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Social Justice - A Conversation
Unknown Speaker 0:00
Hi, I'm Charles Stanton. I'm on the faculty of the Honors College of UNLV. And the Boyd School of Law.
Unknown Speaker 0:07
Hi, I'm Lana weatherald. I'm a third year law student and welcome to social justice, social
Unknown Speaker 0:11
justice to conversation conversation.
Unknown Speaker 0:13
Well, good evening, everybody. It's November 18. And Happy Thursday. So today we want to talk about what happened on election night. So I know the last time we left you listeners, we didn't really know, right? We are at 630. polls closed at seven we weren't really sure mail in ballots hadn't been counted. We weren't sure if elections were going to be contested. We really didn't have any answers for you guys. So during this little half hour of this particular program, I think we should try to encapsulate the best we can what happened during this election cycle. How did it happen? What happened? Why did it happen? So tune in if you want to sort of get a good encapsulation of what it is happened on election night last week, and I'll let the professor take over?
Unknown Speaker 0:57
Yes. Professor Stanton here. Yes. Thank you, Lana. Yeah, well, it was a surprise to a lot of people. What happened, a lot of people were expecting a major onslaught in both the House of Representatives and the Senate. And that did not happen actually, in many ways, the opposite happened. The Republicans did not retain control of the Senate. And the Democrats have the possibility of adding even another seat in December. And as far as the House of Representatives is concerned, the margin is very, very small, it's probably less than, it's probably less than 10. Members, it might not even be more than five or six members. So so that that was that's what basically happened. Now the question of how it happened, had to do what I think demographics in a lot of ways, it had to do with the demographic, visa vie, who voted, who was motivated to vote. And how many people really felt they had a mission to vote. When you do polling in an election, polling is as a very, very fine art. And you want to touch upon those voters who are most likely to vote. And the Democratic Party honed in on three particular groups of people to make their statement. One set of those voters was women voters. Obviously, that was a that was a gift that the Supreme Court gave the Democratic Party, and they were able to utilize it extremely well. in state after state. Many, many women voters said that their priority issue was abortion. And that was certainly one part of their Shioda of support. The second part was, of course, the youth vote, and the youth vote 18 to 34 went overwhelmingly for the Democratic Party. And of course, that's a warning sign for the Republicans in the future. As more and more young people come into the voting come become a voting age. It's succeeding much more liberal than even the middle part of the electorate or or, or people who were older. And then the third part of the vote was was elderly people. The Democratic Party was very shrewd in how they honed their advertising helped along by a number of Republicans who talked about, you know, doing away with Social Security and Medicare. And you combine all those things, three things together. And you add the icing on the cake was that a lot of Republicans, which were also turned off by denialism, the fake election message of the former president and his acolytes, so many of them split their ticket, and many of them also didn't vote at all.
Unknown Speaker 4:27
Yeah, I believe split tickets are sort of the story of this election. You saw it everywhere. So in my home state of Wisconsin, you know, shockingly, a Tony Evers, who has been such an education forward as one of the more progressive, you know, elected officials that I think Wisconsin has ever seen. I don't think I'm crazy for saying that. He you know, he won, but so did Ron Johnson, who I believe to be nothing short of insane, you know, not to mince words here, but nothing short of insane. But then not only Wisconsin, then here in Nevada. So, you know, you had people that were not willing to put Adam Laxalt office people that thought his messaging was just far too extreme and ridiculous. But then we're on the same token willing to elect Joe Lombardo. So Laxalt too extreme Lombardo not too extreme. Ron Johnson not too extreme, you know, but Tony Evers one. So I think the split tickets really were the story. And, you know, it's hard to think how that got rationalized by the number of voters that seems to have done that, but truly swung the election I think for a lot of these democratic races that were won by people that were very intense, I mean, against candidates that had no business being an elected official. They we people were willing to split the ticket and say no, and say absolutely not. I agree that this person is not supposed to be an elected official. And I'm not willing to take this sort of rhetoric into office. And if nothing else, that's a hopeful as a hopeful thing,
Unknown Speaker 5:48
it is a hopeful thing. And of course, you know, in Pennsylvania, Arizona, and Nevada and Michigan in the four major categories of race, which is governor, senator, Attorney General, and Secretary of State, almost all those elections went democratic. The only exception really was in in Nevada, where Joe Lombardo defeated Steve Sisley Ack. And I think that Steve says the ACC, would have had a hard time getting reelected pretty much against anybody
