From Heartache to Hope: A Journey Through IVF Advocacy
Rebecca: To the women who had their transfers canceled mid-treatment, keep fighting and then to the women who, just had their transfers canceled mid-treatment.
I would just say, keep fighting. I know that it probably feels like you don't have a voice, and you. May not have one right now because you're so upset you can't even speak. But I'm here, and I'm on the other side of it, and I will scream for you until this changes.
Welcome to the ladies who lead podcast. This is a community of women supporting women. This is a community of women supporting women. Tune in every other Thursday to hear from SK Vaughn as she catches up with ordinary ladies doing extraordinary things. We will cover topics like diversity and inclusion, gender pay gaps, thought leadership, and respect in the workplace. We want to celebrate with you and hear stories of success and hard lessons learned. Whether you are a lady who leads in the boardroom or a lady who leads in your community, this is the place for you. Let's do this.
SK Vaughn: I'm so excited to be joined here by Rebecca today.
How are you surviving and thriving this week following the Alabama Supreme Court controversy
Welcome to the podcast.
Rebecca: Hi.
Rebecca: Yeah, thank you for having me.
SK Vaughn: Every time we jump into the episode, we always kick it off with, how are you surviving and thriving? So while you're thinking through yours, I'll jump into mine. I've just been kind of surviving. I think we all have this week, when we were taking a look and really understanding what all the IVF talk was about, right? And the Alabama Supreme Court causing IVF in the state has been, really just kind of hard to process in general, because it's made me do the extra homework to say, okay, so, what does this truly mean, apart from all the other noise that you hear and all the other influences in your life? It's like, what does this truly mean from an education standpoint? Where do I sit in all of this, and how do I want to help respond? Or maybe not. And so I've been surviving just in this season, of seeing a lot of women not coming forward on this issue, and it's been a little bit discouraging and seeing that, because it's definitely affecting women's reproductive rights. And so I was a little bit surprised by that. I'm thriving because I've seen people like yourself, Rebecca, who have been one of the few women to step up, speak out, and speak your truth. And I think it's been a really beautiful thing to watch, and I've been so inspired by your message and just continual influence online and with the news outlets. And there's been other people who've come forward as well, and people have been trying to organize different ways to really get to our government and just share our message and, of hope and what we're wanting to see happen. So, at the same time, while I've been discouraged in surviving, I've also been thriving and seeing a lot of incredible people step up and share their journey and their heart for it. That's kind of how I'm surviving and thriving this week.
SK Vaughn: What about you?
Rebecca: Yeah, well, thank you so much for those kind words.
Rebecca: It's not how I exactly saw my
Rebecca: week starting on Monday, but here we are.
Rebecca: No, I would say survival is the motto for my life this week. I'm very tired, and I am not a crier at all, except when I'm exhausted. So if I cry today, it's because I am so, mentally and physically tired. So, yeah, I mean, barely surviving this week.
Rebecca: Thriving, though, and finding my voice.
Rebecca: I'm a privileged white woman.
Rebecca: There's not much that I really need to advocate for, for myself, because life.
Rebecca: Is kind of handed to people like me on a silver platter in some aspects. When all this news came down Monday.
Rebecca: I was upset like any other woman.
Rebecca: But also particularly as a member of the infertility community and as a fellow IVF warrior. But on Wednesday, when my doctor reached.
Rebecca: Out to me, asking me if I.
Rebecca: Would be willing to talk to some.
Rebecca: Media outlets, that was when I really started to kind of thrive in.
Rebecca: Finding my own voice and advocating for, people like me and families like mine.
Rebecca: It's been kind of cool to be a part of this because I think it's going to be big. So, yeah, I would say that's it. Absolutely.
SK Vaughn: Well, it's important work that you're doing. And I can identify as a white, privileged woman, that there's not much to advocate for. But I think when you look around, there's so much to advocate, maybe not for ourselves sometimes, that it can be a little bit overwhelming, but it's such a unique perspective when it's your own, when you're very much going through something. So thank you for sharing that.
SK Vaughn: And I did want to kind of.
