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Welcome to Funnel Vision, Hosted by Mikael Dia, Founder & CEO of Funnelytics - a revolutionary marketing analytics software that allows marketers and business owners to map and track their sales and marketing campaigns visually.
We feature Marketing Agency Owners and Performance Marketers to highlight the tactics, tools and strategies they use to grow their own business and their clients.
Funnel Vision brings you 3 episodes every single week that aim to highlight the strategies used by successful agency owners and performance marketers in a 20 minute format.
Aside from their unique topic of the day, our guests always answer one big question:
What is your best growth tactic?
For more content, check out our YouTube page, newsletter or connect with Mikael Dia on LinkedIn!
[00:00:00] Mikael: What's going on, everybody, welcome to another episode of the funnel vision show. I am very excited for my guest today because now we have somebody who actually been in touch with and spent a lot of time with. In fact, actually, we're both in the same city in Toronto, Leanna Ling. I am super excited. She is the CEO of ad skills.
[00:00:28] Mikael: Uh, ad skills is a massive network of agency owners and marketers who want to better up their game, basically take it to the next level. Lianna, uh, welcome. Thank you for being on.
[00:00:41] Liana: Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here.
[00:00:43] Mikael: I'm, I'm excited to have you. I'm excited to have a chat. We've, we've spoken about, you know, multiple things over, uh, over the years.
[00:00:51] Mikael: I think we've known each other now, but, um.
[00:00:53] Liana: And we're finally pressing the record button. Because I think we've had some great conversations. We're like, oh, we should have recorded this.
[00:00:58] Mikael: Exactly. Exactly. [00:01:00] And now we're finally recording it and sharing with others. So, uh, As I always do, um, Leanna, what's your humble brag?
[00:01:07] Mikael: Like, tell me what you've been able to achieve for your clients. Tell me what you've been able to achieve for yourself. Just like this time it's, it's time for you to kind of. Not be so humble too much and tell us why people should listen.
[00:01:21] Liana: Sure. So I am a lawyer turned entrepreneur and over the years I have become known for being, um, a rock star.
[00:01:30] Liana: Like I have been called a beast. with meta ads, I will say that, or Facebook if you're old school and one of my handles actually on social media is the lead gen queen because I am like that is my game. I just launched a new campaign for a new client and I think before they were getting something like 15, 20, 30 cost per leads and we're getting 5 and they're qualified.
[00:01:55] Liana: Right? Because we know it's not just all about the numbers, but that's my thing. Like, I'll jump [00:02:00] in because of my in depth knowledge of meta, which we can talk about a little bit today if we want to. Um, and be able to get these types of results for clients.
[00:02:08] Mikael: And, and you only do this specifically for, like, lead gen offers?
[00:02:13] Mikael: Like, for, You know, lawyers, professional services, that kind of stuff, or do you, like, do you play in many fields?
[00:02:20] Liana: Yeah, great question. I actually don't work with lawyers. I found it was really hard to do that, uh, to, to, to bridge that gap, actually, when I became an entrepreneur. But I actually do a lot more work with coaches, info products, and I don't do just, uh, lead gen funnels.
[00:02:34] Liana: Like, I love lead gen, love webinar funnels. Um, I've also doing very well with the low ticket funnels, especially the, the challenge funnels as well. So that, that's my jam is like B2B. I love that. I don't really do that much. I tried. It's not my thing to do e commerce, um, or doing like a lot of B2C.
[00:02:53] Mikael: Interesting. Very, very interesting. And, uh, but you're also CEO of [00:03:00] AdSkills. So you're doing like many things all at once.
[00:03:03] Liana: Well, I find that I have a handful of clients that I just adore and I want to work with. So I like to have that. It keeps my feet on the ground. And then the other side of my life, I really am just.
[00:03:17] Liana: so blessed that I get to serve and like talk to so many agency owners and marketers and we can just geek out. Well, you can see like you're in our community, like we can literally geek out all day long about what are you working on and how, you know, and then we just kind of, you know, work together to, to help each other out.
