The Filter That Keeps Drama Out of Your Culture w/ Char Learson

If you want a healthy culture — you have to build it on purpose.

In this episode of Project Sisterhood, Chrissy sits down with Char Learson for a strategic and inspiring conversation on leadership, culture, and how to keep drama out of teams, ministry, friendships, and life.

We talk about systems that protect unity, why presence matters more than performance, and how to lead with wisdom while still keeping things human and joyful.

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If this episode encouraged you, share it with a friend and leave a review — it helps more women find Project Sisterhood 💛

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Creators and Guests

Host

Chrissy Cole

Chrissy’s parents moved to the U.S. from the Philippines in the late 70′s. She saw her parents both come to know the Lord at a young age. She and her family poured their lives into the local church and were changed by God. Chrissy attended Evangel University in Springfield, MO and earned a B.A. in Communications with an emphasis in Public Relations.

What is Project Sisterhood?

Project Sisterhood is a podcast for women who want to grow in faith, find healthy community, and become who God created them to be.

Hosted by Chrissy Cole and the Project Church Sisterhood team, each episode brings honest conversations and biblical encouragement centered on identity, belonging, spiritual maturity, healing, relationships, and purpose.

With a mix of humor, vulnerability, and real-life wisdom, Project Sisterhood creates space for women in every age and stage to feel seen, strengthened, and connected—because you were never meant to do life alone.

00;00;00;02 - 00;00;23;04
Speaker 1
Sometimes I think as ministers. Yeah. We put so much into the practical. We put so much into, how are we going to draw people like. And it's like when you have some systems and resources, tools that kind of allow those things to just flow and go, we can keep on prioritizing the presence of God. Yeah. This is a project sisterhood podcast for all things women.

00;00;23;06 - 00;00;45;01
Speaker 1
Whether you feel purpose for ministry, motherhood or the marketplace, we have fruitful and genuine conversations that transcend your season yet impact your true identity as a woman. From light hearted and laughable to honest, deep matters of the heart, your soul will be encouraged. We hope you and all women of every age and every stage, by life and freedom in Jesus.

00;00;45;04 - 00;01;06;09
Speaker 1
Hey ladies. Welcome back to the Project Sisterhood Podcast, where we talk all things marriage marketplace ministry. And I'm so excited to, introduce you to many of my friends and one of my friends and sisters being sure. Listen, yes. Actual name. Shortly. Shortly.

00;01;06;09 - 00;01;16;11
Speaker 2
But you're one of my favorite people to pronounce that name because you're the only one that gets it right. Most people say chalet Chardonnay or Chevrolet. So I appreciate your pronunciation of.

00;01;16;12 - 00;01;34;21
Speaker 1
Well, my real name, as you know, is Mary Chris. And when it was red growing up, you know, teachers would read Marcus Lawrence's no Mary. Chris. Duh. Just kidding. It's not a very common name, but if you were to see the pronunciation. Absolutely. Mary. Chris, how do you get that wrong?

00;01;34;22 - 00;01;35;14
Speaker 2
I don't know.

00;01;35;14 - 00;02;00;02
Speaker 1
I always marry Chris, not Marcus. Yeah, I am not a boy, so I. I love your name. I love, I love, just the person you are, and I, like I said, I love introducing my friends, and fellow sisters who are leading in this church to our sisterhood. Because not everybody, as we've grown, I have they've gotten they haven't gotten to know, all the sisters.

00;02;00;02 - 00;02;16;01
Speaker 1
So, Shar, talk to me. Tell me a little bit about who you are. Besides a mama five, a wife and a leader and executive leader in a national organization. Right. So who are you?

00;02;16;04 - 00;02;36;07
Speaker 2
I am a unique individual. I, I am a person that really appreciates culture. Productivity. Yes. I like to be doing and helping and serving where I can and when I can. And, I appreciate really interesting brains like yours. And so this is a perfect pairing.

00;02;36;07 - 00;02;56;11
Speaker 1
Yeah. I remember one of the first times we had coffee, I was like, man, we are just attracted to one another's brains. Yes. I loved how it was working. We like to be strategic. We like to, think things deep thing things practically and everything in between. And so I, I love telling the story of how we got to know one another.

00;02;56;11 - 00;03;24;09
Speaker 1
And I've done this with the last few of our guests, but, we were in Little League two years ago. Pastor Caleb, my husband, he was coaching our boys, Kai and Rocco, and it was so I love that year because, in a predominantly white little league, we had Asians, blacks and whites all on our team and Hispanics, and we were like the most colorful.

00;03;24;11 - 00;03;28;22
Speaker 2
We were the Project Church of Baseball. Yeah, work.

00;03;28;24 - 00;03;40;28
Speaker 1
It was awesome. And so, and not only did we have, you know, a very diverse team, we had very competitive moms. Moms being too. Yeah.

00;03;41;01 - 00;03;47;12
Speaker 2
Yeah. And children that did not, produce the level of competition we were hoping for. So it was wonderful.

00;03;47;17 - 00;04;04;13
Speaker 1
Yeah. So it was it was so interesting. And I knew that you, were in the church. Well, I don't know how I discovered that, but we had some mutual friends, and we're like, man, I really like this person. Let's go to coffee. We go to coffee, and our brains hit it off. Yes. And then I never invited you to church.

00;04;04;18 - 00;04;24;05
Speaker 2
No. Which I loved, first of all. Which might sound weird, but I felt like you weren't pushy. Like I would not have known if it didn't happen organically. And I think organic growth is the best type of growth. And that was really what got me after I met you. And you didn't say a word. And we're sitting in the church at the coffee, didn't say, like, hey, yeah, this is.

00;04;24;05 - 00;04;28;01
Speaker 2
Yeah, you should come. I was like, I want to come. Yeah. So that's really.

00;04;28;06 - 00;04;41;02
Speaker 1
Why do you want to be a sheep stealer? I know that you and your family were figuring out a place to land. And you were already at a church, still figuring out how long you were going to land there. But I didn't want to be a sheep stealer. Yeah.

