Ballot of the Heart: Hickories, The Old Course, and The Meaning We Found in St. Andrews

What happens when you chase the Old Course, and Scotland gives you something even better?

In this episode of The Bag Drop: Untold Stories in Golf, host Matt Considine and cohost Dr. Kevin Moore (a.k.a. “The Professor”) reunite NewClub’s Pilgrimage Three to relive a week in St. Andrews shaped by ballot drama, links golf, hickory clubs, family memories, and the deeper meaning of why golfers return to Scotland in the first place.

The conversation explores the thrill and heartbreak of balloting for the Old Course, Steve Pease’s storybook late tee time and birdies on 1 and 18, Hilary’s first true links golf experience, and why Kingarrock Hickories may have stolen the show. Along the way, the group reflects on golf’s civility, creativity, fellowship, and the feeling that even when you do not get exactly what you wanted, golf somehow gives you what you needed.

The conversation dives into:

• Why St. Andrews feels more like a pilgrimage than a trip
• The emotion of missing the Old Course ballot and leaving fulfilled
• Steve Pease’s unforgettable Old Course finish
• Why Hickory Golf became a surprise highlight
• The creativity, simplicity, and soul of links golf
• What American golf can still learn from Scottish golf culture

Thanks to our Pilgrimage Three crew and esteemed NewClub Members for joining us and sharing their stories: Hilary, Jimmy, Steve, Tyler, Ananth, Michael, Dean, and Bill. Your chapter is now part of The Pilgrimage Tradition, and we're all richer because of it. 

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Chapters

00:00 Introduction
 03:33 Professor’s Fact
 05:48 Why Scotland feels like a pilgrimage
 10:11 Pilgrimage Three reunion begins
 11:08 Steve’s storybook Old Course round
 20:10 Hilary on first-time links golf and the Old Course
 22:44 Missing the ballot and wanting another crack at it
 31:45 House of Gods, surprise guests, and Adamson Links
 39:30 Why hickories at Kingarrock stole the show
 51:02 What Scotland gives back to golfers
 57:25 Lightning round for the 2026 pilgrims
 01:00:20 Leave with a full heart

What is The Bag Drop?

The Bag Drop features weekly stories from the culture, community, and characters shaping golf today. Produced by NewClub Golf Society, each episode blends authenticity and expert insights for passionate golfers at all levels. Special guests from clubs, courses, and across the changing landscape join us for thoughtful, in-depth discussions on all things golf.

What is NewClub?

Founded in 2017, NewClub is the premier private golf society in the United States. It blends the community and access of a private club with the variety and affordability of public golf. Members enjoy thousands of reserved tee times, competitions, and events at exceptional partner courses across our local chapters, along with signature trips and exclusive perks. NewClub is revolutionizing golf membership, making the game more meaningful for those who love it.

Creators and Guests

Host

Matt Considine

Founder of NewClub and our resident feel player. Matt’s junior golf career led him to the University of Akron where he met our co-host. During his junior year, Matt Studied abroad in Ireland and discovered golf societies. Subsequent trips to Scotland fed his passion for the history, ideals, and culture of accessible, affordable, and sustainable golf, a concept he would later bring to the U.S. with NewClub. Known for his interviewing style, quick wit, and compelling storytelling, Matt brings thoughtful, reflective conversations to The Bag Drop. His professional journey before NewClub included multiple leadership positions in growth-stage startups, where he managed teams responsible for more than $250 million in revenue. Matt actively gives back to the game as a Board Member of the First Tee of Akron and past chair of the Evans Scholar Foundation. Proudly based in his hometown of Akron, Ohio, Matt finds inspiration in family life with his wife, their three children, and their golf dog, Gypsy.

Host

The Professor

NewClub's Chief Ambassador and every golf sicko's favorite educator. Kevin is a thoughtful and deeply curious host. His studied, constructivist approach adds intellectual enrichment and balance to the show. As a professor of Math Education at the University of Georgia, Kevin's background in applied mathematics and cognitive psychology uniquely informs his insights on golf strategy and performance. Originally from Ohio, Kevin was a Division I collegiate golfer at the University of Akron, where his passion for understanding mathematical thinking began. After earning his doctorate from Arizona State University, he combined his analytical expertise with his love for golf by co-founding Golf Blueprint, an organization aimed at helping golfers optimize their games through data-driven strategies. Kevin enjoys balancing deep philosophical discussions with simple pleasures, such as indulging his sweet tooth, cheering on college football, and spending relaxed evenings with his friends, his wife, and their beloved dog, Nole.

What is The Bag Drop: Untold Stories in Golf?

Weekly stories from the communities and characters shaping the game. The Bag Drop blends thoughtful, honest perspectives of Matt Considine (Founder of NewClub) and Dr. Kevin Moore ("The Professor") with expert insights for passionate golfers at every level. Produced by NewClub and supported by our members, each episode welcomes guests from clubs, courses, and the lesser-known corners of the golf world for thoughtful discussions on all things golf and life.

Founded in 2017, NewClub is the first of its kind golf society in the United States; blending the community and access of a private club with the variety and affordability more typical of public golf. Members enjoy thousands of reserved tee times, competitions, and events at exceptional partner courses across our local chapters, along with signature trips and exclusive perks. NewClub is on a mission to revolutionize golf membership, making the game more meaningful for everyone who loves it.

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Matt Considine (00:02.476)
Welcome to the New Club Bag Drop, Untold Stories in Golf. I'm your host and founder of New Club, Matt Considine, here with our co-host and dear friend, the professor. Professor, it is wonderful to see you this morning, sir.

The Professor (00:18.054)
Well, it's even a more wonderful morning because we get to talk about one of our favorite topics today on the episode.

Matt Considine (00:25.078)
We gotta be careful with the intro because when we bring up Scotland or St. Andrews, our guests don't get to say anything. We just kind of go a little too long on our own stuff. But yeah, we enjoy talking about the home of golf on this show.

The Professor (00:29.861)
you

The Professor (00:39.25)
I was recently at a friend's wedding. Congratulations to Jaime and Maggie on their wonderful nuptials and a wonderful Argentine wedding. If you haven't been to one, I strongly suggest you get down to an Argentine wedding. They do it right. It makes me just very disappointed in how we do it in the States. But I ran into someone who's going to Scotland this coming summer. And of course that led to a probably a 45 minute conversation while everybody else is like, would these people shut up about Scotland golf?

Matt Considine (01:08.696)
There is a, those that know, know, right? And after you've been, you're like instantly bonded, not just with the people you go, but anybody that aspires to go or anybody that's been or there's something there. It truly is, I think a reason we call it the pilgrimage here at New Club is we all want

to be there because we played this game our whole lives and it gives it so much more meaning when you've been there. So we're doing it again. We're doing a reunion show for our eight pilgrims who went on the 2025 edition of the pilgrimage with New Club. And we've done this twice before, professor. You were with me for the first go around. You were in Argentina for our second, but last week, I got to tell you, man, it was, even though there's a little bit more distance from the group,

that we talked to, the memories felt vivid, things started to come back to them. Number one was an interesting discovery of this trip and it was mostly Chicago members, because that's where we grew out of as a club, it's our local chapter. number two, that was expansion in a lot of ways, because I think we learned that we bit off more than we could chew with the itinerary, but it was also.

mostly members from Atlanta. if when you look at this crew and who went over in 2025, it was Northeast Ohio represented with a good bit of family members in there. So this is a very awkward show for Maddie boy. Cause at any moment, my family could just flip on me and start telling you things I don't want our lovely audience to know. So I got to be careful, but that was, I think the year that we started really honing what matters most.

and understand the pieces of the pilgrimage that it should always be fresh or always new as we like to say both at new club and our friends overseas at the new golf club. So just so excited to talk to these guys. Before we get there, professor, I we've both been a little, you know, holiday slumps, new year transitions. I don't forget about routine, my friend. I am not jumping in front of the professors. Prophontocations, the professors facts.

Matt Considine (03:29.91)
What do you got for us today? Maybe keep it short, but give us some something to get our brains going.

