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This week on Sober Banter, we’re joined by Tim Lineaweaver—a therapist, dad, and four decades sober.
Tim takes us back to 1984, when he first got sober, and walks us through how recovery has evolved (and what’s stayed the same) over the past 40 years. From navigating trauma in sobriety to talking with your kids about alcoholism, this conversation is full of real-life wisdom, humor, and heart.
Tim takes us back to 1984, when he first got sober, and walks us through how recovery has evolved (and what’s stayed the same) over the past 40 years. From navigating trauma in sobriety to talking with your kids about alcoholism, this conversation is full of real-life wisdom, humor, and heart.
We dive into early cravings, drinking dreams, and what it means to help others while still protecting your own peace. Whether you’re newly sober or years into the journey, Tim’s perspective will leave you feeling seen and supported.
Want more from Tim?
Follow his writing: wreckagetorecovery.substack.com
Reach out directly: tnt410@aol.com
Episode Highlights:
2:36 – Back to 1984: Getting sober
5:13 – Sobriety in the 80s & How Tim got sober
8:43 – Growing up in an alcoholic home
14:31 – Trauma and addiction
19:39 – Upcoming memoir & Earning a degree in sobriety
23:33 – What people misunderstand about trauma
26:09 – Never met someone who regretted getting sober
27:43 – What’s changed in recovery since the 80s
33:09 – The core message Tim wants people to hear
36:49 – Talking to kids about addiction
41:05 – Drinking dreams
P.S. Thanks for supporting independent recovery shows like ours. We’re a small but mighty team (okay, it’s mostly just me editing at midnight), and we’re so glad you’re here.
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Do you have questions or feedback or want to be a guest email rachel@soberbanter.com
- (02:36) - – Back to 1984: Getting sober
- (05:13) - – Sobriety in the 80s & How Tim got sober
- (08:43) - – Growing up in an alcoholic home
- (14:31) - – Trauma and addiction
- (19:39) - – Upcoming memoir & Earning a degree in sobriety
- (23:33) - – What people misunderstand about trauma
- (26:09) - – Never met someone who regretted getting sober
- (27:43) - – What’s changed in recovery since the 80s
- (33:09) - – The core message Tim wants people to hear
- (36:49) - – Talking to kids about addiction
- (41:05) - – Drinking dreams
- (43:53) - – Tim’s call to sober publishers
Creators and Guests
What is Sober Banter?
Sober Banter, a podcast about life without alcohol, is real, relatable, and never boring. Hosts Rachel and Colin share honest conversations about sobriety with humor, heart, and a touch of chaos.
Rachel Casey (00:00:04):
All right, everybody, welcome to Sober Banter.
Rachel Casey (00:00:06):
My name is Rachel, and I am hosting solo, but I am not solo.
Rachel Casey (00:00:10):
Today,
Rachel Casey (00:00:11):
I have Tim Lineweaver,
Rachel Casey (00:00:13):
not only a dad in recovery,
Rachel Casey (00:00:16):
a grandfather in recovery,
Rachel Casey (00:00:17):
but also works as a therapist in recovery.
Rachel Casey (00:00:20):
Welcome, Tim.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:21):
Thank you so much, Rachel.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:23):
I'm glad to be here today.
Rachel Casey (00:00:24):
What is your sobriety date?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:26):
It is August 27th, 1984.
Rachel Casey (00:00:31):
1984.
Rachel Casey (00:00:31):
That is four decades of sobriety.
Rachel Casey (00:00:36):
Congratulations.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:37):
Thank you.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:37):
I just celebrated 40 years last August.
Rachel Casey (00:00:42):
How did that feel picking up?
Rachel Casey (00:00:43):
Did you get a chip?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:45):
I ordered my own chip.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:47):
It's interesting.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:48):
I normalized recovery in my life for many years.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:53):
I didn't celebrate except mentally, if that makes sense.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:57):
I'd be like, oh,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:00:58):
I have X number of years today, but 40 was a big number.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:02):
I wanted to just celebrate that a little bit.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:05):
So it was great.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:07):
My kids came from all their far-flung places.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:11):
My grandkids came and we had a lot of friends over and it was just a really nice
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:15):
kind of celebration and it made me feel really good.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:18):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:01:19):
That's a big accomplishment.
Rachel Casey (00:01:20):
Did your kids see you drink or were you sober by the time?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:24):
Let's see.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:25):
My daughter's first year, I was still addicted.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:28):
I was absent a lot from her life.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:31):
Yeah, I'd be in and out.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:33):
At one years old though?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:34):
Well, let's see.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:34):
She would have been a year and two months is when I went to treatment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:37):
And since then, we had my stepson and then my other son was born.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:43):
So they have not seen me drinking or using.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:01:46):
Thank God.
Rachel Casey (00:01:46):
My son was two when I got sober.
Rachel Casey (00:01:48):
Didn't go to treatment.
Rachel Casey (00:01:49):
I have two nieces.
Rachel Casey (00:01:51):
One, I was drinking when she was born and it was pretty bad.
Rachel Casey (00:01:54):
And then the other one,
Rachel Casey (00:01:56):
when she was born,
Rachel Casey (00:01:57):
it was really surreal because I'm like,
Rachel Casey (00:01:59):
this is someone who will never see her aunt drink.
Rachel Casey (00:02:03):
Like I was holding her sober and I'm just like...
Rachel Casey (00:02:06):
I can say, it was special.
Rachel Casey (00:02:09):
It felt really cool.
Rachel Casey (00:02:11):
And not to say that my other niece, obviously, she was my first.
Rachel Casey (00:02:14):
It was still very special, but it's really different.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:17):
Yeah, it is.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:18):
It totally is.
Rachel Casey (00:02:20):
And my mom is sober.
Rachel Casey (00:02:22):
She got sober when I turned 21.
Rachel Casey (00:02:24):
My son was her first grandson.
Rachel Casey (00:02:26):
And she says being a sober grandma is definitely the biggest blessing.
Rachel Casey (00:02:30):
And it's hard, though, being new in recovery as a parent.
Rachel Casey (00:02:34):
So what was that like back in...
Rachel Casey (00:02:36):
Like, take me back to 1984.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:38):
I grew up in an alcoholic home.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:40):
My father was a real, what we would call a chronic alcoholic.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:44):
He was sort of known for his drinking.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:46):
He was an interesting guy.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:47):
He was a writer, fished, hunted.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:50):
He wrote for course illustrated for four years, had some medical complications, lost the job.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:02:57):
We moved up to Cape Cod, Massachusetts, and his alcoholism had a really big effect on me.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:03):
And I started to drink when I was 13.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:05):
I smoked pot the same year.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:09):
I started to smoke cigarettes when I was 12.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:12):
By the time I was probably in my late teens, I was an early to mid-stage alcoholic.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:19):
Started using cocaine.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:21):
Long story short,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:22):
by the time 1984 rolled around,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:24):
I had really blown up my life,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:28):
ended up divorced,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:29):
trying to get custody back of my daughter and visitation and stuff.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:33):
And she was kind of the most, at least the initial motivation for that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:38):
As I say, my son, too.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:39):
Like, I feel that it's.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:41):
And probably you can probably speak to this, too.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:43):
For me, it was sort of like, OK, I know what I went through with my dad.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:47):
You all want to put my kids through that?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:49):
No, I don't.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:50):
I want it to be different.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:03:51):
And that that was at least one of the things that really called me to recover.
