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Following the successful first and second series of Unlocking the SDGs – A Blueprint for the Future, Professor Monica Lakhanpaul and Professor Priti Parikh are back with a deep dive into the UN SDGs. Over five episodes, the series considers issues including the role of AI and education in the SDGs and what other countries are doing to achieve the goals. Listen as academics from across UCL’s faculties and beyond bring new perspectives and understanding to this complex global issue.
00:00:12 Speaker 1
Welcome back to the third series of unlocking the SDG's, a blueprint for the future. In this podcast we explore the UN Sustainable Development Goals, or SDG's, and what they mean for society. I'm Professor Monica Lakhanpal, professor of integrated community child health In the UCL Great Ormond St Institute for Child Health
00:00:30 Speaker 2
And I'm professor Priti Parikh, professor of infrastructure engineering and International Development at the Bartlett, UCL School of Sustainable Construction.
Speaker 1 In this episode we're focusing on education and the role of education for sustainable development or ESD's. Over the previous series, we've heard from a wide range of UCL.
00:00:53 Speaker 2
Students in world, with their studies about why sustainable development matters to them. So today, we're exploring how sustainable development can be integrated into the curriculum and what that might mean for the next generation of students.
00:01:10 Speaker 1
Our guests today are Anoushka Jain from UCL, Department of Political Science and Vasiliki Kioupi, from University of Leeds. Anoushka, as well as being a UCL student, you're a UCL student sustainability ambassador. How wonderful is that in education for sustainable development and I understand that your Co leading a change.
00:01:11
Oh.
00:01:30 Speaker 1
Baker's project with Doctor Lisa Vanhala in the UCL Grand Challenges and that you're engaged in several other education and sustainability related projects.
00:01:39 Speaker 1
Sounds like you're extremely busy. You're clearly very, very passionate about sustainability and it's great to hear that so.
00:01:46 Speaker 1
I would really like to know what led you to get involved in sustainable development.
00:01:51 Speaker 3
That's a great question. Firstly, I'm definitely it's been a busy year, but I think the main reason I'm passionate about sustainability and this is going to sound a bit cliche, but I can only control my own actions. And so I do need to believe that they, no matter how small they see, can create a difference. And to me, my and I'm very lucky this is true. But my personal experiences.
00:02:13 Speaker 3
Have shown me that small steps can create large tipping moments that can inspire others and foster a sense of community.
00:02:20 Speaker 3
Oh.
00:02:21 Speaker 3
And the UCL change makers project is a great example of that, because for me and a lot of people that I worked with, there was a profound tipping moment because our goal was to develop a sustainability research curriculum and the project was awarded abroad. And when we focused, we started. We were focusing on academic initiatives, but then that quickly expanded way beyond our control.
00:02:41 Speaker 3
Their expectations, because professors and academics were involved, became increasingly committed to sustainability. They began reaching out to their colleagues, sharing our curriculum ideas they were discussing how they can incorporate more sustainability with their students, and it seemed like an incredible ripple effect. And I was very happy to be a part of that.
00:03:00 Speaker 3
And I'll finish. She did that and it made me realise that such a small project could spark a wider movement within the academic community, which is notorious for being a little bit hard to create change in. I think another really big tipping moment for me personally was at UCLA. I held a small community making dope bag workshop very made.
00:03:20 Speaker 3
Bags from old T-shirts and it was just a very cute way to bring community together, but also do it in a green, healthy way. And after the workshop, a lot of the participants reached out to me and they sent me pictures of their adorable dope bags and how they made them with their friends and family. And we're trying to exercise sustainability on smaller.
00:03:36 Speaker 3
The level and honestly, I think that's the most we can hope for from everyday people that they just try on a very basic everyday level setting. Both of those incidents a little other things that have happened at UCL this year have made me very passionate about believing that small actions, especially things that I can control, can have a huge impact later on. Well, you're really.
00:03:57 Speaker 1
A role model I think for other students, but not just for other students.
00:04:01 Speaker 1
Everybody who lives their life in the community of UCLA and I love the idea of the tote bags. I really do that something very practical, really, that it sounds like brought people together as.
00:04:11 Speaker 1
Well, just thought.
00:04:12 Speaker 3
And I said this word really so adorable because we were sitting around and we were making their bags and decorating them and talking about sustainability and what others ways they can do that.
00:04:21 Speaker 3
And two people there are going to collaborate now and they're starting a sewing workshop where they can sue old clothes that have pairs in them so they don't have to throw them out.
00:04:29 Speaker 3
And upcycling workshop where they can change boats. So if you no longer want one of your clothes then you can switch clothes with somebody else. And I know you see all those on a larger scale as well. But doing these on a smaller community level has been really interesting and really exciting. I think it's got a lot of people together and I've definitely made friends through this which I obviously appreciate.
00:04:48 Speaker 1
And I think what's important about what you're saying is taking.
00:04:51 Speaker 1
Ship that what you're demonstrating to all of us is really that it's not somebody else's problem. It's not somebody else's crisis. As we've heard in another podcast. But actually you've taken ownership to take control. Yeah. Really. And show other people what they can do. Like you said, small steps can be ripple effect for a much larger change.