The Professor (03:33.01)
Okay, bitch. I got a short one. First, let me ask you, what's your your go to energy drink? What do you do? You coffee guy? Are you a monster? You just electrolytes? What do you what do you hit up?

Matt Considine (03:47.978)
Stimulants and I have a long history that we're figuring out, but it's caffeine and it's coffee, but I'm back to really one cup a day before 11 a.m. That's really what I've reduced it to, which has been good.

The Professor (04:01.458)
Nice, nice. I'm obviously a coffee snob, know, love Mike morning long black and then espresso in the afternoon. But of course being down in Argentina back on urban maté, you know, I a long, long run on that. I'm back on that. So I thought, you know, in honor of Maggie and Jaime, I'd bring up an urban maté fact. It's a really interesting plant. It will not grow by just planting the seeds. All right. So they learned this and they realized like, okay, birds eat the seeds, digest them. Then through the excrement.

that's when the seeds are at a place where they can actually grow. So actually it'll grow the mate plant, which they make herbamate from. They actually have to go through a whole process that replicates that where they have to wash the seeds, let them sit in warm water, wash them again, so on and so forth to actually plant and grow the seed of which they make their lovely Argentine caffeine reliant drink down there.

Matt Considine (04:56.438)
I will never look at it. I enjoy an herbamate if I was to order them infrequently, but I'm never gonna look at it the same way now knowing the excrement part of what you just described. So thanks for ruining that for all of us.

The Professor (05:06.482)
And it.

Hey, if you're drinking the can stuff, that's totally different. We're talking about the actual plant, like the true experience where you pour. It's got a whole process of dumping into a wooden cup and you shake it up and you do this and you dump hot water in it. If you ever see an Argentine walking around with a big thermos in a pouch, that's what they got. They travel with their urban Monte. They drink it all day.

Matt Considine (05:15.906)
The real deal.

Matt Considine (05:28.526)
That's what it is. No kidding.

I gotta hear more about your Argentine adventures or we gotta get Jaime back on this show.

The Professor (05:36.804)
we should get him back on there. Let's explain the wedding culture. Cause it's just 12 hours of dancing. There's excuses for food in between as a break, but you go till seven, eight in the morning and just you dance from seven to seven.

Matt Considine (05:48.498)
That's incredible. Setting the stage before we get to our special guest today, I want to read some quotes. Last group we had, I went back to the original letter I sent about this whole event for New Club. Our only international fixture, our consistent international fixture and why. You can go back and listen to that episode. I thought it was great. But one thing I did for this morning's prep, Kevin, is I listened back.

to our original recording with the first pilgrimage. And I just had, I pulled out a couple of quotes and I want to share them before we get to this group. David Schaeffer, pilgrimage one. I now I understand why new club exists. I understand why the new golf club exists. I'm connected to both. Paul Wellman, it didn't matter who I sat next to at the pub. The conversation always just flowed about golf, about life, even though we didn't know each other prior.

That was Paul Wellman. Steven Toira. I'm not going to remember what clubs I played with. I'll just remember being there. His clubs never showed up. That was just funny to me. I forgot about that. Jen Powers. I don't even think I was golfing. I was just connecting to the ground beneath my feet to Scotland and this game that I love. That was probably my favorite. Tony Caffanigro sitting upstairs at the new golf club overlooking one and 18.

That's when it really hit me. We are part of something with this golf society that we started in Chicago. It made my vice captaincy have meaning. It meant so much more to me after this. It is humbling and exciting. And to now think about where we're going to go next. That's pretty powerful to me and what I do. And then Paul, I got Paul's and then just their group consensus. This was, think Captain McCartney was part of this first group. What he said was just don't rush it. Let the place come to you. And

The Professor (07:30.364)
powerful.

Matt Considine (07:45.036)
And that's, think, so true of St. Andrews. So we'll get to our group. This is going to be very illuminate. It's going to be fun. There's going to be some laughs. But if you're a member of New Club and you're looking at some checking off some things for 2026, we do have a few spots left for the 2026 pilgrimage. So I'll mention that at the top of the show. There's some freshness to it. Always new, as I said, but the lineup is.

Michael Considine (07:59.122)
Mm.

Matt Considine (08:11.5)
You know, gonna make old Tom Blush as it always does. You're playing everything in St. Andrew's, the new, the Eden Jubilee, balloting for the old More Days in 2026. And we'll get to why with this group. But then you'll add in some of our favorites like Crayole Golf Society, like Kings Barnes next year, and a couple little surprises throughout the week. But yeah, that's in the mobile app for everybody listening and without.

Well, I got to thank our friends at Titleist. It's 2026, Professor. Listen, I've been thinking about my iron game, getting ready for the season. There's going to be some goals specifically attached to that. So if you are doing the same thing that I am and you want to get some more precision, some more control, some more feel in 26, definitely get fit with the Titleist certified fitters. The T100s are for...

For me, that's exactly what I was looking for is more control, more precision, but the T150s, you know, they have the same feel, but you're going to increase some speed. You're going to get a little bit more distance and forgiveness. The T200s, if distance is the priority, I definitely recommend checking out the T200s because they, you don't sacrifice trajectory with those T200s. You're going to get more distance, but they still have that launch. And the best part about the fitting process when it comes to Titleist irons, in my opinion,

is being able to try them all and being able to find a blended set. can't, I personally don't have blend set, but I've watched so many fittings now that I see how important that is to get that gapping right, to make sure you find that five miles per hour between each club. Nobody does that better than Titleist. So thanks to our friends at Titleist. Check them out in their whole new line of T-Series irons over at Titleist.com. Let's get to the show.

The Professor (09:40.625)
Mm-hmm.

Matt Considine (10:11.992)
Bill, Michael, Steve, Hillary, Dr. Mayers coming in at the start of the show. Thank you all for being here. This is very exciting for the professor and I, we get the geek out about St. Andrews, but for you, get to relive your adventures overseas. So I'm gonna start us with the guy that ended the pilgrimage. We always kind of start this thing with.

Dr. Dean Mayors (10:13.836)
All right,

Matt Considine (10:39.214)
The travel story or two I'm going to the end the the end is now the beginning of this show Steve Pease my man Tell us I've heard a lot of stories about You know the old course and the majesty of it and the magic that happens I don't think I've heard more of a Cinderella s story than yours Can you start us off here with telling us about your day at the old course?

Steve (11:08.173)
course and yeah, it's a pleasure to join and see all of your smiling faces again. I'm a long time listener, first time video podcaster here. So it's, it's a pleasure. I mean, the entire the entire trip end to end was was what I guess, Hillary and myself and Jimmy in the pub afterwards, we're calling it storybook, you know, after the round at St. Andrews. And the day started, just like any other, I guess, at

during the pilgrimage, we went out, I believe, on Eden. And I had the honor and pleasure of playing with Bill for the first time, I believe. I'm just watching him ball strike the hell out of it. And I know, Matt, that this is a Titleist podcast, but his Jerry Barbers were just dialed in all day long. So.

Matt Considine (11:56.182)
Hey, listen, Jerry, you know, our friends at Titus, I'm going to talk to about the design of the Jerry Barbers. need to, that's not a gimmick. Those work.

Hilary Considine (11:57.87)
you

Michael Considine (12:04.408)
.

They're shape proof.

The Professor (12:10.193)
You

Steve (12:10.971)
Shank proof. Unfortunately, I was playing Titleist tonight and then they were not shank proof that morning. But it was great. was like, I had a little inspo watching Bill flag shot after shot. Yeah, we went in for a lunch after I put up like I guess just smooth 91 and everyone else had a lovely, including myself, had a lovely afternoon planned.

Hilary Considine (12:18.169)
you

Steve (12:39.323)
Like a step back in time, truly. mean, if you can go back in time any more than being on or near the old course. I can't remember the exact name of the nine hole where it was like Kilkarny or Kilarnak. can't.

Hilary Considine (12:51.097)
Michael Considine (12:51.877)
Ken Garrett.

