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These are short, powerful, and focused 5-10 minute episodes designed for busy educators who want quick insights into:
✅ Virtual Reality in Education
✅ Exciting Trends in EdTech
✅ Game-Changing Tools for Quality Instruction
In just a few minutes, you’ll gain actionable insights into how VR and emerging technologies are transforming learning—no fluff, just the good stuff!
🔥 Want to be featured? If you’re an edtech innovator, VR developer, or education leader, let’s connect! I’d love to showcase your work.
Shannon: Hello everybody and welcome back to another exciting episode of Putin's podcast.
Pops, I could not be more thrilled for today.
You are in for a treat.
We have the most amazing, the most wonderful Caroline Sanchez Crozier.
And did I get that?
Caroline: Yes.
Shannon: Yes.
Awesome.
'cause I usually just call her Caroline.
She is not only a friend, she is a guiding light who has helped me in more ways than I think she'll ever know.
But she is also an entrepreneur and I would love for Caroline to introduce herself and tell us all about her wealth of knowledge.
Hi, Caroline.
Caroline: Hi Shannon, dear friend and partner.
So okay, I'll start with yes.
I can be labeled as an entrepreneur.
Many hat that I wear.
And for coincidentally this month I'm celebrating 38 years of as an official entrepreneur.
When I launched CSC Consulting Group back in 1998 in tech when my colleagues and friends have known me all those years, say, back when technology was a thing, it's when I started.
So, that was a journey that brought me from.
Switching from corporate and as, as a business, you know, CPA auditor to launch this ENT entrepreneur initiative that was gonna be part, you know, part-time temporary.
To raise my two children and ended up finding my passion.
And as I said, when you do things for others, you find out things for yourself.
So it's the CSE consulting group has evolved.
Imagine the technology over those 38 years.
A number of times we have to reinvent ourselves, transform ourselves, and so the company is a boutique company today MSP and IT service provider on the one half, in the other half, we provide educational services.
To our clients.
And our clients are primarily schools that have been for 38 some years, and and small business and nonprofits.
But then we also work with other larger clients in collaboration.
So, and we're based in Chicago but we've been covering Illinois wide, Midwest wide and sometimes even, you know, national and international clients.
Shannon: That's absolutely fascinating and congratulations.
That is a huge milestone As somebody who has been working and had her own company for a year and a half, maybe two it is.
Beyond exciting to see that there's you know, female trailblazers out there that I can look to and I know other people, you know, especially men, don't see the importance of it.
But having a female entrepreneur and a female leader that I can look to for guidance.
Can you tell me a little bit about how you've been able to stick it out this long and stay tough?
Because women still aren't really accepted in the tech industry to the level that we deserve.
Caroline: Thank you for asking and when we first met, we connected instantly because of that question you asked is that you know, we bring a lot to the table.
Women and at a different dynamic and to our, and our, our, the recipe of, of, of an entrepreneur, you know, one of the traditional, you know, I'm gonna go to
business school and do my business plan and get my business off the ground traditionally with traditional people that start businesses that are typically male.
So for me this started as I said earlier, to pivot as a being corporate to balance my, my, home life with my children.
But as an entrepreneur I realized that we, by doing that kind of juggling in the home and with our things that we surround ourselves in our lives, we bring that
to the challenges of being an entrepreneur to overcoming obstacles and, and, and the things that we're gonna run into, you know, when we start our business.
So, you know, the, the company started.
Small part-time consultant and I had to use all my assets that I had just get it started with little to no, you know, you know, you know, capital and, and, and all the challenges that entrepreneurs face.
So, you know, I had a business background.
I, you know, go to my local bank for support my community bank and I rely on my extended family.
So I'm a middle child of 11 a middle child of 11 and first gen.
And.
Shannon: 11.
Caroline: 11
two.
Shannon: Yes.
You heard that right?
Caroline: Yes.
And so I relied on those resources that there's always a way to look at very creative assets to, to bring to the table.
And lo and behold, within the first year of, of, of doing this very of creative way of launching this side gig that became, became a full-time gig, I ended up lending a, a contract with Apple Computer.
Yes, apple computer.
For my first the beginning years, early nineties where I represented Apple for the Chicago public schools.
And from there, you know, things have evolved quite, quite incredibly is is my journey.
Shannon: And that's nothing to gloss over.
I mean, when you look at back at Apple and why they are successful, I've said it time and time again.
I don't understand why the XR industry doesn't wanna pull an apple of the nineties.
And get into education and create a generation of users.
So you were right there from the very beginning with that.
And so you've seen that.
So how has that early adoption of that technology in schools kind of informed, you know, your work over the last three decades and, and how you see, you know, equitable tech across, you know, education and other industries even today?
Caroline: I can tell you it has shaped my vision and purpose, you know, dramatically from Apple's vision for education and my connection to my own personal journey is first gen in college and immigrant from Mexico to see.
