The Startup CPG Podcast


In this Founder Feature, host Caitlin Bricker sits down with Kai Lim and David Yu, co-founders of Reprise Health, a modern gummy brand making Eastern herbal wellness accessible and approachable, to talk about how they built a brand that now spans natural and conventional retail.


Kai and David met in business school and bonded over the same childhood memory: grandmothers on two continents feeding them bitter herbal teas and soups. Kai grew up in Singapore, studied accounting and finance, and started his career at Boston Consulting Group. David studied math at UCLA, then spent his 20s abroad, including six years in Johannesburg managing international supply chains for hospitals and schools. After visiting Chinatown herb shops in New York and San Francisco, they noticed curious younger shoppers leaving empty-handed, and Reprise was born.


Caitlin, Kai, and David dig into why gummies were the right format, how their formulas were developed with certified herbalists and a fifth-generation Taiwanese herbal medicine company, how every batch is lab tested three times, and what it took to pass Whole Foods’ quality and legal review. They also cover the strategy behind launching into Walmart with travel-size packs, growing from about 200 to over 2,000 doors in 12 months, and the founders agreement and weekly retrospective they use to keep their co-founder relationship strong.


Listen in as they discuss:

  • How grandmothers on two continents and a trip to Chinatown herb shops sparked the idea for Reprise
  • Why Reprise is a story of rediscovery, not family recipes passed down
  • Why gummies make ancient herbs approachable, with over 70% of customers having never tried ginseng before
  • How formulas were developed with herbalists and a family company in Tainan, Taiwan that has made herbal medicine since 1892
  • How every batch is lab tested three times, with up to 70% of raw herbs rejected before extraction
  • What it took to pass a five-month quality and legal review at Whole Foods
  • How Reprise climbed to top-three rankings in sleep, turmeric, and menopause gummies at Whole Foods California
  • Why a Whole Foods launch proved quality, and why Walmart tests the brand’s mission of access
  • Why Reprise chose a 10-gummy travel pack for Walmart to make trial easy
  • The founders agreement, quarterly reviews, and Friday retrospectives that act as “resentment prevention devices”


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Creators and Guests

Host
Caitlin Bricker
Managing Editor @ Startup CPG

What is The Startup CPG Podcast?

The top CPG podcast in the world, highlighting stories from founders, buyer spotlights, highly practical industry insights - all to give you a better chance at success.

David Yu
Reprise is not a story of us taking grandma's recipes and then putting it onto whole food shelves. Reprise is really a story of rediscovery for us and what we feel like is for millions of other Americans. It's not a story of a family recipe passed down. It's a story of, hey, here's something that's been a part of our families and cultures for hundreds, if not thousands of years. How do we rediscover it and reintroduce it to a larger audience?

00:41
Caitlin Bricker
Hey, everybody. This is Caitlin Bricker, Managing Editor at Startup CPG. We are back with another founder feature. Today I'm talking with Kai Lim and David Yu of Reprise Health, a modern gummy brand that's making traditional medicine accessible and approachable. Kai and David started off as friends with similar stories of their grandmothers feeding them soups and teas with mysterious herbal blends in them. And they've now skyrocketed into a brand spanning the natural and conventional channels. If you ask me, I think their key to success is of course, having a great tasting, effective product line, but also the way they approach their relationship as founders. You'll get my live reaction to their founder agreement and how that would seal the deal for me if I was a retailer. Sit tight for this one.

01:27
Caitlin Bricker
At Whole Foods Market, Reprise Health has the third best selling sleep gummy product, is the second best selling turmeric gummy brand, and the third best selling menopause supplement product. And they're rolling out to over 450 doors in Walmart. They were able to make these retail connections at our Startup CPG events. I hope you love this episode as much as I do. If you're looking to connect with buyers, investors and industry experts in real time, you need to be in our community. Join our Free Slack community with over 40,000 members. Get access to exclusive events and trade shows where you can meet those buyers and investors in real life, tap into free resources and much more. Text CPG to 833-605-7002. That's 833-605-7002 and we'll get in touch. As always, enjoy. Hey everybody. Welcome back to the Startup CPG podcast.

