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Get a seat at the table and build the design career you want. This podcast is for designers looking to break in, level up, and take control of their careers—whether you're freelancing, climbing the corporate ladder, or just trying to get noticed. Every two weeks, we dive into career fundamentals, design best practices, and the hottest topics in the design community.
That's a danger to the design profession, you know, and also the the enjoyment or lack of enjoyment you will have on the job if someone just doesn't care about your crafts, and you do.
Tyler:Yeah. But what I'll say to that is that those companies will fail. Like, we've seen like, this AI thing is just another iteration of engineering led companies. And we and, like, we all know what that means. We've talked about it before.
Tyler:It's like Yeah. Let let the engineering team, they know a bit of it. This guy knows the And we're officially live.
Nick:We're officially live exactly. I mean, this is just an experiment. I think I I figured it out.
Tyler:Ominous? Tell me more.
Nick:Very ominous. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think I I had this, like multiple ideas in my mind for last few months, talking to designers, talking to you, talking to you know, people on communities, design communities about the design markets with all these people being confused and not sure what to do. Should I use AI? Should I not use AI?
Nick:Like should I even go into design? Is it future proof? All that kind of stuff. Or people saying things like, you know, it happened to me. I'm finally part of the gang because someone from a non design department created a prototype and they're all happy with me and they are skipping my work, you know.
Nick:So there's a lot of tension and confusion going on. And I've been thinking about, you know, was this always the case? You know, where we always the the play ball of the company that people ever take us seriously? And did anything change really? You know, that kind of thing.
Nick:And I think it helps for people who aren't sure if they should become a product designer or how to handle these situations. So I think that's a cool thing to talk about today because I really think it will help a lot of people.
Tyler:Yeah. I I love it. Yeah. I think it's a hot topic. I've been I've been more on Reddit lately.
Tyler:So I've joined forces with you, keeping my finger in the pulse.
Nick:I will make sure to upvote your comments even though you might get a lot of downvotes. You know, I'll be that one single upvote you get.
Tyler:I should start posting because I'm I'm a lurker. I'm not a poser.
Nick:Yeah. I'm not really a poster myself in terms of sharing a topic. I don't want to be too salesy over there, but I do comment quite a bit. I'm not a top 1% commenter. You get that little tag above your name.
Tyler:Mhmm.
Nick:But I often do get a lot of lot of votes. Let's just call them votes because sometimes they're down votes, sometimes they're up. Yeah. So I'm quite active there.
Tyler:Both of them. Yeah.
Nick:You know, so so for example, one of the things that I figured out is that companies, you know, and and, you know, in isolation, it's it's it's not it's not really new. I'm sure you'll be like, really? You know? But if you have companies on the line from small to big, like how they respond to your design is often different for smaller companies versus big companies. And then there's a second line underneath it.
Nick:And that's the UX maturity that people say or in other words, how much of a design process is in place? Like how seriously do they take design? And I think where you land on those lines really determines how likely it is that you will enjoy your work. Also, how likely it is that someone from a different department will, you know, have this idea of, well, you know what? I can do it on my own.
Nick:I don't need this designer. Have Claude. I can make this beautiful landing page on my own.
Tyler:Yep. Until you watch it convert. But I think, like, to that point, I think a really good sign is to tell if you're which one of those two buckets you're kind of you're landing is if ever there's an emergency and there needs to be something fixed that requires design, product, and engineering inputs, and whoever gets if design is considered, then you're in that good bucket or that good sliding scale.
Nick:Yeah. Well, that's true. You know? And and I think if you're a junior designer versus a senior designer, I think the main difference is, you know, the the how comfortable you feel with the politics around design. You know, a junior designer, in my experience, and not only from speaking to junior designers, but also from looking back at my own career, like ten years ago, if a manager would ask me like, hey, we should put this thing back, I would be like, of course, you know, let's do it.
