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Confessions of a Shop Owner is hosted by Mike Allen, a third-generation shop owner, perpetual pot-stirrer, and brutally honest opinion sharer. In this weekly podcast, Mike shares his missteps so you don’t have to repeat them. Along the way, he chats with other industry personalities who’ve messed up, too, pulling back the curtain on the realities of running an independent auto repair shop. But this podcast isn’t just about Mike’s journey. It’s about confronting the divisive and questionable tactics many shop owners and managers use. Mike is here to stir the pot and address the painful truths while offering a way forward. Together, we’ll tackle the frustrations, shake things up, and help create a better future for the auto repair industry.
Andrew Fischer [00:00:00]:
We're technicians, and we think back of the house is the hardest thing. I'm sorry, man. I still think being a service consultant, service advisor, service writer, whatever you want to call them, that is still hands down the hardest job in the shop.
Bryan Pollock [00:00:12]:
I don't want the job.
Andrew Fischer [00:00:13]:
We can fix cars.
Bryan Pollock [00:00:14]:
When. When that customer comes in our shop and I'm in the office and they're like. They're starting to say the stupid things.
Andrew Fischer [00:00:19]:
I can't do it.
Bryan Pollock [00:00:19]:
I've learned. I turn around and walk out.
Andrew Fischer [00:00:21]:
I do the same thing.
Bryan Pollock [00:00:22]:
Because I'll be like, I can't do their job.
Andrew Fischer [00:00:24]:
The following is a special edition of the show. Don't worry. Today's episode still features doofuses talking about the aftermarket. This one just doesn't include my dad. So it's probably better than normal. The stuff said on this show does not necessarily represent the views or opinions of our peers, our sponsors, or any other associations we may have. Chances are there may be some spicy language in this show, so if you're sensitive to that, you should probably move along. Without further ado, here's your special.
Andrew Fischer [00:00:55]:
Brian Pollack with Confessions of a Shop Owner, presented by techmetric. The best thing to happen to the world of personal transportation since the advent of internal combustion engines.
Bryan Pollock [00:01:08]:
We're recording now. Like, we're just. We're ready to go. Braxton will probably literally put this in there. I've seen him in action.
Andrew Fischer [00:01:16]:
So now we gotta behave.
Bryan Pollock [00:01:17]:
Okay. So now we gotta behave. So how things been going for you?
Andrew Fischer [00:01:22]:
I'm here, dude.
Bryan Pollock [00:01:23]:
You're here.
Andrew Fischer [00:01:24]:
I'm here, man.
Bryan Pollock [00:01:25]:
You're filling in. You're filling in this afternoon.
Andrew Fischer [00:01:27]:
Filling in. We had an instructor not show up, so gonna was only supposed to instruct tomorrow and Saturday, and now we're doing a evening session today, so pulling it off last second try to kind of
Bryan Pollock [00:01:41]:
off the top of my head is not one of the ones I've had to do yet. That's a little tricky.
Andrew Fischer [00:01:45]:
It's. It's. You know, the good part is you gotta. We got a catalog. You know, it's the only. Only thing I got going for me is I got a catalog and I could pull something.
Bryan Pollock [00:01:52]:
You know, I should probably introduce you. Andrew Fisher.
Andrew Fischer [00:01:55]:
Thank you.
Bryan Pollock [00:01:56]:
Facts, facts. Tech fix.
Andrew Fischer [00:01:58]:
Tech fix. World pack.
Bryan Pollock [00:02:00]:
World pack.
Andrew Fischer [00:02:00]:
CarQuest.
Bryan Pollock [00:02:01]:
CarQuest.
Andrew Fischer [00:02:02]:
I think that's it.
Bryan Pollock [00:02:03]:
Is there anybody you don't work for? A whole bunch.
Andrew Fischer [00:02:06]:
Obviously I'll behave, but yeah, I mean, you know, whatever it takes to get as much as we can out there. So, you know, it's maybe oversaturation to an extent. But you know, it's what I do for Tech Fix. I don't do the same for World Pack.
Bryan Pollock [00:02:23]:
Sure.
Andrew Fischer [00:02:23]:
What we do for worldpack, I don't do the same for carquest. You know, you try to, you hit different technician levels through the different companies. So I'm just really blessed, man. I, I, I can't say any better.
Bryan Pollock [00:02:34]:
And you're kind of running a shop too. Leadership. Major leadership position. Like. Yeah, I do in there at the shop.
Andrew Fischer [00:02:40]:
Yeah. Day to day operations. Still in the shop. Still in the front of the house. You know I do a lot of leadership coaching with, with Tech Fix and Shop Fix. So you know, I feel like a fraud most days because as you know, we never have it together. So you know, you're riding highs and you're riding de lows. So you know, it's, it's, it's humbling.
Bryan Pollock [00:03:03]:
Humbling, that's probably the best word for it. Right. You know, the wide range of training that you're doing now. You know, one of the major complaints we hear from shop owners, actually we were just having a conversation in here when you came in and right before you came in there's somebody talking about how it's, it's very difficult. The training end of this industry is very difficult right now. It's difficult on the trainers. You like me, are away from our families.
Andrew Fischer [00:03:33]:
Yep.
Bryan Pollock [00:03:33]:
Doing this thing. You way more than me. I'm, I'm just, you know, I'm just, I'm just having a good time. You're like in it. How many, how many weeks are you traveling? I, all of them.
Andrew Fischer [00:03:43]:
It seems that way. So last year I was away from the shop a total of, I think it was 65, 67 days. Oh my God. That doesn't count weekends because most of these fall on the weekends. I mean it was, it was a lot of time away.
Bryan Pollock [00:03:58]:
That's tough. And then one of the other thing that we talked about is specifically the evening type training.
Andrew Fischer [00:04:04]:
Correct.
Bryan Pollock [00:04:04]:
That's out there is like, it's freaking tough. I mean I just had a conversation, we just brought, and I won't, I won't name names. We just brought guys to an AC class and whenever I can I try to go in with them. I want to see what's being taught. And the, the name of the class was Modern Modern Climate Control Systems, I think. Okay. And it wasn't anybody you're associated with. And we sat in there and I'll tell you what, man is tricky.
Bryan Pollock [00:04:32]:
Our shop, our shop is Hourly and we, we pay our guys to go to training. So you're at a point where these guys are, these are, these are essentially overtime hours. These are time and a half pay hours because we're in New York State and that's. It's, it's not an option to pay them straight time. You know, I think different states maybe have different rules where you could pay guys training hours straight time or, or whatever. Yeah, but, but we don't have the option. So we're paying time and a half and we went in there and this guy spends. I timed it on my watch because I was, I was on a mission.
Bryan Pollock [00:05:02]:
I wasn't there to learn about modern AC systems. I was there to see vetting. What am I paying for?
Andrew Fischer [00:05:06]:
You got to vet it.
Bryan Pollock [00:05:08]:
28 minutes on R12.
Andrew Fischer [00:05:10]:
When was the last time you seen R12 in your shop?
Bryan Pollock [00:05:13]:
The. All the. Every car, every car that has R12 in it has been rotted up to the door handles and in the junkyard since 2010.
Andrew Fischer [00:05:21]:
Yeah, same. I mean we're very similar situation, very
Bryan Pollock [00:05:23]:
similar climate, very similar salt situation with you and I is probably maybe a little bit more by me because. But anyways, very similar. Right. They've been gone 28 minutes on that. And I'm not gonna get super technical because this is the confessions of the shop owner and not super technical podcast. But as you know, newer AC systems, heat pump, solenoid valves, blah blah blah, made more changes in the last eight years than they did in the previous 50s. Right. In the previous 50 years.
Bryan Pollock [00:05:49]:
More has changed in the last eight. In my opinion, the stuff that I was interested in, the teaching of the heat pumps and the solenoid valves and all this stuff. The class ends at 9:30. Starts teaching on it at 9:27.
Andrew Fischer [00:06:03]:
Well, they probably didn't know it either. That's, you know, and I'm not bashing. But you, you know, we see it and that's.