00:05:10 Speaker 3
Definitely. I think if we.
00:05:11 Speaker 3
Don't take accountability for our actions at all and say, oh, it's somebody else's problem.
00:05:16 Speaker 3
Then.
00:05:17 Speaker 3
Honestly, that's nobody's problem because everybody thinks that. So I think doing what you can on your own level, whatever you can, is something, and it's worth the.
00:05:26 Speaker 2
And Anoushka like the point you're making about small action points and holding ourselves accountable, really. And actually those small action points as a collective can be hugely impactful, especially to local communities. And you started talking a little bit about engagement with communities in London in the last season of this podcast, we heard Professor.
00:05:45 Speaker 2
From Fox and Doctor Jessica ESPY from Bristol University, who were discussing Bristol's groundbreaking one city initiative, the development of Bristol University's partnership with the City Council around SG's, what are UCL students are doing to engage with London communities and how can we?
00:06:04 Speaker 2
The academic community to build on those partnerships.
00:06:06 Speaker 3
That's a great question because I have so many ideas that is firstly on what UCL students are already doing. So I do think that UCL students as a whole are involved in a lot of different types of initiatives in terms of supporting local communities and all types of sustainability. So, for example, these can range from beekeeping projects with.
00:06:26 Speaker 3
Students organising sustainability, which is a student run sustainability project.
00:06:30
Good.
00:06:31 Speaker 3
And do things like the UCL chain speakers projects.
00:06:34 Speaker 3
I think a few examples I did make a list ahead of time. Was that for example my role as student sustainability investor? I've worked on projects that promote sustainable practises within and outside the university, so things like workshops and upcycling, making those dope bags, organising events that raise awareness about environmental issues.
00:06:52 Speaker 3
Secondly, Community partnerships and research, so UCL partnered with SOS UK, which is a student run sustainability project in free sustainability universities, by partnering university students with communities in the local areas, which has been great because so many students want to be more engaged and want to have more sustainability in their lives.
00:07:13 Speaker 3
And actually are so driven to do these things, but they don't have the opportunities.
00:07:17 Speaker 3
So I think these community partnerships and Community involvement are just so, so important because they allow students to John's to actually get involved. Thirdly, volunteering and social impact initiatives and this is mostly from what I've seen, what I've done, this is outside of official UCL channels. But for example, me and some of my friends falling deer with organisations across London.
00:07:39 Speaker 3
Such as speech. The future, which is working on integrating sustainability into high school education across the UK and.
00:07:46 Speaker 3
Now we're trying to incorporate this into UCL by talking to the IOE and seeing, hey, how can we incorporate this into the teaching programmes that the IOE does for well teachers because that's so important. Another way that I think you see all students have collaborated with local communities is through policy and advocacy work. So there's a lot of youth advocacy groups.
00:08:07 Speaker 3
Working on climate change right now, so I'm working with the UK Youth Climate Commission and a lot of students from UCLA as well.
00:08:13 Speaker 3
And we're advocating for youth climate policies, youth education policies and making sure we're educating the youth with environmental policies that not only informs them, but also empowers them to get so much of climate change education. Right now, it's quite frankly, a bit depressing, and it really takes away your joy or passion or want to do anything for the environment.
00:08:35 Speaker 3
Because it seems so hopeless.
00:08:37 Speaker 3
And I think a lot of students are trying to move away from that system and try to make it a lot more hopeful and try to make it a lot more empowering that, yes, things are quite bad, which nobody can deny. But there is still things that we can do as students in terms of building on those partnerships. I definitely think that there's one space that you still can definitely improve.
00:08:56 Speaker 3
Yvonne, because strengthening university community collaboration is really important. So things like establishing dedicated community liaisons within UCL are supporting student LED initiatives with community and things like providing funding and resources. Because yes, students can be without funding and resources and even access to spaces where they can promote their work. It is really, really.
00:09:18 Speaker 3
Hard to make a project get off the ground, I think thirdly.
00:09:22 Speaker 3
Hosting collaborative events with community partners, because Community partners also want access to these spaces and they want to be working with university students, they just don't have that access. And I think universities sometimes forget how much access they can provide to both students and community partners. And it's again, it's so important because that's through universities. The main space that.
00:09:42 Speaker 3
Students find communities they can work with or help out with, and that's where they find their employment opportunities. So.
00:09:49 Speaker 3
I definitely think that UCL should be more engaged with the communities in some of the ways that I've listed, and not just because it's good for students and it's because it's good for university partners. Illustrates have been done recently about how more than 70% of students want jobs and sustainability. They want to graduate and create social change. They want to create good social impact. So this does feel like a win win.
00:10:09 Speaker 3
Their students, universities and local community partners.
00:10:12 Speaker 2
Thank you for setting out a range of impressive initiatives with local communities and highlighting how universities can support your endeavours.
00:10:21 Speaker 2
And also the importance and value of really embedding this in our curriculum because it's very clear from what you've described that.
00:10:28 Speaker 2
A lot of.