02:27
Caitlin Bricker
This is Caitlin and today I'm here with Kai Lim and David Yu, co founders of Reprise Health. Hey guys. How you doing?

02:34
David Yu
How's it going, Caitlin?

02:35
Kai Lim
Hey. Really good.

02:36
Caitlin Bricker
Always good when I get to have a conversation with brand founders. I'm really excited to have you here. I feel like, Kai, you were popping up at basically every event I was at for the longest time I was like, am I following you? Are you following me? What's going on here? But there has been so much growth with your brand since the first time we met. So I'm glad we're having this conversation. Now, before we get into all things Reprise Health, can you tell us first, what is Reprise?

03:05
Kai Lim
Yeah, in one sentence, Reprise is Eastern herbal wellness crafted into a daily gummy.

03:11
Caitlin Bricker
Love it. Nice and simple. We love a good pitch. I can understand it. Nice and digestible. Very cool.

03:18
David Yu
Literally digestible.

03:20
Caitlin Bricker
There you go. I'd love to know because I think it's really interesting talking to health and wellness founders, what backgrounds you come from before you decided to get into CPG. So, David, let's start with you. What's your background?

03:35
David Yu
So Kai and I met in business school and I actually studied math in college. I will tell you, completely useless in CPG. But after I got my math degree from UCLA, I actually spent all of my 20s abroad. So I spent one year in Shanghai and then six in Johannesburg, South Africa. And my job was actually international supply chains. So I was helping hospitals, schools, government institutions throughout southern Africa get access to critical supplies. When it came to medical devices, none of that stuff is made on the continent of Africa. And it's critical stuff that every country needs. And so, yeah, so my job was to make sure they could get the stuff they needed.

04:18
Caitlin Bricker
Wow. I mean, having a supply chain background is just in CPG because that is really hard to navigate. So it sounds like where you're coming from made it much easier for you to dive into the world of CPG supply chain, I would hope. Anyway, it has. I'm interested to hear more about that.

04:36
Kai Lim
Yeah. Yeah. I feel like David's math background has been very helpful.

04:39
David Yu
Actually.

04:39
Caitlin Bricker
Just hearing that you were a math major makes me sweat a little bit. So said this before, and I always say it again, is that numbers make me sweat. I want nothing to do with them. As long as I see a paycheck coming through, we're good. Kai, what's your background? Where are you coming from?

04:54
Kai Lim
Yeah, so I was actually born and raised in Singapore, a very small country, city, state. And my background going into undergrad, I was double major in accounting and finance. And since graduating, I have always been a generalist. I joined Boston Consulting Group right out of undergrad. And there was where I got to really explore many different industries, different topics. And I would say on certain projects, I kind of get a sense that I like them more. And those projects are typically with like consumer type projects. And then in Terms of topic. I really love the innovation side of things. So that was kind of where I got to really explore and begin to realize, like, I really do enjoy consumer space.

05:40
Caitlin Bricker
I really like that you described yourself as a generalist, because I would definitely describe myself as a generalist, too. I think when we say that we have a specialty, it kind of boxes us in. So being able to absorb different skills and take attention to other things that we might be really good at, I think that's a really good skill to have. So how did you guys link up? Were you friends before creating Reprise? Tell me the history here.

06:06
Kai Lim
Yeah, so for that, I'm going to take us all the way back. I grew up in Singapore, and I have a grandma who was always making me drink these bitter teas and soups that has herbs in them. And really, at the time, I didn't know what it was for. I just remember running around when my grandma forced me to drink it, and I hated it. And so, crazy enough, David and I met in business school, as he mentioned, halfway around the world. David, who grew up in Oakland, California, he had the exact same experience with his grandma. And that's kind of how we came together, right? Like, same childhood, two different continents. And when we started talking about this, we started wondering if it was just us, right?

06:48
Kai Lim
So went to Chinatown herb shops in New York, in San Francisco, many of these herb shops to find out. And, yeah, that was how it all started.

