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Authentic, Authoritative, Unapologetic ServiceNow commentary by Cory "CJ" Wesley and Robert "The Duke" Fedoruk
Duke: Once again, another
shout out to Chills Music.
The guy who did our intro song,
man, I can't get enough of it.
CJ: Yeah.
It's awesome.
, when I heard that thing, man, goosebumps.
Goosebumps,
Duke: this is one of the best
things we ever did for the show.
Anyways, if you was thinking about
doing the same thing, we'll have
a link of the description below
for how to contact Chills music.
All right, Corey, what
are we talking about?
CJ: All right, dude.
Today we're talking about how to run a
campaign using ServiceNow, a political
campaign that is not a marketing campaign.
Well, kind of marketing too,
but a political campaign.
Duke: Yeah, so for those of you who don't
know, Corey has a very interesting hobby,
CJ: It is the indeed . That's a great,
that is a great way of putting it, right?
So, uh, I'm involved very
heavily, with local government
here in the village where I live.
And, I'm currently on our
version of the city council.
, I was appointed back in October.
And, , I'm running for a new
term, which is four years.
and then prior to that,
I'd run for this same spot.
Back in, 2019.
I lost by about 50 votes,
which kind of sucked.
Um,
Duke: the village
CJ: 54,000 people.
Duke: and you lost my feet.
Oh God.
just like pull my hair out.
CJ: Do you could find 50
votes in the couch, right?
Duke: That's awful.
CJ: Well, there's Chicago,
so , so for those who don't know,
I live in the Chicagoland area.
the village that I'm running for, that
I live in is, , Oak Park, Illinois.
And, there's no point
in trying to hide it.
Right?
You Google my name, that's
the only thing that shows up.
Duke: So if you're a fantasy J
in the Duke, you will realize
that we talk about build, build,
build, build all the time, right?
Especially for newcomers.
We're like, build what you know.
Build what you know.
So Corey and I made this gigantic
swimming pool of Kool-Aid.
And we've got three or four
straws each, and we are going
to drink all that Kool-Aid.
And in this episode we are going to role
play, Corey is gonna be a stakeholder.
I'm going to be an implementation
consultant, and we're going to, , explore
his world of work and we are going
to try and gather requirements for a,
, political campaign app in ServiceNow.
So what we hope you get out of this is
just a way to engage with yourself, future
customers, future employers, for how to
make sure you have the best understanding
of these apps before you go and.
CJ: Yeah, duke.
And, and, and one other thing I want
folks to get out of this, right?
So we often talk about the
unconventional uses of ServiceNow, right?
ServiceNow is marketed as it t s M, right?
So IT service management, and then there's
some other, sibling processes, enterprise
service management processes that get
marketed under that same umbrella.
You and I have often, and for a long time,
been talking about, utilizing ServiceNow
in kind of non-traditional ways.
Right?
running a household.
you often talk about the example
of running an ice cream shop, you
know, offer, offer a bike when you
were a kid, those sorts of things.
And so I think this is a really
good, in practice version of some
of that advice to see to, so folks
can see actually, actually how
it would be done and that it can.
Duke: Exactly.
It's, it's about.
if you, if you have a craftsman come
over to do something to your house,
they're gonna ask you all sorts of
questions because you can't just
say one sentence and it's done.
or even a better example,
somebody's gonna build you a house.
Like think about all the stuff that
goes into planning a build for a house.
And so it's like, no,
we're not building a house.
but the questions will get you there
no matter what the situation is.
So here we go.
Um.
Corey, what is the, like when you
tell me you have to run a campaign,
CJ: Yeah.
Duke: like what is the point
of running the campaign?
CJ: Oh man.
So the point is to win the seat, right?
that's the macro point, right?
So there's an election and
you wanna win the election.
In the case of my campaign, there
are three open spots, right?
And there are five people running.
And so what I want is one
of those open spots, right?
So that's the point of it, but that's
the point of the, uh, my involvement in.
