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Small group leaders, pastors, and more discussing strategies for growth and community in church groups. The Small Group Network is an international ministry that equips churches to engage in deeper discipleship and community.
James Browning: Hello, and
welcome to F G squared.
Steve Gladen the global pastor of small
groups from Saddleback church polls
from his over 25 years of experience.
To encourage and equip listeners like
you to lead small group ministry.
So let's listen and learn together.
Derek Olson: Welcome to
another episode of SG Squared.
Steve Gladden on Small Groups.
Derek here with the Man, the
Myth of Legend, Steve Gladden.
Steve, how are you my friend?
Steve Gladen: Doing.
Doing well.
I mean, uh, we are in August and.
Slowly creeping towards kickoff.
And you're, you're sporting your
Washington Huskies where I am doing
nothing, no swag for the National
Champions, Ohio State Buckeyes.
But anyways, it's, it's, it's good.
Lots to catch people up on.
So, I don't know where you have it in
the show, but it's, it's gonna be, this
is gonna be quite the show brother.
Derek Olson: Well, yeah.
Let me first, uh, attempt people with
our title so that they stick around.
'cause this is gonna be a show
on five tips for setting up your
small groups strong this fall.
So you're not gonna want to miss,
uh, Steve's five steps, but.
Steve, this is the first time you
and I have gotten together since your
latest Earth shattering breaking news.
So to everybody who hasn't heard or
seen the social media announcement,
uh, break this down for us.
Steve Gladen: Dude, well actually there
were two that were floating out there,
uh, towards the, uh, end of July, um,
or probably in the middle of July, I
had a post all through social media.
I actually, uh.
Decided to step away from Saddleback
Church, which is super crazy.
I mean, all along, uh, I knew I was
gonna be there to help Rick finish,
well hire our new guy as one of the
elders of the church, wanted to hire the
right person then help him transition.
Then I figured that that transition
would slide through and I'd retire
at Saddleback, but God started laying
it on my heart and Lisa's heart.
More importantly, that, uh, as
I've spent 35 years in the local
church, um, gosh, what is that?
Almost 28 of those at Saddleback
doing just small groups.
Uh, coming out with a student pastor role
and then heading into the small groups
environment for 35 years the local church.
Uh, Lisa and I were trying to just to
pray about things and next steps, and God
has been opening and closing different
doors and stuff like that, and it just was
super obvious for us to take that step.
to, uh, spend our last five years
working more in the global church.
Now, I've done a lot of global conferences
pre show Eric, I mean, Derek and I
were just talking about, uh, you know,
uh, all the countries we, we both
have been in, and I've, I'm going to
Spain in the fall for my 44th country
that, that I've been in and around
the world and just enjoyed stuff.
But when I'm talking about the, the global
aspect, the last five years is that.
Uh, it, it's kind of teeing into, uh,
an episode we just did on August 1st.
But what that is, is that we're gonna
spend these last five years working
and developing the small group network
to tee it up so that, uh, beyond me,
there'll be this, this network of people.
That will help you connect
relationally, resource you
strategically, and impact you globally.
And we unpack that all
in the August 1st show.
And so I'd encourage you to jump back if
you don't know what we're talking about.
But yeah, the two big announcements.
Leaving Saddleback at church, I
thought I would retire at God had
other plans and who would've thought
at 64 I would take a, a network.
That has just been a, a fun
thing to do here and there.
And, uh, make it stand on its
own and do its own 5 0 1 C3.
It's just a crazy, crazy journey that
Lisa or nor I thought would be around.
And we, if when you listen to the
show, you'll understand we're asking
everyone to kind of jump in and help
out in a little bit of a different way.
Uh, so more about that in the,
the show that's already aired.
But this show, we wanna help set you
up for the fall and get you going.
Derek Olson: Wow.
Wow.
Wow.
Steve Gladen: I know.
Isn't that crazy?
I'm just like going, whoa.
mean, super.
