientist. This is called the power movement.

Just take notes Uh, I don't care about your question. I'm gonna answer my own Hey great book alex Is Um is see the scientist get some character development where he starts to get a bit of a spine, right? He's like i'm just i'm not doing that right because he's been under the thumb of xerus for so long he's like been Trained he's been tamed his back has been broken to be like well i'll never be able to Defeat or whatever with this guy So, you know, let me just do everything he says Instead of like having his own, uh having his own You know thoughts and answers and and things like that, right? Yeah, so uh I I don't have anyone that he reminds me of if that's kind of what you were getting at, but I do I do look forward to seeing well if he's gonna stay alive honestly because I could also see Nicholas matt his name's nicholas the author. Uh, I do see nicholas I do see nicholas, uh, maybe killing him like not that there's any foreshadowing for that but like I wouldn't be surprised if like hey, he serves his purpose I would I wouldn't be surprised if they kill him off later After they give him a little bit more development because I feel like he's more than just the quest I definitely feel like he's more than just a quest giver to go back to like the video game Tie-in or whatever.

He's not just you meet an npc. He gives you the quest you start off the adventure There's more to him. He spent a lot of time.

I mean describing norville his relationship with uh, With the with we saw backstory girl. We saw backstory and he has ties to you know The bad guys as working with them. He's trying to slow down or figure out why the weapon they're building or developing is Is being going to be used for like there's so much depth built countermeasures to them.

Yeah. Yeah. He's like, um, The the guy from the star wars that when he built the death star he built it with a fatal flaw just in case They were to use it for you know What he thought they were going to use it for and it's I think he's he's a really cool character I'm excited to learn a little bit more about him Um and slava that might be a question for you.

Do we learn more about norville later on throughout this book, too? Not enough to satisfy anybody. Uh, and that's not a critique of the author of the book, but we don't learn more about him but He doesn't die We we see him through the end so i'll spoil that because That's really I don't think that's even a spoiler per se He is with us to the end of the book for the reasons you mentioned. Yes.

No, of course not chapter 14 Yeah, yeah chapter 11. He's dead And then and then again in chapter 14, he's killed twice and then he's brought back and then killed again Yeah for the reasons that matt just outlined he's more than an npc We see him at the end of the book because he has that tie To the government and his girl friend lover Whatever she is to him She still needs to be rescued so he can't be killed because she can still complete the project without him just in a longer timeline She's smart enough. Yeah.

Yeah, because that he had that conversation with her. I think right like you can still complete this without norville Well, he said it in front of her to xeris. He's like, oh, yeah, my team can definitely do this Yeah, and then xeris is like that's what I wanted to hear Yeah Uh, but I do think that he's going to be this is my impression Halfway i'm only halfway through the book right that he's going to be the artificer for our group where he's making all the gadgets and gizmos And he's got plenty of experience Yeah, yeah well by chapter 22 jonathan you should know that already I if you're paying attention that's exactly what he does I was trying to be kind to the audience.

Thanks a lot. Okay. Wow You know, it's a spoiler we got to talk about spoiler heavy show this book so book club marriage you're not Two books one body That is uh, richard unfortunate reference that is two books one spine two guys one book If you know, you know, I thought I was done being reminded of those videos Oh Gosh I uh, I want to learn more about jerek I really want to learn more about jerek because in chapter 11 or 12 You learn a little bit about him in a very special way To not spoil anything and that made me really really really want to Learn more because even in the orphanage you meet jerek, right? You go through and then it's just like he leaves the orphanage with jerek And then we don't see him.

We don't talk to him. He's dead or we think he's dead. He went to a special farm For milking For dead freelancers, okay No, this is this is something that is absolutely well done by the author where he uses this uh plot device of Nightmares And it's really wonderfully done.

So we've got you know, occasional flashbacks, which a lot of people have done great But he's using something different with like nightmares and sleep paralysis real-time development that you can use. Yeah. Yeah Yeah, it's pretty cool.

It's pretty pretty. I can't I can't recall anybody else doing it like in that way Because it's it's very it's fresh and it's new and I like it. I like the way that he he uses that Mechanic I guess um of writing.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah What that boss mechanic? I think what you said mad just now that's you put words to what I was thinking the way the story is told is fresh and new and Given that this is nicholas's first published book He hit it out of the park Because you'd imagine an author that's seasoned And this is his you know, third Fourth series he's writing in a holy cow a new way of writing sci-fi.

