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Austin Current is the author of Science of Strength training. A great book that goes over the basics of strength training and the foundation of what anyone should know as they work for greater health and fitness. Purchase his book here
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Creators and Guests
What is LiftingLindsay's More Than Fitness?
Dive into the joy of fitness with Lindsay and other guests exploring how it goes well and beyond the gym floor, the number on the scale, the size of your waist or the calories you're counting.
Lindsay: Welcome to the
Lifting Lindsay podcast.
I am super excited, guys.
I have Austin Current on here with me.
And when did we meet Austin?
Was that for, that was a long time ago.
When was it?
Austin: 2018 maybe?
Lindsay: Oh my goodness.
It was, was it the first?
It wasn't the first N one camp.
Austin: No, it would've been
probably the second or third
Lindsay: That's it.
That's crazy.
It's been forever.
Oh my
Austin: goodness.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It doesn't seem like that long.
Lindsay: It doesn't, but what's
crazy is then we just barely saw
each other again at another N one
Austin: Yeah.
Yeah.
It tends to be where we
see each other, which is, I
Lindsay: I know
Austin: it's great.
Lindsay: where's, is there
a nerd camp going on?
We'll be there like,
Austin: Yeah.
Muscles nerds.
Great.
I'll be there.
Lindsay: yep.
I love it.
Okay, Austin, I'm actually gonna
have you introduce yourself.
I feel like you could do a better job.
Austin: We'll see.
I.
Lindsay: talk about
biomechanics camps and such.
So go ahead and let my
audience know who you are.
Just a little bit about you.
Austin: Yeah, so I've been a
personal trainer since 2013.
I started in person, got into
the online space, uh, and I've
continued to do both ever since.
I started lifting when I was about 12,
and so that was an early part of my
life that really got ingrained into me
and the physical pursuit of things, my
ability to physically express myself
through strength training really
drove a lot of my, my teenage years
in childhood and into my, my early
adulthood, which got me into competing
and professionally in bodybuilding.
I turned pro when I was 20 in the
IFPB and I had a short stint about
a four year career there in the IFPB
competing and physique, which was great.
I learned a ton about myself.
I learned a ton about a, this
thing that we do, uh, about.
Working with people, working of all
different types, and learning how to
push myself and learning kind of what
works, what doesn't, or what may work
better for some and, and not for others.
And that's just kind of continued on.
And so, you know, I started
lifting when I was quite young.
Have had a lot of people around me who
were very, very smart and very, very
intelligent and, and really guided me in
the right direction from a very young age.
And so I've been very
fortunate in that way.
And fortunately, I've, I've
just been a sponge, uh, my,
my whole life here lifting.
And I've taken in a lot and I've had a
lot of opportunity to study, not only
through university, but also under
some really smart people and, and other
trainers and educators in the space.
Uh, so that's kind of what's landed
me up to this point and led me to
writing my book, Science of Strength
Training and publishing that in 2021.
Lindsay: Science of Strengths Training.
So I think I shared that one or two
times in stories because I, I get a
lot of questions, with, with women
and men who are just starting out
and they don't know where to even go.
They may even be overwhelmed by the
amount of information that I share.
Some women have even been like,
can you point to the tricep?
Like what are triceps?
Like you keep saying this
word or, or whatever.
Right.
Can you, can you point there?
Your book is actually one
that I've strongly encouraged.
Even some coaches, I'm like, I think
you're missing some of the basics.
Austin: Yeah.
Lindsay: You probably just want
that on your shelf to like freshen
up yourself or even to use it as
a resource for your own clients.
So I, I love that book.
I.
Austin: Thank you.
I really appreciate it.
I, I had two audiences in mind when
I wrote it, uh, to try and touch
on, and I hopefully did a good job.
I think I did a fairly decent job,
at least at kind of bridging the
gap for people who are just kind
of starting out into the gym.
So your beginner's more novice up to like
an intermediate level of, Hey, I just
got into this and, or I've been into it
for a bit, but I need to learn more, or
would like to dive in a little bit more.
And then the early on personal trainer
who you know, you can put names to
things, you can put processes to things.
You can put certain systems to, uh,
to kind of see it, how it works in
practice with things that you may
have already been doing where you're
like, oh, this is why that works.
Or This is why muscles
grow when I do that.
I was kind of hoping to touch on
those early on gym goers, but also
the early on personal trainers
and kind of bring it all into one,
and into one affordable resource.
So I'm hoping I did
that and I think I did.
Lindsay: Yeah, it's on Amazon.
Is it?
I'll, I'll put a link in the notes.
Austin: Yeah, it's on Amazon.
Yeah, it's Science of Strength Training.
If you just go to Amazon and type in
strength training book, it's usually
the one of the first to pop up.
But yeah, it's got a yellow cover,
so it's pretty easy to spot.
Lindsay: Okay.
Okay.
We'll put it in the show notes
'cause it is really good.
I really do like it as a resource.
I was really excited when you
published that and I, I think I was
like on the wait list and everything
'cause I wanted to support you, but
also I love, um, books like that.
I love and I love you.
I love that you're a life learner.
And I feel like one of the reasons why I
wanted to have you on here is because I
feel like you're one that will dive into
the nuance, but then you have the wisdom
to know where to place the information.
Austin: Yeah,
Lindsay: Does that make sense?
Austin: Absolutely.
I, I think that's, I think that's
a part of kind of aging and, and
maturing in any field that you're in.
Uh, I think when you're first
starting out into something, you tend
to find yourself living within one
extreme or another, and it tends to
be fairly myopic or narrow viewed,
Lindsay: mm-Hmm.
Austin: and everything seems
to be filtered through.