I mean, so many emails, so many texts,
so many dms, of people that, that
have seen the, the post back when, and
still even today, some are trickling
in just, I think people thought what?
I thought I'd retire at Saddleback
and nothing against Saddleback.
I'm still gonna be an
elder at Saddleback Church.
Lisa and I are still attending
our Saturday service.
Uh, but you, you know, Eric,
Derek, you know, my big dilemma
is with this move you wait,
Derek Olson: Yeah.
What's that?
Steve Gladen: do I get NFL
ticket or was it primetime?
What is it?
NFL?
What?
Derek Olson: Yeah.
Yeah.
Steve Gladen: it is?
I gotta tee this up better, but I didn't.
There's some NFL pass and
so since I'm always at
Derek Olson: Right.
Steve Gladen: you know, it's like, why?
Why?
Why pay for a pass when I don't need it?
But college football's where it's at
Derek Olson: Okay.
I mean, yeah, it's just, there's so many
things in my head that we don't have time
to talk about, but Steve Gladden not at
Saddleback, is almost just hard to fathom.
Um, but as we know,
anytime, at least in my s.
My short time around the block.
Anytime there's a, a change at
the top with the head pastor, it
always seems like within a few
years there's always so much change.
It happens.
Steve Gladen: Yeah,
Derek Olson: with, with key staff.
It's crazy how that works, isn't it?
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
You, you're, you're so right
because statistically, it's
so true because the, uh.
They'll say it's between the, the
two, two to five year mark that
all that change starts eeking in.
And so, um, kudos to Andy and Stacy.
They are taking Saddleback
to that next zone.
I mean, we're, we're gonna have
a blast having a front row seat
everything that's happening.
And trust me, I, I wouldn't
stay as an elder of the church
if I didn't believe in it.
So, ironically, the way our church is
set up, I'm Andy's boss, so, uh, hey.
Derek Olson: Oh man.
That's great.
Will.
And then what are you gonna,
literally having been at Saddleback
for what, almost 25 years?
28.
That's insane.
Okay.
I mean, what are you gonna do
with yourself not having to
be on point for the weekends?
Steve Gladen: It's, it's crazy,
but, I'll enjoy the weekends,
but, uh, Monday through Friday.
We'll be crushing the small group
network and building things, and
there's so many visionary things.
I, I don't wanna spoil the
podcast that we just did, but.
Tons of stuff in there I
want you guys to listen to.
And also ways that you can help
out the small group network.
I mean, for 18 years the network has just
been kind of coasting along, uh, funded
by Saddleback Church and taken care of
by Saddleback Church, and now it's time
for it to grow up and stand on its own,
but it's gonna take all of us to do that.
So there's ways for you
to participate in that.
You can become a friend of Saddleback,
you can come all access, or you can just
be a donor of two Saddleback Church.
But the mission is what's more
important than how it's funded.
So listen to more for
Derek Olson: Yeah.
Steve Gladen: uh, taking
Derek Olson: think you actually meant
to say small group network, not be
a friend or a funder of Saddleback.
Right?
Steve Gladen: I'm all, I'm
all for the local church man.
I wouldn't have given 35, almost 38
years of my life to the local church.
Derek Olson: Yeah.
It's amazing.
Well, for everybody that missed,
uh, the previous episode before
this, go back and listen to it.
So you got everything dialed
in that Steve's saying.
And now let's get into five tips.
For setting your small groups
up strong for the fall.
'cause Fall is where it's
at in small group ministry.
Right Steve?
Steve Gladen: Yeah, the season
really does start, uh, in the fall.
Obviously, discipleship is a 365 24 7.
Uh, aspect of, of our lives, but
there are different onboarding
points that just fit in the cultures.
Tends to be a fall, tends to be January
and tends to be, there's some summertime
things that are actually really strong
for young couples because kids are
outta school and there's no homework
and there's generally no sports leagues.
So there's a lot of great
summer things you could do too.
But yeah, fall is one of those.
And we want do wanna talk,
we wanna give you five tips.