00;04;41;05 - 00;04;44;07
Speaker 2
Yeah, you were great. It's one of my favorite things about you.

00;04;44;14 - 00;04;59;18
Speaker 1
All things? Yeah, yeah. So then you ended up coming just to check it out? Just, We just kept on becoming friends to hang out at baseball game. Yeah, you gave me some of your desserts. Oh, tell people about your micro bakery.

00;04;59;18 - 00;05;09;08
Speaker 2
Yeah. So I had a micro bakery called The Cake Dealer. And I remember when I met you in baseball, it's like after. Especially after we started talking about competition and, like, what are these kids doing?

00;05;09;10 - 00;05;14;23
Speaker 1
I'm. Oh, no, we said we're not even a baseball family. We're basketball families. And we're like, oh yeah. Yes.

00;05;14;24 - 00;05;22;09
Speaker 2
And I remember thinking you were the sweetest mom ever. And you dressed really cute. Your nails were pastel yellow, which is a it's.

00;05;22;09 - 00;05;25;09
Speaker 1
A it's find it. I don't think I ever had pastel.

00;05;25;16 - 00;05;44;06
Speaker 2
Dell, but. Okay. But also I remember saying like, that's the type of person I want to be connected to. And I couldn't pinpoint why. And then I prepared this box of stuff from our micro bakery, and we just really hit it off. Yeah, I found myself wanting to be around you more, and I always want to be around people that make me better.

00;05;44;06 - 00;05;45;18
Speaker 2
And so yeah, and.

00;05;45;18 - 00;06;11;11
Speaker 1
Then our sisterhood event was coming up, fashion for surrender. Yeah. And you told a testimony, just last year, about your experience at fashion for surrender, particularly the surrender. So you're so kind, and you donated all these desserts, for the events, and everyone got to taste the cake dealers stuff. And you were my cake dealer.

00;06;11;11 - 00;06;18;27
Speaker 1
I'm not even a dessert person. But I eat all of your desserts, especially the caramels. So, so tell me about your experience at fashion for surrender.

00;06;18;29 - 00;06;39;16
Speaker 2
That was an experience I did not ask for. Nor was I ready for it. I thought it was going to be like, you know, I've been to a million women's events in business, especially large scale. I'm like this going to the same thing. I've been to church events and I just wasn't into it. But I wanted to go because I knew I needed to put my best foot forward, to be able to change the experience that I've had in church before.

00;06;39;18 - 00;07;01;16
Speaker 2
And so when I went, I wasn't expecting anything, which was the first problem. And I went and I thought, I'll, you know, do these desserts and I'll meet a couple people and I'll shake hands and kiss a few babies, and then I'll be out of there. Yeah. And, I was completely arrested by God, and I had not cried for years and years and years ever.

00;07;01;19 - 00;07;02;14
Speaker 1
And you told me nine.

00;07;02;15 - 00;07;19;27
Speaker 2
It was nine years. Yeah. And, through deaths and all of that, just no tears came from me. And, I've told you, I've always felt like as a person that has been purposed for pain. And so I just thought like, yeah, it's going to be normal. Totally arrested, the songs that came for the experience. I could not stop crying.

00;07;19;27 - 00;07;27;29
Speaker 2
It was overflowing. And surrender has been my word for many, many years now and I would like it to change. I would.

00;07;28;02 - 00;07;29;11
Speaker 1
Since I don't think it's going to change.

00;07;29;11 - 00;07;30;02
Speaker 2
I don't think so.

00;07;30;05 - 00;07;35;16
Speaker 1
I don't think are absolutely fashion for surrender, and I think that was something that was unlocked for you.

00;07;35;16 - 00;07;54;00
Speaker 2
Yeah, it was. And I keep thinking each year I'll get better at surrender. And I am realizing every year it's not that you get better, it's that you, expect that you need to surrender all the time. And that's hard. But also the reality, following Christ is that you will always need him. So.

00;07;54;03 - 00;08;18;13
Speaker 1
So what I loved as I was getting to know you in this time was seeing the Lord transform you and just love on you. It was like, you are this, well, of, service. Like you were serving your family, serving everybody around you, serving our women that you barely knew. And it was like I was just watching the Lord deposit so much love in you.

00;08;18;19 - 00;08;44;22
Speaker 1
And then it was overflowing. And the way that you continue to serve and, And the, I guess the stance of humility that you were taking in that season, made me more welcome to the idea of you joining as me and Kayla, particularly in leadership. Yeah. Not that you were on staff, but you we actually hired you for, contract work as our leadership coach.

00;08;44;22 - 00;09;10;18
Speaker 1
Yeah. So, again, some more context for you. I, so not only are your mom, you had a micro bakery. Mama five, by the way. You were also in health care for 20 years, and you have done so much work with culture in health care systems. So talk to us about how you came to becoming me and Caleb's leadership coach.

00;09;10;22 - 00;09;34;10
Speaker 2
Yeah, I remember I actually remember saying to you, I think I, I reached out to you either by text or email. And I said, I would really love to work with you or something. And I have an executive coaching background. I've been in health care for, like, over 25 years. And, the latter part of my career has been in consulting, where I move into major hospital systems internationally and nationally and just completely change their trajectory.

00;09;34;13 - 00;09;53;24
Speaker 2
Generally, people hire me to obviously get their EBITDA and their margins better, but I go in with the intent to change their entire culture. And that will, you know, in turn, give them dividends year over year over year. And, I loved project because it would be one of the only times I could probably go into an institution and not change everything because it's terrible.

00;09;53;24 - 00;10;19;15
Speaker 2
But to be part of something that's healthy and it just becomes even healthier. Yeah, that was really interesting to me. And I have had, I've always had the outlook that church is a lot like health care. Yeah, health care people come when they're sick. But I feel like at project even people that aren't sick or hurting or in dire straits at the moment, they still come and there's a need and, so we started working together and I felt like that season was one of my favorite seasons.