00:10:28 Speaker 2
Our students are inspiring, motivating and pushing academics to do better on kind of issues such as sustainability, and we're very lucky today to have Vasiliki as well from the University of Leeds, a place where I grew up. I grew up in Leeds.
00:10:43 Speaker 1
Very close to my heart and my daughter actually qualified as a sustainability consultant as.
00:10:48 Speaker 1
Well, from her teachings at University of Leeds, so very, very close to my heart for two reasons. But what I realised is that we actually have representation from UCLA and another university, which is always interesting to be able to compare and contrast and have a dialogue across two different institutions. And what you both do and thus leak your Electro and sustainable curriculum as well.
00:11:09 Speaker 1
But also you will have come across many young people who have been thinking about sustainability in a different way than maybe we did in well, I did in in our my generation and also Anoushka . You know you've obviously been talking about schools as well as young people. So just really wanted to hear from both of you maybe Anoushka first and then.
00:11:28 Speaker 1
This leaky?
00:11:30 Speaker 1
Why you think young people of today and even those in school really have a growing awareness of the SDG's and sustainability. To compare, it maybe compared to when I was a little.
00:11:41 Speaker 1
Bit younger.
00:11:42 Speaker 3
I think my answer to this is very short and very simple. We don't have a choice. The climate crisis is here and so many of us are terrified.
00:11:52 Speaker 3
And so scared that taking action is the only way that we can feel in control of our futures and our lives, because we don't know what else to do. And that's the only way we can feel like we're actually doing something. So I definitely know that's true for me. And so many other climate advocates I've talked to or even people involved in sustainability that.
00:12:12 Speaker 3
They feel like this is the least that they can do and they.
00:12:14 Speaker 3
Need to do something.
00:12:15 Speaker 1
What's interesting is that's for the older, so the young people maybe at university, so you know, you have an awareness. You're you're an older age maybe amongst the young age people. But even I'm hearing the younger children, you know, the 8 and the nine year.
00:12:28 Speaker 1
Rules and even they're talking about it now, is that do you think that's because they're being exposed to it they're hearing about?
00:12:34 Speaker 1
It on the.
00:12:34 Speaker 1
News or what's really engaging their thinking?
00:12:37 Speaker 3
I definitely think it's a couple of things, but honestly, even when I was 11 or 12 or even 9 or 10, I was still really worried about the climate. I think sometimes adults.
00:12:49 Speaker 3
Underestimate how stressed out kids in general fall ages are about the climate because I know some of my friends who have younger siblings who have been thinking about this since they were six or seven and and I remember also thinking about it at that age. I do think education is such a huge factor in that.
00:13:06 Speaker 3
Aside from obviously having to care, but education has definitely transformed the way that students view climate change, because generally in most parts of the world, and definitely the UK climate education and sustainability is becoming such an integral part of how we talk about the future. And you can't talk about the future without talking about climate change. And you can't talk about the future without talking about sustainability.
00:13:28 Speaker 3
And I really appreciate how the education system is catalysing that change.
00:13:32 Speaker 1
But what sometimes worries me as a paediatrician is we're seeing mental.
00:13:36 Speaker 1
Challenges for many, many young people, and now we're using the words like, you know, climate crisis, and they're worried about the future and fear and anxiety. And sometimes I wonder whether all of this burden on young people, it can actually be really make it difficult sometimes and I don't know what dialogue you've had when you were younger.
00:13:56 Speaker 1
Did the schools really talk about it? Did family parents really talk about it or should we be?
00:14:02 Speaker 1
Facilitating and educating.
00:14:04 Speaker 1
Being family members, parents, school teachers, to actually have an open dialogue so that we don't create also a young society that just so frightened of their future that it really impacts on their well.
00:14:17 Speaker 3
Being ID definitely, I think I touched on this earlier as well, but one of my main issues and it's I'm really glad that it's happening.
00:14:24 Speaker 3
But one of my main issues with GAR, the current state of climate education, sustainability education, is that it doesn't provide you any tools.
00:14:32 Speaker 3
Or like just an understanding of how to make solutions, we talk so much about, oh, this is the climate crisis, the world's heating up and we're heading to a disastrous place. All of that. But then nobody, that's it. We're not taught. OK, so some really bad things are happening. But then what can we do? It feels like these things are just being thrown at us, even to students at a younger age.
00:14:54 Speaker 3
But you're not telling us, and I know so many students want to know. How are you empowering us to fix these things? Because we're the ones who are going to have to fix it. So if climate education is all about.
00:15:03 Speaker 3
Filling our heads with problems and anxiety about it. I do understand that to a level because you need students now to understand the severity of the situation, but you also so desperately need to inform them as to how they can help and how they can fix things and not make them feel like a really small part. A small cog in the machine you need.
00:15:20 Speaker 3
To tell them.
00:15:21 Speaker 3
Hey, you can do things and you can.
00:15:23 Speaker 3
Makes the world, and I think that hope and inspiration is really missing from climate, education and sustainability education.
00:15:30 Speaker 1
Well, you've used the word hope that actually one of our other colleagues also used climate hope rather than climate crisis as something you should also think about. And that's.
00:15:38 Speaker 1
Leaky you you know.