Steve (12:54.213)
Thank you, Michael. Appreciate it. So I guess I just, we, like everyone else, watched Bill go out and be able to win the lottery and make it onto the old. And that was kind of the thing all week long is like, let's enter the lottery. There's like the specter and possibility of playing the old. Even if you don't get on the old, it's still going to be an amazing trip is what everyone would tell themselves. And that is, that holds true. It's not, it is.

Dr. Dean Mayors (13:14.54)
you

Steve (13:24.571)
You can still get on the old course, obviously. It's just a whether or not you play it. So Sundays, you can, you know, go up to the Russics, walk Granny Clark's wine, get on the course, go hang at the Himalayas, which we did. And Tyler was being anothenized so badly that we made him put left-handed on the back nine of the Himalayas. And he still won.

But you can, you have proximity to the old course and it's the center of the town and it's the center of the golf world. And even if you don't play it, it would not have really diminished the chip trip to a great degree. might've been a little bit disappointing, but we're sitting there at lunch after our morning round and, Andy White sits down next to me and I was, I think Tyler was off like, I don't know what he was doing. Tyler is my roommate throughout the week.

And Andy was like, how'd you get on? That's what he said to me, which is like the Scottish way of saying, you how did the round go? And of course you're not supposed to respond with the number that you shot, but like how much fun you had. And I was like, I had a blast. was great watching Bill. And he's like, are you looking forward to the afternoon? And I said, you know, I'm just going to go down to the pavilion and see what happens. And he's like, what do mean by that? And I said, I've been in, I guess you could call it unlucky all week long on the

the digital daily ballot. And I just figured it couldn't hurt to see if I could sneak on the old, like, or at the very least enjoy basking in the history and ambiance and being near it, like I said, is what it's all about with this trip. It's the center of everything. So he strongly advised me not to do that. He said,

You know, that sounds great. I would say your chances are not really nonexistent. They're very minuscule. He was keeping it real with me. He said, but what I could do is Tyler wants to go down and I think Tyler wanted to enter the ballot for Saturday. And this was like, what Thursday, something like that. And he, he said, I'll put in a good word. So like, that's something I could build off of. was like, great.

Hilary Considine (15:19.799)
you

Steve (15:47.599)
So he took myself and Tyler down to the pavilion. Tyler entered the ballot as he had done a few times before. And both he and I don't think ever finished in double digits. We were always in the kind of high 90s, 100s. So maybe it was double digits, but as far as the queue, like your position in the ballot line. So Tyler enters, his ballot goes off and joins the rest of the crew.

As he should have done, I should have probably done for an amazing afternoon nine and step back in time for a hickory round. I just couldn't, I don't know. I don't know if I could have really lived with myself if I wouldn't have given it one last shot to get on. And at the St. Andrew's Pavilion, your options are limited. You can kind of listen to gregarious Minnesotans boast about how they.

were the only one in their group of 12 to get on and you could have like an old Tom ale and you could go to the practice green. So that's what I did. Then I FaceTime my wife and Marion, the lovely pavilion attendant came up and tapped me on the shoulder while I was talking to my wife about how, you know, the day was going and how amazing the trip had been. And she said, you're off at 540. So I was like, I didn't even know what to say. I, and stop me if I'm just waxing here.

Hilary Considine (17:11.287)
you

Matt Considine (17:15.438)
Well, let me first compliment you with the best Scottish accent we've ever had on this show.

Steve (17:19.131)
It's very Mrs. Doubtfire.

The Professor (17:19.75)
That was solid.

Michael Considine (17:20.482)
That's pretty good.

Hilary Considine (17:21.237)
Mm-hmm. Mastered it.

Matt Considine (17:23.431)
I will accelerate you here, Steve. What'd you make on one? What'd you make on 18?

Steve (17:29.797)
Bird bird.

The Professor (17:31.825)
Oof.

Matt Considine (17:31.874)
I don't know anyone that's done that. mean, Kevin.

Michael Considine (17:33.421)
It was the most impressive feat I saw on the entire trip, was seeing Steve Burdi 1 in 18.

Steve (17:33.627)
3-3.

Steve (17:38.265)
The best, yeah.

Matt Considine (17:40.408)
And you guys saw it, tell us about, so Michael take that. You guys all saw it? You got to witness this guy in the epicenter, literal epicenter of the world of golf, one and 18 at the old course with the backdrop. You guys see him do that? Did he look calm? Did he look like Tiger 2000?

Hilary Considine (17:40.499)
Incredible.

Dr. Dean Mayors (17:56.139)
you

Michael Considine (17:57.293)
Very calm. think Alex and I were in the car with Andy and Steve. We actually dropped you guys off. So we saw you on one, didn't see you sink a putt for birdie, but then the whole group returned that evening to see you finish on 18, which was so special. But he stripes the drive down the middle of Fairway and just sticks an iron shot to what do you think? 10 feet, 12 feet and sunk the putt on 18.

Steve (18:21.819)
On one or 18? Yeah, it was maybe 15 feet, but it was right on line with the flag from what I could see. I mean, it was in the gloaming. You couldn't really tell. But that was definitely, ha. Yeah, we don't talk about 17 in this tale, Bill.

Michael Considine (18:31.318)
Yeah. Tigeresque.

William Howard Considine (18:33.639)
I like just road shot on 17.

Michael Considine (18:38.648)
Yeah.

The Professor (18:39.058)
Look at Bill taking it to 17.

Matt Considine (18:41.88)
Take it.

Steve (18:42.459)
Um, yeah, 17 was like, I think a pickup six, but, um, that was the best part. Like that was the, the, best surprise was seeing, um, like all of the pilgrims lines on the, on the, you know, the road hole wall. Um, rooting me on and seeing them on 17. Yeah. Super cool.

Hilary Considine (19:01.046)
Well, we had your location. We had your location. were on our way back and I think we were all in the car trying to rush back knowing that there was a chance we could catch you. So we were all basically running to catch you on 17 to see you off on 18, which was amazing.

Steve (19:19.363)
Yeah, and that made it, honestly. The fact that you all, or half of you at least, got to come out on course. I think Michael was behind the green. I standing under the shadow of Bill, like, trying to get up and down on the road hole. And it did not go well. But it was so amazing. I was, like, shocked to see everyone there. It was so cool.

Matt Considine (19:41.53)
I blame most of my junior career, Steve, on being in the shadow of Bill trying to get something up and down. I felt like I was hitting ricochets off walls a lot. Hillary, talk about, you got onto the old as well. Have you ever played a golf course quite like that? You've played a lot of places, you've lived a lot of places, but what makes the old course so different from others?

Hilary Considine (20:10.91)
Yeah, I mean, it was incredible. So going to Scotland, that was my first experience with links Golf. Total newfound love for it. And I was incredibly nervous. Like, just knowing that we got the ballot, we were going to play the old, I was shaking on the first tee. I honestly like think I blacked out.

Michael Considine (20:38.775)
You

Hilary Considine (20:39.925)
And just knowing that I like did it, I was so proud and I felt so lucky to be there with like my family. And it was just honestly such a life highlight. I think on the first hole, once I made it over the brim and putted out, there was just this overwhelming sense of relief. I was like, my gosh, I can do this.

I did the first hole.

And I don't know, I think it's just such a magical place, like you're almost teleported.

Dr. Dean Mayors (21:19.035)
Put these on the steps you can take them if you go down.

Matt Considine (21:20.046)
There was a that we've always heard on the show about the shaking that occurs when you are on the first tee and 18 and everybody's kind of said the same thing. Like, yeah, I've never like I'm not playing for anything. This isn't competitive, but I'm shaking. I think that puts Steve's achievement and really a context for me of like, you know, burying that putt, walking off 18 when you just know you're at the origin of this whole thing, the whole game.

Dr. Dean Mayors (21:25.572)
Dr. Dean Mayors (21:47.119)
asked.

Matt Considine (21:49.675)
It is pretty cool, really cool.

William Howard Considine (21:51.817)
Well, Hillary hit a perfect drive. She might have been nervous, but her swing was smooth. It was right down the middle. And then I think Jimmy pulled out a four iron and almost hit it into the right in front of the green. The two of them were off. We all were there watching. I was really thinking that Jimmy might propose on the first tee, but we were waiting.

