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We're diving into how podcast discoverability trends are evolving into 2024. For the longest time, podcasters have relied on new listeners finding their show organically. And if you've listened to this podcast for long, you'll know that we aren't fans of that method — because it historically doesn't work. However, podcast listening apps like Apple and Spotify are evolving in the way they suggest new shows in a way that will benefit new podcasters across the board. We're going to talk about this + other effective ways you can grow your show in 2024.
1:30 Popular listening apps like Apple Podcasts and Spotify
3:15 People are listening on multiple apps
5:30 How to help new listeners find your podcast
7:12 Guesting on other shows
7:44 Crossposting episodes
8:00 Use your email newsletter
8:15 Landing quality guests
9:00 Creating a release kit for your guests to share
10:15 Leveraging your social media to promote your episodes
✅ New podcaster? Grab your FREE Podcast Starter Kit.
1:30 Popular listening apps like Apple Podcasts and Spotify
3:15 People are listening on multiple apps
5:30 How to help new listeners find your podcast
7:12 Guesting on other shows
7:44 Crossposting episodes
8:00 Use your email newsletter
8:15 Landing quality guests
9:00 Creating a release kit for your guests to share
10:15 Leveraging your social media to promote your episodes
‼️ Are you feeling stuck with your podcast? Learn about our Podcast Strategy Sessions.
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► Need help launching a podcast? We do that!
► Need a professional podcast editor? It's our specialty.
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► Recording remote podcasts like us? Use Riverside!
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Disclosure: We only endorse products and services that we’ve personally used or come highly recommended by trusted sources. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases. We may receive a small commission at no extra cost to you.
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► Need help launching a podcast? We do that!
► Need a professional podcast editor? It's our specialty.
► Recommended Podcast Gear
Microphone
Headphones
Earbuds
Webcam
► Recording remote podcasts like us? Use Riverside!
► We use Transitor.fm to host our podcast and you should, too.
Disclosure: We only endorse products and services that we’ve personally used or come highly recommended by trusted sources. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases. We may receive a small commission at no extra cost to you.
Creators & Guests
Host
Host
What is Podcircle Podcast?
Finally there’s a podcast for podcasters. Every week join hosts Kyle Cummings and Mickenzie Vought as they share the knowledge and expertise they've gained from years of launching, running, and promoting successful podcasts. Whether you're an aspiring podcaster or you've already got hundreds of episodes under your belt, these conversations dive into the topics that matter to every podcaster — from marketing and growing your podcast, to recording equipment and best practices, monetization, cutting-edge tools, hiring help, and much more.
[00:00:00] Mickenzie Vought: When you have quality guests on your show, really make it easy for them to talk about your show. create an entire release kit that you give them with assets and links to the show notes and links to share on their social media.
Tag them, make it really easy and make it appealing for them to talk about your show.
Welcome to the Podcircle podcast, where we bring practical tips and insights for every podcaster.
[00:00:22] Kyle Cummings: you're just getting started or you're already a seasoned podcast pro, these conversations dive into all the topics that matter most to you. So today we're gonna dive into how people are finding podcasts in 2024. So let's start with all the obvious places first, which are podcast listening apps. So if you open up Spotify, Spotify has started suggesting podcasts based on other podcasts that you listen to.
So the whole, if you like this, then maybe you should check out this kind of thing. YouTube is obviously really good that. Um, apple Podcast is no longer my preferred. . Listening app for podcasts. But,
[00:00:58] Mickenzie Vought: is
[00:00:58] Kyle Cummings: um, I know I was a big Apple Podcast guy for a long time, but, once I moved over to Spotify and subscribed to all my, my shows there, I just think that experience is better.
And I think show notes show up on there better.
I just like the way that it kind of catalogs things. But you know, that's where a lot of people, that's what people think about when they think about where to discover new podcasts. But are there other ways we're gonna talk about Apple versus Spotify?
We're gonna dig into it a little bit more because I think it's a, an important topic, you know, to kinda start off the new year with.
[00:01:29] Mickenzie Vought: I think when you think about listening apps, you first and foremost think of the big two, right? You think of Spotify and you think of Apple, and Spotify has really come for Apple's market share. We talked about that a couple of episodes ago. and I kind of went on a rant about Spotify. honestly, uh, in total, one in four podcast listeners use Spotify for podcast listening, and one in five use Apple.
So they're still kind of prominent ones. like, I, said, as of February of last year, Spotify surpassed Apple, um, and the number of listeners. And so that gap is just continuing to. widen and in 2025 they are projected to have 42.4 million listeners and Apple will have 29.2.