Unknown Speaker 6:23
well, and I think it's fair to note that a sisolak was in a very much no win situation. Nevada is a giant hub of tourism, right, there was no doubt in my mind, if we were going to put 1000s back at work on the strip during the pandemic 1000s would have died. I do understand that that led to 1000s of people being unable to pay their bills that led to 1000s of people not able to return to work where they otherwise believed they may have. And I, I get that that cause strife, but it was a no win situation, it was people die, or people lose their jobs. And unfortunately, I just don't think Steve sisolak was willing to put this state in a position where 1000s and 1000s of you know, hospitality workers were dying in mass. And these are a lot of the time the hospitality workers in Nevada are, you know, people that are low income or people from socio economic disadvantages, and I sort of admire his ability to say, well, I know this may cost me reelection, but I'm not willing to let these people die. And I fully believe that his choice to keep the strip, you know, shutdown or relative lockdown going on in Las Vegas was the reason he lost. And you know what? Yeah, it's almost an admirable way to go down if it was because of lifesaver. Oh, I
Unknown Speaker 7:28
agree. I agree. I think that I think that in the state of Nevada, particularly the Secretary of State's race, and in the Senate race, the support of the culinary Workers Union was also a vitally important thing, I think that they lived with discuss that how they had a tremendous door to door campaign. And I think, I think in in a lot of these races, the secret weapon for the Democratic Party was the Republican candidates themselves.
Unknown Speaker 8:06
Yeah. You know, is to being far out. Far too far out.
Unknown Speaker 8:10
In Pennsylvania. Course, Mehmet Oz. Lake and an Arizona Laxalt was really harmed politically by the advertising.
Unknown Speaker 8:25
Yeah, for those of you that don't live in Nevada, and are not watching or living locally, and watching what was happening with Adam Laxalt. In those political ads I have. I have not seen that much vitriol and a political ad in some time. I mean, these were, they were hammering them left and right, calling abortion a joke. And these are things he actually said, but just with the veracity in which these were filmed, and then how much they were aired. It's no surprise he lost. And then like we said, Women Voters were willing to show out they were willing to go stand in line in the polls, they were willing to send in their mail in ballots and say absolutely not to this guy, even if they were Republican. They were willing to split their ticket and say absolutely not to this guy. So yeah. And then we saw it again in Arizona, with Kerry Lake who, you know, when the professor and I were talking earlier, I said there's really only one word to describe when it's just kind of nasty, just kind of nasty, if she was, was Cheney may have helped, helped a little bit where she was concerned, but then in Pennsylvania to where Mehmet Oz who I view as nothing more than a grifter and gave up all of his personal wealth to lose that election because he says nasty things about Fetterman that shouldn't ever be repeated. I think people are just willing to say no, no to this. Too far out. The Republicans did the Democrats I shaved phenomenal service by putting up people that were completely in my opinion, inept.
Unknown Speaker 9:38
Well, I think I think a lot of that a lot of that was the ex president. And, and what's interesting in so many of those races that they nominated in the primaries, primaries that really were not participated in by the whole of the Republican electorate, a small percentage of those people nominated people who are unelectable. And the Democratic Party did ads, basically boosting them supposedly, but boosting them in a way that was absolutely poisonous, because they they elaborated on all their, you know, far out positions. I think that I think that in Pennsylvania and Arizona, particularly both of those candidates on the Republican side went beyond the bounds of what you're supposed to do, certainly with, with with Fetterman. I think there was a lot of people, particularly older, older Republicans, moderate Republicans, who, although they had some reservations about Fetterman in the sense, you know, after we had the stroke when his capacity Beecher Jehovah, alright, so hopefully told the job. I think they they were turned off by a lot of the personal attacks on the guy. And I think that that's a hopeful sign for the country. Because I think that's what we need to do. We
Unknown Speaker 11:24
need to say, No, we're not accepting, yes,
Unknown Speaker 11:26
we need to get away from we need to get away from the personalization of politics. And we need to focus on issues. What are the issues that people are being impacted by?
Unknown Speaker 11:39
Yeah, you know, I will say, though, with the rejection of Oz in Pennsylvania, the rejection of Carrie Lake and Arizona, the rejection of Laxalt, here in Nevada, why what happened in Georgia, with Herschel Walker, the fact that this race went to a runoff at all? I mean, I did not think especially when we were starting to see early results, that he would end up forcing a runoff, but my God, well, I mean, he cannot he cannot formulate coherent sentences at certain points. were that bad with him?
