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Explore how the social construct of race and racial oppression operates at multiple levels with a rotating focus on different social systems. Connect with Austin-area justice movement organizers and everyday people with relevant lived experience to lay out historical context, current affairs, and creative possibilities for a liberated future.
Y'all, you're listening live from Austin, Texas, and a large swath of Turtle island is, under a heat wave like we are here. So I hope you're staying cool, at ease, hydrated. Rest is resistance, as Trisha Hershey says. This is Stacey Fraser, and you're listening to Racism on the Levels, a monthly show and a member of the newly found Austin Cooperative Radio Hour Collective in this format. We explore on racism on the levels how the social construct of race and racism operates at the personal, interpersonal, cultural, institutional, and systemic levels.
Speaker 1:With the focus on creative possibilities for a liberated future, I invite community in conversation with Austin area leaders to lay out for you the historical context, the current conditions, and creative visioning on how we can get free. The views expressed here are not necessarily those of the coop board of directors, staff, volunteers, or underwriters creating the show on the sacred ancestral lands of the Tonkawa, the Comanche, the Lipan Apache, the Sanna and the Germanos. People who have faced inconceivable losses and attempted erasure due to violent settler colonialism. I encourage you to consider how you can show up in reclamation efforts. This show centers justice and that requires connecting with ancestors and grounding in historical truth and accuracy.
Speaker 1:You can find the original stewards of the land you're on by visiting native hyphen land dot c a. And now today, I have a lovely guest in all dimensions, Stacey Shea Williams, who my in my mind embodies community here in Austin. Welcome, Stace. Thanks for joining me.
Speaker 2:Thank you. Thank you so much for having me, Stace.
Speaker 1:So, please go ahead and introduce yourself to the listeners.
Speaker 2:Well, my name is Stacey Shea Williams. Like you said, most people know me just as Stacey Shea. Among Stacy's like we become stays among Stacy because because we always know what's good. I've been longtime involved engaged with arts and culture and preservation and history in Austin, Texas. I've been in Austin.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna age myself a little bit here, but, since 1984. And so I've watched a lot of change. Both my parents are artists and scholars and and and hippies and bible belt belt buckle learn. You know? So, I I've I've I've been around at this work for quite some time.
Speaker 2:I'm also a a spoken word artist. I was a writer first, I guess, is is the best way to say. I'm a singer songwriter. I'm a a radio host as well. So so this is weird to be on this side of things.
Speaker 2:I'm not gonna lie. But, yeah, that's that's I'm a mother and a and a and a friend and a sister and a daughter and all the other things that a whole human
Speaker 1:is. Amen to that.
Speaker 2:So I guess that's a start.
Speaker 1:And how about how deep do your roots go back here? Were your parents also from this area? What did they get?
Speaker 2:I am Texan through and through. I'm from my family. Both sides of the family are from surrounding areas. And I've I've got we ended up like I said, we landed here because my dad was in the navy. Uh-huh.
Speaker 2:And we wanted to come back to Texas. So, because this is where our family is in Central Texas, specifically because of how it is and how it feels and the weather and the color of the sky and all the things. Right? And so so so we settled here back, like I said, in 84. And, but, yeah, I am texting through and through.
Speaker 2:I'm not gonna tell you exactly where because that's 1 of the credit questions that they ask you when you're verifying and changing your
Speaker 1:passwords. This is 1 place where you and I for, for once, differ a little bit. I figured they're gonna they're gonna they're gonna find me if they know me. Yeah.
Speaker 2:They have it. Yeah. Yeah. And if you'll listen to
Speaker 1:my other show, y'all heard where I'm
Speaker 2:from Funkytown. Yeah. I'm from Fort Worth, Texas. So but, anyway, thank you so much for having me, and and, wow, what a pleasure. And I'm so glad to be here.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So thanks for sharing that. We met at an Austin Justice Coalition community gathering. This was last May, and it was a community gathering around the Buffalo tragedy, unfortunately. Yeah.
Speaker 1:We were at Kenny Dorham's backyard, which is in the heart of historic black Austin. And I'd love for you to tell me a little bit about the space itself, how it came about, and what your relationship is to the space.
Speaker 2:Okay. So I, I work with Harold there as far as, you know, I'll work the front of the house. I'll run the cabana. I've helped with some some, anytime he ever needs anybody to show up
Speaker 1:to the city, I'm right there.
Speaker 2:And it is a very, very special space. And what I tell people when they come to work there or to volunteer there because we have a blended staff of people that are, like, on on staff and then volunteers as well to supplement, is that this isn't a regular bar gig. Right? Kenny Doris Backyard is 1 of the last places in town where it doesn't matter your socioeconomic status, your race, your your your your nothing. Everybody comes together on neutral territory in appreciation of the music of the food of the art.
Speaker 2:It's an outdoor music, you know, venue, outdoor food court, outdoor muse art gallery. And so everybody comes there and is able to just be human together. And so it's always been a very as soon as I'm, like, came into the space, I was like, oh, yeah. Whatever Harold needs, I'm gonna help him as far and as best as I can, to make sure that we preserve this space because Austin, if we have, if we're gonna be honest, it's very siloed. It's everybody has their their their spot that they go when their their area of town in which they hang out.
Speaker 2:And there's this there's this kind of weird separateness that we have here while we're all moving around together. And in Kenny Doran's backyard, everybody gets to come and be human together. And then they can all go back to their silos, but maybe they've got a seed planted in their spirit to not be a separate when they're in those spaces. So it's really important to me to to not only be there and participate in the in the in the vibe, because it is a vibe. Right?