06:57
Caitlin Bricker
I have to know, did your grandmothers say something to you? Did they tell you what the ingredients were in these soups and teas that you were eating and drinking, or were you just trying to put the pieces together later in life to be like, that's the flavor that were getting.

07:11
Kai Lim
I kind of have an inkling, because oftentimes the hottest one to drink is the one that's most memorable, which is ginseng. And ginseng, when you brew it in the kitchen, we're talking about a really pungent smell that you can smell all the way from the kitchen to your room. And so that is the most common one. I would say that my grandma fed me.

07:31
Caitlin Bricker
I don't know if you've ever tried valerian before. Is that in any of your formulas?

07:35
Kai Lim
Currently not, but we do know a valerian.

07:38
Caitlin Bricker
Valerian root. The first time I smelled that was at Cambridge Naturals, which I know you're both familiar with now. Vicky, who worked in the herb section, opened up the jar to refill the bulk herbs, and I was like, whoa, did somebody step in something? And she was like, no, it's the valerian. And I took a whiff of the jar, regrettably. And that is also a very pungent herb. So it's funny to hear you.

08:04
Kai Lim
Now. The experience you just described is exactly our experience, right? When we say we visited these herb shops. When we first went there, even just outside the herb shop, the first thing that hit us was the smell. It was kind of like just pure grandma, right? And then when we go in there, similar to your experience, I think we just see all these huge walls of drawers, and they're really nice, beautiful drawers. But very quickly, David and I realized we just had no idea what to ask for when we're in there. And that was really the story of us visiting these herb shops. We started observing. We just started seeing a lot of younger Americans who were curious. They were lingering outside and then leaving without buying anything.

08:47
Kai Lim
And so we kind of gathered that people were curious, but probably, like us, were too intimidated to ask what this is for. And it's pretty crazy to think about because we grew up with this stuff. It was familiar to us, and we still felt like outsider. We didn't know where to start. And so we then decided to start interviewing people outside the shop because we couldn't do it inside. And we interviewed just, like, people, one by one. And I remember one quote that really got me was this younger lady who told us, like, yeah, I know about these herbs. They're good for us, but I'll never make it myself. And I think she was pretty strong on the word never. And that was when I think it kind of clicked for us that it wasn't just David and I. It was not just us.

09:31
Kai Lim
I think a whole generation grew up with this and don't know where to start and would never do it. And a lot of people who probably want in also didn't know how. And that's kind of how Reprise was born. We asked ourselves the question, how can we make Eastern herbal wellness more accessible?

09:47
Caitlin Bricker
I love that. Do you remember the first herb or herbs that you purchased when you left a store together?

09:54
Kai Lim
We didn't get to purchase any herbs because we didn't know what to ask or how to get started.

09:59
Caitlin Bricker
Interesting.

10:00
David Yu
We might have been gifted, like, a little, like, sachet of, like, a mix of herbs. And, like, to this day, I don't know. I could probably identify the goji berries and, like, maybe one or two of the mushrooms. But I think you asked, like, a really interesting question, right? Like, reprise is not a story of us taking grandma's Recipes and then putting it onto whole food shelves. Reprise is really a story of rediscovery for us and what we feel like is for millions of other Americans. Because in our own lifetimes, to Kai's point, this was a part of our childhood. Both my parents are Western trained PhD biologists. Growing up, half our medicine cabinet was stuff from cvs, the other half was all from herb shops of stuff.

10:46
David Yu
Like, I could tell you the names of them in Chinese, but like I couldn't tell you what the hell was in them. And if you go look at my medicine cabinet now, it's pretty much all stuff from CVS or Vitamin Shop or Whole Foods. And so Reprise is. It's not a story of a family recipe passed down, it's a story of, hey, here's something that's been a part of our families and cultures for hundreds, if not thousands of years. How do we rediscover it and reintroduce it to a larger audience?

11:15
Caitlin Bricker
I like that a lot. I do like the family recipe stories, but I also like this approach of making these products more approachable because just like you're saying, you're observing these people, including yourselves, walking into these herb shops and leaving empty handed, which is a pretty sad thing for the people who are going in there interested, and also the shop owners too. So I'm very curious how you went from going into those herb shops together, having these backgrounds, these similar stories with your grandmothers, with these family recipes and then taking that and deciding this should be a product and furthermore, this should be a gummy. So David, maybe you can speak to how the product came to be and how you started securing the herbs and ingredients for those products too, for sure.

