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Welcome to The NICU Translated Podcast, where we break down the complex world of the NICU into clear, relatable insights for families and the professionals who support them. Hosted by Mary Farrelly—a certified NICU nurse, doula, and educator—this podcast is your go-to resource for navigating the NICU with confidence and compassion.
Whether you’re a doula looking to better support NICU families, a healthcare professional seeking deeper understanding, or a parent preparing for or living through a NICU journey, you’ll find actionable tips, evidence-based guidance, and heartfelt stories to inspire and empower you.
Each week, we’ll explore topics like:
-NICU 101: Terms, diagnoses, and medical equipment explained.
-Preemie care basics and developmental milestones.
-How to advocate for your NICU baby with confidence.
-Emotional and trauma-informed support for NICU families.
-Insights from NICU professionals and families who’ve been there.
With episodes featuring expert advice, list-style guides, and real-life interviews, The NICU Translated Podcast is here to equip you with the tools and knowledge to make the NICU journey less overwhelming and more empowering.
Subscribe now and join our community dedicated to bringing more joy and less trauma to the NICU experience—because the NICU is only the beginning.
Let’s navigate this journey together.
Mary Farrelly (00:00)
Waiting is the hardest part of the NICU. The waiting for answers, for stability, for the day your baby finally comes home. But it's not just parents who wait, siblings wait too. My guest today, Emily Rosen, is a mom, creative director, and author of the beautiful new children's book, Waiting for Max, a NICU story. Inspired by her own family's journey, Emily has turned one of the hardest seasons of her life into a story that helps others feel seen, connected, and hopeful.
We're talking about how to support siblings, navigate the uncertainty of waiting, and how to find small moments of light in the middle of the unknown.
Mary Farrelly (01:06)
Hi everybody and welcome back to this week's episode of the NICU Translated Podcast. I'm so excited to have you here today, Emily.
Emily Rosen (01:14)
Me too, I'm really excited to be here. Thanks for having me.
Mary Farrelly (01:18)
So one of the things and the themes of this episode is talking about just the art of waiting and what that means both in a NICU journey, because as we know, there's so much waiting before, during, and after NICU stay, but really touching on waiting, the art of waiting as it relates to the full spectrum of pregnancy, birth, and beyond. So let's start a little bit on who you are and
what taught you about the art of waiting and what that looks like for you.
Emily Rosen (01:52)
⁓ yeah, so I'm Emily Rosen. I live in Los Angeles and I'm a mom to two kids, Max who's six and Eva who's one. and Max, was born six weeks early at 34 weeks. and so the waiting began when my water broke, unexpectedly one morning and rushed to the hospital and
you know, waiting for answers, waiting for, you know, clarification and so much confusion in that moment. And so 20 hours after I got to the hospital, Max was born. And the waiting of the NICU stay began right then because I had to wait to go see him. You know, he was on my chest for maybe 30 seconds. And then my husband followed him to the NICU, but I had to wait to be.
stitched up and recover and get someone to wheel me down to the NICU to see him. And so every element from the very, from the moment Max was born had been some form of waiting. And then he was in the NICU for 16 days. So that was the biggest wait of all of waiting for him to come home. And that was, I don't have to explain to you or any NICU parent listening like,
how difficult that wait is from whether your baby's there for one day or 16 days like Max was or months and months. ⁓ Every day kind of feels like forever while you're waiting to have that baby in your home, which is how you always envisioned it would be when you have a baby. And so that was really difficult for me and that's why I wrote my book, which I'll share with you today too.
Mary Farrelly (03:36)
I love that you mentioned that the waiting can just feel, at least in my experience, waiting can feel like you have your foot on the brake and the gas at the same exact time. Like you are revving to go, you wanted to go to the next step, you wanna get to the next place, but there's something else also like knowing, you know, as a NICU parent, like we're not ready to go home. don't, my baby isn't developmentally appropriate. We haven't met all these milestones. So it's this constant like splitting.
pushing, pulling, tugging, and it can feel really unsettling to be in that window of waiting and not even sometimes in the NICU especially there's waiting for what we think is the noun, which is the discharge date, but then there's also waiting for so many unknowns as well. What did it feel like in the NICU to you to be in that kind of liminal space as they say, that limbo, that waiting period? What did that feel like?