00;10;19;22 - 00;10;26;22
Speaker 2
It felt like we were never really working. We were creating, we were strategizing, we were vibing. I feel like we could have gotten our sleeping bags.

00;10;26;22 - 00;10;27;09
Speaker 1
Yeah, and just.

00;10;27;09 - 00;10;29;12
Speaker 2
Stayed here and it would have felt like, you know, it.

00;10;29;12 - 00;10;48;14
Speaker 1
Was so fun. I think one of the things that stuck out to me was you telling us that there's something healthy in this culture, and you identified it. You've done culture work in, healthcare systems for so long, and you are a coach and you're like, if you can identify where you're healthy, then your culture will only get healthier.

00;10;48;16 - 00;11;11;03
Speaker 1
You can maintain it. Yeah. And, you know, sometimes we set out to do whatever God has given us a vision for, and we're always like, okay, God, just kind of take us in. He's going to just grow us. But I think good stewardship over what God has given us, whatever vision he's given us, is to identify why things are working, what he put in place and allowed to work.

00;11;11;08 - 00;11;32;25
Speaker 1
And when you can identify those, name it and reproduce it, then I think that's just good stewardship. So you really helped us take our stewardship, I think, to another level. And that started with me and Caleb doing, taking an honest look at where we were deficient, but again, not just focusing only on our deficiency, but also what are we doing?

00;11;32;25 - 00;11;35;11
Speaker 1
Well, yeah. Identify it, name it and you'll repeat it.

00;11;35;11 - 00;11;43;15
Speaker 2
Yeah. Right. I think to so your process, in having me. Come on. We went through an assessment, which was a very fun time.

00;11;43;15 - 00;11;45;19
Speaker 1
Oh, my gosh, it was very revealing.

00;11;45;19 - 00;12;06;23
Speaker 2
Yeah, it was revealing, but it was fun because most of the time when I do an assessment, it's it's a white glove and it's really hard for people to hear what's going wrong. You guys had overwhelmingly more things going right and working for you. So I knew the work would be funner. Not necessarily easy, but funner. Then you went through that phase where it was restructuring, like, let's let's figure out the parts that are a little bit fragmented.

00;12;06;26 - 00;12;23;09
Speaker 2
And so that was really where you and I and Caleb started rolling up our sleeves and getting into the real work, and then starting to see the fruits and getting other people to join in on the conversation and come up with witty ideas. Was really, I think what was the catalyst to a lot of the work you guys still are doing.

00;12;23;09 - 00;12;23;20
Speaker 2
So.

00;12;23;20 - 00;12;42;18
Speaker 1
So tell me what the difference was to you working in, while you were in health care? I know that's the market. And you're currently working for a nationwide fertility company. So, the marketplace. Tell me the difference that you see between marketplace and ministry and just leadership in general.

00;12;42;19 - 00;13;01;02
Speaker 2
Yeah, I think the biggest difference and the the part that keeps me up at night is, the connection to the mission in health care that gets lost, even though we're taking care of six people and they're in front of us every day, you would think it would be at the forefront. But we get lost in dollars often in health care, which is what's a little bit, of the problem in health care.

00;13;01;04 - 00;13;21;09
Speaker 2
We've been at health care for a very long time. And we have not solved the really easy problems, which is, you know, putting people first in ministry. I think that is at the forefront. And I think we do it better in ministry. And I think that's something that, is a big takeaway. How can we do more of what the church is doing in our business and in leadership?

00;13;21;09 - 00;13;24;09
Speaker 2
And, that's hard for people to swallow.

00;13;24;11 - 00;13;51;11
Speaker 1
Yeah, yeah. Well, I think that, I've loved marrying, some corporate practices with some ministry practices organization. Again, it's not because we're becoming corporate. It's because I think God has called us to steward some things. Well, yeah. And so, I remember as saying that with health care, it was like you were helping, in the world in that sense.

00;13;51;11 - 00;13;57;25
Speaker 1
But then ministry is also health care for our soul. It is in our spirituality. How did it change you? How did it impact you?

00;13;57;26 - 00;14;16;19
Speaker 2
Yeah. So it's really sad the way it impacted me because I've been I was literally born into health care. I was born on Halloween and, my mum was pulling a double shift as a clown, like she was working as a candy striper, which nowadays is like a certified nursing assistant. She's in a clown suit, like a vintage big nose, the whole thing.

00;14;16;19 - 00;14;17;04
Speaker 1
Okay.

00;14;17;04 - 00;14;32;15
Speaker 2
And she goes into labor on her double shift. And I'm literally born to a clown. Right? So this is hilarious. So she knew at a very young age that I was going to be in health care. Like she said, I was the er baby. I was always in the hospital, and by the time I was five, I was telling the doctors, like, you shouldn't say that you should do this.

00;14;32;15 - 00;14;58;19
Speaker 2
And so it's translated into my career. But the sad part is that the longer I spent in ministry, the more I wanted to get out of health care. Which is, sad for me because I so passionate about health care and helping people. But what has been really challenging about being in ministry, because I've worked with other ministries on changing culture, is what you just identified, is that it's really hard for a lot of churches to wrap their hands around how you mix business with ministry.

00;14;58;19 - 00;15;10;14
Speaker 2
And I always hear, no, this is ministry. This is not a business. But I actually think, the infrastructure that stands up business is very similar to ministry with a greater cause and ministry.

00;15;10;16 - 00;15;33;00
Speaker 1
What what do you think is important to a you're saying like I think one of your personal slogans is, people over profit. And that ultimately is should be our call. Whether you're in ministry or the marketplace. Yeah. I think as Christians we go into places and spaces with that at the top of our hearts. And, what do you think the key is to.

00;15;33;01 - 00;15;51;00
Speaker 1
Because you're going to the marketplace job every day. I mean, this woman, I cannot tell you. I don't understand how productive you are and how you can, you know, it's so funny. She works in our co-working space, and we share an office with me, her and Caleb. And, you know, sometimes people have meetings with me and there.