12:04
David Yu
So the first question is why gummies? The simple answer is like all of a sudden we decide we're going to put everything into gummies. And Kai and I were saying, why not Chinese herbs? And what's really cool about gummies is everyone has a comfort level with gummies. Gummies just inherently feel familiar with. They look like a piece of fruit snack from our childhood. And when we talk about exposing a new audience to these really ancient, powerful herbs, familiarity is key. So over 70% of Reprise customers, they've never had ginseng. So when they take one of our ginseng gummies or our focus gummy that has ginseng in it, that's the first time they've ever tried ginseng.

12:45
David Yu
They might have heard of ginseng before, but for one reason or another, they've avoided it up until they see it presented to them in the form of a gummy. The other advantage that gummies have, Kai talked about the smell and the bitter taste. Our gummies solve all of that. They taste really good. They probably taste like 95% like a fruit snack and 5% with like some herbal notes in them, like herbal floral notes in them. But the goal here is that they taste so good that you want to take them every day. And unlike lots of over the counter medication or prescription medication, herbs are gentle and they take time. So consistency is key. And so when you can put it into a convenient form factor, a tasty form factor, people actually take it every day and they get all the health benefits.

13:31
Caitlin Bricker
So how did you decide what herbs you were going to put together? Did you work with a formulator? Did you talk to your families? How did that process look?

13:40
David Yu
Like I said, our formulations are not from our grandmas or our families. Everything is actually formulated by doctors. So these are herbal formulations that are formulated by either certified herbalist or an acupuncturist who's trained in herbalism. The other critical piece of this is we actually partnered with a fifth generation family company out of southern Taiwan to develop our gummies. They've been making herbal medicine for over a hundred years, since 1892 out of a city called Tainan in southern Taiwan. And they have so much incredible institutional knowledge when it comes to these herbal ingredients. And so we spent actually over a year co developing these gummies with them. So what that means is we actually took the exact same herbal extracts that they've been making for over a hundred years.

14:31
David Yu
It's the exact same herbal ingredients that you'll find in Asia's best herb shops or they supply to all the acupuncturists in the US for example. So it's like literally that, but in a gummy form. So that authenticity and that real ingredients, this is not a proxy, it's like the real deal in the gummy. We take a lot of pride in that.

14:51
Caitlin Bricker
So it sounds like to me that this is not just a gimmicky product. Not that even if it was, that you'd ever admit to that. But we see a lot of brands who are throwing adaptogens who are throwing herbs in their products. And it's seems like it's maybe just to say that those ingredients are in the product, but maybe not at a dosage that's going to do anything. So can you speak to how you got to dosages that actually work for people?

15:20
David Yu
That's a great Question. And I would say there's two parts to this. There's one, how we came to the formulation and dosages to your point. And then two, there's a larger question of how do we ensure that what we say is in our gummies is actually in our gummies. So on the dosages side, it's a combination of like food science, like how much active can we get into a little piece of gummy? As well as our medical advisors who formulate our gummies in terms of ensuring that what we say is in our gummies is actually in our gummies. Our gummies. Every single batch is actually lab tested three different times. I was lucky enough to go visit Southern Taiwan last year and they have this like very high tech, 5,000 square foot lab testing facility.

16:07
David Yu
And like I said, each one of our gummies is lab tested three times. So the raw herbs are first tested. Everything from pesticides to heavy metals to plant DNA testing. At this step, actually up to 70% of the raw herbs are rejected before extraction. So and like, it makes you like wonder like where those rejected herbs go. They're not going in the trash, they're going back to the supplier that sent us these lower quality herbs. Okay, so that's like step one. Then after they're extracted, they're lab tested again after extraction to get a sense of potency and effective extraction. Thereafter after to put in the gummies, they're then tested again. And what we publish on our website is actually an upto date summary of all of these lab tests that you can go see. Right.