The land of opportunity in the US and, and to see also the, the differences of education in one end of the city to another end of the city or the state or wherever, that it's just because you have an education doesn't mean it's all the same.
You know, it's, the offering is not the same.
The delivery's not the same, the resources are not the same.
That's just what I realized that like, oh my God, I had no idea.
So through's eyes.
Coming in with technology in the early nineties, what we saw was incredibly d differences in the school infrastructure, in the buildings with power as basic as power.
So we were part of a team to sell, train teachers and support the technology.
And we would come in and they would buy a lab.
Back then, it was mainly labs.
No power, not enough power.
So we have to look at the infrastructure of a hundred year old buildings as a starting point, and then we have to look at the need for human capital resources of teachers being trained.
And that wasn't always easy to package.
And you know, to have a complete plan that would make full use of the computers from being able to plug them in to being able to do basics on what the technology does and what it doesn't.
And how does it tie it to teaching and learning.
So.
That's, that's where my initial view.
But I did say that I did see the vision, power of what Apple envisioned, what they call make these models, sites that would show the possibilities.
But we had to start baseline wherever the schools were, wherever the teachers were, where were the buildings were, we had to build from there and build up until their ultimately being of value to, to teaching and learning.
Shannon: And I love that you brought that point up because I constantly talk about it.
Anybody that listens to me, I'm sure they're, they're sick of hearing me talk about it, but that's the same thing that we're still dealing with today.
If you get 30 headsets, do you have 30 outlets that you can plug 'em in?
Can you charge 'em?
Can it ha, can it handle the bandwidth?
The same things that you were dealing with then are.
Still going on now.
And if people don't look at those problems and answer those first, it doesn't matter how great the technology is.
If, if the teachers and the the educators and the students can't access it, you can have the best tech in the world and it's not gonna do any good because they can't get through those roadblocks in the very beginning.
Caroline: And can I add to that?
So the infrastructure is the foundation, obviously the building, the location, the lab, the space, the power and all that.
But the other is the the, the, the training that is needed and too often in over the decades, not only in education but in, even in industry where they spend a ton in some technology stuff.
There's no a plan for the training of the people, you know, the, the human capital that is needed to benefit from the technology.
And then the third thing, and then I'll pause there, is this schedule, because there's a tight schedule, especially in schools, where do you fit it in?
You know, it's not gonna be done through osmosis and teachers have a full plate already, so you have to kind of move this around the
schedule and to be able to bring them into that, you know what, you know what they, the Lisa deserve is the support and the training.
Now, I'm gonna say the force also is the mindset.
The mindset for the change.
So I'm gonna pause there.
That, and I still see that being things that we address, whether it's VR or AI, or you know, robotics or whatever it is, it's the same thing.
Shannon: I would like to also point out, I did not pay Caroline to say that because you literally took the words out of my mouth of what I try to get people to understand is
that if you don't have the training, you don't have the understanding of what the people are using it and the day that they go through, you don't have that firsthand experience.
Just 'cause you went to school doesn't mean you understand being an educator.
And so.
All of that in no matter what form it is, it's new terminology, it's new training, it's new procedures.
And if that groundwork doesn't get laid, like you said, it doesn't matter if it's ai, doesn't matter if it's vr, it could be, you know, the new Chromebook.
Like it was the same thing.
We had to learn how to use it.
And if you skip over that to the next big thing, 'cause we're always hearing that in technology, you know, the next big thing.
So how have you managed to stay successful and not.
Fall into the trap of just jumping onto the next big thing and like kind of staying the course.
Caroline: One thing that I'm gonna say that goes beyond my role of entrepreneur and being a disruptor and you know, not being afraid of taking risks, is I always look at my work.
From the heart, I'm mission driven.
Whether I'm running my business, which I'm not anymore, since six years ago, launching this new inter enterprise of nonprofit, but the mission, if you're mission driven, you start at the end, who are your users?
In what value are they getting from this?
If they're gonna take time away, if they're gonna have to replace something, if they're going to focus on something new to learn.
So I, we don't go to the next shiny thing.
We look at the whole package and having come from corporate and consulting world, I either worked at Deloitte or with the credit, you know, McDonald's, another Comcast.
It we, we have to look at a full picture, is a consultant that I think is ingrained in me, is assess the needs design around those needs with a human centered approach, launch and implement and monitor and support.
Then evaluate, it starts small and build up to scale and to replicate.
And if it didn't work, you may wanna scrap it.
And if it worked, what's the next phase?
What's the next stage?
And have everybody take a buy-in from my approach of top down and bottom up, it cannot be one or the other.
It has to be both.
Shannon: And, and I love that you mentioned Human first and, and heart centered because that's where we kind of instantly connected of, you know, we were like, oh, we could help these people or help these guys.
And it wasn't like, oh, we could make this money or that money.
And, and I think if that's all you're driven by, like hey, that's fine.
But you know, that.
That's just not what we tend to gravitate to.