Speaker 2:Mhmm. But also to do things I can do as far as policy and related things to make sure that those types of spaces are allowed to continue to exist. We can acknowledge change. The neighborhood's changing. That's the thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. You know? But we have to, at the very least, honor and preserve a little piece of what made everybody wanna come there in the first place. So that's why that's that's that's that's space for me. And then, you know, Harold McMillan has been a keeper of the soul and and all that jazz, as they say, for quite some time, like over 40 years.
Speaker 2:So he's dedicated to the work, so I don't mind sitting and learning from him and and helping him out as best I can using my voice in the spaces in the spaces I can.
Speaker 1:Yeah. If y'all haven't, checked out that space, the space that we're talking about, it's it's open. Right? It's it's so accessible. Yes.
Speaker 1:And it's vibrant. There's there's muraling all over and, I believe there's a mural on it that says, what do you miss about east Austin? Is that Yeah. That's on the front.
Speaker 2:On the front. That's on the front. And then there's a cup there's another 1 that's, you know, that are in engagement where you can just drive you know, walk by and write on them. Right? Like, you know, what do you miss about?
Speaker 2:And then I think everyone is is, right now because we they change out. Right? They were ticked. The other 1 right now is, you know, what do you wanna do before you go? You know?
Speaker 2:And, those are important things to consider. Right? And then but this place is open and there's a bunch of food trucks in there. You can just go hang out in there. And, of course it's open for community use if someone wanted to contact him to to use it for something specific.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of free stuff that they do, but we all, you know, there's we also work on space and things. I say we like like I've also worked events there where someone rented out the space. So it it's for community use. We want it to stay alive, and we want it to stay accessible, and we want it to stay diverse. So it's we show up to make it.
Speaker 2:So,
Speaker 1:yeah, so, that leads into my next question for you is how it has that space weathered gentrification?
Speaker 2:Better than most, just to be completely honest because it does have such strong community support. Anytime there's because like I said, it's it's happening. It's happening. It's already done. The land is already purchased in a lot of cases, and, it's it's up for decision making, per city processes and things for the rest of the stuff that's left, the few pieces that are left.
Speaker 2:And, it's weathered better than most because every time it comes up where someone's saying, alright. We're gonna do something else here now and the the community comes out and it's like, no. You're not. Like, no. Thank you.
Speaker 2:And then, of course, district phone reps work really hard to make sure that those black spaces are still preserved as well. So, it's been a rough balance just as an outside observer. This is me not speaking for the organization. This is Stacy Shea Williams speaking as an independent outside observer who works with many of these organizations. It's a really tight rope to make to to that we're in right now in a pivotal time in Austin city planning right this minute, like, right now, that's gonna shape what gets preserved and what Austin shows that it values.
Speaker 2:And, so there's certain places by just existing. There's so many things that just by existing, it's a it's a it's a statement. Yeah. You know? We're here.
Speaker 2:We're here.
Speaker 1:We're visible.
Speaker 2:That's right. Right here. Mhmm. And we're gonna keep meeting here. And, oh, by the way, it's not just us that value it.
Speaker 2:You know? It's it's the the whole community benefits from this. There's so many so many things with music and with art that originated in black East Austin. You know, there's so many opportunities for wound healing that originated in East Austin. And there's nothing wrong with acknowledging the hurt and the harm of the past.
Speaker 2:While also honoring the beauty of it and moving forward and growing it in a way that is inclusive to everyone and and and and sans those ugly things that Austin used to do. And so it's an important time. Like, pay attention y'all. That's all I'm saying. Pay attention to what's going on in in that, cultural heritage district because that's what it is.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. And they're building it up. So pay attention to what's gonna go in there. It's it's really and support the spaces that currently exist, not just Kinney Dorm's backyard. There's there's others.
Speaker 1:What are a couple of other spots that you
Speaker 2:Well, Victory Grill is back up and running, you know, and that's a big deal. And then, of course, there's the there's another African American cultural heritage. So there's a black music museum over there. And, of course, there's just the businesses that exist over there that I'm not gonna name off specifically because I can't possibly remember each of them. And I don't want anybody mad at me, you know, but go walk around.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. Go walk around and, like, connect with the connect with the streets because it's it's got a vibe. Go look at the moon tower. You know, if y'all ever watched dazed and confused, it's not that moon tower, but it was built at the same time as that moon tower. And it's part of the famous set of moon towers.
Speaker 2:It's Austin. It's part of Austin history and culture, that whole area, that whole area. So I don't think there's anything wrong with acknowledging that it's changing and growing and that the people that live there are different now.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:As long as those people that live there and as our city as a whole create a culture of appreciation for what what it was and what was birthed there.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think it's I think that all this is an also situation. Mhmm. So
Speaker 1:what is your dream for the future there? You said there's a lot coming up. Well, what do you what would be your ideal there?
Speaker 2:I want it to look like Harlem Nights. Like, no. No. No. But I want it to look like all the other active arts and culture districts in Austin, Texas, where there's there's thriving businesses that are pointed towards, you know, that specific culture preservation element, you know?
Speaker 2:And there's there's people that come that's got a tourist focus where they come and, you know, that's on the city website that says, hey, while you're in town, check this. Just we aren't having to reinvent the wheel. You know? There's plenty of towns that have active cultural heritage districts, multiple active cultural heritage districts, and they they they highlight each 1 of them in a way that people come to town just to go experience that culture. And if people don't think that Austin was like the like we are the coolest town in the world, maybe, but definitely the United States.
Speaker 2:And I'm not just saying that, you know, but but, no, there's so many things that happen here first. They try it here first. It starts out here first. And then if it takes here if Austin says it's okay, there's so many things that gotta get past Austin to get out. You know?