Unknown Speaker 12:07
Well, I think I think the answer, I think the answer is that he was a Heisman Trophy winner. I think the answer is that he led Georgia to a national championship. And I think that I think that in a lot of these states, sports celebrity, especially in an intercollegiate level, is a lasting legacy that a person has Tommy Tuberville, being elected a Senator, is one example. And then there are others. And, of course, the glaring contrast between him and Reverend Warnock where this is a man who's very distinguished Well spoken. Apparently, Raphael
Unknown Speaker 12:55
Warnock deserves to be in office. It's just very he's, you know, yeah, you don't want to say he's served his dues, because it's that doesn't appear to matter much anymore in this electorate. But I mean, good Lord, in here.
Unknown Speaker 13:08
I wonder, though, I wonder sometimes, in these cases, when they put people like that up to run, whether they want somebody basically, who doesn't have really a mind of their own right, they want so
Unknown Speaker 13:23
can be a puppet and a mouthpiece for the party. Yes,
Unknown Speaker 13:26
somebody who's going to follow their dictates and will vote the way they want them to vote? I think that that sort of gets into an issue of how party in some ways has become poisonous. How, you know, when you have votes, particularly in the Senate, where, you know, basically, one person or two people can basically prevent a bill or an issue from even getting to the floor right for voting. And I think that's, that's what we need to address in the next Congress. We need to address the idea that we're a democracy now that the Senate is a deliberative body, but that deliberation at a certain point must end and then you must have a vote. It's completely undemocratic for issue after issue, to not be to not be voted upon for a straight up and down vote by the people who represent you. Because I think it's a total excuse of leadership and really moral courage that so many bills die without even getting an up or down vote. And I think a lot of that is the reason is because they don't want their members to go on the record for actually what they what they believe in. I think we've seen it with the Republican Party for a number of years. Well, most most, outlandishly when Merrick Garland was nominated to be on the Supreme Court and Basically the idea that not only Wouldn't they vote for Merrick Garland, not only Wouldn't they allow a vote in Merrick Garland, they wouldn't even allow a meeting a hearing. So, so what, what, what is democratic about that? And, and I've said it before, and but we've we've discussed it with Lana and we've kicked it around. I think the filibuster is completely undemocratic. I don't have I don't think it has anything to do with democracy or good government or representing the people the way they're supposed to. And it's not in the Constitution. There's nothing it's not cauliflower. It's a cost.
Unknown Speaker 15:38
It's a political tool. Yeah, it's Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 15:40
absolutely. You know, so. So certainly, certainly that, that that's there.
Unknown Speaker 15:45
No, I think you make a you make a great point, we're just party has become poisonous, because I just found myself even with a Georgia run off, you know, being almost angry that there were so many third party voters that ended up, you know, that should have went the other way that we could have avoided a runoff if it wasn't for third party voters. And then I had to sort of walk that back and think in my head. Good, Lord, you're being you know, you're having this vitriol and this anger towards people that decided they didn't like the two party system. You know, of course, they don't look what's happening around us. I shouldn't be angry at those people. I should be angry at the people that have allowed Herschel Walker to even be here in the first place. So I just you know, we're almost getting to the point where a party has blinded us so much that we're you don't even know who the real enemy is to look towards. Yeah, I think I think you make a great point. Professor,
Unknown Speaker 16:28
I think I think that after this election now, I think there's going to be a reassessment.
Unknown Speaker 16:36
Well, Trumpian politics didn't work. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 16:38
the Trumpian. Politics didn't work. I think there's going to be a reassessment of looking towards 2024. What is that? What is that demographic that the Republican Party needs to reach? And how do we reach it? And also and also, to we have candidates, do we have candidates who we can elect to major offices? And I'm not, I'm not, I'm not sold on Ron DeSantis.
Unknown Speaker 17:11
Really? Well, I think he'd win in a landslide as a Republican candidate. I think he appeals to a lot of those split ballots, as we were talking about that, I think ended up saving the Democratic Party. I think that I don't think they'd be split validators on a Ron DeSantis ticket. I don't think he holds that same sort of intense vitriol and I mean, that they don't say gay stuff was bad, but I think as far as the women is concerned, he doesn't have that really intense anti abortion messaging. He he doesn't really hold that same sort of malice when he speaks you know, he does sort of speak a little bit more like how you and I he holds those colloquialisms? I don't think he's as when you're talking about just Republican candidates that are so off putting in the past. We're talking about Mehmet Oz, we're talking about carry like Chuck and all these people that he doesn't have that same IQ factor that I think a lot of them do. He's not an IQ. He's a he's a dad, he's a dude. And I don't think he's a particular you know, he did work for the DOJ as an attorney. He's not somebody that's completely unqualified. I think he would stand up, but he's, he's not gonna run them. They're not gonna run up. They're gonna run Trump. So let him loose.