And you know, something that has, I don't care if it's the dirty word now or not, but you know, we're big into diversity and underserved communities and so what are you seeing for some of the outside of the obvious, we know what's going on with the current.
Whatever, administration, but outside of that, before any of that kinda happened, what were you seeing as some of those challenges
already for, for, you know, minorities, for underserved communities, especially when it comes to technology and technology access.
Caroline: Great question and I will only see.
The word diversity, the word equity, the word inclusion is benefiting everyone, everyone in many different ways.
From accessibility to awareness to engagement, and whether it be because of language, because of diverse way of learning, because of accessibility, 'cause you're in rural communities or not, you know, all of those things.
Have to be taken into account if you're gonna be successful in a business or in building a product or a nonprofit that you're serving
your constituents because, you know, we've been, we've been built as a country by embracing and in, in attracting that diversity globally.
So it's always been an asset and will continue to be an asset, and it, it will never exclude anyone.
Shannon: And one of the things too that you mentioned was you know, universal Design for learning, and we've kind of connected on that as well because.
All of everybody's different lenses, even if they're from the same nationality, they could learn very differently.
You know, just because you fit into one box doesn't mean that you fit all of those things.
So when you come from that, you know, universal design that we know can include everybody, I feel like it allows you then to, you know, to offshoot and to grow into other things.
And so how have you taken that into your nonprofit work, whether it's with digital leaders now and Ghana, which I would love for you to kind of explain to everybody what those are because I'm honored to be a part of 'em.
And so how have you kind of taken that approach into what you're currently doing?
Caroline: Great question.
Again, it's from my learnings, you know, mistakes and, and aha moments of my business of, you know, more than three decades.
I intentionally chose to step down, you know, you know, day to day business to continue to do the work, but with a, not only a continued purpose and mission, but one with an organization that has that nonprofit status and 5 0 1 C3 status.
So we can tap into other funding sources and come in with an philanthropic eye for funding.
We have taken the UDL from the approach of the gaps that we've seen.
In the silos that I've seen in my business that I wanted to go deeper and further.
I felt that as a business, I couldn't do that as a business, as a, as a for-profit.
So I had to have a, you know, beginning and end to a contract, to an opportunity.
And that's not the way I, I think and the way I, I, I operate.
So, so the nonprofit world has given me the ideal, I should have done it sooner, but no, and I love being an entrepreneur, and I, I do have that track record to say, you know, as a business.
This is what can be done as an entrepreneur, but as a nonprofit, we have a different an approach and the approaches and why the name Digital
Leaders now is that I saw those gaps that exist in bringing technology to everyone besides the UDLI saw the differences of commitment of leaders.
So that's why I say, you know, we are not gonna help the student or the teacher as an example, unless that leader of that building principal or that chair of that
department in curriculum instruction or in technology or whatever department or superintendent or you know, leader of a higher institution, unless they buy in.
In what I saw that I do now differently in the nonprofit.
Is that the digital part, you know, given the leader part intentional and the now of action now had to happen.
'cause otherwise we expecting change with teachers or students when the leaders are not even fully aware what they're bringing in or what they've been buying and
don't understand the full picture without their vision and without their knowledge that this is going to move the needle in their organization, in their school.
And, and so forth.
And too often those conversations don't happen with tech vendors because they're just looking at the next shiny thing.
And that's not how I think, and that's not how I look at things for our business as well as for our nonprofit.
So the digital leaders now gives me that incredible opportunity to invite people of common beliefs like yourself in, in common approaches.
To do this work collectively and, and, and not in silos.
Not only as a school, not only is community, not only is industry.
So the digital leaders now framework has three pillars.
Education with my decades of work and gaps that I've seen in technology, implementation, and success and inclusion and all that.
A community that I've been a volunteer in multiple organizations on boards and my civic engagement, and I don't see them at the table too often.
These technologies in emerging tech and how this transforms policy, how transforms impact and, and all that.
And of course industry.
Where is where you come in, Shannon?
Very valuable in, in a new initiative, kind stack.
I am an entrepreneur.
I am an industry.
I have lived it and I, I and I, and I share that, but I don't see as much.
Engagement with industry from the ground up with a real strategic, solid collaboration partnership on these new technologies and, you know,
tech talent, you know, career pathways being developed, you know, by teachers, but it should be with industry coaches and, you know, all that.
So, you know, I hope that answers your question.
That digital use now has given me a whole new way of.
Collaborating and breaking down those silos and being intentional in recruiting and attracting like minds and partners in these three sectors.
Shannon: Yeah, I thought that was fabulous, especially because you're exactly right, everything is in silos and.
We need somebody to break those up.
And you know, like you can have students creating projects, but if there's nobody in the industry that's gonna wanna buy 'em, then what's the point?
And you don't know what industry wants unless you actually ask them or bring them together.
And then how do we fund it?
Well, let's get the leaders and how you can bring everybody together.
And that's really like a very important skill and kind of like networking and schmoozing as I like to say.
