Is This About The Money?

A surprising amount of what looks like a money problem is actually something else wearing a money costume. Tim shares a story from his early touring days, when a tour manager's blunt question — "Is this about the money, or is it something else?" — cut through a negotiation in under a minute. He applies that same question to financial planning, using the common example of someone wondering if they're saving enough for retirement: the real issue often isn't the math, it's an unresolved question about priorities. Tim walks through a framework for looking past the numbers to identify what you actually want, then reframing that priority as a matter of identity rather than obligation — a shift that makes it far easier to stick with a plan.

One Key Takeaway: Before assuming a financial question is just a matter of getting the numbers right, ask whether there's a deeper question hiding underneath it.

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What is The Thing We Never Talk About?

The Thing We Never Talk About is an educational podcast about personal finance for creatives and other weirdos. We'll discuss managing cash flow with a lumpy income, when to save & when to invest, and how to reduce stress & build confidence when it comes to your money. No hot stock tips, no complicated strategies, and no finance bro jargon. We'll hear from artists, musicians, creative professionals, and other weirdos about how they navigate these questions for themselves. The Thing We Never Talk About is hosted by Timothy Iseler, CFP®, a former recording & touring audio engineer with 18 years experience in the music industry.

Timothy Iseler: Hi, everyone.

Welcome to The Thing We Never Talk About.

My name is Tim Iseler.

I'm a certified financial planner, and I
run my own independent financial advisory

business, helping musicians, artists,
and other people with weird jobs make

smarter decisions with their money.

You can learn more at iselerfinancial.com.

If you have suggestions for things you'd
like to hear about or a question you would

like me to answer in a future episode,
please visit iselerfinancial.com/podcast

And if you like what you hear,
you can also subscribe to my

Keep It Easy newsletter at
iselerfinancial.com/newsletter.

I write about exactly this kind of
stuff, and I share it there most weeks.

Today, I want to share a
story about something that

happened on my first big tour.

I started my career as an audio
engineer working in a great recording

studio in Chicago, but, aside from
touring with my own bands, I had no

aspirations to tour professionally.

Not that I was opposed to it,
but it just wasn't on my radar.

When I first started touring with bands,
it was with people I knew, indie bands

who were very much connected to the
music community that I was a part of.

I didn't really make any money from
those tours, but I didn't really

have to: I had my recording studio
job, and touring was just a fun

thing I did with my vacation days.

That changed in 2007.

A person I knew through a Chicago indie
record label, who has since become a

trusted friend, was managing an artist who
was about to take a big step forward in

terms of production and touring, and he
needed to hire personnel for this artist.

It Was my first time touring on a
bus, but it was also this artist's

first time having his own bus.

Part of the deal that the manager made
with the crew and hired band members

to hedge against the extra expenses
involved was to offer a fairly modest

day rate through the first three months,
then, if everything was working out,

the band and crew would get a raise
for the rest of the touring cycle.

As I mentioned, this was my biggest
tour to date and the only one where

I thought I'd actually make any
money, so that deal was fine with me.

As the initial three-month term was
drawing to a close, I still hadn't heard

anything about that promised raise.

So, when the manager joined us for the
end of a tour, I knocked on his office

door and asked to speak with him.

I can't remember exactly what I
said, but I know it was not as clear

and confident as I wanted it to be.

After maybe a minute, the manager stopped
me and asked a question that has stuck

with me ever since: "Is this about
the money, or is it something else?"

He went on to say, "If this is
about the money, we can work it out.

If you just don't like the gig,
though, I'm not sure I can help you."

As I said, this manager has since become
a good friend, and I really appreciate

his willingness to cut to the chase.

Because once it was clear what we were
talking about, we had everything worked

out in probably less than thirty seconds.

And I think about that question
fairly often in my current career as

a financial advisor: is this about
the money or is it something else?

Sometimes the thing we want to change
or solve has a dollar amount attached,

so we assume that the solution is
about money; that if you can get the

numbers in order or massage the math,
then the answer will become clear.

But very often, there's a second,
more subtle question or aspiration

hidden under that supposedly
straightforward math problem that is

actually the source of the friction.

Let me give you an example.

A lot of people reach out to me
and want to know if they're doing

enough to save for retirement.

And that's a perfectly legit question.

That's the kind of question you can solve
with good data and enough calculations.

But if the numbers that the calculator
spits out don't match up with what you

want to hear it can be really difficult
to take action, to do the things that

the numbers say you're supposed to do.

So let's dig a little deeper.

Is this about the money?

Is this about getting the numbers right?

Or is it about something else?

Retirement is kind of a nebulous
concept when you're 10 or

15 or 25 years away from it.

So what are you actually hoping
will happen when you retire?

What is it that you actually want
to do that you aren't doing now?

Let's say that someone wants to
retire so they can travel more.

That's something I hear a lot.

Okay, that's great.

You want to travel more.

Of course, time and money are finite,
both right now and in retirement, so

traveling more means that you're not
spending that time and money on any of the

dozens of other things you could be doing.

Now what we're actually looking
at is a prioritization question

masquerading as a money question.

Are you willing to prioritize
that life over the many other

ways you could use your money?

If so, then we can make a plan.

If not, then no amount of
running the numbers will help.

You need to first get clear on the capital
W Why before you start solving for how.

Now, here's a trick I first learned
about in Atomic Habits by James Clear.

If you want a new habit to
stick, start first with identity.

If you want to prioritize saving
for retirement so that you can

travel more, rephrase it as a
matter of how you see yourself.

"I am the type of person who
prioritizes saving for travel."

Now when you put your money into
your retirement accounts, it's

because it aligns with who you are
rather than just something you do.

Do you see that distinction?

Adding a simple statement about
identity makes it easier to

stick with those decisions.

We've taken a, air quotes, money
problem and turned it into a

question of priorities, then turned
those priorities into identity.

Now when we crunch the numbers or
use the financial planning software,

we're helping you live according to
your aspirational view of yourself

and not just solving an equation.

That is so much more satisfying
for everyone involved.

And to be perfectly blunt, it makes it
much, much easier to stick with your plan.

So what's the takeaway?

When you have a problem, question,
or concern that involves money,

don't immediately assume it's just
about getting the numbers right.

Having the right numbers is important.

I'm not saying we should throw our
calculators in the trash, but we first

need to understand if this is about
the money or if there's something

else that needs to be addressed first.

It's worth asking a second or even
third question to get a little deeper.

The answers to those questions
can be turned into aspirational

statements of identity.

You're no longer saving for retirement
or whatever because it's something you

should do or something you want later.

You're doing it because you're the typ
e of person who prioritizes travel or

family or whatever you've identified as

the really important stuff.

Now that you're clear on your
priorities and identity, any decisions

you make are coming from a place of
alignment with your values rather than

just solving a math problem to get
the quote-unquote, "right answer."

I think that's a helpful
framework that anyone can use with

their own financial questions.

And if you try it out, I'd
love to hear how it goes.

You can send me an email at
[e-mail]

or reach out through the connect page on
my website at iselerfinancial.com/connect.

The Thing We Never Talk
About is for educational and

entertainment purposes only.

It's not legal, investment, or tax advice.

People on the show, including myself,
may have interests for or against

any investments discussed, so do
yourself a favor and don't ever make

any investment decisions based on
what you hear on this or any podcast.

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If you have a money or finance
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iselerfinancial.com/podcast.

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Thanks so much for listening.

I appreciate you