Well, this has been my experience,
which is great, but as you become more
seasoned in any career, that no longer
keeps working to a degree, right?
And you have to start to be able to
dive deep, but also to take your, remove
yourself from it to have a, a higher
kind of 30,000 foot view of, okay.
This is all well and good,
but now where do I put this?
How do I use this more specifically with
people when, when and where they need it?
The best way I've been able
to kind of think about it is.
On your computer, you kind
of have these folders, right?
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: On your desktop, let's say you
have a folder with a bunch of stuff in
it, sometimes organized, sometimes not.
That's sometimes how we
learn things and retain them.
I see the information that we
accumulate in our career as these
folders that we can go and click on.
And sometimes there's subfolders, there's
sometimes there's subfolders within
those subfolders, depending on how much
depth you have in a certain subject.
But regardless, you're, you're able to
kind of go to a certain folder, open it
up, and go to this reservoir of knowledge
that you've been able to accumulate
through experience or through study and
learn kind of where to apply it and why.
And I think being able to go deep
but also go wide and zoom out
they're both very important skills.
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
It, it's so true.
Um, I did wanna ask you a few questions
about what do you, because you, I
mean, you started lifting at 12.
Austin: Mm-Hmm.
Lindsay: I remember my husband wasn't,
his dad told him that he couldn't lift
until he was 14 because it would stunt
Austin: stunt
his growth.
Lindsay: Yeah.
Probably.
Probably one of the, um, I mean
that, that one, it just never dies.
It's kind of like the
knees over toes thing where
Austin: Oh yeah.
I get that all the time at the gym.
Uh, when I'm training people in
person, or doing a in-person seminar
or something, people are like, now when
I do this lunge, now I know my knees
aren't supposed to go, beyond my toes,
and I'm like, not necessarily true.
You know, you then you gotta go into
it and you're like, well, this is
why, this is why this is a position.
Right?
And yeah, those myths
kind of never, never die.
Um, unfortunately.
But yeah, I started young.
Yeah.
Lindsay: So let's talk about that
because I actually had somebody recently
reach out to me saying my 10-year-old
wants to start lifting with me.
But it's gonna stunt his growth.
We didn't talk about this before, but have
you ever heard where that myth came from?
Austin: I don't know the
exact history of that myth.
You know, I know we have a lot of,
we kind of know generally kind of
where that 10,000 steps came from.
Right.
More of a, a Japanese marketing campaign.
Um, but it also kind of works out.
It checks out because the ideal
amount of steps per day is somewhere,
bet probably between eight to 10,
Lindsay: Yeah.
Austin: if not maybe a little bit more
depending on where you're at in life
or what else you do for a living.
So that's a, that's something that
came from somewhere that it really
shouldn't have, but also it kind
of worked out, which is great.
I'm not sure where it came
from, but I would like to know.
I'm not sure how it
would stunt your growth.
Um, similar to young
children drinking, uh, soda.
I'm not sure how that
would stunt growth either.
Lindsay: Hmm
Austin: I think there's a indirect
rationale that would make sense there,
potentially of like, well, if you're
just drinking a bunch of soda, you're
not getting the right nutrients.
You won't grow great.
But also, like, you know,
kids are probably eating food
alongside the soda, hopefully.
Right.
Some nutrients.
Right.
So they're gonna grow.
Also, you can feed a kid anything
and they're gonna probably grow, so.
Right.
So, um,
Lindsay: And some moms like me are like
to the point of frustration of we will
just give you anything if you just eat.
'cause some kids,
Austin: yeah, I mean, we're very picky.
I mean, I would eat, I mean, if it wasn't
a chicken tender, I mean, get outta here.
Lindsay: Yeah.
Yeah.
That is kind of how it is.
It's the chicken nuggets
or die kind of thing.
Like
Austin: yeah.
Live and breathe chicken nuggets, baby.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's, those are the best.
Um, but back on track.
Lindsay: barely found out
that it came from a study
Austin: Okay.
I.
Lindsay: they looked at young children
who were forced to work in either camps
or I think it might have been like
post World War II where there wasn't,
and, and they totally ignored the fact
that these children were starving.
Austin: Right,
Lindsay: They totally ignored the
nutrition coming in piece and they only
looked at, and I think it was in Japan.
I.
They only looked at, these children are
forced to work and look at how much work
they do and their growth is stunted.
And so now people are like, this
is really where it came from.
That's where it came from.
You mean nobody paused to say
And they're also not eating,
Austin: right.
Yeah.
I mean, look at any, I, I don't think
any point in history where a human
being would be emaciated beyond belief.
Under fed and overworked, they've
ever been thriving physically,
Lindsay: Exactly.
Austin: ever.
Right.
That doesn't make any sense.
So when you think about, you know,
uh, resistance training and starting
to integrate this in, in a younger
person's life, it's, you know, I
think it all kind of starts with it
first starts with play, right?
I used to jump off jungle
gyms that were fairly tall.
I, I would try to jump off, I was
the kid that would just try to
jump off the highest thing I could.
And you know, if that's not stunt in
my growth, I don't know what, what
would, you know, like I'm just jumping
off high, high stuff and landing
straight on my, you know, bones.
Like, if that is, you know, it's
not like I'm, I'm not the tallest
person in the world, but I'm, I'm of.
Who knows, I'm
Lindsay: it all.
Austin: Maybe that explains it all.
I'm of average height of a
male in the us so there you go.
Um, but it starts with
play, in my opinion.
And, and getting kids to play,
um, and through play, you know,
they, they see resistance on their
muscles, on their bones, on their
connective tissues regardless.
Right.
I play, I played sports
from a very young age.