So both growing, but Spotify definitely growing at a larger rate.
[00:02:14] Kyle Cummings: Definitely.
[00:02:15] Mickenzie Vought: as you think of the future of your podcast, how can you create a show that might be optimized for some of the things that Spotify's doing? I think that's important. think kind of looking at it, apple, um, subscribers tend to be older, I think. at how people adapt to technology and older generation's gonna be slower to make that transition like you and I have, maybe to Spotify or YouTube or some of the other platforms that are appealing to podcast listeners in a more diverse media way. So I think that's kind of an interesting thing.
And additionally, longtime podcast listeners prefer Apple to Spotify. So. Again, if
[00:02:48] Kyle Cummings: Hmm.
[00:02:49] Mickenzie Vought: been with Apple since the beginning, they were the first people on the scene, you're gonna be slower to transition. Um, but as Spotify continues to try to get everyone's ears, and take, more of that market share as they look at audiobook and they're already there for music and I just really continue to think we should look at Spotify.
So are the big two, but then also there are other places. So let's kind of talk about that, Kyle, um, outside of the big two, apple and Spotify.
[00:03:15] Kyle Cummings: So you pulled a, uh, a study. It said The average podcast listener in the US uses close to three different platforms that I find that so interesting. Why do you think that is?
[00:03:25] Mickenzie Vought: also
[00:03:26] Kyle Cummings: I.
[00:03:26] Mickenzie Vought: I
sometimes there are shows that I just listen to on Apple. Maybe I, my brain does that and I've subscribed, or maybe I haven't transitioned over. There are some podcasters who, um, Apple platforms and then give you, if you use the Apple, you get this episode sooner. And the same way Spotify was doing that, like exclusive shows. And then I think about people who are really starting to lean into video. And you probably have
[00:03:49] Kyle Cummings: Hmm.
[00:03:49] Mickenzie Vought: that you are going to YouTube for still now. I think Spotify's coming for all three of those and
[00:03:55] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:03:56] Mickenzie Vought: the only place you listen. But right now there might be people who are listening to a, you know, one on YouTube, maybe one on Overcast, or maybe even someone's just listening to an RS Feed because they're a Patreon subscriber. You
[00:04:07] Kyle Cummings: and it's . Yeah, our SS feed. You got it. yeah, it's interesting that as soon as I said it, I'm like, well, I do listen to podcasts in multiple places. 'cause I, I do love watching podcasts on YouTube. I just don't think it's so funny how I'm still coming like, YouTube is now a major, though we produce a lot of content for YouTube and produce a lot of video.
It's a podcast platform. It's a hosting platform.
so YouTube and Spotify. Apple with their premium,
[00:04:33] Mickenzie Vought: Yep.
[00:04:33] Kyle Cummings: ServiceNow. then I was a Patreon subscriber for a while to a comedy podcast that, uh, that showed up in my Apple feed. I think, uh, it didn't show up in my Spotify, so you're right. I mean, we we're kind of listening all over the place.
So, and that I think, kind of informs a lot of, bit of the podcast wars of, Which one is gonna win out, which, you know what I'm saying? So we talked about that a lot in our last episode. So, another interesting stat that says, a heavy podcast listener would be considered six or more hours per week, use four different services to consume podcast content.
So that's, that's pretty much in line with what I just said. So,
[00:05:09] Mickenzie Vought: Yeah.
[00:05:09] Kyle Cummings: know, other, platforms are YouTube, like we mentioned, in iHeartRadio, Pandora, all fighting for a, for a piece of the, the podcasting pie, so to speak.
[00:05:19] Mickenzie Vought: And I think, okay, so how are we getting, let's look conceptually even larger than that. I think 60% of podcasters report that building an audience feels like the biggest top challenge their most felt needs. So let's dive into a little bit more conceptually. How do you move your listeners, even get them to those listening apps?
Right. And I think
[00:05:37] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:05:37] Mickenzie Vought: foremost is still. Charts and podcast recommendations and apps. So Spotify is starting to recommend, if you like this, you might also like this. Um, then charts, most popular shows are gonna get pushed. Similar shows are gonna be pushed together. Um, you do to help people find you within those, push your show up in the app charts by encouraging your listeners subscribe and leave reviews.
I think that's something that's underrated and. also wanna encourage you to get creative around that. I once listened
[00:06:07] Kyle Cummings: Hmm.