For starting to set that up.
So whether you are, uh, on staff or a
volunteer working directly with your
small group leaders, or whether you
are in a larger staff and you have,
uh, staff that are helping you with
this, we wanna give you five tips that
you can do to those people that are
closest to your ring of influence to
help set them up strong for the fall.
Derek Olson: Well, let's
get into number one.
If you're taking notes, write this down.
Clarify the why.
What's this mean, Steve?
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
One of the things that I, I, I do when
I, uh, consult with churches is we
do a little exercise with whoever the
main players are and we pass a three
by five card around and we ask them to.
To basically just clarify the why.
What's the end in mind?
What are you trying to do?
And what happens with that is you find
out that people know the physical address
of the church, but they don't know
where they're trying to take people.
And by clarifying the why, one
of the greatest tips you can
give is start to reinforce.
Why the groups exist.
What is success for
the small group leader?
You wanna make sure that when
your small group leaders are
meeting, they know they're not
just meeting to go through a study.
They're not just meeting to have
connection or deep friendships,
but they're meeting to take
people to a certain endpoint
and what is that endpoint.
And so the fall, the summer is
a great time to set yourself
up strong for the fall.
You can clarify that why, and one
of the things that's gonna force
you to do is say, what is the why?
Sometimes whys can be very superficial,
and they're not explained, and they're
not, they're not staffed, they're not,
the resources aren't built around them.
But this is a great opportunity for
you to say, if a, if a small group
leader is gonna express the why.
Why they exist?
What are they there for?
Are you in the in alignment with that?
And the summer is a great time to
relax and just have a great relational
conversation with your small group
leaders just to see where they're at.
Do they understand why they're existing?
Without you becoming the police and
trying to take them to the woodshed or
anything like that, or are you with that?
But you can always lead in by just,
you know, helping to reinforce the
why and say what do they think about
that and how are they doing with that?
And just where they're at.
But make sure it's a hundred
percent relationally driven so
that you can do that and naturally.
With that, you wanna make sure that
your training, your coaching, your
curriculum pathway, uh, you know,
just every, all the tools that you
have are all pushing towards that,
that same central focus of clarifying
that why and knowing what the why is.
Derek Olson: I love that.
I think that's so key because as a
small group leader, just being reminded
of the bigger picture of why we're
doing this, of why we're meeting, and
why we have this curriculum and why
we're opening our home is just key.
Uh, you know, because sometimes people
can just get in the grind and, and forget.
So clarify the why so good.
Number two, check in.
Break that down for us.
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
know, checking in is
a, a number of things.
One of the, one of the things
is you obviously wanna check in
with people, which is what we've
talked about in the last point.
And, you know, helping to clarify the
why, seeing how they're doing, and, and.
Those pieces.
But another great tip for you to do
is check in with all your processes.
Uh, if you're heading into a
launch, how are things looking?
Is, is everything done right?
Uh, because of the culture in summertime,
being a strong time where people kind of
let their guard down or relax a little?
Mainly allow churches exhaled during
that time, you know, uh, a lot of times.
Things can change, or processes can
change, and it has a rippling effect.
And so what I encourage you to do
is, you know, be able to check into,
uh, not, not only with your people,
but also the processes that you have
in place for your group leaders.
Click all the links that
are on your website.
Uh, check the, check all the
tools that you have and everything
else that you're, you're.
Putting out there to make sure it's there.
Make sure the training
materials are all in stock.
Make sure everything's printed.
Make sure you're ready to go.
Have you submitted dates?
Are you doing a refresh?
Are you doing a rally?
Whatever it is you're doing, as you're
heading into the fall, fall launch time
is check in with all those processes.
Don't assume anything.
part of what we do in that check,
I mean this fall is helping
with our, uh, small group team.
Even though I'm stepping away
from Saddleback, I'm very.
Entwined in the new model
that they're working with.
But as I was going through the
registration process, found a
little glitch and flipped it to
the right person to saying, Hey,
because customer service is, is what
happens when processes break down.
