2. Structures and Scaffolds

Jen Sigrist, Director of Educational Services at Central Rivers AEA, discusses instructional shifts a teacher can make in the classroom to support learner agency.

What is Learner Agency?

Discussions around the importance of Learner Agency in the educational process.

Beth Strike: Welcome to the Central Rivers AEA learning on demand podcast. I'm Beth Strike and I'm the director of creative services and communications. And I'm here with Jen Sigrist, director of educational services and a leading expert on Future Ready practices in the state, if not the nation really. Jen, welcome.

Jen Sigrist: Thanks Beth, good to be here.

Beth Strike: Awesome. So today we're going to talk about going [00:00:30] beyond embedding choice in your instruction. We're going to explore more advanced ways to promote learner agency. And I know very little about this topic, so this is going to be fun.

Jen Sigrist: Be fun for me too.

Beth Strike: Oh, right? All right. Let's dive right in. So when it comes to learner agency, what are the instructional shifts a teacher would need to make? So I know we talked earlier in a more beginning level podcast about just this whole concept of what it is, but now we want to really get into the instructional shifts. So can you talk about that a little bit?

Jen Sigrist: Sure. [00:01:00] As a secondary teacher, I learned about this probably the most from being an elementary principal, watching elementary teachers establish routines and put structures in place so kids over the course of the year can be more independent, is really where I started to understand some of the instructional shifts we're going to talk about today for learner agency. As a high school teacher, when I had a 15, [00:01:30] 16 year old come into my classroom, I'm like, "Why don't you already know this? Why can't you already figure out the steps you need to take to complete this project? It's due in two weeks, just get it done." And I didn't understand the things that I could do as a teacher to set them up for success in managing their own time and their own project. So when we think about instructional shifts that a teacher can make, one of the things that I think about is start small [00:02:00] in giving kids choice and freedom in their learning, and building structures that you can take away over time.

Scaffolds you can take away over time, like daily check-ins just as an example. So you could start with a project and we have students maybe choosing how they're going to complete a project. Everyone has it due at same time, but they have lots of freedom let's say in how they're going to come across this information. Well, [00:02:30] the first time you give them this choice, instead of saying, "It's due in two weeks, go." You could say, "I'm going to build in a pre check-in for this class and at the end of class I'm going to check-in and we're going to see what we accomplished, what worked well today?" So just building in some of those scaffolds so kids have time to think about, "Hey, what worked for me today, what didn't? What do I want to do differently tomorrow?" So giving time for those conversations that we just assume kids have, [00:03:00] is also a great way to uncover supports kids may need like, oh, maybe they're not good at setting goals.

You may need to come in and help them set realistic goals. I know the first time I asked a student to set a goal they're like, "Well, it's to get it done." Okay, well we got to break that down. Where are the pieces you're going to have to do in order to accomplish that bigger goal? So when it comes to instructional shifts, the first thing I would say is really thinking about how [00:03:30] can you build in structures so that the independence isn't expected day one, it's developed over the course of the year and then of course over the course of the students educational career. So we have to build those scaffolds in, release them gradually so students can become more independent in their learning.

Beth Strike: Nice. So we have focused so much on the curriculum and so much on the assessment [00:04:00] and the instruction, those are all really important things, but I'm hearing you say it's also some of these other supports that maybe we've forgotten about along the way that we're more used to providing in the elementary years, that we need to kind of bring some of those back and they really would help with this. So when you think about being a teacher who's wanting to do this and make these in instructional shifts. What do you think I need to know and be able to do to do that?

Jen Sigrist: Well, one of the things, I think every teacher would do this if they thought they had the time. So [00:04:30] letting go of some of the, I have to get through the curriculum and instead thinking about what are the big ideas for the content that I want students to take away? Just shifting that mindset to a list of standards that I'm going to get through to what's the big idea I want them to uncover from these set of standards? Bundling those standards might be a starting point, because then when we have the big idea, we can then step back as a teacher and say, "Okay, to get that big idea across, [00:05:00] what things are non-negotiable, what does everyone have to have? But then where do we have opportunities for kids to have different amounts of choice?"

It could be choice in what they read, how they go about it. And it can also then get to a point where students are designing their learning. When we have opportunities to get at the big idea, instead of a list of standards, we find ourselves going toward more conversation about what could it look like, instead of what do I need [00:05:30] to deliver to you today? So I think one of those need to know how to do skills for teachers is really get to the big idea, what's essential in learning, beyond just going through a list of standards. The next thing then I would say is to think about the opportunities there exist in that learning for kids to design their own pathways, to design their choices. [00:06:00] And then here's the part where the teacher content knowledge becomes so critical, because then the teacher can say, "Here are things that I know are good resources. Here are things that I know kids are going to stumble with, and I'm going to head off those misconceptions."

And that's when that direct instruction can come in play just in time, instead of just in case. You're ready for them. And you see where this class is going to go or these group of students are going to go. And you can help them [00:06:30] with those misconceptions as they come along. The other thing I would mention too then Beth, is having those resources that provide structure for students. So if it's a tool that helps them plan out their project or their learning, if it's a learning strategy or learning inventory that helps them say, "Hey, this is what interests me about this topic. This is what I want to uncover. Here's the question I'm interested in answering as a student." Having [00:07:00] some of those templates or question stems, those things ahead of time that is that structure I mentioned early on in our conversation where you don't just drop them in it and say, "Hey, figure out what you want to learn." You have structures and scaffolds and resources for them to help think through what it is they need to learn and want to learn in that big idea you've set out for them.

Beth Strike: Interesting. It reminds me of what we used to say, a teacher's more of a guide than being upfront, [00:07:30] that old way of thinking about it where the teacher's upfront doing all the teaching, we're more guiding alongside the student, providing the support. So would that be true?

Jen Sigrist: Oh, absolutely. That's the art of teaching that a computer... No YouTube, no TikTok is ever going to take away the place of a teacher when it comes to that ability to guide. I can get a lecture on demand. I can get that on the computer, but I can't get that guide that you can be as a teacher. That's what makes us so critical and why [00:08:00] we'll never go away, even though the next YouTube will come out, the next technology app will make something else more accessible to kids, but the ability to connect with them, to know what they're interested in, to say, "Hey, you're going here. Have you thought about this?" That's what a teacher does that a computer just can't do. And really that ability to help kids think about, this is what went well for me today and coaching them.

[00:08:30] That's something a computer can't do. And so that guide, that coach, that reflect how did this work for you? You can do that with kindergartners as well as seniors. We just don't always feel like we have the time to really embed that into our practice. And what we're saying with learner agency is, that's what helps kids stay engaged and they don't learn if they're not engaged. So give yourself that time. The time you spend [00:09:00] on those practices increases their retention and engagement with the content that you really want them to learn.

Beth Strike: Nice. Anything else you want to add before we wrap up?

Jen Sigrist: No, but I just appreciate the timer on the conversation. Know that it's an ongoing practice and don't give up, teachers. The first time you try to give choice, don't give up because you may think, "Gosh, they don't like it." Or some of the seniors I had, "It's easier when you just tell me what to do."

Beth Strike: Right, right.

Jen Sigrist: That struggle is going to happen. [00:09:30] So don't stop just because they're going to struggle. But over time, you're going to see it pays off in those independent practices. And gosh, if kindergartners can do it, first graders can do it, I know we can do it with our high school students as well.

Beth Strike: All right. Thanks Jen.

Jen Sigrist: Thanks Beth.

Beth Strike: So thanks for listening in and going beyond embedding choice in your instruction, and really looking at more advanced ways to promote learner agency. This has been a Central Rivers AEA learning on demand podcast.