SK Vaughn: Touch base just for those who might not have been educating themselves or reading into kind of where we're at to date with IVF and just kind of giving a little bit of a high level overview and feel free to join in and share what you think. Rebecca, too.
Alabama Supreme Court paused IVF in the state of Alabama last week
But in vitro fertilization is a medical procedure where doctors induce ovulation to remove eggs from a patient and fertilize them with sperm outside of the body. The resulting embryos can either be implanted into the patient's uterus in the hopes of getting pregnant, or the embryos can be frozen for future use. Some embryos are usually discarded in the process, which is an action that now violates Alabama's wrongful death of a minor act, a civil law dating back to 1872 that allows parents to sue over the death of a child. This now applies to all unborn children, regardless of their location and developmental stage. So all of this was pretty much brought on about a recent incident that took place in the mobile infirmary Medical center, where a patient wandered into the area and removed several embryos, dropping them on the floor, resulting in killing the embryos. Last week, the Alabama Supreme Court paused IVF in the state of Alabama, causing many parents to worry about their growing families. And is there the possibility that they might be facing criminal prosecution along with their doctors? Friday, the Alabama attorney general's office did release a statement explaining they have no intention to prosecute IVF families or providers. However, medical experts share concerns about the widespread effects this may have across the country, as well as creating a blueprint for groups and legislators who may wish to target fertility treatments. That's kind of my kind of quick synopsis of everything. But, Rebecca, feel free to chime in.
Rebecca: Gosh, it's such a layered topic of conversation. I mean, IVF in and of itself is so layered, and there's so much that goes into it.
Rebecca: It's something that takes at least a month.
Rebecca: It's hard to comment on it if.
Rebecca: You haven't walked through it. And I think that what's encouraging is.
Rebecca: There are so many people right now educating themselves on what IVF is, and in turn, they're learning more, and they're probably having a little more of a right to have an opinion.
Rebecca: In a way, I do have a little bit of an issue with men having an opinion. It's one thing for a woman, I don't know, a man. It's so hard for, especially knowing that.
Rebecca: So many men are making these decisions for us. But, yeah, this ruling is so bonkers. And quite honestly, I think that a lot of the judges who made this decision don't even understand IVF at its core.
Rebecca: So I think that we've got some bills that are about to be coming through. I'm heading down to the state house on Wednesday to talk to, lawmakers and representatives and all that kind of stuff.
Rebecca: And I think that we've been spending.
Rebecca: A lot of time the last few days just sort of educating people on.
Rebecca: How this has been affecting families in Alabama, how this is affecting people. Who are in the midst of IVF treatment.
Rebecca: And I think this week we're going to see a shift to more of a boots on the ground type of strategy. I think it's going to kind of start to shift a little bit.
SK Vaughn: I hope so.
SK Vaughn: And I think that's great work they are doing. And my hope is that people can educate themselves and then figure it out from there. I've got friends and family who've gone through it or who are currently going through it in a different state, and there's a lot of just fear because there could be a trickle-down effect from this. I think that that's something.
SK Vaughn: I think there will be, yeah, I think there will be a trickle-down effect.
Rebecca: We're kind of used to people kind of poking fun at us and sometimes things being a little backwards backwoods, if you will. I really hope that we don't play into that image that people have of us. I really hope that we can kind of take this opportunity to say, no, this was nine people who made this decision, or really seven, because two dissented. So this is seven people who made this decision, and everyone else is being level at it. I mean, the bills coming through are bipartisan, and I think that in and of itself says that the people of Alabama do not feel the same way the seven judges on that Supreme Court feel.
Rebecca: And hopefully other states are taking note.
Rebecca: And maybe we were going to do this, but the people of that state are standing up, so maybe we should hold off.
You've got two children from IVF
SK Vaughn: You've got two children from IVF, I think. Well, we'll just jump in. Rebecca, kind of tell us a little bit more about your family. You've got two children from IVF, I think.
SK Vaughn: Right.
SK Vaughn: And I'd love a bit more about them.
SK Vaughn: What are their names and ages?