Your customer service drops low.
And so what you wanna make sure
is that you're just checking
in with everything you know.
Go to the, the volunteers that you have.
You know, are you connecting with
people you know, are the volunteers
that may be building stuff for you
or, or monitoring stuff for you?
Just make sure it's there.
Just check in with everything and
don't assume anything because you
wanna make sure that you are ready
to go for of the most important
seasons, uh, in small group ministry.
Derek Olson: You used the word
customer service and so on this
point of checking in it make.
Me.
Think of Chick-fil-A and Inn Out Burger.
Does Inn out make the
best burger in the world?
No way.
Steve Gladen: Yes, sir.
Derek Olson: No.
I've had way better burgers.
Does Chick, does Chick-fil-A
make the best chicken tenders?
No.
They often have those G Gristly pieces
on the ends, which is just disgusting.
My point is though.
They have mastered their check-in.
They are so passionate about what they
do, and they've so thought about the
customer service and serving, you know,
me for example, whether it's the drive
through or dining in, everything's
clean, you know, usually, and they
have the best service, and so you just
kind of become a part of this thing
where there's lines of cars wrapped
around the building because they're
so dialed in and they're so reliable.
It's like I'm back again.
So let's do that for small groups.
Come on, let's let me like
in and out in Chick-fil-A,
Steve Gladen: It is a good point
you're bringing, although you were.
in, you know, what you
said about the two places.
But, uh, you know, it is a good point
that, um, when know that they just don't
train one time and then forget and never
do the, the checkups or the check-ins.
And so it's a, it's a good
point that you're bringing.
I love it.
Derek Olson: check in number three.
Listen.
Well, how can we listen?
Well, Steve.
Steve Gladen: You know, there's, there's
so many things that, uh, and this kind
of rolls into that first point, uh, when
we talked about clarifying the why, but
when you're talking to people, make sure
that they have your undivided attention.
One of the things, only because I get so.
Trying to do multitasking, which I
obviously know I can't do well, but one
of the things when I'm, uh, with people
to listen better is I'll, I'll silence
my phone and I'll put it in my pocket.
Uh, there there's research that says
even when you put your phone on the
table and flip it, you know, glass side
down, there's still a psychological
thing to people that's saying that
phone is a little bit more important
than the conversation you're having.
There's probably nothing that's gonna
happen in the 30, 40 minutes that you're
gonna be engaging with that person that,
uh, you know, the world won't fall apart.
And so I would encourage you, there's
so many things about listening, uh,
that is all peppered throughout the
Bible and the book of James and the
Book of Proverbs and many other places.
But the thing is you have.
Two ears in one mouth, and
listening is one of the most
important things you can do.
it, it's so important for, there's
a, a psychological term that, uh,
that floats out there called, um,
in, in teaching about, uh, polar,
uh, and it's, it's an acrostic
that talks about listening skills.
You can look it up on Google
if you'd like to, but the, the
main crux of that whole deal is.
Make sure that you're, you're
looking at them, that you're, uh, not
doing a stare down, but that you're
looking from like the tip of the
nose to the top of the eyebrows, that
you're kind of leaning into them.
You're nodding, you're repeating
what they're saying so that they
know that you are listening.
You can ask them how they're
feeling about something, but.
Listening skills are so important
that, um, in, in the English
language, it's funny that the
word, listen, if you rearrange the
letters, you can get the word silent.
so part of the key of listening well is
you being silent so that they can share,
you know, what's going on with them.
other thing with that I encourage
you to do with it is, is you know,
find out finding out about them.
How are they doing?
What, you know, doing that check-in
with them is, is part of the process of
just, you know, not only listening well,
but part of listening is asking good
questions and then sitting back, you
know, how's your, how's your summer going?
What's been a high, what's been a low?
How's your family doing?
The more you can use first
names on that, the deeper your
relational skills with them will go.
And so what you want to be able to do is.