I started playing sports, uh,
when I was five, started playing
basketball, football and baseball
when I was around five years old.
And so I got a ton of play
throughout my childhood regardless.
Right.
So I think when it came time for
me to become interested in strength
training and resistance training, I
think I had a really good base already.
When I was 12 too.
It's, it's not like I started out
back squatting for one rep max
and, you know, trying to power, uh,
deadlifts, you know, 300 pounds.
Like I started out with
some body weight stuff.
Once I mastered some body weight
stuff, my brother took me into the gym.
He's a couple years older than I am.
He'd started to teach me all the things
that he was learning and from a very,
the same strength conditioning coach
that I ended up having throughout my
sports performance training years,
who's, who was extremely overqualified
and very, very smart and put all of us
in a, in a great position to succeed.
And so my brother was kind of handing that
knowledge off that he was learning to me.
And even when I first started going
into the gym, it was still like,
okay, we're gonna do body weight dips.
We're gonna do pull-ups.
We may get into some dumbbells
today, but probably not.
If we do, they'll be really light
and I'm gonna control for form.
I'm gonna be sure that you're,
you're coordinating the movement.
It looks natural.
You know, you're not gonna harm
yourself or injure yourself.
And I, I think more, it has
more to do with the environment
that this, these younger kids or
adolescents are, are within, right?
And I think the trouble you get in
when you're young is really anytime,
but especially when you're young,
'cause you tend to be a little bit
more uncoordinated, especially when
under load, 'cause your, your whole
life's been spent under body weight,
so you add any external load to that.
The first time you squat or bench
press, you tend to look like a
giraffe that's just been born.
And, you know, you're like, okay,
I don't know how legs work now.
Um, but with that, I do think it is
environmental and I, I think one of the
best things you can do as a parent and
I, I, you know, if I have children, this
is certainly something I'm gonna do.
Um, but I see it happen at the gym a
lot, which is, you know, these 11, 12,
13 year olds will start to come in with
one of their parents and they'll start
to train with their parents and they'll
start to work out with their parents.
They'll gain positive associations
with the act of going, it'll become
a consistent routine in their life.
They'll have hopefully
positive memories towards it.
And it's a very reinforcing behavior.
They're, they're inevitably
gonna feel better from it.
They're inevitably gonna
feel stronger from it.
They're gonna physically start to look
better, they're gonna start to physically
perform better in the, in the world, uh,
in their everyday life or through sports.
As we know, it's, it's also very impactful
for cognitive development as well.
As a younger person's brain is developing,
you know, it, it increases, uh, bd NF,
which essentially helps promote like
neurogenesis, neuroplasticity, the
brain's ability to form and adapt to new
things and become essentially better,
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: and stronger and better
neural pathways and, and all of those
things which are, is very interesting.
I think you should probably be mature
enough to be able to listen, you should be
mature enough to understand the impact of
what this can have if you're not careful.
I'm, I'm in full support of, you know,
11, 12 year olds being in the gym and
lifting weights and starting to place
resistance on their, on their muscles,
bones and connective tissues to help 'em
adapt even stronger and, and even better.
Um, 'cause as we know as well, the
stronger that we can have those things
be, the more resilience they have
across our lifespan, and typically
the stronger they, they stay.
Uh, and we can help stave off things
like osteoporosis and dynapenia and
sarcopenia and all the things that, all
the muscle diseases that we see arise,
uh, in middle age and beyond for adults.
If you're able to, to gain a fundamental
baseline of strength and, and bone mineral
density, that's, that's massive for young
children, you're really setting 'em up
for success in a big way physically.
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
I totally agree with that.
And then just adding on like
the, them learning, uh, grit
and gaining confidence in
themselves.
Austin: Oh yeah.
Lindsay: So my suggestion would be
for moms and dads who wanna start
bringing their kids to the gym.
Would be like, look for the wins.
Don't, I mean, obviously we want to
educate them on form, but I don't
want somebody being like, that's
not the iliac fiber we're going for.
It's like, no, no, no, no.
You make it fun.
You build their confidence and you teach
them respect of, um, like the people
around, um, awareness of them and of the
like machines and of the weight, right?
Because you gotta respect that,
otherwise you're gonna be stupid with it.
Austin: Absolutely.
Lindsay: So I think it's a great thing.
I love that you were so young
when you very first started.
So you, you're coming from a
sports background doing weights,
then, you're a coach, you've also
done body, uh, building shows.
And now you're not competing.
I kind of want you to walk us through
that because, and I'm gonna tell you
why I want you to walk us through this
because I think I still remember one the
first time I met you, and you and Cassem
Hanssen were asking me some questions.
I remember saying, I feel like what I see
is somebody does one bodybuilding show and
then all of a sudden they think that they
know everything because they get shredded.
But the truth is they
actually don't know very much.
They only learned an extreme.
And I watched you and you were
like nodding like, Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm.
And I felt like that resonated with you,
Oh, big time.
Yeah..
Yeah.
So talk a little bit about that,
because you've been there, you've
done it, and so many women are now
following competitors and getting some
weird ideas that this is how we all
should live for health and fitness.
What has your experience been like?
Austin: I, I think that spending
time in an extreme can be valuable
because it gives you the, if you're
open and receptive to receiving
this, it allows a perspective to be.
gained, right?
It's hard to have perspective
without experience.
'cause how would you, perspective
is contextual to experience.
So if you don't have an experience
within something, it's hard to
have a perspective within it.
So that's one thing.
And so I, I think having such an
extreme experience with fitness and
bodybuilding and attempting over,
let's say, I think my total career was
probably five or five years probably.