Rebecca: Yeah, so we've got Jack, and Jack.
Rebecca: Is seven, he's in first grade. He's actually at a baseball practice right now, so he's out of the house. If not, he'd probably be peeking into the screen to say hey to you. and then we've got McLean. McLean is one. She is asleep in bed right now. Hopefully she doesn't wake up.
Rebecca: If she does, we always have Miss.
Rebecca: Rachel to entertain her while we chat. And McLean is actually named for Dr.
Rebecca: Mamie McLean, who you may have seen.
Rebecca: On the news in the last few days. She has really been on the front lines of this whole entire situation that's unfolding. And she was my fertility doctor. She is the doctor who helped us get McLean, and I am just so indebted to her. And respect her so much. So, yeah, she is one of our daughter's namesakes. Our daughter, McLean, is also a surrogate.
Rebecca: Baby, so she's named for our gestational.
Rebecca: Surrogate as well, who is so near and dear to our heart and who's.
obviously right now heartbroken over what's going on. She's just asking how she can help from Colorado and whatever she can do, she's watching this news unfold like so many people over the whole world.
Rebecca: Actually talked to a news team in New Zealand this morning, so, yeah, so everyone's worried about this and concerned about this, but to get back to your.
Question: What do you love most about each of your children
Rebecca: Yeah, I have a Jack and a McLean, and they are so precious and cute.
SK Vaughn: I love that. what do you feel like you love most about each one of your children? I feel like maybe a special story or characteristic that just makes you think, okay, they're the best.
Rebecca: Oh.
Rebecca: Ah, man.
Rebecca: Jack, he's all boy.
Rebecca: He's so funny to me.
Rebecca: He's all boy, but he loves me really fiercely and I'm kind of obsessed with him. It's such an interesting love having a.
Rebecca: Boy as a mom because I know.
Rebecca: That I'm only his favorite girl for so long. One day he's going to get older.
Rebecca: And meet someone else, and so right.
Rebecca: Now, it just feels really special. He loves spending one-on-one time.
Rebecca: With me and I love being able to give that to, it's just, it's.
Rebecca: Kind of fun to watch, like, run.
Rebecca: Around and be all boy, but know.
Rebecca: Want to come snuggle up with mama, and go on picnics with mama and things like that.
Rebecca: And then my daughter McLean, gosh, she's one. So she's just now starting to get a really great little personality and she's learning cute things and she'll clap for.
Rebecca: Herself and she does her little hands.
Rebecca: With the itsy bitsy spider and she loves her bun bun. Anytime I give her her bun bun, she kind of like, holds it and.
Rebecca: Pats it and it's interesting to see.
Rebecca: All the things she's learning.
Rebecca: She'll put a bottle up to her Bun bun's mouth and it's like all the lights are starting to turn on in her little brain and it's neat go do it again.
Rebecca: Jack's seven, so he was six when McLean was born.
Rebecca: We had gone a really long time without a baby in this house, so you kind of forget how magical it is when you can see them starting to learn things and really connect to
what's going on around them.
SK Vaughn: Yeah. What a special time.
The journey to infertility
SK Vaughn: So please share with us kind of your journey and infertility and kind of the hope that IVF, was able to provide for you and your growing family.
Rebecca: Yeah, so my husband and I started trying to get pregnant when we had been married for about a year.
Rebecca: I would say eight months into it, we went to my OBGYN and I.
Rebecca: Said, I just have a bad feeling it's not working.
Rebecca: I'm, quote unquote young.
Rebecca: I was 26 at the time, and I just kind of felt like, I think just to be on the safe side, let's just go run a few tests.
Rebecca: And so my doctor was really wonderful. He's like, yeah, we'll do a few things, make sure that everything's going well.
Rebecca: And we're working as it should work, and then we will check back after a few months.
Rebecca: So everything looked good. All of our tests came back normal.
Rebecca: I ended up actually having a,
Rebecca: laparoscopic procedure in April of 2015 to just make sure that I didn't have any endometriosis, which I did have endometriosis. So we got rid of it and.