[00:06:08] Mickenzie Vought: that every time you left a review, you like entered into something where they would create a rap or a song based on a TV show, uh,
[00:06:17] Kyle Cummings: Hmm.
[00:06:17] Mickenzie Vought: your review or of your name. And like they got really creative and they got a ton of reviews because would you not wanna be at the end of the episode in their, their rap or their song or whatever.
Um,
[00:06:28] Kyle Cummings: Right.
[00:06:29] Mickenzie Vought: I think one ask if you're giving good content, someone's. serving them, you're asking them to do that and give back to you. And two, make it fun and creative. Those are my two suggestions of how to get more reviews.
[00:06:40] Kyle Cummings: I love that about getting creative, about asking for reviews. I've, I feel like that can be kind of a hard thing to do. you know, in some of the apps it can be kinda even kind of hard to find, like where to leave a review.
So I would even say just as a
[00:06:51] Mickenzie Vought: it and all the things. Yeah.
[00:06:52] Kyle Cummings: Y Yeah, just even tell people specifically like where to go. Like, Hey, if you're an Apple, here's how you do it. If you're in Spotify, I think it's actually easier in Spotify 'cause it shows up kinda at the top. You can leave a five star rating, things like that.
But, let's talk about what you can do to help more people to find your show. So a pretty obvious one is to guest on other podcasters shows. So kind of put yourself out there. Find people that are in your space or, or adjacent to your space, and ask to be on their shows. there's different services, um, agencies, different podcast booking services.
You can hire some people. Do that and find luck with that. Others just link, they use their LinkedIn network and they're like, oh, you've got a podcast. I'd love to guess and, and talk about X, Y, and Z. Or, I noticed that you've been talking about this. You know, I actually have some expertise or some opinions on that.
Um, I'd love to hop onto your podcast and time and talk about it. So I'm a big fan of doing that. And then also cross-posting those episodes. So you know, if you can find a podcaster who will let you come on their podcast or maybe they come on yours and you guys share that episode between your two different podcast feeds, that can be a really cool thing to do.
just the power of your email newsletter to promote your podcast. If you've got 300 people, 3000 people, or 300,000 people, use that email newsletter. To promote your podcast episodes. also the last one is just get quality guests on your show.
[00:08:14] Mickenzie Vought: I think we talk a lot about quality over quantity, right? So just because someone has a lot of people following them, it doesn't mean they're gonna be a great guest, but
[00:08:23] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:08:24] Mickenzie Vought: a quality guest who's gonna, a felt need for your audience and they have a large following, that's really great.
Um, know that I have discovered podcasts simply because I have searched a guest that happened to be on there, so.
[00:08:36] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:08:37] Mickenzie Vought: One of my favorite authors is Shauna Quist. A couple years ago she had a podcast then it was short-lived. It was like a short, limited series, and I wanted more from her in that format. I was already used to hearing her and wanted more, so I just searched Shauna Niequist and it came up with a bunch of shows that I had never listened to, but because I wanted to listen to her. ended up listening to new shows and it was a discoverability for me. I think the
[00:09:01] Kyle Cummings: Hmm.
[00:09:01] Mickenzie Vought: side of this is when When you have quality guests on your show, really make it easy for them to talk about your show. We've talked about this in in past episodes, but create an entire release kit that you give them with assets and and links to the show notes and links to share on their social media.
Tag them, make it really easy and make it appealing for them to talk about your show.
[00:09:22] Kyle Cummings: Yeah, especially those social media clips, those reels, Make them look and sound good. they're gonna wanna share it.
[00:09:27] Mickenzie Vought: and you talked about your email newsletter and I think this is also a space where you can utilize that cross-promotion and this collabing and networking that you're talking about. I follow another podcaster who is always advertising, um, must be a friend or a. Some, another author in this space and she always talks about this person's podcast at the very end of her email newsletter.
It's like, Hey, if you like my show, you might also like this. Um, and I have just, I've had guests on who are really intentional and say, Hey, will you share if you like this person, you might like this person. So like they're trying to connect me and then show me that they're someone that will then connect. Me to other people. So it's just this collaboration and this networking, I think can go so far in this space. think about, not scarcity, but just about how do we collab and not
[00:10:12] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:10:13] Mickenzie Vought: I think when we're talking about collaboration, uh, and marketing and all that, it can feel a little intimidating. And so we really are a strong believer in using social media to lift your podcast. We've talked a lot about this. Um, talked about this in episode 10. And episode 13 of the Pod Circle podcast. And those two titles, if you wanna go back and listen just so you can catch up. Um, was Five Ways to Grow Your Podcast Audience. We talk a lot about social media in that one. And then on episode 10, converting social media followers into podcast subscribers. We really go in depth about, um. The strategic and simple and low lift ways that you can take an audience that's already pretty engaged with you and then those most loyal and move them to a podcast listener. So you should
[00:10:53] Kyle Cummings: Love it.