Bryan Pollock [00:06:11]:
I love it when people say things that are correct, even if it's not.
Andrew Fischer [00:06:15]:
Well, it's the reality. Right. And we, we have to be real. Like as a technical trainer again, I know this is shop owners and management, but as a technical trainer we have to, we have to be real with ourselves too.
Bryan Pollock [00:06:28]:
Right.
Andrew Fischer [00:06:28]:
Like there. I'm not going to go in and teach an alignment angles class. Right. No, that's not my specialty area.
Bryan Pollock [00:06:34]:
Absolutely.
Andrew Fischer [00:06:35]:
And I would, it would be a fallacy and it would be a fraud for me to do. So could, could I do it? Yes. Would it be what the attendees wanted? Absolutely. Not, no. And that's part of the problem. I think it's a big part of the problem.
Bryan Pollock [00:06:51]:
It's a huge. And I understand because the other thing that ties into this is maybe in this class that I had the guys at, you know, maybe this isn't a good example, but you go to a lot of classes and they spend a lot of time on fundamentals and everybody's always like, oh, they just, you know, I'm not taking a fundamental class, blah blah, blah, blah, blah. And then it's like you start working with these guys, you have them in your shop and you're seeing comebacks, you're seeing this, you're seeing that and you're like, this is the same guy that doesn't think he needs to take the fundamentals class. And here we are, you're coming to me, we've got this problem on this vehicle. You've not checked the oil for a VVT problem. You've not checked the oil, you've not checked the battery. Like. Like, dude, like there's a lot of mystery problems and actual problems that are oil level and condition.
Andrew Fischer [00:07:44]:
Absolutely.
Bryan Pollock [00:07:44]:
And battery condition.
Andrew Fischer [00:07:45]:
But that falls on us as management and owners because here's where the problem comes in. Right. We let them select the classes they want to go to.
Bryan Pollock [00:07:53]:
Yes.
Andrew Fischer [00:07:54]:
And the reality is, in my opinion, you know, the average technician, the first, we're going to call it 10 years.
Bryan Pollock [00:08:01]:
Okay.
Andrew Fischer [00:08:01]:
Probably shouldn't have that ability. I think the average technician, the management knows management ownership, shop foreman, however your shop structured, they know where that technician is struggling and that's where they need to be the biggest issue is.
Bryan Pollock [00:08:17]:
And they need to decide.
Andrew Fischer [00:08:18]:
Absolutely. The other issue run into is we. I'm going to coin Matt Fonzlow here. We over romanticize the diagnostic side so much and let's be real, man, that's the problem, right. That. That is the problem. Because not everybody is built to be diagnostic technicians.
Bryan Pollock [00:08:36]:
100% agree.
Andrew Fischer [00:08:38]:
And until we realize that. And does that mean that the suspension guys less, more than the diagnostician. I don't think so.
Bryan Pollock [00:08:48]:
I think you make a good point. I think we see it all the time. We really do. We see if you go to the average shop out there and you watch guys put wheels on cars, how many shops do you think, when you go to them, do you think the guys are cleaning the wheel hubs and torquing the wheels?
Andrew Fischer [00:09:07]:
I mean I've. Outside of ours, I have never seen that happen in a shop outside of ours. Now again, I don't get.
Bryan Pollock [00:09:13]:
We're focused on. We're really focused on evap diagnostics, oscilloscopes, this, that and the other thing. And we'll have Timmy the technician will put brakes and rotors on the front and rear vehicle and it'll come back Paul Satan. And we'll call the parts store up and be like, hey, these freaking Wardinskis you sold me are hot garbage. This thing's freaking shaking to me. And then I get a hold of the vehicle and we don't have. We're big time on cleaning wheels. These are problems we've had in the past, which is why we're like what we are now.
Andrew Fischer [00:09:42]:
Exact same thing.
Bryan Pollock [00:09:43]:
I'll pull the wheels off. And the fricking hub was so dirty when he railed this thing on there with impact gun. I have to take a hammer to get the wheel off the car. We just put the wheel on which people in the South. People in the South. You're not going to understand this part.
Andrew Fischer [00:09:55]:
They are spoiled. Okay?
Bryan Pollock [00:09:58]:
But here we are. We're lacking fundamentals, but Timmy the technician's gonna go to the scope class and he's gonna go figure out how to find the moon phase with a lab scope. That applies to 0.2% of the cars that ever come through the door anyways. But Timmy can't get his brake jobs done to come back not squeaking. Yeah, I mean, it's a huge ego issue.
Andrew Fischer [00:10:20]:
Ego and ignorance is the biggest issue in my personal opinion. You know, I think the other issue you run into to upset people, the Alphabet soup BS that we throw around from the technical. I mean, we were just talking about that before when I'm live here, you know. But the, the Alphabet soup. I'm sorry, their, their ABC level is so broken in the idea, standardization and the idea that we keep throwing this around. I mean, I, I say this in classes all the time. I am a C, maybe even a D level tire technician. I'm going to break some stuff, dude.
Andrew Fischer [00:10:54]:
Like, I'm just going to be honest with you. I might be A, upper level C, low level B diagnostic tech. So where does that make C level tech? I, I just, I, I don't believe in it. I can't subscribe to it. Not in today's world. The days of bumper to bumper that every technician can get through. Everything is done and it's been done.
Bryan Pollock [00:11:14]:
How many times in these groups have I responded to people? What do you mean by a tech? And they're like a guy that I can give everything. And I go, here's the Deal. I don't know everything. I know a lot of really smart people. I haven't met a guy you can give everything. No, I haven't met a guy that is going to. Except for Scott Manna. I haven't met a guy that was for.
Bryan Pollock [00:11:35]:
That was for Fonzel. I haven't met a guy that you're going to give a European immobilizer problem to. And then he's going to rebuild a GM 10 speed and then he's going to put injectors in and whatever. He's going to correctly diagnose some diesel injectors, not just sling them in there, right. And then do whatever else. Like, like it's, it's not going to happen. It's not a person, guys. The person doesn't exist anymore.
Andrew Fischer [00:11:58]:
And it hasn't in a long time. Now, some of us, I mean, I'm going to be straight up with you, dude. My ego. For the first 15 years of my
Bryan Pollock [00:12:05]:
career, you thought you were the shit.
Andrew Fischer [00:12:06]:
I thought I was.
Bryan Pollock [00:12:07]:
You were fixing some stuff. But I was getting real lucky.
Andrew Fischer [00:12:09]:
I got real lucky. I was a dealer guy. I was rebuilding transmissions, doing drivability by seeing pattern failures, Right. Don't get me wrong, I had some, quite a bit of independent experience too. But I got, I got cocky. And then reality hit, you know, reality hit really bad, really fast. And that's when I realized, like, I gotta figure out a lane to stay in. And what am I the best at? I'm not a high producing guy.
Andrew Fischer [00:12:34]:
I've just never been a high production technician. I could probably do 85 to 100% sure in most weeks.
Bryan Pollock [00:12:42]:
Sure.
Andrew Fischer [00:12:42]:
But that's not, you know, we preach it or we hear it preached across the board. You know, your text should be 120 effective, blah, blah, blah, blah, BS and
Bryan Pollock [00:12:52]:
it's tough to hit.
Andrew Fischer [00:12:53]:
And the guys that tell you this, I see this all the time in certain groups. Oh, I've got a technician, it's 180 effective, blah blah blah. That's BS because I'll tell you what, you and I take those phone calls from those guys. So, you know, we got to stop
Bryan Pollock [00:13:06]:
lying to our phone calls. And then the other, the other side of it is, you know, does, you know, does there, do they. Did they decide to run a labor multiplier? Right? There's a lot of shop. Yeah, sure, yeah, right. If you run a 1.5 labor multiplier, yeah, sure. The guy maybe turn 80 hours a week, I guess. I don't know. But straight book time and everything Done.