Rebecca: We kind of thought that was going to be what the issue was.
Rebecca: So kept trying, did some IUIs wasn't working. Eventually, I moved to a fertility clinic.
Rebecca: In Birmingham and did my first round of IVF in January of 2016.
Rebecca: And I was really excited about it.
Rebecca: I think so many women, unfortunately, there's.
Rebecca: Such a stigma around infertility and infertility treatment.
Rebecca: I think that for so many women, having to turn to IVF feels like the last resort, and it feels like they're being told they're broken and their.
Rebecca: Body cannot do what it's meant to do.
Rebecca: Thankfully, just for my own mental health.
Rebecca: I didn't feel that way. I was really excited about IVF. I was like, well, this is what we need. We just need some help getting pregnant.
Rebecca: The other stuff isn't going to do it. This is going to do it.
Rebecca: And I was just really grateful for the opportunity to be able to afford it.
Rebecca: This was the doctor's office that I really liked and felt well taken care of and we did it, and I got pregnant. My very first transfer, and nine months.
Rebecca: Later, we had Jack, so as far as IVF goes, that's kind of like a dream that was
Quote unquote easy, and we definitely thought it would be easy when we wanted.
Rebecca: To have a second baby, or maybe even a third if that time came along.
Rebecca: So, yeah, that first time was everything we wanted it to be. We had Jack, and when he was two, we started saying, okay, maybe when he's three, let's transfer another embryo.
Rebecca: So Jack turned three in October of 2019, we kind of went through the Holidays, and then in fall of 2018.
Rebecca: When Jack turned two, we decided we would start trying when we got through the holidays.
Rebecca: So January 2019, we, transferred our first frozen embryo.
Rebecca: Jack was a fresh transfer. We froze six embryos.
Rebecca: So we transferred the first embryo, and it didn't work.
Rebecca: The next month, we transferred the second embryo, and it didn't work.
Rebecca: We took a break, and then in.
Rebecca: April of 2019, we transferred, our.
Rebecca: Third frozen embryo, and I got pregnant. And that was for me.
Rebecca: My husband and I were like, well, this is it.
Rebecca: We'll get our baby around Christmas, and that's that. And when I was eight-ish weeks.
Rebecca: Pregnant, I went in for my second.
Rebecca: Ultrasound, and there was no heartbeat anymore.
Rebecca: The week before, there was, and this.
Rebecca: Time, there was no heartbeat. So we took some time off.
Rebecca: I had to have a DNC.
Rebecca: Then we took some time off, and.
Rebecca: Then in July of 2019, we transferred again.
Rebecca: I got pregnant again. I would say this pregnancy's loss was one of the toughest I had.
Rebecca: I went into an ultrasound, and the baby had a heartbeat.
Rebecca: And we'll see you in a week.
Rebecca: And then we came back a week.
Rebecca: Later, and they said, your baby's heart rate has slowed down, and your baby's going to die.
Rebecca: That was probably a Monday or a Tuesday.
Rebecca: When I was pulling out of the
Rebecca: Doctor's office, my doctor called me on.
Rebecca: The phone, and she said, I've scheduled.
Rebecca: The or for you for Thursday for your DNC. And I said, but the baby's not even gone yet. And she said, it'll be gone by Thursday. Side note, this is not Dr. McClain.
Rebecca: This is a different doctor. So I said, okay. So I told my husband, I said.
Rebecca: Well, there's no chance.
Rebecca: They've already booked me the like, clearly.
Rebecca: They have no hope of this baby living.
Rebecca: So we went in Wednesday to check the baby was still alive and the.
Rebecca: Heart rate had gotten slower.
Rebecca: So they said, okay, come back in.
Rebecca: The morning at, like, 06:00 a.m.
Rebecca: The baby will be gone.
Rebecca: You can get your car and drive to Birmingham for your DNC.
Rebecca: And I went back in we went through two rounds of IVF and lost one embryo
Rebecca: His or her heart rate had decelerated.
Rebecca: But was still beating.
Rebecca: So they said, okay, come back tomorrow.