Because let's face it, it is.
So how have you and, and you're fantastic at it.
And I think it, I think it becomes because you're genuine and you actually care.
But one of the things that was hard for me going from just being, you know, like a classroom educator to this business side is that like, I get my feelings hurt or things like that, and people are like, no, that's just business.
Like how have you managed to kind of, you know, keep strong and, and learn how to navigate these different worlds.
Caroline: Oh wow.
That's, that's.
Evolution and transformation inside out because I have been in those spaces throughout my career versus a, as an accountant, CPA, in corporate with very few, you know, women that I was surrounded by, and then even less, you know, with the Latina.
So I had to be comfortable and be uncomfortable.
Being able to be, you know, proceed with that passion, that purpose even though I was uncomfortable in those scenarios.
So, you know, I think that for me it's the practice as they say.
You know, it takes like 10,000 hours to be good at something.
You know, imagine 38 years, you know, and then on top of my eight years of corporate over and over and over and being in in settings.
Where I'm one of the few, one of the few that can speak from my experiences, not because of my color or my ethnicity or my language, but because of my life experiences that I bring to the table.
I call it diversity of thought.
If people were to think of diversity of thought and the innovation that brings that into a team building, you know, conversation or product development or you know, disruption of new way of doing things.
He comes from differences of thought and from different life experiences.
So I always, and I thank my parents, my dad, who was a disruptor, even though he didn't go to much formal education, but he was a
disruptor and an innovator in his own journey as an immigrant from Mexico, bringing us all in and to a better life and a better world.
And, you know, within a short time, you know, my way of thanking him and my parents, my mom is.
You know, studying, doing one school, college, my career, entrepreneurship, and then representing Illinois for the small businesses of Illinois in the White House with President Clinton.
And tell my story of, you know, resilience and hard work and you know, what we bring to the table from all of our different countries worldwide to build America in the way that we come together.
I think that's been what I've been able to do.
Look at those differences and, and not only.
Celebrate them, but use them in our, is our superpower.
And it's, and I carry that message across authentically with my own experiences as, as a, as a a, you know, middle child of immigrants in, in my own challenges in my own community that I participate.
And now my nonprofit, I adopt my own village of Summit in Illinois and I adopt my own schools that I went to school in Argo High School and Dominican University.
I'm a trustee emerita.
So I start in my own backyard and I, that authenticity is genuine and people sense it, feel it, and they wanna be a part of it.
And I wanna be a part of others that, that are the same.
Shannon: Yeah.
That, that's, that's beautiful.
And, and it's true.
You can't fake that authenticity.
Like you can fake a lot of stuff, but that you can't.
And one of the things, diversity of thought.
Love that.
Totally stealing that.
I will give you credit though, but it, one of the things that instantly I could feel from you too was.
So for you, and, and I'd like you to kinda expand on it, is, is gone us and so you can definitely, you know, give your description of it, but we all have it.
It might just be called something different, but you know, like I, you know, what I bring to the table coming from, you know, lower middle class and upstate New York, you know, there's things that I had that were easy, things that weren't.
And so I have a lens and you've always appreciated that.
And I've had my own Gs, I just didn't.
No, you know, I didn't have a term for it maybe, and now I feel like I do.
So kind of explain a little bit about that.
So that can kinda lead us into the Ghana Tech Expo that I'm really excited to talk about too.
Caroline: thank you.
Because ghana's may be a Spanish word with multiple meanings but I realize in the research of how it evolved.
Is that it has connection to many cultures globally.
So, I connected to my own, but then I'm learning from others, coming from different backgrounds to say, you know what, Ghana's, it's a different word, but we use this and it means the same thing.
Oh my gosh.
Grid resilience, you know, the work ethic, stop it, and nothing to get to provide for your family to, for your client.
That kind of, the grit that overcomes and that's for entrepreneurship is in critical.
For being an immigrant in a new country with new people in the community.
So Ghana's evolved from a research project at Illinois Tech.
You know, three years ago when the Dean of the School of Design, meaning the human centered design, not graphic design mind, you adopted our nonprofit to solve a problems.
What they do, they solve problems.
And the dean took on our project, our, our nonprofit is a project, is a, is a project with, with students master degree students in human-centered design.
The problem I posed was we have all these Ghana's that we call Ghana, which many can relate to the grid, the resilience, and we apply it in many of
these careers and jobs, you know, in, in, in hospitality industry and in landscaping and, you know, blue la blue collar labor jobs and, and all that.
Yet that raw talent in Ghana.
Resilience is not being, that's not impacting their lives and their opportunities in tech.
And why, why is that?
Because, you know, new, new innovations and inventions come from that kind of DNA and that kind of makeup.
We're missing something here and I can't figure out what it is.
What do we need to do to bring together?
So long story, the research came up with, you know, Caroline.
I did a lot of interviews with you and with others in your, in your circles and everybody talked about this, Ghana, and, and then those that did have made it have said, you know, I went through all this but I didn't see myself.