00:15:39 Speaker 1
You teach students as well in.
00:15:40 Speaker 1
Leeds how does this?
00:15:42 Speaker 1
Really play out in your experiences.
00:15:45 Speaker 4
Thank you for this question and I'm so happy to hear from Anoushka who is a student just like my students and I'm always inspired by, you know, by their responses and views that I completely agree with what Anuska said. So I will respond to this question with two hearts, one of the lecturer. But in a previous.
00:16:03 Speaker 4
Life I was. I was also a secondary school teacher and environmental educator. So in terms of the students, so the students are very passionate about taking action.
00:16:12 Speaker 4
This is something we really need to realise. They really want to take action. They don't want only to learn about not only gain the knowledge about sustainability problems, but they really want to take action because they feel they urgency of of what is happening and they feel passionate about making a difference. I think another aspect of it is that they are developing skills.
00:16:33 Speaker 4
That are useful for their future, so they are really considering themselves in careers that have to do with sustainability.
00:16:40 Speaker 4
I think of it as a social mission. They they feel passionate about it because they think it is their social mission. So we really need to empower them. As Anoushka said, we really need to consider what kind of education we need to offer them at the university level and at school level, you know, to empower them to take this action that they want for their younger students I have seen.
00:16:41
See.
00:17:01 Speaker 4
In my, in my experiences, it's in Greece. Mainly I and I have.
00:17:06 Speaker 4
A smaller experience in the UK, students are always passionate about big ideas. They feel inspired by them, especially in adolescence, when.
00:17:14 Speaker 4
They are trying.
00:17:15 Speaker 4
To save themselves and save, you know, their personalities. So they really align to these big ideas of Environmental Protection. We really want to start a social movement.
00:17:26 Speaker 4
We really want to take some action. We really want to change things. So I think the education system really needs to understand this and nurture this kind of ability, this kind of personalities in in the students.
00:17:38 Speaker 4
In terms of climate anxiety, I think this is a this is a big issue.
00:17:43 Speaker 4
And I agree, and I have. I have done it in the past as a, as a secondary school teacher, to focus on the green aspects of, you know.
00:17:51 Speaker 4
What is to?
00:17:51 Speaker 4
Come and I realised that my students were becoming disconnected. We we need this kind of hope. We don't need to scare people away. We are all acknowledging that there are big problems.
00:18:04 Speaker 4
There, but we really need to focus on not only the heads but the hearts and hands of the students. So how they can emotionally connect with the educators with, you know, what is happening in the world and how they can express themselves through some kind of of action. I think this is how they can manage their emotions as well and.
00:18:24 Speaker 4
Well, they they can cope with with what is happening.
00:18:27 Speaker 4
And we really need to give them the spaces to do that in education.
00:18:31 Speaker 2
And Vasiliki, I know that University of Leeds is working incredibly hard to integrate as the Jews into student educational opportunities. It would be wonderful if you could tell us how this journey started and how is it progressing.
00:18:44 Speaker 4
The University of Leeds has a 10 year strategy. It is called the climate plan. We aim to become net 0 by 20.
00:18:52 Speaker 4
But in this journey to net zero, we are considering other aspects as well, such as sustainable travel, how we can actually reform research and teaching, how we can make more responsible investments and how we can enable everyone become involved in decision making. But I'm specifically working as part of the sustainable curriculum principle of the university.
00:19:12 Speaker 4
So.
00:19:13 Speaker 4
This aims to offer every student at the University of Leeds the opportunity to engage with sustainability during the time they spent at the university, so this started in 2022, but the university was doing work on education for sustainable development. The formal strategy was initiated.
00:19:31 Speaker 4
Because they understood the urgency of the challenges and they also wanted to empower the students with the competencies needed to realise the seeds.
00:19:40 Speaker 4
So what I'm doing as part of the sustainable curriculum leadership team and I have to say that this leadership team comprises member of my own department, the Sustainability Research Institute. We are also working in collaboration with professional services such as the Sustainability Service and also colleagues from other schools and faculties because.
00:20:00 Speaker 4
We really want to see.
00:20:01 Speaker 4
How VSDS can be embedded in different disciplines and we we also engage with students because we need to Co create things with students. This is something that is of priority to us. So what we are doing, we have implemented a pilot mapping of the SDG's with one of our schools, school of civil engineering and.
00:20:21 Speaker 4
For the next academic year, we will do it completely. Student LED in collaboration with the students organising for Sustainability UK, because at the same time we have this reform that I said of the teaching and the curriculum, we really want to see how much sustainability in this disease have been embedded so far. What are the gaps and how we can remedy those.
00:20:40 Speaker 4
Gaps and it is good that we are giving this opportunity to the students to drive this because they really want to take action and they really want to see that the university is actually doing something for sustainability and there's disease. The other thing we have started this community of practise for students and staff to come together and discuss about ESD and.
00:21:00 Speaker 4
This disease and supports each other. It is called Lamcy or Leeds University network for sustainability in higher education.
00:21:09 Speaker 4
So this has been successfully running for one year and we have seen a lot of people from diverse schools. For example, the School of Music School of Mathematics. You know, these apps that you would not immediately associate with sustainability come together and share how they're embedding the stages. We are also in touch with many other groups at the university because we don't want to work in silos.