Nick:You're right. But then today, you know, ten years later, I would be like, well, you know, yesterday we talked about this and this and this reason to not put this this thing back. You know, what changed? Why do you want to put it back? And then you get more of a discussion.
Nick:So if you have a large company, so you're all the way to the right on that line of company size and or the design maturity maturity is quite low, you have to realize that it's going to be more about politics and your soft skills. How can you handle yourself? Being able to ask why and daring to say no to a manager is going to be way more important than, you know, how quick you are mocking up a prototype.
Tyler:Yeah. And I think even before that, what use what what helps as well, I think soft skills work, but like, I think even before that, you should know your your product pretty well. It is like oftentimes when you're trying to push for ideas, there are edge cases or things you're not thinking about if you're if it's you just arrived at the company, you don't know all the ins and outs. I think what's what's super important, what's helpful is that you really invest in understanding the product, how it works, even the even the edges that admin section that no one uses, like knowing the full breadth of of the product. So you have something you have a baseline knowledge.
Tyler:And then on top of that, you can layer a politics understanding, like, not arguing, but kind of collaborating, kind of pushing your ideas forward. Because oftentimes, if you have great ideas, but you're not thinking about this and that, and then that kind of derails the conversation sometimes, especially if you're junior.
Nick:Yeah. So I mean, but that just takes time inside the company. Right? You just have to run into all these edge cases, understand everything. Yeah.
Nick:Oh, yeah. I mean, how often has this happened to me when you think you have this great idea and then you present that you're all happy and then the stakeholders like, yeah, I mean, no, that's just not how the product works. And then you feel bad about yourself and maybe a bit resentful against that manager because you're like, well, I took all this time to work on this and it's great and this is really user friendly. But then you started a losing battle because you just didn't know the thing you thought of wasn't possible because of all sorts of constraints. I mean, that's Yeah.
Tyler:Yeah. I mean, just all that. Yeah. This all that also is like show often and early and be okay with showing, like, messy work. I've I've noticed a lot in, like, junior designers, just like it's the hide and then show the final product, which I get it.
Tyler:If you're very like, you're going in in several directions, you're not quite sure which direction to go, but it's okay to get feedback on, like, on a messy direction. And you can practice it. Like, this is messy. This come the ideas. I'm trying to see which direction I wanna go with love feedback.
Tyler:It's like, have you thought about this? And then those into your example, those comments, this is not how our product works, are are more well received because it's like, yeah. I great. Thank you. That's why that's why I asked that question.
Tyler:That's why I showed my work early.
Nick:Yeah. It's it's still fine to push back. You know, if someone says this is not how it works, it doesn't mean they're always right. You know, there could be something behind it, you know, stress from their manager pushing on them like, hey, we have to make this deadline, you know, and all they're hearing now is this designer with this new idea and they like it. But hey, you know, all I'm seeing is this deadline that we're not going to make because of this extra work, you know.
Nick:So it's okay to And, push you know, if you share design with the stakeholder, you know, to emphasize what you're saying, I think it's always necessary for you to also mention the type of feedback you'd like. Like, is it generic high level? This is just an exploration type prototype thingy feedback? Or are you like really close to a finished product and you're really looking at this like little nitty gritty copy feedback and pixel perfect feedback? You know?
Nick:So that's that's very important to give them guidance on what you expect from them.
Tyler:Yeah. Famous last words is, hey, what do you think of this? With no context or no or no filter. It's like you're gonna get the worst type of feedback.
Nick:Yeah. Yeah. Then you get this the feedback you'll get is I like it. Or maybe worse, I don't like it. And then you get in this oh why type type situation.
Nick:Yeah. So so I think that's really important to consider, you know, the design maturity maturity in a company, you know, and what that means for your situation. Like when when it's low, you know, those people who now have the AI tools, like I think they were there before AI became such a mainstream thing.
Tyler:Mhmm.
Nick:You know, they they were the people with their notepad and and sketches and long documents, like, already thinking they figured out the design, you know? But the difference is now they have the tools to actually skip you.