Hilary Considine (22:13.46)
you

Matt Considine (22:16.214)
We were all waiting. We were all waiting back home for that. I'll get to the I'll get to the the golf's golf's true love story. We'll get to that by the end of this, Hillary. I'm a little disappointed Jimmy's not here, but it's not all, you know, a Cinderella story like Mr. P's Michael and and a not who is not with us. I believe you are the first two and Dean.

Hilary Considine (22:16.308)
You

Michael Considine (22:17.621)
Yep.

Hilary Considine (22:21.85)
What a love story.

Dr. Dean Mayors (22:27.089)
you

Matt Considine (22:44.652)
I don't believe Dean played the old course. Dean, welcome. I know you're getting situated there, but were you able to get on the old course this go-around? Okay, so my question...

Dr. Dean Mayors (22:51.789)
not this go-around. But I got to play it before, as you recall, with you and Bill and Ronnie Denny several years ago.

Matt Considine (22:59.338)
One of the most special rounds of my life. It was awesome. Well, I'm gonna point to Michael first. Let's talk about that disappointment. Because we've had almost 60 people, if you include our first big trip over to Scotland, and you guys are the first to not get on the old. Which in itself is kind of wild, but Jimmy collected some data and showed me very clearly that...

These were the record weeks the week you guys were there was one of two record weeks For the ballot because of the positioning with the open and that everybody now can do it digitally and get there if they win it So you your probabilities were totally different than the other groups, which was really eye-opening interesting, but let's talk about the disappointment I mean you're there you want to play the old dance with the old lady as they say and you don't get it like how did that feel?

The Professor (23:54.035)
Hold on a second, I feel like your brother is relishing in this moment right now, Michael. He just like.

Michael Considine (23:59.094)
I could go so many directions here, Kevin, but I will say there was some heartbreak for the good Dr. Dean and I. When you're there and you see how special just the atmosphere is, yeah, you're just pumped. You want to get on that old course just like everybody else that sets foot there. But I think the experience, like Steve said earlier, is just so amazing as a whole.

Matt Considine (24:01.656)
Hold on.

Michael Considine (24:28.553)
that we were okay. I I think it was so great just for our group to have the luck we did have. Five out of eight of us getting on. And the way Steve got on, the way Tyler got on, Hillary, Jimmy, and then of course, Dad. Dad had probably the best weather day of anybody. Where he played the old course in what, 80 degree weather and sunshine. But what it did is it...

put kind of a fire in you to say, I want to go back and I want to get on the old course. So it's not giving up or saying, hey, yeah, we're heartbroken, but Anath and I, and I'm sure Dean, you feel the same way. Hey, let's get back there. Let's get on the old. Yeah.

Dr. Dean Mayors (25:09.615)
I want another crack at it, absolutely.

Matt Considine (25:13.196)
Yeah, it's I think one of the misconceptions maybe or tragedies with the old course in itself is that people do feel like it's a bucket list. It's a once in a lifetime thing. But I think all of us that have played it know really the mystique of it. What makes it special is that you should aspire to go back again and again and again. And it was a reason that we changed.

the structure of the Pilgrimage that people that went on prior ones can now go because we were hearing that. were like, guys, you guys have a standing opportunity. I want to go, I got to go try it again. played seven all wrong or I just didn't, I got to embrace that. it's kind of always evolving. It's always different when you play it. Dean, how'd you deal with the disappointment yourself? I mean, you were roommates with Ananth and I've been on enough golf trips

with knots to know there was top shelf liquor in your room. I know that would be true. So was it the 25 year aged scotch that you used to cope?

Dr. Dean Mayors (26:14.618)
I just... I just want...

Hilary Considine (26:15.772)
Thank you.

The Professor (26:20.722)
You

Dr. Dean Mayors (26:24.273)
Yeah, well, you I do have some favorite memories of Scotland and St. Andrews and number one, obviously the golf and the friendship, but the fish and chips and of course the whiskey. And Anant is a great guy, a great, you couldn't have paired us better as far as roommates. It actually happened to be the place everybody gathered for pizza one night because it was late. And Anant showed up.

with this bottle of Scotch that I did not, whiskey that I did not expect to have in our room. And he just started pouring after whenever we'd go before dinner or what have you. And we did finish that bottle by the time the week was out. So yeah, we did enjoy our partnership very much. As far as disappointment, I didn't feel that disappointed. I got to play a lot of golf with a lot of good people, classic Looney's golf and.

There were other places, as you well know, that I thoroughly enjoyed during the course of the week. So there wasn't that much disappointment really.

Matt Considine (27:28.462)
Bill, father, you have been to St. Andrews more than anyone here. Aside from the old course, because we know that changes, but I would like to hear how this round was maybe different than the ones you've had there in the past. But you're also a member of the New Golf Club, which is common. When we picked our name, I didn't think this would ever have

William Howard Considine (27:31.637)
Yes.

Matt Considine (27:54.528)
enough confusion that you know people would but there's enough people that know both new club here and the new golf club that is but you're also a member of the new golf club and have been over with me to to visit to play in the town matches but my question is around the town and all these years that you've been able to go through st. Andrews i'm curious what do you feel is timeless about that place and and what has

quietly changed over the years. Are there things that you feel are different about St. Andrews now than when you first, you know, were there 30-some-plus years ago?

William Howard Considine (28:32.35)
Well, as you said, this is my fifth trip to the home of golf. And every time that I'm blessed with the opportunity to go there, I'm reminded about the values of the game that we all enjoy. And the reason you get reminded is because of the people that you interact with in St. Andrews. They know how to, as Steve said, they don't want to know about your score.

They want to know about the enjoyment you had, the men and women that you were able to interact with on the course. They love to hear stories about your conversation with your caddies. And it's a real rich experience, quite honestly. And every trip I've made, I come back and it's a better trip. Three of those trips have been associated with the new club.

every time the fellowship that comes out of that and getting to know people like Ronnie Denny and the people at the club, the New Golf Club, you can't put words to describe it. You really can. You just let that kind of soak into your heart and you understand that how fortunate you are that you're getting that experience. In terms of the city itself, I've been there enough now that

I know which alleys to cut through to shorten my walk to the course. We do do a lot of walking. I know when we were over there for the town matches, I think one day I actually had 40,000 steps. That was one of my records. And it just is again, things you can't really again put in words, but I'm looking forward to doing it again. And even my round, was able to play this year on the old course.

I bogeyed the first hole. I was just a little too excited. But then I kind of got rolling and I had a chance to shoot my age. But number 15, I found the wrong sand trap and I ended up coming in a little higher than that. But again, it wasn't about the score. It was about the three men I got to know that we played with. They all had roots to Puerto Rico. One worked in Washington, D.C. The other worked down in the Charlotte area and the other was from Puerto Rico.

William Howard Considine (30:57.139)
And wouldn't you know it, we ran into them afterwards at the pub and they were buying drinks for the whole Consonant clan. So, you know, those are the kinds of things that you remember. I was very on my round at the old course. had my wife, Becky, your mom, she was with me. She was reading my putz and Michael's wife, Alex, who was eight months pregnant was out there walking and trying to make sure I was.

using my Jerry Barbers the right way that day. again, great trip. And anybody that hasn't done it yet, you've got to get on the list because you're going to come back with all kinds of stories. And I'm surprised I haven't heard a couple of stories yet about the house of God and a few other kinds of things that played out during our trip.

Michael Considine (31:29.297)
That's right.

The Professor (31:42.738)
you

Matt Considine (31:45.955)
House of God sounds interesting. I don't know. Anyone want to take that one?

Michael Considine (31:50.391)
I could take it. I'll comment for the good doctor that's not on the phone with us today. But for anybody staying in Edinburgh leading into their trip for a night or two, Dr. Murthy would highly recommend a place called House of Gods, which is a pretty unique place to stay, but a cool vibe that we all got to visit and experience for people that don't want that same adventure. There is the Intercontinental that is a little softer tone and

Steve (31:56.347)
Thank

Michael Considine (32:20.848)
We'd recommend both.