But when you think about the campaign,
the point is to maximize your outreach,
Maximize getting in front of folks, right?
Like you want to, your visibility
in front of the, the village or
whatever kind of constituency
that you're running for, right?
so I wanna make sure that folks see me as
often as possible, that they understand my
message, and that they know when to vote.
that one is really, really key.
That last one, that they know when to.
Right.
Because what happens is, and what
I heard a lot after the, um, the
election in 2019 is, oh man, I didn't
know the election was this Tuesday.
Or crap, I would've did early voting
because we had spring break and we,
we didn't get back until Wednesday.
Right.
And so ensuring that folks know when
they can vote for you so that they show
up and actually do it is one of the.
Duke: Okay, so I'm gonna, I'm
gonna repeat back and you tell me
if I've got, the outcomes, right?
So this whole app has to make it
easier for you to win, but if we
break down the essence of winning,
it's that you have to get as many
people aware of you as possible.
So, outreach and awareness.
but not only do they have to know
that Corey Wesley exists, they must
associate Corey Wesley with your message.
CJ: Correct
Duke: Okay.
And then they have to know when,
and is it fair to say where to vote?
CJ: Jas, when and where.
Yep.
Absolutely.
Duke: Could anybody in Oak Park go to
any, polling place in Oak Park or is it.
CJ: Um, no.
So that's the thing, right?
So, and during early uh, voting time,
they have to go to village hall.
, and so early voting is like two
weeks or something like that.
and then on voting day, on actual election
day, then they need to go to the polling
place in which they're assigned, which
will typically be like a school or
some other public building like that.
Duke: Wow.
Okay.
so I've broken it down into four outcomes
that we definitely have to, optimize.
Maximizing the outreach, maximize the
knowledge of your message, knowing
when to vote, knowing where to vote.
Is there anything else you can think of?
CJ: I think that's a good,
uh, a great start, honestly.
I mean, there's probably a few
other things like the, there's some,
uh, no, that's the point of it.
No, that's the point.
Yeah.
Those are the outcomes.
Yes.
Duke: Uh, other outcomes are
allowed, like, there must be
several processes within a campaign.
, otherwise you'd just be doing
this in your head, right?
But clearly you have people and
records and stuff like this.
So why don't we break down
some of the processes that you
would have within a campaign.
CJ: Yeah, so we talk about
logistics a little bit, right?
So, um, you gotta manage
your volunteers, right?
So you have folks who are gonna
be knocking on doors for you.
You got folks who are gonna be spreading
your message via like, social media or
email or having, outreach with their
friends or hosting, you know, meet
and greets and that sort of thing.
you also have, fundraising, right?
Like, that one's really, really key.
Just like you can't run an on me,
right on empty stomach, right?
As some kind of metaphor
like that I remember.
Or you can't run a campaign on
an empty stomach either, right?
Like, you gotta have money.
And so fundraising is
also one of those things.
Uh, a local election, at least in
our village, doesn't cost nearly
as much as say, like running for
mayor in Chicago, but you still need
some money in order to get it done.
communications is another thing
that you want to make sure that
you're tracking and scheduling
and hitting the right frequency.
Right.
And so, and planning out right, the plan
of that, especially with communications,
like when do the blog posts go out?
When do the social media posts go out?
When do the emails go out?
What are they saying?
What's the target
demographic for this message?
Because sometimes you're gonna
wanna split your message up.
Some people are gonna care a little bit
about, issue A more than issue B, so
you target your message to emphasize
issue A with people who care about
issue A and emphasize issue B with
people who care about issue B, right?
So all of that needs to be tracked
and planned and scheduled right,
so that you don't lose track of it.
And so that the logistics of
communications are, are really key.
Duke: there's a lot to unpack here.
I've got some notes.
I'm gonna go over them.
You tell me if there's anything.
I've completely misunderstood.
So, I've counted three processes so far.
We can certainly talk beyond that, but
one of which is manage your volunteers.
Uh, so we have to have a, a
place to store the volunteers.