00;15;51;00 - 00;16;06;12
Speaker 1
And I'm like, those numbers aren't ours because it's like 4.7 million. And, you know, it's like, that is not project churches number is, you know, that's all of, you know, source numbers. But like, I almost lost my question. Darn it. This happens a lot of times. You know, where I was going.

00;16;06;12 - 00;16;08;18
Speaker 2
I think, like, where you're going is.

00;16;08;21 - 00;16;11;14
Speaker 1
I love it. This is our relationship to.

00;16;11;17 - 00;16;16;26
Speaker 2
Are you wondering how what are the things in business that we should be bringing into ministry to.

00;16;16;28 - 00;16;18;28
Speaker 1
A a great. Yeah, yeah. Go there.

00;16;18;28 - 00;16;38;04
Speaker 2
So the concept that I think is, what works for both. So there's this. So I want to talk about Apple real quick. And you know I met on the lease technical person you know. So you know what it gets me is when I think about Apple and this is controversial I don't actually think Apple has a demonstrably better product do you.

00;16;38;06 - 00;16;54;27
Speaker 2
Okay nevermind I'll answer that. Do you like Apple? But what I'll say is I think Apple they you can make a call, you can text message. Those are the things I like to do on so how are they so successful if their product is not demonstrably better, right. Yeah.

00;16;55;00 - 00;16;57;18
Speaker 1
What is it? The simplicity. User friendly.

00;16;57;18 - 00;17;13;14
Speaker 2
Yeah. So here's how it ties into health care. And this is what I do every day. I go into physicians who have been doing this for 40 years. I'm not a clinical person and I'm not an A person. You want an emergency? Okay. But what I say to them is the apple equation. And, they're stumped. And I say, what are that?

00;17;13;14 - 00;17;28;00
Speaker 2
So in when physicians go to med school, when they decide to become a surgeon, they're taught you think that they're taught like something really cool. And actually they're not. They're taught the three A's. Every surgeon is taught this. If you can achieve these three A's when you go into business, you will have patients forever.

00;17;28;00 - 00;17;30;20
Speaker 1
Let me guess and see if I'm a good student. Affability.

00;17;30;23 - 00;17;31;12
Speaker 2
Yes.

00;17;31;12 - 00;17;35;27
Speaker 1
Right. Accessibility. Yeah. Oh what was the third one.

00;17;35;29 - 00;17;36;21
Speaker 2
Availability.

00;17;36;21 - 00;17;37;18
Speaker 1
Availability.

00;17;37;18 - 00;17;56;15
Speaker 2
So affability is do they like us. Yes. Do we do that at church. Yeah. Right. You don't want somebody to be a host that doesn't want to serve because it comes out and bleeds all over the congregation. Right. I don't serve if that's if that's your spirit. Right. So people have to like us not just the word like they have to feel like they can act.

00;17;56;15 - 00;18;14;29
Speaker 2
That's possibility. Physicians need to do the same thing, or you're probably not going to go take your son to that doctor. Right. Availability. Do people know how to access us, where our building is? Is it clear how to get here? You would be surprised in health care, in the hospital, I do this thing where I sit in a wheelchair and they push me around.

00;18;14;29 - 00;18;36;06
Speaker 2
I have a camera because I need them to see what a patient sees when they come into a health care system. And there's signs that say the ERS this way, and I follow it, and it doesn't take you to the E.R. it's actually that way. There's trash, there's floors, have stuff on them. I do an audit, a pride audit where I drop a piece of trash and I sit in the lunchroom, and it's, like, glaring.

00;18;36;10 - 00;18;57;13
Speaker 2
And I see how many people with badges just walk over it. It's on camera, and I count it for an hour. I love time studies. So in the church, it's the same. Do people know how to get to project church? Yeah. What could make it more clear? And then, accessibility is can they get online? Do they know how to access what happens if there's trouble?

00;18;57;13 - 00;19;12;03
Speaker 2
Do they call you or do they call Pastor Sam, or should they go to Caleb? Right. So if we can nail those three things in business, yeah, people will come in. They'll stay. Because the goal is not just that they come to the door. The goal is that their hearts are captured and they become part of our family.

00;19;12;03 - 00;19;13;20
Speaker 2
Right. It's the same for church.

00;19;13;20 - 00;19;34;26
Speaker 1
It's a great lesson for just teams. Yeah. Which I should invite you to do our next team talk. Just kidding. Kind of. Yeah. No, she's not kidding. Love that. I think some of the things that we learned while you're with us, first of all, when you were doing an audit of us, you sat in one of our staff meetings and you ticked every time somebody interrupted somebody.

00;19;34;29 - 00;19;39;15
Speaker 1
And I want to tell everybody the results, but it may be incriminating to the man.

00;19;39;17 - 00;19;41;12
Speaker 2
It's might be, it might be, might be.

00;19;41;15 - 00;20;04;02
Speaker 1
I just gave it up right there. But the amount of times certain people and certain agendas would interrupt the others and, and it was just it was so great and refreshing to have another eye on the organization. That again, was for us because they're it's easy to become critical when you're not for an organization or for somebody that you're trying, quote unquote, to help.

00;20;04;02 - 00;20;06;12
Speaker 1
Yeah. You know, or that you're supposed to be serving it.

00;20;06;14 - 00;20;25;16
Speaker 2
You know what's interesting, too, as you're tying this thread of, business and church, that data that came out of that assessment that I did is the same data that comes out of assessments I do in huge hospital system, 600 bed hospital systems, international hospital systems, Army, all of the military hospital systems. The data is the same. Yeah.

00;20;25;19 - 00;20;41;25
Speaker 2
Whether it's who interrupts, how often they interrupt. What's confusing? I ask this question when I go into churches or into health care systems. Hey, I know nothing about your system. I just want to talk to the people that serve here every day, are here every day, are committed to being here or on the fence and are are wanting to leave.

00;20;42;00 - 00;20;54;05
Speaker 2
What's missing, confusing and wrong. And most people don't want to ask that question because they have to deal with the answer. But the reality is if we can solve those things, yeah. Then we have of affability accessibility and availability.