Matt Considine (32:23.754)
We already have a lot of religious undertones with the name of the pilgrimage. we going with House of Gods as our recommendation. Now we're really...

Dr. Dean Mayors (32:31.792)
That may have been anything but the house of God.

Michael Considine (32:33.731)
All right, they make a good martini.

Steve (32:34.265)
Psst.

Matt Considine (32:36.046)
I'll check out reviews. I'll check out reviews after the call. Professor, you get in here. Who do you want to hear from? Who do you want to?

The Professor (32:36.37)
There we go

Hilary Considine (32:38.157)
Yeah, it's not five star.

The Professor (32:42.962)
I always love just listening to these pilgrimage reflections because it just it always reminds me. I don't think there's any place like St. Andrews in terms of the stories that are coming out camaraderie. How much is about the golf but also not the golf. The fact people can just walk with you during your round. The fact that you go there you want to play the old course that's the one course you want to play and if you don't get to play it you walk away be like hey that's fine like I'm okay with that. I got to do

Hilary Considine (32:43.183)
you

The Professor (33:10.322)
all these other experiences. mean, I don't think anything else can replicate that. But I do want to turn this back to golf a little bit. And Hillary, you brought up this is your first time playing links golf, right? Could you talk a little bit about what stood out to you as, you know, different, similar? What did you think about it? You what was your takeaway after playing, you know, maybe your first round or two of true links golf?

Hilary Considine (33:20.228)
Right.

Hilary Considine (33:31.79)
Yeah, honestly, I didn't know what to expect fully. I was a little bit nervous, but after the first few holes, I really appreciated it loved it. I honestly found that I could probably have left at least eight of my clubs in the States because I was basically using just a putter or a hybrid the entire time.

Dr. Dean Mayors (33:50.447)
Thank you.

Hilary Considine (33:59.758)
But I really loved it. mean, the ground is so firm. And I mean, the ball rolls forever. I think one of the things as a female going into the trip, I was a little bit nervous, honestly, because I hadn't played that many rounds of consecutive golf since college. And then I'm going over there and playing all of these amazing courses.

The Professor (34:22.662)
Mm-hmm.

Hilary Considine (34:27.63)
Like, can I keep up and how is it going to be over there as a female? And I just loved it. I felt so welcomed and like loved by everyone and really cheered on. The one thing I just can't say highly enough about is the fact of the forward tees not being referred to as

the women's tees

The Professor (34:58.194)
Mm-hmm.

Hilary Considine (35:00.331)
I love that because here in the States, it's always referred to as the women's tees, but over there, they're so accepting and the forward tees, both men and female play off of that. So things like that, that I wasn't fully expecting, but really appreciate it.

Old Tom Morris (35:17.336)
was very disappointed there, Hillary. I thought you were going to and the ingredient with the people, couldn't speak anything more highly off. So it's very, very disappointing. You know, just suddenly.

Utter Legend (35:17.352)
was very disappointed there, Hilary. I thought you were going to say Andy and Graham are the people you couldn't speak anything more highly of. So it's very, very disappointing. You know, just suddenly the forward tease. So you put the forward tease above us. What on earth is going on?

Dr. Dean Mayors (35:17.711)
Thank

Michael Considine (35:24.304)
Hey guys!

William Howard Considine (35:25.589)
you

Matt Considine (35:27.074)
Hahaha!

The Professor (35:27.57)
Ha

Hilary Considine (35:29.229)
Perfect timing.

William Howard Considine (35:33.51)
Yeah.

Michael Considine (35:33.604)
Ha ha!

Matt Considine (35:36.556)
Welcome welcome Graham. He always knows how to make an entrance. Welcome, Grant Dalton. Welcome Andy white our

Hilary Considine (35:36.813)
Good to see you, Grav.

Dr. Dean Mayors (35:40.687)
You

Utter Legend (35:42.884)
I was like, this is amazing, I'm coming at the right time, we're gonna get a bit of praise and Hillary goes for the forward tease. Fantastic.

Old Tom Morris (35:43.285)
This is amazing. I'm coming at the right time.

Michael Considine (35:49.122)
You

Matt Considine (35:49.326)
Well, judging by the record books of our third pilgrimage now, we might be moving the old Tom team led by Andy White to the forward tees completely because there has been domination by you, Graham, in this the competitive element of the program.

Utter Legend (36:06.972)
Well, would say domination by my excellent playing team. You know, that's that's it. They're the guys that do the hard work. You know, the only time that I ever play is in the Hickory Challenge and we've lost that every time. clearly I'm I'm a non playing captain and Andy is the is the reverse. So that's that's that's the way to continue the the victory of the young Tom. So I take my hat off to to you all. And I also want to wish you all a happy new year. I hope you're all well.

Congratulations Michael on your baby. We were in the pre-stage so it's great to see the pictures and everything like that. It's been lovely. that pre? Great. Not that pre. Well, well, well, yeah, okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. Certainly wasn't, was, okay, we were in in-between. But I'm delighted to see everything and I hope everyone is well. It's nice to see you all.

Michael Considine (36:44.291)
He has.

Old Tom Morris (36:45.887)
Not that pretty, Graham. Not that pretty.

Michael Considine (36:49.559)
Right. Right up to the 11th hour.

Matt Considine (36:50.094)
Ha

Michael Considine (37:03.353)
Thank you, so good to see you guys.

William Howard Considine (37:03.359)
Great to see you here too.

Dr. Dean Mayors (37:04.911)
Good to see you. And thanks again for being such gracious hosts during the week that we were there.

The Professor (37:04.978)
Happy New Year.

Hilary Considine (37:05.453)
Great to see you.

Old Tom Morris (37:11.918)
It's an absolute pleasure to have you over.

Dr. Dean Mayors (37:12.717)
especially at the new club.

Utter Legend (37:16.07)
No, we were delighted. We had a great time. The only issue is, I'm sorry that you had to spend time with Dylan, but we've fired him now. it's not, I'm joking. Dylan is still part of the team. He's just in New Zealand.

Old Tom Morris (37:16.289)
We were delighted. We had a great time.

Matt Considine (37:16.344)
The I-

Michael Considine (37:25.397)
no. no.

William Howard Considine (37:26.805)
See you guys.

Dr. Dean Mayors (37:28.409)
haha

William Howard Considine (37:33.781)
You guys probably heard too that...

Old Tom Morris (37:33.855)
He just hasn't received the letter yet.

Michael Considine (37:34.332)
good.

Utter Legend (37:36.048)
Yeah. It's a long way away to get the Royal Mail to.

Michael Considine (37:36.847)
The pink slip.

Dr. Dean Mayors (37:37.327)
Hahaha

William Howard Considine (37:38.729)
You were such good hosts that, you were such good hosts when we got back to the States, Jimmy proposed to Hillary and they're going to get married in October.

Old Tom Morris (37:39.753)
to get the right whale too.

Old Tom Morris (37:48.843)
Congratulations, that's amazing. yeah. And you think, and still the highlight is the four.

Utter Legend (37:50.076)
Congratulations, yeah. And you think that, and still the highlight is the former tea celery. That's excellent.

Hilary Considine (37:50.444)
Yeah.

Thank you.

William Howard Considine (37:56.755)
Ha ha

Matt Considine (37:56.876)
Hahaha!

Michael Considine (37:57.071)
Ha ha ha ha.

Dr. Dean Mayors (37:57.209)
Hahaha.

Hilary Considine (38:00.396)
my god.

Matt Considine (38:01.966)
This is always my favorite part of this. These two gentlemen will tell you scheduling is not my strength, but they move things around to surprise you guys. But we have added to the survey who is the favorite Adamson link team member, by the way, guys. And they're not on this call this year. I'm just saying. so props to our guy in New Zealand. Andy, I.

The Professor (38:19.922)
No

Utter Legend (38:21.704)
It's Dylan, it's definitely Dylan.