Unknown Speaker 18:12
I, I don't Well, I will say this. I will say this. If, if the ex president is indicted,
Unknown Speaker 18:25
which is just odd to even come out, and
Unknown Speaker 18:27
we had this, we had this discussion almost every week. I come. Yeah, that's proclamation. If the ex president is indicted, I do not see how you can run that that individual and a national campaign. I just don't see it. And you can say, well, that, you know, it was collusion between the Justice Department and Biden. You can say whatever you want to say. But the bottom line is, if you have a man who's under indictment, and if he's under indictment, or violation of the, of the espionage, essentially treason, essentially treason, obstruction of justice, I just don't see it. I just don't see it. And I
Unknown Speaker 19:16
think God willing, I mean, but they'll do it anyway. Professor, I wish I had the I have no faith. I have no faith if they won't believe, but then he'll lose. Yeah, but then he will lose. Because they can't back out of it. How do you back out of it now?
Unknown Speaker 19:29
Well, you can back out of it. You can back out of it because you don't want to go down with him. Right. And I think his I hope this election spooked him. Yeah, I think his his, his selling points have diminished. So that if you're a senator up for reelection, and was a lot of them, yeah. 24 right. And you're saying to yourself, you know, I backed the sky. It worked out one time. Buttons So data 2018 It didn't work out and 2020 It didn't work out and 2022 It didn't work out. He has, I think he has even regardless of the of the, you know, the legal Jeopardy he's in, I think he has a shelf life. I don't see it with this guy. Because, because if if the if the proposition is that, you know, Trump ism is alive and well, then all of those candidates that were he was the one he was the one who put forward they are lost, like three quarters of them lost. So what will appeal would he have? Because if you don't trust the man,
Unknown Speaker 20:45
oh, I agree with you. I just don't believe they're smart enough not to run them. I don't believe they're smart enough to put run up. And then I don't believe that they like that he is a mater. I mean, as moderate republican party can get nowadays, but I, I think they're gonna run. I think they'll run Trump. I you know, what they and let them let them lose. That's how I see it is I believe they will run him and I believe they will lose handedly when they do.
Unknown Speaker 21:08
I think, you know, although he was he was the shadow just
Unknown Speaker 21:13
need us could be his running mate.
Unknown Speaker 21:14
Oh, I don't see that happening. I I just don't I get a we we on that, you know, we look at it in a different way. I think I think the Republican Party to win needs to get somebody who can appeal to that middle ground. And they can run you know, it's true what you say about the Santas to the extent that he's not that he's not Trump, but he's done a lot of things in Florida. That will be the fodder for endless commercials, right? And I mean, don't say gay was a really bad No. And then, of course, he was running, he was running against the guy who was like a perpetual candidate, who would run in so many races had been in so many jobs. Nevertheless, nevertheless, having said that, my observation of Chris from Charlie Crist is a joke colloquially, and Florence has run for everything right. You know, he's, I guess you could say he's the BETO O'Rourke of Florida.
Unknown Speaker 22:17
And I will say, you know, for those of you that aren't familiar with the Ron DeSantis, originally, when he first got elected to beat a guy named Andrew Gillum, by a margin so slim, I mean, he just barely been Andrew Gilliam and Andrew Gillum was then I believe, arrested in some meth fueled some sort of sexual escapades. So this was, I mean, he very narrowly won against a felon. So this was not some guy that I think everybody believed would be some, you know, political power in the Republican Party, he really does have something about him for whatever reason, he's kind of been really attractive to those Florida people, those Florida voters, Trump,
Unknown Speaker 22:53
Trump is not worried about, you
Unknown Speaker 22:55
know, what he should be? Either either he's
Unknown Speaker 22:58
not worried about him, because he's delusional, or he's not worried about him, because
Unknown Speaker 23:04
he, the establishment is informing him that he has nothing to be worried about.