Tyler:Yeah. But there's a dangerous game there. Like, yes, they like, I've had a situation we had a situation recently where prototype came down from PM, showed showed client, did discovery work, and then designer took it over, realized late that we forgot one piece of the product that was core to it. And our blinders were on or or because we we went from prototype to, okay, we'll just translate this to high fidelity, not doing like the design due diligence of like, okay, we need to make sure that we What I think you can't skip ever is the journey mapping or user flow because like you're that's the stage we're really thinking about like, okay, here the what are the different pieces that we need to add on top of the experience? What are the different edge cases?
Tyler:What do you have to think about? And then moving to your to your prototyping, often if you jump straight in, you're gonna miss something. And then it'll it'll show up late, and then you'll have to kind of scramble towards the deadline, which would that's what happened. Luckily, we caught it.
Nick:How easy will it be for you to to make the the situation you're talking about to make it that more more of an example so we can all understand? Like, or would that mean you had to explain something for thirty minutes? Because I know it's quite complex what you're building. Because I'd love to know what you mean by there was a whole part missing. Like, what does that mean?
Tyler:Yes. Meaning, like, there is so you have a you have a workflow. So, like, there's an addition to a workflow. So let's say, you were adding taxes, for example, on top of the flow. Like, you have a you have a wealth or a fintech product, and then you have a tax calculator.
Tyler:That requires for you to collect information at step one, two, and three, and four. But you've prototyped one, two, and four, skipped three, just because it looks you you've gone down the happy path. So step three was forgotten because, like, that it wasn't included in the vibe coated prototype handed down handed down from God. So you're you're you're you're then you're missing what what you're missing is that really that due diligence and making sure that you're you're covering all the different flows. And in that case, like, we caught it late.
Tyler:We were at HiFi. A sprint was starting, but one of our designers is kinda like, there's something's off here, and then kind of went through it by themselves, and then mapped out the experience like, oh, we missed this part. And this is crucial because this Yeah. In step three is the component that is the the parent level element that kind of pushes all the information to the other other sections. And that was missing.
Nick:Right. So and then because of everything was set in motion already, and then you had, like, a few days instead of a few weeks to to figure out this crucial step number three.
Tyler:Yep. So, like like, that all that to say, like, you they may able to create every anyone can create a prototype, but, like, there is the risk is if they do the design process properly and they create the prototype. But in most cases, there isn't this unicorn that exists that can do all the things.
Nick:In a way, also, it's it's not it's not only thinking about yes or no, but also how you think about it. Mhmm. You know, designers have a cool way of thinking, I think, to go really broad and zoom out and think about like visual hierarchy. You know, when I talk to more technical people, they're like often, not always, but often they're like, can we leave this thing out? Because, you know, it's just less things to look at.
Nick:But then the designers, guess of, well, okay. Yes. It's less to look at and less cognitive load, blah blah blah. But adding this extra thing here, it does balance the page better. And because of it, the page as a whole is easier to digest.
Nick:You know, that that kind of thinking is, you know, really available in in, you know, in a lot of non designers, I think. If you go to marketing people, it's the other way around. They want to put, in my experience, much more on the page. They want to explain everything, sell everything.
Tyler:Yeah. And that there's there's such a balance, especially if you're working in iterations, like you're working in a product that you keep adding bells and whistles to. It's it's off it you it's often feels like the feature that you're working is the thing that'll change the world, that'll change the product. This is the thing. This is feature x is gonna make this company a a $10,000,000,000 company because we launched this feature.
Tyler:When in reality, it may just be something that has been asked a couple times from the customer success team. Would they really need this one small thing? Doesn't change the world, but it really helps. It really would help them. And then you might be in the mind frame of, like, as you're designing it, making it so visible, meaning putting it pushing it super high in terms of the hierarchy of the page, when in reality, it could be pushed down within a a drop down menu or a sub menu.