[00:03:34] Liana: So, yeah, I just, I love my life.
[00:03:37] Mikael: That's awesome. So for those who don't know. What exactly is AdSkills?
[00:03:42] Liana: So AdSkills is a community and it's also an education platform where we train people on how to create and drive traffic to their offers. The main focus is on paid media. I am expanding it more to also organic and [00:04:00] for us to be a bit more Holistic, because I think you need, we want to give you everything you need to be successful with your traffic, and that includes understanding organic, that includes understanding your landing pages, that includes like me bugging you all the time about how to improve, you know, how our funnel flow works and things like that, um, but that's what we've been known for, and AdSkills has been around for at least over, I believe like 15 years, AdSkills.
[00:04:23] Liana: org.
[00:04:23] Mikael: Wow. Yeah, I think it was started by Justin Brooke, right?
[00:04:26] Liana: It was, yes.
[00:04:28] Mikael: And, and how did you become CEO? Like, what was that story like? What was that process like?
[00:04:34] Liana: Yeah, that's a really interesting story. I think I've only shared it once, ever. So, uh, this is, here, well, no, I am, I'm somebody where I am. I mean, I, it sounds like, you know, uh, if I say like I was a nobody, I don't know what you would kind of take from that.
[00:04:49] Liana: But really, nobody really knew who I was. I'm like here in Toronto, right? Signing up some clients. I'm doing ads for people. I'm doing, you know, do that thing. And it wasn't until I joined [00:05:00] AdSkills, and by the way, my story is, is not very different from others who have said this as well. And Justin saw what I was doing, I was showing him, I was getting these results, you know, like whatever, 60 said webinar registrations at the time, the good old days.
[00:05:14] Liana: Um, and, and he kind of like lifted me up and I started to become known like internationally and then my name out there and people started to recognize me and, uh, I started to get more confidence about, hey, like, cause I thought everybody was the same as me. I didn't think I was doing anything special.
[00:05:30] Liana: Until Justin and others in the community reflected back to me. I was like, no, uh, that's not normal, right? Um, so I started teaching, uh, inside of the community. I started helping more people. Um, they asked me to lead a couple of sessions and Justin has said that I was one of the only people who got this amazing response back from everybody who came to the sessions and also that taught the sessions at a level and a standard that he, um, you know, kept for himself.[00:06:00]
[00:06:00] Liana: So, um, shortly before I became CEO, uh, he had actually asked me to take over the pro certification program. I was in there and I'm like leading in I'm having a great time and doing all that and we just started having Discussions he was just like can we have a chat and I thought oh, what did I do now, right?
[00:06:16] Liana: um, but it ended up just having being like a really I think great very honest transparent chat about Where he felt he was going with his life, where he envisioned, you know, ad skills and where he thought ad skills could go. And he felt that where that he was sort of standing in the way of ad skills growing to the level that he wanted it to.
[00:06:36] Liana: And they had actually been looking at for, you know, somebody to take his spots. And they kind of said like, like, they feel like I. have the same genuine care and love for ad skills community as they do. And as I mentioned, I've always gotten really good feedback whenever I've done, um, you know, trainings in the community.
[00:06:54] Liana: And one of the tactics I do have in order to keep growing my agency is to find [00:07:00] communities where I show up every single day. And I'd literally been doing that for years. In fact, some people thought I already worked for ad skills because I always showed up even in the slow times. I thought it would be perfect.
[00:07:10] Liana: And it was just a very organic. process for me to take over the company. Um, you know, and so that was, which was kind of weird because I, I asked for help from my mentors who have done, you know, bought and sold many companies. And it was, I definitely did not do this the way they told me to do it. It was a very organic, natural process, which to me meant that it was meant to be.
[00:07:33] Mikael: Yeah. Honestly, whenever. Whenever things are forced, it always ends up kind of going a little sideways. And, and a lot of times, uh, people are so focused on the outcome that they put blinders on to any sort of red flags. Cause they're like, yeah, I, I. I just want the outcome, right? So I'm, I'm going to work towards that regardless of things.