Um, so over a five year period, really
my sole focus in life was how much
muscle can I truly get whilst being
as lean as humanly possible and then
be judged on that, competing against
some of the best physiques in the world
Lindsay: That's not just you judging
yourself in the mirror, but having
to hear outside views of your body
Austin: Oh, having grown men
and women, pick your body apart
Lindsay: Oh my
Austin: and then give you, give you a
sheet of paper at the end that basically
says, this is where you're lacking.
Fix it.
It's not for the faint of
heart, you know, you have to,
Lindsay: Yeah.
Austin: you kind of, you're
opening yourself up to that.
And also it's very subjective, right?
So what one person likes
another person may not.
The, the extreme does help
gain perspective, right?
You know, when I'm teaching these things
to people that I train and coach that
are early on, who are very similar to
people that you describe, I explain
things in a way where it's like, it's,
it's like that, but the light version.
Everything's kind of the light version.
But also understanding that there is
this reality of we can really gain
80 to 90% of the total benefit we're
ever gonna gain from that thing, like
strength training with fairly low effort
relative to what a bodybuilder is doing
to maximize and optimize that, right?
For example, this is an example that
I, I think can, can help visualize it.
So we know in strength training
that the first set that we do, I.
The first really hard set we do is
gonna be the most stimulatory towards
a type of growth response or a positive
adaptation we're going for there.
That's gonna be the most
stimulatory set we do.
And every set there on has a
smaller impact on benefit and
a higher impact on fatigue.
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: Right?
So the first set we get, let's say
90% or 80% of what we're gonna get.
Then the second set is the next five
to 7%, and then the next set is the
next one to 2% or whatever, right?
And so each one, like the first, the
first couple sets are like, by and
large the most effective sets you're
ever gonna do with the lowest risk of
downside in terms of downside here is
fatigue that we're gonna have to manage
properly across the week so we don't
get injured or overtrain or something.
And so using that analogy, I think
it's important to kind of put it
in perspective with any effort
that you're putting in, right?
So being able to have a level of, of
direction and tension with things like
nutrition or your training or, you know,
working on your cardiometabolic health
with aerobic training, like cardio
training, most of those benefits are gonna
come from those early on efforts, right?
That aren't, to the degree, that
doesn't say you have to continue
those consistently over time.
Let's say if you're doing, you can get
80% of the benefit from doing two or
three really solid training sessions
across a week versus, someone who,
you know, like myself, when I was
competing in bodybuilding, I would do
two sessions a day, six days a week.
From those extra sessions, yes, I'm
getting more benefit towards my goal, but
each session beyond those first three were
very small amount in which I had to also
very closely manage my fatigue, manage
my muscular damage, manage my soreness.
I had to manage, there's a lot more
factors I had to manage that I, if going
back and I didn't compete and I was just
kind of living my life as I do now is just
like a person in the world trying to be
healthy and, you know, strong and capable
and maintain my health over, over time.
You know, I, I fully endorse having
really a really, really solid two
to three days per week of training.
And if you don't love training, that's
more, that's more than enough to reap most
of the benefit you'll ever get from it.
And I, I think that's an important thing
to understand and that understanding
that, you know, more isn't always better.
Right.
A deeper deficit isn't
always more effective.
Right.
And, you know, sleeping 12 hours isn't
probably gonna, inevitably could be better
than just a consistent seven to eight,
Lindsay: So understanding the
minimums, the minimum effective dose,
Austin: I guess that's
what I'm trying to say.
Yeah.
That's a good way to put, yeah.
Lindsay: probably the most beneficial.
If, if somebody could grasp that,
Austin: Mm-Hmm,
Lindsay: that's, that's
80 to 90% of the rewards.
Austin: Absolutely.
And, and think of like a
minimum effective dose.
So there's a new study that came out.
Uh, a minimum effective
dose to have, a fairly large
impact on all cause mortality.
So think anything that can kill you,
like cardiovascular disease, uh, stroke,
diabetes, you name it, 60, just 60
minutes a week lowers that risk up to 33%.
I think the study said, um, or quoted,
but 33% less risk of dying from something.
And strength training, we know helps
with up to 40 different chronic
diseases that people die from.
Like the most deadly diseases
that we have that humans get.
Strength training helps
stave off 40 of those.
and those are kind of, those all course
all cause mortality risks, right?
So by just doing 60 minutes, right, that's
two 30 minute sessions, that's three
20 minute sessions across a week can
lower that by, you know, up to 30, 40%.
And that, I don't want you to get
too caught up listeners in the, the
percentages or the whatever, but it's
just understanding that minimum effective
dose where you're getting so much
benefit from just doing something, right?
And the important thing is finding
that something that you enjoy enough to
consistently show up and do it right.
Same with the nutritional approach
or whatever lifestyle you're
trying to to create around it.
But those minimum effective doses are
extremely powerful and you tend to get,
again, reap most of the benefit from
the minimums, which are very important.
Lindsay: Yeah.
I love that.
So when it comes to, let's
move over to nutrition.
When it comes to nutrition, what do you
feel like, if we can continue calling
'em like the minimum effective dose,
what are some things that people then
should be looking at as far as minimums?
Because a lot of times, sadly,
our reference point is maximums.
Like I even just had somebody reach
out to me today saying, what's
the maximum of protein I can have?
I'm like, why are you
asking that question?
Like,
Austin: Who cares?
Like eat until you can't, I don't know.
Yeah.
Lindsay: I'm like, I know.
It's like, it's like caffeine.
There is none.
Okay.
There is, but there is with caffeine.
But somebody who's addicted
like me will say there is.
Austin: Again, like it, it's
all very contextual, right?
And you know, I've, there's been periods
in my life where I am, my caffeine intake
has been over a thousand milligrams a day.
Lindsay: Whoa.