Rebecca: Friday, and we'll do this whole thing over again.
Rebecca: So I went in Friday morning.
Rebecca: Once again, baby's heart still beating. It's slower, and at this point, it's arrhythmic.
Rebecca: And they were like, okay, we're so sorry. You're just going to have to go home for the weekend and come back on Monday.
Rebecca: On Monday, we went in, and the baby had passed away over the weekend.
Rebecca: That was a really tough one to.
Rebecca: Know that the baby was slowly dying inside of me. We went on to transfer the remaining.
Rebecca: Embryos from that round of IVF and got pregnant and lost them.
Rebecca: and then in 2020, I went.
Rebecca: To Dr. McClain, a new doctor, and a new doctor's office, and just had, listen, I need a new, fresh set.
Rebecca: Of eyes on my case. I want to marry go round.
Rebecca: We're not changing anything. We're just doing transfers every month with the same protocol and the same meds.
Rebecca: Dr. McClain really shook things up.
Rebecca: We went through two rounds of IVF for Dr. McClain, got pregnant each transfer. But I would end up either having a chemical pregnancy or we would get to a heart rate point, and then, like, a week later, the baby would pass away.
Rebecca: So eventually, we had to turn to.
Rebecca: Surrogacy, and that was also a really hard conversation I've ever had to have with a doctor. That conversation took place, and we did.
Rebecca: Another transfer and then another round of IVF, and then eventually we found our surrogate and got so lucky in the way of which we found her.
Rebecca: It was a total God thing. And she got pregnant, and we had.
Rebecca: McClain in January of 2023, and now.
Rebecca: We have a remaining embryo. Wow.
Rebecca: Just a really heartfelt story with all different kind of turns. And I know it has had to have been really difficult in that stretch. And also just having a child inside of you that's slowly dying. I can't imagine the pain and the loss that must feel. How did you during that time, find hope and get through some of the harder times in those conversations.
Rebecca: Honestly, my faith was really huge, and there were some ebbs and flows with it, for sure. There were some really dark moments with my faith, and then there were some.
Rebecca: Really wonderful moments with my faith where.
Rebecca: I really grew in it.
Rebecca: I, led a Bible study for.
Rebecca: A couple of years, which was really.
Rebecca: Wonderful just to be surrounded by other women who were going through the things.
Rebecca: I was going through a lot.
Rebecca: Some people can kind of fall apart in ways, and my marriage got stronger in some senses. And my husband really stepped up to the plate and supported me by really.
Rebecca: Taking over things under our roof with our son and with household duties. I spent so much time just in the bed being depressed and sad, and.
Rebecca: He really stepped up and never asked.
Rebecca: Me to buck up and come on, it's going to be okay.
Rebecca: He always just let me lay in.
Rebecca: My emotions and feelings and let me process how I needed to and just.
Rebecca: Sort of did dad duties and never complained about it.
Rebecca: That was really special just to be surrounded by so much support.
Women are speaking out about embryo freezing after the overturn of Roe v. Wade
Rebecca: People say it takes a village to raise a child, but it really takes
Rebecca: a village to lose a child, too.
Rebecca: And also going into it, it's very different to lose a pregnancy with a baby with a heart rate like a Heartbeat and to have a chemical pregnancy or to have an embryo transfer that.
Rebecca: Doesn't even result in pregnancy, right.
Rebecca: To me, those were very different range.
Rebecca: From, like, oh, we have to do this again. It's still not over. When I would have a transfer that did not result in a positive pregnancy test, I never felt like I was having a miscarriage or a chemical that.
Rebecca: Didn't feel like that to me.
Rebecca: It just felt like, okay, well, that didn't work, and now we have to try again.
Rebecca: Whereas when I had a miscarriage, when.
Rebecca: I got to see a baby's heart beating on a screen, that felt very.
Rebecca: Much like a deep, deep loss. So it kind of goes back to.
Rebecca: This whole embryo thing.
Rebecca: Like, an embryo is not a baby.
Rebecca: It's just not. And I heard someone say it really.