Tyler:It just has to exist somewhere, but it's not it's not the primary focus. So it's I think designers do that very well, like balancing where should how prominent should this feature or this thing be within the page, within the application, and not so that, like, you're not all the different features that you have are fighting for for space.
Nick:Right. Yeah. That's true. You know, just looking at something and being able to say this page or this dashboard or this screen is well balanced. Like, I think that's a that's a very strong skill.
Nick:And you know, the the designer's eye, is what they call it. You know, and I don't think there's an AI tool that can get that feeling right of this looks well balanced.
Tyler:No. Because it doesn't it's not referenced or anything. No. True. It's like yeah.
Tyler:If it's doing AI, you'd have to feed it screenshots of because it's base it's it's basically feeding off of what it's built and what you've given it. So does it feel well balanced? Sure. Or it'll come up with something. Well, you know, I've my my dataset is feeding off this old article from 2007.
Tyler:Well balanced means this is my reference for well balanced. So Yeah. It has no idea. Our judgment is still still in play here.
Nick:Yeah. True. No. I I I think that's that's very interesting to know or to discuss next, you know, the judgment thing. Because, you know, with all the designers not sure what to do and, you know, AI wise or or with their jobs and and job hunting, you and I, we know the judgment is important, you know, and attention to detail and the designer's mind and way of working.
Nick:But before and after this whole AI thing, many companies just don't care about your judgment. Right? I think that's a that's that's a danger to the design profession, you know, and also the the enjoyment or lack of enjoyment you will have on the job. If someone just doesn't care about your crafts and you do.
Tyler:Yeah. But what I'll say to that is that those companies will fail. Like, we've seen like, this AI thing is just another iteration of well, I think anyways, it's just another iteration of engineering led companies. And we and like, we all know what that means. We've talked about it before.
Tyler:It's like Yeah. Let let the engineering team, they know a bit of it. This guy knows a little bit of UX. Mhmm. Let's or let's just offload it to AI.
Tyler:And then number one, it's gonna cost a pretty penny for the credits that you're burning to figure out the UX part. And and number two, it's not gonna look that great. And then down the line, you're gonna have to pay for a designer to kind of fix it. And Yeah. And we all know what fix it is, which is means like, we'll do some treatment, but the underlying UX is gonna be there's so much design debt that is gonna cost you so much just to reconfigure or refresh or relaunch whatever product you've built.
Nick:You might as well start from scratch. Before we continue, if you're feeling stuck in your design career or if you feel like you're doing solid work while no one really notices, we've got a bunch of extra stuff on our website.
Tyler:We're building a community for product designers to actually learn, grow, and get hired, just scroll and collect more inspiration.
Nick:There's also articles, checklists, and courses.
Tyler:All based on real world experience from both of us. No fluff, just what actually works.
Nick:Check out designtablepodcast.com. The link is in the description.
Tyler:Face it. Basically. Right?
Nick:Yeah. Cause that's what you're doing. Like, it feels like you're fixing something, but you're actually replacing all these little bits and pieces one by one. And it feels like you're repairing something. But if you look at it, like, twelve months later, you see you've replaced literally all bits, and it's just like you've started to go started over.
Tyler:You know what the biggest you know what the biggest like, if you're if you're a junior designer and you have to prove that your design work works, like, most companies have, like, analytics tools that have session recordings. Now those videos will trigger people in the wrong or right way depending on who's watching it. Yeah. If you actually watch people use your product unmonitored, no user interviews, and watch them fumble away, that'll that'll usually get someone's like, send those videos across to like the c suite or
Nick:Yeah.
Tyler:The VP of end or or product. We're oftentimes in blinder mode, ship and go, ship and go, but actually watch how they use it. That'll that'll put the the brakes. Have someone like pump the brakes a bit. It's like, people are are struggling to use our product.
Tyler:Yeah. It's not a feature or an engineering challenge. It's a UX or design challenge that needs to be addressed there.