Emily Rosen (04:33)
Yeah, you described it really well. it's kind of bringing me back to that, know, was over six years ago at this point, but it's really, I think the hardest part of the waiting is that nothing is in your control. You know, of course you're your child's advocate and you're there to support them and help them. But at end of the day, the NICU doctors and nurses and staff, they're kind of determining the care and figuring out what's best for your baby and what.
they need to eventually go home. But it's, you know, there's no timeline. You don't really know your baby's gonna come home until a couple days before. Usually, at least that was how it was for us. And so it's just a constant of like, okay, he's doing great. Like, when's he coming home? But you know, there's no real answers until he got to those 48 hours of eating all his milk out of his bottles straight. And
So yeah, I I think that lack of control was really hard for me because as a first time parent, I envisioned, you know, having my son and going home with him and breastfeeding him and, you know, rocking him and doing all the things in his nursery. And obviously that wasn't what happened. And so just kind of coming to terms with that in the moment while also trying to navigate this new thing that you don't know much at all about.
was incredibly difficult. And as a result, I cried every single day, multiple times a day, and just tried to survive, I think, in that time.
Mary Farrelly (06:11)
Yeah, there's so much in stepping into the role of a parent in general, feel like, especially for the first time, there's almost this like humbling moment where you realize like you don't have control over this other person. Like you have influence and you have this role as this parent and this caregiver, whether in the NICU or not. There's always this moment that I feel like there's a surrender that has to happen to the
Emily Rosen (06:36)
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (06:38)
situation or to this new role of being a parent and it almost involves like a death of your old self, of like this old person who really was in charge of yourself and in charge of everything in your own destiny and your own plans and especially a lot of millennial women were very like very good at controlling things and very good at and organizing and having this vision and executing it and having this drive and ambition and being in
Emily Rosen (06:50)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (07:07)
as a parent and especially in the NICU, you're like forced to slow down and stop and that can feel so intense and there's the grief, there's also so many levels of grief also of like loss of the end of your pregnancy, loss of this vision for what birth and what postpartum looks like and adding waiting on top of it. So you said in the moment you were really overwhelmed with emotion and
Emily Rosen (07:12)
Definitely.
Mary Farrelly (07:33)
which is totally an appropriate response, right? Like it is, there's so many feelings swirling around and especially some of us weren't great at processing them and being in these four situations, some things just, especially past traumas and other experiences just all comes forward. What other, did you find any ways in the moment to cope or settle into the waiting or is it mostly now that you're
Emily Rosen (07:43)
Right.
Mary Farrelly (08:00)
out from it you're able to reflect and see what that experience felt like and like almost find the meaning in it which I know you have with your book we'll touch on but in the moment did you have any any like moments of insider tools or coping things that helped you wait?
Emily Rosen (08:07)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, great question. I would say I never fully settled into the wait. I was always like on edge and anxious and that led to some postpartum anxiety later on. But I did have some things that really helped me get through it. One was reading books to Max every day. We brought a different book every single day to read to him, whether he was in the isolette or we were able to do skin to skin and read to him.
And that felt like one normal expected thing I would have done wherever my new baby was, I would be reading to him. so getting to do that was truly, truly helpful. And it was very beneficial to me. And I know it's also very beneficial to the babies to hear books and words and help with their development as well. So that's one thing that got me through it and ultimately inspired, helped inspire my book.
⁓ and then another thing is that one night we were driving home, we would go to the hospital like three times a day. We lived pretty close. We would go for like three feedings and stay for a couple hours each. And the last one we'd always leave around 11 PM. And I remember tearily saying to my husband, as we were driving by a CVS on the way home, like, can we stop in and print out photos of Max in their 24 hour photo kiosk and.
We did that a couple of times while he was there and that really, really helped. Like, you know, we should have pictures of our baby in frames in our house. It doesn't matter if he has cords on him or a feeding tube in his nose. Like I want pictures of him. And it was another like quote unquote normal thing a new parent would do and something that I think really helped. And that's actually reflected in the book that I have printed pictures of the baby in the NICU that
his older sister sees, not just pictures on a phone that, you now, like most of the time when you're looking at pictures, they're on someone's phone. But I really wanted her to get to hold pictures of her baby brother like I did, that was helpful.
Mary Farrelly (10:23)
as you're saying that, it's you're able to read stories to your baby in the NICU and then the pictures is you're also telling your story too at the same time. So was a way for you to almost have both pieces of storytelling. So let's talk a little bit about your book that you wrote, which really, I read it and I was like, wow, this really does summarize in the feelings of waiting and the
Emily Rosen (10:29)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (10:50)
beauty and the hope and the pain all kind of mixed together in one and by writing it in for the perspective of a bigger sister and a sibling I feel like it really ties it together so beautifully. So tell us a little bit about the book and your I guess the why behind you wrote it and how it came to be and then a little bit maybe even about the story that you wrote too.
