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Paddles Ready is your go-to podcast for everything happening in the world of paddle racing.
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in my opinion, is the most fun.
So Tommy, where's, uh, dragon boating in the States sitting right now?
We had 30 clubs, uh, represented, which was the most, uh, in the world. We just formed a new official youth committee.
Competitive.
What advice does Tommy give that paddler before they hop in the boat?
It's you and the sharks.
Be patient
and
have fun. Like how many world titles do we have to have in dragon boating really? Good question.
So, so why do you think the USA is improving so rapidly, Tommy, at the moment?
I think what's happened is that we've-
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This is Paddles Ready, the global voice of paddle sports. Live commentary, race coverage, athlete stories, and expert analysis from across the world of paddling. From dragon boat racing to ocean ski, this is where the competition, the culture, and the stories come together. Let's get into it
How are you, mate? Good to have you back.
Oh, good to be back. It's, it's, uh, early in the morning here because we've got someone all the way over in the US of A, Dougie.
We have delivered in spades, and on our podcast this morning, our special guest comes all the way from the USA. It's Tommy Leonardi, our US Dragon Boat Federation president.
Tommy, welcome to Paddles Ready.
Thanks for having me. I almost feel like I'm in Australia.
We don't want to... You don't want to be here at the moment. It's, uh, it's pouring rain and it's cold, but, uh, nowhere near the States, I'm guessing, when it comes to cold. We're still in board shorts and T-shirts.
No, we're doing all right here.
It's May, it's, uh, m- mid-spring and starting to get warm again, so I'm happy.
Oh, that, that, that, that's it. So what's the time where you are, Tommy?
It is 6:04 PM.
Good stuff. So before we get started, Nico, um, I thought just for the people out there who aren't too sure, uh, the credentials of Tommy and, um, what he's done for the sport, and he has done a lot for the sport over the last 30 years.
He's done 30 seasons, um, there over in the States. He's competed and coached in over 14 or 14 IDF, uh, IDBF World Champs. Uh, he has currently won 52 World Champion medals, which consisted of gold, silver, and bronze as a paddler and both as a coach. As I said earlier when we started, he's president of the USDBF.
President and assistant coach of the Philadelphia Dragon Boat Association. And what have, what have you got here, Tommy? And Dragon Boat Club in North America, and technical and strategy coach for Philadelphia Flying Phoenix. Mate, that's a big bio. You've got plenty of runs, uh, you've got plenty of runs on the board, let me tell you.
Was that, was that a baseball or, or cricket, uh-
Well, I thought the same- ... reference there ... but, uh, we'll take baseball. Okay. We- we're in the States, we'll take baseball. All
right. Excellent. Yeah. And, and, and, and Tommy, that, that is fantastic, um, see- seeing you and, and obviously Doug and I, we, we, we had the pleasure, um, for everyone tuning in, we had Tommy calling us, uh, in Brandenburg with the races, which was fantastic, right on the foreshore, Tommy.
How did you like that?
Well, I wasn't expecting you to ask me to actually call a race. I thought I was gonna be there with a microphone, you know, filling in between races, maybe giving a little color commentary, and then all of a sudden a race is about to start, and you give me the, the microphone and the sheet, and you're like, "Hey Tommy, why don't you call the next race?"
And, you know, surrounded by two professionals, so I was like, "All right, let's go." You know, a- apparently, you know, people are usually pretty candid in the comments during the live stream, and no one told me to, uh, get the heck off, at, uh, off the stage. So I, I guess I held my own, but nothing compared to you two.
No, but, but it was good. We were just talking about on that comment just then, the interaction when the people were coming in from, from all over the world, they're hearing your voice. They've known your voice for so many years. And actually Dougie, we couldn't get him off. It's like, Tommy's like, "No, no, stay.
Next race. It's all good." "It's all good. Stay the next race." And, and, and- No, it was fun ... and, and are you going to be in, uh, the club crew in Taiwan? Oh,
yeah. Going to
Taiwan. Oh, well we got you on there again then.