Matt Considine (38:31.66)
I want to talk about the Hickory, which we've never done on these kind of reflections. That place, Kingaric, I haven't had the benefit, but when we came to you and asked, hey, what's something that could make this even more unique? We already know the way that working with Adamson, what we feel is important about our members coming to St. Andrews, you you threw this in there and said, you're not going to regret it. Trust us. They're not going to regret it. I know from personally,

talking to all these guys. I've heard about the Hickory more this time than anything else. And Michael, I know it felt like I was rubbing in the fact you didn't play the old course earlier. was just so like, every bit as excited for what you and Alex, your eight month pregnant wife did with Hickory clubs, as I was for anybody getting on the old course. You guys had that moment, it almost felt like that was the bucket list thing now. And so Andy, I just want to start with you.

the inclusion of that, it's different and we don't get to play with it. What was it that you knew would be special?

Old Tom Morris (39:38.473)
I it's great to hear that everyone's loved it over the years and it's one of our favourite activities. So the thing about Kingaric and Hickory is the history of it, obviously. I mean, you come to St Andrews to immerse yourself in history, but Kingaric is as old as it gets. It's literally, without giving you all the background of it, it's nine whole golf course. Hickory's only played on it, but it's maintained and it was kind of recreated.

in exactly the same format as it was in 1920s when it was still built. So when they discovered the plans for it in the house there, they put it back together, they used moors from the 1920s, they have sheep kind of grazing on it to keep the rough down. So it's not exactly Augusta Speed Greens, but the whole beauty of it is it's just set up exactly as the way it was there. So it's something so authentic, you're just not gonna get it anywhere else. It's the only...

The Professor (40:23.377)
Mm-hmm.

Old Tom Morris (40:32.567)
golf course like that in Scotland. And the fact that you literally get gingerbread and shortbread at the end. And I always seem to get a trophy at the end as well. So it's a big, it's a big, yeah, big plus. That's why we take everyone there.

William Howard Considine (40:47.015)
It was very enjoyable.

Matt Considine (40:47.266)
I have a feeling you're gonna shift the Quaysh competition down a notch and the goblet, the Hickory Goblet's gonna become the main deal here soon. Who on?

Old Tom Morris (40:54.721)
think the quake got lost anyway, so it's fine.

Michael Considine (40:57.431)
Yeah.

Matt Considine (40:58.702)
Sorry, think it was, Dad, you were talking about your experience with Hickory.

William Howard Considine (41:02.367)
I just, so enjoyable. Becky and I played out of the same bag that day with Graham. I even have one of the Hickory golf balls right there, you know, to keep that memory alive. It was just, but you know, Graham didn't bring us in as a winner. We watched these other guys get the Goblet trophy at the end. great day though. I highly recommend going to Hickory.

The Professor (41:15.673)
Mm-hmm.

Michael Considine (41:27.392)
Mm-hmm.

William Howard Considine (41:32.285)
Out of all the stuff we did, I rated that number one on my list. Closely behind the storm we played in when we were on Karnouski.

Dr. Dean Mayors (41:39.799)
Yeah

Michael Considine (41:40.133)
yes.

Steve (41:41.415)
my gosh.

Matt Considine (41:42.21)
That comes up every year. Graham, is there a microclimate around Carnoustie? We've never had a group play it in anything other than rain and gale force. what is it? Is the course actually a cupcake and we just think it's hard because the weather stinks?

Matt Considine (42:01.548)
We lost them.

The Professor (42:04.412)
He's muted.

Matt Considine (42:05.676)
I gotcha. You're good.

Utter Legend (42:05.745)
There go. I'm back. No, I mean, it's strange. mean, actually, thinking back to that time, that was only the only bad day that you had, wasn't it? I mean, I think the weather was fantastic when you were here and then you just had a bit of a bad one at Carnoostie. it's interesting if you talk about microclimates, you know, as you stand looking across the sort of Firth of Tay,

You can be in beautiful sunshine here in St Andrews and then you can see the rain just running all the way along the north side of the Tay and that is the belt that Carnoustie and Panmure and Monty Feath and that's on so you can get some bad days and that might be just coming off the river there but yeah, I mean it adds to the experience at Carnoustie I suppose and it's such a phenomenal golf course.

in my opinion that it doesn't really matter, hail, rain or shine that you play it in, it's just a wonderful experience to do. But Bill, you obviously got a memory of that there at that time. But I have played it in glorious sunshine as well, so maybe next time that's the conditions you'll get.

William Howard Considine (43:25.887)
Well, I wouldn't trade the day because it was with Hillary and Jimmy and Michael and I and it was raining hard, but we couldn't have asked for a more enjoyable day on a wonderful golf links.

The Professor (43:40.953)
I think, Cardinucci, think to get the appropriate treatment, having the bad weather is exactly what you need. I know that was our one bad day on our trip too. And it's like, hey, this is the most fitting place for that. I want to circle us back to the Hickories. Obviously I'm a huge technology guy and I love the distance debate and should we roll the ball back and I could sit over a beer and talk about that for hours. So I'll kick it out to the whole group and we can respond. Y'all talk, hey, the Hickory thing, that was amazing.

What was it about Hickory's and playing golf with Hickory's that stands out to you as like, this was special. This was something that I really enjoyed and would like to do.

Michael Considine (44:19.125)
I know I was surprised how well you could play with those clubs. I was ready to replace my wedges with the Niblick or Jigger and say, hey, I can still chip with these things. I hit them better than I did in the rounds prior, but.

Hilary Considine (44:26.761)
Thanks

Matt Considine (44:32.783)
I think your whole career, you're a field guy, your whole career was ruined by technology, Michael. You would have been easily out there with those guys.

The Professor (44:37.145)
is

Michael Considine (44:37.739)
Thank you. Thank you.

The Professor (44:40.698)
His rolling swing is made for those shafts, how he rolls it and everything like that. It is like made for that, that loaded wooden shaft.

Matt Considine (44:43.5)
Yeah, it is though, isn't it?

Michael Considine (44:43.765)
Alright?

Michael Considine (44:48.506)
Exactly. No, it was really cool. I just think the whole experience was amazing. Alex and I just loved it. We still talk about it. But yeah, the technology surprised me. You could really hit some nice shots.

Matt Considine (45:01.41)
What's the ball they give you there, Andy? Is it low compression, anything that helps? the Pro-V doesn't really work well.

William Howard Considine (45:04.436)
Right here.

Utter Legend (45:08.103)
So, literally, to begin with, you're not allowed to give you a t-rex of the spot or anything like that. They have some replicas. So, an authentic one costs something like 25 pounds, so $30. So, obviously, if you've seen the rough, you just don't want to be doing that. So, you guys are there, I think, the season, so all around the month, we're pretty much in the rough. So, that's the sheet, you know.

Old Tom Morris (45:08.421)
So literally, to put it in normal terms, they give you a tailor-made soft response or I think it's either Callaway, super soft. They had some replicas, so an authentic one costs something like 25 pounds, so $30 or so. So obviously if you've seen the rough you just don't want to be doing that.

So you guys were there halfway through the season, so all the replica ones were pretty much in the rough. So once the sheep get on that over the winter, they'll find those balls again for next year. But the equivalent that they found is a tailor, I'm sure it's soft response, you guys will, maybe no brands better than me, or a Callaway super soft. So it's a soft compression ball. And it's all, as Michael says, it's all about tempo and timing. It's all smooth. Don't try and hit the bull. Kevin, you'd be absolutely goose because...

Utter Legend (45:34.951)
in terms of finding those holes again for next year. But the equivalent is a tailor-made, soft response you can actually make. all means that you have a more comfortable super-soft. So it's a somewhat reasonable, and it's all as we know, it's a tall and ten-point tine. It's all smooth. And don't change it. It'll get a bit more solid.

Old Tom Morris (45:58.455)
you you hit the ball, whatever, 350 yards and it would go everywhere. So it's all, it's all us old boys are loving the hickory. That's exactly it.

Utter Legend (46:00.679)
So we had to go over it. So I said, well, that's a waste of all the money we're spending on our one-year-old anchor. That was exactly it.

William Howard Considine (46:09.045)
We had this year, Srixon is what we used.

Old Tom Morris (46:12.64)
There you go. There you go. Whatever. Whatever that is. Whatever that is.

Matt Considine (46:16.659)
I'll just quickly remind our friends at Titleist for joining, supporting the show. Let's go to Graham.