Rebecca: Well, an embryo is not a baby. And we had to learn that in a really hard way, multiple times over again.
SK Vaughn: And why do you feel like that distinction is so important for you personally, but as well as for others to kind of have that distinction?
Rebecca: Well, you know, aside from just reproductive rights and infertility treatment, I never really found myself having to have this conversation. I think we've really consumed ourselves with having this whole entire pro choice, pro life conversation over the last few years, especially since the overturn of Roe v.
Rebecca: Wade, and that's been more of like an abortion conversation.
Rebecca: Right.
Rebecca: I've really never had to defend my right to be able to choose what.
Rebecca: I want to choose to do with my own embryo. So this is like a new animal, right? No one really knows what it means. It's really unprecedented. But now that's where this conversation has gone, which a lot of people actually predicted with the overturn of Roe v. Wade. They said, well, they'll come for IVF next. And that's exactly what has happened.
Rebecca: But I think, too, what we're learning is that people are standing up and saying, no, absolutely not. No infertility.
Rebecca: IVF, is such an isolating, lonely thing.
Rebecca: And like I said, there's so much.
Rebecca: Of a stigma around it.
Rebecca: Women don't talk about it.
Rebecca: And I'm hoping that women who have always kept their mouths shut about it, whether that be because they're private or.
Rebecca: There might be health reasons, but they don't.
Rebecca: Want to share why they are doing it? I hope that those women have felt more supported in the last week because so many people have come out and
Rebecca: said, we're not going to stand for this.
Rebecca: I, in some ways, have felt more.
Rebecca: Supported than I ever have before, too. That's great to hear.
SK Vaughn: And I love this idea of more women stepping forward and really using their voice, because I feel like it's something that you very much have to go through to truly comprehend and have that level of empathy. But at the same time, I'm also thinking about future families and those who might want to freeze their eggs as they continue to get older with future family planning. Like, I don't have kids yet, but I'm 30 this year. That's a scary reality that maybe some women aren't facing today, but say, in the next year or two or however many years, you still want to have the right, the choice to, continue your family planning.
Rebecca: Yeah, and it's so interesting because I think
Rebecca: that a lot of people think, oh, you can't get pregnant. You're doing IVF, or you're doing IVF because you're invertal and you can't get pregnant. There's other reasons to do IVF than that. It could be that you had,
Rebecca: There's women who've had cancer in their twenty s and they say, okay, you've.
Rebecca: Got to freeze your eggs because you won't have a child otherwise because you're about to go through all this radiation.
Rebecca: And all this treatment that's going to.
Rebecca: Prevent you from using your eggs later down the road. So you've got to do this first. It might be that I have a sweet friend who, she and her husband.
Rebecca: Are both genetic carriers for this really horrible disease that they had no clue they were carriers for.
Rebecca: And their son now has it. So they said, well, we want to have another baby, but we don't want another baby to suffer the way our son's going to suffer. So we're going to do IVF. And it took multiple rounds of IVF for them to finally get an embryo.
Rebecca: That did not carry this genetic disease. There's just so many things that go into it.
Rebecca: I think that sometimes there's sort of this, like, oh, celebrity. Like, they just want to choose their baby and do all this.
Rebecca: It's not that. And ultimately, at the end of the.
Rebecca: Day, it's a decision that you make with your partner and your doctor and the government shouldn't be involved in it.
Rebecca: In any way, shape, or form.
SK Vaughn: 100%. I couldn't agree more.
Alabama Supreme Court ruling on abortion raises questions about reproductive rights for women
SK Vaughn: So when you heard about the recent ruling by the Alabama Supreme Court, what was your initial reaction? Do you remember hearing the news? That's a lot to process. I'm just imagining what you must have been feeling.
Rebecca: I don't know if it's different for
Rebecca: you down in Mobile, but up here,
Rebecca: in Montgomery, I had no clue this was even going on. I want to say a few years ago, I might have read a news article about the couple having their embryos.
Rebecca: Destroyed at that mobile clinic.