Rachel Casey (00:03:56):
Yeah, and my dad is also what you say, currently chronic, alcoholic.
Rachel Casey (00:04:02):
I looked in the mirror and I was exactly what I'd swore I wanted to be.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:08):
I had the exact same experience.
Rachel Casey (00:04:10):
Best thing that ever happened, though.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:12):
I mean, that's the downside, but there's the upside.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:14):
I came home.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:16):
I'd been on a binge for a couple of days.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:19):
They came home.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:20):
My wife was understandably very upset.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:22):
My first wife, you know, I was like, where the hell have you been?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:25):
And what are you, you know, what are you doing?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:27):
And I exploded and I was rooting around in the refrigerator for a beer.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:31):
Yeah.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:32):
And I had a jar of mustard in my hand for some reason.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:36):
I flung it against the wall and it exploded.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:39):
My daughter burst into gasping tears.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:43):
I walked out of the kitchen and there happened to be a mirror in the hall.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:46):
I looked at myself and it was like,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:48):
oh my God,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:48):
I looked just like my father when he would be raging.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:52):
And it was like...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:54):
I didn't get sober immediately after that, but not long after that I did.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:04:59):
And I really had that feeling of like, I'm really losing my grip.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:04):
I'm becoming what I said I would never become.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:07):
And that was another motivation for getting into recovery.
Rachel Casey (00:05:12):
When you were in early sobriety, I mean, phones were not the way it is now.
Rachel Casey (00:05:16):
Technology wasn't the way it is now.
Rachel Casey (00:05:18):
So how did early recovery, what did that look like for you?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:21):
I tell people that for me,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:23):
early recovery was kind of a rock fight in a sense,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:27):
because by the time I had made the decision to get sober,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:31):
the unmanageability,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:33):
as they say,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:33):
of my life was really...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:35):
I was separated from my wife, soon to be divorced.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:38):
The IRS came after me for back taxes.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:41):
All I had was a high school diploma.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:44):
And guess what my line of work was?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:46):
I was a bartender.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:47):
They were pretty tough circumstances.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:49):
But I would also say...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:51):
some real beneficial gains that kept me in it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:56):
And I should also mention, I craved a ton too.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:05:59):
Like I would just go through the day craving.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:02):
My way of coping with that was to eat ice cream.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:04):
So that kind of,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:06):
but I would also have these really wonderful moments where,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:11):
oh my God,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:12):
I feel kind of like a whole person here.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:16):
oh my God, this music I'm listening to right now is so great.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:21):
There was sort of a spirituality to it that was really encouraging.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:27):
I also was lucky.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:28):
I had a very empathetic, nonjudgmental therapist that was really encouraging.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:34):
And sometimes I would go to her and I'd be like, oh my God, my life sucks.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:38):
I'm getting divorced, the IRS.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:40):
What am I going to do?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:42):
And she would say,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:43):
Keep with it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:44):
Don't quit.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:45):
It's going to get better.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:46):
Keep going.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:47):
And she was right.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:48):
It did.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:06:48):
A lot better.
Rachel Casey (00:06:50):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:06:51):
Did you go through AA or you kind of did it with the therapist where that's where
Rachel Casey (00:06:57):
you went through kind of the trauma work?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:00):
Well, my approach was all of the above.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:03):
I grew up in an environment that,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:06):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:06):
as you touched on earlier,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:08):
it wasn't really about being a sober person.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:12):
Alcoholic home.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:13):
I hung out with, you know, in the bars.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:16):
I was involved in dealing cocaine.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:19):
The idea of going to therapy was really kind of radical.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:22):
Yeah.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:23):
But I was desperate.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:24):
Or I actually went to treatment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:26):
She kept encouraging, you need to go to treatment, you need to do more for your recovery.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:29):
I'm like, no, I don't think I need to.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:31):
And I would relapse and so on.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:33):
So I went to treatment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:35):
In those days, it was sort of the Minnesota model.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:38):
You detox and then do 30 days.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:40):
I came home.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:41):
I did therapy, individual therapy with her.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:43):
I did group therapy.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:46):
And I did AA and NA.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:48):
There was a little NA meeting that I went to.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:51):
It was just sort of beginning.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:53):
It wasn't as big as it was now.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:56):
And I did a ton of meetings.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:07:58):
I did group therapy bit by bit.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:01):
The trauma stuff kind of leaked out to my therapist as I got more comfortable talking to her.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:07):
I just kind of loaded myself up with support.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:11):
One way I like to tell it is when I was in treatment after like two,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:15):
two and a half,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:16):
three weeks,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:16):
I was like,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:17):
if I could just stay here the rest of my life,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:20):
I think I could be so easy.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:24):
But I had a secondary thought, which was, okay, what is making me feel that way?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:28):
Well, individual therapy, group therapy, meetings, you know, so structured.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:33):
I did a ton of meetings for like three, three and a half, four years.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:37):
And I did therapy for even longer than that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:08:41):
And it paid off.
Rachel Casey (00:08:42):
especially the trauma of growing up with an, in an alcoholic home.
Rachel Casey (00:08:46):
Cause I had two alcoholic parents.
Rachel Casey (00:08:48):
I still haven't been able to go to adult children's.
Rachel Casey (00:08:51):
I will,
Rachel Casey (00:08:52):
I've been to like three meetings and they wreck me so hard that even my therapist
Rachel Casey (00:08:57):
is like,
Rachel Casey (00:08:58):
let's just not push that yet because we're not there yet.
Rachel Casey (00:09:02):
Like the very first chapter,
Rachel Casey (00:09:03):
the idea of like,
Rachel Casey (00:09:04):
you didn't know what kind of home we were going to come home to.
Rachel Casey (00:09:06):
Was it a mad drunk?
Rachel Casey (00:09:07):
Was it a sad drunk?
Rachel Casey (00:09:08):
Was it a happy and that hypervigilance?
Rachel Casey (00:09:12):
lives with me still i can relate to that yeah certainly i am in school i only had a
Rachel Casey (00:09:18):
high school diploma too when i got sober and i've gone back to school originally
Rachel Casey (00:09:22):
was like yeah i'm gonna be a counselor addiction counselor with one-on-one and i've
Rachel Casey (00:09:27):
kind of leaned back a little bit how do you separate your recovery from helping
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:33):
others with their trauma it can be tough i don't believe that there's only one way
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:38):
to get clean and sober
Rachel Casey (00:09:39):
I don't either.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:40):
A lot of people take different paths than the one I took.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:43):
And my thing is at the end of the day, okay, if you're sober, then you're in recovery.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:48):
Good for you.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:49):
And however that works for you, it works.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:52):
So we don't need to stress about it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:54):
Having said that,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:09:55):
I think that one typical mistake that I made and that other newly people who want
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:00):
to be sober make is
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:02):
They don't do enough to really support themselves.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:06):
And it can be kind of like throwing a wet sponge at a thick concrete wall and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:11):
expecting it to tumble over.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:13):
You need a sledgehammer for that thing.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:15):
Yes, that can be frustrating.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:17):
But there's also, nowadays, I think, treatment is better and more refined.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:24):
And there are ways of...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:27):
of working with people where they can,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:31):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:32):
you sort of see where they're at and then you counsel them accordingly.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:37):
Sometimes people arrive at my door and they're really ready to change.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:41):
They're really to embrace it and go.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:43):
And other times,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:44):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:44):
maybe their husband or wife or girlfriend,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:47):
boyfriend has directed them,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:49):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:49):
you need to go get therapy.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:51):
So I just try to have a broad approach to people.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:10:55):
and meet wherever they are on their journey so far kind of thing and then help them
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:02):
accordingly.