[00:07:56] Mikael: So, uh, it's cool that you ended up kind of being CEO. [00:08:00] So you've been CEO now for how long?
[00:08:02] Liana: Uh, about a year. Yeah. Over a year now.
[00:08:04] Mikael: A year over a year now.
[00:08:06] Liana: Again, it was a very transition. It's so, you know, I don't have in terms of the exact anniversary when I was like all alone, it's, it's been almost a year, but it would, we kind of did it have, so, you know, with training wheels kind of getting in place.
[00:08:18] Liana: Right.
[00:08:20] Mikael: So, so tell me, um, Okay, because you still run your agency. You still have a handful of clients. Uh, so tell me a little bit about that agency journey. Like, how did you become the queen of lead gen? Is that the nickname they give you?
[00:08:32] Liana: Lead gen queen. Yes,
[00:08:33] Mikael: lead gen queen. Like, how did you become that? What was that journey like?
[00:08:37] Mikael: I mean, first, when did you, I'm a lawyer. When did you like, I don't want to be a lawyer anymore. Let me start Facebook ads. Like, how did that, and, and what was that kind of, um, journey and. I guess at some stage you found that tipping point that oh man, I'm getting incredible results, so kind of walk me through that.
[00:08:58] Liana: Sure. So I, [00:09:00] um, just to frame it, when I was a lawyer, I had experience working in a small boutique firm where you literally have no life, because that's just the way it is. And I moved to work as part of the in house counsel department at TD Bank, which I know you're familiar with being here in Toronto.
[00:09:15] Liana: And, uh, I, I was actually made redundant, um, along with another lawyer as well. And that had never happened to me before. So you go through this whole imposter syndrome, you know, all that mental games that you play with yourself there. And what's interesting is, um, I realized it took me a couple of months, but I finally realized that I was a frustrated entrepreneur.
[00:09:38] Liana: Because when you, when you do have a job in certain places, they don't allow you to have like side gigs and explore all that. Um, so I realized afterwards that I was a frustrated entrepreneur inside of there and I needed to be my own boss. I also realized, which you may find as well, I find a lot of other, uh, entrepreneurs are like this.
[00:09:54] Liana: That I am actually a really bad employee, that I was really quite miserable for the [00:10:00] years that I was an employee, you know, um, wherever I was with the firm or with TV, etc. So, that was also probably why maybe I just subconsciously did things the way I did and why I was one of the ones chosen to be made redundant, right?
[00:10:13] Liana: Um, and so I, again, I'm a, I guess I'm a very like person where I just do things trans, uh, just gradually. So what I do is I met somebody who was a friend of a friend who sold franchises and I didn't even know you could buy a service franchise at all. And he ended up selling me a digital marketing franchise.
[00:10:33] Liana: And at the time I felt comfortable with that because. You know, I'm, you have the support, you have a system, you have, you know, people to help you provide you with training, but yet you're on your own. It sounded like the perfect thing for me. And that's how I started to become an entrepreneur was with a franchise.
[00:10:50] Liana: With the systems, becoming a salesperson, understanding Google ads and all that other, you know, everything that building websites, like doing. everything like that. [00:11:00] And so that's how I started. Um, and over time I was able to figure out what my niche was. I remember when Facebook, you know, I'm old, right? So I remember when Facebook started allowing us to do ads and things.
[00:11:12] Liana: And, and I realized at the time that my niche was really getting ROI on social media. That was my thing. And that actually became sexy. And I was able to close a lot more deals because I said, Oh, this is like, this is me, right? I teach you how to get ROI on social media. And then I just started doing a deeper dive into Facebook.
[00:11:29] Liana: Um, along the way, long story short, um, having a lot of ups and downs, I did end up in ad skills and learned more skills. And really just did a very deep dive into how the heck does this Facebook platform work, you know, like I'm always questioning things and, um, and I found that the deeper I understood it, the more I could kind of bend it to my will in a way, you know, once you understand how to structure things and, and that's how I started getting better [00:12:00] results for clients, which again, at the time I thought was like normal, but now I know it was, wasn't.