Rebecca: I feel like it feels slightly familiar, and it would, because I would have been going through IVF at the same time. And I'm sure that I was like.
Rebecca: Oh, my gosh, this is crazy.
Rebecca: How could anyone ever have access to a cryoprotectant tank?
Rebecca: How did they get back there?
Rebecca: I mean, I'm sure I was like.
Rebecca: I have so many questions, but I.
Rebecca: Never realized there was litigation happening in the background. I never realized there was something going.
Rebecca: To the Alabama Supreme Court until the Ruling came down Monday. I was sitting at my kitchen table doing some work. I work from home. And so I think I just gotten off a Zoom call, and a friend of mine sent me something on Instagram about it. I was like, what is this? And I kind of started to look into it harder. I think I kind of did, like, a laugh, something kind of like that. Because I remember thinking, like, this has.
Rebecca: Like, a man's name written all over it. Only a man would think, I don't know.
It was kind of, like, comically ridiculous in that one moment.
Rebecca: And then it was like, wait, hold on, hold on. What does this even mean?
Rebecca: What is this even going to mean? So kind of started to look into it a little more, and then my husband got home from work, and I was like, have you been reading the news?
Rebecca: Have you seen all this stuff? And he was like, yeah.
Rebecca: I was like, what does this even mean for us?
Rebecca: What does this mean for our embryo?
Rebecca: What happens now?
Rebecca: And he was like, I don't know.
Rebecca: But I'm claiming it as a dependent on our taxes since apparently it's a child. And it was very confusing. We were just confused on Monday, and.
Rebecca: Then when IVF clinic started to shut down, it was like.
Rebecca: It went from confusion to just anger.
Rebecca: Just full on anger that families are having to stop treatment. I mean, it should have never gotten.
Rebecca: To this point ever. I couldn't agree more.
Rebecca: I think it's such a shock that it would get to this point. I'm like, what year are we in?
Rebecca: You know what I mean?
SK Vaughn: I hate to think that we're going backwards in history on, women's reproductive rights in the year 2024, when we have so many women who are highly educated, who are kicking ass, doing big things as well as men, as well as other people. Why is this even up for discussion? You know what I mean? That's the big question. The big kicker is, yes, I think you can always make processes it better, and modern science and medicine is going to continue to only get better, but why stop it now? Why halt the progress? And especially while people are very much going through it, and, it just doesn't make any sense to me to.
Rebecca: You know Alabama is a pro family
Rebecca: State, and, nothing about this ruling is pro family. No one values life more than a woman or a family going through the midst of IVF and infertility.
SK Vaughn: and so it just makes no sense at all.
So what advice do you have for other women who are struggling to conceive
SK Vaughn: So what advice do you have for other women who are struggling to conceive? What would you tell them right now in that season?
Rebecca: I would say it's so hard, it's so lonely, it's so isolating.
Rebecca: You've got to find a group of women, whether it be just a support.
Rebecca: Group or it is a Bible study, if you're, Christian and that is.
Rebecca: Something that you enjoy or just a
Rebecca: friend to confide in, I think that
Rebecca: these things, to be able to talk.
SK Vaughn: Freely and to kind of unload what you're feeling is so important.
Rebecca: And I think to be able to have someone else understand that as well because they're going through it is so important. It's hard, right? Because so many women don't want to share.
Rebecca: It can feel so, messy to.
Rebecca: share, and it can feel so,
Rebecca: Like an admittance that you don't work
Rebecca: the way you should. Your body's not working the way you should, and it should. And that is so sad to me because we're just not made that way. We're made for community.
Rebecca: We're made, to be supporters of
Rebecca: The people around us and to be supported, to be held up when we can't.
Rebecca: And it's so important.
Rebecca: And I would say, find those people that are around you. You don't have to post on social media about it if you don't want to. You don't have to stand in front.
Rebecca: of your Sunday school class and share.
Rebecca: This hard thing and ask for prayer. But if you just turn to one person around you and say, I'm really struggling with this, and it's really hard.
Rebecca: It will come back to help you.