Rachel Casey (00:11:03):
And this is going to sound probably a little silly,
Rachel Casey (00:11:04):
but I recently watched ER after Loving the Pit.
Rachel Casey (00:11:08):
And I see one of the characters after five years relapses and she has these chronic
Rachel Casey (00:11:14):
relapses,
Rachel Casey (00:11:15):
some worse than others.
Rachel Casey (00:11:17):
And I thought to myself,
Rachel Casey (00:11:19):
how as a counselor would I be able to,
Rachel Casey (00:11:22):
you know,
Rachel Casey (00:11:22):
watch someone relapse and try and convince me that,
Rachel Casey (00:11:25):
you know,
Rachel Casey (00:11:25):
oh,
Rachel Casey (00:11:25):
they're not alcoholic anymore.
Rachel Casey (00:11:27):
And this is only through a TV show.
Rachel Casey (00:11:28):
So I was wondering how that works when you're working with someone who's like in front of you.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:33):
Well, it certainly can be painful.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:35):
And I've seen people relapse who've had many years of sobriety,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:41):
and sometimes it's difficult for them to get back for whatever reason.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:45):
I certainly would tell you that it can be really painful for me to see that,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:50):
experience it,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:51):
because usually by the time something like that happens,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:56):
I've been with somebody for a while.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:11:58):
And so it's
Rachel Casey (00:11:59):
And it's not immediate that it falls apart.
Rachel Casey (00:12:02):
So maybe you can even speak to that because I think people don't hear that enough
Rachel Casey (00:12:06):
that you think,
Rachel Casey (00:12:07):
oh,
Rachel Casey (00:12:08):
I could go back and you try,
Rachel Casey (00:12:10):
but it's not like your life will instantly fall apart.
Rachel Casey (00:12:13):
But typically,
Rachel Casey (00:12:15):
if you're alcoholic,
Rachel Casey (00:12:15):
at least like me,
Rachel Casey (00:12:16):
I know I'll end up back right where I started,
Rachel Casey (00:12:19):
if not worse.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:20):
The first step talks about powerlessness over your substance.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:24):
And for me, I take that step every day.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:28):
I think about it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:29):
I wake up into my day and I just do a quick kind of ask of myself, am I still powerless today?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:35):
Yeah.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:36):
Yep.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:36):
And the idea behind that for me is just that if I am powerless,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:40):
it means that whatever the problems were what I was using before,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:45):
if you want to roll the dice again,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:48):
bad things are going to happen.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:49):
And not only that, I ask myself, are you happy with your life today?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:53):
And the answer to that would be yes.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:54):
I feel blessed and grateful and grateful.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:12:58):
I also try to encourage people to kind of think along the same lines.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:03):
If you don't like the word powerless, that's okay.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:05):
Think of something else.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:06):
I have problems when I drink or use.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:10):
It doesn't have to be, you're an addict, you're an alcoholic, you're powerless.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:14):
If you want to use those terms, that's fine.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:17):
I was sort of raised up in AA where those terms were strictly used and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:23):
So I use them.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:24):
But it's important,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:26):
I think,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:26):
to just remember feeling when I had gone to my daughter's christening back in 1984
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:33):
in August.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:34):
I ended up in a blackout.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:36):
I behaved horribly.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:38):
I can tell you the details if you want them, but just trust me on that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:42):
And I woke up the next day and I felt so deeply in despair and lost.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:49):
It was kind of my come to Jesus moment with myself.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:52):
I was like, Tim, you don't have an idea of how to live a decent life.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:13:57):
You need help and you probably need more help than you've been giving yourself.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:01):
So I picked up the phone and I called my therapist and I said, I need help.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:06):
I need to go to treatment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:07):
And she was like, oh, I'm so glad.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:10):
And she said, don't go anywhere.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:12):
I'm going to call you back.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:13):
And she called me back and said,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:15):
found you a bed in treatment in a good place,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:18):
but you have to wait till Thursday.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:20):
It was like Sunday morning.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:21):
A few days later, I packed up my gear and off I went.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:25):
I feel like that treatment still pays dividends to this day.
Rachel Casey (00:14:29):
That's a great way to look at it.
Rachel Casey (00:14:30):
I love that.
Rachel Casey (00:14:31):
For your work-wise,
Rachel Casey (00:14:32):
do you kind of say like you focus in trauma addiction and do you see that those two
Rachel Casey (00:14:39):
almost always intertwine or?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:40):
A high percentage of the time.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:43):
And you can,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:43):
if you look at statistics,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:45):
you see different stuff,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:46):
but all of it is mostly above 50%,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:49):
70%.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:52):
And the other thing about that is that those statistics may not be as high as they
Tim Lineaweaver (00:14:58):
might be because some people just don't even want to talk about Trump.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:01):
And I was like that in the beginning, like, I'm not talking about that stuff.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:05):
I'm not telling anybody.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:07):
I'm actually writing a book now,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:08):
and I've been working on a chapter that was sort of pivotal in my life,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:13):
and it details an incident of sexual abuse that I suffered.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:19):
When that happened, I said to myself, I am never telling anybody about this ever again.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:26):
I'm putting it in a box and I'm taking that box and putting it in another box and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:31):
I'm going to chain it up and I'm going to throw it away.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:34):
And I did.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:35):
until I was probably about 29 or 30.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:39):
And then I was sitting in group therapy and the topic became about sexual abuse.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:46):
And I just sort of blurted out that it happened to me as well.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:49):
That was so finally,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:52):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:52):
it happened when I was pretty young and it took,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:56):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:15:56):
two decades or more for me to be able to talk about it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:00):
I think that therapeutically,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:02):
you have to be cautious about working with people on their trauma.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:05):
It's sort of like what you were saying, like sometimes it's a little early.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:08):
You know, what's the main thing right now?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:10):
Well, the main thing is that we keep sober, stabilize your life.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:15):
And when we're ready, you know, there's no rush on that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:18):
Then we can start to deal with that as well.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:16:20):
And so for me, kind of my traumatic experience trickles out over time.
Rachel Casey (00:16:27):
As I sponsored, I've been sponsored.
Rachel Casey (00:16:30):
I went through the steps.
Rachel Casey (00:16:32):
Yep.