Yeah, well you're g- a special guest. I mean, I remember when you were on Tommy, at one stage there I remember, because I was doing all the, um, numbers and the analytics.
I think at one stage there when you were on, I think we had 4,800, 5,000 viewers watching, um, at the time with you commentating, um, along with Mary. So, uh... And then we had Julie as well. Between the three of you, we had, uh, some great special guests.
Good friends of mine. They're excellent.
No, good stuff. So Tommy, where's, uh, dragon boating in the States sitting right now?
Uh, you know, is it, uh, is it motoring along? Is it, uh, things you could do better?
Well, we don't take anything for granted, that's for sure. I never do. I'm always looking to learn. Um, but at the last club cruise in Ravenna, we had 30 clubs, uh, represented, which was the most, uh, in the world. Uh, second was Australia with 24.
Um, so that was amazing. And one of the reasons why we have such a large representation now is because a few years ago we decided to have a true national championship where all of the berths for the, uh, club crews are w- are awarded. So now teams had to train and race against each other in order to qualify to go to the, uh, Club Crew World Championships.
And it's just become just bigger and better, and it's just wonderful to see. And I could just tell a quick story. Uh, uh, what drives me is that every time I'm doing this and thinking about who I'm representing or thinking about where I'm going on a trip, I'm living my childhood dream, okay? When I was a kid, I grew up in Brooklyn, New York.
We're-- We were poor, right? So we were in, you know, you're in New York, it's hustle bustle, but we couldn't afford to travel anywhere. And just my luck, I happened to be in South Brooklyn, which was equidistant between the three largest, three of the largest airports around, right? LaGuardia, Kennedy, and Newark.
And because I was only maybe 5 or 10 miles away from all of them, I would always see planes overhead and always wondering where they were going and always wanted to go where they were going, and it was this giant tease as a kid. So every time I'm on a plane going to a dragon boat event, I always think about how fortunate I am to be doing what I dreamed of as a kid and doing it in a sport that I love.
And one of the reasons why I love supporting this so much is I see so many other paddlers getting these same opportunities. You know, I see... I love talking to rookies who go to their first world championships and ask them how it is, and just the, the look in their eyes, and they just have this glow and this fire and Uh, a-
a- absolutely.
And, and, and I'm glad you touched on that because it's about bringing all the cross-border, cross-continent and which... Oh, look, you have, you have the Olympics, and then you've got national championships and you've got stuff. But as like you said, you've got paddlers, especially the club crew from, from Panama, from, from China, from the Dubai to Australia, and they meet, they talk, they collaborate, a- and they do that.
So, um, I, I'm really glad that you, you, you touched on that and, and you know, Dougie was sort of going on to where is USA dragon boating? Dougie at the last nations, and correct me if I'm wrong, you had like 900 athletes In Brandenburg, was it Dougie?
Wait, 900 total, total? Yeah. Or are you talking about Australia?
No, no, the USA. Didn't you have one of the largest contingents
of
athletes?
Oh, I forgot the number, but it was gigantic. It was
huge. Yes. It was huge.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We, we, we had a lot of people. It's a lot of juggling.
No, exactly.
While the Nations World Championships is obviously the most competitive, because you have your top national teams going against each other, the Club Crew World Championship, in my opinion, is the most fun.
Because you have, like you said, so much more representation, you have more countries, and you have everything from national team level athletes against other clubs who are just so happy to be there and to, to observe and compete and learn. And to me, that's the, the, my favorite by far is the Club Crew World Championships.
Yeah. Well, I know, um, our te- the Aussies, I mean, remember Nick, we had a great youth. Um, the girls were there, the young, the young Aussie team. I mean, these are guys putting their hands in their pocket to travel to the other side of the world. They're, they're barely out of university or still in university.
A couple of them were still doing their, you know, A levels in year 12 or at high school, and here they are, they're mixing it with the best, um, and they're showing how strong the youth is in the sport by getting out there and paddling against the rest of the world. I, I think, uh, our contingent, or well, not contingent, our team, and I say our team because Australia, um, I think to get to the other side of the world shows that the youth of the sport is in good shape coming through.