00;20;54;08 - 00;21;19;01
Speaker 1
Oh that's so good. We actually, that's how we assess our services. What's wrong, missing or confusing? And also we've in other seasons we've said what makes us happy and what's crappy and what's the API. What how are we going to apply? So that's another way, I think if you're trying to assess something, what's what makes you happy, what's actually crappy and is the application, what are the APIs?

00;21;19;01 - 00;21;40;19
Speaker 1
So I just made up a word there, but we use it in our staff for years. Too, it really is. I think what I love about the business tools that you've given us, the resources, and you really came during a time where Caleb and I felt like we're coming out of a foggy season where we were like, we need some marriage tools, we need some leadership tools, and we just need something to break.

00;21;40;19 - 00;21;48;14
Speaker 1
What we feel like was a glass ceiling over us and so when we had somebody who was for us and cheering us on, if you're going to be a coach, you have to be for the people.

00;21;48;14 - 00;21;49;02
Speaker 2
Yeah, you have.

00;21;49;02 - 00;22;13;19
Speaker 1
To be more for them than you're critical of that. And so I felt like you came in and it just lifted the lid for us and took our leadership to the to the next level. And I think what I love about, you bringing in that business mindset was that there are some practical tools and, great research that had come with it and just great application.

00;22;13;19 - 00;22;35;12
Speaker 1
Yeah, very practical. And, but I will say this, I think that we've maintained keeping the main thing. The main thing was, which is the Holy Spirit empowered ministry and Holy Spirit empowered ministry, we were able to prioritize the presence of God still, because we knew that some of these other, resources and tools were keeping the other things afloat.

00;22;35;12 - 00;23;03;11
Speaker 1
But sometimes I think as ministers, yeah, we put so much into the practical, we put so much into, how are we going to draw people like and it's like when you have some systems and resources, tools that kind of allow those things to just flow and go, we can keep on prioritizing the presence of God. Yeah. And so it just gave us like just relieve some of the brain fog that Caleb and I were coming out of a hard year.

00;23;03;17 - 00;23;04;17
Speaker 1
Yeah. Our season.

00;23;04;17 - 00;23;32;06
Speaker 2
I feel like you all really were set up for success. You already had the things that were the hard things to implement, so I knew it was going to be a bit easier where I think I really started seeing you all really, really flow, probably more expeditiously than I would have anticipated. Just because I've done this work for a long time is related to when you, when and how you both started using the filter to empower teams to make decisions because you guys are not able to be everywhere.

00;23;32;08 - 00;23;48;21
Speaker 2
And that's where I think leaders get it wrong. I've been in other church systems, but also in, health care, where leaders assume that when they don't empower people to make decisions, that that's leadership. And what you actually do is you work against yourself and your organization, in this case, your church. You and Caleb are really open to that.

00;23;48;21 - 00;24;11;07
Speaker 2
And then what came after that was how you all conducted the risk assessment for launching your second, site and the way you all ran through that, the process with which the thought, how you included people, that's how you sustain. And I think more, more people in leaders and organizations focus on getting people in the door. What they should be focusing on is how do you keep people in the seat?

00;24;11;09 - 00;24;32;10
Speaker 1
I you know, I'm not trying to have you tell everybody our are great. What is it called, a scorecard? I feel like you've given us a great scorecard, but some of these principles that you're talking about that we did well. And I will say this, I think we can apply things that we're talking about to our families, in our workplaces, in, in the ministries or some of these things.

00;24;32;10 - 00;24;57;02
Speaker 1
I know a lot of women in our community. They're starting businesses, they're starting groups, they're leading a community group here, and they have this vision. We have some friends who are leading, I shout out Jen and her, walking club and shout out, you know, girls night out. And and there's so many things and tools and resources that you've given us that can really help us sustain the things that God has given us vision for.

00;24;57;09 - 00;25;19;09
Speaker 1
And so, the filter talked to us about a filter because ultimately, if I again, I'm one of your students, I would say as, as a leadership coach, if I was a good student, I hopefully this is right, that the filter is really, what we pass all decisions through in order to maintain the right culture. The filter shows us what our culture is and culture is what we stand for.

00;25;19;09 - 00;25;20;06
Speaker 1
Yeah, and.

00;25;20;08 - 00;25;20;20
Speaker 2
And what you.

00;25;20;20 - 00;25;44;19
Speaker 1
Don't see and what we don't stand for. And I think we need to determine that for our families, for our businesses, for our groups, for our endeavors, for our church. We need to know what we stand for and what we don't. And so this filter is something that we can apply to our lives. So if you could somehow make this in a really, app, it's I don't know if that's the word I'm looking for, you know, can you make it to where.

00;25;44;19 - 00;25;46;08
Speaker 1
Yeah, I serve up the ladies here.

00;25;46;08 - 00;26;03;17
Speaker 2
I have so many tools in the tool belt. Right. But, I think the tool for leaders, if I had to choose one, it would be the operational priorities, which is the filter. So whether you're in your personal life or your business life, you should be able to use this. It applies everywhere. Every business, every church has multiple competing priorities.

00;26;03;17 - 00;26;24;08
Speaker 2
That's really what this is dealing with. And when there is a dilemma, you need to be able to figure out how to make decisions aligned with the way pastor Caleb and Pastor Christy would make decisions, because otherwise they're going to be on the phone calling you. And so being able to filter those competing priorities and know what to do equips your team with yet another tool on how to do things the way Project Church does them.

00;26;24;10 - 00;26;46;25
Speaker 2
So the filter prioritizes what I would say the top four that exists in every institution. It doesn't matter if you're a hospital, a church, a jail, an education system, it's all the same. There's many, but the four are safety, which is normally an assumed priority. People assume when they walk into a hospital that they're safe. That is probably the worst assumption you could make.

00;26;46;28 - 00;26;54;05
Speaker 2
But it's a non-negotiable. So you should think of your first priority as non-negotiable. If it's not there, you don't have a business, you don't have a church.