00:21:32 Speaker 4
We believe that the transformation of of the university activity towards sustainability should be systemic, so we are working with many other groups. The experiential learning group, the global opportunities team or the career service, the entrepreneurship groups and many other people, the student societies, the Student Union, because we really want to embed.
00:21:52 Speaker 4
Sustainability in all of the activities of the universe.
00:21:56 Speaker 4
Not only the curricular activities, the Co curricular activities, the broadening activities that give students the opportunity to study something alongside their own subject, and also intensive work placements, volunteering opportunities, you know, working with communities, as Anoushka said in in the beginning and how this can actually enrich their their own.
00:22:16 Speaker 4
Experience at the university.
00:22:18 Speaker 2
And it's very exciting to see the element of Co creation, especially between academics, professional services, colleagues, students and communities. I think it's a very exciting journey that University of Leeds has embarked.
00:22:31 Speaker 1
And what I understand as well is.
00:22:33 Speaker 1
That you've been in?
00:22:34 Speaker 1
Adding SG's into the curriculum, but you've also been doing some research around this as well and I think that's really interesting because it's it's like everything is. And if you don't have the evidence to support what you're doing, it becomes very difficult to sustain it in a way that's meaningful. All that you can share with others as well. So I really wanted to learn a little bit more about your research.
00:22:54 Speaker 1
What really inspired you and made you think M This is important enough to focus?
00:22:59 Speaker 1
On and what can other universities such as ourselves, really learn from your experience?
00:23:04 Speaker 4
My research started when I moved to the UK. My specific research on based on on the on embedding based it is in higher education programmes and and modules, so it was in 2017 that I started my PhD back then. Yes, these were a very hot topic, so there was a lot of research around the stages and I thought.
00:23:24 Speaker 4
You know, this is a new and inspiring framework and a road map to achieve sustainable development by 20-30. And this could mean you know that we can actually.
00:23:34 Speaker 4
Act action and we can we can build a better.
00:23:37 Speaker 4
Future for everyone.
00:23:39 Speaker 4
And then I started, you know, researching basically this more closely and there was at the time a lot of research on, you know, individual studies and for example, how can we select indicators for impact and how we can measure this kind of impact?
00:23:55 Speaker 4
And what are the trade-offs and synergies among the SDG's? And there was a lot of research, specifically in in, in universities of how universities are impacting SD's as stand alone.
00:24:07 Speaker 4
Those, but after analysing and critical thinking, you know on all of this literature, I realised that we should not think of vestiges as standalone targets. We should consider them as a systemic framework.
00:24:21 Speaker 4
And this is the most important thing we can do. So I developed a framework that, you know, can be used by by universities to actually check how they can embed sustainability into research, teaching and operation.
00:24:36 Speaker 4
But also how they can measure the gaps that they have or where they're doing the progress, where they're having progress.
00:24:44 Speaker 4
So this this framework it is actually looking into enabling conditions for the studies you know to come alive and be sustainable society to become realised. This has been published also in academic journals and it has received attention from universities in the UK and also the global.
00:25:00
Health.
00:25:01 Speaker 4
Which is very interesting to see. I think the FDA is also speak to global self communities and global self universities as well. We should not be prescriptive and it should not be a top down approach when we're adding pasties.
00:25:12
It is good.
00:25:13 Speaker 4
To have the.
00:25:13 Speaker 4
Buy in from the university leadership, but the focus should be on empowering students and staff to really work on thinking how the.
00:25:21 Speaker 4
Thinking could be transformed and I think there is a lot of work to be done in professional development of.
00:25:27 Speaker 4
Have.
00:25:28 Speaker 4
And actually, shaping them create programmes with students. So what we are doing at the university is we are working with professional services, for example the organisational development and professional learning service, to embed this kind of ESD into the training programmes for staff and what else?
00:25:48 Speaker 4
I would also advise universities to think about this. It is not only about, you know, embedding the SDS or the systemic enabling conditions of the SDG's, but it is how we can move from the more passive pedagogies to the more active learning pedagogies.
00:26:03 Speaker 4
How we can actually embed specific learning outcomes for sustainability, so the students develop not only this knowledge and skills but also the values, the attitudes, the behaviours that actually can lead to the realisation of the studies. And lastly, I think if the university as a whole has a vision and mission that is guided by the.
00:26:24 Speaker 4
This would actually help sustainability.
00:26:27 Speaker 4
Touch all of the aspects of of the university activity and everything can be seen through this kind of sustainability and esg's lengths.
00:26:33 Speaker 1
And the framework you mentioned, it's published in a journal. Where else can people access it easily as on a website? Or how can we get?
00:26:41 Speaker 4
Hold of that, it is available in two publications that people can access, but I'm also working on a website.
00:26:47 Speaker 2
And I like the point you're making about a systems approach and interlinkages between the sustainable development goals. I mean, this is a point which pretty much has come up in every podcast episode we've done on this topic, Matt.