Emily Rosen (11:12)
Yeah, definitely. So it's called Waiting for Max a NICU Story. And as I mentioned, reading books to Max every day, know, obviously there's thousands of books about new babies and new babies coming out from the hospital, but there's not a ton out there about babies that stay in the NICU first. And even though one in 10 babies go to the NICU. So it's really something that affects almost all of us as I've been sharing this book.
with people, everyone has some connection to the NICU, whether it's their own child, their niece or nephew, their friend's child, their student, maybe even themselves when they were a baby. And so I felt it was really important to get something out in the world that helped the kids going through it too. And I took a children's book writing course online in 2021.
in the midst of COVID, just needed a creative outlet. And I'd always dreamt of writing a children's book. So was like, I'm gonna just, I'm gonna do this and learn how to do it. And, you know, I thought of a lot of different ideas, but I kept thinking about this idea about a story of a NICU baby. And so I wrote, you know, a few versions. Originally, it was actually written from the perspective of the baby, because given I was a first time parent, that was kind of my perspective.
⁓ But in kind of thinking about it more and talking to people, I realized, you know, it really would be an amazing tool for other kids going through it, older siblings, cousins, next door neighbor kids who are waiting like I was for my child, but for another kid in their case. And so I wrote it from the perspective of this older sister, Louise, who's waiting for her baby brother, Max, who's in the NICU. And she basically channels
all the feelings that I had of waiting, but from her perspective. you know, waiting is hard for anyone for grownups and even more so for kids who don't have a concept of time, who don't understand what's going on. And so this book really kind of explains the NICU and why the baby's there. It doesn't go into every detail. Obviously, every NICU story is different and can't possibly be covered in one book. And I also didn't want to scare kids with
you know, there's so many scary parts of the NICU, but giving them some knowledge about the isolette and the monitors and the feeding tubes to just have a sense of what's going on there, especially since other like siblings aren't often allowed to go to the NICU to visit, especially like during flu season. And so the book really explains those as Louise kind of asks questions of her parents about what's going on and they show her pictures of her brother and
Mary Farrelly (13:29)
Mm-hmm.
Emily Rosen (13:56)
She notices things in the pictures or in the videos. She watches that spark ideas in her to think of ways to get her brother home herself because she doesn't want to wait like any kid doesn't want to wait. Max is like, we're going somewhere and he's like, how much longer? And it's only five minutes, but it's forever to him. so she sees the feeding tube and she's like,
Mary Farrelly (14:12)
Thank
Emily Rosen (14:20)
And the dad explains, you know, that's to get him the nutrition and food he needs to grow. And she looks around her house and she's like, well, we have a lot of food here. Like he can use that for something else. And she draws a picture of him swinging on it home like a monkey, or she watches a video of him in his isolette and she hears the beeping monitors and her mom explains what those are that they monitor his breathing and heart rate.
but she thinks it sounds like a spaceship and the isolate looks like a spaceship, so it's a spaceship counting down to blasts off and she draws a picture of that. And so she keeps drawing pictures of her different ideas as she learns about different parts of the NICU until he ultimately comes home and you'll see her last idea, but when you read it. And yeah, my hope is that it can really be a tool for kids going through it and for parents and grandparents.
librarians to help kids cope and understand what's happening, you know. Seeing this older sister and how she's coping with wading through using her creativity and drawing pictures could spark something in them and how they're feeling. Maybe they're not as into drawing as Louise's, but maybe they decide to do something else. They build the NICU with their blocks or they act it out with their stuffed animals, whatever it may be. Like it's a
a coping mechanism that's taught and you see her resilience and her creativity getting her through it. And that's another reflection of me because this book writing it has helped me heal and process what's happened even years later. And so she uses creativity in the form of drawing and I use it in the form of writing to kind of work through the weight and the trauma of it
Mary Farrelly (16:07)
I, when I was reading it, and I think we had talked prior to this conversation, and I think it's such a powerful tool for like, you know, NICU siblings who are waiting for their sibling to come home. And for really anybody who needs to understand the art of waiting, like I was envisioning reading it to my children as a NICU nurse who I disappear for long periods of time and I go work on a shift and it's very
Emily Rosen (16:33)
Mm-hmm.
Mary Farrelly (16:36)
very hard of a concept for them to grasp and understand. So having the young tiny humans be able to identify themselves in Louise and like see how she waits and how her, as you said, like how she uses her own tools, her own coping skills to be able to get through it can spark so many conversations that you wouldn't otherwise be able to explain to a kid because I mean, even as you were saying, like your son,
not knowing what five minutes means, it's really hard to explain the concept of waiting to a child. I mean, it's hard for an adult to get some time. We still...