00;26;54;05 - 00;27;01;20
Speaker 1
And I want women to be listening to this with your families in mind, with your businesses in mind, with your ministries in mind. Yeah. Keep going.

00;27;01;22 - 00;27;20;02
Speaker 2
So the second would be, compassion. And it's interesting. That was a hard sell when I started this work, because healthcare systems don't think compassion is as important as your EBITDA or your dollar, but it actually is more important than that, because without that compassion, especially in the day and age we're living in now, people won't come.

00;27;20;07 - 00;27;23;21
Speaker 2
They'll just find the hospital system or the church. That's kinda.

00;27;23;26 - 00;27;29;26
Speaker 1
Right. And isn't this also the second level? The filter is what gives you kind of your competitive edge, the.

00;27;29;26 - 00;27;50;28
Speaker 2
Second and third part. So step two and three are priorities two and three compassion. And the third one being expertise are your competitive advantage. It it's what sets you apart. So that's how people will know you in the community. And if you don't nail those you'll die to the competition. Or in this case, somebody will just leave your church and go to another church because it didn't stick.

00;27;51;00 - 00;28;09;05
Speaker 2
The fourth priority, which is equally as important, but you have to know that when you're using this filter, although it's number four equally important. But if these are all glass balls that you're juggling, the one you're going to drop first is four. Because without the one through three, you won't have you won't have the business. Yeah, the fourth is stewardship.

00;28;09;11 - 00;28;28;03
Speaker 2
So that is not just money, which is what people assume, but it's how do we use our resources. Do we have enough resources? How do we treat our resources? How do we think about allocation of time and energy? And time is especially important more than money, because it's the only nonrenewable resource. And so, that stands up your business.

00;28;28;08 - 00;28;44;04
Speaker 2
Yeah. So when you think about it in that way, if you can teach people how to make decisions when you and Caleb are not in the room based on those types of priorities, you will start seeing that everyone is making decisions aligned with the church and not with what they want to do or their agenda. Yeah.

00;28;44;04 - 00;29;05;19
Speaker 1
Oh, that's so good. And I think that, God has given each of the women listening to this a vision for their families, their businesses or their ministries. And I think we should you should write down what are your four priorities in line with the safety, with the compassion, with the expertise. And then finally, stewardship. Really understand what you stand for and what you are against.

00;29;05;19 - 00;29;25;23
Speaker 1
And I think that will really help us be more effective and and successful as, as women. And okay, last thing I kind of want to there's so much that I want to get in with you. You guys, this is one of my favorite people on the planet, okay? She's, one of my besties, but also, I just, but I do.

00;29;25;23 - 00;29;58;12
Speaker 1
I just love your brain so much, and you're always just so encouraging. And I love working alongside of you. It's so fun to work alongside of people that you actually like. Yeah, that helps a lot. And and sisterhood has been something that I think that allowed some of this work to move forward. Talk to me about what you've learned since being a part of our community, and what sisterhood has taught you, brought you, how the Lord's blessed you, how the Lord's challenged you.

00;29;58;12 - 00;30;21;00
Speaker 1
Talk to me about sisterhood because, you're not going to be able to do this stuff alone. That the filter, the priorities. You can't think of all of it on your own. Yeah. There's always some helpmate that God has given you, whether it's you being the great spouse to your husband or, you're partnering with your kids, you're partnering with, people that are volunteering or people who you're hiring.

00;30;21;00 - 00;30;25;28
Speaker 1
So talk to me about community. Talk to me about sisterhood. How have you been impacted?

00;30;26;01 - 00;30;27;06
Speaker 2
Yeah, I think.

00;30;27;06 - 00;30;30;03
Speaker 1
That playing all that sorry, I you know what I want.

00;30;30;04 - 00;30;50;12
Speaker 2
Yeah. Community. You know, I didn't value community in the same way that I do now having gone to project because I didn't come from a place where that was, something that was talked, talked about or even encouraged. And so learning about community and how there's so much power and togetherness than there is doing things on your own, has been really an eye opener.

00;30;50;15 - 00;31;14;08
Speaker 2
I think community is especially important and hard for people to grasp when they're high, reliance people when they rely on themselves. But when you have to fall to community, you realize that community is what keeps everything going. But to me, the community is the engine to anything. And it's been interesting watching it develop at project, because I feel like community has always been huge here.

00;31;14;13 - 00;31;33;18
Speaker 2
But it just keeps growing. I also have found that in community there's still conflict. Yeah. And, the way you work through the conflict and rise above it and decide to commit and collaborate together is really where the rubber meets the road. And it's what God expects of all of us. And so I think it's like the bloodline.

00;31;33;18 - 00;31;41;29
Speaker 2
I think without it, you know, you can have great ideas, you can have really great strategy. But the reality is that culture eats strategy for lunch.

00;31;41;29 - 00;31;42;11
Speaker 1
Yeah.

00;31;42;11 - 00;31;48;03
Speaker 2
And if part of your culture is not community, you're you're going to be lunch, right?

00;31;48;03 - 00;32;09;22
Speaker 1
Yeah. It's so good. Oh, I love that. You said something there. That community is the bloodline. Yeah, which is totally in line with our vision here at church. That community is our heart, and. Right. That's where the blood's pumping. That's right. And it's the, lifeline for. Yes. Right. And so I think community is so important. And I'm just going to address something that.

00;32;09;25 - 00;32;13;01
Speaker 1
Oh, you are you aren't ready for this, but. Yeah. Okay.

00;32;13;01 - 00;32;13;24
Speaker 2
I love that.

00;32;13;24 - 00;32;14;11
Speaker 1
Service.

00;32;14;11 - 00;32;16;03
Speaker 2
I love surprises.

00;32;16;05 - 00;32;41;07
Speaker 1
And I think this is a really good piece where I'm going to practice vulnerability here because community, only works when there's vulnerability. And so, it was so I, I can't believe I'm saying this, but I, I'm I'm getting a chance. But I sister had it was it was so magical. And the season that we're working together and please, nobody get really weird religious about that.

