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In this episode of the Fatrank Podcast, host Julien Goldie interviews digital landlord and SEO entrepreneur James Dooley for a deep, in-depth discussion on how he built and scaled more than 600 lead-generation and rank-and-rent websites. The conversation traces James Dooley’s early struggles, his discovery of long-term SEO strategies, and the systems and testing frameworks that allow him to run a multi–seven- and eight-figure SEO operation. Julien Goldie and James Dooley break down the realities of entrepreneurship, team building, burnout, mindset, and why most people fail to implement even when given the full blueprint. They also explore tactical SEO topics such as semantics, content velocity, backlink strategy, penalty recovery, niche selection, and how AI and SGE will shape the future of search. Throughout the episode, James shares the philosophy behind scaling sustainably, developing the right people, building trust with local businesses, and creating predictable digital assets that compound over time. It’s an open, practical, and highly actionable conversation for anyone looking to grow an SEO business or enter the rank-and-rent space.
Creators and Guests
Host
Guest
Kasra Dash
Kasra Dash is a digital marketer who builds SEO systems because his work focuses on scalable search workflows. Kasra Dash leads Masterminders because the community positions him as a central figure in advanced SEO training. Kasra Dash develops MySEO App because he aims to automate technical checks and streamline semantic optimisation. Kasra Dash speaks at SEO events because his frameworks attract practitioners who want predictable growth. Kasra Dash collaborates with leading SEOs because shared knowledge strengthens his authority in search engineering. Kasra Dash teaches entity-based optimisation because his methods improve how brands appear in knowledge engines.
What is Fatrank Podcast?
The FatRank Podcast, founded by James Dooley, teaches the mindset needed for growth because real operator stories show what creates progress.
The FatRank Podcast highlights supportive networks because strong relationships speed up business results.
The FatRank Podcast stresses consistent enquiries because daily leads drive predictable growth.
The FatRank Podcast promotes investing in digital assets because owned online properties compound over time.
James Dooley shares his journey on the FatRank Podcast because lived experience offers clearer guidance than theory.
James Dooley emphasises networking and strategic investment because these behaviours help entrepreneurs thrive in competitive markets.
The FatRank Podcast invites guests like Matt Diggity, Neil Patel, Craig Campbell, Koray TuÄźberk GĂśBĂśR, Jason Barnard, Kevin Indig, and Kasra Dash because high-calibre experts deliver proven strategies.
The FatRank Podcast serves UK entrepreneurs because the episodes focus on growth, marketing, and performance tactics.
Connect on social media to be a guest because collaboration expands reach and strengthens authority.
Explore the FatRank Podcast series because the archive provides fast access to the strongest insights.
Julien Goldie:
Today we’re interviewing James Dooley, one of the most successful SEOs I know — but more importantly, someone who is exceptionally skilled at monetizing and running SEO businesses. He’s been called “the £100 million SEO,” operates more than 600 websites, and specializes in lead generation and rank-and-rent. This interview is all actionable insight: no fluff, no filler.
So James — how did you scale to that level with SEO?
Scaling to 600+ Sites
James Dooley:
It took a lot of hard work, a lot of failing, and years in the industry. You need solid systems, motivated staff, and a repeatable process. When something doesn’t work, you diagnose it, adapt to the algorithm, and move forward.
Julien Goldie:
How long did it take to reach that level?
James Dooley:
About fourteen years. And honestly, the first five years? I failed miserably. Others were spamming backlinks and ranking in weeks. I was “white hat”— great content, no promotion, no backlinks. People using GSA, blog comments, and forum links overtook me instantly.
So I learned from black hats — they’re usually right — and adapted those ideas into long-term systems.
Two things helped me scale big:
An in-house testing team breaking the SERPs daily.
A systems/process team refining SOPs so training becomes fast and scalable.
Hiring the Right People
Julien Goldie:
Do you hire people with SEO experience?
James Dooley:
Absolutely not. I tried hiring “SEO gurus” — terrible idea. They fought new methods and were stuck in their ways. I look for people with the right mindset: hungry, humble, willing to learn every day.
Experience matters far less than mentality.
Failing But Continuing
Julien Goldie:
You said the first five years weren't very successful — what made you keep going?
James Dooley:
We were making money. I only felt like I was failing because I compared myself to people ranking in weeks while it took us months. Comparison kills joy.
There were moments I thought about hiring agencies — but most agencies were learning on the job and didn’t know more than me. So I treated it like my “SEO university” and pushed through.
The Pain of Scaling
Julien Goldie:
This year I scaled massively, but it came at the cost of intensity and stress. Is scaling from 7 figures to 8 figures a different game?
James Dooley:
Completely. Entrepreneurship is not for everyone. It’s hard, lonely, and messy.