Utter Legend (46:16.711)
I think...

The Professor (46:20.146)
I'm

William Howard Considine (46:20.393)
Yeah.

Hilary Considine (46:21.704)
you

Old Tom Morris (46:21.886)
Adamson links use Pro V1s, can I just point that out?

William Howard Considine (46:25.954)
Utter Legend (46:27.847)
think just talking back to the hickory though, actually, I had a, I rushed to that because I had three guys over at Panmure in the morning and it was a lovely day, I remember, and I sent them all pictures, like, this is where I'm going, this is what I was doing, and they were so intrigued by the whole thing, and actually, because I've looked back at that and spoken about it, they continue to speak about it, and...

We got a wonderful day up there and I think one of the things that is different is when you are on a trip here in Scotland and you come to St Andrews or go to Carnoostie, it's always busy. You're always like four ball out, four ball out, four ball out. And that's just the nature of coming to golf in Scotland. But then you go to this place where you don't know what to expect and then you find this old...

The Professor (47:13.873)
Mm-hmm.

Utter Legend (47:19.719)
ancestral sort of pile that's there with a golf course that they created and you're in the middle of Fife, you have no idea where you are, it's so, and it was so pretty and it's just like, it's very difficult to describe if you've not done it. But the only way that I would describe it is that it's a must when you are here to do because it's just incredibly unique.

The Professor (47:42.885)
I feel like there's something about connection with the course that the Hickory clubs give you. If we think about the theme of this pilgrimage and going to St. Andrews is about connecting with golf and the golf courses. For me, the Hickory clubs, you really feel the course and get tied to the course so much more where the current technology kind of dominate the course or just take so much more of it out of play. It's refreshing to hear that you all are doing that and picking up on it.

Utter Legend (48:09.383)
Guys, it's lovely to see you. We've got to go and try and put some food on the table and sell another trip to somebody from Sea Island. So I hope that you have a wonderful 2026, that we get to see all of you at some point on either side of the pond. And we're wishing you all well from St. Andrews and we hope to welcome you back soon.

The Professor (48:18.47)
Thank

William Howard Considine (48:36.681)
And happy new year to you too.

Old Tom Morris (48:36.906)
Yeah, I'll just echo that. And obviously, for the guys coming this year, Matt, we'll look forward to having them. And yeah, we'll have an absolute riot in St. Andrews again. And obviously, if you're on team Old Tom, you'll win the Hickory Goblet. So there you go. So good to see you all guys. We'll need to dash, but we'll catch up soon. Hillary, you didn't tell us which to save the date. Which date do we need to put in the diary? mean, I can't...

Hilary Considine (48:38.043)
happening.

Michael Considine (48:38.116)
Thanks guys.

Matt Considine (48:38.542)
Thanks for joining, guys.

Dr. Dean Mayors (48:39.191)
Thank you. Thank you.

Utter Legend (48:39.441)
Let me see.

Steve (48:40.079)
Thank you, Andy and Graham.

Michael Considine (48:52.7)
There you go.

Utter Legend (48:52.877)
See you on the next one.

And Hillary, you didn't tell us which to save the date. Which date do we need to put in the diary? mean, unbelievable. know, it's as if you don't want us to come. Can you believe that, Andy? Can you believe that? I saw your smile get bigger. I saw your smile get bigger when you heard we were leaving. Phew. Okay.

Hilary Considine (49:02.407)
Yes. No, it's in the mail. October 3rd.

The Professor (49:03.231)
Ha

Matt Considine (49:09.676)
Haha!

Old Tom Morris (49:10.998)
It's October Graham, I didn't pick that up.

William Howard Considine (49:12.091)
October 3rd. October 3rd.

Hilary Considine (49:18.503)
Never. Bye, guys.

Steve (49:18.99)
No.

Matt Considine (49:19.393)
You

William Howard Considine (49:19.445)
Bye bye.

Michael Considine (49:20.06)
That's great.

Dr. Dean Mayors (49:22.455)
Bye.

Steve (49:22.875)
Cheers.

The Professor (49:22.898)
See you guys.

Matt Considine (49:23.862)
Hillary, we've waited long enough. You left for Scotland with a boyfriend. You came home, you have a fiance now. What was it about this group specifically that sparked, you know, was it being around such sacred golf that you said, you know, let's do another sacred thing in marriage. Tell us, did you think you're getting proposed to over there? Give us your whole love story in Scotland.

Hilary Considine (49:52.395)
that's all across my mind, but I figured it would be too like nerve-racking for him to bring the ring over there and kind of go through all that. And we have our, family here in the States. but you know, we're, we're there on the old like on the bridge taking pictures. I was like, my gosh, I don't know. Is this, is this going to happen here?

But no, we just had the best time and loved the group, amazing friendship and stories to really last a lifetime. And yeah, we got back to the States and it happened here, yeah.

Matt Considine (50:41.87)
I think he was planning on it, but then he met all these knuckleheads and he's like, I don't want these guys around.

Steve (50:47.195)
Please.

Hilary Considine (50:51.589)
I don't know

Matt Considine (50:54.03)
I have one more question, but professor, I'll let you ask anything else on your mind for the group from the trip.

The Professor (51:02.032)
Yeah, I think I like to ask this for anyone that goes to Scotland and has a memorable experience and sees something different. You know, if there was one thing you could bring back from the Scotland trip, the experience, the golf culture ethos, what would that thing be?

Dr. Dean Mayors (51:08.589)
.

Steve (51:26.203)
I I can answer that in practical terms. worked for a golf course and the thing about going to almost any sort of destination course in and around life and St. Andrews specifically is you're greeted very warmly by staff again and again. But you also get a tea gift a lot of these places, which is a nice little swag setup. At least in like what I got on the old was simple and elegant and like a little zip tote and I.

I'm trying to implement that type of thing at my, the golf course I work for. but definitely the, your perspective is fundamentally changed as a golfer when you go to St. Andrew's play and come back. So it's like, I don't know how you can't be changed. You know, I don't know how you can come back to the United States and not look at like, whether it's your municipal course down the street or like an elevated atmosphere, wherever you go, it's just like the game looks different. and a very nebulous.

The Professor (52:22.501)
Mm-hmm.

Steve (52:23.939)
way but it's like it changes you in a very good way.

William Howard Considine (52:28.501)
You know, would agree very definitely. Like at Crayel, the way the starters came up and talked to us and described the teas. Of course, at St. Andrew's, they very definitely greet you and very genuine and everything they say, but also the civility of the game. I mean, we all like competition, but the civility of competition over there. I know when Matt and I played in

Dr. Dean Mayors (52:45.576)
Thanks.

William Howard Considine (52:58.037)
the town matches, the two gentlemen we played, I mean, it was competitive, but boy, tell you, everybody's kind of rooting for one another, too. And it's, about that bond, that friendship, fellowship, and the respect for the game that old Tom got started. I mean, and you're on sacred ground. We've said that a couple of times, so you got to respect it. And oftentimes I don't think, some of the

Games I play and people are respecting the ground we're playing on or respecting the game, the way they behave. So I just love the way they play it out in the old Scottish traditions.

Matt Considine (53:40.748)
The

Hilary Considine (53:40.9)
Totally agree. All right, I was gonna say for me, think I had the opportunity to have two caddies and one was at Cornustia and one was on the old. And I think that that experience and their ability to like really cater to each golfer and like them as a person and not so much, you know.

game and ability and I don't know to me that really stuck out.

The Professor (54:14.629)
Mm-hmm.

Michael Considine (54:17.51)
I'd say in my book, you can't beat links Golf and Scotland does it best. I much prefer links Golf over the golf in the US for the most part. I think there's so much more creativity. Yes, it can be difficult, but it's playability that's so accessible with the shots you have to play. Just get ready to bump and run, keep it low. Yes, you can hit some high shots here and there, but not often. Like Hillary said, you could probably ditch eight clubs your bag.

going over, but just love that style of play. And they're obviously very, very proud of their courses and the respect shown is amazing. And I can't wait to go back.

The Professor (55:01.03)
Dean, we haven't heard from you.