Austin: which for me at that
time was like, you know, I
slept fine, I was normal.
but obviously you start to gain,
so obviously the higher caffeine
usage, it becomes less effective.
Right?
It's like any other drug.
Caffeine is a drug.
Like any other drug.
It's just one that's more accepted and
one that has very minimal downside.
I mean, I was a professional athlete at
that time in terms of, I, I trained like
a professional athlete at the time, right?
So two, two sessions a day,
I was going to school, I was
working, I just, I had to survive.
So that was what I was doing, right?
but also, like if my grandma has a
green tea, she's up for two days.
So
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: everyone's different with,
with what they can tolerate or
what their body demands, right?
And your body metabolizes
things differently.
metabolizes everything
differently in many ways.
And, and sometimes you can be
better at metabolizing that or, or
less, uh, have less effectiveness
of metabolizing certain things.
You know, I, I do think having this
minimum effective dose mentality
around most things you do, because
more can be better in that scenario.
So as long as you kind of are able to
nail down like, okay, what is my minimum
effective dose that I know is making
a positive, creating a positive in my
life towards a better version of myself
and a healthier version of myself?
Let's establish that, right?
Because if you can't establish the minimum
effective dose, then what's the point
of finding the maximum effective dose,
Lindsay: mm-Hmm.
Yeah,
Austin: truthfully?
'cause you're not gonna stick to it.
You're not gonna do it.
You know, it's kind of goes to the,
the adage we always talk about as as
coaches of like the best program is
the one that you're gonna stick to.
It's not necessarily the one that
looks best on paper, is quote unquote
optimal based off the latest science.
It's how can we use the knowledge we
have from all of those other things
to create a program that's just gonna
be as effective as it needs to be for
you and that you're gonna stick to?
And so finding what that is for
you in things like protein, right?
As you mentioned.
It seems the longer, like over the past
decade, it seems that we need less and
less and less than we have always thought,
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: right?
Protein's very important.
You should definitely get it in.
But at one time, you know, it was, well
you need at least at least one and a half,
if not two, two times your body weight.
You know, if you're not doing
that, you're not, there's no way
you're getting enough protein.
And now it's like, well you could
probably get 0.6, almost half your
body weight in protein, and probably
be fine, probably be healthy.
You'd probably be, you can
be a very healthy, active
adult and get that's enough.
That seems to be good.
There's other mechanisms at play, right?
So, you know, we protein turns certain
machinery on that allows us to maintain
and grow new muscle tissue, but.
strength training also stimulates that,
and it's a much greater stimulator of
that process than protein is alone.
Okay so if we're active and we're
re training our muscles under
resistance, then we're getting a
huge signal to do that thing anyways.
And now we just need to be sure that we
have a few meals a day that have maybe
at least 20 grams of protein in them,
if not a little bit more, depending
on if your body size and muscle mass.
But that's really good start.
That's a minimum effective dose for that.
So three or four meals with
20 grams of protein in them.
Yeah, you're, you're probably
pretty good for most people.
Lindsay: It is, and I love that you
bring up the context is so, so important
because when we are just trying to,
like sometimes when, when women are just
trying to maintain a small, smaller body,
we're trying to, uh, lose weight and,
maintain, and we don't really, really
care about maximizing muscle growth or
holding onto as much muscle or whatnot.
What you need is not what
these bodybuilders are doing
that, that you're following.
It's, it's nothing like that.
If you're trying to go for recomp,
there have been some good studies
showing, yeah, you probably want to
get more, you wanna have it higher.
But a lot of times when it's just, I
just want to, you know, lose weight and
maintain and I don't really care what my
delts look like or my glutes look like,
it's, I just wanna be healthy and strong.
It's like, okay.
It is interesting is that one
of the things that you feel like
over the past few years you've
changed your mind on is protein?
I.
Austin: Considerably.
I, I think this is over the past several
years, this is the lowest my protein's
ever been on a consistent basis.
And again, I, I sort, I have these
minimum thresholds, so every meal
I have, it's gonna have at least
20 to 25 grams of protein in it.
That's a minimum for me.
That's, again, that's a minimum threshold.
And I think with everything,
it's a minimum threshold thing.
So I have a minimum threshold
for steps per day that I get.
I have a minimum threshold for general
calories that I try and get per day.
I have a minimum threshold for
as much sleep as I get per day.
I have a minimum threshold for how
many times a week I strength train.
I have a minimum threshold for how many
times I do aerobic training in the week.
Those thresholds aren't astronomical.
So I'm 200, 205 pounds.
I, I'd say consistently, I get probably
140 to 150 grams of protein per day.
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: And sometimes I get a lot more
than that depending on what I, you
know, if that day had a lot of meat in
it or more protein shakes or whatever.
But sometimes the day just
doesn't, and that's fine too.
But my minimum threshold's,
like 1 40, 1 50.
You know, minimum threshold for
me, strength training wise is
at least two sessions a week.
Minimum threshold for steps per
day is minimum 7,000 steps per day.
Just because we have data that shows
that's a good minimum threshold to have,
again, uh, having positive adaptations
towards our metabolism and, uh, the rest
of our system of regulating risk of all
cause mortality as we continue to age.
And again, minimum threshold for
sleeps around six hours a night.
I try to shoot for eight, but
sometimes that doesn't happen
'cause we're humans and that's life.
You know, I have these minimum
thresholds for myself and I would
say recently I've been consistently
training four or five times a week.
I've probably consistently gotten
a little bit more protein 'cause
I'm training a little bit more.
But I also have more of an appetite
'cause I'm training more, I'm moving more.
I tend to go towards, I tend to gravitate
towards food a little bit more during
those periods of time, naturally.