Right.
And you, you mentioned three
different types of volunteers.
You have your door knockers, your
social media, and your event managers,
event planners, event executors.
CJ: Yeah,
Duke: Are people only one of
those or are people Many of those.
CJ: Um, some people gonna be,
um, many of those categories.
Some people might only be one.
Um, that you're gonna also have
strategic advisors too, right?
Like, so you might have folks that
you, , that you have , that you have
to look at the communications before
you send it out, so that kind of thing.
Or, or just kind of advise
in on strategy, in general.
So you, you would want another
category for advisors as well.
Duke: so I've, I've added a category
for advisors, but I wanna come back
to how those categories matter and
the specifics of managing volunteers.
Let's just go over the
top level processes again.
The second thing you
mentioned was fundraising.
and this involves obviously the asking
and the sources of where those funds are.
Right.
But is there also any kind of, compliance.
CJ: Oh yeah.
Duke: That you have to, in your
fundraising, you have to like track
it a certain way, and so in order
you could be com compliant with some
kind of campaign law or anything.
CJ: Absolutely.
And I'll, I'll, I'm gonna punt the
details of that to my treasurer, right,
who's not on this call, but he, I,
that he, he handles all of that for me.
But yes.
to be clear, there are,
campaign finance laws, right?
And so you gotta make sure that
you're adhering to those and
that you're disclosing donations
above a certain amount and the
mandatory reporting threshold time.
and things of that nature, right?
And that you're keeping track of
how much certain folks are donating.
And I, I think there's some
individual contributor limits as well.
I don't, I don't know.
Like I said, I, I, I, I pun a lot of
the details off to my treasurer, cuz he
is got a lot of experience with this.
But yes, campaign compliance,
finance, compliance loss are a
thing and we need to, uh, make sure
that the system can support that.
Duke: Okay, so, oh, the, something
I'm going to add to the outcomes
list that we already discussed is
that the campaign must be compliant.
CJ: Yes.
Duke: And I'm just gonna break the
fourth wall here for everybody listening
A really good rule of thumb is as soon
as somebody starts talking about money,
you start talking about compliance,
CJ: Amen.
Duke: right?
CJ: yeah.
You wanna start thinking about as
soon as people start giving you
money, you wanna start thinking
about, okay, how do I record this
Duke: Yep.
Because oftentimes they'll be
thinking about just the numbers.
I gotta track the numbers, I
gotta track the numbers, but hit
those two birds with one stone.
provide them a solution that not only
tracks the numbers, but maybe prevents,
warns, inhibits your capability to do
it wrong or in an uncompliant fashion.
CJ: Absolutely if there is a limit
to, individual contributions, right?
Like you want the system to flag it, or
generate some kind of report when you
got folks who are approaching that limit.
Or if you try to enter in like a
donation that's above that limit.
Then you can go back to the person
who offered it up and, return it,
and get you, get yourself down to the
limit or something like that, right?
There are, um, mandatory reporting,
laws about contributions that
come above a certain level.
those things need to be disclosed, near,
immediately, I think within five days.
So, you know, we would build in
some kind of rule for that as well.
So if I'm entering into the ledger,
say contribution of, $5,000 or
something like that, that needs to be
disclosed in like five days, right?
So the system should, yeah, the system
should note that so that my treasurer
can input that data into the requisite
system, for the state of Illinois
so that it all gets done correctly.
Duke: we, we know for certain
that fundraising is gonna have
to be tracked in service now.
To some extent and that we have to,
look out for mandatory reporting rules
and your treasurer's gonna gimme that.
So we will book a second meeting with
your treasurer to talk about that.
so that's two of the three
of the high level, campaign
processes, that you mentioned.
The last one is communications,
uh, and subprocess to that are
planning, execution and targeting.
Now, since you did this last year already,
Is it safe to assume that you already have
a platform that does the actual mailing?
CJ: so this is funny, right?