You know, you gotta see it.
To be it, I struggled alone and I made it.
And I had that grit in Ghana.
I don't want others to have the same thing.
I don't want the young IT generation to the next gener of leaders.
The creators that are not even known, they could be the creators of, of tech in emergent tech to hear and to see us and put us all in a room.
Those that have it in in the potential is not fully out yet, or they don't even know it.
Lack of belonging is what they're having right now, unfortunately, but yet they have it in them.
Bring 'em together.
Ghana's Tech came from that.
Bring an create an expo.
Bring the tour walls together.
Education, the future tech leaders, those tech leaders.
They look like them and others.
We don't exclude anyone.
Everyone is invited.
And so Ghana step became that third pillar of industry that was lacking excitement and in a calling to industry.
And that's when we met was a perfect time because we were just shaping the next year of Ghana's Tech, which is gonna be this year, 2026.
April 22nd, a little plug April 22nd at Rose Universe University, who was hosting again this year.
And we wanted to emphasize the emerging tech in the future of it.
The good, the bad, and the ugly.
There's fears, there's, there's, there's misconceptions of it.
There's truly loss of, you know, thousands and thousands of jobs, but they're being replaced by many jobs.
That where the skills are lacking.
So what do we do in, in, in creating this kind of tech expo with industry at the forefront to be the ones to benefit and to also be a partner with us in reaching out to community,
reaching out to education university partners like Rosa University, Dominican University, Alma Mater, high schools like Ridge or high school district in, in Norwich, Illinois.
Argo from Summit.
And you fit right in.
Once we met, we knew that those, those worlds needed to be to collide intentionally in a positive way.
And and that's where we are with shaping and building it.
Inviting all those that industry leaders was from small, mid, or large corporations to say, wow, we can co-create out in the field, we can build these team challenges of cohorts of students, professors.
Tech coaches like yourself, and then go out into the community, whatever those communities are where we can co-create.
And at the end of the day, students are learning hands-on experiential learning, and the solutions are gonna impact whether internal operations of those community organizations or the constituents that they serve.
And hopefully didn't go too far and too convoluted here.
That's where we are building the second go around with you as a co-chair Dr. Melina and Kafer is a, a framework creator of this model of of the team challenges around creativity, culture, and heart human centered and and so forth.
And then Dimitri Garcia, one of our DLN board members, and we're super excited to bring all these leaders, like I said, top down in, in, in beneficiaries, students and community.
To co-create together.
Shannon: No, I absolutely love it and I'll be continuously plugging it, by the way.
Yes, April 22nd, Ghana Tech Expo and I will be there and I cannot wait.
It's gonna be an exciting combination of so much hard work and I will also include links to.
To this episode when it's posted and Ghana tech.org by the way, you can go and check it out 'cause it's more than just the expo.
There's so much stuff
that that goes into.
Caroline: on that?
Thank you for saying it.
I don't believe in one time events.
I've been attending many over my 40 years, and so, and we go in rah rah, exciting, innovative, walk away, inspired, and we go back with, or you're a teacher or you're a, you know, a professional or a student.
Then you go back to the same thing in, you know, change takes place or very difficult to get change.
Our Ghana's Expo is a combination of the year round work.
We highlight right now, the team challenges are starting now this spring semester, and we're inviting the students, we're recruiting them, the professors or tech advisors.
So if anyone in the audience is interested in being a part of it, please attend.
We also do events out in the community, boots on the ground.
AI town hall meetings is an example.
We're launching Ghana Tech Club of students in computer science in tech to lead what.
Means for them.
We're launching consulting group of seasoned professionals and business leaders like myself to be supporting this initiative.
So things are evolving and it's a whole movement and a whole set of activities that of impact that are year round.
And we keep evolving, you know, organically.
So 2026 is, as I described, but 2027 is gonna be much at a whole other level because of what we all call creating together.
Shannon: Yeah, that's such a a, a good point.
Like, like, like you said, yeah, we're all pumped and excited and then you go back into your daily grind 'cause it's what you know, and it's comfortable and, and everything else.
And so having this constantly evolving.
Kind of group and mission and like wave.
It's like kind of like you said, building momentum and and continuing forward.
And what I love about it too is if you don't understand, like these are real students at real university real world problems that we're helping to solve with real world companies.
So it's not like this grand, oh well, you know, this made up company with this made up problem.
It's going to directly affect their community.
And I think that goes back to, to.
The heart of the mission that you always said, it's, it, it's affecting people that they can see in every day.
And it's not this, you know, you gotta, you said you gotta see it to be it and to dream it.
And I think so much over the years, people got so offended or like, you know, like, I'm like, it's not about you.
Like I was, in my mind, I was a fabulous female mentor for my female students of color, however.
As a white woman, there was only so much I could do.
So just because I wanted, just because they wanted to see people that looked like them.