If you're gonna take the time to clarify
the why, if you're gonna take the time
to check in, not only with processes and
everything, actually getting time with
these people, make sure you listen well.
And so ask yourself how much
listening is happening when I'm with
people, and how much is me talking?
Derek Olson: Everything you just.
Said there, I think is so key and can
be applied to so many different areas
of life beyond smog groups and ministry.
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
Derek Olson: I mean, listening,
well, in this age of mobile phones,
social media, ai, it's listening
well is a lost art, essentially.
And so if you do, if we do what Steve
just said, um, just in our meetings
with our small group leaders and.
Our meetings in ministry.
I mean, that is a lost art that
will give, make a bigger impact.
I'm convinced than most things we could do
because who's listening well and putting
their phone down, leaning in, listening.
That was great.
Okay, number four, say thank you.
Steve Gladen: Yeah, it, uh, uh, our family
has a, uh, a, a goofy phrase that rolls
off that, which I won't bore you with,
but, uh, part of, uh, saying thank you.
It, it's fascinating that in Hebrews,
uh, three 13 it says that encouragement
has the power to restrain sin.
And, uh, in this, in this season where
I have, uh, uh, stepped outta Saddleback
and stepped into the small group network.
Um, it has been a powerful time that
people have been sending me notes
of thank you and the encouragement
that I get from that and, and how
they have poured into my life.
it has been powerful.
As you know, there's been
hundreds of, and hundreds of
notes that have poured into me.
It has a way of, um,
giving you that, that hope.
Has that way of giving you that
confidence has that way of giving you
faith to be able to do sometimes the
things that you don't think you can do.
And when you say thank you, thank you,
can be done in many different ways.
What I hate in our culture is that
we've distilled thank you down to
a gift card you know, hey, here's,
here's a, here's a $5, a $10 coffee
gift card, you know, enjoy it on us.
And although that's very nice.
And, and I'm sure it means something
to the people, but being able to give
words of appreciation of thank you
to people will go so much further.
Now, I know you can't do it every
time that, that you see them, but
there's different degrees of thank
you that you can give people.
And so just make sure that.
I've noticed in culture that we,
the pendulum has swung so much to,
what can I give you that is very
materialistic, chacha, uh, tchotchke
type of things or, uh, or, um, you
know, gift cards and things like that.
We've missed the, the capability
just with a simple thank you.
And so as we're going through this,
one of the tips I would give you
is learn how to give encouragement.
One of the things that Rick taught me
early on when the, he always challenged
the staff when you're on the patio
with people is give people a look.
A word and a touch.
the look is looking in the eye.
The word is that encouragement,
that thank you, whatever they're
doing, and then giving them a touch,
whether it's a handshake or a hug
or a fist bump or whatever it is.
Uh, something that gives
physical touch that's appropriate
is, you know, a key to that.
And so.
Recognition is a powerful
piece of what they do.
Now, part of it is in order to say
thank you in a very personal way and
to enable to, uh, give recognition or
to give encouragement or to give hope,
you've kind of gotta know a little
bit of the context to their life.
So I'd encourage you, the more you're
with a person, the more you get to know
them, the more you're gonna have words
that will speak to their heart, that will
really do what Hebrews three 13 says.
Derek Olson: Say thank you.
So good.
And last but not least, that brings
us to number five, model openness.
What's it mean to model openness?
Steve Gladen: Yeah, and part of
this just starts with you, and the
beautiful tip I would give you is be
as clear and as transparent as you can.
With your small group leaders.
Not everybody has a perfect day.
Not everybody has a great day.
I've been able to share with some of the
leaders, you know, at Saddleback, you
know, uh, 'cause I'll ask How you doing?
I go, dude, I, I am anxious.
I am scared.
I know those are not biblical.
I know I gotta work through those.
But in all honesty,
that's just where I'm at.
And so being able to, uh, model openness,
it, it can work both ways when you're on
a high of highs and excited about things.
uh, you know, when I'm with
people, I try to be who I am.
and one of the greatest compliments
is when, when I'm talking with people
and they go, that is so Steve Clayden,
and I'm just like going, they know
who I am and they know I'm real.