So 2019 when I did this,
I did all of my email, uh,
communications through ServiceNow.
and so yeah, so that was the platform
initially, but I'm reaching a much
wider audience this time around, so
I do have a platform for that now.
Duke: when we talk about managing
communications and ServiceNow, the
tasky bit is, planning the comms,
the channels, and the targets.
Not necessarily the individual people
targets, but the, , the interest targets.
CJ: Yes,
Duke: are interested in property
taxes, so send this one, send this
email promising that there'll never be
more property tax ever to those folks.
Right?
CJ: Yes.
And then immediately go back on
that once you get elected, because
that is a promise you cannot keep
Duke: Okay.
CJ: yeah.
But yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
You break it down by, interests.
and that way.
Uh, and then target folks.
Sometimes you can, use
demographics to age you in those.
Interesting.
But, um, you know, other times
you just might have to know
Duke: fair to say the actual mailing
list is in another platform, but for this
communication, we're basically gonna Okay.
A message.
CJ: Yes.
Duke: So when I, when I think
of somebody's check marking a
message, that's an approval, right?
So part of communication is app.
CJ: Absolutely.
That's exactly how, how I
would think about this, right?
Like there's a, you know, a message
that needs to go out on property Texas
on this date to this demographic.
Uh, let's make sure that there gets
an, a candidate sign off or a senior
senior strategist sign off, To make
that get done, Because maybe the,
current, atmosphere of the campaign
means that you need to switch tactics.
And so you do that in a moment.
That's why I think an
approval is really, really,
Duke: I'm skipping around a bit.
And by the way, breaking the fourth
wall again, it is okay to do that
. When you're in a workshop, it's not
necessarily going to build itself in
order, you will have to revisit concepts,
questions will pop up in your head.
feel free to bounce around a little
bit because the most important
thing is that you understand
this thing like your stakeholder.
CJ: Absolutely right?
Like you want to make sure
that you understand like you
said, the outcomes, right?
Like that's really what,
what drives a lot of this.
You know, once you understand the
outcomes, then you can understand
what a value in the system is, right?
So, Yeah.
It's okay to jump around to try
to get, paint the full picture.
Duke: Better now, Even if you look
disorganized or whatever, because you
ask questions out of order and jump
back to other things and what are, it
is way better to do that at the start
than it is to do it in the middle.
CJ: Yeah.
and look, I'm a systems stinker, right?
It's one of the things that I actually
advertised in my campaign in a,
in a way that folks can understand
and don't actually use those terms.
but what happens to a systems stinkers
is, is that as you're starting
to talk about a topic, another.
Thread starts to become available
off that topic and you start
to explore, it's kinda like dot
walking where you're coding, right?
you can start with, you know,
the user table and then you
can end up at the company table
or the location table, right?
Because you start to see
these connections, right?
So it's okay in a workshop to follow
those connections as well, and then
eventually bring it back around.
Duke: so I need to go back
to the fundraising a bit now.
Fundraising is about the, the
accumulation of your fundraising
knowledge and the compliance thereof.
Do you have a similar.
Need on the spend side?
Like do you have to track where
you're spending certain stuff?
CJ: Absolutely you wanna track everything
you spend on a campaign, right?
, you know, and there are
different ways to do that.
And again, I let my treasurer,
tell me, but I just let 'em
know, like any kind of thing.
so like, you know, if I was using,
ServiceNow this time around, right?
I pay for that.
Um, as part of my company, I have my
own instances, which is why I could
use it for email, um, if I wanted to.
, but you would have to categorize
that as an in-kind contribution.
but I, I'm not quite sure.
So I would run it by him and tell, and
he'd tell me like, okay, this percentage
of it was used in the campaign, or
something like that, hypothetically.
and then, we would qualify it.
That, that's what I think would happen.
Again, I would punt those questions
to him, and he'd make sure that
I was doing everything correctly.
Duke: What I wanna make sure is that
I don't build you a solution for a
problem that already has a solution.
So when you're, when you're in a
campaign, you're in the trenches and
somebody's like, oh, we need to update
our website with some information.