16:54
David Yu
So if you go to our website right now and you go to our De Stress gummy webpage, you can actually see the lab test results for our most recent batch of De Stress companies.

17:04
Caitlin Bricker
Wow. I think that says a lot because with products in general, but I think even more so with health and wellness products and supplements. Consumers really are demanding more transparency. And what better way can you do that than saying, here are the results we've triple tested for you. Here it is. Do you get anybody coming to you specifically asking for more certifications or more transparency in looking for those test results? Maybe Kai, you could answer this.

17:34
Kai Lim
Yeah, I mean, David and I actually when we launch into Whole Foods, even any retailer, we usually do a bunch of demos ourselves. We go to the store and actually hand out gummy samples to consumers so they can get to try. And that I would say is one of the questions that would come up where consumers would ask us, hey, how are these gummies tested? Or is there the lab Testing result. Another group that often asks us about this lab testing results are actually retailers. So Whole Foods is a really good example to use. We wanted to get into Whole Foods first because we wanted to get into the natural premium channel. But what comes with that is also a really tough, very high quality bar that we have to pass.

18:19
Kai Lim
And so specifically with Whole Foods, they have a quality standards team and a legal team that looks at all of this. And we had to go through with each of this team to show them all the certifications and to ensure all the ingredients that we use meet their ingredient standards. And this process can take months to even a full year going back and forth. I even remember taking one of these calls during my honeymoon in Japan because we really need to get this to launch into Whole Foods.

18:49
David Yu
I think for us it took five months of like Whole Foods, their lawyers, and their quality team just reviewing every ingredient, every claim we make on our packaging. So yeah, unfortunately in this country, herbs are not considered medicine. They're considered dietary supplements. And the supplement industry in the US is completely unregulated. So that burden that falls on us as brands and then also the retailers that carry the products to self regulate effectively. Wow.

19:19
Caitlin Bricker
I just have to backtrack real quick. I'm assuming, Kai, your wife is still with you even though you took that call on your honeymoon?

19:26
Kai Lim
Yeah, yeah, she's still with me and we have a little baby, so I think it's going well.

19:31
Caitlin Bricker
Okay, great news. And I also just want to like keep going on the relationship side of things, which is you got this deal with Whole Foods. You ended up in Whole Foods. You also got into Cambridge Naturals through the Cambridge Naturals grocery run. I was so excited about that. And now I'm hearing that you're getting into even more stores. So I want to hear more about these launches that you have coming up or that have already happened. And I also want to hear more about your strategy. Do you have a channel strategy? What does that look like if you do have one?

20:07
Kai Lim
Yeah. One of the biggest launch that is coming up is our Walmart launch. So I think from the outside looking in, it could be pretty interesting. How did we go from premium natural channel to will be categorized as a mass retail. And for us, that decision was very deliberate. Getting into stores like Whole Foods first was for us to prove that our quality is there. And I would say going into Walmart really is testing our mission. And I'll go into what I mean, for us, Whole Foods, like I mentioned, it's one of the highest quality bar you have to pass. And that's what we really wanted when we started out in the retail scene and went through all these months of compliance and really it was a lot to go through. But we also really appreciate how thorough the process is.

20:54
Kai Lim
We appreciate the compliance process and it's also proof to kind of what David was saying that our whole herb extraction is not just a marketing story. It's actually there's a whole process behind that. And now with Walmart actually I have to give again thanks to startup CPG. We actually pitched to them at Expo west just this year where we did a one one meeting through startup CPG. And this is really exciting for us because Walmart I think is all about access. Our mission is to make Eastern herbal wellness accessible to all. And launching into Walmart allows us to tap into a lot more consumers to give them access to this Eastern medicine. Just some numbers.

21:37
Kai Lim
90% Of US population lives within 10 miles of Walmart and 94% of Americans shop at Walmart or Walmart.com so for us this is really a big step to test our mission to make Eastern medicine accessible.