No, this dude did it on a plane And just knocked it out of the park first book Fantastic. I think it's great so far. Like I said, i've i've glazed this this series and alex as much as I could Um, it's it's super exciting Nicholas did a very good job at least so far with what i've read and i'm super excited to see the rest That seems like a great place to end it for the first 10 chapters here if you've got comments questions or thoughts in terms of what Nick or alex if you're mad, uh did in the book drop them in the comments Let us know what those are.

We'll read them on air, which will be sweet. Yeah But uh, yeah, we can't wait to have him On at the end of the show for a guest recap and discuss this world his bigger picture the ip as a whole Everything that he's thinking about doing So matt and spencer will be along for the whole journey, which is awesome Looking forward to it back any final final, uh final thoughts here before we uh cause a uh a ruckus I was just gonna land the plane jonathan. Just land the plane I just bring a pair.

I am so excited to finish reading this book. I am not kidding This is one of the most exciting books i've i've been able to read in a while and I didn't want to stop but I told myself I had to so that I could get the most out of this and and and get to you guys what my raw reactions instead of Sitting on a couple weeks on and be able to process and theorize and stuff. I mean you're getting raw matt right now raw excellent raw raw milk raw milk Somebody says raw raw, maybe maybe that's matt's thumbnail Well matt i'll tell you this when you get to where Jonathan is right now and just a little bit before You will enjoy the hell out of it.

There was a chapter And roman's drinking a glass of milk He's being tortured, uh with the milk Torture there's roman there's something here's where I won't spoil anything because Even if i'm careful, I might give away too much. There's a moment With roman where he's going through some stuff And it's written in a way where I could not put it down I even stopped in the hallway of my office and finished the 10 minutes that were left in that in that section He was late. I couldn't I just couldn't put it down.

It was really well done a lot of tension and you just can't wait to find out how roman What happens and how roman reacts and what what will he do next a bit of a sander lanche It felt like a very mini sander lanche a casbara lanche it was a casbara lanche and it was Only for that section because everything afterwards gets back to its regular speed towards the end of the book But this moment in the end it was Another chef's kiss to the author. It was really well done. All right, uh, I want to end this way i've decided hot takes one one hot take for the book round robin and then Episodes done i'll go last Or i'll go first either go first.

I'll go i gotta think. All right, go first My hot take is that this isn't dark enough I mean, I don't think that's too much of a hot take. I think we're still super early in it Like we had some darkness parents died I don't think it's gonna turn into as dark as you want But I agree it could potentially be a little bit more despair-esque He wants he wants it to be a gothic style uh Gothic futuristic gothic.

I forget neo-gothic. I forget how cyber gothic Cyber gothic something like that. Yeah, if you go to the episode right here You'll hear what he actually said Um, thanks lava, you're welcome.

All right, and because of that I don't think it's dark enough. That's my hot take next I'm gonna steal yours and I didn't have a hot take because I thought the introduction of the world was done Well, and we'll be able to judge it based on book two three and four with more scrutiny. But this introduction was Flawlessly executed in my opinion, but I do agree with what you're saying.

So i'm going to just Double tap on that that that's my hot take to more grittiness more darkness Not necessarily more pain that roman has to go through or more trauma that we have to Get revealed to us. Maybe we will that's great. But overall if it gets darker and grittier That would be an improvement On already what I think is a really great book my hot take is that roman is too much of an a** That doesn't align with my hot take spencer Get out That's why I said it's a hot take my hot take is there are not enough characters booty cheeks.

Oh Now you get some booty cheeks in it that's true Not enough characters, I don't think not well, let me change not enough likable characters Because even like like spencer said roman's an a** I don't I don't hate roman but I don't love roman It's kind of a douche, right? He's an a**. He's a richard um The likable characters are all gone. So and i'm cautiously optimistic.

I'm cautiously optimistic Yes, i'm cautiously optimistic because what turned me away from the game of thrones? Is all of the characters that I like just kept dying and everybody that I hated stayed I didn't like anybody after And I never read the books So i'm sure they're different but in the in the show I watched all of season one and season two and I was like, this is stupid I don't care about anybody else in the show. So I stopped watching I don't want exactly when sean b died. I was like, well, that's my favorite character Shit, you should have known immediately that he was gonna die just by being him being in it.