That didn't take away from what I did.
It had nothing to do with me and people that don't understand.
I'm like, yeah, that's 'cause you could walk into a store and find a doll that looked like you so you don't get it.
So getting people to understand that yes, maybe, you know, we're ensuring that these people are included, but we're also not leaving anybody out.
I think that's so important to hit on and I think so needed now too with everything that's happening, you know, that we just, because we are ensuring, you know.
Representation, whatever, doesn't mean we're not wanting everybody.
And, and that's what I love about, you know, Ghana's tech and not just the expo, like you said, but the whole mission of what you do.
If there was a, you know, predominantly white suburban school that said, Hey, we need a tech club, you're there.
Like,
Caroline: Exactly.
Shannon: I, I love that.
And, and, and.
How do you stay true to that?
Because I know we've had to make a little bit of adjustments on some of our advertising and things, so I I do feel like that's going to end and we're gonna come back around.
But how do you keep your strength through that?
'cause I know it can't be easy, and I know I struggle with it too.
So for any of us that are struggling, how do you, how, how do you stay strong through that?
Caroline: Couple ways.
One is the spiritual inner being of me can say, connects to that, you know, that it's never gonna change.
I do yoga as well, meditation, you know, try to manage all that noise that's out there that I can't control and, you know, may not like or can't change.
I would say that's, that's one of 'em.
And, and the other is stay active.
I'm a doer.
I take action.
I'm so busy doing good things with people like you, Shannon, and Melina and Dimitri and our team and our community of partners in the energy is so high, and the students and their reaction, their appreciation, and their gratitude that.
I don't have time and I don't have, I, you know, my, my energy glass is limited, so I keep it full of this kind of interaction and, and, and engagement and, and, and activities.
That, that's what keeps me centered.
And and I do my done moments.
Trust me, I'm not perfect and I have, but I go back right to, okay, what are we, what can we accomplish?
What can we do?
And you know, my statements, I have two statements that I. With that also keep me grounded is the from the Alchemist from Brazil author you know,
when
you, when you pursue your personal legend, the entire universe conspires to help you achieve it.
True to that, I believe that, and it does work.
And I, you know, I, I I've lived it.
And the second one is, you know, be the change that you used to see in the world from Gandhi.
Keeping that.
And then the third and last is my three Ps. Passion, pride, and purpose.
That's what keeps me going and grounded and optimistic, and hopeful that there are enough people with humanity, with passion, with compassion you know, with kindness that we will rise above all this and that we will, we, we are right now, we are.
You know, we wouldn't be having this conversation if we didn't.
So
that's.
Shannon: I love that you did point out though too, you said, I do have my down moments.
Like I think that's, that's okay.
Like, you know, depending on the generation and, and the, the family culture you came from, it was, it doesn't matter what's going on.
You get up and you go to work and you know, and, and, and, and you get over it and, and you know.
All that kind of stuff.
But I've learned that it's okay to have down moments.
Like, I'll allow myself to feel sad for the evening, and then when I get up the next day, then it's a new day and we, you know, we gotta keep moving on.
But I think an important part of that is finding your tribe and finding your community, which I feel like I've, I've found with you guys.
And if I am having a down moment, I can look to, to one of you and you can bring me up and then when you're down, I can bring you up and we can support each other.
I think that that's so critically important, and, and that's what I hope people that are listening understand about the SC Tech expo April 22nd, is that that's what we are.
We want everybody to succeed.
I always say, you eat, you know, I eat, we eat, and, and you know, we can keep each other going through, you know, those challenging times and, and, and get to the good ones.
Caroline: And to that point you know, even though this s tech is launch from the digital leaders now nonprofit, the ecosystem that have, you know, we intentionally included that have been working in silos, we're intentional to bring 'em all together.
And with s Tech in particular.
When we say industry, we don't just mean the go-to big corporations because I think everybody goes to them and you know, they're great for so many things, but they're not the best for other things.
Our local business are small, medium size, the fabric of our economy and our country with thousands and thousands of us, you know, that are, you know, one person solopreneurs to five to 20 to.
40, you know, our, in my business CC consulting group, we've evolved over those, you know, you know, decades and reinvented ourselves.
And we've been nimble and we've been agile and we've been repurposed, and we have had to, you know, take a step back to a step forward that is the fabric of America in more than the big corporations.
And we want them at the table, of course, but too often we leave out the, you know, mom and pops or the small business.
There's more consulting.
Without my business, you know, CSA consulting group, paying my bills while I launched a nonprofit in, in this philanthropic journey, I wouldn't be able to do what I do and in the impact I make in my community.
We have a lot of that out there that we too often don't even think about.
And so Ghana Tech is also about bringing industry and everyone in every aspect of entrepreneurship, entrepreneurship, entrepreneurship.
That is what's going to keep us grounded in moving forward and innovative.
Innovative, especially because.