21:52
Caitlin Bricker
Wow, those are some pretty big numbers. I did not realize I do live near a Walmart. I don't shop at one, so at least I fall in one of those categories. But I do really appreciate seeing the expansion that Walmart is doing with new and emerging brands and obviously you fall into that category. I really like what you're saying about validating the quality of your products through Whole Foods and getting on shelves there because I'm sure you could take a nice big breath of fresh air after you got in, went through the process. Sounds very rigorous. I had no idea lawyers were involved, but I guess it makes a lot of sense. And now seeing that you're getting into Walmart too.

22:33
Caitlin Bricker
When I think of Whole Foods and Walmart in my head, I think Whole Foods natural channel all the way, totally organic, natural customer. When I think Walmart, I think everybody, which is a really good thing. So with you coming to market with these products, making them really accessible and approachable, being able to see how that's going to play out in the Walmart categories in those aisles, I think this is going to be really cool to see this unfold. I would love to see data from you in a year or two to see how it compares. It's really exciting. Congratulations.

23:07
David Yu
Thank you.

23:08
Kai Lim
Thank you. Whole Foods is one of my favorite retailer. David and I actually just got back from a trip to Austin and it was really productive visiting the headquarter and Meeting all our buyers in person. We kind of presented this to them very recently. But Whole Foods launch has been going really well for us. Four months into launch we did over 100 demos. Our team interacted with over 10,000 customers and between David and I, we visited more than 50% of the stores that we are launched in on the west coast. And this was all within four months of launching. And you can tell that we both like to work really hard once we launch into a retail store. And I believe those actions have led to really good results with all the efforts.

23:52
Kai Lim
I think one of the results that I can easily look at is our ranking within Whole Foods. Our ranking has climbed pretty rapidly across many SKUs. For example, our restful sleep gummy Niq is showing that we are the number three best selling sleep aid gummy in Whole Foods California. Our turmeric gummies are ranked number two. And our menopause gummies is the number three best selling menopause supplements on the shelves right now. And that's something that were celebrating with our buyers. And we're really happy about the progress with Whole Foods. There are a lot more exciting things that are coming up with Whole Foods, one of which is we are going to be at the Fairfax opening in California where they will be presenting us this big check where Dan Aptley himself is going to present us a big check.

24:34
Caitlin Bricker
Wow, good stuff. What do you plan to do with your Walmart rollout? What is that? Looking for you to make sure that you have that brand awareness with customers and make it even more approachable to Walmart customers.

24:49
Kai Lim
Yeah, I'll talk about one of the things going into Walmart was the biggest decision was actually the SKU selection. So selecting what products we want to launch in. And actually what we are launching in Walmart is our travel size gummies. So it's a five day serving. It's very intentional because we also understand Walmart shopper might not be familiar with our product. So we want to make sure we increase triability. So with this 10 gummy pack, a travel pack, a first time customer could easily try them for $8.99. And the beauty of that is also you get the exact same formula, the same herb, the same standards that has been approved by Whole Foods, but in a pack size that you can try very easily.

25:33
Caitlin Bricker
Very nice. How has it felt getting into all of these stores? I don't think we've said this yet, but how many Walmarts are you rolling out into? And I'm saying Walmart's plural. I know A lot of people just say Walmart's in general, it's Walmart. So I just want to make it clear I know it's Walmart. But anyway, how many stores are you rolling out into?

25:55
Kai Lim
Yeah, we are going into more than 470 stores.

25:58
Caitlin Bricker
Wow. How does that feel as a brand knowing that you are going to be in that many doors on top of what you're already in?

26:07
David Yu
So this year in particular has been a wild ride for us from a retail standpoint and truth be told, startup CBD deserves a lot of credit here. So in the last 12 months we've actually gone from around like 200 doors to over 2000. So it's been a 10x growth in a relatively short amount of time, especially by retail standards. In terms of how it feels, I would say one of the biggest challenges with being a founder of a CPG startup is it often feels like the winds are fleeting and the challenges are enduring because it takes something like a Walmart launch, like when do you celebrate it and how long can you really celebrate it for? Right. Is it when the PO comes through? Is it when you are trickling out on shelves?