[00:12:05] Liana: Um, and that's really how that happened. And it was just always talking to people. By the way, one of the tips I would have is, when I went right into the franchise and knew I would do this in any network, I figured out who were the top performers in there. And I made it my mission to go find them and just to go talk to them, buy them coffee, buy them lunch, do something.
[00:12:23] Liana: I was like, tell me like, and most of them are really happy just to share. And that's how I learned. You know, I remember I was like speaking, I used to speak a lot with David Schloss, um, in back in the day and he was somebody very instrumental encouraging me to be a media buyer, um, you know, and learning from him and I just, I just wanted to soak it all up.
[00:12:42] Liana: So I was never like looking at this is my way and that's the only way I'm doing it. I'm always looking for ways that I can learn and that I can up my game because As you know, there's no one way to do everything, because if there was, we would have already taught it to everybody and, right? And we would all be doing it, right?
[00:12:59] Liana: [00:13:00] Um, and that's, and that's something that I think I also inherited from my mom. Like, my mother is very much into what she calls September learning, which is like continuous learning. And that's, that's what I've applied. All the time, whether it's how I grow my agency, how it can be better at my craft. Um, you know, even now you're like, wow, your CEO of ad skills, you get to learn about and talk to all these different agencies and platforms.
[00:13:22] Liana: I learned something new every single day still. Um, and I can apply it to my clients. I apply it to my own ads. I teach it and I share it with the rest of the community as well. And that's, that has really been an underlying theme in literally everything. I also made it a goal of mine to master entrepreneurship.
[00:13:40] Liana: And that led me on a whole other journey where I was working with Norm Brodsky and Louis Schiff and at the Inc. Business Owners Council. And I mean, that was so fascinating, but I really wanted to master it and, and learn from the best. And, and that's what I do, whether it's. You know, um, how to beat escape rooms, which being in Toronto, I love escape rooms, [00:14:00] uh, whether it's, you know, doing ads or how to run a better agency, um, or copywriting or whatever I want to learn from the best.
[00:14:10] Mikael: The only thing I would say is have you mastered entrepreneurship yet? Because I, I don't know if that's possible.
[00:14:18] Liana: It's the journey, right? It's
[00:14:20] Mikael: the journey, for sure. Like, it's the
[00:14:21] Liana: journey, but I've definitely learned so much more than I think that I even realized, because it's not just about tactics. I learned about, um, especially being part of the Inc.
[00:14:31] Liana: Five, being able to serve the Inc. 5, 000 community for a couple of years. Again, that's probably this whole other episode we can go into, but really better understanding the mindset, the, um, you know, the differences between a mindset of a fast growth entrepreneur versus we call middle class people who have a job.
[00:14:47] Liana: Um, which is why I learned a lot from Louis Schiff. Um, you know, just the tactics, the strategy, the mindset. Uh, yeah, it's so, but the pursuit of mastery is just fascinating to me. And I just love the journey.
[00:14:59] Mikael: Yeah, [00:15:00] I, I agree. I think, um, as entrepreneurs, we're, we're always striving to learn more. We're always trying to try new things, break things.
[00:15:10] Mikael: I think a lot of us, we, we thrive in, in kind of chaos because we, we love to turn chaos into clarity. Uh, it's one of those things that, you know, drives us fundamentally as, as entrepreneurs. So what was your, let's call it kind of the tipping point. What was the, where did things really shift for you? Was it when you like started learning the Facebook algorithm or like, was it when you decided I'm going to be the social media ROI person, like.
[00:15:41] Mikael: When did things really start shifting for you?
[00:15:44] Liana: So I think that there was two areas. The first was, um, again, when I've had been on this roller coaster and I finally joined AdSkills, one of the things I didn't realize I was really bad at was pricing. And Justin encouraged me to [00:16:00] charge more than I was asking for because he saw I was good enough, right?