A- absolutely. Well, the, the American schools, they were, they were, they were pretty dominant over in Germany as well.
Yeah. Uh, we, we won the Youth Cup. Um, you know, and Nathan, uh, Salazar was our, uh, main youth coach, did a amazing job, and, you know, hopefully we'll just keep going that way. In fact, we just formed a new official youth committee at the USDBF level, because at the IDBF level, they're making more of a strong push for a youth commission.
So as a result, all the countries are being asked to have more of a formalized, uh, youth commission or committee themselves, and we definitely followed right into that.
That, that, that's awesome that, one, the IDBF are doing that, and also the, the, the US Dragon Boat Federation. So let's, let's, let's go down that path a little bit, Tommy, and get your expertise and unpick your brain.
The USA is so big. There's so many clubs. Then you get that national team for the youth, the under 24s, all the way up to senior Ds. How do you make the-- And over the years we've seen it, and I've seen it with the USA even touching back when that, that, that world title Nations Cup in Penrith when the USA beat China, time of 1:48 Dougie, I think it was.
Fast forward thir- fast forward 30 years. Sorry, Doug.
Oh, no, 19 years ago it was, 2007.
2007. Yeah. So fast forward, how do you manage, pick, what's the criteria to, to obviously all different clubs have different coaches, different... Do you guys have a guideline and, and love to hear how the USA-- Not, not, not, not that you want to give too many tips away.
We'll talk about technique later, but how do you, how do you, how do you manage that and how did, how is it formed? We'd love to hear that, and I'm pretty sure a lot of people tuning in would love to understand this as well.
So I mean, we don't, we don't dictate anything to clubs, right? Every club has their own way.
But the OC1 outrigger canoe one person time trial, um, has become the main standard, the standard I would say, in the US for choosing, uh, your clubs, your best clubs. Uh, you know, without a doubt, you know, the, the, the three top clubs at last year's nationals I know for absolute fact use time, uh, OC1 time trials as the cr- as the only criteria.
Um, and it works. You know, uh, some people, some people say, you know, "Well, does it really translate?" Yeah, it really translates. Like, you can literally take the data from your time trials and put them in a relatively simple formula and predict to within less than a second what your team is gonna do on the water if, and only if, they execute on race day correctly.
So the power, the h- is already measured. What you do with it on race day is the question. But if you execute correctly, there is no surprises on race day. The, there, there is no s- uh, you know, the, the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. It's power in the boat, and it works as fast as you can make it go.
So yeah, we've definitely discovered that.
That, that's amazing and, and look, we saw it transition Dougie from the New Zealand, um, to the, the, the la- latest Australian Championship. We had the Wairoa 100 waders come over, all outriggers, and Tommy, they absolutely annihilated everything.
They came over pretty much for one race, I reckon.
They came over, they got the job done and went home, and it was unbelievably- Oh,
we, we went head-to-head with them in, in Ravenna. They were, they were right there with everybody. Absolutely.
Yeah, Tommy, w- w- Tommy, Nick and I was having a chat about this just recently And touching on the crossover and, you know, we're seeing a lot of paddlers from different disciplines now coming to dragon boating.
You got your OC1, you got your sprint canoes, you've got stand up, you've got... You know, are you seeing that a lot in the States now, that a lot are coming over, the CrossFit guys, swimmers?
What's interesting is that typically your top paddlers in the US were varsity athletes in college and or high school.
Very athletic people who now find another place. Uh, a lot of, uh, former swimmers for sure, former rowers, but, you know, uh, we had one person in Ravenna who was a national champion, uh, ultimate Frisbee player in college. So, you know, it, it could be any sport and you're a great athlete.
Competitive.
Yeah. And you learn how to do it.