26:54
David Yu
And then contrast that with okay, how are we going to increase our manufacturing capacity? That's a weeks if not months long challenge. How are we going to scale our marketing campaigns? That's a never ending challenge. How are we going to present our data to our merchants and buyers so that they're happy with us? That's not something that you do. Once again, enduring. And I think the advice I would give to other founders here is like, that's kind of the nature of the game. We, Kai and I try and stay disciplined. When we get a big win, we try to like give ourselves 48 hours to celebrate it.

27:38
David Yu
And then conversely when we take a big L which happens all the time, we're allowed to feel sorry for 48 hours after that 48 hours, pick yourself off the mat, stop feeling sorry for yourself and let's get back to work.

27:50
Caitlin Bricker
I am interested to hear more about this because David, I know that you are pretty passionate about managing this co founder relationship that you and Kai have. So can you speak more to what you do to make sure that this stays balanced and seamless and very well integrated?

28:08
David Yu
Yeah, for sure. And you're right Caitlin, that we are quite passionate about it mostly because we found it to be really effective. We know enough startups and startup founders at this point where it's an ongoing challenge. Most co founded relationships are average at best and we feel like we have an incredible one. Kai and I like to joke about us being like the luckiest guys on the planet. Like, if there's a $20 bill sitting on the sidewalk somewhere, like, it's either I'm gonna find it or Kai's gonna find it.

28:38
Caitlin Bricker
I love that.

28:39
David Yu
That's like kind of who we are. And yeah, I think we must have done something right in our previous lives. But truth be told, when it comes to managing a co founder relationship, it's really not luck. It takes a lot of consistent work, it requires robust systems that we buy into and it takes investment throughout time. So we have a few systems in place that we're quite proud of. Firstly, we have a super comprehensive document. That's our founders agreement. The first draft of that was when were just coming up with the idea of Reprise. And this document covers everything from our values to our norms, how we communicate to. Do we work on weekends, do we work on holidays? How much are we going to get paid before we're funded? What our goals are. Right.

29:28
David Yu
Like, are we going to sell the company one day? Right. How much do we want to sell it for? Like, everything you can think of is in this document. And then it's all written down. It's not legally binding. If nothing else, it's a tool and a checklist for us to say, hey, here are all the things that are important to me. Let's talk about it and at least come to some agreement on what those things are. And then we have a recurring calendar invite where once a quarter we review that document. So Kai and I have been working together for years now. It's been reviewed and revised a bunch of times. And the reason why we review once a quarter is things change. Our aspirations change, our commitments change. For example, Kai had a baby this year, right?

30:10
David Yu
So it's perfectly reasonable for him to be like, hey, I know previously we had agreed that we would work on weekends sometimes. Like, I really want to spend more time with my newborn baby. And you need systems and mechanisms to talk about those things and come to agreements and then reinforce commitments. So that's the founders agreement side. The other system we put in place is a weekly one. So every Friday we have a weekly retrospective. And it's also a recurring calendar invite where we spend 30 minutes pretty much talking about our feelings and stuff that happened in the week and how we felt about them. I'll admit Kai and I are not incredibly great emotional communicators. I don't think it comes naturally to either of us. So in many ways, this is a forcing mechanism.

31:00
David Yu
And examples of what might come up in a weekly retrospective can be like, hey, Kai, when were talking about the Walmart promotion plan for sampling, I don't think you did a good job of listening to my point of view. Something, you know, just as an example. Right. And when you have a forum and a space to talk about stuff like that, two incredible things happen. One is it sets up norms in terms of what is considered safe areas to go into. Two is even during the week, when we're not proactively talking about it, just knowing that this opportunity exists allows more fluid work during the week. And I would say, like both these tools effectively, what they are is their resentment prevention devices.

31:52
David Yu
And resentment is really, you could either think of it as poison or you can think of it just like a drag coefficient. Like oftentimes as founders, what it feels like is like we're just like hiking uphill and loose gravel. That's the feeling of it. And like any amazing hike, you want to do it with someone that you love being around. And that's Kai for me. But when you resent that person, it just feels like, oh man, your backpack just got 20 pounds heavier. And so whether it's the weekly retrospective or the founders agreement, there are ways to lighten the load so that you can continue ascending and progressing without that drag behind you. It really does feel like a physical weight has been lifted off when we're really feeling down. And inevitably there's so many low moments.