Speaker 2:And we really need to embrace that and realize we can do a lot of good in the world by being an example of the right way to do things. Yes. You know? We've got an opportunity here specifically with this. This is a neighborhood we basically get to rebuild from scratch If we're talking if we're gonna be completely honest as far as the cultural heritage elements of it, we get to highlight and build those from scratch and rebuild things that were scraped, that were raised because the cultural, anyway, I'm not gonna get into the that part of it right now.
Speaker 2:But but, but it's still there. You know? So we've got an opportunity to build, like, 1 of the coolest cultural districts maybe ever and show others how it's done because they're looking y'all. Like, they watch us.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. You
Speaker 2:know? They watch us.
Speaker 1:So we
Speaker 2:could do it right. That's what I see is us being a really good example of how to mitigate negative gentrification where it exploits the neighborhood and do it in more of a preservation and and honoring the history of the neighborhood. You know, where people kinda walk around and say, yeah. I live in historic black east Austin, and there's this and this and this that we participate in and and all that.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, where it's a just like they do when they're like, well, I'm in Clarksville. I'm in Tarrytown. I'm in, you know, all these things that or Wheatsville that also used to be freedmen colonies.
Speaker 1:If we're
Speaker 2:gonna, you know, if we're gonna go back, it's cool because of same reason as all the rest of it. And we just we can move forward while still acknowledging that it was a a there was 1920 23 freedmen colonies that were around here that made up Boston area, and then there was also Czech and German communities. Like, there if you look at a map of the freedmen colonies, they're dots. Right? In between those dots, there was Chicano, there was German, there was Czech, there was indigenous peoples that were still living in the area.
Speaker 2:So what started Austin was this diversity, and we got lost somewhere along the way. Like, the people got along fine. It was just it was if I say just me saying it. When the politicians came in, we got kinda messy with each other. And so I think this is an opportunity for us to get back to the people.
Speaker 1:Yes. That's what I see for it. Well, I know I myself like to fancy Austin this little oasis micro, you know, microcosm in this greater seat, but but it actually is connected to the rest of the country. And so, you know, what happened in in Austin, you know, the groundwork was laid a long time ago up in the northeast. Right.
Speaker 1:On this continent. And, and so we're not completely removed. And so the waves of the major movements of the civil rights movement happened here locally, and there was a lot of that history in that. I agree with you. It's beautiful to amplify the the Carver Museum, many cultural events, and and I'm also optimistic about that being, elevated in years ahead as east Austin gets built up in a new way.
Speaker 2:Right. No. I think I think so. I think there's some things that we should try to keep as close to the way they are now, and then there's other things that we really need to put a lot of a lot of resources into making them beautiful accessible spaces. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I'm I'm looking forward to seeing what shakes out, but when none none of it's gonna go how anybody wants it if we don't show up and support and and and make our voices heard on those things. So
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:You know, so once we start to participate.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So that that actually brings me to a nice segue into your your role as an artist and a singer. Tell us congratulations on your recent album release.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you. I've been sitting on that 1 for a very, very long time.
Speaker 1:Tell us a little bit about it, and and we're gonna we're gonna hear a couple of clips from it, that tie in directly to the conversation we're having today. So how'd that come about?
Speaker 2:Okay. So me and a and a dear friend of mine named Derek t Washington, who passed away very May 26th, actually, suddenly. But we had been working together, making music together for about 15 years. And then, life does what it does and you go. And so we set it down, and I didn't know how to play guitar.
Speaker 2:And so when when we when the band dissipated 6 years ago or so, I stopped playing altogether because I was like, I don't know how to play my music. This is terrible. But we recently, got everything all back together, and we were like, you know what? We're just gonna release this album of these practice sessions from 5 years ago, to put a bow on it and call it done. Just call it done, and now we're gonna get this new project together, which is what what I'm in, you know, what I'm doing now.
Speaker 2:And we're gonna start doing, writing the new stuff that we'd already been working on. You know, there's we've got piles. We have piles of stuff that we just hadn't finished yet. Right? And then I had piles of stuff and whatever.
Speaker 2:And so we finished the album and set the release date, and he didn't show up to the 1st practice to get ready for the album release party. And and then, of course, we found out that he left. And, but we still did the release party, but it turned instead to be more like a celebration of his body of work of that particular body of work. But it's just the practice sessions. Like, that's him playing on 7 out of 9 of the tracks on it that the, 2 of them are d madness composed, but the rest of them, Derek t Washington composed.
Speaker 2:But it was really just these are recorded practice sessions, put a bow on it so that I can get the new stuff going and and move forward and be done.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow. Thank you. You you just gave me a gave me, and now the listeners coming into this, a deeper appreciation for what we're about to hear. These are the practice sessions. And, yeah,
Speaker 2:you know, it was it's not finished, but it's done.
Speaker 1:To your friend who who has transitioned is still here live with us in the studio today. Right? Yeah. So let's listen to a little bit of tea time. Yeah.
Speaker 3:It's tea time. Get up and set the table. Talk. Come over in your fancy dress and with your Saturday hat. You can break some crumb bits if you like, but, I was thinking brisket sandwiches.
Speaker 3:It's tea time. Get a fence at the table. It's tea time. Hey, Trey. Would you like some tea?
Speaker 4:Indeed. You know the deal, chamomile. Keep it 01:10 on the real we time. Rose Hibiscus, it's us, you and me. Tea time, no driver, no lava way to spend my free time comes to mind.