Rebecca: It really will. You've got to find a community of women who can support you. And I would say find a doctor that you really love. If you're there yet, some women might not be to that point yet, but.
Rebecca: If you are a point, think finding
Rebecca: a doctor who you really love and
Rebecca: who you really trust is really important.
Rebecca: And then to the women who, just had their transfers canceled mid treatment.
Rebecca: I would just say, keep fighting. I know that it probably feels like you don't have a voice and you.
Rebecca: May not have one right now because
Rebecca: You're so upset you can't even speak.
Rebecca: But I'm here and I'm on the
Rebecca: other side of it and I will scream for you until this changes.
SK Vaughn: Thank you.
SK Vaughn: What are the next steps our listeners can take to help women's reproductive rights right now?
Rebecca: There are a few things you can do, especially if you're in the state of Alabama. You can, one Wednesday there's going to be advocate to protect ivf day down at the state house. That is going to be huge, I think.
Rebecca: So we're going to meet down there.
Rebecca: Around like 9:00 in the morning. We're going to talk, we're going to do things. We're going to try to go sit in on some of these committee hearings.
Rebecca: That's going to be super important if you're in the Tricounty area specifically. I know it's hard, middle of the workday for people to get here, but if you're near here, it would be so hugely appreciated. Just more support. We would love to have a big group for that.
Rebecca: There's also the, doctors.
Rebecca: We could support our doctors for the fertility pack.
Rebecca: So there's different ways that you can.
Rebecca: Go in and do that online, which I can send all of this to you to post. If you go onto ASRM's website, there.
Rebecca: Will be ways you can help with that to support the access to the Family Building act. Donations would be great, but I would say specifically right now that our main task, it's going to be Wednesday. It's going to be getting these bills passed. So we already have some opposition coming.
Rebecca: In from a couple of groups who are not supporting this bill. So I think that the more people who can come out and just sort of advocate for themselves or advocate for their family members, that would be super important.
Rebecca: I think one thing that we need to mention is that infertility affects one in eight women, and there are nine judges who sit on the album Supreme Court. So statistics tell me that at least one of them has been directly affected by infertility or their wife has. I think we have, like, what, two.
Women sit on that court and the rest are men.
But we know that at least one of those couples has been affected by infertility.
It also tells us that one in four women will experience a miscarriage.
So that tells me that at least two of them or their wives have a miscarriage. I think what's going to be important is getting in front of these lawmakers and reminding them that the Alabama Supreme Court may want to ignore the people in their homes or in their lives who've experienced infertility and miscarriage, but we're not going to let those lawmakers ignore us. So we're going to sit here and we're going to scream and we're going to talk to every news outlet we can and do anything we can until this has changed. Yes.
SK Vaughn: And if you'll send me the links, we'll be sure to add them in our show notes so our listeners can take action and also understand what's coming down in the next week. I would love to know, how can our listeners find you online?
SK Vaughn: What's your shameless plug?
Rebecca: Yeah, my instagram handle is rebas. Matthews with one t. I do have a private account, so you got to ask to follow me.
Rebecca: I've got little babies I want to protect.
Rebecca: And then I do have a LinkedIn page, and it's just Rebecca Mathews with one t in Mathews.
Rebecca: So. Yeah, perfect.
SK Vaughn: Well, thank you so much, Rebecca. Thank you for sharing your story. Your truth and your heart behind IVF and the importance of protecting that in the state of Alabama. It's a lot to process, but it's people like you who are stepping forward, women like you who are stepping forward paving a way for other women.
SK Vaughn: So thank you.
Rebecca: Yeah, I really hope so. I hope that, more women will feel empowered to come forward and share their story and advocate for themselves and for the women who feel like they can't right now. I mean, I get it and my heart goes out to you and I will step into that gap and do it for you. And thank you for giving me this platform to share.
SK Vaughn: Thank you for listening to another episode of the ladies who lead podcast. Looking for another way to engage with the ladies who lead podcast? Check out our instagram in our show notes at the ladies who lead. And don't forget to check out our website www.delaysyoulead.com. Until next time, I'm SK Vaughn.