[00:16:04] Liana: So he says, you should be charging this. And I started, even though I felt uncomfortable, I did. And people paid it, like, no questions asked. So, I was clearly under, way undercharging before. But that was a big thing for me because it was like, wow. Actually, I am now at the same level as the other, these other people who I kind of put on a pedestal and thought, wow, there's so much better than me.
[00:16:23] Liana: Like I would never be that way. And then all of a sudden I find myself there playing at their level. In my mind, that was when I was able to command the prices that I knew they were charging as well. And that just started this whole thing where then I started to getting mentioned more, you know, people start talking about you.
[00:16:40] Liana: Out of people come up to me in conferences saying they'd heard of me, I was like, what are you talking about, right? So clearly I was doing something right over there. Um, and the second thing that also was a tipping point for me, which sounds a bit silly, but A friend, a friend of mine was actually helping me just get my social media kind of together.
[00:16:57] Liana: She's like, you need a gimmick, right? Like you need [00:17:00] just a persona or something. And I came up with lead gen queen. And so I changed my handles there. And it's just something about putting a label on you made a huge difference for me. You know, that was back in the day when clubhouse was really hot and I would come in the room
[00:17:17] Mikael: the six minutes.
[00:17:19] Liana: Yeah, right. But I mean, I would come in the room and my friend would be there and she'd be like, lead gen queen is here. And I was like, it just took me to another level. And it just gave me this confidence. And people were like, you're the lead gen queen. Right. And I'd be like, yeah, I am. I should be able to do this.
[00:17:34] Liana: You know, so I think of that too. Like when I go up, um, you know, I, I invested in becoming a better professional speaker. I did like, it just. Again, it was that confidence and it just gave me that persona that I felt I could just live into because that's me. I love theme stuff. I just, you know, that that was just my thing.
[00:17:53] Liana: And, and so I figured out that that's what really gave me the confidence to do all the different things that I'm doing.
[00:17:59] Mikael: It's funny. [00:18:00] Um, whenever I go to conferences, people, I'm the phonolitics guy, the, the way I've seen you with your hat before. Like I, you know, it's funny because like, These little things people don't realize, but, um, there's these little things that you can do that create memorable.
[00:18:18] Mikael: Like, that's why I wear this hat all the time. I very rarely wear my hat outside of like when I'm on camera or taking pictures. Um, but then people instantly recognize it, right? Like, it's like when you look at Tony Robbins, everyone knows, Oh, that four leaf clover, that's a Tony Robbins hat. Right. And there's these little things like Lee Jen Queen.
[00:18:39] Mikael: It's like, yeah, I've heard of that name. Who is that person? Oh, it's you. Oh my God. Right. And it, it almost creates this like, mythical type of persona, which is, which is very interesting.
[00:18:49] Liana: And everybody can do that. Like you don't have to be a big thought leader or speaking on stages. Like you could just do that yourself.
[00:18:56] Liana: And I would challenge anybody listening to this to do that themselves [00:19:00] and just and may sound a bit woo woo, but really, trust me, try it and see what happens, because I just I showed up on social media differently. I showed up on stage differently. I showed up in conversations differently, all because of that title that I gave myself.
[00:19:13] Mikael: Oh, I agree. Even when I do it for, for myself, like the minute I put on the Finalytics hat, it means it's, it's go time. Like I'm, I'm representing Finalytics. I'm here to represent our brand. It creates a lot of, you know, motivation and momentum as well. So, okay, you mastered Facebook. So let's talk about Facebook for a minute.
[00:19:35] Liana: Yeah, sure.
[00:19:36] Mikael: Um, how and what is mastering Facebook? So tell me a little bit about your best growth tactics. Uh, when it comes to Facebook, can every single type of business use Facebook? A lot of people talk about, Hey, well, I'm on LinkedIn. Like my audience is B2B. Like, can I really get them on Facebook? Um, I more Google, et cetera.