Nick:That is something I found very inspiring in my I used to work for a large bank, and they were quite design mature. You know, they had a design team of 50 designers. They had a usability lab and like the the leader of the designers, which almost makes it sound like a Wild West Jeez. Game of Thrones type thing. You know, with the the design leader, like, he was one level below the CEO of the whole bank.
Nick:So so I think that's as good as it's going to get for a designer with someone so high up got who's got your back. They were fighting this whole accessibility game, you know, like designers know it has to be accessible. The color contrast has to be right. Screen reader has to be supported. Alternative text, being able to navigate without a mouse, like all the things you and I are just like, yep, of course, you know.
Nick:But then all the non designers were like, well, you know, that's going to be a lot of work. I don't want to do this work. So what we did, we asked someone, a colleague in the bank who we know had like very like visual she wasn't blind, but it was very close to being blind. Like she had a lot of trouble seeing. We asked her to just go to the core flow of that part of the app, like registering something or whatever.
Nick:And then, you know, the typical design thing to ask, you know, can you think out loud while doing this? And we literally had this video of this person being like this close, like to her phone. Like, I don't do it. I do have to click here or I can see it. And then getting stuck like and then that video, like we didn't summarize it or make it shorter or anything like we just had like all these high level people just watch the whole thing start to finish, like as part of a presentation and just, you know, it's almost like rubbing their faces in it like this is what happens.
Nick:And then, of course, you got the data on how many people in The Netherlands had poor eyesight and like what it means and then lead to to hammer it, to bring it home, you know, and that really helps, you know, just put in a quote of someone who's stuck or recording or, you know, what you're saying, like the the the analytics recordings, like, it really helps. I've seen some in practice. Yeah. They will not like you, but you will get your way.
Tyler:That's it. Like, the like, why why it feels like design is under attack is just it's a visual thing that you can point to versus like like coding or engineering. It's like a black box. They're just it's like no one no no one from the marketing department wants access to the GitHub repo. They they have been like, no.
Tyler:So does it work or does it not? And that's a good example. So like, yes, you can nitpick on something that you see a designer do, but also if you, to your example, push back, here's the visual or the recording of example of someone using your shitty suggestion. Take that.
Nick:Yeah. True. I I got a question from one of our our viewerslisteners that I think really relates to all of this, you know, the design market and the state of it. If you don't mind me putting you on the spot right now, like I can read the question to you. I'm curious what you should.
Nick:Sure. Alright. So this person says, I've landed a six month internship in a med tech company developing OR devices. He's four months in currently. And like halfway through, more or less, he got his performance evaluation, and he's been told to use AI to generate screens and quote unquote, improve my workflow.
Nick:And then he says, the thing is, I do use AI, Claude, to consult Brainstorm Ideate to come up with solutions to problems. And eventually, after quite some time, I tell it to visualize that design solution. Specifically, I took Jira tickets assigned to me, ran it through Cloud, broke it down and analyzed it back and forth, user persona, constraints, edge cases, blah blah blah blah. That's how I've used AI in my workflow. Mhmm.
Nick:However, that performance review is making me doubt myself if I am really using it as efficiently as I thought I did. What's your opinion on this question mark?
Tyler:I mean, sounds like he's using it, but then I I wanna like everyone says AI this, improve your workflow. So like that could have came out of someone watched the video on YouTube saying, oh, look, there's a new design workflow. And then the information was passed on, you should do that too. Yeah. But, like, I would dig a bit deeper into why they're suggesting that.
Tyler:Like, first thing that comes to mind when listening to that is maybe maybe you're slow. Maybe you need to kind of speed up in terms of, like, delivery. Are you late in terms of delivering your design deliverables? And are you holding up the team, the engineering team, etcetera, etcetera? Are you are you slow to respond?
Tyler:Like, that's what that comment seems like. It could be more complex than it, but I would like, the purpose of the performance review is, yes, you're getting feedback, you're getting critiqued of what to do better, but, like, you have opportunity to ask why and dig deeper, like, why are you suggesting this? It's am I to use AI because it's a mandate from the company? Is it because I'm too slow? Is it because it's better for handoff?