Speaker 4:Times like this. I wish time would be like this for all time. But for now, time exists in the moment. Wisdom gets me open and the poetry's potent. Whether we sit in the walk and taking the time for relating and relating and talking is the essence.
Speaker 1:Time is precious, and these
Speaker 4:brisket sandwich is the business. It's tea time. Southern sweet Saturday at 3 times. Sister, you look smashing
Speaker 1:What a summer jam.
Speaker 2:III like that 1 too. It sounds fun. When d madness started playing that, I was like, oh, this is this sounds like I'm outside, refreshed.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. Pretending to be cool. Yeah. Pretending to drink a nice beverage if you're not actually doing it. So this song, I I chose to to play this because it this flies in the face of white supremacy culture to me.
Speaker 1:This song, this vibe, this this message. Right? Yeah. It's an antidote, if you will, the song. So was that in your consciousness when you wrote it?
Speaker 2:I think it's always in my consciousness. I think it's in everything I do, and and I'm, you know, not trying to sound all like ethereal or anything like that, but there's certain things that that every person is here to do and they just are that. And, I'm biracial. And so in being that, I am flying in the face of racism. Like, my very existence is is flying in the face at, like, I am.
Speaker 2:I am. And, and I think I I carry that with me through most everything as far as, you know, like, that's all I got, really, when it when it comes right down to it. That's all any of us have. Particular 1, it is very much like was like I was saying about Kenny Doran's backyard. What I love about that is just the coming together and the spaces and things.
Speaker 2:Right? And and, so this song is is I think it's yeah. I mean, I don't know if I did it on purpose necessarily, but, with the song, sometimes I just hear the music and the words just they just come. The song the the music tells me what the words are. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And and then sometimes I'll refine the story, but most of it is a lot of it's real just like first draft. Like, this is what goes on top of this. And I I don't think I did it on purpose, but I think it's something that people need to know. You know, like it's a you're enough, And you're you're enough. You're enough.
Speaker 2:You know, make time to talk to each other. And when you humanize folks, you you get a whole new perspective on things as folks as folks everywhere once we kinda get past what we're told to think about stuff.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And I like that.
Speaker 1:So you mentioned, you know, your biracial identity. How has that shaped your life?
Speaker 2:I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:In in just little small questions on this show. Small questions.
Speaker 2:Okay. So I say to people sometimes I am a black woman and I am a white woman. And I've been arguing with people about that my whole life because they've been asking me to pick and I won't. Like, I am both. I can fully understand.
Speaker 2:And I, I walk in the world realizing that, for a lot of folks and for a lot of folks, I'm I the world engages with me as a black woman, as a woman of color, and I'm aware of that. I'm aware of those differences, in the treatment. I'm aware of those differences in, in in the way that that that folks engage with spaces. I'm probably hyper aware of that given the fact that I've got, you know, my my my my black side of the family and my white side of the family, and I've spent quite a bit of time with both of them, obviously. You know?
Speaker 2:And so there are certain things that that I that I observe, being of both cultures and seeing that some things happen on 1 side that don't happen on the other and vice versa. But the other thing that's happened is that's, you know, I mean, it makes things glaringly apparent that wouldn't be obvious to other people. So that's that's a big thing that's impacted the way that I view the world and engage with the world is because I see things from both sides. And,
Speaker 1:I mean, that's a superpower. You know?
Speaker 2:It's also devastating. Yeah. You know, for some things to be just so obvious, that it's that it's that it's not necessary, for some things to be so obvious that it's not necessary for us to engage with people in certain ways. But it's also I get to see lots of really good examples of how it's supposed to be. And so you got to take the good with the bad, as they say.
Speaker 2:Right? Mhmm. And the stove my grandmother's stove in my head has 8 burners. I didn't separate those as far as, you know, the black kitchen and the white kitchen until last year. So it's kinda cool to have this blend and to be able to see things as as, as also as also.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And.
Speaker 2:As and. Yeah. Like, and. Like, so, yeah, it's it's but it's impacted a lot. But it's also why I've struggled and worked so hard in everything that I do to create spaces where people feel welcome because I have felt unwelcome in so many spaces.
Speaker 1:You
Speaker 2:know, the too white to be black, too black to be white, all the preconceived notions from both and outsiders as as far as others that are not, you know, whatever. So you learn to make spaces and make people feel welcome all the time so that you so that you can kind of make a ripple to where it's not like that for other people.
Speaker 1:Well put. Thanks. Well felt. I felt it. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Thanks. Let's play a clip of save the baby. It's appropriate. If you're just joining us, you are listening to Racism on the Levels. I am joined today by Stacy Shea Williams who has nourished us so far with her story of her stories of Austin, historic Black Austin, East Austin, Kinney dorms backyard.
Speaker 1:And then we were listening to some of the songs off of her recently released album, Practice. Mhmm. And, I just think it's fantastic that your, your baby was, to hear it, the little ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Providing instrumentation at the age of 4 on that song.
Speaker 2:So Yes. She was. She was. She used to come to band practice with me all the time, and I hope 1 day she'll appreciate it. But right now, every time I say, hey.
Speaker 2:You wanna come to band practice with me? She's like, oh, I don't have to? It's boring, you know? And, you know, she's she doesn't she doesn't appreciate it yet, but maybe she will 1 day.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:She's so sick of it because just the thousands of hours that we've spent doing music related stuff. You know? She's like, boring.
Speaker 1:And what a foundation. You know? She'll appreciate the 1 day. She's got that solid foundation to come back to. Just draw from.
Speaker 1:Right? Right. Forever.
Speaker 2:With whatever she wants to do with it. You know? She got that soul. So it's like, no. We we we're creators for sure.