[00:10:54] Mickenzie Vought: out. We won't dive too far into this right now, um, but I think it is harkens on what Kyle, you're always talking about quality clips.
[00:11:01] Kyle Cummings: Mm-Hmm.
[00:11:02] Mickenzie Vought: record video and create scroll stopping reels in social media, um, and create a show that people rave about and they wanna talk about. Make it easy for them. Do clear asks, run a contest. Like there's all kinds of ways to convert and get people, um, your social media to your podcast, and then simultaneously from podcast listeners to talking to you on social.
So,
[00:11:23] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:11:23] Mickenzie Vought: audience.
[00:11:24] Kyle Cummings: Right on. we're gonna round this one out. Uh, before we go, uh, I wanna tell you about the podcast starter kit that we offer, at po circle.com/start. I feel like you're the one that put it together. Mackenzie, you, I feel like you, you talk about it better than I do, to be honest with you.
[00:11:39] Mickenzie Vought: I think from top to bottom we wanna make sure that you are launching smarter and working smarter, not harder. And we have launched successful podcasts. We know what goes into it, and it can feel really intimidating when you look at an entire list of things that need to happen to get it out into the world.
So this kit is gonna take this idea you have in your head and really make it practical. Bring it down to the tasks you have to do to get it out into the world. So move from your head out into the world because we really believe you have a message that the world needs to hear.
[00:12:05] Kyle Cummings: it's a new year and a lot of people are, are thinking, a lot of people that in 2022, going into 2023 said, you know what, this is my year. I'm gonna start a podcast. Well, 2023 came to an end and now it's like, you know what? I really wanna start that podcast. So that podcast starter kit is your go-to resource for how to get your show up.
and it's, it's really gonna show you the ropes. Uh, it's, it's a really top to bottom, guide for helping you launch your podcast. So
[00:12:30] Mickenzie Vought: Yeah.
[00:12:30] Kyle Cummings: and check that out at pod circle.com/start. Yeah.
[00:12:34] Mickenzie Vought: if you're thinking about launching this year and feeling kind of intimidated and wanna get it from your head, but you've got a vague idea. that Kyle and I love to do is strategy sessions to really get crystal clear about what is your message, who is your audience?
How can we optimize this? Um, and so email Kyle at kyle@podcircle.com and set up a free consultation and talk to him about, Hey, would a strategy session be right for me? Here's the stage where
[00:12:56] Kyle Cummings: Yeah.
[00:12:57] Mickenzie Vought: here, here's what I wanna happen. You know, give him a vague outline and we can help you get it crystal clear with one of these two hour sessions.
I,
[00:13:04] Kyle Cummings: Yep. The, the key word there is clarity. I think that people just, they walk away with a lot of clarity. Um, come in. . feeling really fuzzy about the direction of their podcast. Maybe they're 10, 20, even a hundred episodes in. They're thinking, is this, am I getting the return on investment, you know, on this?
And or how do I, you know, how do I monetize it? How do I grow it? How do I get in front of, you know, this group of people that I wanna speak to? we can absolutely help you with that. We do it every week. So, um, last thing is, if you're listening to audio and you want to consume the video podcast,
[00:13:37] Mickenzie Vought: Yeah.
[00:13:38] Kyle Cummings: every episode up on YouTube.
So find us at Podcircle on YouTube and subscribe to us there. Um, listening on Apple or Spotify, we'd love if you give us a . A rating and a review there as we were talking about you're on Apple, you can go to our, our channel. Scroll down. If you love the podcast, leave a five star rating Leave us just a quick review. Let us know how we're doing. Anything we can improve on. We're all ears. Would love to hear from you. Um, same thing on YouTube. you drop the comment and say, Hey, love the episode. Or if you have a question about anything we're talking about, if you wanna suggest a topic for a future episode.
We would love to hear it. Honestly, podcast is for you. We're not doing this for ourselves, so we want to, we wanna arm you with the, the best and advice, So thanks for listening. We'll be back at you next week with another episode. As always, take care. We'll talk to you next week.