Bryan Pollock [00:13:26]:
Right. And then like, like I'd really like to see, I'd like to see the numbers and then I'd like to see all the comebacks and how that affects the supposed efficiency because I've, we've dealt with this at the shop all, all the time. I mean guys that are super fast but man, they, they get that car in and they get it out and it's like a boomerang that's like back in the bay, you know. You know, luckily for us we have pretty robust QC process. It doesn't same.
Andrew Fischer [00:13:48]:
I was just going to add that, you know and like on a 30%, you're like oh, instantly. And you know, we run a 30 labor bump in our shop. But QC and honestly, yes, we are a flat rate shop but I expect my guys take the, take the labor bump out of the equation. I do ask them to be about 80% efficient.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:10]:
Sure.
Andrew Fischer [00:14:10]:
But I specialize them.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:12]:
Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:14:13]:
So I've got a Euro guy.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:15]:
We, we kind of do that too. Like I got a guy that does heavy line repair pretty well. I'm typically going to give him the heavy line.
Andrew Fischer [00:14:22]:
Absolutely.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:23]:
I got a guy, I got a guy that welds really well, really good at it. All the exhaust repair goes to Cole. Cole does a good job at it.
Andrew Fischer [00:14:31]:
You don't want me welding. Yeah, I could promise you that.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:33]:
Well, he can weld and he's just, he can like see it. And he's young. He's young. He doesn't have 20 years experience. I mean he's only five years experience but he can look at stuff. And he's driven enough boxes in his life where he can look at something. And I mean like we just give. He's got a little red toolbox over there full of all these little exhaust connectors.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:50]:
This, that and the other thing, he'd be like, oh yeah, I'll just take that out, do this. I need a flex pipe this long.
Andrew Fischer [00:14:55]:
Blah, blah, blah, blah blah.
Bryan Pollock [00:14:55]:
We'll fix it. Right.
Andrew Fischer [00:14:58]:
Good for him. I can't do that.
Bryan Pollock [00:15:00]:
He doesn't. I got, you know, there's other guys I cannot give that job to. It will not get done.
Andrew Fischer [00:15:06]:
Yeah, and there's, and that's okay. It's okay. But again, you know, we, we talk about it, we hear it in the industry. I want a guy that can diagnose and that's going to produce, you know, 50, 60 hours a week in a 40 hour work week. Man, that is, that is such a pipe dream. Those guys don't really exist.
Bryan Pollock [00:15:21]:
I think the other thing, too, is the. The culture in the industry. The front counters are not a lot of that I do. One thing that I do okay. Ish. Is efficiently get through dye stuff in most of it. Getting most of it build out correctly. Like, I used to get super frustrated because I'm doing it.
Bryan Pollock [00:15:43]:
You know how it is. You're the one actually touching the car. You're like, dude, this freaking sucks to try to figure out it takes this long. You know, a lot of them are fast. Don't get me wrong. You know, a lot of them are like the things died. Your reports written, 15 minutes on to the next one. You get a ton of those.
Andrew Fischer [00:15:57]:
No doubt. Most of it. Is that right?
Bryan Pollock [00:15:59]:
But, you know, and let's say that 10% takes a little, you know. You know, let's say that. Let's say 80%'s that. And let's say like the next 15% takes a little longer, you know, might have an hour into it. So we gotta, you know. But, you know, I gotta. Barely done. But then you get like that last 5% where it's just got towed out of another place or it doesn't make sense.
Bryan Pollock [00:16:19]:
Or the service. Or are you working on a Honda with a weird problem? Because Honda, every third step in any service information, replace PCM with known good. Yeah. Right. And what I found when I was getting very frustrated about what we were billing for that stuff, is I found that I was making the assumption the boys up front understood this. They don't, and they don't. And it's not their job. And that's not a shot at them.
Bryan Pollock [00:16:48]:
Our guys. I'm gonna put this out there. Whenever I talk about my own shop. I feel like we have the most cohesive team we've ever had right now. And I'm super happy with it. But sometimes I think one thing as far as what they. I'm like. I'm thinking they're in my head.
Bryan Pollock [00:17:05]:
I'm like, oh, well, well, why do I have to explain this to you? It can't be this. We can't do that. Like what? Talking about they just don't know. It's not their job.
Andrew Fischer [00:17:12]:
And the beautiful part is hearing you say that, because this is my struggle every day.
Bryan Pollock [00:17:15]:
Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:17:16]:
You know, but same. Same situation. I think we finally got a good team together. My. My advisors do a really good job. What we do to kind of try to try to combat this is. I'm big on a complimentary. Let's say it's a runability problem.
Andrew Fischer [00:17:31]:
I'll do a Complimentary code scan and I will.
Bryan Pollock [00:17:35]:
So funny because people hate parking lot scans. We do parking lot scans to make appointments, all that.
Andrew Fischer [00:17:42]:
That is our model.
Bryan Pollock [00:17:43]:
Like I can't believe, I can't believe you make fun of the people that do free dyeing but you do parking lot skins all day.
Andrew Fischer [00:17:48]:
Because then I can establish Jones has
Bryan Pollock [00:17:50]:
a freaking turbocharged engine with a freaking purge valve code. I'm gonna tell her, hey man, this freaking check valve is probably stuck. You probably shouldn't freaking get on this thing going down the road. It's gonna damage your fuel tank. You know what I mean?
Andrew Fischer [00:18:01]:
Well, let's say, you know, greatest example, we do a lot of European stuff. I get a BMW in, they got a check engine light. Pull it in, do your complimentary scan. I got 20 codes in the enhanced side and five on the generic.
Bryan Pollock [00:18:13]:
We just went through that is not
Andrew Fischer [00:18:15]:
a level 1 hour Diag.
Bryan Pollock [00:18:17]:
We just went through this. And I did the same exact thing on a mini BMW, whatever. And that was just like you said. We're like, I'm like, you know what I told Will? I said, we are so little into this right now. We don't even have to charge this guy at this point. And we can tell him if he would like to drop it off with us and spend about this much money to start. And be prepared for the heartburn of being the second owner on this 10 year old auction vehicle. It puts you in a position where you can use your experience but the service writer doesn't know.
Bryan Pollock [00:18:51]:
And see, that's where I was screwing up. I was assuming that the service writer knew that every 12 year old BMW second owner auction car was going to be a fricking dumpster fire and we need freaking five hours to get going or else we're going to be losing our tails when it's got 27 codes in it. They don't know.
Andrew Fischer [00:19:06]:
They don't. But here's a very uncomfortable conversation. We're technicians and we think back of the house is the hardest thing. I'm sorry, man. I, I still think being a service consultant, service advisor, service writer, whatever you want to call them, that is still hands down the hardest job in the shop.
Bryan Pollock [00:19:24]:
I don't want the job.
Andrew Fischer [00:19:24]:
We can fix cars.
Bryan Pollock [00:19:26]:
When, when that customer comes in our shop and I'm in the office and they're like, they're starting to say the stupid things.
Andrew Fischer [00:19:30]:
I can't do it.
Bryan Pollock [00:19:31]:
I've learned. I turn around and walk out.
Andrew Fischer [00:19:32]:
I do the same thing.
Bryan Pollock [00:19:33]:
Because I'll be like, I can't do Their job, man. And then the other thing is. So then like what I finally figured out for me is I'm like, okay, the issue is I'm not communicating this into something they can use to sell the right amount of time. I'm essentially putting a bunch of jargon that nobody understands in a three paragraph write up and seeing I need two more hours. Because it might as well be because I said so. Because all this doesn't make sense. Doesn't make sense to anybody.
Andrew Fischer [00:20:00]:
And it shouldn't.
Bryan Pollock [00:20:01]:
Why should it? They don't do it. So that's like the biggest stride we've made in charging properly for the diagnostic work. Parking lot, me figuring out how to communicate properly. Absolutely.
Andrew Fischer [00:20:15]:
It was me that is, you know, we, with tech fix, you know, Kevin Roth and I do the, the mindset call every second Tuesday of every month. Gotta give the plug there. But this is one of the things we talk about all the time. Because let's, let's be real. Most technicians don't know how to communicate. We don't have that ability. And trying to teach very introverted people. Let's face it, most of us are introverts.