So y- you know, you, you, you find what you have and you teach them how to do it. Now, people who are already paddlers, okay, I love talking to paddlers who only recently got into dragon boating but have been doing, say, outrigger for a long time. And I was a little, I was a little skeptical, you know, are the, are the longtime outrigger paddlers gonna really like dragon boating, are they gonna thumb their nose at it?
They love it. The reason why they love it, they tell me, they go, "It's so awesome having boats so close to you." Because if they're out there in the ocean doing a long race, it's pretty lonely out there, right? There's only a boat ahead. It's you and the sharks. Yeah. It's, it's exactly. So they, they, they really get into it.
It, it's, it's wonderful to see, you know, like the, the Danny Chings of the world, you know, come back year after year to paddle dragon boat with us. You know, one of the best, uh, outrigger paddlers in the world. Is, does Danny- Love being- ... paddle with you
guys?
Yeah. US. Yeah. He lives in California.
Nice.
Oh, good.
Mm-hmm.
And
might have to get M- he, he can be your special guest soon, I, I, I, I think, Tommy.
Oh, yeah. I would definitely, uh, he's, he should be a great interview.
So Tommy, leaning, leaning into that, what you were just saying about the strength of the OC1, stand up, blah, blah, you know, all that. Where's that sit for the United States as far as, uh, does it favor you in the long game, in the distance, or having these guys, or, yeah, or is sprint, is sprint where you wanna be?
No, that, I mean, it's been, it's very clear that the US excels most at the nat- at the world championships in the 1000 and the 2K, right? And then in the 500 it's usually an absolute battle, and then the 200... Now this is interesting. At the national level, you know, the US at the 200, um- is, yeah, usually fighting, you know, behind some of the other countries.
But at the club crew level The US is starting to do much better in the 200. And the reason is, and I'm gonna give a little way, a little secret here, but too many clubs in this world in the short distance try to paddle as if they're a national team. And it's a very different a- animal being on a national team with 20 super elite paddlers who can sustain a super high rate, and then attempting your club of 20 people who, let's face it, you know, if you're a club, a lot of your people on your team are not premier national team athletes.
It's just impossible to have that many people. So we've, you know, worked into that and noticed that there's a, there's a compromise there in terms of what you do with your stroke rate and your strategies. But yes, at the nation's world championship level, you know, y- you watch China, you watch Thailand, especially in the, uh, in the 200s, and, you know, it's, it's crazy.
A- and what I've seen personally, um, throughout at Dougie is the other nations are picking their rating way up because they've got to be. You, you remember the starts, Tommy, 30 years ago it was one, two. Now it's just off the block.
In, in the short distance, yes. Yes. I mean, it was amazing to watch the Chinese premier open team in Germany win the 200 by, I- I don't know if it was open water, but it was almost a boat length, which is absurd.
But then in the longer distances, all of a sudden the gap got tighter and tighter. So, you know, it goes to show you can only do so much.
I think Canada was the first time that China had beaten in a, in a straight race, um, i- in Brandenburg, um, i- in, in that premier. I don't know whether it was the mixed or I don't think it was the open.
I think it was the, the possibly the premier mixed. So-
Yeah, I, I forget exactly which one, but yes, Ca- Canada's really... I mean, look, Canada, US, China, uh, Thailand, when they're at the worlds are usually battling it out, you know, for that Nations Cup.
Well, that was gonna lead into my next question. Globally- Mm
from, from what you're watching and what you're seeing, who are, crews and also countries, who are setting the standard in the sport right now that you're liking?
Well, I mean, like I just mentioned, right? You've got obviously Canada's always super tough. China's always super tough. Um, US, you know, we're battling right there.
And then, you know, Germany stays close. Um, Australia, I've noticed a, a significant improvement Uh, from this cycle to past, something different's going on there. You know, and you can never, y- y- you never take anything for granted. You just don't know who
you got to power. The UAE. The UAE. UAE finally- UAE ... in, uh, in Ran- in Germany.
I think you reached out and said, "Nick, Nick, give me, give me a month with these guys." "These, these guys are athletes."
Yeah. Oh, yeah, I did. We c- yep, yep, we can chat about that later.