Dr. Dean Mayors (55:03.457)
Wow. Well, I've gotten to go twice now. And I'm a bit of a historian like Steve, as most of us are of golf. And it's just the idea of the links golf, because it encourages such creativity. You'll get there, and you'll say, are many ways I could play this shot, but I have to consider the wind. I have to consider the conditions I'm in, what turf I'm on right now. And I just played Pam Muir with

with Michael, which again was one of my favorite experiences at that course. And I saw Michael hitting a punter from like 100 yards off the green. And rolling it right up on the green probably five feet away, and I thought, this is true creativity here, something we would never think of in the United States. Playing the wind as we did, staying away from bunkers as best as possible. And with all of that, I just felt the history.

more than anything else, how close I was to how this game began and using that creativity. So yeah, I would go back in a minute.

The Professor (56:07.548)
Mm-hmm.

Michael Considine (56:14.915)
Well said.

William Howard Considine (56:16.51)
Now, one thing we haven't mentioned that's a treat is after the rounds, the dinners we had and the stories and the conversations and being at the new golf club, the one night for a dinner, even on the hickory course, the last hole we played it, I think at 12 some, we all played together coming in. You know, those kinds of friendship, fellowship builders, you just don't get every day. And boy, when you get them.

You just got to embrace them and the memories stay alive. mean, they've been alive with me. So, and I know they are with everybody who was over there.

Matt Considine (56:57.282)
Professor, I can't really improve on any of that with my question, so I'm going to skip it. I have one last segment. I know we're over our requested time, so thank you everybody for being with us today. I got one last segment for our 2026 pilgrims. I spun this up this morning when I should have been helping my children get ready for school. I was typing it out, so forgive if it's not fully baked, but we're gonna do a little lightning round.

And this is intended to be advice for the 2026 Pilgrim. So I'm going to do one of them for each of you here or two of them for each of you. We'll go around the horn. Dr. Mayer's favorite pub in St. Andrews.

Dr. Dean Mayors (57:42.56)
John Vegans.

Matt Considine (57:44.278)
Michael, favorite meal in St. Andrews.

The Professor (57:44.338)
quick answer.

Michael Considine (57:49.162)
wow, probably the new club dinner. That was amazing.

Dr. Dean Mayors (57:53.292)
No.

Matt Considine (57:55.982)
Bill favorite Adamson team member. Dylan, Andy or Grant. he didn't even need options. He just said it.

William Howard Considine (58:01.172)
Dylan.

Dr. Dean Mayors (58:02.924)
Dylan! Dylan!

The Professor (58:03.186)
Thank you very much.

Michael Considine (58:03.886)
Ha ha ha ha!

Steve (58:07.451)
Stuck it.

William Howard Considine (58:08.415)
Dylan, Dylan, Dylan.

Michael Considine (58:08.845)
That's hilarious.

Matt Considine (58:09.23)
Still, Dylan is the man. Dylan is awesome. Mr. P's favorite opening tea shot.

Steve (58:20.539)
I mean, the widest fairway in golf is one at the old course. I'd say new club though, like the new course, I'm sorry. Like it was unbelievable feeling. And like it was like the heat was shimmering off the fairway. It was not.

The Professor (58:30.374)
Yeah.

Matt Considine (58:35.182)
We, one of the tragedies is how overlooked the new courses at St. Andrews. That opening tee shot is awesome. That opening hole is awesome. Hillary, favorite 18th hole.

The Professor (58:39.311)
It's so good.

Mm-hmm.

Hilary Considine (58:47.628)
video on.

Matt Considine (58:49.56)
Hard to beat, hard to beat. And then I'll go around one more time. And now this, I want you to complete my sentence, okay? Dean, arrive with.

Dr. Dean Mayors (59:00.512)
Whiskey. Alondon Chorus. No, Arrive with...

Hilary Considine (59:08.789)
you

Dr. Dean Mayors (59:10.518)
Arrive with your brain because alert, oriented, because you're going to need it when you play in Scott.

The Professor (59:19.484)
thought he might go there. I thought he might call it the cerebral answer.

William Howard Considine (59:22.901)
I he might say clubs.

Dr. Dean Mayors (59:24.969)
Yeah, no, but I was like Hillary. I didn't use three-fourths of the clubs.

Michael Considine (59:25.089)
Yeah.

Steve (59:25.379)
Yeah.

Matt Considine (59:30.924)
Michael, let go of.

Michael Considine (59:36.336)
preconceptions of how to play golf. Just got to be creative.

Matt Considine (59:42.04)
Bill, pay attention to...

William Howard Considine (59:45.747)
what your wife says.

Matt Considine (59:50.41)
Even when you're traveling, right? mean, that's maybe even more important.

William Howard Considine (59:52.521)
That's right.

The Professor (59:54.49)
Again, notice how quickly he answered that one.

William Howard Considine (59:56.585)
Hahaha

Matt Considine (59:56.91)
Hillary, you'll understand it when...

Dr. Dean Mayors (59:57.173)
Yeah.

Hilary Considine (01:00:03.38)
You're there.

Matt Considine (01:00:07.052)
And then Steve, fitting to let you end, you kicked us off and he said the words at the new golf club for this group, leave with.

Steve (01:00:20.475)
Full heart. It was cool.

Matt Considine (01:00:24.014)
Full heart. That's awesome, man. Well, I want to thank all you guys for being here. You know, this trip is very special for all of New Club. It's important for us. It's exceptionally personal for me. It was Mark, my co-founder, who said, man, if we could only get a good percentage of our members to have the experiences that you had that inspired you to do this, that changed the course of your

career and how you were going to spend time. Like, man, if we just get a little percentage of that. And I think this this it really has and the way it's designed and how we're working with Andy and Graham to make sure that you feel not just hosted, but you feel a part of that town and and we're you know, the flats that we stay in and now we're improving even the walk to the course and all these little details. And it's about being in the the symphony that is St. Andrews and bringing some of that back.

But what I love about this group and all the stories as I was reflecting on it last night, it's the idea that we have these aspirations and these are the things that we want in life, in our golf, but we don't always get exactly what we want. And it was why I really wanted to ask about the rejection of the old, because in my experience, I go with those preconceptions and I have this idea of what I want.

But in the end, golf has always given me what I need. And in this case, I think the best example was the old course didn't deliver for some of you guys, but Hickory did. And you had those moments with wives and unborn children and future husbands. And you're all lifelong friends is really what we hope came out of this. So thank you for being here. Thank you for being a part of New Club. The pilgrimage is richer tradition.

Because of it, it'll be hard to top, you know, unborn children and marriages and Birdie on one, Birdie on 18 finishes and top shelf scotch. But you guys are really a part of this tradition now. So thank you.

Dr. Dean Mayors (01:02:36.223)
Thank you.

Michael Considine (01:02:36.769)
Thanks guys.

William Howard Considine (01:02:37.193)
Thank you. Looking forward to the next trip.

Steve (01:02:37.275)
Thank you, Matt.

Hilary Considine (01:02:38.325)
guys.

Yeah.

Matt Considine (01:02:42.486)
And thanks for everybody who listens this show, being able to hang out with the professor every single week. We're back in the new year. We're ready to rock. We got a bunch of great guests coming up. got some surprises coming for everybody this year. And it's a little more work for the professor and I, but we're going to be ready and we're going to deliver you guys some new ideas around this show. So reach out, send us a note at the bag drop at newclub.golf.

And please like rate review the show. I had no idea how important that is for for others to see us and hear us. You know, we love this game and we want to share it with other people who also love it. And so if you can like rate review sensitive friend, that goes a long way. We we put a lot of our time into this and we love doing it. So so thank you again for listening and thank you as always to our friends at Titleist for supporting this show, supporting New Club Golf Society.

They are the number one ball in golf regardless of what you heard earlier and and we are Great partners and friends with our friends at Titleist. So thanks everybody and we'll catch you all on the next one

William Howard Considine (01:03:50.975)
Fantastic. Thank you.

Dr. Dean Mayors (01:03:52.726)
Thank you.

Hilary Considine (01:03:53.406)
Thanks guys.