And, uh, one of the things I just
would encourage you to do is.
You are their pastor, no doubt about it.
But there was only one perfect person on
this planet and we all know it was Jesus.
And so part of what it's gonna
be important for you as you model
openness is to realize you're a
pastor, don't have to be perfect.
And uh, you know, the more you can
build that reality that is there.
I love when I've been reading through
the book of Acts, just the, um.
The transparency that
flows from everybody.
I, I love the one part in, uh,
acts 2 42 to 47 when they said they
gave to everyone who had needs.
And you don't know what the
needs are unless people are
transparent showing it to you.
And so, um, you know, there's that,
that place that is in that makes that
it, that brings endearment to you and
them when you are sharing a special
part of your life that you say.
This is how you can pray for me.
This is how you can come around me.
And so it's really important that if you
want a good, healthy that that is flowing
throughout your small group ministry.
It starts with you.
If you're plastic, there'll be plastic.
If you're real, they'll be real.
And so I just encouraging you, there's
a piece with this too that, uh, you
know, it's called unequal disclosure.
So it's really important
that you understand you don't
come in and drop the whole.
Sealing down of saying, you know,
this is everything I'm going through
when they're not even expecting that,
or you've never done that before,
but you start with equal disclosure.
So you can build the, the health of
your small group leaders together.
So they're starting to get to
know a little bit more about you.
You get to know a little bit about more
about them, and then you take, keep taking
it deeper, deeper, and deeper so that you
can model openness just free and going.
One of the beauties I've had at Saddleback
being there 28 years, uh, or almost
28 years, is that ability that people
know who I am and I can be who I am.
Now when I meet somebody new, I've
gotta power it back a little bit
and not scare them to death because,
you know, everyone comes in with
presuppositions of what a pastor is.
And so, uh, you don't wanna shatter
'em right at the, at the start.
But you do wanna slowly but
surely be able to have a time
when you can be real with them.
Derek Olson: Model openness.
That was number five.
And those are your five tips for.
Setting your small groups
up strong this fall.
That was great stuff that comes
from, what would you say again?
28 years of small group
ministry at Saddleback, Steve?
Steve Gladen: Yeah, it's, uh, it's a
lot of life, uh, that I've gone through.
So that's the beautiful
thing about the gray hair.
Uh, and Derek, that's a great
thing about you, you know, having
that perfectly shaven head, no
one will know when you're gray.
Derek Olson: Yeah, the, I'm
gonna have the last laugh.
Steve Gladen: Yes, you will.
Derek Olson: Well, that was great.
Um, Steve, any thoughts before we sign on?
Any final thoughts in this episode
before we sign off and see our goodbyes?
Steve Gladen: Yeah, you're, yeah, you're
gonna be hearing more about the small
group network in, in the next phase.
But, uh, you know, make sure
you, you kinda get the ground
floor breaking news of that.
Uh, get in and tune in.
It's, uh, on sg squared.
It's the August 1st show.
No matter where you're catching this show
in the future, I encourage you go back,
listen to that, get to know where we're
going, how you can help the small group
network, how it'll help people, how it'll
help you, and how we'll just be able to
continue on to build a legacy of, you
know, helping not only but house to house.
And sadly to say most resources out
there for house, to house, how to
build your weekend, how to take your
church to the next level, and all that.
We're building something very special
that has to do with discipleship
and taking people to that next step.
So tune into that episode and super
excited and, uh, always make sure
that you tune in and listen to us.
Derek Olson: And thank you everybody
for tuning into this episode.
We really hope and pray that it
encouraged you and empowers you to, uh,
lead stronger small groups this fall.
And in turn change lives
and disciple more people.
So until next time, goodbye.
Steve Gladen: See you guys.
James Browning: Thank you for listening.
Don't forget to subscribe
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And to dive in deeper get more resources
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head over to small group network.com.