Andrew Fischer [00:20:39]:
We get into this business because we got to worry about the car.
Bryan Pollock [00:20:41]:
Hyper focus, adhd, Hyper focus.
Andrew Fischer [00:20:44]:
Absolutely, absolutely. So trying to learn those skills, like learning soft skills for a technician, probably the hardest skill. You take the lab scopes, you take the scan data, you take any type of testing you have, throw it out the window. It's learning how to communicate the hardest.
Bryan Pollock [00:20:59]:
It actually got a lot easier once, honestly, once AI came around.
Andrew Fischer [00:21:03]:
Oh, it helps, it helps.
Bryan Pollock [00:21:04]:
I'll have something going, I'll have like four paragraphs written and I'll be like, turn this into something that somebody can understand in an eighth grade level. I'll, I'll copy and paste that, read out of the order, read it in chat, AI and say, turn this into something that the normal educated person at 8th grade level can understand.
Andrew Fischer [00:21:24]:
Yep.
Bryan Pollock [00:21:25]:
And you know it's not. You can't just copy and paste that back. You'll read through that and you'll edit some stuff. But dude, I mean, I was riding the struggle bus and it's like, I don't mean to be like this. I'm freaking weird, dude.
Andrew Fischer [00:21:34]:
Like, well, you know, it's, I tell my texts, you know, I think you guys use tech in the shop. Right. So with tech, I want you go ahead and put the technical in a spot that we hold in house. Right. So I have something to reference back to.
Bryan Pollock [00:21:49]:
Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:21:49]:
But you make it simple. Where the service advisor and the client can read it.
Bryan Pollock [00:21:55]:
Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:21:55]:
So I still want technical because not being at the shop a lot, same with you. You know, from time to time I can go in there and look at some specifications or I built out a inspection that they're going to follow to the T. Go ahead and put your technical in there. But I need you to explain to the client really simplistic, what system's broke, why it's broke, what fixes it. Right. The three Cs. Yeah, let's handle that.
Bryan Pollock [00:22:19]:
Broke. Why it's broke. And like the stuff that I've honestly use it for is programming.
Andrew Fischer [00:22:23]:
Yes.
Bryan Pollock [00:22:24]:
Like, to explain, because the customer's like, well, you're putting this new computer and what do you mean? It's got to be programmed, you know, and, and to explain. Well, I'm like, well, what do you mean? It's got to be like they. All the service information says gotta be programmed. No. Well, and then you learn to use maybe AI to help you a little bit.
Andrew Fischer [00:22:39]:
Yeah.
Bryan Pollock [00:22:40]:
And you say, hey, explain why this transmission control module has to be programmed. And it breaks it down like, oh yeah, the transmission control nodule needs a specific set of instructions. That exact valve body with those exact flow rates, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then it like gives a, like, almost like a metaphor, like another example or whatever, you know, and it's gotten a ton easier, honestly. It really has. But yeah, that, that's like the biggest problem is the communication. Letting them know why it needs to be done, not just the whole. And sometimes you get in your head, you're like, why do I have to explain to you? I just spent 45 minutes testing, doing this, doing that, blah, blah, blah.
Bryan Pollock [00:23:20]:
What are you. What are you talking about? I'm telling you it needs this because I said so. No, that doesn't work.
Andrew Fischer [00:23:24]:
No. Well, think.
Bryan Pollock [00:23:25]:
I can't tell the customer because they said so.
Andrew Fischer [00:23:26]:
Think of it like this, dude. What is. What does most technicians say about a service advisor? Right. You're a technician secretary. Which guys. That is ignorant. Listen to me. That is ignorant.
Bryan Pollock [00:23:35]:
Yeah. It's not like that.
Andrew Fischer [00:23:37]:
They don't do what we do. Right. We. You know, Kevin Ross says this to me all the time. You know, as. From a technician standpoint, we see things two ways. Broken or fixed. Black and white.
Andrew Fischer [00:23:46]:
That is it. That is.
Bryan Pollock [00:23:47]:
Just had this conversation with Jim yesterday.
Andrew Fischer [00:23:49]:
That's how we're approaching programs.
Bryan Pollock [00:23:50]:
We have an issue with a vehicle at the shop and we decided we. Long story short, it's not our problem, but it is but we're just gonna put parts in and just fix it. Like I'm, I'm not. It's a business, it's a business thing, right? And I literally text him on my, on my phone yesterday. I text Jim, I said, that's the funny thing. Fixing cars is very black and white. Business is not absolutely right. Literally text him yesterday morning on the right here from the truck.
Bryan Pollock [00:24:15]:
That's the deal.
Andrew Fischer [00:24:17]:
It's the reality, you know, and you know, we see it black and white. Most technicians devalue what that service consultant, advisor, again, whatever you want to call them, what they do. And it's, it's ignorance on our part because listen, when something doesn't move, we hit it harder. We don't have the ability to do that. We can't do that with clientele. And really when you look at it from a different aspect too, like again, as you've progressed in your leadership in the shop, you've, you've learned that as a technician we get upset with clients a lot. Like the way they ask things. You think they're second guessing.
Bryan Pollock [00:24:55]:
Oh yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:24:55]:
But that's not what.
Bryan Pollock [00:24:56]:
They just don't know.
Andrew Fischer [00:24:57]:
They don't know the questions to ask. What they really want to know is just a couple things. How much, how long can I trust you with my money? At the end of the day, that is really all they're looking for. But they don't, they don't know how to convey it. So they may come in and say, I seen this on Google or I looked here. It's not a shot, guys. It's, they don't know how to ask questions. And that's where the writer or the consultant really shines because they know how to get those questions out of them.
Bryan Pollock [00:25:26]:
Yeah, a well trained, a very well writer will be able to do that. And I, I know exactly what you're talking about. They come in with a chat or we used to do the thing for years. They'd come in, they'd come in with the AutoZone printout.
Andrew Fischer [00:25:37]:
Oh yeah.
Bryan Pollock [00:25:38]:
And I would see back when, back when Jim worked the counter a lot towards the end of where he was working the counter every day, you know, he's kind of like in and out. He's, I mean, he's very involved actually every day because, you know, we got the shop across the street and everything else, but I used to laugh at it. I used to think it was funny. He would grab somebody, would come in with the AutoZone printout, you know, and he'd, I remember he'd Be sitting on the counter and the way our counter set up like this. And there's a garbage can back here. He'd spin around in the garbage can. And I used to think it was the funniest thing I'd ever see. But.
Bryan Pollock [00:26:10]:
But it's just like you said. They went there because they don't know anything. This light came on. I don't know what it means. I stopped here because it was a Sunday. So I went to AutoZone. They scanned it and they say I need an ignition coil. Well, the communication.
Bryan Pollock [00:26:28]:
How do you, how do you turn that into. Just like you said, we have to understand, they don't know. No, they're not trying to get one over on us always. In some cases they, some cases they're
Andrew Fischer [00:26:41]:
trying to be an exception. It's an exception.
Bryan Pollock [00:26:42]:
Sometimes they're trying to be cheap. Most of the time they don't know. They don't know about the testing involved. How, how would the customer know? Dude, I can walk, I. We can go to the next seven shops down the street. You and I can walk in there right now and ask half the technicians in that shop, the technicians working in the field, how to test the ignition coil. They can't give us a thorough ignition coil test. The difference between two wire, three wire, four wire ignition coil.
Bryan Pollock [00:27:06]:
They can't do it.
Andrew Fischer [00:27:07]:
No.
Bryan Pollock [00:27:07]:
Why should the customer know?
Andrew Fischer [00:27:10]:
Yeah. And you know the. It's a perfect training opportunity for your client. You know, we always treat that. I don't know who came up with originally, but you know a code, right? They went to AutoZone, got the code. I always love doing the zip code mail analogy. Hey, that code may have us in your zip code, but our proper testing. Because I hate the word diagnostics.
Andrew Fischer [00:27:32]:
That's my conclusion.
Bryan Pollock [00:27:33]:
I know, I, I use the word too much.