Rachel Casey (00:16:32):
At least in the beginning for me,
Rachel Casey (00:16:34):
I thought I'm not going to need a therapist after because it was so encouraging
Rachel Casey (00:16:38):
that the steps will fix your life.
Rachel Casey (00:16:39):
Everything's fixable as long as you work the steps and you stay dedicated.
Rachel Casey (00:16:42):
And I was that way.
Rachel Casey (00:16:44):
I don't know if you worked as a sponsor or sponsee,
Rachel Casey (00:16:47):
but I've seen sponsors try and take on things that really should be left to a
Rachel Casey (00:16:51):
therapist.
Rachel Casey (00:16:52):
But you can't tell anyone anything.
Rachel Casey (00:16:54):
You can't, there's no rules.
Rachel Casey (00:16:55):
There's no,
Rachel Casey (00:16:55):
and you just see it and you're like,
Rachel Casey (00:16:57):
man,
Rachel Casey (00:16:57):
that guy does not seem like he's qualified to give that kind of advice,
Rachel Casey (00:17:02):
you know?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:03):
I was lucky my sponsor kind of drew a line between demarcation of what he felt
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:11):
helped me with and the other stuff.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:13):
You know, I never felt like my therapist and my sponsor had crossed purposes and I'm confused.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:19):
It was always pretty clear cut.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:20):
And I think you're right.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:21):
I think,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:23):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:24):
AA,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:25):
NA,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:25):
Refuge Recovery,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:26):
there's so many great self-help,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:28):
smart recovery programs.
Rachel Casey (00:17:29):
And they're amazing.
Rachel Casey (00:17:30):
I'm not trying to knock that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:32):
Absolutely.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:33):
I owe a huge debt to AA and NA.
Rachel Casey (00:17:35):
But I also owe a huge debt to my therapist who's now doing the deeper trauma work.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:42):
You know, you don't want somebody trying to deal with trauma that isn't highly trained.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:47):
You should be trained before you're dealing with that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:51):
And the other thing is, you know, it's sort of like...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:53):
If you rip off the Band-Aid, you never know what could happen.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:17:57):
And I've seen some people just get overwhelmed and they go back out and start drinking.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:02):
So you don't want that to happen.
Rachel Casey (00:18:04):
What would you recommend to someone if they were working with a sponsor,
Rachel Casey (00:18:09):
an AA,
Rachel Casey (00:18:10):
and the Band-Aid gets ripped off and now they're like,
Rachel Casey (00:18:12):
yeah,
Rachel Casey (00:18:12):
I want to go drink.
Rachel Casey (00:18:13):
What would you recommend the steps that they do instead of going to drink?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:18):
Finally.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:18):
therapist yes find a trauma you know sometimes like my my therapist wasn't you know
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:24):
formally trauma informed i mean but that's one type of person you could look for it
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:29):
really has the experience but she was really gifted and empathetic and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:34):
non-judgmental and she knew she had this knack for when to push and when to sort of
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:40):
you know comfort and but i think you know if if
Tim Lineaweaver (00:18:44):
Be careful with a sponsor that's really trying to push too hard on the trauma.
Rachel Casey (00:18:50):
Well,
Rachel Casey (00:18:50):
you can just feel very vulnerable,
Rachel Casey (00:18:51):
you know,
Rachel Casey (00:18:52):
because you're newly sober and now you're trying to get what this person has.
Rachel Casey (00:18:57):
And there is a huge vulnerability that.
Rachel Casey (00:19:01):
Absolutely.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:02):
Absolutely.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:03):
You're vulnerable and your primary coping strategy, which is substance, has been removed.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:11):
You don't yet have maybe the coping skills that you'll get over time to deal with
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:17):
the intensity of your feeling.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:18):
My first year of recovery was really emotional.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:22):
I had a lot of anger.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:23):
I had a lot of sadness and depression and a lot of guilt and shame and remorse,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:29):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:30):
all that stuff.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:31):
And that's why I needed to support myself as heavily as I did.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:35):
And again, you know, my therapist was a very big piece of it.
Rachel Casey (00:19:38):
So how did you decide that you wanted to go into trauma and how long did it take
Rachel Casey (00:19:44):
you to get your degree?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:45):
What I did was I gave myself two years and I got sober and sort of got stable.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:50):
I'm like, okay, I'm going back to school.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:52):
Now, when I was a kid, I was a terrible student.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:55):
School made me feel like anxious.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:57):
It was a place where there were too many people,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:19:59):
too many rules,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:00):
too many opportunities to mess up and not do well.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:04):
I had tried college two times before and just dropped out.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:08):
And I said to myself, I'm going to get my bachelor's degree or I'm going to die trying.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:14):
So I went back to a small community college when I was 30.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:19):
So I was two years sober.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:22):
I took just like one course.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:25):
And then the next semester I took two and then I got up to four.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:29):
But the challenge was I was still working.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:33):
Full time.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:33):
I had my daughter on weekends.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:35):
I had sort of reestablished that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:38):
And I was going to school pretty much full time.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:40):
It took me like four and a half years to get through undergrad.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:44):
I was working at a restaurant in Boston, going to UMass Boston.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:47):
And I would, on Sunday, I would work a double shift.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:51):
So I'd be working at the restaurant from 9 a.m.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:55):
until 2 in the morning.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:20:57):
I would go home, get home around three, fall asleep, get up at nine, go to my classes.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:04):
And then that night, that following night, I would work again.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:07):
So it was just a really crazy, challenging thing, but best experience.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:14):
It was amazing.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:15):
I was doing it for me.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:16):
I wasn't doing it because everybody else thought I should go to college.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:20):
I was doing it for me.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:21):
I was an English major with a psychology minor, and I took a creative writing certificate.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:30):
And so it took me about four and a half years.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:34):
Then I took a year off and slept.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:37):
And then I went to graduate school after that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:40):
That was another three years.
Rachel Casey (00:21:42):
I think I'm about on that pace right now is that,
Rachel Casey (00:21:45):
and now I'm in year two and I'm halfway through by trying to get my undergrad.
Rachel Casey (00:21:50):
And it's just, I try to give myself grace though.
Rachel Casey (00:21:53):
I'm like, it's hard.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:55):
Give yourself grace because you know, it's, it's hard.
Rachel Casey (00:21:58):
And recovery.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:59):
It is.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:21:59):
And, and be in recovery.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:01):
Exactly.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:01):
Exactly.
Rachel Casey (00:22:02):
That can sometimes be its own job.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:04):
Yeah, totally.
Rachel Casey (00:22:06):
So you were sober bartending.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:09):
I was.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:09):
I had child support and I was broke and I had a lot of debt.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:13):
And it's the only skill that I knew that I had where I could earn the kind of money
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:19):
to kind of keep everything afloat,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:21):
just barely.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:22):
I had no health insurance.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:24):
I was just like, I was struggling.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:26):
And I wouldn't make that suggestion to anybody else.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:29):
I was trying to be sober bartending.
Rachel Casey (00:22:31):
I know a lot of people now, though, like it is very common.
Rachel Casey (00:22:34):
I think employers like hiring sober bartenders because they know they won't steal the liquor.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:22:39):
Exactly.