And, you know, we don't
have a web designer anymore.
Like, let's just get a freelancer to
update our website for like 500 bucks.
Is already factored for by your
treasurer or and accounting team.
They just look at the bank transactions
and then categorize it their own way.
And is there any need
for formal approvals?
CJ: in my case, there's probably
not a need for formal approvals
because I'm the person who would be
cutting the checks anyway, right?
It's a local campaign,
really small sort of thing.
I can imagine, right?
If this was Chicago and somebody's
running for mayor, that there's
these levels of intermediaries where
they would need approvals for xpa
or rights ban, and Ys spin and that,
and that gets documented, right?
So if we were building the system,
right, and we're building the system,
I'd say we need to make sure that,
we're documenting the spin, the purpose
of the spin, and getting approval for
it And even if that is in the, in my
case, would be like a self approval.
Duke: Okay, so it's basically, it's um,
it's a possibility for a bigger scale.
Campaign, but for a local election,
it's probably not worth our
time exploring for right now.
Right.
CJ: yeah.
Unlikely that we need
the approval mechanism.
But I'd put that in the parking lot and,
you know, revisit it if, if I was ever
to like run for president or something.
Duke: Okay.
Just reviewing the campaign processes,
managing the volunteers fundraising
communications and campaign spending.
but we're putting that in a
parking lot, for right now.
CJ: Well, we wanna make, we
wanna do the compliance aspect,
just not the approval part.
Duke: For the spending.
CJ: For the spending.
Yeah.
So I want to, you
Duke: talk to me about that then.
CJ: Yeah, so it looks like,
it looks pretty much like the
inverse of the donations, right?
Like, we wanna know, who we paid
and the purposes of the payment.
and if anyone volunteered
their time instead of money,
we wanna record that as well.
Duke: Okay, this is people volunteering
time, people who work for your
campaign, volunteering their time
CJ: Yeah, let, let me, let
me reframe that, right?
Cuz that's not quite right.
So say you have a photographer and a
photographer donates their services,
Duke: Oh, okay.
CJ: Yeah.
You wanna record that Now?
People knocking on doors, you
don't have to record that, right?
Like that's just volunteer work.
but if you have someone who's an
expert in their field, And they
donate that expertise, Then you have
to, record that because that's that
whole in-kind, contribution thing
that you need to don, document.
Duke: would I be wrong to assume
that is a type of fundraising?
I've got somebody like fundraising.
This person gave me $10,000.
This person gave me $10,000.
This person gave me 10
hours of photo shoot time.
CJ: Yeah, that's a good
place to put it actually.
if you were to look at some of the
compliance portals that are out there,
that's where they tend to have it.
Duke: breaking fourth
wall here for a second.
There's a lot of social, friction
sometimes around asking questions.
It is okay to ask clarifying questions,
even leading questions to somebody
who's at your building, Corey mentioned
pretty explicitly that this was within
the campaign spending topic, right?
I had an instinct that it wasn't about
the spending of money, it's about the
acquisition of resources, which seems to
align more in fundraising in my mind, And
so I use my courage and, manners, right?
Am I right in assuming ? I give him plenty
of opportunity to tell me, no, you're
wrong in a nice way, But I challenge,
I, I cha it challenges the wrong word,
Corey, but you know what I'm saying.
CJ: I, I do.
Yeah.
and I've got all rice right to tell you.
No dude outta my office.
But
Duke: Fired.
Everybody's fired.
Especially you
CJ: You're fired twice.
but No, no, you're absolutely right.
Yeah.
Uh, that's the leading questions.
Challenge the answer sometimes if
you think, a person means different
than what they're saying, because
this isn't a court of law, right?
Like what you're trying to do
is get down to the truth of what
they ask, what they're asking for.
And you have to remember
that you don't always know.
I, I'll be honest with you, even
as we're having this conversation,
like it's helping me dial in on
some of the things in the campaign
that I actually need, right?