When we talk about emerging tech in quantum and everything, we all need to be there to continue to be the, you know, you know, leaders in, in, in, in, in the future, tech leaders and many, they have untapped talent because we haven't been mentoring them.
So we have a lot of work to do, but we are not doing it in silos.
We're doing it together and everyone here is invited.
Shannon: That was, I love that.
And that was such a great point too.
Everybody goes for the big boys, you know, like, oh, the, you know, like the Coca-Cola or things like that.
But what about the, the local, you know, brewery that's making, you know, amazing SAS Barilla or something that's trying to get their name started and like you said,
those, you know, people that are in our community every day and, and they get overlooked and, i, I wouldn't have even realized that until I kind of started to get into it.
And there's so much out there and you know, okay, maybe they can't drop 5 million, but they can drop 500 and look at how everybody's benefiting.
So I think when you only focus on one aspect, like the dollar or something, is when you lose that, that mission and that heart.
And, and I love that you've been able to, to keep, you know, steady and, and, and kinda keep that that light.
Shining where it needs to be.
And, and like I said, I'm honored to be in your circle.
I'm honored to be a part of it at the table.
And we still have the closing countdown, but is there anything that we didn't cover or any, you know, kind of final thought that you would like to leave anybody with?
Anything that you would like to say?
Like I said, I'll link to digital leaders now.
I'll link to the expo all of that kind of stuff.
But is there anything else you kind of just wanted to share?
Caroline: guess I do, even though I, in so many ways I've said it.
That we don't do this alone.
I may be the front face of D-L-N-C-S-C, my business kind tech, but it takes a village, as people say, and there are a lot of people behind the scenes that deserve as much credit.
And we, and we, and they inspire us.
They motivated us, we motivate them.
So it's been a team effort, you know, from my, you know, immediate.
Family, my siblings who helped me launch my business, you know, 37 years ago with a lot of Ghana and no, you know, salary for the first couple years.
Well, we started to my husband Terry, to my children who are eight months now, 38, and running my business while I'm doing this.
And Julian, his own entrepreneur and potentially future judge to friends and colleagues and don't leave that out of.
The equation of what you're surrounded with.
And when you do make it, you know, I like me, I'm grateful I have the gratitude and incredibly feel blessed to have that those, like you said, tribe with, with all of us all ages, generations, backgrounds.
That richness of that is powerful.
It's innovative, and it's going to continue to take us to another level.
So for that, I'm, I'm grateful for you and I also honored that you joined us.
Shannon: Well, thank you.
That was beautifully said and I couldn't agree more and why I think we're, we're such a good a good pair because we, we've.
Got that spun in, in, in the right places and sometimes not, but, you know, hey, alert as I go and, and like I said, I'm trying to play the game better.
So, I, I appreciate the, the guidance and, and the grace that you've given me to, to be myself and.
I remember I had, I had texted you something and I was so nervous because in the past, like, 'cause I don't like confrontation and in the past, you know, I would be like, well they're gonna get mad at me if I say this or that or the other.
And I told you when you, and I was so nervous and you said, thank you for telling me I appreciate it.
And I was like, wait, not only did she not get mad at me, like she, she appreciated hearing my, my thoughts on it and it's okay to share my feelings.
And like, that has been so.
Unbelievable.
Like, you have no idea.
Like, I, it, it just, I like you, I started to cry because I was so happy.
Like, you know, because I, I am not used to people that, that support me.
And, and because I've always tried to, you know, whether it's been a, you know, keeping the principal happy or this or that, you know, like, oh, there can't be any confrontation or there can't be any disagreement.
And, and so I've just been always terrified of it.
And you were the no joke, like one of the first people that taught me it was okay to.
Express how I was feeling, and so thank you.
Caroline: You are welcome, and I've learned over the years myself to be vulnerable is a good thing.
It's, it's, it's a, it's, it's a strength, it's a superpower.
And too often we think we, it's a weakness especially when we're women that they look at us because we cry.
'cause sometimes they do cry.
It's not a weakness.
It's a very vulnerable, it is definitely a, a superpower because you open up and people get you and connect with you on a much higher level than you could have.
And imagine any business, any dollar amount contract, their relationship.
There's a bond that never, never goes away.
Shannon: Right.
Thank you.
I'm no longer apologizing for being a crier.
I always joke like that's my default setting.
Like if it's anything out, like, you know, like I always say like mad, sad, confused, and I'm confused a lot.
I just cry.
You know, like my, my grandma God lover, she'd always be like, Shannon, we know if you're crying, you'll, you'll, you'll get it under control in a minute.
I'm like, exactly, Graham.
I just need to let it out.
So.
Okay.
I'm excited for the closing countdown.
I think this is a good one.
Okay, so Caroline did not get this ahead of time, so she's, she's put on the spot with this one.
But what are three things, especially 'cause I kind of knowing you and, and, and knowing how absolutely wonderful you are.
I'd like to know this as well.
What are three things that you're oddly competitive about?