Speaker 2:But and then the the emcee on both of those last 2 was her dad, Trey God, the emcee, a lifetime achievement award hip hop guy here in town who was an architect of the Austin hip hop culture as well back in the late nineties and, probably he was performing before then. But as far as like building, you know, boom box and hip hop hump day and all that stuff, that's all part of him and d madness too, compose those 2. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I had Trey on the show sometime too. I think that would be really cool.
Speaker 2:He's he knows a lot. He really does. And a real talented, accomplished cat. Mhmm. So
Speaker 1:so you are also a radio host
Speaker 2:I am.
Speaker 1:On Austin's oldest community radio station, kazi 88 point 7 FM. Yes. And, tell the listeners who either don't know but should know who KZI is, and what role it plays in the community. How long you've been on?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Sure thing. Thank you. Okay. So KZI was founded back in 80.
Speaker 2:Like, really the battle for it started in the early seventies. I'm not gonna get into all of that right this second. But, there was a whole big, great big donut hole for black representation in media in Austin texas. And, a few folks took it on to say that we are going to provide a space for black media representation as per the, you know, federal law requires. And, and then they got together with, I don't know how to say I could go.
Speaker 2:I could tell you, like, a lot, but I won't. At any rate, they went on the air in in 82. And, it was to empower, educate, entertain, targeted towards the black community, but all of us then. But it was specifically targeted towards black listeners because it was an underserved market. A market a market underserved market.
Speaker 2:So so they were intentionally feeling that. And and, John l Warfield, doctor John l Warfield from from UT, was was 1 was the front of the the point to get it all up and up in mind. And there was there was several of, you know, Linda Linda Lewis and and, a few others, Larry Jackson. And there's there's a bunch of other folks that went into making KZI happen. And, again, I can't name all of them because I'm I'm I can't.
Speaker 2:I'll forget all of them, but, I'll forget someone if I try to do that. But there's a bunch of folks that really went into making this happen. And so for the last 40 years plus, it's been community owned, operated, black owned, operated, community supported, listener supported, and it has held pretty well, to its obligation. Of course, there's always room for improvement with everything when you're dealing with community radio because because it's noncommercial, the money flows different. So so, but it's a really important and and it might be it might be the 1 of the the longest running, black community radio stations in the nation, but it's definitely the longest in Texas.
Speaker 2:And I'm really proud to be a part of it. I've been a DJ and, or radio personality and selector because there's the the the the scratchers, turntable guys will tell you I'm not a real DJ. You know? So I'm a selector. I select the tracks and put them in the computer program that makes them run together.
Speaker 2:And I've got a good ear and have extensive knowledge base of music and everything else, but I ain't scratching anybody's turntables. You know? So I'm not a real DJ. But I'm a radio personality and a selector, and I've been doing that off and on, for the last 15 years with since 2009. Just about almost 15 years.
Speaker 2:And I've I've done everything from co hosting a reggae show, guest hosting a reggae show, sitting in with the wake up call was the morning show there, years ago. And then I did a rock and roll show That was that was pretty cool. And then and then now I do the morning grind. That's Monday through Friday. It's the morning show.
Speaker 2:So What
Speaker 1:time does that come on?
Speaker 2:7:30 to 10 AM. And, we've
Speaker 1:got That's a long show.
Speaker 2:It's a lot it's the morning
Speaker 1:I know.
Speaker 2:I know. And so but it's not just me. I don't do it by myself. There's, you know, we've got a lot of great, like, radio legends that that cohost with me on various days of the week that host with me. I say cohost is the term that I don't really like all that much because we co host.
Speaker 2:I guess if I say it like that, then it's perfect. Mhmm. They're not my co host, if that makes sense. Right? I think that's an important delineation.
Speaker 2:But I'm there every day, and then we have rotating hosts that come in on the other day. And we have a lot of fun, and we talk about all kinds of stuff. And, sometimes it's really fun and sometimes or most of the time, there's a lot of fun. There's some fun thrown in there, but we always make sure to include community engagement things. And we do what all community radio stations do.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Right? Like, the community radio stations, we serve our community just like y'all do.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So we just cover a little different we cover some of the same topics and then some different.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But we have nexuses. So
Speaker 1:so this is a show about racism. So let's let's shed some light. Like, how how and what ways have the station and or your show specifically been impacted by racism or has been touched by racism? Well, I think that's the
Speaker 2:just given the the landscape of Austin, not the physical landscape, but the social and political landscape of Austin has really weathered quite a bit. Again, I'm not speaking officially for the station just as my observation and my involvement and from what I've seen with it is, there's a there's it is still an underserved market. You know? It is still in need of resources and support from the city and the establishment. It's still always back burner when it comes to doling out grant money, when when it comes to doling out funding and things that are going towards things that do what community radio does, that do what specifically what KZI does.
Speaker 2:What I have seen and what I've experienced, and this is just across not just KZI, but with all with with most black things in Austin. If it says that it's specifically for black folks in Austin, it gets put on the back burner and the process to get money all of a sudden gets real complicated. And so so and I sit in a lot of meetings, you know, like they are so sick of seeing me when I walk into places because I'm like, well, what about and also why was it because last time I was y'all just said and and you know, I'm just I'm a pain in the rear and I'm okay with it. I'm okay with being that.
Speaker 1:You're you're you're an agent of accountability.
Speaker 2:I guess so. You know, I mean, thank you for that. That's like the nicest thing anybody's ever said. But no, but but it does all of a sudden get real complicated when it's going to handing out black money or things specifically for black things or or and this is almost worse. I'm just gonna be completely honest.