Rachel Casey (00:22:40):
When I left serving,
Rachel Casey (00:22:41):
I couldn't stop shaking and I couldn't carry a glass of alcohol without just
Rachel Casey (00:22:47):
trembling.
Rachel Casey (00:22:48):
That was the problem at the time.
Rachel Casey (00:22:49):
It's not my drinking.
Rachel Casey (00:22:50):
It's that I would have to take like two or three shots to get the shakes to go away.
Rachel Casey (00:22:56):
After I had my son, like it was so bad.
Rachel Casey (00:22:59):
And so it's really impressive that you made it through.
Rachel Casey (00:23:01):
I don't know how,
Rachel Casey (00:23:03):
if other people struggle with it,
Rachel Casey (00:23:04):
but I do know there are a ton of sober bartenders.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:07):
There are one thing about it is I would, I would see something happening.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:11):
I'd be like,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:12):
Yep, that's me.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:13):
If I was drinking, you know, that kind of thing, like, oh, my God.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:17):
So it was sort of a cautionary tale.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:19):
And I was really excited when I left it,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:22):
though,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:22):
because I had,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:23):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:23):
when I was young and drinking and really exciting and fun,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:28):
like that's where the party was.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:30):
But then it got really old for me.
Rachel Casey (00:23:32):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:23:32):
For anyone listening, what do people most often misunderstand about trauma and recovery?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:39):
Well,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:39):
I think people that don't have trauma and recovery don't understand that trauma
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:43):
often drives recovery.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:45):
Like, and we were talking about earlier, you know, high percentage of the time.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:49):
And there's a lot of judgment around that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:51):
Like, you know, oh, look at that drunk or look at that junkie.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:55):
I think that that type of,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:23:57):
those types of thoughts and kind of ways of labeling people ignore the fact that
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:04):
practically every addict or alcoholic
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:08):
Or a person with substance use disorders is that's being driven by trauma that is
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:16):
painful and difficult.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:18):
And those people deserve our respect.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:22):
When somebody gets clean and sober,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:25):
we're really restoring them to the person that they were meant to be and the person
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:30):
that they could be.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:31):
And as you've touched on earlier, those people make the best employees.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:37):
They show up on time.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:39):
They kill it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:41):
They're smart.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:41):
They are empathetic.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:44):
We need to really work with people and help them forward in the same way that I was helped.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:24:49):
And I assume in the same way that you've been helped as well.
Rachel Casey (00:24:52):
Absolutely.
Rachel Casey (00:24:53):
I think that was one thing I really related heavily to Bill W,
Rachel Casey (00:24:57):
that near the end,
Rachel Casey (00:24:58):
he was trying to find a way to help those people with so much trauma that they
Rachel Casey (00:25:04):
can't get out,
Rachel Casey (00:25:05):
just didn't have that moment of that look in the mirror,
Rachel Casey (00:25:10):
the...
Rachel Casey (00:25:11):
Who am I?
Rachel Casey (00:25:11):
Because the trauma is so heavy.
Rachel Casey (00:25:13):
It's like, how can we get people to a point to where we can get them to see the disease talking?
Rachel Casey (00:25:22):
And it's so hard that you can't force it on anyone.
Rachel Casey (00:25:26):
Because if you could, I'm sure there's lots of people that would.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:30):
Yes.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:30):
Well,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:31):
I think one thing that I try to do,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:34):
send a message to clients and other people that are trying to be in recovery and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:39):
dealing with trauma that you can deal with it with both the trauma and the
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:44):
addictions.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:45):
A lot of times, sometimes as therapists, we kind of use the scare stuff too much.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:50):
Like, oh my God, if you relapse, you're going to...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:53):
These terrible things are going to happen.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:55):
And, you know, there's truth in that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:25:58):
But the other thing that we need to send a message is if you deal with your
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:02):
addictions and then you deal with your trauma,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:06):
your life is going to get so much better.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:08):
I tell people I've never had anybody who's gotten into recovery and stayed there
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:15):
and sort of dealt with all their stuff come back to me and say,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:19):
you lied.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:20):
Yeah, no one.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:22):
This is awful.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:23):
It's like no good.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:24):
I'm going back out there and I'm drinking because you just don't hear that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:28):
You hear people are grateful that they're
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:31):
able to reach their potential where before they they were stuck and and struggling
Tim Lineaweaver (00:26:36):
and they they achieve independence and happiness and good relations there's just so
Rachel Casey (00:26:41):
much good stuff there so i think i heard someone say they were like the liquor
Rachel Casey (00:26:46):
store will always be open tomorrow if i'm so wrong right i've never met one person
Rachel Casey (00:26:51):
in recovery that was like being sober was the worst it's always like i'm so
Rachel Casey (00:26:57):
grateful i didn't
Rachel Casey (00:26:59):
go drink alcoholically.
Rachel Casey (00:27:00):
It's a very,
Rachel Casey (00:27:02):
that was one thing that is also convincing that I wanted to go work in the recovery
Rachel Casey (00:27:08):
addiction world is it is a very rewarding field that you're like,
Rachel Casey (00:27:12):
once you see someone that you were able to help pull out just like you,
Rachel Casey (00:27:16):
cause I know it's like being in it.
Rachel Casey (00:27:18):
So I know the misery and it's like helping others come out of that.
Rachel Casey (00:27:23):
But like my, my dad was,
Rachel Casey (00:27:26):
does not want help.
Rachel Casey (00:27:27):
He, I mean, he's miserable, but he will also claim he doesn't want to change it.
Rachel Casey (00:27:34):
He wants to stay.
Rachel Casey (00:27:35):
He has no desire to do anything about it.
Rachel Casey (00:27:38):
So it's like, if you change your mind, I'm here.
Rachel Casey (00:27:42):
But so how have you seen it changed too?
Rachel Casey (00:27:45):
Because for decades, not only are you working in the field, you're in recovery yourself.
Rachel Casey (00:27:50):
What have you seen change the most?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:27:52):
The treatment field, I think treatment is a lot more effective and various.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:27:57):
In other words, there's a lot different kind of modes of treatment that you can access.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:03):
There's, you know, PHP programs, there's IOP programs.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:09):
There are, I think, more therapists with expertise in addictions and trauma.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:14):
There's EMDR, there's, you know, tapping.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:17):
There's all kinds of different ways of dealing with stuff.
Rachel Casey (00:28:21):
What did you start out with?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:22):
Like talk therapy or... Yeah, I was just talk therapy with my therapist.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:27):
She was amazing though.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:29):
Like...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:31):
I remember my first day, I just walked in there and I was like, I can't believe I'm doing this.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:40):
What is this?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:41):
It was just so contrary to my life to actually go talk to a person about my problems.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:47):
You don't do that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:48):
You just drink and just get hammered and that's how you cope.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:28:55):
She was just this very confident, self-possessed
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:00):
woman but but in a way that wasn't like i can't talk to her you know it was like
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:06):
and she was so um gifted and in terms of her empathy and i think if i had felt any
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:13):
vibe of judgment or something like that i would have just left i'm not doing this
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:20):
and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:20):
Something about her that just,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:22):
even though,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:24):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:24):
I was kind of fighting her on stuff,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:26):
I did keep going back and I was,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:28):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:29):
roughly honest.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:31):
And so it worked.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:32):
And, you know, nowadays I think there's a lot more available out there.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:36):
That's a good thing.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:37):
The bad thing, the other side of that, and I don't know how much you've talked about.