Tyler:Like, I would dig deeper. And you can ask that post performance review. I just wanted to clarify, like, the great thing about feedback is that you have it's the start of a conversation, not the end of the conversation. So you can now speak reach back to your manager and ask, like, I've been thinking a lot about my workflow, and I was curious, like, from a perspective, like, what what is what would be your goal in terms of, like, what would be the desired outcome based on that feedback you gave to me? Mhmm.
Nick:Yeah. Yeah. I agree. I I I like the the start versus end of conversation, what you just just said. You know, I I think it goes two ways.
Nick:Like, the practical thing, like what you're saying about the flow, like it's I would just if there's someone there at the company, I would see if I could find a senior designer to sit down with and just ask them like, how are you working? Like, what are your steps? You know, compared to your steps, ask for help. Maybe ask if you can shadow this designer just to to learn from the designer. You know, only applicable if there are other designers.
Nick:That's one thing. And then second thing, of course, no pushback, but what you said, but also it's one company and an internship. If they say like this, the question mentioned, you know, use more AI to improve your workflow. Like it sounds to me like this company doesn't really know what they're talking about. Like, that's a non designer thing to say.
Nick:And then interns, like very junior designers, they are so happy that they have something. Know, finally, I found this internship. They just don't want to push back, you know, being afraid that they might lose their internship or, you know, make someone angry. And then they just take it. And then like you say, they watch YouTube and go to Reddit and or listen to some design podcasts on YouTube like ours.
Nick:And then they just believe what they hear and it becomes this big monstrosity of forced AI use. You know, you don't have to use it all the time, everywhere, you know. Use it where it makes sense. And you cannot really expect an intern to be super fast. That's why they're an intern.
Nick:They're learning, you know. So my message to a company would be, you know, guide them more. Don't leave them hanging with some, you know, fancy one liner. You know, use AI more, improve blah blah blah blah. Give them a bit more guidance.
Tyler:And, like, the trend is that most like, most juniors or more people who are early in their design career are most likely to use AI in their workflow, and it sounds like this person is too. The more senior are the more jaded and they're more pushed back. I've I've done this before. I don't need this new tool kinda thing. So Yeah.
Tyler:Like, in that case, he this person sounds like they've been using the tools. Like, the feed I don't like the feedback of use more AI. Like, as a junior, you need more of the hard skills feedback. Like, they need do you need to learn to craft the design work so that you can learn what you can accelerate with AI? Like, you you're not we don't wanna skip steps.
Tyler:You still wanna learn to crawl before you before you walk and run. Like, those are the skills that you have to strengthen. Later on, you can speed it up. Fine. But that just seems like skipping steps.
Tyler:Like, that's the purpose of the internship is the company has some extra work, and they they're they're keen on kinda developing new talent, but also you need to develop that new talent. And that starts at the base level of, like, the things that you like the reps that you need to kind of push in that in that design craft.
Nick:Yeah. Does that mean manual design work for a bit to really Yeah. Slow you down on purpose? Give you more constraints on purpose?
Tyler:Do all the manual things. Like, can you can do like meeting transcripts, fine. You can take your notes. You can digest the Jira ticket, put it beside your Figma board so you have something to reference or like the actual The the features are things you need to kinda check off, fine. But you actually need to push the pixels because how like you're gonna be like off boarding all your design thinking and design crap to AI.
Tyler:It's gonna it's gonna hit us like a a certain threshold of purple gradients that you'll never pass.
Nick:Yeah. That's true. That's true. You know, so yeah. I mean, if if he's been told to use AI to generate skills and improve my workflow, apparently, don't currently think his workflow is good enough.
Nick:And then use more AI is and what people often do is to to tell you a solution without really telling you about the problem. Like, if I tell you, hey, Tyler, I mean, you should just use more AI, you know? Yeah. Then you're like, woah, I'm confused. He's he's telling me to use more AI.