Right, because.
Lindsay: Yeah.
Austin: While I'm moving
more, I'm, I need more food.
But I think having those minimum
thresholds are, are very important.
But protein certainly is one that I,
I used to really be anxious about.
Like, oh my gosh, okay, we're, we're
somewhere, we're at a, a graduation party.
We're, we're like, I need,
there's no protein here.
What's go, like, do I bring a shake?
Do I, what do I do?
You know?
I gotta find whatever's
here that has protein.
I even used to blow my calories out of the
water just so I got the protein, right?
So if there's only fried chicken
or something that's, you know, has
a ton of kind of needless, I'm not
saying I love fried chicken, but you
definitely should not eat that daily.
I would eat a ton of something that
I knew was gonna calorically be way
too much, just so I got my protein
source, or just so I got my protein hit.
And it's like, that's probably
a shortsighted view of what
that actually means or matters.
And so I've definitely taken a, a
giant step back in terms of protein.
Lindsay: I love that you brought that
up because, we recently went to Boston
and people are always surprised by how
little I track throughout the year.
I usually just mindfully eat.
But we went there and my
husband was tracking before
he's trying to lose weight.
And I'm not tracking.
And people are like, well what
are you, what are you doing?
And how are you finding protein and
how are you doing this and this?
And it's funny 'cause I'm like, I'm
on vacation and I'm going to eat
till satisfied, not till stuffed.
So I'm still gonna respect my body.
I'm gonna respect like,
like even what I want.
But I do think, like you, Austin,
probably four years ago, the Lindsay
four years ago would've been bringing
like her core power with her.
Austin: Yeah.
Lindsay: I would be like, I'm gonna
bring a shaker with a few scoops
because they never have enough protein.
And now it is kind of funny.
I like that you said.
Extremes are good.
Living in extremes are good because
we gain experience, we gain knowledge.
And I, yeah, perspective, and
hopefully wisdom comes with that.
Because I was telling Alex, you know,
I'm getting all these questions about,
like, I took a picture of my plate
and there was no protein on it that,
well, I think that there were like some
sausage links or something like that.
But other than that, people
are like, how, what'd you say?
Austin: Quite low in
Lindsay: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
Compared to how many
carbs were on that plate.
But, um, people are like, well,
how are you managing protein?
How are you doing that?
And I'm like, do you know what's
funny is, I'm on vacation and
for a week I'm not going to be
eating like I normally do at home.
And I'm, I don't care and I'm not
stressing because actually for
me to maintain my health and my
weight is just, eating mindfully
and until satisfied, not stuffed.
And if people can actually allow
themselves to do that a little bit
better, there'd be like this mental
freedom that I feel like they would find.
Austin: Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, you gotta think
too, uh, humans existed.
We've existed as we've existed and the
way we look and function now for, I mean,
the, the knowledge we have now is for
the past 200, 300,000 years, so, what
do you think human beings were doing?
You think they had a steady flow of meal
by meal protein regulated out, right?
Humans across time, even through
known documented history, most humans
didn't really know probably when
their next full meal was coming.
Yet they still lived and created and
lived a full life for as long as they did.
So the fact that we have an opportunity
to care and the fact that we have
an opportunity to even think about
optimizing that is pretty insane.
So I think starting again,
perspective is huge.
So understanding like, wow, I have, you
know, dare I say, I have the privilege
to have a steady daily intake of protein
in my life is, is absolutely huge.
And that's a huge bonus for me.
Lindsay: mm-Hmm.
Austin: It's not like I
get protein once a week.
Um, you know, you can even probably
go ask some of your grandparents, you
know, people listening to this, what I
mean, their lives look like, what their
nutrition looked like back in the day.
Well we had, we had steak, we had a steak
once a week, or we, we know we had, we
were having meat for dinner twice a week.
But every other, you know, the
other days of the week it was like
beans and grains and other things.
Right.
Um, and that's okay.
Great.
I mean, and, and look at your grand,
like they're, they're still alive.
They're here, they're, they're fine.
Like they're going on with their life.
Um, they're probably, hopefully
at least somewhat healthy and that
probably has more to do with how much
they've moved and how much they've
physically challenged themselves across
their lifetime, more so than how much
protein they ate across their lifetime.
And so I, I think having a hierarchy of
importance is, is absolutely crucial to
not only improving the way that you look,
feel, and function, but also maintaining
the, the way you look, feel, and function.
And understanding that the best thing
you could possibly do for yourself is
to be physically active and to get as
consistent of sleep as you possibly
can, depending on your situation.
And to eat as nutritiously as you
possibly can given your situation.
And I say given your situation, it's
because everyone's, ca you're, everyone's
playing it with a different hand that
they've been dealt, whether that's in
life, whether that's on a day-to-day
basis, whether that's whatever, you
know, so the hand you're dealt or on the
holidays around your family is probably,
for some, probably a crappy one.
There's crappy food around, there's people
giving you crap about that fact that
you care about what you're doing with
your body, yet it's up to you to kind of
make the best of that hand that you've
been dealt in that situation, right?
And that's gonna look different
for everyone at different points
in their life or for whatever
holiday or whatever intention you
have that for that season of life.
But I, I think having a hierarchy of
importance where physical movement
is kind of at the top and health
promoting behaviors are at the top.
And I think almost everyone understands
generally what healthy is, right?
We can all, we all have a, an idea of a
horizon that exists that we would define
as healthier behaviors, and it's up to
us to generally move in that direction.
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: And depending on kind of your
goals and the timelines of those goals,
there's certainly better routes that
take less time, that there's less
headaches or there's less confusion.