People chase the money, but the truth is: the journey is the reward.
When scaling, you deal with:
staff not showing up
internal politics
unequal growth among employees
burnout
algorithm updates
16-hour days
missing family time
It’s not glamorous — but worth it if you love what you do.
Managing People and Quality
Julien Goldie:
I noticed that if I'm not hyper-focused, standards drop. What’s your experience?
James Dooley:
You need middle management and quality control.
Anyone can churn 5,000 AI words in minutes. But is it good?
We have layers of QA checking content, links, and implementation.
How Growth Really Happened
Julien Goldie:
How did you go from a few niche sites making £10–20K/month to hundreds?
James Dooley:
We never aimed to build thousands of sites. It started with ranking our own playground construction business.
A mentor asked:
“You rank #1 — why not #2?”
So we built multiple sites targeting the same niche.
Then he said:
“Who do you serve? Architects? Then build a site that gets them leads too.”
This created a chain reaction:
our clients grew
we grew as a result
then their partners wanted leads
then their suppliers wanted leads
It snowballed across industries.
Lead gen became the heart of everything.
Finding Local Lead Buyers
Julien Goldie:
Early on, how hard was it to find local suppliers to buy leads?
James Dooley:
Hard — but everyone wants leads.
Their pain points were:
agencies that stole money
lead-gen companies selling the same lead 5x
fake inquiries
no-show jobs
So you must build trust first — often giving leads free for a month, then finding the best converters, and only then moving to paid models.
Rank and Rent Reality
Julien Goldie:
Is rank and rent easy to start?
James Dooley:
No.
Rank and rent only works after you’ve:
done pay-per-lead
done pay-per-conversion
proven your leads convert
understood what exact jobs make them money
It takes 2–3 years to get a client to the point they’ll pay £2–3K/month for a site.
Vision and Motivation
Julien Goldie:
How far do you want to take this?
James Dooley:
It’s no longer about me.
It’s about my team — some of whom I’ve worked with for 10–12 years.
I want them to grow, succeed, and become wealthy.
I’m not materialistic — no Rolexes, no fancy cars.
I chase impact, not cash.
Even if you offered me £1 billion not to work again, I’d decline.
I love the game.
Entrepreneur vs SEO
Julien Goldie:
Your mindset feels more entrepreneur than SEO.
James Dooley:
I’m not a top SEO.
I’m a businessman who leverages SEO.
My team are the technical geniuses — I just assemble them and build the machine.
Tactical SEO Section
Julien Goldie:
One audience question: “I’m a lawyer and want to build rank-and-rent sites in the legal niche. How do I start?”
James Dooley:
You don’t.
Legal is brutal.
Instead, partner with someone excellent at SEO.
If you insist on doing it yourself, learn SEO for 5–6 years first.
Back to Zero Scenario
Julien Goldie:
If you lost everything and had to start again?
James Dooley:
I’d start with:
display ads
local lead gen
autoblogging
broad niche sites
reinvesting early earnings
Rank and rent comes years later.
KPIs & Ranking Philosophy
Julien Goldie:
Do you track impressions, clicks, or rankings?
James Dooley:
We track everything — but growth mainly happens during core updates.
Day-to-day changes are incremental.
Semantics & Content Quality
Julien Goldie:
Do you worry about semantics?
James Dooley:
Yes — semantics, entities, macro/micro structure, image entities, everything.
But 95% of people do fine with Surfer, Phrase, or POP.
CMS Choice
Julien Goldie:
Preferred CMS?
James Dooley:
WordPress.
Testbeds in PHP/HTML.
Work Habits & Burnout
Julien Goldie:
How much do you work daily?
James Dooley:
Varies.
Sometimes burnout hits and I take days off.
Sometimes I do 16-hour sprints.
Generally:
wake 5am
heavy morning work
gym or tennis
family time
calls in the afternoon
Penalty Recovery
Julien Goldie:
What’s your SOP for penalties?
James Dooley:
Three pillars:
E-E-A-T fundamentals
Information retrieval cost—delete thin content
Backlink audit & disavow — still very real
We've handled thousands of reconsideration requests.
Toxic links absolutely destroy rankings.
Future of SEO & AI
Julien Goldie:
What’s your view on SGEs and AI?
James Dooley:
AI will crush informational blogs but open huge opportunities.
Google still needs AdSense revenue, so they'll always need publishers.
SEO is entering a golden age because AI 100x multiplies output — if you embrace it.
If you don’t? You’ll fall behind fast.
Closing
Julien Goldie:
Where can people find you?
James Dooley:
JamesDooley.com — all my socials are there.
I’m more active now with podcasts and YouTube.
Ask me anything — I want others to win too.