Rachel Casey (00:29:41):
What's the bad side?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:43):
There's a lot more money in treatment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:45):
So there's more corruption.
Rachel Casey (00:29:47):
That's a, that's a good point.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:49):
You know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:49):
this sort of we need heads in beds kind of mentality of just loading people into
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:55):
treatment and then doing everything you can to hold them there,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:29:59):
to my mind,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:30:00):
is problematic and not good.
Rachel Casey (00:30:03):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:30:04):
And I got to interview a therapist and the ethical challenge was with insurance,
Rachel Casey (00:30:10):
having someone who wants help,
Rachel Casey (00:30:13):
but they're like one day sober.
Rachel Casey (00:30:15):
So technically they won't qualify to get into treatment.
Rachel Casey (00:30:18):
And she said, it's really hard to be like...
Rachel Casey (00:30:21):
If you just like went and took a sip and came right back,
Rachel Casey (00:30:23):
we can get you in and be fully covered.
Rachel Casey (00:30:25):
But you don't you can't say that to an addict.
Rachel Casey (00:30:27):
You can't tell an addict, hey, just go relapse really quickly.
Rachel Casey (00:30:32):
You don't know that they'll come back.
Rachel Casey (00:30:33):
They might not have that same the way that things have to be worded or how things
Rachel Casey (00:30:39):
are timed or how you answer a question.
Rachel Casey (00:30:41):
Even if it's not honest and the counselor knows it's not honest, that can shut down.
Rachel Casey (00:30:47):
a claim being covered or not covered.
Rachel Casey (00:30:50):
And she said it is a real ethical pull when you're sitting across from someone that
Rachel Casey (00:30:53):
you know needs help.
Rachel Casey (00:30:55):
And you're like, do I forge the document?
Rachel Casey (00:30:59):
Do I, you know, just do I tell them in that was the ethical battle she talked about.
Rachel Casey (00:31:05):
And that opened my eyes like, wow.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:08):
Yeah, I've worked on inpatient programs probably for about a third of my career.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:13):
It's really tough work,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:15):
really tough in a lot of different ways and for a lot of different reasons.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:19):
But I was working with a young person who had been in Florida recently.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:25):
And he told me that what he was doing was he was cycling in and out of treatment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:33):
The treatment program would give him $1,000 if he would go to detox and stay for
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:41):
whatever his insurance would cover.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:44):
And he had medical necessity, so he fit the criteria.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:48):
So he would go in.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:50):
come out, they'd give him a thousand dollars.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:52):
He would go on a run for like a week and then come back in,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:31:56):
get another thousand dollars and so on and so forth.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:32:00):
And I was just blown away by that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:32:03):
Like, oh, my God.
Rachel Casey (00:32:04):
I mean, addicts are brilliant.
Rachel Casey (00:32:06):
I'm telling you, like, and I find a way, don't we?
Rachel Casey (00:32:09):
But the good news is,
Rachel Casey (00:32:10):
is if you're listening and you're not sober,
Rachel Casey (00:32:12):
like it is even more powerful in sobriety.
Rachel Casey (00:32:16):
And I think it's the magic that you see.
Rachel Casey (00:32:19):
If someone hears a recovered addict is here, someone needs help.
Rachel Casey (00:32:23):
It's the quickest phone call you'll ever get.
Rachel Casey (00:32:25):
We will stop everything down and be like, how can we help?
Rachel Casey (00:32:29):
Where are
Rachel Casey (00:32:30):
here's where we can tell you and if we're not available we immediately know 10
Rachel Casey (00:32:35):
other people that are and again if if this didn't work and being sober was really
Rachel Casey (00:32:41):
miserable that's not how it would go it would be hard to but everyone who has been
Rachel Casey (00:32:47):
in an addiction and then is able to get to the other side is it's just not you
Rachel Casey (00:32:53):
can't see it until you're there
Tim Lineaweaver (00:32:55):
Yeah, you can't.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:32:56):
I was convinced that it was going to be a joyless black and white.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:01):
It's going to be miserable the rest of my life.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:04):
I have found that that is just so not true.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:07):
Life is full of joy.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:11):
I love to have the full kind of scope of my emotions.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:17):
Everything that recovery has given me, I'm so grateful for it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:22):
And I think that's the core message for people.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:26):
You can do it if you really work at it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:31):
And if you do it, you will be very happy and fulfilled.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:33:36):
And, you know, we just have to keep sending that message out there.
Rachel Casey (00:33:40):
Absolutely.
Rachel Casey (00:33:41):
And I think growing up in an alcoholic home because alcohol was very normal when I
Rachel Casey (00:33:47):
got sober,
Rachel Casey (00:33:48):
like it was so much around that I didn't think there was anywhere you couldn't have
Rachel Casey (00:33:53):
it,
Rachel Casey (00:33:54):
you know?
Rachel Casey (00:33:54):
So I was like, where am I going to go?
Rachel Casey (00:33:56):
What am I going to do?
Rachel Casey (00:33:57):
Like my entire life, there's always a drink around.
Rachel Casey (00:34:01):
And I've found in sobriety, number one, alcohol is not everywhere and it's not in my home.
Rachel Casey (00:34:07):
And
Rachel Casey (00:34:08):
While there might be a hard moment because I'm now changing my norm.
Rachel Casey (00:34:12):
I'm going from alcohol is my solution for pretty much everything to sobriety.
Rachel Casey (00:34:19):
And I had to find like meditation, be able to sit with it.
Rachel Casey (00:34:23):
And the feeling was very uncomfortable.
Rachel Casey (00:34:25):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:34:26):
A lot of times, but there was never a time where, like you'd said, or wake up that day and
Rachel Casey (00:34:32):
I can do it for 24 hours.
Rachel Casey (00:34:34):
I've committed today that no matter what,
Rachel Casey (00:34:36):
no matter what happens,
Rachel Casey (00:34:38):
even if my worst case scenario happened,
Rachel Casey (00:34:40):
I will not drink today.
Rachel Casey (00:34:42):
As someone who's,
Rachel Casey (00:34:43):
again,
Rachel Casey (00:34:44):
just alcohol everywhere all the time,
Rachel Casey (00:34:47):
I kind of thought I was like breaking society,
Rachel Casey (00:34:51):
societal norms.
Rachel Casey (00:34:53):
I do still remember just from growing up in an alcoholic home,
Rachel Casey (00:34:57):
how normal it felt for 27 years of my life.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:01):
Yeah, I can relate to that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:03):
I mean, alcohol in the house, alcohol was everywhere.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:06):
Everyone was drinking.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:07):
Yeah, it was our tea.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:09):
And it did seem like alcohol was everywhere.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:11):
And I also remember you touched on this when you were just talking about it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:15):
But for me, like I would in those days, all my friends were alcoholics and drug addicts.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:22):
And I was very, you know, that was a very centered part of my life.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:28):
So I didn't I would go to a meeting and I'd be like.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:33):
This was like an oasis of these people understand me.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:38):
They understand what I need and I can get it here.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:43):
And so if I am craving or if I'm disturbed by something,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:47):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:49):
AANA,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:50):
and now there's a lot of other programs that work as well.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:53):
Any group of people.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:54):
Yes.