00;32;41;07 - 00;33;01;00
Speaker 1
Magical in the sense of being like, holy. Yeah. All over it. Yeah. And operating on all cylinders. And, we are getting through personal challenges and ministry challenges. Yeah. All together, supporting one another and all these things. And then there came a season. Yeah. Where you got a job in the corporate world.

00;33;01;03 - 00;33;01;17
Speaker 2
Yeah.

00;33;01;17 - 00;33;29;03
Speaker 1
You moved out of the, stay at home mom's situation, contracting work and micro bakery, and then, you kind of rising to dream job. Yeah. Level. It was amazing. Like, we're so excited for you. I remember we went and celebrated you getting this dream job situation. Although I was totally grieving, knowing that our time wasn't going to be the same because you weren't, you wouldn't have the same availability.

00;33;29;05 - 00;33;50;23
Speaker 1
So then, if I'm being honest, I kind of was. I was so sad that I kind of got in my feelings of, like, oh, man, I really miss her. Yeah. And then there was some disconnection there. Yeah, but not because anything had actually taken place. There was no actual offense. Yeah, with one another. It was just kind of like, oh, I was sad.

00;33;50;25 - 00;34;04;22
Speaker 1
And our relationship changed and there was separation. Yeah. And then there came conflict. Yeah. I mean, there are other conflicts that may have played into this. We don't need to go into all of that a little bit, but yeah.

00;34;04;24 - 00;34;07;07
Speaker 2
I mean, yeah, yeah.

00;34;07;10 - 00;34;31;15
Speaker 1
Outside of conflict outside of me and you, there are other conflicts that were like playing, probably a role. So in our friendship. But what we say and we've said that many times that conflict is a price we pay for a deepening level of intimacy. And so even though I know that there was a season of disconnection, I was like, oh my gosh, I think I'm sad.

00;34;31;15 - 00;34;54;26
Speaker 1
But the sadness might be turning into offense. Yeah, sadness might be turning to confusion. What? Probably more confusion. And then it was like me believing the best and telling myself to believe the best was, not working anymore. Yeah. And so it was. It was almost like God brought me to the point of like, okay, you're not going to be able to handle this alone.

00;34;54;28 - 00;35;20;07
Speaker 1
I think we sometimes try to handle conflicts with a sister or a brother or our community in our own heads, and that doesn't work. Yes. It does not work. You're trying to figure out things in your mind first. And and not even with God. You just ruminating and thinking about things on your own is called self-reliance, self dependance.

00;35;20;07 - 00;35;39;29
Speaker 1
And so the Lord very much convicted my heart. And he said, you have to go tell her now that this is how you feel. And I go, no, I, I, I am not offended. I believe the best only but I had to like come, come clean and you hadn't even done anything. But seasons change and friendships and I.

00;35;39;29 - 00;35;43;07
Speaker 1
Yeah. I was like, hey, my feelings are hurt.

00;35;43;10 - 00;36;10;08
Speaker 2
I was so glad you said that to me because I had so much going on and so much, so much excitement and pain at the same time happening in my life that you're very aware of that. I think I just wasn't aware that that shift in time had created this narrative, and was causing friction. Yeah. And what's interesting, because, you know, I love science, it's interesting that you say, like, we can't just be thinking about things in our head.

00;36;10;10 - 00;36;38;12
Speaker 2
The brain actually is meant to solve complex problems, and you're talking about self-reliance. And I think this is something where people that are too heady get themselves in trouble, right? When you don't have a problem to solve, your brain will create a problem. It will try to solve, because that's what it does. And so it's interesting, as I've reflected on that season that we had, I've thought more about my self reliance, and I'm definitely a person that relies on myself, and that's something I'm trying to work on.

00;36;38;12 - 00;36;57;01
Speaker 2
But I think that's where community comes in. Is to your point, like the noise stops when you engage the community, because that's when you're really going to get to the reality of what is the issue. And if there is a fence or there is a problem, let's solve it. You won't solve it by yourself. And I've realized that that's the catalyst for me when that's happening, which happens often.

00;36;57;01 - 00;37;15;00
Speaker 2
I'm the person. Like when I go on the road, my house is going to burn down, my kids are going to get kidnaped. Everything's going to happen. But none of it has happened. Is like pray first. Yes. Which I know you're a devout prayer. But also go to the community and just sort it out. And so I think, yeah.

00;37;15;02 - 00;37;16;16
Speaker 1
Can you say, like, there's a price to pay?

00;37;16;18 - 00;37;17;02
Speaker 2
I love that.

00;37;17;07 - 00;37;43;06
Speaker 1
Love the intimacy. Yeah. And we definitely hit another level in our friendship and trust, as increased. But I think that Sisterhood Kent will go through seasons and we can sometimes be operating on all cylinders. But we need the Lord's help to keep us united. And, open dialog, open conversations and really sharing your heart and vulnerability is going to make the difference in all your friendships and all your relationships.

00;37;43;08 - 00;38;04;05
Speaker 1
And so I'm just I'm just grateful for that season, even. And I, I think there's a lot more work in the kingdom to do with the people that we have conflict with and the people that we love, like. And let's just be honest, I mean, I, I was my husband the most. I have the most conflict with him, but I wouldn't want to deal with anybody else.

00;38;04;05 - 00;38;28;25
Speaker 1
And the the depth of our relationship and intimacy is like the roots of a redwood tree. You know, I and there have been a lot of winds and waves and, a lot of stuff trying to come at us, but because our roots and our commitment to doing conflict well and our commitment to growing and deepening our intimacy, through conflict is, yeah, that's what's keeping us here.

00;38;28;25 - 00;38;50;13
Speaker 1
And I think that for our friendships, I'm thinking that for. And let me just bring it back to Ephesians 222. It says, in whom the whole structure being joined together grows into a holy temple. And the Lord let me go further back. So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God.