But nonetheless, it's very important
that you're just trying to continue
to walk towards that horizon of what
a healthier life looks like, you know?
And so any effort towards that, I
think is, is extremely powerful.
And those efforts compound over time.
And they also are very reinforcing.
So the fact that you, the more you move,
the more your body tends to want to move.
The better you eat, the better your
body tends to want to eat, right?
Obviously food environment's huge.
Uh, your environment in general
is huge, whether that's around
physical activity or food.
You know, if, if you struggle with a
bad environment around food, then work
to change that environment to have less
food around that you know isn't healthy,
that isn't packed full of nutrients,
that isn't filling when you eat it.
Try and put yourself in an
environment where movement isn't
seen as something that is crazy.
You know, like sometimes I go to,
you know, sometimes I go places
and I'll find myself in certain
situations where, you know, I'll
wake up, go for a walk after I eat.
I'll go for a walk before I go to bed.
I'll go for a walk people look
at me like I have two heads.
Like, they're like, what are you doing?
Why are you just walking?
Why are you just mo?
What are you doing?
What's the point of that?
And I'm like, well, I feel better.
And I stay healthier when I do it.
My body composition seems
to, to hold on better
when I do it, it maintains itself better.
I sleep better.
My brain feels clear.
What's the problem, right?
And also I go places where that's
just a part of what they do.
It's like, oh, hey,
morning walk you coming.
Hey, after, after we
eat, walk, you coming.
If you're not in this environment,
then you're gonna have to do it.
And that sometimes can be
a burden, but it's also, I
think it, it can be empowering
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: it's like, hey, I'm gonna, I'm
gonna lead right now and I'm gonna be
a leader within my own life, and I'm
gonna be a leader within this family.
And I try to do that with my family
when I go on vacation with them.
Every day after breakfast, we do
a long hour to two hour long walk
on the, because we always do beach
vacations with that side of my family.
And so every day after breakfast for
that week, there's at least the minimum
threshold, hour long walk after breakfast.
It's optional if you wanna come, but
it's absolutely happening every day.
Non-negotiable because you at
least did something physical.
You did something health-promoting that
day, and you tend to make better decisions
after you do something like that.
So,
Lindsay: That is so true.
You really do set up your
environment better when you
start out the day that way.
So I'm gonna just kind of recap.
The thoughts that are coming to me as
you're talking is I feel like you, by
focusing on the minimum dose, we are
really focusing on the things that are
going to bring, the greatest return
for your investment as far as health.
So focusing on that as far as health.
I've seen studies now saying, you
know, yeah, 0.6, 0.7, those are
like, that's the minimum for health
individuals as far as protein goes.
As you move away from that, just wanna
spend the next few minutes like, 'cause
some people are like, that's awesome.
I love my healthy lifestyle.
I have that down.
Austin: Mm-Hmm
Lindsay: I don't wanna be a bodybuilder,
but I do want to look like I go
to the gym every day because I do.
So do, do you think that they
have a different minimum dose?
Do they, what are your thoughts on that?
Austin: I think there's gonna be a new
minimum dose for maybe how much you, I.
resistance train, how hard you
train during those sessions.
Maybe how many sets you're doing,
how many reps you're doing.
Or at least how hard you're working within
how many sets and reps you're doing.
I think that starts to
shift up a little bit more.
I think everything tends to shift up
Lindsay: Okay.
Austin: right?
I see it more on a sliding scale that
is in relation to the context of your
own life and, and kind of what those
goals look like for you, as those goals
slide towards greater difficulty goals,
more in involved goals, which typically
mean, okay, I wanna get stronger, I wanna
build more muscle, I wanna get a little
bit leaner, the intensity of that goal
starts to shift towards more intense.
And as that sliding scale starts
to shift, it becomes more important
for the other things to follow.
So again, we have these
minimum thresholds.
We have these minimum effective doses
or dosages that can help us meet
those minimum requirements to man
properly manage our health and our
health span across our life, right?
But as your goals and the difficulty
of those goals goes up, well, you're
gonna have to care a little bit
more about those other things too.
And so, you know, I, I, we don't
have hard numbers as of right now.
that say one gram is necessarily
any better than 0.8 grams.
Grams of protein per pound
of body weight, right?
We don't necessarily have
anything that says that.
We just know that we have these certain
markers where up to a certain point,
this seems to be continuously a little
bit, maybe a little bit more beneficial.
Like let's say one point, so around 0.8.
So it's 1.6 grams per kilogram, so
it's around 0.8 grams per pound.
'cause you can just usually divide
kilograms by two and you're close.
Let's say it's 0.7, 0.8 grams per pound.
There isn't anything even within
the meta, the meta-analysis.
So the study of all the studies that
we're looking at protein that even came
up with that one point, that 0.8 or 1.6
number, the chart that they graphed out
doesn't definitively say that well 0.7 is
any worse than 0.8 or any less effective.
We just kind of know that
0.8 is a good threshold.
I think that we have, again, we kinda
go back to these minimum thresholds
and the higher level of difficulty
that goal has, I think you should
continually progress the other efforts
towards promoting or helping sustain the
effort towards that goal that you have.
And so that could mean more
protein, you know, that could be a
little bit more intention towards
your, your nutrition, right?
Instead of generally eating, maybe you
have a little bit more focus towards,
okay, I do need to really focus on
my protein intake today or during the
season that I'm aiming for this goal.
I may need to more tightly
regulate what those other macro
nutrients are or how much generally
I'm getting of those per day.
I.
Based off of how I'm feeling and
performing in my workouts, and how
I'm recovering from those workouts.
How I'm sleeping throughout the week
from those workouts and from that
nutrition supporting that training.
And I, I think you have some
form of regulation that you
have to sort of monitor.