I know that's on you That's on me. But still that's on you. Ned stark was cool as f**k and then they killed him and I was mad Anyways, um, I want there to be more likable characters.

I want I want a plucky character I want something that's fun because I mean I like han solo but they added he added a little bit too much han solo to this han solo He's when you say plucky plucky When you say plucky Give us some examples of plucky c3po r2d2 Plucky not necessarily like comic relief, but something that in your party they add value to the party or what the I guess we're keeping it video game a bard add something to the party that has you know That the glue I want glue to keep people together somebody that's fun to be around fun to listen to um, and just have fun with because there is a lot of disparity coming I can tell just because of the way that xerus is the plot how his parents died and stuff like that and how Roman developed into the person that he is so far I can see there's a lot of room of for growth for him to become like the hero of the story and stuff like that or a redemption arc but I want I don't want to hate where i'm at Without somebody that can pick me up and be like it's okay. It's just we're just trotting through the woods We need we need an aethon. I need yeah I need a c3po just somebody who is innocent enough but can still hold their own in the world Obviously, they're not like too out of place, but I want them to I want there to be a little bit more levity.

I know you want it to be darker. I want some levity Because it feels like it's exclusive though. It feels like they can work.

Yes. I I agree I feel like we're in this middle ground right now of where it's like it wants to be darker without any of like Light at the end of the tunnel. He really he's making it darker and darker He's getting the plot to go to like this is going to happen I feel like there's still plenty of bad shit to happen.

Not just to roman not just to dioram Not just to the world. There's a lot of dark stuff to happen coming forward sunshine and rainbows after chapter 10 I don't want sunshine and fucking rainbows I just want to be able to be picked up out of the disparity and see Some a fun side to like roman or something like that. I don't know.

That's my hot take you jonathan. That's my hot take Yeah Well, you'll do you will see a bit of a softer side to roman you'll you'll get to see more of him like the kid that could have been The the kid that could have been the man If the horrible shit didn't happen to him you get to see a little bit of that But just a little bit because the sunshine and happiness on dioram is you know hellfire and really depressing hail So yeah, if I want grim dark i'll just go read warhammer lore and just that's it I want I want some fun So speaking of warhammer lore, I want us to read warhammer at some point So matt i'm gonna task you this is a future I mean i'm gonna go hang out with one of the biggest warhammer fans that I know literally after this So i'll see what uh reading lists you can give me Yeah, yeah, what's the order of well, we can so there's two things we can start in uh in the 40k or we can start in um A warhammer fans are gonna eat me up if they hear this. I don't know the the high fantasy setting of warhammer I can't remember what it's called 40k.

No 40k is 40 000 years into the future 40 000 years of war So that's the like space marines and stuff. No. No i'm saying let's start in the 40k series.

Okay. Yeah, sure That's fine. Uh, because we've got enough high fantasy on the show.

I Uh, did I send you if you want more sci-fi? There's plenty of freaking star wars books that I want you guys to read What's a sci-fi exactly what's a star i'm an idiot anyway revin fuck you just Yes that guy we have to revisit him we talked about that when you were on revvin I literally bought the book on accident because I thought he had it and he touched me He's like hey next time just ask I was like, I thought you had it Not yet order of operations brocco, it's so good so good Um, what was I about to say something? I don't know. Anyway. Oh, oh the warhammer 40k music.

Did I send you that on insta? the guy who's been writing music in the warhammer 40k, uh lore Oh i'm gonna we'll drop a link it's Very fun. I don't even know the lore yet But i'm just like the lore is so like if you want dark jonathan, this is gonna be dark That's heresy Okay, you don't even know the meaning of heresy You you had no idea. I know it's a joke.

I played. Um, One of the games on the computer ages ago donna. We were sitting rts.

Yeah Yeah, it might have been done a war. Yeah, they're on like dawn of war four right now necro Necrons I was the necrons. I was really good with them actually But thanks for joining us for the show, uh glad to have everybody here and Can't wait to get into the halfway mark of this book uh next time and a little bit for Thanks for coming to that This is the last time you'll see jonathan on the show jonathan you're fired You know, it wouldn't be a show if you didn't tell me that yes I had Oh, all right.

See you guys next time. All right. See you guys I have a favor to ask you if you like what we're doing The simplest way to support the show is to hit subscribe In return, we'll keep leveling up and we'll listen to your feedback and read authors that you suggest And of course, we'll take side quests along the way Thank you for joining us and we'll see you next time