Unknown Speaker 23:10
In other words, that, you know, when it comes to, as you know, as we both know, to run a national campaign, it takes an enormous amount of money, right. And I would say conservatively speaking, over a billion Oh, absolutely. So at least, and probably more. So you would have to get you would have to get a tremendous amount of money behind you. But not only get money behind you, you would have to get someone who could be you could be assured would repay you. You see, that was the thing with Trump, Trump got an enormous amount of money. But Trump more than paid back the money that he got. He got the biggest tax cut bill for big industry corporations that were the that has ever been passed in this country. In addition to that, he got huge money from all the conservative backers, who wants to people in the Supreme Court, he got that. And the and if you take those two things put together, plus all the other judges that he appointed on the federal bench, it was worth it for them. The money that they gave him was worth it. Now, where are you going to find somebody who basically you can pick Supreme Courts which is unheard of. There was a less here's your list, this is where you're gonna pick, okay, I'm gonna pick them it's great, but he did it and everything was good with it. Everything was good with it, you know, so it remains to be seen we need we need to see I think before anybody can make any predictions about you know, liquid, they're gonna run in a crystal ball. We need to see how the legal process either way so it doesn't work. You know, and I've said it again that and I've said it before. And I'll say it again, I think that this is a seminal moment in American history as visa vie justice. I think that our our ability to, to present the idea that America and you that every person is judged equally, which in many ways has always been a mythology, because we know that people are color. And we know that people who are poor are not judged the same as Franco. Well, the but I think, I think and this particularly egregious, and this particularly egregious example, egregious, egregious, not on on any two matters, but these, the the possession of the possession of our most intimate secrets, and your house, the willingness or the unwillingness to return those secrets, plus the fermentation of a an insurrection are things that cannot cannot stand. If you want to have any, if you want to have any consensus among our populace, that there really is
Unknown Speaker 26:15
more legitimacy. You know, because it did. I mean, we were viewed, I think, very much on an international level, is it legitimate when you were allowing people to throw a literal face at your nation's capital hitting their marijuana pens in the nation's capitol bringing their ADRs and costumes into the nation? I mean, it's like, it's a fact that we're even talking about it is ridiculous, and how the whole thing was allowed to go down as if it was a part of you know, what, it is a dark, like you say, a dark spot on our history and how we choose to respond to it will be everything.
Unknown Speaker 26:48
I'll just throw us in quickly about General Kelly, who was chief of staff for Trump, right? And how he all these years later, now, he's talking about how James called me and and James McCabe were targeted. And all these people who are enemies of the President was targeted. And they wanted to use the IRS in different ages. Where were these people? Where was Mike Pence? Where was where was
Unknown Speaker 27:16
Mike Pence was worried he is head was on the chopping X, quite frankly,
Unknown Speaker 27:19
where were all these people when they had a duty to speak? And now? Well, it's coming. Yeah, everybody's everybody's come out with a book. Now. I was
Unknown Speaker 27:29
watching something on Bill Maher, where they said, I think over 1200 books have been written about the Trump presidency.
Unknown Speaker 27:38
You know that the time for the time for action is when these things are happening. It was it was really it was really, it was really a miracle that the country didn't go south, that our democracy didn't go south. It was really by the grace of higher power, that those people that day in Washington, those Capitol Police, those people who had sworn to uphold the law and did uphold the law. And, and people like Pelosi and Schumer and quite to a lesser extent, Mike Pence, to a lesser extent Mike fancier who believed in that in that ideal to keep our democracy running. But you can only go to the well, so many times, you know, there's certain point, you know, the you bend, and you'll also break. So we have to make sure as a nation, that we elect people who truly believe in those principles and those values and those ideals, even though many times they fall short of what we wish they would be somebody once said, you know, I think it was I think it was Franklin, and they asked about Franklin and he said that they said what do you think of the American ideal? And he says, Well, he says, he says it's the worst. It's the worst government that's ever been invented, except for every other one.
Unknown Speaker 29:15
And I think with that, we're leaving on a slightly more optimistic note than we usually leave you guys with. So thank you guys for being getting out going and voting and we hope you tune in next week. And hopefully, we'll have a little bit more of an update some more news on haul of how the run off is going in Georgia and some more updates for you guys just generally about the world of social justice. Thank you for tuning in. See you next week.
Unknown Speaker 29:35
Thank you so much.
Unknown Speaker 29:36
Thank you for listening to our show. If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact us at weather one that's w e t h e l one@nevada.unlv.edu. Or to contact Professor Charles Stanton, contact him at CHA R L E S That's Charles dot Stanton s t a n t o n@unlv.edu. See you next time
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