Andrew Fischer [00:27:35]:
Yeah, I did too.
Bryan Pollock [00:27:36]:
But like really, I catch myself doing it. It's like the Alphabet soup.
Andrew Fischer [00:27:39]:
Same thing, right?
Bryan Pollock [00:27:40]:
You don't like it, but you still use it.
Andrew Fischer [00:27:42]:
But, but if you explain it to them, hey, the code gets us in your zip code. For through our testing, we're going to get to your street or your neighborhood, right? Then we're going to get to your block, Then we're going to get to your small neighborhood and then I'm going to be knocking on your door and you're going to answer. That's what the testing is going to do for us. And most clients, when they hear that, you see the comfort in their face right now. Every once in a while you're gonna get. Well, the shop down the street doesn't do this or, you know, they don't charge, blah, blah, blah. And that's fine. Whatever you want, whatever.
Andrew Fischer [00:28:12]:
I don't care what the next shop does. I don't care if you don't charge for diagonals.
Bryan Pollock [00:28:16]:
And sometimes the answer is just we do.
Andrew Fischer [00:28:18]:
Yeah. Hey, this is how we do it. This is what we do. We do and we explain it. You know, and my two advice.
Bryan Pollock [00:28:25]:
Somebody told you to come here because, you know, turns out we don't advertise at all. And somebody else told you to come here to get your car fixed.
Andrew Fischer [00:28:30]:
Right?
Bryan Pollock [00:28:30]:
Like, because that's, this is what we do. And maybe you're not accustomed to it, but you're, you know, we sell. That's, that's the other major thing. We sell fixed vehicles.
Andrew Fischer [00:28:40]:
Absolutely. Absolutely.
Bryan Pollock [00:28:42]:
And some people don't like that. Some people are like, well, you're paying for our time. Well,
Andrew Fischer [00:28:51]:
okay, to an extent.
Bryan Pollock [00:28:53]:
If you can't produce a fixed vehicle, what was your time actually? What was your expertise actually worth on that vehicle? Well, and I've been. We bought cars.
Andrew Fischer [00:29:02]:
Same. You sell a guarantee. So when we call a client, if we're wrong, I'm gonna eat it. We're never gonna charge a client for a bad decision.
Bryan Pollock [00:29:11]:
Oh, and I never understand that. I, I don't. A total, total side quest. We get a lot of cars in where they've been billed.
Andrew Fischer [00:29:20]:
Oh, yeah.
Bryan Pollock [00:29:21]:
For parts, installation. The car's not fixed. Like sometimes from other. A lot of times from other independent shops. Honestly, I'm not, I'm not kidding you. A lot of times from dealers.
Andrew Fischer [00:29:31]:
Oh, man.
Bryan Pollock [00:29:31]:
I, I had another shop in our area. He, he had a, he had a problem on a GM vehicle. He couldn't get through it. Whatever. He's like, you know what, I'm cutting. I'm just gonna send it to the dealer. And it wasn't an intermittent type issue. It was a circuit fault type issue.
Bryan Pollock [00:29:47]:
And he just, they just didn't have what it took for him. He didn't have the mixture at the time to get through it of technicians. He's got the guy now. He didn't have it then.
Bryan Pollock [00:29:55]:
Look, when I first opened my shop, I thought my old systems would keep up. The software that I had would continue to evolve. But as we grew the slow estimates, scattered workflow, increasing downtime, it really just, it was becoming a real problem. That's why I switched to techmetric. It's not just software. It's a complete shop management system that makes my life easier. Smart jobs, instant Estimates, integrated payments, integrated financing options. I mean it allows me to focus on the work that actually makes me money and not get bogged down in the other details.
Bryan Pollock [00:30:28]:
My shop's repair orders have jumped over 300% since switching to TechMetric. And when I need help, their support team responds in real time. I actually was online with them asking questions just this week and I got answers in minutes rather than having to wait for callbacks and emails days later. If your system is holding you back, it's time for a change. Tap the link in the show notes and see how techmetric can help you move your shop forward.
Bryan Pollock [00:30:51]:
He sends it to the dealer and they tell him, okay, yeah, we think it needs an ABS module. Think we think it needs an ABS module. It's going to be installed and programmed. It's going to be like $2,300 and there's no gear once you, once you own it, if it doesn't fix the cars. He paid the dealer like I'm like, how do you. When the vehicle isn't fixed, we have a hard faulty code and it's got the same code and the thing's not fixed. How do we wind up in this world for. The customer's paying.
Bryan Pollock [00:31:23]:
That's the deal. That's the.
Andrew Fischer [00:31:24]:
We charge for our time 5% better. Brian.
Bryan Pollock [00:31:28]:
Yeah, we charge for. Well, you're paying for that technician's time. His time ain't worth. He didn't find the broken wire that was four inches from the connector. I found his time wasn't worth anything.
Andrew Fischer [00:31:39]:
No, and I got a great example of this too. We just recently, yeah probably three months ago now. I had a 24 multi air jeep, one of the small jeeps, Renegade. Okay. This poor lady had had this vehicle at two dealers and two independent shops before they brought it to us. Setting throttle body codes, going into limp mode instantly. New throttle body, new pcm, new connector because, you know, worked on the older ones, got to work on the new ones. Long story short, she comes in by us, she's very upset.
Andrew Fischer [00:32:08]:
They, they asked me to look at because you know it's going to be a crazy one. Let's get the shop formative off.
Bryan Pollock [00:32:13]:
90 of the time when they come from other shops, it's power is missing somewhere.
Andrew Fischer [00:32:17]:
So I go to it, you know and in classes I always teach, you know, you gotta, you gotta have a system, gotta have a process. I didn't even start the car. I go in and I look at freeze frame. When the code set I was at 13 RPM. So it's during cranking. So what's the very next data pit I look at is voltage.
Bryan Pollock [00:32:35]:
Voltage in the dirt.
Andrew Fischer [00:32:37]:
7.6.9.
Bryan Pollock [00:32:39]:
I needed a battery.
Andrew Fischer [00:32:40]:
Or need a battery. Battery. Fix the car, right? That lady was, like, arguing with us. It wasn't to fix it. I walked up.
Bryan Pollock [00:32:46]:
That was the conversation you and I had earlier. Nobody thinks they need to know the fundamentals. Why are you calling me without a battery test and without oil level? Don't call me.
Andrew Fischer [00:32:53]:
Yeah, don't call.
Bryan Pollock [00:32:53]:
Don't. Don't call me if you don't know what the battery test result is. You don't know the oil level. I know.
Andrew Fischer [00:32:58]:
You tell me it's good. Everybody knows. They call me if you say it's good. Out. Brian, if you called, said it's good, or somebody I trust says it's good. I trust what you're telling me. But if. If you're not there and you tell me it's good, I don't want to sound like an asshole here, but I will hang the phone.
Andrew Fischer [00:33:14]:
I will hang the phone up. Yeah, give me specs.
Bryan Pollock [00:33:17]:
But, like, I don't like. So that's. That's my big beef in this industry. Like, we sell fixed cars, and it hurts people's feelings, but, man, there's. You're gonna run out of talent on cars. Anybody that tells you they don't have. I got a couple Volkswagens and a Jeep I haven't fixed. Okay? That.
Bryan Pollock [00:33:35]:
That's the reality. That's the real situation. I think the Jeep. This is where many years later, from when I didn't fix the Jeep, I think I know what was wrong with it now. I think I honestly. I think I honestly. We got a junkyard. It was like a 95 Jeep.
Andrew Fischer [00:33:47]:
Those are the ones that hurt. Because after the fact, once you get that knowledge, you're like, many years later.
Bryan Pollock [00:33:52]:
I'm like, putting two and two together in my head. I'm like, wait a second. I know what happened. The PCM was bad. And the Jeep that was in the junkyard that the PCM came out of went to the junkyard because that PCM was bad. I'm like. Like, it's the only thing that makes sense. But anyways, that's not fixed.