00:27:02 Speaker 2
And I know that your team recently organised an exciting event called the Social Justice Jam. Can you tell us more about it?
00:27:10 Speaker 4
Yes, yes, thank you. I mean, the social justice dam took place last month. It was an effort that started early this calendar year in January 2024. So the social justice jam spaces for change was a virtual event that happened over three days. It was like a very intense online programme that brought together.
00:27:30 Speaker 4
Diverse participants. You can consider it as.
00:27:32 Speaker 4
A hackathon type event but.
00:27:34 Speaker 4
We we really want to focus on it being exam, which means it is Co created by students, staff and community members and the participants are very diverse and they come together, you know, to, to engage in some creative discussions and creative ideas about solutions that are so important that I mentioned that, you know, we really need to consider.
00:27:56 Speaker 4
Commissions not only the problems it was funded by the Horizons Institute, the Horizons Institute is a platform for the disciplinary research at the University of Leeds. We identified the partner because we wanted this to be a collaboration between the global North and Global self.
00:28:11 Speaker 4
Our partner was the University of Pretoria and specifically my colleague Tajon Songa from the Centre for the Advancement of Scholarship. We also had two community partners, one from Pretoria, the Mofang African heritage site led by Doctor Babena, who is a traditional healer.
00:28:30 Speaker 4
And also a local community needs which is called Seacroft through an organisation that is called sporting trust, who helped us engage that that Community, this organisation is member of the collective organisations in the area that are called, we are secret and they are doing amazing work with young people and families in.
00:28:48 Speaker 4
Jerry, so we all came together with students. We had student sustainability architects, much like sustainability ambassadors such as Anoushka , who helped us Co design the jam. So we focused on two challenges faced by those two communities. One specific to Mamelodi, Pretoria, which had to do with converting.
00:29:10 Speaker 4
Rubbish dump into community garden and how this actually community garden could enjoy, you know, the status of other nature reserves in other parts of South Africa. This was specifically in in the in another privileged area of South Africa and for historical reasons.
00:29:26 Speaker 4
You know, there were injustice issues in that area and we also worked with Seacroft and other underprivileged community needs around reclaiming and building back from the local council, so the the Community can use it as a youth centre so young people can pursue activities and they can grow together and they can discuss things they can organise.
00:29:46 Speaker 4
Events and things like that. So we integrated those two challenges into a creative scenario with help from students and colleagues from creative writing.
00:29:55 Speaker 4
And we invited diverse participants, as I said. So we invited students and staff from the University of Pretoria Community. Members from Angelotti students and staff from the University of Leeds, and community members from Seacroft to come together.
00:30:07 Speaker 4
During this event.
00:30:09 Speaker 4
And the event had morning sessions of guest speaker presentations from Melody and Seacroft and afternoon sessions, where groups would come together, go through the scenario and identify the challenges they wanted to think on and provide solutions.
00:30:25 Speaker 4
We also had workshops on arts based approaches and how through the arts we can actually be more creative in in devising solutions. We we had sessions of power symmetries because we have global North and South community and university relationships navigate. We had sessions on how we can problem solve through tools.
00:30:45 Speaker 4
And then we had a final day where the groups pitched solutions to their community members and the representatives of the communities. I think it was a very exciting event because it was innovative. People were committed to it from from day one, the facilitators we had, both from Pretoria and Lee.
00:31:03 Speaker 4
They were really keen to help the groups and, you know, navigate them through challenges so they can really delve into the the challenges and provide solutions and help them with tools that they could use to provide the solutions and the final day was it was a great event because we saw how the two communities wanted to empower each other. So how?
00:31:24 Speaker 4
The community, the global S really wanted to help the community in secret of understand that communities have knowledge and they are experts in their own setting and this knowledge is powerful and this can and should be shared with the world and we had.
00:31:39 Speaker 4
Members from the Seacraft community wanting to forge a relationship with Mamelodi so they can both package similar challenges, such as with local councils and local governments. For example, we had students being very excited and asking how can we have this kind of opportunity in our normal curriculum, modules programmes and not only in Co curricular events.
00:31:59 Speaker 4
Take the dog.
00:32:00 Speaker 4
We had facilitated those very, very excited about, you know, navigating the groups and how they saw local, local solutions being built and, you know, understanding of the context and how we can make difference in in communities. And I think you know, we are now evaluating this dam and we we are developing all the resources that we.
00:32:20 Speaker 4
We used during the tampas open educational resources so everyone can use them in any university or in any other kind of educational set.
00:32:27 Speaker 4
And I think and.
00:32:28 Speaker 4
We're also developing a blueprint of how to run this kind.
00:32:31 Speaker 4
Of Zen, I'm.
00:32:32 Speaker 1
Very excited about and I just wish I was part of your jam, so feeling very, very jealous at.
00:32:36 Speaker 4
The moment no, we can invite you the next one, I think. Or we can.
00:32:40 Speaker 1
Organise one perfect so we have in the past.
00:32:47 Speaker 1
Students about the SDG's.
00:32:49 Speaker 1
And I'd like to really pose the same questions that we asked to them to you as well. So this is going to be asked in two parts. So the first part and Anoushka , maybe you could answer first, which do you think is the most important SDG, just give you a moment for that. And secondly, if you could create an 18th goal.