Rachel Casey (00:35:54):
That's like mine.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:55):
Fellowship, right?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:35:57):
Like this is, you know, sort of one of the antidotes to addictions.
Rachel Casey (00:36:02):
with the resources today which back when you got sober probably were not as
Rachel Casey (00:36:06):
available like the sources were pretty much a na or therapy or like treatment
Rachel Casey (00:36:14):
center but today like you can find a group
Rachel Casey (00:36:18):
pretty much anywhere online.
Rachel Casey (00:36:19):
You don't even have to go in person,
Rachel Casey (00:36:20):
but even in person,
Rachel Casey (00:36:21):
I mean,
Rachel Casey (00:36:22):
there's,
Rachel Casey (00:36:23):
there's so many just within my little circle.
Rachel Casey (00:36:26):
Um, and that's, that did really help me in the, the early days.
Rachel Casey (00:36:31):
Cause you start to, I start to forget anyway.
Rachel Casey (00:36:33):
So I can imagine after 40 years,
Rachel Casey (00:36:35):
you know,
Rachel Casey (00:36:35):
there's like,
Rachel Casey (00:36:36):
oh yeah,
Rachel Casey (00:36:36):
something I do remember being like
Rachel Casey (00:36:39):
triggered and having to go run to a meeting, which sounds crazy today.
Rachel Casey (00:36:42):
I am curious as we can kind of wrap up,
Rachel Casey (00:36:44):
but your kids,
Rachel Casey (00:36:45):
how does that work since some of them haven't seen you drink?
Rachel Casey (00:36:49):
What do you do?
Rachel Casey (00:36:49):
How do you talk to your kids about it?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:36:51):
Well, I wanted to talk to my kids about it because they have a genetic predisposition.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:36:59):
Alcoholism is very strong on my paternal side.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:02):
So my
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:03):
grandfather, my father, my brother and I all have addictive issues.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:09):
And so it doesn't guarantee that they will develop addictions, but there is that predisposition.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:20):
And so I talked to them starting pretty young.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:24):
I tried not to be too heavy handed with it because if you just constantly...
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:30):
push on kids, then they're more apt to go out and do the thing that you don't want them to do.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:36):
But I just said,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:37):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:37):
like as they got into their teen years,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:40):
you're going to start running into opportunities to drink or,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:45):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:46):
somebody might offer you a pill or a substance or powder.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:49):
And you need to be prepared for that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:53):
And we need to talk about it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:54):
You know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:37:54):
I talked a lot about the difference between kind of responsible drinking versus,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:00):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:01):
going out to get kind of shattered and how that kind of abuse can lead to
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:08):
dependence.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:09):
And so, so far, knock on wood, none of them have developed addictions.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:15):
The other difference for them was that,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:18):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:18):
they weren't traumatized in the same way that I was and that you were,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:22):
right?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:23):
So they don't have that driver.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:26):
And another thing I told them,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:28):
which I think was important,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:30):
was there are certain substances that you should never experiment.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:35):
Heroin and cocaine.
Rachel Casey (00:38:38):
say cocaine is so bad apparently like I didn't I've done it many times and I didn't
Rachel Casey (00:38:43):
know until I went to school how it'll never leave my dopamine in my brain like
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:49):
it'll just that's forever gonna be there well that that was my experience like I
Tim Lineaweaver (00:38:54):
snorted cocaine got addicted that way but then when I smoked it within a year I
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:00):
destroyed my life and so I tell them don't mess with those drugs you know and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:05):
And I also kind of left the door open.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:08):
You know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:08):
if you guys want to talk about something,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:11):
I'm not going to punish you or get mad at you.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:14):
Let's talk and and really, you know, kind of determine what makes sense for you.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:20):
So far, so good.
Rachel Casey (00:39:22):
Genetically, each everyone in our family has addiction, like literally both sides.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:28):
I mean,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:28):
the,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:29):
the,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:29):
the not traumatizing your kids is a really great big first step in making sure that
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:35):
they're parented,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:36):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:37):
better than we were.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:38):
And I, you know, my, I think my father's, I came in really caught parenting.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:43):
He was a lot like your dad just drank himself to death.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:46):
Didn't want help.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:47):
This is,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:48):
it's not happening,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:49):
but a lot of stuff that he did with me,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:52):
I was like,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:53):
okay,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:54):
I'm not doing that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:55):
Cause that didn't help me at all.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:57):
You know?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:39:57):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:39:57):
I have noticed,
Rachel Casey (00:39:58):
and this is where the forgiveness of being an addict and understanding the person
Rachel Casey (00:40:04):
and the disease is that there are some things that I know my dad was doing or my
Rachel Casey (00:40:09):
mom,
Rachel Casey (00:40:10):
because my mom drank my whole life too,
Rachel Casey (00:40:12):
that they were drinking.
Rachel Casey (00:40:13):
And there's no way they would have done those things had they not just been
Rachel Casey (00:40:19):
You know,
Rachel Casey (00:40:19):
had they been present,
Rachel Casey (00:40:21):
obviously I make mistakes as a parent,
Rachel Casey (00:40:22):
but like,
Rachel Casey (00:40:23):
not the kinds of things I grew up with.
Rachel Casey (00:40:25):
But that's only because it was fueled by alcohol.
Rachel Casey (00:40:27):
I think if my parents weren't sick,
Rachel Casey (00:40:30):
I don't think the extent of the things that happened would have happened,
Rachel Casey (00:40:34):
you know.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:40:35):
Yes.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:40:35):
And I think it's probably likely you tell me, but I know that my dad also had trauma.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:40:42):
I don't know the details of it,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:40:45):
but I know that his relationship with his father was really traumatic for him.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:40:50):
So I can think I get kind of bad about things my dad did, but I'm like, OK, he had trauma, too.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:40:57):
So, you know.
Rachel Casey (00:40:58):
And that's where I'm like, I'm not mad at him.
Rachel Casey (00:41:01):
Oh, one thing I've wanted to ask.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:04):
Yes.
Rachel Casey (00:41:05):
Do you still have like drinking dreams or have you had drinking dreams ever?
Rachel Casey (00:41:08):
Or what's that like even 40 years now?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:11):
I don't have them nearly as frequently as I used to, and they're kind of occurring dreams.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:17):
And in the dream,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:18):
I usually have some cocaine on me and some alcohol,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:24):
and I'm dealing with my wife or kids,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:27):
and I'm trying to get away from them so I can coke.
Rachel Casey (00:41:30):
Always trying to escape.