Yeah. No, no, no. Hu- hundred p- and, and my favorite, Dougie, um, used to be Miramar, Indonesia. I love Indonesia.
Yes.
You know? I, I, I- Yes.
Indonesia ... I, I love Indone- Indonesia. Yeah.
So why do you think the USA is improving so rapidly, Tommy, at the moment? What, what's, what's different?
I'm not sure if it's improved more, because as we mentioned earlier, you know, we won the Nations Cup in 2007 and 2011. I think what's happened is that we've, our, our ability has spread further around the country, and as a result, we're strong top to bottom, right?
So, you know, juniors won the Junior Cup. You know, the premier was, was close to Nations Cup, but not quite, but right there. And then our seniors were, were close. Canada won the Senior A Nations Cup. So, you know, it's, it's, it's spreading the word. It's trying lots of different, uh, ideas and techniques, and being collaborative, and being open to saying, "What works?
What doesn't? Let's try this." 'Cause here's the overarching thing. I mean, even though this sport was Created, invented, uh, 2,000-plus years ago. It's only been internationally organized for about 40 years, 40 so, 40-plus years.
Well, that's what Julie said to us. I couldn't believe, you see the dominance of Canada in Brandenburg just recently, or anywhere, and then Julie's, "Oh, w- we're 40 years old."
And yet you've, you hear, it's just like how far they've come.
Compared to other sports we might be familiar with, right? I'm very familiar with, say, you know, baseball, uh, basketball. The strategies and the techniques, I've noticed them change in the last 20, 30 years, and these are sports that have been around for 100 years or more.
So if those sports are always finding new edges, what's the learning curve of dragon boat? It's even steeper, and things are changing quickly because we're all still kind of new at this, believe it or not, compared to other sports.
Well, that's, that's, that's a, that's a fantastic... 'Cause on an earlier show, we had, uh, um, uh, sorry, we, we, we were talking to Mr.
Luo from Champion Dragon Boats, and back in the '90s, we used to have the teak boats, and I don't know whether if, if, if, if Philadelphia, like they're one of the oldest clubs. Let's put your coaching- We, we had
the teak boat.
Yeah. Let's put your coaching hat, let's put your coaching hat back on. Where you coach and how you coach, where do you see the US coach?
Because so many clubs and teams and national teams that I've seen over the last, you know, since two th- well, since 1993, they go to a championship and they come back and they try to, "Oh, I'm gonna try and do the Thai stroke or the Indonesian stroke or the Filipino stroke." Does America have their own hybrid stroke?
What, what, what you try and do the perfect... Because you got, as Dougie said, you got sprint canoers, C1s, outriggers, you know. What, what, what do you feel is, is, is the USA technique?
There is no USA technique, okay? There are teams that are still doing the old Canadian stroke that very few Canadians even do anymore.
Um, it's, it's like this delay. Then there are teams that are doing, uh, what they, they're trying to copy the Philadelphia stroke. Why- whereas here in Philadelphia, we're always looking for an edge. So now in Philadelphia, we're taking what we already did really well in Philly and now adding, uh, some of the kind of nuances and discoveries that I was able to hone in my four years, uh, coaching for the Bucks County Club, which is a club just north of Philadelphia.
So, you know, to, to, to his credit, you know, Bob McNamara, the head coach of Philadelphia, you know, first coach inducted into the IDBF Hall of Fame-
That, that, that's a, that's a name that, that is synonymous to dragon boating.
Yeah. And you should interview him. He's, he's a great interview. Um, but, but you know, he's always looking for an edge too.
I mean, here's someone who's been coaching for 40 years and is always open to something new, and we've collaborated and we're bringing some new ideas even into Philadelphia. And these are ideas that I've either learned from other paddlers that I've spoken to, or kind of sometimes you learn from new paddlers, you know?
One day I was out working one-on-one with somebody, teaching them how to isolate a certain part of body, and I started watching her do something and I was like, "What are you doing?" She goes, "Oh, I'm just isolating that part." And I'm like, "Hey, I like that. That's a drill." So I- so she created a drill that I wouldn't even thought of because she was so kind of raw and, and just trying it out.