Bryan Pollock [00:34:09]:
Can't get a hold of it. If I could buy. If I could find that thing, it's crushed. If I could have bought that thing and fixed it, that's how irritated I am about it.
Andrew Fischer [00:34:16]:
Same thing.
Bryan Pollock [00:34:17]:
And I have. I have a Volkswagen 2 rag out back that I'm gonna have to figure Something out on to make run again. Because I just. I can't live with it. It's. It's. But it's not fixed. It's not fixed.
Bryan Pollock [00:34:29]:
I mean, cars that are. And I have two. I have two. Two rakes out back. I have a diesel and a gas outback.
Andrew Fischer [00:34:34]:
I'm sorry.
Bryan Pollock [00:34:35]:
That are in. Everybody's always like, oh. And as soon as I see somebody in the comments somewhere. Oh, I've never. It's always the shop owners. It's always shop owners that are also tax. And they're like, I've never had one I haven't fixed.
Andrew Fischer [00:34:49]:
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Bryan Pollock [00:34:50]:
In the comments. Two weeks later, they're like, Hey, I got this O3 Chevy that won't communicate. And I'm like, does they have an aftermarket radio? And they're like, yeah. Why? Go on. Never mind. Because you don't give them the answer because they're so cocky.
Andrew Fischer [00:35:01]:
You know, it's funny you say, you know how many shop owners I've. I worked for a shop owner one time early in my career that looked at me when I was in the middle of a. Of some testing and said to me, and this is during the heyday of iatn, just. I got to put that out there.
Bryan Pollock [00:35:15]:
Okay.
Andrew Fischer [00:35:16]:
I don't know what's taking you so long. I can diagnose any vehicle from my computer desk in less than 45 minutes. Handed him the tool and walked out of the office. You know, and I'm. Guys, this isn't a shot at shop owners. Like, not. Not at all. But you are abs, I hear.
Andrew Fischer [00:35:30]:
I see this all the time.
Bryan Pollock [00:35:32]:
If you've been out of the bay for a while the last five years, I. And I always make these blanket statements. It's probably different. Vehicles last longer in certain part of the countries. Vehicles do not last long up by us.
Andrew Fischer [00:35:44]:
No, Same.
Bryan Pollock [00:35:45]:
So we're working on, you know, our. Our 2010s are gone. We're not working on 2010s.
Andrew Fischer [00:35:50]:
Very similar situation.
Bryan Pollock [00:35:51]:
We're not working on 2010. Sense the average mix of vehicle that crossed the threshold into our shop. The technology is continuing to advance at an exponential rate. If you've been out of the bay for five years. Yeah. And you're going to try to make some blanket statement from your desk. Don't. Just don't.
Andrew Fischer [00:36:12]:
Yeah. If you think the techno technician shortage is bad now go ahead and piss one of them off by saying something like that.
Bryan Pollock [00:36:18]:
And I get it. And there's a lot of issues with tax. I get it, yeah, I get it.
Andrew Fischer [00:36:22]:
It, absolutely.
Bryan Pollock [00:36:23]:
But it's not what it was. If you've been out of the bay for 10 years, this ain't what it was.
Andrew Fischer [00:36:31]:
Oh no.
Bryan Pollock [00:36:32]:
When you were, you know, even in
Andrew Fischer [00:36:34]:
there, even six months, you know, I've been leader, you know, running the shop pretty consistently for about a year. And when I have to go back out and get involved in a car, there's a lot of times I gotta stop. I got to practice what I preach. Theory and operation. How's this thing working in? What's the enabling criteria?
Bryan Pollock [00:36:54]:
I'm in the, I'm in the shop almost, almost every day and I just got pinched on it like a couple weeks ago. It was, I went to do a purge seal on like a 23 blazer with a, with a force on these. And these new GMs have these things. They're purge pumps.
Andrew Fischer [00:37:07]:
Yes.
Bryan Pollock [00:37:08]:
So I made the assumption I didn't read. I didn't rtfm. I have a whole ass class based on art.
Andrew Fischer [00:37:13]:
Literally teaching that class like tomorrow, right?
Bryan Pollock [00:37:15]:
Yeah, made. There's chat groups that people have made with you called rtfm. Them had poker chips with RTFM written on them.
Andrew Fischer [00:37:22]:
I have that on my, my diagnostic cart that I will see.
Bryan Pollock [00:37:26]:
Andrew. GMs have never changed their EVAP system since 1996. So I roll in there, do a purge seal and it ain't working. I'm like, oh, this fuel tank pressure sensor is goofy. And I start looking around and the purge. Long story short, it's. They added a component. They changed how they purge the engine.
Bryan Pollock [00:37:40]:
Yeah, because I didn't rtfm, that's three years ago.
Andrew Fischer [00:37:45]:
But here's the other thing. We talk about this from a technician standpoint. The biggest issue I see, and you bet you see the same thing, we talk about reading the manual. Reality is a lot of I'm going to blanket statement text and I don't mean it that way because this is a country wide problem. But reading comprehension is a serious issue. And the reality is there's a lot of times I will try walking a technician through something and they will read it to me and they don't comprehend. Now yes, we see it in our field, but until we fix this, we fix anything.
Bryan Pollock [00:38:20]:
The funniest reading comprehension example I ever made, I ever I ever had was we had Braxton did his thing where he takes something I say and he cuts it out of context and turns it into rage bait. So it was referring to people who won't read the manual. And because somebody had made a comment that oh, this whatever is 22 pages long or something. And I said, copy and paste it into Chat GPT and tell it to summarize it for you. And because they can't comprehend, they don't want to read the 22 pages. The reply comment was, listen to this guy telling us to just type the problem into Chat GPT. The I was trying to solve his reading comprehension problem and he blocked himself up with more reading comprehension issues because that's not what I said at all.
Andrew Fischer [00:39:11]:
Funny how that works, though.
Bryan Pollock [00:39:12]:
I remember, dude, do this to help yourself. He's like, are you seriously saying, ask Chat GPT what's wrong with the car? I'm like, that's not at all what I just said.
Andrew Fischer [00:39:22]:
I remember with Tech Fix, Lowell had a video out probably two, three years ago now that got edited and he straight up said, guys, if you don't have technicians capable doing advanced diagnostics, stick to brakes and suspension, and nobody remember that one at all.
Bryan Pollock [00:39:37]:
Oh, God.
Andrew Fischer [00:39:38]:
Oh. And they just. I had text messages, emails, messages for months on this. It's because nobody listened to what he said. He stated, if you don't have those technicians currently don't get involved with things you're not specialized to do.
Bryan Pollock [00:39:55]:
They will burn you to the ground.
Andrew Fischer [00:39:56]:
Oh, dude, I couldn't do what you guys do, man.
Bryan Pollock [00:39:58]:
They will burn you to the ground. They will absolutely burn you.
Andrew Fischer [00:40:02]:
I stopped responding in groups because of it. Like, then, then they. They take us as then, too. Because I'll ask a very. So I'm very big into being direct, right? A direct, you know, difficult conversations, passive aggressive.
Bryan Pollock [00:40:19]:
And you're just going to be regular.
Andrew Fischer [00:40:20]:
Yeah, I'm just going to be direct.
Bryan Pollock [00:40:22]:
Right, right.
Andrew Fischer [00:40:22]:
Facts, not feelings. I'm big, especially my leadership style is very much facts, not.
Bryan Pollock [00:40:27]:
Yeah, I'm not going to bring this up.
Andrew Fischer [00:40:29]:
Yeah, but like, hey, so you'll ask a question and then you'll get, oh, that's why nobody goes to technical training. Because you guys are. Dude, you literally have the answer in front of you. You're just too damn ignorant to see it.
Bryan Pollock [00:40:40]:
Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:40:41]:
And you want to know why you don't get help in these forums? Because you have. Man, I watch poor rich Felco get destroyed and won just a few months ago. One of the most knowledgeable dudes out there. And you want to know why? It's because of stuff like that. I don't know how you guys do it with the podcast, man, because I see you guys get it left freaking right.