Emily Rosen (17:06)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I have trouble waiting for something I'm
excited about or something I'm nervous about. Like, yeah, it's a universal theme. And like you said, it applies to all of us, no matter if you're having a NICU experience or not. And so I think it also is just a great family story about this love between siblings and...
Mary Farrelly (17:14)
Yeah, it's very abstract.
Emily Rosen (17:31)
the resilience and how to kind of deal with a difficult situation no matter what difficult situation you're in or whatever you're waiting for. And, you know, I actually like when I sign books, I always say like, I hope you get what you're waiting for. Because we're all waiting for something, you know, it might be a small thing like a present we want on our birthday, or it might be something big like a baby coming home from the NICU or, you know, so it's, we're all waiting for something. And so I hope that on some level,
you know, anyone who reads this story can connect with it in that way.
Mary Farrelly (18:05)
This reminds me, I actually still have it on my phone. One of the parts of my own story, did not have, neither of my girls went into the NICU, but I had a long fertility journey to get to both of my children. And I had this message that came up on my phone every single morning that said, there's wonder in the waiting. Because I feel like so often we get so stuck on the destination, right? And we're not sitting there, we're not able to appreciate the journey that we're on.
Emily Rosen (18:16)
Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Mary Farrelly (18:34)
and what's right in front of us in those like micro miracles and how much beauty there is in the waiting because there really is. Once you get the thing, right, the baby comes home or the baby's born or whatever it is, there is so much joy in that moment but it's really the anticipation and the buildup that can bring to emphasize and bring even more joy to that moment too. So that was a reminder that I had to,
constantly be reminding myself like stop rushing this. There's nothing you can do to rush this. You need to enjoy the moment that you're in that whether it feels like you can enjoy that day or not, you're here. So let's show up and be here today in the now, which is really hard to do.
Emily Rosen (19:06)
Yeah.
Yeah,
that's beautiful that you had that reminder. I mean, I think that's a good tool for anyone listening to use. Yeah, I think like, as you were talking, like, worth the wait, like, that's like, the, you know, the main message of this book is, you know, no matter how hard this waiting is for her brother, like, he's worth the wait once he gets home. And that is how it felt when Max came home that like,
He's my baby, this is who I want, and this was his beginning, and we had to wait a little longer for him to be home with us, but he was worth it, because he's our special kid, and we wouldn't want anyone else or any other story. And the same thing happened when had my daughter, Eva, who's one now, had a long fertility journey as well, to have her, and three years of IVF, and...
other fertility treatments and procedures and ultimately we had her with the help of a surrogate. And so that was a lot of waiting, like years of waiting. And she's also worth the wait. I'm glad, as hard as that journey was to get her, I don't want any other baby but her. And I don't care how she got here, she's here and she's ours. And so I think that's a good thing to remember.
Mary Farrelly (20:26)
Mm-hmm.
Emily Rosen (20:34)
you know, whenever I'm in a hard situation or waiting for something as well.
Mary Farrelly (20:38)
Yeah,
and those things, those people and moments and things that we're waiting for, because we waited, they're ever so, forever more sweet, I feel like. Like you have an appreciation for them and a gratitude that you might have kind of overlooked if things were easy or just straightforward. In the thick of it, it's very hard to see that. I just to move forward.
Emily Rosen (20:49)
Exactly.
Definitely. completely, yeah, I completely agree. So hard. You like can't, you're like, I just want
to know what's happening and like when this baby's coming. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. When you don't know the future, you don't have control over it, like we said. And, but yeah, I am forever. Everyone's grateful for their kids, but I agree. Like,
Mary Farrelly (21:08)
I want to the last chapter of the book. I want to look and I can live it. That's fine, but I need to know the last chapter of the book.
Emily Rosen (21:25)
Both my kids are miracle babies in their own ways. And, you know, they, I'm truly grateful. Like even yesterday, I was just sitting on the floor playing with Eva and like just feeling this sense of gratitude that she's here even a year in. so I think that's really special too.
Mary Farrelly (21:43)
So as someone who has had a lot of waiting in her life, you are someone that is supporting that person that's waiting. So a loved one or a neighbor, a sister, a mother, like whoever is in not the actual direct person that is waiting. What are some, and I have my own insight and experience with this too, but some people don't always know how to show up and how to talk to people who are in that limbo period, in that waiting period. And what are some,
Emily Rosen (21:47)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Mary Farrelly (22:11)
thoughts or words or ways that people can show up and help support their loved ones who are in an intense period of waiting in their life.