00:33:09 Speaker 1
What would?
00:33:10 Speaker 3
It be, I think that's a great question and I know considering the theme of this podcast, the answer for me seems a bit obvious.
00:33:17 Speaker 3
But I definitely definitely think that SDG poor quality education with stipulations has to be the most important SDG, and I have a lot of reasons for this and I will justify my answer.
00:33:29 Speaker 3
And defend this.
00:33:30 Speaker 3
Heavily, but firstly, it's definitely a huge emphasis on quality because you need a solutions based approach and access for all we definitely need.
00:33:38 Speaker 3
Equity and education.
00:33:40 Speaker 3
Because education is the key to social mobility, and it is the most helpful tool you can give underprivileged communities and we're seeing an alarming decrease in access for education across the globe and that's something we definitely to focus on because when we talk about quality education, we don't want to talk about quality education for select 10 or 20% of students in. I mean normally global N countries.
00:34:01 Speaker 3
With super privileged backgrounds and that's not exactly what we mean. It is so, so important to focus on quality of education. We need access for all, and we need that equity.
00:34:10 Speaker 3
Secondly, quality also means focusing on empowerment and upscaling and making sure students feel like they can create change in the world in whatever way that they want to. But some change right? Also, it needs a lot more support, monetary and otherwise, for educators, arguably one of the most important professions there is, and it is astounding.
00:34:31 Speaker 3
And I think kind of a feeling on.
00:34:34 Speaker 3
For society that we don't give more attention to and don't focus more on educators because they're literally responsible for changing the course and the trajectory of so many individual vibes. And the other reason I would definitely think that policy education is the most important SG is that on a personal level, I am the person that I am today because of the quality.
00:34:54 Speaker 3
Education that I have had, it has made me want to create social impact that's made me feel empowered enough to believe that I can change the world in some way or.
00:35:01 Speaker 3
The other and also.
00:35:03 Speaker 3
So just as a matter of efficiency, education is the fastest way to change the world, and that isn't an exaggeration, because it is a compounding effect. If you educate one person incredibly well, they can change hundreds of lives and so quality education means you get a team of incredibly talented changemakers that can create amazing social impact. And again, you can change the trajectories of so many individuals.
00:35:24 Speaker 3
So she couldn't tell. I'm very, very passionate about education as a social impact tool and it's definitely something that is so underutilised.
00:35:32 Speaker 3
This because I firstly don't think you can educate enough people and you can't educate people too much.
00:35:37 Speaker 1
So the importance of teachers and education, I think that's really, really critical and I think that, you know, at all the universities to encourage people to teach as well as do research and be good educators is something that we work very hard on. So I think hearing you so passionate about education.
00:35:53 Speaker 1
It really makes me feel that we could spread that message to all our educators in the institutions and it would make them realise how important what they do is to everybody's lives and how it can touch so many.
00:36:05 Speaker 1
People and another thing about the importance of education. It reminds me what my grandmother used to say. Everybody could take away your money. They can take everything else from me, but they can't take away your education. So hearing directly from yourself, I really appreciate those thoughts on that.
00:36:20 Speaker 1
Now to the difficult question.
00:36:22 Speaker 1
Goal 18 what would that be?
00:36:24 Speaker 3
For you, I have definitely thought about this a lot and I think I would have proposed SDG 18 to be something along the lines of digital equity safety and responsible regulation, and that's a bit of a long 1 and I will.
00:36:36 Speaker 3
Like that, but I think the goal would be to encompass these three interrelated aspects, because firstly in terms of digital equity, we're seeing growing divide between people who have access to digital resources and people who don't. We definitely saw this during COVID, but it's so important to focus on ensuring equitable access to digital technologies and the Internet for everybody, because that's how you.
00:36:57 Speaker 3
Bridge the digital divide by providing affordable, reliable Internet access, especially for remote area.
00:37:04 Speaker 3
This and also making sure that devices and online resources are accessible that marginalised communities and also people with disabilities so that you can make sure that everybody can benefit from these.
00:37:13 Speaker 3
Opportunities.
00:37:14 Speaker 3
Secondly, and I think this is such a big issue, especially for, I mean my generation and people who are under the age of 18, Internet safety is.
00:37:24 Speaker 3
I know I think right now it is kind of a joke because it is seems very.
00:37:29 Speaker 3
And with increasing use of the Internet and online interactions, it's so important to ensure that children and also adults are safe and secure online, and that those digital environments are secured because there's so many issues like misinformation, digital harassment, a lack of online privacy, and we definitely need to focus on that as a global issue because the Internet.
00:37:50 Speaker 3
Is worldwide. Thirdly, and this is definitely more relevant this year and moving forward, responsible AI regulation and just responsible technology regulation because.
00:38:00 Speaker 3
AI is becoming such a huge problem across the world, so just things like deep fakes and there's generally it is a very concerning tipping point at which we're at. We need to make sure that we regulate AI before it's just released into the world and creating those frameworks to ensure that AI is developed and deployed responsibly and there's transparency and accountability.