So there are things that are popping in
my head that I didn't even have, actively
cir circulating in my brain before we
actually started this conversation, right?
So challenging, me and pushing
back on some of the answers, does
help me clarify, you know, the
thoughts on what I actually need.
Duke: Awesome.
so we talked about the general
processes in a campaign, but let's
talk about nitty gritty work.
The assignable sub-tasks.
and I think a lot of this comes
in The management of volunteers.
Right.
You said door knockers.
Tell me what it takes to get your foot
soldiers out there and knocking on doors.
Just that part.
CJ: first you gotta identify a pool of
talent, so the folks who are gonna knock
on the doors, then you gotta identify
the area, area where they're gonna knock.
you need to have a match
that they're going to convey.
and then you want to have some
kind of deliverable, right?
That's gonna be some kind of
collateral that they can leave.
and as part of that message, you want
to have like, you know, talking points
and maybe re rebuttals, like, depends
on how deep you want to get, right.
but they should know you well enough to
be able to vouch for a lot of this stuff.
And that's where the
collateral comes in as well.
I think that's it.
Duke: Okay, for a given door knocking
campaign, you have to identify the
people that are on that campaign.
or on that, door knocking night,
you have to have messaging ready.
And I hear there's different
types of messaging.
There's talking points
and objection handling,
CJ: Yeah.
Duke: and there's the
organization of collateral.
CJ: Yep.
Duke: So it's not, yeah, exactly.
It's not enough that I
know how to talk about it.
I wanna leave you with Corey's smiling
face above the three bullet points of how
Oak Park is gonna be awesome afterwards.
and then you have to assign them to, I
dunno, I'm going back to my ice cream
pedaling days, but you call it a route or,
CJ: Yeah.
A route that's a good way.
I, I'll call it, let's, let's
Duke: neighborhood to cover
or something like that.
CJ: Yeah.
Yeah.
Neighborhood, a collection of
houses, whatever you wanna call it.
Right.
I think a route's just
as good as anything.
Duke: when you cover a, a neighborhood
with door knockers, is that a fire
and forget process, meaning you
just tell them to go do and there's
no return metrics or feedback?
CJ: you might do a debrief and
figure out like if anybody actively
refused your message or something
like that, but most of the time
it's not really worth the time.
Right?
This is really, very much
a, a fire and forget, right?
Like you wanna knock on as many
doors as possible to get as much
awareness going as possible.
And if people are unhappy a.
You know, the candidacy is much better to
just move on than to try to convince them.
Duke: But would you ever like
audit or improve on the fly?
Any messaging?
CJ: That's a good point, right?
Like if if a lot of folks are coming back
to me and saying, Hey, we are hearing
that, , folks don't believe that you like
puppies and you know that we've heard that
from, at least 10% of the doors we knocked
on, then that might be something we wanna,
log somewhere and figure out like, how
do I do better messaging on me liking.
Duke: Everybody knows
you don't like puppies.
CJ: I love puppies, man.
What do you mean?
Duke: I,
CJ: Hi.
Duke: oh, uh, okay.
the last campaign you run did you
have any kind of solution to get
the talking points and the objection
handling points to your door?
Knockers.
CJ: no, I did not.
so yeah, when I ran in 2019, I was
a newbie to all of this stuff, man.
I was flying by the seat of my pants.
I didn't have organization or anything.
I, I was, I was, uh,
what, what do you call it?
Uh, what, uh, so, you know, uh,
when you watch like Spider-Man
or whatever, everybody's got the,
got the guy in the chair, right?
Like , I was, I was the can, I was the
candidate and the guy in the chair, right?
Like, I didn't have, but I didn't
have like the Avengers with me.
I got the Avengers now though.
Duke: I'm going to talk through
this, the management of volunteers
for a door knocking campaign.
I gotta stop using that word
campaign here cuz we're, this is
a, a giant campaign, but the, the
each door knocking event, right?
Is that like an evening?
Everybody do these routes and then, a
couple days later you do another one.
A couple days later you do another one.