Emily Rosen (22:21)
Yeah, I mean, I think when Max was in the NICU, just people checking in and bringing food, of course, helps and making life easier how they can. For me, like in both situations, the NICU and the fertility journey, talking to other people that had been through that wait and come out the other side.
Truly helped, like I talked to two friends when Max was in NICU, who previously had NICU babies and were home and healthy. And that like really got me through it as well. And same with the fertility journey people who had worked with surrogates or done IVF and now had their baby that they dreamt of. I think those are really powerful things to do. And if you don't have someone in your life, like there's great organizations out there that can connect you with.
people that have been through it or support groups. And then I think like not asking too many questions, just like be there to listen, like especially with the NICU, like don't ask when the baby's coming home. Cause as I said, you don't really know until maybe a couple of days before if they could be coming home. And so just checking in of letting them know you're there and you're there to listen if they want to talk and.
you know, or if you don't want to talk, that's okay too. I think that's really important. ⁓ And then in my fertility journey, one friend said to me, you know, after my second failed IVF transfer, she said, I don't know when and I don't know how, but at some point you'll be looking at the family, at your family and that's the family you're supposed to have. And I think that
It really stuck with me like for years, like until I did have that family and it was true. You know, I didn't know at that time that I was going to end up working with a surrogate. I didn't know that we were going to use our last viable embryo and that was the one that was going to work and when it was going to work. And, it did. And you know, now I'm here in a really great place with the family I always dreamt of. I think, you know, just trying to, like you said, like sit in the moment and
be on the journey and at some point, you know, it hopefully will come to work out in the way you had hoped in some shape or form.
Mary Farrelly (24:43)
There has to be a level of faith and trust and that can look different for different people depending on what their spiritual or religious background, but in general you have to like trust the outcome and trust that there's a story playing out and we might not know what it is, but it is our story and so it is the story that is happening and maybe, I know it's hard to, especially with really intense and really...
Emily Rosen (24:51)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mary Farrelly (25:09)
sad outcomes, it can be really hard to be like, this is the story that's meant to be, or it's meant to be that way. hate that. In the moment, I was like, I don't love that. But there's also, is, there is like, again, that surrender and that faith that like, I'm surrendering to this right now. And I trust that there is going to be what is, this is my story and it's being written and that's okay. And I do also really, really appreciate the value of that peer to peer support, because it is one thing to have
Emily Rosen (25:13)
Right.
I
Mary Farrelly (25:35)
random person say like, know that this is going to work out for you. It's another thing to see it lived out for other people and to hear and see like hear stories of surviving whatever that experience is and whatever that looks like. Whether you're surviving a loss, whether you're surviving a fertility journey, surviving a NICU stay, like there is light. One of my things that I say over and over again is like the NICU is just the beginning. It is chapter one of your your story as a parent. It's chapter one of your baby story.
Emily Rosen (25:42)
Right.
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (26:05)
There's thousands of chapters left to write. And it's a really intense one and it's a really formative one and you're never going to be able to erase it or get rid of it. Like that chapter is your chapter, but it is still just part one. And there's so much more joy and hope and beauty to come. And so sometimes that can help as well, like seeing that from people who have lived it because it is hard to metaphorically think about it, but I remember I had.
Emily Rosen (26:15)
No.
Mary Farrelly (26:32)
multiple miscarriages and talking to people that had miscarriages and whether or not they had other children but just like got through it was so helpful to just word vomit at somebody too and they'd be like I know I know I get it I've seen that I was you and I feel I feel what you're feeling and now I'm okay or I'm better it's different like there's a other side to the to the the dark bits there's a light at the end of the tunnel in a way
Emily Rosen (26:39)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yes.
And my hope is that my book can be a small part of that too, especially for kids going through it, that like, okay, Louise's baby brother came home and it was hard and like just offering a little bit of hope and a few smiles in a situation that's difficult for anyone involved. so yeah, I think that finding people or
books or tool, any other tools that really show, you know, another person's journey can truly, truly help. And what you were saying about like, this is just the beginning of one chapter of thousands. Like that was something that especially was a part of my fertility journey when I decided to work with a surrogate and I was really struggling with that decision. you know, talked a lot, a lot with my therapist and she saying, you know, this is just,
nine months, like you have a whole lifetime with this child and like the nine months of her being in someone else's belly is like just a very small part of that lifetime with her. And so just remembering that like, yeah, even, you know, if your NICU stay is a day or months and months, like still have this lifetime with this baby. And it does stay with you that beginning, but I it makes you stronger. And it's a part of
who you become as a parent and that's okay and makes you appreciate things that much more and yeah.