So you, you always gotta be open to something new, and it could come from anybody at any time.
Well, Dougie, you mentioned this earlier on You've got techniques, you've got new paddlers, but then when you're winning by sometimes one hundredths of a second, and then you get down to the minutiae of, "Hey, the more force I'm putting on the pa- I've got slippage.
The torque's not there." And then that, that leads into the, the, the paddles evolving, Dougie, from your old wood paddle to the carbon fibre, to different designs, to different makeup and testing of it. That's a whole other different level, which can pick up hundreds of seconds in a team.
Well, that's what I was thinking, like what technical adjustments can be made that can instantly give a boat better speed, Tommy?
Well, I mean, one overarching thing I would say is a quiet paddle is a fast paddle. Okay? And that's something Bob McNamara has been saying for decades. I- if you're paddling and you hear a whoosh, next, next stroke, you got to get rid of that whoosh. That's telling me, that's telling you that you aren't as deep as you want to be during that stroke.
If it's quiet, it's gonna be faster. So that, that would be your number one thing, is just make sure it's as quiet as possible. And obviously, there's lots of other nuances and techniques that go into that, but-
Yeah ... look for that. That beautiful hit and glide that we love.
Well, a- I'm gonna... I don't like the term hit, and I'll tell you why.
I, I, I give an analogy when I'm coaching, okay? Paddling is not like hitting a ball. It's like throwing a ball, okay? To throw a ball, you hold it as long as you can and accelerate that arm And hold the ball as long as you can until you have to release it. Hitting a ball is almost an instantaneous contact.
So instead of trying to hit the water, you wanna hold the water and feel like you're throwing the boat forward as opposed to hitting the water. So that's an interesting nuance there when you said hit. It's a different way of looking at it. It makes a huge difference. When paddlers start to feel like they're holding the water, then they're getting more power.
It should not be an instantaneous contact with the water.
And we see that with the longer, like you, you look at the stroke rating, Dougie, even in, in, in Brandenburg, it's like the Chinese are almost double the, the Americans on that 1,000 meter. However, you've got that power through the water, you're getting the full water on the blade.
Yeah, beautiful. I like it. I like it. Bringing baseball to, bringing baseball to, uh, to dragon boating. By my-
The beautiful thing about the sport is like, you know, you can watch, you know, you can watch a German team and a US team and a Canadian team and a Thai team, a Chinese team, you know, going down, you know, all, all pretty close with completely different stroke rates.
And there they all are, depending on their mindset, you know, their philosophy and also their body shape, right? If your average height of your team is six foot four inches, um, you're not gonna go at 110 strokes per minute. I mean, you, you just, you can't do it. So you have to really think about what works for your crew.
So Tommy, um, we're obviously, uh, not wrapping up, but I had a few questions. I do a segment on the, uh, podcast called 60 Seconds with Dougie, and they're rapid, rapid-fire questions, three or four. So I'm gonna put you on the spot and, um, we're gonna go here. We're not call it... 60 Seconds with Dougie will be up later, but this is a special 60 Seconds with Dougie, um, with Tommy Leonardi.
Okay. Best crew culture you've seen?
Philadelphia and South Breeze. Okay? South Breeze is a club in Southern California that took the best talent from all the local clubs and, but still gives back. They had all these people and these local clubs that wanted to take it to another level, so the best paddlers created South Breeze, but the best paddlers all coach and compete with their original clubs.
Philly, because we're their oldest club in the US, kind of did a reverse. As we grew and got better, many of our paddlers also became coaches of other local teams as a result. So, you know, two great clubs doing amazing things on the water, but also giving back and helping others, and not just keeping their secrets to themselves.
Cool, cool. Okay. Toughest nation to race?
China and Canada right there too, depending on the distance, without a doubt
Cool, cool. Most underrated country, paddling country?
New Zealand. We already hit on it, but they're, they're coming. All right? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, I saw what they did at the Club Crews in Ravenna.