Speaker 2:It's almost worse that they oversimplify it and say we're gonna give it to 2 organizations. And then Austin gets the check. It's I've given away this 1, 000, 000 of dollars in for towards towards African American, black heritage, this, that, or the other, cultural preservation, this, that, or the other. And they'll they'll give it to 2 people. I mean, that's just I just it's it's more than 2 people.
Speaker 2:But you understand what I'm saying, though? It's, like, generally the same the same players in the in the in the in the thing because in order to be impactful again due to the racism, and it's not their fault either. I'm not faulting the people that are out there doing the work. You know? Some of them are honest about it and great about it.
Speaker 2:Some of them, you know, do just like everybody else does. K? Fine. It is what it is. But it also has to do again with the racism that because things are so complicated, sometimes folks feel like I'm gonna look.
Speaker 2:I know that I'm gonna have to go through this person to get it done, because they're the ones that those folks over there will talk to. And it's problematic. It's it's it's it's problematic. Not not insurmountable, not not unwork aroundable. You know?
Speaker 2:And and not not beyond being able to come to some kind of understanding where everybody can kinda where everybody wins. Like, that's the thing. It's like there is I can definitely see a a way where everybody wins an equal and equitable distribution of resources with Austin, Texas because we ain't broke. You know
Speaker 1:what I'm
Speaker 2:saying? And there's certain things in Austin where they'll just here's the automatic budget line item here. Austin is gonna maintain this because it's part of the history and culture of Austin, and they can't seem to figure out how to do that for east Austin. And it's it's it's I just look at them all the time and I'm like, yeah. But if it's really important to the city, then maybe they could write some stuff in that that's just automatic that that's that they're gonna pay for it and support it.
Speaker 2:And and there's all these other ways that you can preserve things and then get money from the federal government. And, oh, by the way, there's a bucket of, like, 1, 000, 000, 000 of dollars at the state level. You know, so I got these things in my head that
Speaker 1:Yeah. Well, you know, I hear here here's the thing. You're succinctly describing in my estimation systemic racism. Thank you. Organizational racism.
Speaker 1:Yes. These things are squishy. They're amorphous. They're complicated by design. They're difficult to pinpoint and to describe, but you feel it happening.
Speaker 1:So you know it's happening. It's just really hard to go in there and with the, you know, with incision preciseness, figure out, oh, this was the racist decision or this was the policy or this was the the person. You can't because racism is like an octopus that's really clever. No no hate on octopi.
Speaker 2:No. I love that. I am
Speaker 1:a scuba diver. They're awesome. I hate comparing racism to octopi.
Speaker 2:So what I say is it looks like 1 of those like a map of a of a a serial killer that has the or or or, you know, 1 of those people that has all the pins in the map with the strings tying all the stuff together.
Speaker 1:You know? You zoom back and then you start to see patterns. See it. That's right. That's right.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so because I am so involved and because I've been involved with so many things, there's and I'm not the only person. Don't get like, please don't like, there are there's there's lots. You're a person like this as well that's like in all the spots and you're looking at it and you're like, you know, this probably doesn't have to be this complicated. You know? So once you step back and take, like, the bird's eye view of the thing and look at the look at all the pins and where they all go and everything, and then you're like, oh, it's tangled up right here.
Speaker 2:Let's
Speaker 1:fix that real quick. Oh, it's tangled
Speaker 2:up right here. Let's fix that right quick. You know? But there is some heart changing that needs to happen, and there's some folks that need to kind of stop thinking about themselves as gatekeepers and start more thinking of themselves as keyholders. And those are 2 different things.
Speaker 2:And we've got a whole lot of gatekeepers in our community, and we need key holders. And unfortunately, those gatekeepers and key holders are the same person. They just have to change their mind. And that's really hard thing to do. That's a hard thing to get a person to do.
Speaker 2:So that's the thing with that. But
Speaker 1:Yeah. Poetically poetically put.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, I know. Racism impacts a whole lot of stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And you gotta go up the river and then up the river again and then up the river again. By the way, speaking of the river, where is there an east side Riverside restaurant? Crickets. But there's a river over there. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:It's real pretty too. Mhmm. So So it's that kind of stuff. Mhmm. But they're talking about putting a salvage yard over there.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I was gonna say, I don't wanna tell everybody about Secret Beach and where it is exactly.
Speaker 2:They don't tell it.
Speaker 1:Yeah. But I also do know that there are and you can just go on to any community group on Facebook of the neighbor because a lot of neighborhoods have community groups there and see, action around maybe an old plant, that is going up for redevelopment and what that's gonna do to those natural sanctuaries and those waterfronts. And so, if you're so inclined to start poking around, the information's there. You just have to have the the the appetite to look for it.
Speaker 2:They don't make it easy to find. No. They don't make it easy to find, but we do have to stay engaged. And they do have meetings. We can go and talk to them and tell them what to think and take public comment.
Speaker 2:And, at the very least, we have to give the system an opportunity to let us down. So and I say it like that to say, like, we can go and we at least if we go and we say it, when they don't listen to us, we can go back and say, well, we said we went through the process.
Speaker 1:Well, exactly. And, I'm a practitioner and a trainer of kinging and nonviolence conflict Reconciliation and that's a very necessary step is to present the ask. Show what you want and when they say no because you're prepared for them to say no, that's when you move into direct action, and you have direct action to show the injustice.
Speaker 2:I'd love to see that gave me goosebumps.
Speaker 1:Then you go back to negotiation, and that's there is a way. Right? That's right. Thank you, doctor King. Yes.
Speaker 2:I mean,
Speaker 1:that was that was that was his and many other people's.