00;38;50;13 - 00;39;12;08
Speaker 1
We're the household of God. We are the family of God. We're being built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets. Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone in whom the whole structure being joined together, grows into a temple, a holy temple in the Lord. In him you are also being built together into a dwelling place for God by the spirit.

00;39;12;15 - 00;39;35;17
Speaker 1
Yeah, when we do community well, when we grow together in community and deepen our connection in conflict, then we're built together in unity to allow the Spirit of God to dwell in and among us and to do what only he can do. Yeah, he will remove offense. He will forgive us because we've forgiven others where we can be.

00;39;35;17 - 00;39;57;09
Speaker 1
Forget it. Forgiven is if we forgive others. And so, man, this dwelling place will make us, you know, more in touch and connected with Holy Spirit and will make us more effective in the kingdom. Because he is our driving force. He is the one holding us together. He is the one giving us vision. He is the one giving us strategy.

00;39;57;15 - 00;40;20;01
Speaker 1
But we have to do it together. Yeah, sisterhood is so important. And, I've seen sisterhood in our lives with whether we're doing family together, whether we're doing ministry together, where we're whether we're like trying to do all these other ventures on the side together. Yeah. Side gigs. Yeah. It's just been a beautiful thing. I wouldn't want to do it, without that sisterhood component.

00;40;20;01 - 00;40;20;11
Speaker 1
So.

00;40;20;11 - 00;40;42;16
Speaker 2
Yeah, I have to say, one of my favorite things about what Project Church has taught me about sisterhood is how much sisterhood and the strength and health of it is reliant on the strength and health of our brotherhood. Yeah, and I love that project. Church is really committed to aligning that principles, doing things together. You know, I'm used to the guys are over here, the girls over here, we've got our own thing and we're killing it.

00;40;42;16 - 00;40;45;17
Speaker 2
And they're in a season where they're not. And that's just not acceptable at Project Church.

00;40;45;17 - 00;41;03;23
Speaker 1
Yeah. Oh, I remember there was a there was a season where, one woman I've got and I'm telling you, she was amazing. She did say something to me though, where I was like, oh, we need to correct that a little bit. Or maybe not move forward in the same way. But she said, as the sisterhood goes, so goes the rest of the church.

00;41;03;26 - 00;41;25;10
Speaker 1
And I just thought, oh, I don't want it to be led by the sisterhood. I want the brotherhood and sisterhood to be alongside one another, where the kingdom of God is seen in its fullness. And I not I'm not saying that I want to hide behind brotherhood, but I just think that we're supposed to be alongside one another so that we can present a full image of God and His body.

00;41;25;18 - 00;41;45;17
Speaker 1
So, yeah, brother and sister, that's also important. And I see that we're getting to partner with our men, and brotherhood is getting stronger. Yeah. And healthy. And it's it's just an exciting time in our church, so I love it. Love you so much, Ruby. I know that you're like one of the OGs on the podcast. Yeah, I'm from season two.

00;41;45;18 - 00;41;46;03
Speaker 1
What season?

00;41;46;08 - 00;41;47;05
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah.

00;41;47;07 - 00;41;52;16
Speaker 1
Yeah, yeah, they're great. So, so we won't be seeing The last of you.

00;41;52;19 - 00;41;52;27
Speaker 2
No you.

00;41;52;27 - 00;42;22;00
Speaker 1
Won't. Yeah. So thanks for being with us and sharing your brain with the sisterhood. I hope some of you ladies were able to grab some nuggets. Yeah, especially with that filter. I hope you took some notes. And I ultimately hope that your sisterhood is strengthened and even your, understanding of culture for wherever you are influencing your families, your ministries, the marketplace, your jobs, whatever it is that you are pursuing, know that the culture is that is very important.

00;42;22;00 - 00;42;22;19
Speaker 2
Yeah.

00;42;22;21 - 00;42;32;22
Speaker 1
To that. So God's going to determine that with you. So be obedient. Oh, we didn't do a, we normally do, book recommendation and book recommendations before we leave that.

00;42;32;24 - 00;42;34;27
Speaker 2
You don't want to talk to me about books. I have so many.

00;42;34;27 - 00;42;35;23
Speaker 1
Yeah.

00;42;35;25 - 00;42;53;29
Speaker 2
You know, there is a book that I would recommend called The Obstacle Is the Way. And it's really kind of a lot about what you were talking about with, with community and sisterhood and working through challenge and conflict. And it basically teaches you to stop trying to go around the obstacle. You actually have to go through it.

00;42;53;29 - 00;42;58;03
Speaker 2
And I think that's biblical. And so, yeah, that's the book I would recommend for the day.

00;42;58;03 - 00;43;19;18
Speaker 1
Beautiful. This is not a Jesus book, but it's the one that you just recommended to me. I don't know if this is the best one. Good strategy, bad astrology. Understanding what strategy is as opposed to vision. So some of us are thinking that, oh, I have a great vision for this, that and the other. But maybe God's actually asking you to be strategic and really good stewardship of what God's already entrusted you with.

00;43;19;20 - 00;43;39;29
Speaker 1
Strategy isn't just expansion and vision and more money. You know, it's requiring more resources of you. Strategy will help you be responsible with the resources God has already given you and the stewardship that you need in your life. So I guess that's a good one, especially for those of you who are business leaders. That's that's a great one.

00;43;40;01 - 00;43;50;12
Speaker 2
If you want to kingdom one, there's a book called Jesus CEO, which teaches leaders all of the principles that Jesus led through in his ministry and how you can apply it to your business.

00;43;50;12 - 00;44;12;01
Speaker 1
Beautiful, beautiful. All right, ladies, I hope that you got a lot from this podcast. Don't forget that we have sisterhood. Coming up, sisters nights, October 24th. We're we hope that you're there. This this might be airing on that actual day. If so, see you tonight. If not, no worries. But we love you, ladies. Stay strong, stay cool.

00;44;12;01 - 00;44;13;12
Speaker 1
We love you. See you next time.