Bryan Pollock [00:40:59]:
I tell people all the time, the five smartest diet guys I know in the country, the five smart. I know I'm very fortunate to know a ton of people smarter than me. If I had to rank them, which would be very difficult because we're talking about the top point 1% and different specialties. They are different specialties. If I had to pick out the top five, the top five I would pick. Do not respond in any forums or anything any longer because they're just like, they can't deal with it. They just can't deal with it. The amount of ignorance.
Bryan Pollock [00:41:33]:
Everybody wants a silver bullet. Nobody wants to work. You ask people, just like you said, what are the fuel trims Good? Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:41:42]:
What's good?
Bryan Pollock [00:41:42]:
Good. All readings. I just did one a couple weeks ago. Everything on the scan tool is good. I go, well, the car ain't broke. Like, how do you help these people? And this is a huge issue. And like, there's owners in this industry that care. They care.
Bryan Pollock [00:42:00]:
They want their goal. Their goal. I was talking to one this morning. I had breakfast with her this morning. Her goal is to be profitable and make all of her employees lives better. She goes this, you know, she said this thing where everybody's talking about serving the public this, that. She's a bunch of hogwash. This is my goal.
Bryan Pollock [00:42:18]:
I want to be profitable and make my employees lives better. There's people who want to do that, but man, the egos make it difficult.
Andrew Fischer [00:42:27]:
The egos are the big thing. But I think I know who you're talking, talking about. And it goes back to, again, I gotta, I gotta give Kevin some shout out here. Kevin taught me years ago, Mr. Roth. He said, you know, there's a circle of business. The owner's got to give first, but they receive last.
Bryan Pollock [00:42:45]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:42:46]:
So, you know, it's the owner takes care of the employees.
Bryan Pollock [00:42:49]:
Yep.
Andrew Fischer [00:42:49]:
The employees take care of the client. Client's going to take care of the business. The business is going to take care of the owner. It's the circle of, of, you know, responsibility, I guess be the best way to put it. And I, I do think that a, I think a vast majority of ownership have the right intentions. Sure. The, the problem is, is they don't necessarily know how to execute and let's face it, like the reason all the coaching companies exist. And I'm all for them.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:22]:
I think, I think there's a coach for everybody.
Bryan Pollock [00:43:24]:
Yeah, there's a lot of different flavors. I think that you probably got to find your flavor.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:28]:
You gotta find one.
Bryan Pollock [00:43:28]:
Not everybody's got the same flavor. Not everybody wants to run the Same way.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:32]:
But the reality is, is we're tax. Right. And I don't own the business. I don't have the financial responsibility that Mark, my owner does.
Bryan Pollock [00:43:39]:
Okay.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:40]:
I couldn't have that.
Bryan Pollock [00:43:41]:
Okay.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:42]:
I am not financial, I am not financially responsible.
Bryan Pollock [00:43:45]:
You wouldn't be able to sleep with that much paint on paper.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:47]:
I couldn't do.
Bryan Pollock [00:43:48]:
That's what they call it with farming, right? Yeah. And I sandwich paint on paper.
Andrew Fischer [00:43:51]:
I, I am very, I would be the employee I would want to hire. And this sounds like very egotistical, but I really care. Like I watch every, like I watch everything every day.
Bryan Pollock [00:44:03]:
That's how I got to where I am.
Andrew Fischer [00:44:04]:
But you know, most, most owners were former technicians that didn't understand business. And let's face it, a lot of owners still don't understand basic business. So you know, having those is, is huge. But I, you know, back to the whole thing. I think most owners want to and the reality is they're just not making the money they thought they were going to. And that again, that's where I think, you know, I think everybody needs a coach.
Bryan Pollock [00:44:28]:
I've had this conversation with so many texts and they're like, oh, well, I think I'm gonna go out on my own. You talk to them and you know, they think they're being treated unfairly. And I'm like, well what do you do? This. You get a good feel for where they're at. I tell you what they're making.
Andrew Fischer [00:44:44]:
You ain't gonna make that as an owner.
Bryan Pollock [00:44:45]:
I'm like, like, that's not gonna work. You're not? No. I'm like, you're gonna have to grow. I go, you'll, I go. Once you get a five bay shop with five guys working on in it and probably a writer and a half a full time and a part time writer at the counter, you could probably make that.
Andrew Fischer [00:45:06]:
But the perception versus reality.
Bryan Pollock [00:45:09]:
Yeah, I, I think these guys, a lot of them think that they're, you're gonna. A lot of them see the other thing is a lot of them see the result of many years of hard work.
Andrew Fischer [00:45:20]:
Well, and that's huh, that's in anything.
Bryan Pollock [00:45:23]:
Yeah.
Andrew Fischer [00:45:24]:
I mean think about it. How many times you sit in a class and you look at a technical trainer and you go, damn, that dude's smart.
Bryan Pollock [00:45:29]:
No, he's just been beat up.
Andrew Fischer [00:45:31]:
He's standing on a pile of that got up there. I tell everybody, like any success you think I have, first off, I screw up daily.
Bryan Pollock [00:45:38]:
They're like, how did you know that wasn't going to fix it because I've put that part on before and it 100 does not fix this problem. And this, even though it says it does, it's not going to do it, man.
Andrew Fischer [00:45:48]:
Hard knock there.
Bryan Pollock [00:45:49]:
Done that. It's never this, it's never this, it's never this. And then one day it's that. That eventually happens too, right? It's never this, it's never this, it's never this. You hit the whole it's never this about 137 times. And then like one day you're like, well, it's not that. I got to go find the real problem. You can't find the real problem because it was that thing.
Bryan Pollock [00:46:04]:
And I. Okay, well, lesson learned.
Andrew Fischer [00:46:07]:
But yeah, again, black, white and gray.
Bryan Pollock [00:46:08]:
Yeah. Everybody looks at it and they're like, oh, I'm going to go out on my own and I'm going to do this work here. And like, and they think they have this huge, oh, all these customers are going to come to me and this, that, and the other thing because they always come to me. And then they find out, oh, they were going to that shop because they got a loaner car and they have synchrony. You're working out of your barn. Do you have a loaner car in synchrony so they can finance the repairs? Oh, no. You don't really care to come to you that much.
Andrew Fischer [00:46:34]:
I think from a technician standpoint, I think I would be a better technician today if I was production now understanding technician. KPIs. Understanding them now, like, having a grasp. If I would have had that 10 years ago when I was doing exactly
Bryan Pollock [00:46:51]:
what they were looking for, dude, I'd have freaking rock star.
Andrew Fischer [00:46:53]:
I would have hit 200. No, I'm just joking. But I would have had a much easier life.
Bryan Pollock [00:46:58]:
Were you about to say you'd hit 200 hours a week?
Andrew Fischer [00:47:00]:
No, no, not, not, not me.
Bryan Pollock [00:47:02]:
Never been sleeping in your toolbox. You just crawl in it and shut literally for four hours. Come back out.
Andrew Fischer [00:47:06]:
I, I, I literally just sent one of my first employers a message and thanked him for being he, he was kind of a to work for, but I was an employee and I sent him a message apologizing and said to him, like, hey, you're probably the best leader I ever worked for.
Bryan Pollock [00:47:23]:
Right.
Andrew Fischer [00:47:23]:
I didn't understand. I understand it now.
Bryan Pollock [00:47:26]:
It's funny how everything comes full circle. One of the first people I ever worked for, one of the first, the second job at a shop I ever had. Life happened to him. His dad had a Produce business. Long. Long story short, his dad passed away. Whatever. And he runs his dad's produce business.
Bryan Pollock [00:47:45]:
The dude was super smart. He taught me. He was the shop owner that could dag back in 2004. This guy could dye a car. He knew why. He knew why the car was broke. He would show you. He taught me how to dye a catalytic converter.
Bryan Pollock [00:47:59]:
He taught me how to diag. An O2 sensor. He taught me how to dag. Ignition misfire there. It's so funny because come full circle, he runs this produce business now. So now this guy that got me going in the right direction, this industry, like, brings his broken stuff to me. He's like, I don't know what's wrong with this thing.