Like these are multiply
triggered workflows.
am I getting that right?
Okay.
The start of that workflow is to get the
pool of volunteers, Is that like prior?
Prior to you're getting commitment
to the volunteer from the volunteers.
CJ: Yes, because then that, because
that allows you to do the next part,
which is determining the route.
Duke: Okay.
So part two is determine routes.
CJ: and you need to know the pool
of volunteers because you don't
want to create a route that's
bigger than you have capacity to.
Duke: Okay.
Now in terms of getting the volunteers,
message capable, we just finished
talking about messaging a second
ago to get them message capable.
would that change outing to outing is it.
we, we have a new volunteer.
They wanna knock on doors for us.
It's part of that volunteer onboarding
process that they're given the
talking points and objection handling.
Does that, is that distinction clear?
CJ: Yeah.
Yeah.
And I would say it's the latter,
as part of the onboarding,
you'd get those, that messaging.
and it might evolve over time.
if we're feeling the
winds change a little bit.
but most of the time door knocking is just
really about getting your face in front of
other people so that they know you exist.
And, and that's where
the collateral comes in.
And I think, I guess this
is the next part, right?
So onboard messaging
during, on onboarding.
Last part of the process is make sure
you leave the collateral because people
might forget everything that you said
when you, after you that conversation.
But they'll have that piece of paper
where they can go to the website and go
to the Facebook page, They can, you know,
shoot an email, that sort of thing, and
they can, uh, continue that relationship.
Duke: one of the things I've
done here, Corey, is I've started
breaking out into separate workflows.
So clearly there is the, organize
a door knocking event, right?
where we're identifying the volunteers,
assigning them to routes, making
sure that everybody is okay on, on
talking points and objection handling.
organizing and equipping them with
collateral, so pamphlets, what have you.
and then at the end of each of those
nights, we're gonna have a debrief
session so that we could possibly
loop back and do message improvements.
Right?
CJ: Yeah.
And the debrief might
not be that same night.
But it would, there would, there
should be, like at the end of that,
particular event, there should be a,
debrief that happens at some point.
So that we can understand if
anything needs to be tweaked.
Duke: So that's kind of fuzzy, right?
Like it's relatively informal.
Maybe you package a couple nights
into one debrief, that kind of thing.
CJ: That sort of thing.
Right.
And it might just be like a, volunteer
initiated thing where they kind of, maybe
they push a button on an app that says,
Hey, I got some meaningful feedback.
And then we, you know, we come together.
Duke: Okay, cool.
Like almost like a post.
event, survey,
CJ: Yeah.
Like a PO Yeah, exactly like that.
Like
Duke: like, uh, yeah, yeah.
Generally did more, did more
places feel, good about the
message than bad about the message.
And they could just do a pulse
check and then any specific
feedback in a, in a text.
That seems pretty cool, right?
Because then you could basically
like do a heat map of the
neighborhoods you're doing.
CJ: Yep.
Duke: Based off of your foot
soldier feedback on how the
messages was, was being absorbed
CJ: Absolutely.
Duke: and you can almost get
more specific target information.
That's exciting, man.
CJ: That, that is super exciting,
especially locally because there's no
polling mechanism for elections, right?
So you, you're kind of flying blind
and hope that everything's working.
but this is great actually when, when
I think about it, because, and even if
you're just collecting a negative, right?
Even if you're not collecting a
positive, if you're just collecting
a negative, you can understand like
where you might have big spots of.
Duke: Well,
CJ: if you, and
Duke: a word in there
that I lost immediately.
It's like you're doing this in lieu of a
CJ: Oh, um, polling,
Duke: Oh, yeah.
In lieu of polling.
CJ: Yeah, because there's, it doesn't
exist, at least here, and maybe it exists
in some other localities, some local,
um, municipalities where you can actually
figure out like how the race is going.
Like in Chicago, it's big enough where,
there are newspapers and all audits, all
sorts of organizations that are polling
the local folks, and you can kinda
make a sense of where you stand, right?