I was like-
They're paddling from Tonga, Samoa, uh, uh, to New Zealand to get there, man.
Yeah. Well, you know, when you race against people with tattoos on their faces, you know- ... you know you're, uh, you're in for a fight.
All right. Favorite race distance?
As a coach or as a paddler?
Both.
Okay.
Double, double prong question.
As a paddler, the 2,000 because it- you're out there longer, you're trying to catch up to, to, to other teams, pass other teams. Okay? My least favorite, um, race as a coach is the 2,000 because when you're not in the boat and you're watching your team and there's a certain amount of luck and, you know, who's in their way, who's not in their way, who's crashing, and you're about to lose your mind, it's, it just...
You have no control of the situation, and it can drive you nuts. So yeah, it's a, it's kind of a double-edged sword, that 2K, depending on what hat you're wearing.
Uh, Tommy Le- Leonardi heads down to the, uh, boat shed, there's a young paddler there. What advice, who's never paddled before, what advice does Tommy give that paddler before they hop in the boat?
Be patient and have fun. There are so many moving parts to paddling that i- if as long as you're patient and learn and slowly put things together, you'll get better and better. You need to be very patient in this sport. It's something I tell everyone I coach. You know, "Just relax, it'll come. Just keep working on it."
Beautiful thing about the sport is that you can build good muscle, muscle memory because it's repetitive.
Downwind or grind?
Oh, definitely downwind. Come on. After a regatta,
what- Without a doubt ... after a regatta on a Sunday afternoon, what does Tommy do? Lemonade or a beer?
Oh, lemonade.
Lemonade? No,
definitely not a...
I don't do alcohol, nah. We've done the- Well, depe- depend- it depends on, depends on how much t- tension there is need to be relieved after, after a, a, a race, but usually I keep
it- Oh, well that may be my next question. Yeah. Coffee before or after training?
I don't drink coffee.
Okay.
You think I need
coffee?
Early mor- early morning, early morning or late starts for training?
Oh, man. Uh, early morning, but that's just because I was kind of forced into it in, in Philly. It's actually a great story.
Okay. Favorite, uh, regatta you've attended over your 30 years?
Favorite regatta, uh, without a doubt Ravenna 2024. So many incredible special moments.
B- uh, you know, winning world championships with the Philadelphia team paddling, winning a world championship and other medals, coaching a different team, and being there with so many incredible people. Um, there was just so much love at that event, uh, among everyone. It's just, it was wonderful. I just, I love the club crews.
It was just such a amazing event.
Well, thanks. And I asked you what you would do for a junior paddler because that was always my- or a new paddler, that was always my last question. You've answered that. So thank you for answering those questions. We get a little bit more of a personal insight to Tommy, um, and everyone there.
I hope you enjoyed, uh, our podcast with him today all the way from the States.
Absolutely. And we'll, and we'll see, we'll see you, uh, in Taiwan in just a f- i- yeah, in j- in j- in just a few months. So we'll be there and, and we'll see how good Tommy is here. I'm Hando.
I'm Dougie.
And we are Paddles Ready.
Paddles Ready.
Thanks, guys. Paddles Ready, Tommy.
Well, good morning. We are day two here at the Aussie Champs, and I am down at the Brisbane River Dragons, and I have found
Mark Slater.
G'day, Mark. This is 60 Seconds with Dougie, in case you don't know, and I am the voice of paddlers on the ground.
Right.
Yep. What, what's worst excuse you have heard from someone to miss training?
It's traffic.
Okay. Downwind or grind?
Downwind.
Early morning training or sleep-ins? Sleep-ins
for me. Oh,
what's more important, fitness or technique?
Both really important. Technique particularly.
Carbon fiber or wooden paddle?
Carbon fiber.
Coffee before or after training?
Generally after.
Biggest talker on the boat?
Oh, Martin Zelker.
Sprint or distance?
Sprint.
Beers or lemonade on the Sunday arvo once you're done?