[00:19:58] Mikael: So can everybody [00:20:00] do Facebook number one and number two, how do I think about Facebook if I want to make it successful?
[00:20:07] Liana: Sure. Um, everybody can do Facebook, but not everybody should do Facebook
[00:20:12] Mikael: because
[00:20:12] Liana: it's, it's big enough, but. I actually look at it more from a compliance perspective. There are just some that is just too hard.
[00:20:19] Liana: You, you can't, your, your hands are handcuffed so much due to compliance issues that you just can't really get across the message properly. And, and I think have everything work for you the way it should. Um, but there were, and, and B2Bs that, you know, we've tried and it just didn't work out as well as LinkedIn is because it just, it just didn't, you know, but were the people there?
[00:20:43] Liana: Yes. But it just wasn't the right messaging, um, you know, in terms of that. So, you know, but I would always try it. I always try Facebook first, as long as you're not doing like CBD and some again or dating or just like some other areas are just very, [00:21:00] very challenging to do from a compliance perspective. So, um, the reason for that is just no matter how much we love and hate it, because I do, and I think a lot of people do, um, they're still really, really, really good at finding the people that you want.
[00:21:13] Liana: If you ask for leads, it finds you leads. If you ask for purchasers, it really tries to find you people who will purchase. And you can still get it a lot faster than at least in my experience when I've also run Google ads as well. So I just feel like I can, do a lot faster testing on it. Um, where I have found it really helpful for me to Grow on Facebook is Uh, you know, at first I would chase different tactics and different formulas and just try and follow them.
[00:21:41] Liana: But what I realized was I just really had to understand what was happening, how it actually worked.
[00:21:48] Mikael: Before you keep diving, when you say chasing different tactics, um, do you mean in this case, Uh, oh, I, should it be a webinar funnel or should it be a book funnel or should it be a tripwire funnel? And like, [00:22:00] is that what you mean in terms of tactics?
[00:22:01] Mikael: Even
[00:22:01] Liana: more granular, like, you know, like doing the, Oh, you know, run, run the ad, like here's one, right? Run the ad to an international audience, get all the engagement up there, then take that ad and put it in your conversion campaign. And in theory it should be better because you've got all these like engagement, even though it's from countries and people that you don't even want, um, you know, for, just for example, right.
[00:22:21] Liana: That's just one tactic.
[00:22:22] Mikael: Right. So playing the algorithm, in a sense, or trying to find ways. Yeah,
[00:22:26] Liana: so I chase all of those, and you know, they all, they all work. Let's just put it out there. Everything works. It just depends, will it work for you? Will it work fast enough for you? Will it get you the, you know, cost per lead or cost per acquisition that you want?
[00:22:39] Liana: Um, So what I figured out was the more I could sort of read, first of all, like, read actually what they have in their documentation, they actually do tell us a lot in their documentation, nobody just bothers to read it, um, actually read it and try and better understand how it works, especially now that, you know, Meta and [00:23:00] Google and all these other platforms are leaning more and more towards AI, it's even more important for us to understand like what What, what are they willing to share with us so that we know, okay, like, I can set things up in a way that they want, but then I also have the wisdom to know when I want to change things, um, because I have a better idea of why things are happening.
[00:23:19] Liana: So, uh, one example is realizing that because they shared, um, I won't, we don't have time to go into the whole formula, but I was at an event where they actually shared, here's at a high level, our formula for how we value the ads. realizing that even though it looks like they've taken away a lot of our options, like our buttons to push, they actually haven't.
[00:23:38] Liana: And in fact, the targeting, which is what most people complain about, is actually shifted very heavily over onto the creative, onto the copy, onto the videos and images that you use. That's how we can send signals to Facebook about who we want to target, like who we want to buy from us. And to me, that's great news because I can control that.
[00:23:59] Liana: I can't [00:24:00] control any of the other stuff. But just understanding that as an example, I stopped chasing. Oh, like I have to find like the perfect interest to put in Facebook. It doesn't work as well anymore. And so then now I'm using the creative to send signals to Facebook about, okay, like, do we want moms?