Andrew Fischer [00:48:16]:
Just awesome.
Bryan Pollock [00:48:17]:
Figure it out, man. You know what I mean?
Andrew Fischer [00:48:19]:
That's awesome.
Bryan Pollock [00:48:20]:
Isn't that awesome how it just came full circle? It's so great, you know, And I love it.
Andrew Fischer [00:48:23]:
But being able to admit it too, like, I gotta be honest with you, man, writing him, that was a struggle for me because I remember. I remember when I actually worked for him twice.
Bryan Pollock [00:48:35]:
Okay.
Andrew Fischer [00:48:35]:
And on the second leaving, or maybe it was the first. I don't even remember anymore.
Bryan Pollock [00:48:39]:
He.
Andrew Fischer [00:48:40]:
It's your. I'm years ago, and I've got the
Bryan Pollock [00:48:42]:
memory of my second leaving.
Andrew Fischer [00:48:43]:
Yeah, I don't remember. Dory the goldfish is me. Anyway. But he said, you're only successful because of me. And I held that close to the freaking chest for years. And I gotta be honest, when I started getting a little bit of popularity, I guess I'd say I made sure he seed it kind of. Kind of is an move. But in retrospect, a lot of who I became most because of him.
Bryan Pollock [00:49:12]:
Right, Right.
Andrew Fischer [00:49:13]:
But that was a hard. That was a hard pill, right? Very hard pill to swallow to say, you know, what you did have, whether it was positive or negative, we'll leave that out. But you had. You did have an impact.
Bryan Pollock [00:49:23]:
Enough of an impact for me to get my together and get in the right direction.
Andrew Fischer [00:49:26]:
Yes, absolutely. And you know me at 25 versus me at 40 today. I. I appreciate it a lot better than I did then. Because back then, you know, you're. You're on, you know, pure testosterone. Like, nobody's gonna tell me anything.
Bryan Pollock [00:49:40]:
I'm 25 years old. I know everything. I've done everything. Don't talk to me.
Andrew Fischer [00:49:44]:
Yep.
Bryan Pollock [00:49:44]:
Yeah, absolutely.
Andrew Fischer [00:49:46]:
And again, like, from a technician standpoint, now understanding my KPIs as a tech technician, I think if more technicians learn those before they wanted to go out and be a Owner. I think it'd be a. A reality. Forgive my language, but it would be a one hell of a reality check for a lot of us.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:02]:
Right? That's awesome. That's great advice for all the technicians
Andrew Fischer [00:50:06]:
out there, every one of you, because
Bryan Pollock [00:50:08]:
we have technicians that listen to podcasts because they get a hold of me sometimes, so.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:12]:
Complaining about their eso.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:16]:
So. Well, what a great conversation. We've been at this for about an hour.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:19]:
Time flies, brother.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:20]:
Right. I really appreciate you being on.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:23]:
Thank you, man. Appreciate you.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:25]:
Maybe I'll pop into your class later. I won't ask any questions. I try to behave. I try to behave when I'm in your class.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:30]:
Guys, I need you to understand. Was it two years ago? Before we end this two years ago, I believe it was here at Tools.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:36]:
Was it, like, your first major teaching?
Andrew Fischer [00:50:38]:
I taught. Super Saturday.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:40]:
You're gonna teach eight hours. You were teaching eight hours.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:43]:
Yeah, I was filling in then, too.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:45]:
That's right.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:46]:
And not only. So I want you guys that want to teach, and I encourage anybody to teach, because if you want to get good at something, you got to teach Beach.
Bryan Pollock [00:50:53]:
Yeah, yeah. Yes. And that's scientifically proven.
Andrew Fischer [00:50:56]:
This sits in my front quarter, along with coconut Steckler.
Bryan Pollock [00:51:01]:
I brought Steckler.
Andrew Fischer [00:51:03]:
Mr. Mr. Jim Wilson.
Bryan Pollock [00:51:05]:
Mr. Jim.
Andrew Fischer [00:51:05]:
I love old man Wilson. And shout out to Mr. Wilson. And there was a couple others. I. I don't remember who they were.
Bryan Pollock [00:51:11]:
There was a bunch of us in there because everybody's like, what are you doing this morning? Everybody's gonna goof off. I'm like, andrew Fisher's gonna, like, teach his first major gig. I'm like, let's go sit in the front row of this thing. And nobody would sit in the front row, but I sure did.
Andrew Fischer [00:51:23]:
Right in the front quarter. And you know what? I still, to this day, every time you teach, I'm teaching the same session. So I never.
Bryan Pollock [00:51:28]:
Can never get it.
Andrew Fischer [00:51:30]:
Pisses me off, man.
Bryan Pollock [00:51:31]:
I think. I think when. When class submissions and stuff came up for this, I told Brett, I go, I will. I will teach. But I have to teach at the same time. Andrew Fisher teaches because he's always gonna sit the front row. My class at Huckleby, but I don't think. Think I heckled you.
Andrew Fischer [00:51:45]:
You know what? I'll tell you this, though. That was some of the best constructive criticism. And. And as an instructor, get ready for that. That was some of the best constructive criticism I ever got. You know, Brandon pulled me aside, worked with me. You and I talked.
Bryan Pollock [00:51:59]:
Jim.
Andrew Fischer [00:51:59]:
Jim busted my balls. The Entire class.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:01]:
And it wasn't anything negative. It's like, hey, tips. That's really cool how you did this. I maybe would have done this. And then you, you know, it was just whatever, you know. And I learned a ton of stuff in the class, too.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:10]:
Great, obviously.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:11]:
Great.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:12]:
It was.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:12]:
It was a great class.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:13]:
It was career. Your technical training. Career changing for me, you know, is as much crap as I give you over it definitely. It definitely was one of the best things that could have ever happened.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:24]:
Oh.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:24]:
So thank you. I will never admit that again. So edit that out when you do that out. But no, it was. It was humbling. It was here. I think it was two years ago because last year, Last year, I had to hurry up, get in because my kids graduated.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:37]:
I remember you were in and out.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:38]:
Yeah, I. You told. Taught Sunday morning, so we drove.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:42]:
You taught Sunday morning?
Andrew Fischer [00:52:43]:
Yep.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:44]:
I had enjoyed a little bit too many adult beverages. And I made sure to text you. I said, hey, I thought your class was great. My head really hurts. I have to go sit somewhere else where there's no noise.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:55]:
No, this is.
Bryan Pollock [00:52:56]:
No, it's not you, man. Your class is great.
Andrew Fischer [00:52:58]:
Tools is always so great to me, man. You know, we're all blessed, you know, all these. All these organizations that, you know, allow us to teach and the. The conferences and then like Benji. Benji and Chad bringing me into their shop. I got. Still got to do some stuff for Dan. I owe him.
Andrew Fischer [00:53:14]:
I own Joe some stuff.
Bryan Pollock [00:53:15]:
So I'll make sure to sit in the. When you're at Dan's shop, I'll come sit in the front row of that, too.
Andrew Fischer [00:53:20]:
You know what? In his shop, I can get away with saying a lot more. So. But yeah, you know, I just want to thank everybody for that, you know, it's. It's definitely humbling, you know, and, you know, didn't forget where I came from as far as the technical training goes. I do appreciate you, bro.
Bryan Pollock [00:53:34]:
I appreciate you too. Thanks for being on.
Bryan Pollock [00:53:36]:
Thanks for listening to Confessions of a shop Owner, where we lay it all out. The good, the bad, and sometimes the super messed up. I'm your host, Mike Allen, here to remind you that even the pros screw it up sometimes. So why not laugh a little bit, learn a little bit, maybe have another drink. You got a confession of your own or a topic you'd like me to cover? Or do you just want to let me know what an idiot I am? Email mikeonfessionsofashopowner.com or call and leave a message. The number number 704 Confess. That's 704-266-3377. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to like, subscribe or follow.
Bryan Pollock [00:54:09]:
Join us on this crazy journey that is shop ownership. I'll see you on the next episode.