Like, you know, you can see, Lori
could see, uh, Lori Lightfoot that
is, could see in real time whether or
not she was gaining or losing, right?
There's none of that here in Oak Park,
Duke: Probably a scale game, right?
Like you just, if you're pulling one out
of every 10 people, like in Oak Park,
you'll only get 5,000 if everybody votes
CJ: Right, right.
Exactly.
Exactly.
And so you just wanna push as hard as
you can and try to, like you said, it's
a scale game to reach as many people as
possible so that they know who you are,
and hopefully have a chance to understand
what you're about and agree with it.
Duke: All right folks.
We are at 36 minutes of record, and
clearly there's a lot more to talk about
but , I just wanna quickly review what,
knowing what good questions to ask and
engage in your customer in this way,
just how much you can extract
in 30 minutes of convers.
so Corey, let's review.
What is the point of a campaign?
A point of a campaign is to win a seat,
but if we break down the component
pieces that contribute to winning a
seat, we have, maximizing our outreach.
The more people we
interact with, the better.
The more people that know
our message, the better.
The more people who know when
and where to vote the better.
And our campaign must be compliance.
So that's five points that we know
this app has to contribute to.
Right?
And in fact, maybe as you review
all these features and decide what
you're actually gonna build, you
rate them against these five points.
If it doesn't support that point
strongly, maybe it's something you.
CJ: right.
Duke: Now, what are some of the
processes within a campaign?
Well, we know that there is a process
for managing volunteers, and there are
several types of flows within that.
There's knocking on doors,
there's social media management,
there's events, there is.
Okay.
And even before that, there is the
onboarding of the volunteers ourselves.
Uh, we have one note in the onboarding
workflow that we have to get the
volunteers, the talking points
and objection handling, which also
means we need a place to store
our talking points and objection.
Handlings.
We also have a process for fundraising.
we have to talk to a different
stakeholder for that, but basically
we have to, obey some mandatory
reporting laws, and that includes not
only monetary contributions, but also
time, contributions to our campaign.
Then this is a third process
under campaign management, which
is managing the communications.
Now we are probably gonna have a
external tool for mailing list management
and and mailing list segmentation.
But in ServiceNow, what we plan to do
is, generating communication plans.
What are we gonna do?
How are we gonna send it?
What is The medium that we're using.
Like is it social media?
Is it mailers, is it whatever?
and then we're also gonna
manage the execution of that.
Included in that process is gonna be
some sort of approval so the right people
authorize the right communications.
We also wanna have an earmark here
for further discussions on targets.
Uh, and targets can be interests
or demographics or any combination.
when, uh, we're gonna go back to the
pro campaign process of managing your
volunteers, , and we just took the
one workflow of the door knocking
event and in the door knocking
event, we need to identify the
volunteers that are gonna be on that.
What routes are gonna take.
well, we wanna make sure that they have
read the talking points and objection.
Handlings, the latest versions.
we need to equip them with
collateral to leave on site.
So this would be like a little
pamphlet, what have you.
we got on a potential real big win, which
is can we extract information from that
foot, campaign to tell us more about the
neighborhoods that we are, putting out.
it's already looking like a fantastic
app build and not too small either.
It's pretty significant.
And that was 30 minutes of conversation.
CJ: Yes.
And Duke.
And another, thing I think we need
to, uh, emphasize here is that you are
not a local election expert, you have.
You didn't come into this
knowing the questions to ask
because you had experience here.
Um, you are a ServiceNow expert and yet
we still got to this point, despite the
fact you not being a subject matter expert
on the theme that I need you to build.
Duke: I keep telling people, man, like
playing role, playing games in high
school taught me more about how to do
my job than three years of college Did.
CJ: No right though, right?
Like you put yourself into,
into the shoes of accident.
Here we go.
Right?
Next thing we're dragons.
Duke: All right, we are 40 minutes
in and this is episode 80 and we
still don't have an outro We'll
see you on the next one, folks.
CJ: We out