You know, it doesn't have to
be super closely, but you at
least need to have an idea
Lindsay: Mm-Hmm.
Austin: of like, Hey, do you,
are you feeling a little bit
better now that you're eating
a little bit more carbohydrates
or a little bit more protein?
And generally people say, yeah, I do.
Okay.
Are you still moving
towards, towards your goal?
Yeah.
Great.
Keep going.
Keep adjusting.
You know, and I think that's as
complicated as it truly needs to be.
And obviously the time duration that
you wanna complete a goal in really
changes how strict you have to be towards
all of those things that we've
talked about today, right?
So, you know, if you generally have a
goal over the next 12 months to reach
a certain body weight or a certain body
fat level, or a certain look for you,
well, 12 months is quite a long time.
So just get started and start
moving in the right direction.
And again, all of those
things are quite reinforcing.
The more effort you put towards
something, the more effort you put
towards things that support that thing.
Because we don't like to waste time.
People don't like to waste time,
they don't like to backtrack, they
don't like to do all of these things.
It's sort of, it seems to be
a natural thing for, for us.
So just psychologically.
So we tend to put a little bit more
effort in the supporting things that
help support the main goal of the thing
we're putting so much effort into.
Let's say you have a goal of achieving
a what you were thinking about over
12 months, now you wanna achieve it.
Six.
Well, that changes things.
Now you gotta care a little bit more.
You gotta be a little bit more intentional
or a lot more intentional depending on who
you are and your, where you're starting.
But I think the intensity of that, the
intensity of the goal, the intensity
of the timeline, uh, has as probably
the biggest part to play outside
of those minimum effective doses.
Lindsay: I love that.
That is so good.
So the main things that I'm kind
of walking away with, this is.
Like I said, if, if your main goal is,
look, I just wanna be healthy, I just
wanna reap the rewards of being healthy,
of extending my life as long as I can.
Of being in good health
for my kids grandkids.
So on.
Then, um, finding the minimum dose
and following it, and it doesn't have
to be more complicated than that, but
as we get more specific in our goal,
and as the timeframe for that starts
shrinking, that's when we really have
to focus and care about, the nutrition,
about the training program, about
the intensity levels of the training
program and the overall, uh, volume
of work that's being done there.
So those things begin to matter even more,
but it's still on a spectrum and I think
that that's so good to remind people of is
everything lies on a spectrum, actually.
And even like you said, the studies about
protein, even those are on a spectrum.
'cause if you, if you ever talked to, to
somebody who's, you know, read a lot of
research on it, they'll say, well, we had
this study where they tested this crazy
number and then this really low number.
And it seems like somewhere in the middle.
Like it is.
It is never, you have to do this.
It's usually, well these are good ideas.
If your goal is this and it's,
people are always blown away.
Protein is one thing that I've changed
my mind on a lot over the years too.
I used to give everybody one gram, right?
Per goal, body weight.
Austin: that's a pretty good
goal if you're starting out.
Lindsay: That was it just for everybody
across the board kind of thing.
And then I started realizing, well.
People aren't being compliant.
People don't all want the same goal.
Some people don't care about body
recomp, they just wanna lose weight.
They just wanna feel good in their skin.
Like, there were so many things.
So just knowing that these things really
do, um, live on this, on this scale, I
think just a really powerful reminder.
Okay.
Austin, I've loved having you on.
Tell us, what are you doing right now?
What stuff do you have going
on, as far as coaching?
I, I know a lot of women reach
out to me and are like, do
you know any male trainers?
For some reason they don't.
Their husbands don't wanna use my
app, Austin, and I don't know why.
Austin: You know, um, I can tell you
they'd make a lot of gains, but, um,
Lindsay: Thank you.
Austin: Lindsay knows
what she's talking about.
Uh, Science of Strength
Training.com is my business.
It's, it's my website.
Uh, I'm gonna be around the new year here.
Uh, I'll be launching my training app,
which has everything from beginner
programs up to more intermediate
advanced programs, depending on if
your husbands are just starting out.
And I, I know there's probably a lot
of of men, around this time of year.
I know obviously a lot of women as
well, but I, I know there's a lot
of men who know that they should
be into the gym, or they should be
into the, into getting into the gym.
Sorry.
But they're a little bit hesitant
because they don't quite understand
maybe how much, what are those
minimum thresholds for me?
They know maybe what they used to do
back in the day, but they don't know if
that's still effective or if they can
even go through those movement patterns
anymore as effectively as they once did.
You know, maybe they're not sure how
many sets they should be doing or how
much volume of that work they should
be doing when they're starting out.
I think there's some form of ego
within this as well of like, we feel
as if we should have this thing, this
gym thing, we should have it down.
We should have it mastered.
I'm a man, I, I should
have this mastered and I.
It's just not necessarily true.
I mean, I, I can't walk into any other
thing that I haven't spent time doing and
just show up and be like, well, I'm a man.
I know how to do this.
It's like, well, you haven't been
doing it, so you may not now.
That's okay.
And so the app, um, so coaching, you know,
I have one-on-one coaching spots open.
Um, so if you're looking for something a
little bit more individualized a little
bit more accountability on a weekly basis
attached to that, where we're having
more touchpoints and, and everything is
more one-to-one and individual with you.
I have coaching spots open there.
Or if you want a little bit more of a,
a hands-off approach with an opportunity
to still ask questions and, and get your
technique looked at and everything else,
then the training app is a really good,
affordable option to, to do that as well.
Lindsay: Awesome.
I love it.
Well, thank you so much
for coming on Austin.
You're awesome.
Austin: Thanks for having me.
Lindsay: Okay, we'll talk to you later.