Mary Farrelly (28:30)
I think it's also, the book especially is an incredible tool that you can use for your own NICU graduate as they're getting older and wanting to hear their story too. Because especially my daughter is six as well and she is deeply curious about her origin stories and even my origin story and her dad's and grandparents and she's kind of connecting the dots that there's this like almost legacy of that she can build for herself. the, and it's
Emily Rosen (28:41)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (28:59)
how we tell these stories. Like, is this a story that we're going to our child about their beginning and focus on her resiliency and her grit and her ability to overcome hard things? Like, that internalizes and can become the magic that they lean upon as they go to their next hard challenge and their next hard thing. Do you have you been has your Max read his story and how did that resonate with him?
Emily Rosen (29:18)
Yeah.
⁓ yeah, he's been the biggest cheerleader of it. I waited to show it to him until I had sketches of the illustrations because I wanted him to have visuals with it. But ever since that moment, he's been so excited and asking to read it all the time. He's gone to every story time I've had in LA and he's like my hype man.
Mary Farrelly (29:26)
you
Emily Rosen (29:46)
Like I donated a copy to his school library and he wanted to be the first one to check it out. I was like, Max, we have like plenty of copies at home. He's like, no, I want to be the first one. And it's really cool. And I think he's proud of his beginnings. And when I tell him about like, you know, other people who had and NICU baby, and they're like, that's like me. And like, he knows his story now. And I think that's really important. Like you said, to teach a kid about their beginnings once they're old enough.
to understand it. And with Eva, we have this beautiful art print our surrogate got for us of like a painted version of her embryo. And it's hanging in her room on the wall. And you know, our surrogate still in our lives and we want her to know that beginning too and like how much we wanted her and how, you know, what we went through and so happy she's here. And so they'll both kind of know.
their beginnings and the next book actually will be about Eva's story as well. I'm going to turn it into a series, a waiting for series. So it'll be waiting for Eva and it'll be a surrogacy fertility story about a sibling waiting for their baby to come that way. And I hope to write more about all the different wonderful ways babies can come home to their families that aren't covered as much in children's books.
Mary Farrelly (31:05)
I the need for that is massive because it's, is, they're big concepts that we're expecting or hoping for tiny people to get. And it's hard in the moment, and I'm sure you experienced that with Max waiting for Eva, is that as a parent, when you're going through a waiting journey and you have other children at home, you're, as a parent, as an adult, you're going through your own intense emotions and...
Emily Rosen (31:14)
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (31:33)
logistical needs around waiting too. And so children can sense that, but don't always have the words or the tools to understand it. So having books where they can truly see themselves and see their family and see their journey in a way that they can like grasp and visualize, because children are such visual learners, especially the younger they are as well. It's going to be having it as a series. I'm so excited that you're going to have this like treasure chest of resources that so many people are going to be able to.
Emily Rosen (31:39)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Thank you.
Mary Farrelly (32:02)
from and share and it's so needed and I love your writing style. It feels very soothing and hopeful while still being grounded in the reality of the setting. So I think it's going to be an incredible response.
Emily Rosen (32:14)
Thank you. Yeah,
thank you. Yeah, as a parent, I've always like believe you should tell the truth to your kids. You don't need to share every detail, especially in the case of a NICU, you know, a lot of scary things can happen, but just giving them some information to empower them with knowledge to ask questions, to validate their feelings is really important. And that's my hope for this book and the next book. And I actually wrote like a
a quick version of a book about Max's sister coming with the help of our surrogate so he could understand like where she was growing and and that really helped and you know he's a kid he didn't question it he was just he doesn't care how he has a sister he's just excited to have a sister and that's a really beautiful thing too is like kids are like you know so open to all these things and it's just like giving them a chance to learn about it and
and ask their questions about it is really powerful for a parent and empowering for the kid as well.
Mary Farrelly (33:17)
I feel like teaching a child about a hard topic almost helps us to process our own feelings around it too because you're almost speaking the words out loud and giving yourself space to think things through because sometimes, especially as women, sometimes just power through things and like don't slow down and...
Emily Rosen (33:23)
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (33:35)
make white space to kind of just like think about and process. So having a child that you're explaining things through can be really therapeutic for all involved. also kids are so, we don't give them enough credit, I don't think. Like they really are so smart and so hyper aware in a way, as you mentioned, that we aren't even like, we're so clouded with our own like stuff. They can like get to the heart of it and light it up and are just so pure in how they approach every
Emily Rosen (33:36)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Exactly.