Rachel Casey (00:41:31):
That's always what my therapist is like, yep, trying to escape.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:33):
Trying to escape, trying to move the chess pieces around so I can do what I want to do.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:37):
And I'm thinking like, I haven't really been sober.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:41):
I've been lying all the time.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:43):
So there's this kind of guilt and remorse going along with it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:47):
And I don't care because I just want to get high.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:50):
And then I wake up and I'm like,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:53):
Oh, wait.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:53):
Oh, my God, I'm sober.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:55):
Thank God.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:56):
So it's,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:57):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:41:58):
as unnerving as those dreams can be,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:02):
they kind of serve a purpose for me,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:03):
which is,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:05):
do you really want to go back to that kind of stuff?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:07):
No, I don't.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:08):
It's a tough dream to have, but, you know, maybe there's a silver lining there.
Rachel Casey (00:42:11):
yeah it's your repurpose of I'm not gonna take a drink today because that dream was
Rachel Casey (00:42:16):
not fun no it wasn't yeah my husband has drinking dreams I'm sober in all my dreams
Rachel Casey (00:42:21):
and I usually show my tattoo and I have the little AA symbol but I had them in
Rachel Casey (00:42:26):
early sobriety but I do have ones about being trapped I will tell you that is my
Rachel Casey (00:42:30):
theme I cannot escape and I'm scared and I'm trying to people please and I can't
Rachel Casey (00:42:35):
figure but it's usually I find my husband drinking and I don't do the whole dream
Rachel Casey (00:42:39):
theory but
Rachel Casey (00:42:40):
We got sober on the same day.
Rachel Casey (00:42:41):
So, I mean, we were both.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:42):
That's so cool.
Rachel Casey (00:42:44):
Who's going to cave first?
Rachel Casey (00:42:45):
Like he told me his whole goal in the beginning was he was going to outlast me
Rachel Casey (00:42:48):
because I'm the true alcoholic.
Rachel Casey (00:42:50):
And eventually Rachel's going to be like, let's go get Jameson.
Rachel Casey (00:42:53):
We both outlasted each other.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:55):
And you have the same sobriety day.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:57):
We do.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:58):
We do.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:42:59):
You do like a huge.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:01):
How do you celebrate?
Rachel Casey (00:43:02):
First year we went to a nice dinner.
Rachel Casey (00:43:04):
The second it's now we're coming.
Rachel Casey (00:43:05):
We've done three.
Rachel Casey (00:43:06):
We're coming up on four different each time.
Rachel Casey (00:43:08):
It's I mean, it's busy with Evan.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:10):
Yeah.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:11):
Cool.
Rachel Casey (00:43:11):
And it's Christmas.
Rachel Casey (00:43:12):
So we got sober the week of Thanksgiving, November 22nd of 21.
Rachel Casey (00:43:16):
Now, technically, my last drink was the 21st.
Rachel Casey (00:43:19):
His was the 22nd.
Rachel Casey (00:43:20):
But we say our sobriety dates the 22nd because we took our desire chips at that
Rachel Casey (00:43:26):
meeting at that 6 p.m.
Rachel Casey (00:43:27):
meeting.
Rachel Casey (00:43:28):
And so my sobriety dates, like when I took my desire chip, same for him.
Rachel Casey (00:43:31):
Um, but he did drink at his, on his lunch break that day.
Rachel Casey (00:43:36):
I stayed sober with the baby,
Rachel Casey (00:43:37):
um,
Rachel Casey (00:43:38):
promising my mom,
Rachel Casey (00:43:39):
I'd go this meeting and I'm like,
Rachel Casey (00:43:40):
it's not going to work.
Rachel Casey (00:43:41):
This is stupid.
Rachel Casey (00:43:42):
It's not my problem.
Rachel Casey (00:43:43):
I'm depressed.
Rachel Casey (00:43:45):
Uh,
Rachel Casey (00:43:45):
I don't drinking,
Rachel Casey (00:43:46):
you know,
Rachel Casey (00:43:46):
and I heard what I needed to hear in that meeting and haven't had a drink since.
Rachel Casey (00:43:50):
Thank God.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:51):
Um, right.
Rachel Casey (00:43:52):
So you're working on writing a book, a memoir.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:55):
Yep.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:56):
I'm kind of putting the final touches on it.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:43:59):
It's about my life and my family and growing up on Cape Cod back in the 1970s and
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:07):
about my trauma,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:08):
about my recovery.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:10):
And I'm looking for a publisher.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:11):
So if there's anybody out there that wants a good book on addictions,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:15):
call me up,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:16):
email me,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:16):
something.
Rachel Casey (00:44:17):
Yeah, there's quite a few authors I've had.
Rachel Casey (00:44:19):
So that would be very likely that if any one of even people,
Rachel Casey (00:44:23):
guests,
Rachel Casey (00:44:23):
previous guests,
Rachel Casey (00:44:25):
since all of the people I've talked to are addiction memoirs,
Rachel Casey (00:44:29):
please.
Rachel Casey (00:44:29):
So Tim,
Rachel Casey (00:44:30):
and the great way to get ahold of you through Substack,
Rachel Casey (00:44:33):
that's where you're doing your current writing.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:35):
Yep.
Rachel Casey (00:44:36):
Any other ways?
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:36):
Email me at tnt410 at aol.com.
Rachel Casey (00:44:42):
And I'll put it in the show notes as well.
Rachel Casey (00:44:43):
Grateful that you came on here and shared your experience.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:44:46):
I really enjoyed it.
Rachel Casey (00:44:47):
And your strength, your hope.
Rachel Casey (00:44:48):
Absolutely.
Rachel Casey (00:44:49):
And again,
Rachel Casey (00:44:50):
so knowing that you're looking for a publisher and working on the memoir and those
Rachel Casey (00:44:55):
memoirs really help people.
Rachel Casey (00:44:56):
And I know that and talking to different authors,
Rachel Casey (00:44:59):
it's really cool to see a review of someone they do not know.
Rachel Casey (00:45:02):
And they're like, wow, this book just really spoke to me and spoke to especially with trauma.
Rachel Casey (00:45:06):
That's such a big one and one that people don't like to talk about.
Rachel Casey (00:45:09):
So reading it
Rachel Casey (00:45:11):
can be a really great, great intro.
Rachel Casey (00:45:13):
Yeah.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:13):
And I know that when I was getting sober,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:16):
it really helped me to,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:17):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:17):
that somebody was being upfront about their addiction and how they got sober would,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:21):
you know,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:21):
like,
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:21):
I love to read about that.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:23):
Even you still do now.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:24):
Yeah.
Rachel Casey (00:45:25):
Yeah, me too.
Rachel Casey (00:45:25):
I was going to say, it hasn't gone away from me yet.
Rachel Casey (00:45:28):
I'm still very like connect with someone and you're like, that's my story.
Rachel Casey (00:45:32):
And it's, it's, it feels very like you're not alone and you are anyone listening.
Rachel Casey (00:45:38):
You're not alone.
Rachel Casey (00:45:39):
I know that for a fact.
Rachel Casey (00:45:40):
Thank you for listening.
Rachel Casey (00:45:41):
And I will put everything else in the show notes and hope you have a good rest of your day.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:45):
And you too.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:46):
And thank you so much for having me.
Tim Lineaweaver (00:45:48):
I really appreciate it.