Nick:But it's way better to tell you like, hey, you know, if we're working together now in this internship for the past four months and I think you're doing well, but I see that it's taking longer than I think it should take. Let's sit down and talk about where you're stuck and what we can do to help you learn you know, how to get faster and quicker. Then, you know, have you considered maybe AI in this in this place, you know, it's there should be that's what I would do at least. There should be way more handholding just to to I mean, they're an intern. They have they have to learn.
Nick:Yeah. So I I imagine this this person is a bit in doubt, maybe insecure, you know.
Tyler:Yeah. Because like, if you're an intern, like, you hire an intern, like, it's it's the same thing with being a manager. You like, they don't work for you. You work for them. Like, that your success is predicated on you enabling your team to do their best work, and these interns don't know what they don't know.
Tyler:So, like, you're you're essentially helping them at the start of their career. Use AI is not It doesn't help anyone. Like, you could that person could have done that at home. Like, what are they learning there if that's the feedback they're getting?
Nick:True. Like, if if if the company considers you to just be, like, cheap labor, like, we I'm not sure what it's like in different parts of the world, but in The Netherlands, you don't really have to pay intern. It's all connected to schools. So they pay you by giving you experience and teaching you stuff. But then some companies abuse it by just having like, well, you know, let's I've seen this to my classmates.
Nick:Like, they were in a department full of like 50 interns and one manager, You know, it was really crazy. You know, so maybe he's just in a in a bad place. I don't know what, you know, I mean, it's a question of two paragraphs. If you're listening to this, you know, person asking the question, I would like to invite you to, send us another message where you really, you know, see if you can take away the things we aren't sure about, like, you know, what else did they say? How are are they supporting you?
Nick:You know, what's your workflow like in detail? You you can send us an email or comment on YouTube again. So I think this is a cool thing to discuss because it's so real. It's from an actual listener and doing an actual internship.
Tyler:Which is so important. And also a soft a soft pitch to your side. Or book a mentoring session with Nick.
Nick:Wait. I I well, I in all honesty, I didn't even think about it. It's it was very honest and and aims to be helpful in this case. But I'll
Tyler:be your social.
Nick:Yeah. Well, thank you. Thank you. I'm too modest. Yeah.
Nick:I want to talk about coaching and that kind of stuff now, but I think that's maybe for another episode. Yeah. Any any closing thoughts on this whole, you know, design market and UX maturity and all that kind of stuff?
Tyler:Yeah. I think I think I think design is still the moat. I think there's people are downsizing fine, but there's still need for quality designers. And quality designers only come out of junior and non experienced designers. So do the reps, do the shit you don't like, you'll be good.
Tyler:AI is just a tool. The craft is the most important part. Yeah. And can't be can't be outsourced.
Nick:True. I mean, it's it goes in waves. If you can sit out this wave of AI can do it for us, you'll be very in demand, you know, because they will all run into a wall of shitty design, and then they have to find someone to fix it. See if you can sit it out and and learn as much as you can in the meantime, you know, if possible financially, of course. Don't want to be naive there.
Tyler:Yes, of course.
Nick:Yeah, but then you'll be good. I'm enjoying myself still,
Tyler:you know. Same. And I
Nick:think I think Tyler also, and I think you can too, dear listener. I really think it's it's possible. Alright. Yeah. Let's wrap up on this high note.
Tyler:Alright. That's another episode in the bag.
Nick:Yeah. Great episode. By the way, if you're stuck second guessing your work or trying to figure out your next move, drop a question in the comments or leave a review. We might actually feature you in one of our future episodes.
Tyler:And if you got any value from this episode, hit subscribe wherever you're listening. It helps more than you think.
Nick:You can can find everything else, resources, articles, and more at designtablepodcast.com.
Tyler:Thanks for being here.
Nick:See you next time.