Beers.
Favorite regatta you've competed at around the world?
Club Crew, Adelaide. Your
one tip that instantly makes a junior paddler a better
paddler? Follow your
coach. Complete this sentence, Mark: If I wasn't paddling, I'd be...
Playing golf.
Beautiful. Thanks. That's 60 Seconds with Dougie,
and that's Mark, ex-president of Queensland Dragon Boat Association and BRD stalwart and legend.
Hey,
Nico. How are you?
Dougie, that was an awesome podcast. What-- don't tell me you got another one for me, because th- you keep ripping these w- into me. You gotta tell me something. Well, this is
the hot takes. Oh. We're now Dougie's hot takes.
Dougie's hot take again.
I feel- What
have you got for me today?
Well, what have I got for you today?
Just thinking, is the sport in at risk of diluting itself like boxing? Like, how many world titles do we have to have in dragon boating really?
Good question. So there's a, there's, there's a, there's a club crew, which is every-
Yep ...
two years.
Yes.
Then there's the, the world titles.
Yep.
So I don't know whether it's diluting, like boxing and that's had me, the IDBF, sorry, the, the, the, the- WBF or whatever
it is
W... Yeah. All, all that.
All that.
Th- there is ICF World Championships. There is IDFB- IDBF World Championships. Yep. I don't know whether there's ever gonna be a combined one. Yeah. That would be a great question for it.
What about the canoe? Is there the international canoe, they have- ICF
ICF. That's
right, yep.
Well, that's, that's paddle, that's, that's the global paddle. So that, that's the Olympic-
Yeah ...
side of the thing. That's the ICF, and then you have the IDBF. So- Yeah. And it'd be, you know, it'd be really interesting to see what are the times compared for those two world titles. Titles. Diluting, I think it's great that you have- Yeah
a club crew. Yep. All the teams and they have to compete for it. So hot take, that's, uh, yeah, great question. Great que- Yeah ... it's one for the, it's, it's a lot of thought can come from the viewers all around the world- Oh, 100% ... because th- there, there are a lot of European championships, Australian championship, then they all qualify-
Yep
for world titles, so the club crews, and then they go for the, the, the Nations Cup. And there's, then there's the Nations Cup in, in, in China-
Yeah, gotcha ...
where they have the 100 meter races.
Yeah, gotcha.
100 meter, 100 meter- 100 meters ... fandom call. Oh. That could be one.
We might do a fan of call.
Yep.
We might do a fan of call.
100 meter.
100 meters.
100 meter handos.
Well, I just wanted to ask you that question. It was just like, I was kinda, I, I wa- I was wrestling with it last night when I was, you know, planning everything and I just thought, could there be a risk that we go down too far? Is there too many world titles? Do we run the risk of going down the boxing rou- route, um, or are we in a good place?
Well,
well-
And I'm, I feel we're in a good place ...
absolutely. But, but, but some of these world titles are over six, seven days. Yeah. Maybe every second year there's the prem world titles. Yep. And then there's the, the senior world titles. Yeah. Gotcha. I don't, I don't know.
Yeah.
But the event organizers from IDBF, ICF, they're all doing an amazing job.
Yep. Well, I think it's in a great spot. It was just a question. I thought it was a hot, you know, a good, a good topic to have a chat about Absolutely ... um, um, you know, we're, we're not here to criticize anyone or anything. Um- No, yeah ... give us
your
thoughts,
all you viewers out there.
That's it. Your
listeners.
That's it. All right, mate, thanks for that.
All right.
Catch you later. See you later. Paddles
ready. Paddles ready. Dougie, wow. That was sensational.
How good was that? And you know what the best thing is about it, Hando? What? If you wanna watch us again, get on the website, get on YouTube channel, get on Spotify, get on anything you can- Amazon
and you can watch it again.
Mate, Karl Stefanovic, on his show, we're getting on there as well. Uh. He's paddling with Grant Kenny. Get on and live. Let's go, team.
See you later.
Wherever you are around the world, thumbs up, like-
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