Mary Farrelly (34:04)
hard situation. Like they're just so special little people. A lot of emotions both ways, when it counts. Big feelings all the way around, but we can take some lessons from our children and our life too. What, as we're kind of wrapping up a little bit our talk today, what do you
Emily Rosen (34:13)
Yeah, lot of big feelings for sure. Yeah.
definitely. Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (34:29)
wish, I guess let's say, so for someone who is in the thick of it, in the thick of a waiting moment right now, whether it's in the NICU, they're waiting for a baby, they're waiting to come home, they're waiting for whatever it is that we are, what is the one small thing that you would want them to know in this season of life to be able to get to that next, see the light in the end of the tunnel, but also be there in the now?
Emily Rosen (34:49)
Yeah.
I think remembering that you're not alone. it feels very isolating in the NICU or in a fertility journey or whatever journey you're on. And just remembering that you're not the first person to go through it. You won't be the last. Like there are other people that you can turn to, like I said, whether it's friends or through resources out there that offer peer support. I think just knowing that you're not alone is really comforting.
and knowing that there are successes after all the hard journeys. I think just remembering that or reminding yourself of that as much as you can is really helpful in the moment.
Mary Farrelly (35:30)
Yeah, it can almost feel like you have this like, even if you don't know them and you've never talked to them before in your life, knowing that there are other people going through it literally at the same time that you are too. It almost can feel so much more comforting like you have this invisible army that's supporting behind you and walking alongside you. know I saw, I can't remember where it was, somewhere on social media there was like this app idea that when you push a button if you're up in the middle of the night with your kid and then you can see this map and you can see.
Emily Rosen (35:56)
Mmm.
Mary Farrelly (35:58)
all these other people that are up in the middle of the night at the same exact moment that you are all over the world. And it can just, again, in the moments when you're in the dark, literally, you feel like you're the only one. And it makes it feel so isolating and so hard and lonely. It's really lonely to be going through a period of waiting and feeling like you're doing it by yourself. having those pockets and using a tool like a book or storyteller, connecting your peer support, knowing that you are truly not alone.
Emily Rosen (36:08)
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (36:28)
It feels doable in a way that it might not have been. ⁓
Emily Rosen (36:30)
Yeah. And
I have been like, since kind of putting this book out, I've discovered this whole world of NICU and fertility social media accounts that like, there's like you said, you can find someone who's sharing it and going through it. Maybe you're not one to share yourself, but just seeing someone else going through it. Like when I was going through fertility, there were a few influencers I followed that like, it really helped me. Like someone was, you know,
having a baby via IVF and working with a surrogate or what have you, or having a NICU stay. think there's endless information out there now and people sharing it that's helpful. But to a point, obviously, you need to see what feels right and what feels triggering and have that balance. But if you're looking for something, it's out there, I guess is what I'm trying to say. ⁓
Mary Farrelly (37:16)
Thank
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
Emily Rosen (37:25)
One other thing I'll say that got me through kind of both situations is trying your best to take care of yourself, like at least now and then. Like in the NICU, obviously you could spend every day all day there and some people have to, you know, depending on if they live really far away or, but we were lucky that we lived close by and kind of go back and forth and we'd go out and have pancakes. That's my favorite food and like.
So it's like a little thing like that that feels normal and feels good to you, like can really help. Or like in the fertility journey, know, when we were in between treatments, taking one night away, just me and my husband, or like having a night out with friends, going to a yoga class when I was physically able, like those things like really help you mentally. so I think just finding...
pockets of normalcy in the very not normal situations can also be extremely helpful in the weight.
Mary Farrelly (38:25)
And I also feel like giving yourself permission to do those because I feel like in our heads, we're like, well, we don't deserve this. We can't do it. Maybe later. I have to be here for my baby. I have to do this. Not like, okay, that's a story you're telling yourself. You can, fact, and you need to find these positive normal. So then you can show up at your baby's bedside and bring that joy, bring that groundedness and that refresh to your baby because they're
Emily Rosen (38:28)
Yes.
yeah.
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (38:52)
they're stuck in a spot, especially in the NICU. They can't come out. So I always would say like, go outside to the parents I take for it. Go outside, take a walk, bring the outside back inside to your baby. Like bring your fresh, the fresh air that's on your clothes. Bring that like feeling of sunshine on your face and bring it to your baby. So it is just as important, if not more so, to prioritize. And it doesn't, you know, it doesn't mean you need to take like a full week off or whatever it is. Like it can be a couple hours or an hour.