And it doesn't have to be work or anything, like it could be absolutely anything, pickleball, whatever, like who washes the dishes fast or anything.
What are three things that you're like oddly competitive
Caroline: It is interesting you say three.
'cause I was thinking three or four everything.
Three things that I'm mildly competitive for.
Gosh.
This may sound silly, but you know, over the years.
When people lose something, like, I'll give you an example, a contact, and you can't find it.
'cause you gotta see it.
You know, I have to be the one to find it.
I am going to find it.
When you lose something that's like, it's such a thrill for me.
When I, when I win, I'm like, I got it.
I got it.
So I would say that's one thing.
The other competitive, gosh, it's, there's just.
You're putting me in a spot.
In a spot.
Shannon: And it can be, you know, it can be work related too.
It doesn't, it doesn't have to be like but it can be like, I am oddly competitive about like, like, kinda like with what you said, somebody finding it, like, my mom could still trick me to this day.
Like when I was a kid, she'd be like, oh, let's see how fast you can pick this up and, and I'll time you and like, you know, I had to be faster than my brother.
So like, I'm still kinda like that now.
Like, ooh, I can get this task done.
Like, you know, and I have a competition in my head with nobody.
Like, there's nobody I'm competing against.
But I'm like, Ooh, here she goes.
She got the laundry out of the, you know, dryer that quick.
Caroline: Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, you know, being with, with 10 siblings,
you
know,
the, the competitiveness also is, you know, for who, who gets the last, you know, word out.
You know what I mean?
It's
like
we all talk, we all, I mean, when we're talking, we're like always like in.
Four or five at a time.
And people like, how could you guys understand each other when y'all talking around amongst each other?
I had to have the last word.
I have the last word.
So that's another thing with my family, you know, it's like God have the last word.
Shannon: I could see that.
That's what I think.
I'm like with 11 of you, there's gotta be something you were fighting over.
'cause I just had one and we fought over everything.
Caroline: And so the last one would be, you know, with, with school, I, I haven't been, I, I've not been athletic, unlike some people I know here.
So, athletic, athletic sports was not, not my thing back in the day.
But with academics in, when there were like projects to complete compete, and I still remember the one in high school I had to be number one, the first one to finish.
Something is born as this accounting project.
It was an accounting project and it was in a workbook, and the last one had a piece of paper with a, that could look like a, like a flag if you finished it.
I didn't get that freaking flag.
It didn't mean anything.
They weren't gonna pay any money or anything, and it was all year.
I worked, you know, come in early late.
I needed to get that flag because teacher said the one that finished the flag, the, the finish of work with the flag would post on the wall.
And you'll get to close for the rest of the semester because you finished.
And I had to be the one, and I was, I really
was.
Shannon: for you.
Yes.
Caroline: So I am competitive in that way.
So, you know,
Shannon: I love that.
Exactly
Caroline: own, like I finish it, it's gotta be.
So yeah, that, and that's, that's competitive.
Being competitive is a good thing.
It
is a good,
you know, but also, you know, being a you know, not being a sore loser, which, you know, sometimes we learn.
For mistakes.
And, and that's the other side of the coin, you know, you learn more from mistakes and not being the winner or getting the contract or whatever, than from that.
So, you know, that's, there's both sides that I, I try to look at in a positive way,
Shannon: exactly.
And, and losing well is just as important.
But I mean, look at that, that was in school and you remember it to this day, like, you know, that's how much of an impact on
you.
That's what I'm saying.
That's have.
Caroline: Yeah.
Yeah.
Shannon: Oh, well, Caroline, this has just been so wonderful.
I always say that every time I get to talk to you, no matter how it is, my soul always feels better.
And, and it's true today as it was the first day I met you.
So I cannot thank you enough for, like I said, supporting me, being on the podcast you know, letting me in into the, the GIST tribe,
which I'm so grateful for and will do everything to continue to support and, I can't wait for the Ganas Tech Expo again, April 22nd.
Everybody get, get, be there, be Square, and, and just thank you so much for being the amazing person that you are.
Caroline: Thank you.
I'm so glad we're connected.
Moving forward forever.
Shannon: Absolutely.
Yes.
Me, that's always tell, I'm like, you're stuck
Caroline: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Exactly.
We'll be driving through Mardi Gras.
Next two next couple weeks.
So probably driving through your neck of the woods possibly, I'm sure.
So we should
stop, say hello.
Shannon: You should, yes.
Caroline: My husband
Shannon: some of that bourbon I was gonna say,
Caroline: one.
Yep,
Shannon: exactly.
I was just gonna say the bourbon.
I know your husband loves
it.
Caroline: certainly does.
Shannon: Well, we'll give it up to Kentucky for that, that I, I'll let Kentucky represent the bourbon.
That's cool.
Caroline: Cool, cool, cool.
Alright, my dear Shannon.
We'll,
Shannon: Thank you so much.
Caroline: Take care.
Bye-Bye.
Shannon: bye.