32:39
Caitlin Bricker
I got to say, if I was a retailer listening to what you just said and these strategies that you have in place and these tools that you put in place with each other, that would seal the deal for me, like, honestly, before even trying the product, the fact that you have put these tools into place for yourselves to make sure that this is a long standing relationship and long lasting. I'm very interested in end of life care and death work. It feels to me that you are literally building basically a living will for your brand. An agreement between the two of you. What matters most to you right now, what's going to matter most to you in the future, and making sure that you're holding each other accountable. That if one of you can't speak up for your brand, the other one can.

33:24
Caitlin Bricker
This is a very beautiful thing. I feel like this is the biggest takeaway for me from this conversation that we've had. I never hear about co founders talking about these types of agreements. Maybe they just don't talk about them publicly, or maybe they don't have them at all. But this is beautiful to me. Kai, what are your thoughts about having this in place for your brand?

33:46
Kai Lim
No, like David, I think I really like that we have this mechanism. I think if there's anything I would add is, yeah, it's oftentimes when you don't want to have the meeting is when you really need to have that meeting. And that is the power of this mechanism, like the weekly retrospective. Because I also believe that we need divergent views in the room.

34:06
David Yu
Right.

34:07
Kai Lim
David and I cannot always be agreeing with each otherwise then we'll just be group thinking and making decisions and not critically thinking about those decisions. So I think it's really common for co founders to have conflict and sometimes in the zone of the conflict is when you really don't want to talk to each other about that. And I really like that we have it in place.

34:28
Caitlin Bricker
I would assume that you just like build even more of a love for each other being able to have these really tough conversations. And I love that you are building in this resentment proof ideology for your brand because that could totally break a brand and honestly just like break a relationship for life. So you're doing yourselves a huge service, your brand and your future retail partners too.

34:51
Kai Lim
I would add one more thing where it's also not all doom and gloom every week where we criticize each other sometimes it's also like picking each other up, right? Like let's say trying to get past the operations for Walmart. And David in that week picked me up and reminded me of the wins. And sometimes you just need someone to remind you, hey, look back, right? This is how far you've come and now we're dealing with the next hike. So yeah, I just want to put that out there because I don't want also founders to think, hey, these two meetings that we have is always really challenging. Sometimes they're actually pretty uplifting.

35:26
Caitlin Bricker
I love it. All right. I need other people to learn more about your brand and more importantly, try your brand. So what's your website? What's your social handles? Where can everyone find you?

35:37
David Yu
Yeah, so on Instagram, we're at Reprise Health, we have a new website where you can go see all of our incredible products. Reprise health.com if you're another founder and you want to try our products, DM Kai or myself on LinkedIn, we're pretty active on LinkedIn. Also we are doing a fundraising round at the end of this year. If you want to learn more about our very rapidly growing business, please also DM Kai or myself on LinkedIn.

36:04
Caitlin Bricker
So many exciting things. I'm really excited to keep following along and I want an update about how you're doing in Whole Foods and in Walmart too. And hopefully I hear about a pretty big raise that you'll be doing too. Those kind of numbers don't make me sweat. Those ones are good numbers. Thank you guys. This has been such a good discussion. I really hope that founders listen to what you're saying and incorporate this into their own brands. Hope to see you around. I know, Kai. I will. We follow each other everywhere. I'll see you guys later.

36:35
Kai Lim
See you. Thank you.

36:36
David Yu
Thank you, Kaitlyn.

36:36
Caitlin Bricker
Bye. CPG BFFs we've now arrived together at the end of another episode of the Startup CPG Podcast. As you may know, we're not just the top globally ranked CPG podcast. We're a community of tens of thousands of CPG founders and experts. And you should join us. If you haven't already. Head to startupcpg.com to sign up. You'll get an invite to our Slack community, hear about events near you, and get access to opportunities that connect you with buyers, investors and other brands. It's free. So what are you waiting for? I'll see you in Slack and in real life. Thanks for listening.