Emily Rosen (39:09)
Yes.
No, just a bagel or
a walk in the sun. Yeah, I like, yeah, it's definitely easier said than done. And I have been very hard on myself in all the journeys. And that's something I'm working on. But it is important to like, give yourself grace. like, I show up.
Mary Farrelly (39:21)
A bagel! It can be a bagel! I'm just to enjoy.
Mm-hmm.
Emily Rosen (39:39)
better as a mom when I do stuff for myself, whether that's working out or filling my cup by talking to a friend, like whatever it may be, like do what you can to feel as good as you can and in a not great situation. And, you know, I, it's hard to practice what I preach, but I think it is, I've learned that that really is.
Mary Farrelly (40:02)
I I hate this.
Emily Rosen (40:06)
important for anyone going through any sort of tough situation.
Mary Farrelly (40:07)
It's necessary.
Yeah, it gives you something, at least in my own experience, something that you're waiting for, but that it's a really good thing. Like I might be waiting for my bagel at the end of the day, but it's a good way. I know it's coming and it's there and it just makes all the other hard wait around you kind of disappear for a moment because you're waiting for that phone call with a friend. You're waiting for that walk. It's like a different.
Emily Rosen (40:21)
Mm.
Okay.
Mary Farrelly (40:35)
different type of anticipation that can help balance out. Like one of the things we talked through in all the training that I do with my NICU doula is like, there's a lot in the NICU that we can't control and it's going to be hard. It could be painful even for those involved and the babies. What can we do to counteract that? What can we do to balance it? Like if we're in the hard, where's the joy? So then in the long run, have the scales are a little bit more even so that the trauma doesn't win basically. Like it's there, it's never gonna go away, but what can we do to balance it out?
Emily Rosen (40:38)
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (41:05)
So I love bringing that up and having storytelling for you as a way of balancing it all out.
Emily Rosen (41:05)
Yeah.
Yeah, it's amazing
that you do what you do too. I just have to say like I wish I knew about and had a NICU Doula at the time. I think that would really helped with everything. So thank you for, you know, helping there be more NICU Doulas in the world that can help families like mine.
Mary Farrelly (41:32)
I think one of the visions that I have for is in the waiting, having someone there waiting with you, just being present and being alongside you and doing it without agenda or emotional attachment or connection. They're just waiting with you and being there for you. So thank you. And I'm excited to see how the work of NICU Doulas can impact future NICU stays and the overall, I guess, experience of the NICU journey for babies and their families. ⁓
Emily Rosen (41:39)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mary Farrelly (42:01)
But where can people, I know as people are listening to this, they're gonna be like, okay, I want this book, I want this as, it's amazing gift to give a family, it's an amazing gift to have just in the NICU as a resource, it's such, I mean, as a NICU nurse, I want it for my kids to listen and understand what's going on with my day-to-day living. So how can people find you and connect with you and then also get your book?
Emily Rosen (42:25)
Yeah, so my goal with this book is to reach and help as many NICU families and those supporting them as I can. And so I've actually been donating books to hospitals around the country to NICU so that they can have it in their NICU library as a resource for any families. I'm also going to be donating some proceeds to hospitals and NICU charities as well. And if you're interested in buying the book, it's
Wherever books are sold, it's on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, your local bookstores. I'm starting to get it in some hospital gift shops. And yeah, so anywhere you like to buy your books, you should be able to find it. There's also libraries across the country that now have it in stock as well. And then in terms of finding me, you can find me on Instagram at EmilyRosenCreative and my website is EmilyRosenCreative.com.
I'd love to connect with you. If you're a NICU parent or supporting a NICU family, feel free to reach out to me via DM. I always like connecting with people and sharing stories. So hopefully some of the stuff I share can be a good resource as well beyond the book. Because that's just my goal is to just help as many people going through it as I can.
Mary Farrelly (43:42)
Thank you so much. Your light is making a true difference and a true impact in so many stories. ⁓ And I'm just excited to continue to see how your work in your series evolves and brings even more storytelling to those less told stories. So thank you so much for joining me today. I hope that people who are listening
Emily Rosen (43:45)
Thank you.
Mary Farrelly (44:05)
feel a little bit more comfort in their waiting journey and now have a resource potentially to share with themselves or their loved ones or even their children as they're going through their NICU stay. So thank you so much for being here today, Emily
Emily Rosen (44:17)
Thank you, Mary. I really enjoyed chatting with you.