Speaker 2:But I would say we're asking the wrong questions. Mhmm. And what is our ask as a community? And because of that gatekeeper thing I was talking about earlier, there is not a unified ask because everybody wants to be the 1. And we
Speaker 1:also have a unified community in all the cases because we are we are driven and we are driving ourselves into increasing individualization, individuality, the the collective, the us Yeah. You know, is is, often lost to the eye.
Speaker 2:Yeah. We're gonna die if we keep that up. Yes. Like, we can save. We we have to.
Speaker 2:That's the only way it's gonna be. That's the only only way. Are intertwined. Yes. Because where do I live if we don't do it that way?
Speaker 2:That's what I always ask people. Like, if we don't figure out how to get all the racist to to get along and for us to realize that it's really like it's a social construct more than anything, and yes. The cultures our culture were different because we live in different places and you're like the people you're around, but it really is a social construct. So where do I live if we don't figure out how to get that together? Because I'm all of it.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. And so many of us are all of it and don't even know it. You know? Like, let's let's see about the family secrets and things. You know?
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Absolutely. No. You're right. We're we are we I am a white bodied woman.
Speaker 1:I, I actually went into, We Are Finding Freedom, which is an organization they were founded out in North Carolina, but, I completed an anti racist genealogy course. And in that process, I, for the first time in my forties, really took the time to find out my story of my where they came from, and how. There is direct privilege going back into my ancestry that that I really didn't know it came to life that way. Right? And so, to other white body folks out there, you know, it's the tools these days for genealogical research are amazing.
Speaker 1:Yep. And if you still are of the belief that you're not connected to others I'm doing air quotes. Air aids. The others, you are. I guarantee you.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:There's no such thing as other.
Speaker 1:Nope. Like, not me.
Speaker 2:Othering is an action, but it's not a real it's not a thing. It's a it's a concept and it's a it's a way that we behave towards each other, but we really are not. Like, I'm not a half monster. Whichever whoever you think is a monster. If you think white folks are monsters, if you think black folks are monsters.
Speaker 2:I'm not half monster either way you slice it. You know? So
Speaker 1:And that's the other thing. There is no room for dehumanization in this at all. Like, everybody is playing a role in these systems of oppression. And so, you know, we've gotta humanize. We gotta find our humanity.
Speaker 1:We gotta find our humanity with the the people that are, you know, in the racial categories we're in and the other racial categories and then fight and then focus on that humanizing. Right? That's right. We have more in common than we do different. That's right.
Speaker 2:That's the key. That's the key. Mhmm. As I say, I throw parties. You know?
Speaker 2:We gonna have a party. We gonna eat and drink and
Speaker 1:be merry. Music. Exactly.
Speaker 2:We're all cousins through the groove. And so it's just it's it's really important for us to remember that. And there's we hear so much about all the disparities and all the things, but as I would tell people in my training classes when I was trainer back in the day is, systems are a closet full of binders. Systems are a closet full of binders. It doesn't become harmful until you bring it off the paper.
Speaker 2:And it matters how you bring it off the paper, because there's very few places where it's written down that says, we're gonna, make sure that 4 times, there's the negative results for mortality with with black women than there is other. You know, we're gonna make sure that that happens. That's not written in the paper. That has everything to do with how the people engage with those individuals, person to person. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Person to person. Mhmm. So, you know, it wouldn't be so hard out there if we weren't so hard on each other as I like to say. Mhmm. And and where would I live?
Speaker 2:I wanna live a place. I wanna be comfortable somewhere. I wanna go someplace where I know that that, that everybody, that that we can exist, that I can exist no matter what I am, no matter what my gender, my sexuality, identity, whatever. None of that stuff. I have the right to exist as a human.
Speaker 2:And so everything I do is really working towards trying to gain that respect for humanity, for individuality, for, what each of us we're each sacred individuals. We're stardust. Mhmm. Yeah. Like, we're all sacred.
Speaker 2:So anyway, I think we gotta remember that and treat each other as such.
Speaker 1:So I don't wanna bring us to a into a dark place after that really beautiful, illuminating, poetic statement. But, I do wanna ask you, since I have the opportunity to do so, about your background in raising awareness about human trafficking. So tell me a little bit about that. I saw that in your Oh, yeah. I've done that.
Speaker 2:I used to do a whole lot of work with that before I had my daughter, and and I participated with, quite a with the Zonta Club of of, International Zonta Club. And Texas Young Lawyers Association was another 1 that I worked with as well. Human trafficking is 1 of these modern day slavery. I am an abolitionist. I I again, respect for humanity, respect for every person's right to exist and to reach their full potential and self actualization on all levels.
Speaker 2:Anywhere I can touch that and make it better, that's what I'm gonna do. Human trafficking is the thing that's going on, like, right now, every day, all around you. It's devastating. It's dangerous. And, unfortunately, when the when the society has a sick heart, there's gonna be a demand for it.
Speaker 2:But that that means that the those that can see it and can help should, and so I've raised a ton of money for raising awareness towards that and then resources for individuals when they are rescued from human trafficking. I've worked with organizations that helped to change laws and, to make it where if a person gets arrested, you know, there is a delineation between being a prostitute or being prostituted. So so so the individuals that are that are arrested, they can then instead of being treated and criminalized, they get resources. They get help. So I think it's really important for all of us.
Speaker 2:We have a responsibility.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Right? If we we if our ability to respond.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. You
Speaker 2:know, respond we respond to the best of our ability, and I happen to be a writer and know a bunch of really, really good writers and had a connection to a club that wanted to make some noise about this. And so when they asked when they made the ask, we we showed up for them. And, and it's been taken off, and it's been it's been quite successful. And there's been a continuation of that raising awareness, continuation of the raising of the funds, creating, housing for people to go when they get when they get rescued. Because oftentimes, you have to you have to go into hiding.