00:38:20 Speaker 3
As well as an ethical use of AI technologies is really important and something that I don't think enough people are focusing on, and I definitely do think that part of that is because a lot of lawmakers and policymakers.
00:38:31 Speaker 3
Others.
00:38:32 Speaker 3
Aren't comfortable with technology to the extent that they can make policies on it, and they're definitely not with AI. So I think that's a really big issue because people working with AI and working on AI usually under and again, this is a rough estimate under the age of 40 ish and most lawmakers are 60 to 80. So there is a huge divide.
00:38:53 Speaker 3
And again, that is a bit of a generalisation, but definitely from my experience and what I've seen and the reason that air regulation currently is basically nonexistent, is that.
00:39:02 Speaker 3
So I think the goal for all of these is to ensure that we can recognise how much of A force technology is and harness it in a way that benefits everybody. And is it used for quite malicious purposes because it is so easy for it to be.
00:39:16 Speaker 3
Used for malicious.
00:39:17 Speaker 1
Purposes, thank you for sharing your thoughts with us and I can tell why you're an ambassador for UCLA.
00:39:23 Speaker 1
And you've really given a lot of thought to your answers and given us food for thought as well. And that really puts the clicky in a in a tricky position. Now how, what, what do you think is the most important SDG?
00:39:34 Speaker 4
Actually it has to be quite integration for all the reasons and most comments.
00:39:39 Speaker 4
Mainly the empowerment I mean. For me, education means people are empowered and you know this can change their lives. They can realise their potential. They can make a difference in their communities. They can make a difference globally. But if I was allowed to add something else just to, you know, to to add the different I mentioned, I would also.
00:39:59 Speaker 4
Consider Goal 17 partners for the goals I have seen it with the jam. You know how important and how powerful it is for partnerships from different areas of the world. You can see different perspectives. These perspectives are very.
00:40:15 Speaker 4
Meeting, for example, we were exposed to indigenous perspectives from South Africa on how we can connect with nature, something that we have lost in the global NI.
00:40:25 Speaker 4
Think.
00:40:26 Speaker 4
So, you know, reconnecting with yourself, reconnecting with nature, reconnecting with others and understanding that even though we live in different contexts and operating.
00:40:36 Speaker 4
In different contexts, we're all human and we we all have feelings and we we all have common goals such as, you know, sustainability and how we can build a better future. I think this is what unites us.
00:40:47 Speaker 4
And so we.
00:40:47 Speaker 4
Need to focus on, you know, the commonalities.
00:40:50 Speaker 4
And all the power of diverse groups of people to actually bring the solutions that we need for sustainability.
00:40:56 Speaker 1
And the 18th goal.
00:40:58 Speaker 4
Or the 18th call I want to finish on a positive note because I I said earlier that I work with the US this to be an integrated system. I think what is implicitly articulated by the SDG's is that they are all pointing towards some kind of vision of a sustainable society.
00:41:15 Speaker 4
City. So I would really wish this 18th goal to be building a sustainable society, so this goal would integrate all of the entities together, would help people to actually develop this kind of road map or this kind of framework that is needed for us to achieve this, this positive future. And I think this goal would give us the hope that is needed.
00:41:37 Speaker 4
To combat all the anxieties we have for the urgency of the of the.
00:41:41 Speaker 4
Challenges we are.
00:41:41 Speaker 2
Faced with and, it's very exciting to end on a positive note because what we're really aiming for is.
00:41:48 Speaker 2
People and nature positive solution moving forward and I think both of you touched on that either through the systems lens or Anoushka thinking about safety regulation, use of artificial intelligence. But most importantly I'm definitely feeling inspired by student voices and the moments that we have.
00:42:09 Speaker 2
Activities such as justice jams and community engagement, and I feel that as academics, that's what really keeps us excited and motivated to do our research. It's really.
00:42:22 Speaker 2
Kind of thinking about how we can embed that evidence into research for a better future. So I wanted to thank you both for joining us today. Where can listeners find you online, Anoushka , let's start with you, I think the.
00:42:37 Speaker 3
Best place to find me online would be on LinkedIn where you can find me under my name and the kitchen.
00:42:42 Speaker 3
You can find the students sustainably ambassadors on the UCL website at student sustainability ambassadors.
00:42:49 Speaker 2
Thank you, vasiliki. Where can we find you online?
00:42:52 Speaker 4
So you can find me on LinkedIn Vasiliki, underscore, QP and also on X with the same handle.
00:42:58 Speaker 2
Thank you Anoushka for showcasing the excellent work that the students sustainability ambassadors do at UCL. You've been listening to unlocking the SDG's. This episode was presented by me Professor Priti Parikh and me Professor Monica Lakhanpal and produced by the UCSD's initiative and edited by Front ear.
00:43:18 Speaker 2
Our guests today were Anoushka Jain and Vasiliki Kyoji.
00:43:22 Speaker 1
If you would like to hear more podcasts from UCL.
00:43:25 Speaker 1
Subscribe to UCL minds wherever you damage your podcasts or visit www.ucl.ac.uk/SDG. Join us next time on unlocking the SDG.