[00:24:17] Liana: Do we want dads? Do we want senior citizens? Do we want people who love Pomeranians? Like. What do we want? Beat keepers? What do we want, right? Having that over there and then also knowing when to and how to change it when you get stuck in, you know, a bad section of the audience. I can now use the creative to send a signal to Facebook to, hey, like, look over here.
[00:24:35] Liana: So it's just, it's just really shifted. And now I know how to send the right signals to it. Just as an example.
[00:24:41] Mikael: Interesting. Okay. And, and when you. Okay. Learn that process like just so I'm I'm fully with you. So you now have kind of understood and understand how to leverage the creative more effectively.
[00:24:57] Mikael: But there's got to be things that work [00:25:00] better on Facebook than on. On Google, for example, or work differently. So like, for example, we all know that Google is intent and it's based on a search, a keyword, and we're looking for somebody who's already in that mindset of researching for some versus Facebook is completely different versus even LinkedIn we're talking about while they're already in that kind of business mindset when they're on LinkedIn.
[00:25:26] Mikael: So is there any specific. approach that you have when you're sitting here and you're saying, okay, I'm going to come up with the Facebook campaign. So let's give an example. Funnelytics, right? We've got a software, okay. Typical SAS free trial. Um, do you sit there and say, free trials won't really work with on Facebook.
[00:25:49] Mikael: Um, instead, we should think about it this way. And if so, what is that this way?
[00:25:55] Liana: Sure. That's a great question. Um, the first thing I'm always looking at is I want to, [00:26:00] I want to be able to fulfill your business objective. So at the end of the day, we want more people to sign up for Funalytics, however they get through whatever funnel they're kind of going through, right?
[00:26:09] Liana: So I'm trying to think how can we get the best quality person to, I'm assuming, get on a demo or a phone call or something like that, so that your team can then take them to the next level. Um, a free trial may work, um, in my experience, again, I love lead gen, but what can sometimes happen with lead gen is not everybody has, a strong back end to take these leads and turn them into the type of quality people that they need to get on a call.
[00:26:38] Liana: So again, so I start to think, okay, what else can we do? Right? Like, yes, we can run some leads. That's great. That's always good. I would take a look at how your back end was to see, can we actually turn them into, or get them to believe what they need to believe to get to the next level? Um, and So then I would layer on top of that because again, I've seen this happen is that you do tend to get better quality people when you run a [00:27:00] purchase objective campaign.
[00:27:02] Liana: Um, so I do encourage people to come up with some type of micro offer so that we can run a purchase conversion campaign as well to try and get higher quality people into the funnel, whether it's like a 5, 25, whatever thing, um, because that in theory should get you a higher quality person and get you faster.
[00:27:19] Liana: Um, That's just what I would try at first. I have in the past done lead gen where it went to, it was just all straight leads, but the person was really, really, really good with their VSL, with their follow up, with their back end. So they were able to close quite a lot of the people that we sent through. Um, but that's, That's how my mind goes is I'm thinking more about how can I use what I know about the platform to use your budget most effectively, which I think would be to get quality people, the people has people who are as close to believing what they need to believe so that your team has an easier job when they talk to them to show them fun analytics and just, you know, [00:28:00] and then can close more of them.
[00:28:01] Mikael: Okay, awesome. Leanna, I mean, we, I could keep talking to you. Maybe we'll have to have another episode in the future. Uh, we're already way, way over our normal time here. So I appreciate you. Where can people learn more about you?
[00:28:15] Liana: Sure. Just, just go to ad skills. com. You can, you can go there. I am in that community every single day.
[00:28:22] Liana: So if you want to find me, I'm there. If you want to find me on social, just look for the lead gen queen. And that's where you can find me on social.
[00:28:28] Mikael: Awesome. And I'm also in the ad skills community. So, uh, thank you so much for being here and thank you so much for sharing all this awesome wisdom. Uh, we'll, we'll chat very soon.
[00:28:39] Liana: My pleasure.