Speaker 2:They have to hide when they come out. Mhmm. And then they also have to go through some trauma, related rehabilitation things to help to kind of come out of that hackles up lifestyle. And I feel good about being a modern day abolitionist. And I'm pretty sure that that Harriet Tubman wasn't real happy about the work she had to do all the time, but she slept good every night when it was time to do so.
Speaker 2:It's not always a time for rest. You know? Mhmm. So, I just try to
Speaker 1:pay attention and, you know Who who are, who is the organization here in in the Austin community that if if people wanna learn more or if they want to
Speaker 2:I was I was
Speaker 1:Get involved.
Speaker 2:Let me see. There's a lady, miss Annette Emery, and I I don't wanna, I
Speaker 1:don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 2:I don't wanna say that. Give me
Speaker 1:a minute.
Speaker 2:I'll Okay. I'll tell you that. And then there's
Speaker 1:also Zonta Club. Is Zonta Club an
Speaker 2:international organization? International organization. And if you start there, it's probably on their front page. You know, like, that's a good place. And they've got, like, a list of resources available there last I checked as well.
Speaker 2:So let me pull up this other 1.
Speaker 1:Yeah. You know, I I was, I spent 20 years in nonprofit in the nonprofit industrial complex. I was at all levels and all organizations, grassroots to national headquarters to consulting to nonprofits. And people can get lost in the sea of nonprofits and then not give to any nonprofit because it is confusing and saturated and, there's a trust issue issue, and there's a funders issue. So, that's why I'm asking is, you know what?
Speaker 2:I'll tell you, but but I just I gotta be
Speaker 1:There's a lot of noise. Yes. Yes. Of course. Yes.
Speaker 1:Of course.
Speaker 2:That's why I said, if I start with Zonta, then I know that that's probably Yeah. Like, I can at least
Speaker 1:say Safe. Like, I know for sure I'm not gonna Sure.
Speaker 2:Get anybody in trouble for that. But there's, DHS, of course, I can say that. Sort of safe is definitely big
Speaker 1:Safe Alliance.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Like, that's a really big 1. I'd start there. Do Safe Alliance and DHS Department of Health, you know, Health and Health and Human Services. Sorry.
Speaker 2:They changed their name, Sunset Commission 2 years ago, 3 years ago. Anyway, but that'd be the place to start. And then also, of course, 311 is always that's a good 1 you can call or 911 depending on the situation. You gotta be real discreet about it when you're that's also why I'm kinda being, hold on a second. There's a number I can give you, though.
Speaker 2:I used to know there's a poem. Let me find the the number for you right off top. It's in my phone. Sorry about that. Thank you for your patience.
Speaker 2:And it's a 1. 888. Where's Jo Van Zant when you need her? She she wrote this really cool poem that we perform just about at every, human trafficking show. And it's, you know, everybody goes, 1 888 373-7888.
Speaker 2:That's what it is.
Speaker 1:So There you go.
Speaker 2:So that was that was 1 of the ones that we would always do, but there's so many things that are also impacted with human trafficking, though. It's it's got a big ripple. The clothing that we buy, the food and the like, the processed foods that we get. There's just kinda lots of ways that we can be more conscientious. It's not always it's not always I'm gonna steal this woman and then put her into take this child and put them on out in the field to work.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. Sometimes it's I'm gonna make this these, you know, make them give me their documents and then make them work for me in a indentured this is air quotes here. Indentured servitude type of setting where it's much less obvious that it's human trafficking. As long as there's a demand for it, there's gonna it's gonna be so we have to help each other as far as we can.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Well, we are we are winding down here this hour, and it flew. We didn't even get through everything. I was
Speaker 2:like, what? I was like, I've done a lot.
Speaker 1:We got through a lot. We didn't we can get through everything. And I appreciate it
Speaker 2:so much.
Speaker 1:How can, how can folks find you, and how can they find your music?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Stacy Shea says on all the social medias, STACIESHEA, says, SAYS, across everything. You can find me there. The album is available on, digital platforms. And also, I've got hard copies that I have not put in stores yet, but I'm I'm like, I'm kinda nervous about that part of it.
Speaker 2:It's so scary. They don't tell you about that part. And you don't have a stupid
Speaker 1:We'll we'll have a whiskey, and I'll walk hand in hand with you to those stores and
Speaker 2:put them in the house. Put them in the stores. Right? So I got a couple of rounds I gotta make, but you can also just contact me and I'll deliver them. And we've got an upcoming show on the 5th August at Kenny Dorm's backyard, so they'll be there.
Speaker 2:We're gonna be doing with international grooves night, opening for the Gumbo Yayas, which is gonna be really fun under we play under Texas Creole band now. The album is called practice. Stacy Shea featuring KamaSora practice. And, yeah, Stacy Shea says on everything.
Speaker 1:Alrighty. Stacy, thank you again. Thank you for tuning in. The music you heard, and the intro was Shoyinka Rahim's album Bebo Love. And then you heard Stacy Shea Williams 2023 album practice featuring commissar in the middle of the show.
Speaker 1:This and previous episodes are available anywhere you listen to podcasts by searching for racism on the levels. I'd love to hear from you. My email is stacy with an ie@k0op.org. I also wanna thank Michelle Manning Scott for engineering today's show. Please come back next month.
Speaker 1:My show is going to be every 3rd Wednesday at 2 PM. And remember, in all things and always, love is the highest level.