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Welcome to Opfocus’s podcast RevOps Rockstars. Join hosts David Carnes and Jarin Chu as they interview RevOps professionals and explore the challenges they face today. Throughout the show, we dive into how guests got started with their careers, their best tips and tricks, and what excites them about the future of the industry.
Chris Hudson: one of the main things that I love about my job is I get to teach, right? I, I love to, instead of, hey, Chris, can you build this report? I go, hey, let's spend some time and let's build this report together so I could show you how the data structure is. And I really found myself enjoying teaching,
David Carnes: Today's guest is a RevOps leader with a lot of wisdom to share. He's someone I've known for quite a few years. We met first... At a, uh, Salesforce training class that I led on, uh, the migration to Lightning. And he was such an amazing participant in the class. And now all these years later, it's great to see him as the Director of Revenue Operations for Otter.
ai. Welcome Chris Hudson to the podcast.
Chris Hudson: Thank you, David. Happy to be here.
David Carnes: So Chris, we want to start off with a hard hitting question. What's something in RevOps that you had to learn the hard way?
Chris Hudson: Very good question. Uh, I'm going to answer it in two parts. The first one is there's not enough time in the day to get everything that needs to be done. So ruthless prioritization is probably the main skill that you need to have. And then also learning how to say no.
David Carnes: Uh, I think those are both great. And what would be an example where you had to say no? Is this, I mean, I suppose the harder ones are when you're saying no to folks sort of in the higher pay grade, uh, maybe that their priority isn't the priority for the company, something like that.
Chris Hudson: Yeah, that's one of the ones. The other is sort of, um, again, I align my priorities with like my CRO and my head of sales. And so sometimes if there are cross functional asks that.
are maybe lower priority, I have to say I can't get it done right now.
Jarin Chu: I think that ability to push back is so important, um, in managing a wide variety of functions that are usually under RevOps, and I do want to start talking about your RevOps team. First, as a little bit of context, your company, Otter. ai, Helps different sales teams, service teams, customer facing teams record and analyze their conversations.
I think most recently in February 2021, the team raised a 50 million Series B, which is so awesome. But in your own words, what does otter. ai do?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, so the way that I like to think about Otter is it's sort of an AI meeting companion. So whether you're an in person or in virtual events or meetings such as this, we were a horizontal tool from whether you're a journalist or a student or professor, And you wanted to transcribe your meetings, but we've really Transcribed by https: otter.
ai Found certain niches now and sort of verticals where, whether you're consulting, uh, such as OpFocus or even sales teams, where if you need to write up follow up emails or even just get your action items in meetings, um, it's a really good companion that has followed me since I've started Otter all of my meetings.
Jarin Chu: And that's seemingly one of the top, sort of, most popular uh, RevOps Rockstars guests kind of share when they're like, oh, what gets you the most excited these days in tech? So, so awesome that, uh, Otter. ai is trying to just simplify those follow up motions. Help me understand first, what kind of RevOps team size are you working with and how...
big of a team are you supporting in terms of kind of the marketing, sales, customer success functions?
Chris Hudson: Yeah. Uh, so we are a mighty team of one right now, full time employee, but we do, I do have, uh, a few contractors and consultants helping with specific other areas, uh, what's good is I'm going to be getting headcount in a little bit, uh, for two other areas. Uh, but specifically the people that we support, there's about 13 people, uh, in what you consider like the go to market operations team that I support.
Jarin Chu: Awesome, and congrats on being able to get a headcount, that must be such an exciting time right now.
Chris Hudson: Super exciting and much, much needed.
Jarin Chu: So in your current role as the Mighty Team of One, and soon to be many more people, what kinds of functions do you oversee and support the Go To Market team with?
Chris Hudson: Yeah. Um, so I like to think that I wear four main hats or own four different functions. Um, the first one being DealDesk, and that's really focusing on the speed from getting a quote out, right, and quickly getting that cash to provisioning orders or sort of working cross functionally with?
your security or legal teams.
The other hat that I own is business systems. So, uh, obviously Salesforce is the end all be all for, for sales operations or revenue operations, but, uh, we have about 18 connected tools that really focus on helping the team move fast, but allow us to get the data that we need. And then I also own what we consider go to market operations.
So everything from rules of engagement, understanding the lead process to opportunity from opportunity to close 1 customer and the handoffs in between to commissions and territories and all that. And then the last hat I like to think of is. So reporting dashboards, you know, figuring out account scoring models or lead scoring models and that sort of stuff.
So those are the 4 main role roles that I
Jarin Chu: Chris, what's so cool is that with the number of folks who join our podcast, we're really seeing a gamut of, you know, small RevOps teams, one to three folks, all the way to, we've got 40 people running this one aspect of RevOps.
And what I keep seeing is. The complexity, of course, of the size of the RevOps team will change given the amount of things you own, but the number of functions does not really decrease, even if it's only a few person RevOps team. And you're demonstrating exactly that. You're kind of seeing across the gamut from commissions to provisioning, go to market operations, analytics.
I would love to understand. Knowing that you're also relying on some contractors with work, how to determine what you keep in house, what you do, what your team that you're hiring will keep in house versus what are the things that you can trust a contractor or trust a, uh, trusted consultant to take on and that isn't in house.
Chris Hudson: yeah, um, I think when it comes to. Certain things like deal desk that needs to be in house, right? Cause it's being able to review the contracts And working closely with the sales team. But, uh, we have a CPQ system that I haven't used before. Uh, I've used, you know, Aptis and I've used Salesforce CPQ. And so, uh, being able to find somebody who is the resident expert in this, um, is able to help us change the system without that sort of learning curve that, you know, again, it's, it's.
The, the bandwidth constraints that we have on the team. And so I think. When it comes to finding a resident expert in a tool or a system that is not something that we have in house, that's where we're able to focus on finding an external party to help us out.
Jarin Chu: And you're talking about, of course, thinking about it in the framework of tools and systems. Are there also, um, specific types of functions? You mentioned, for example, Theodesk. Totally makes sense to be in Are there types of functions that you're like, Hey, maybe our team can be more focused on strategy or maybe our team can be more focused on execution and pull in different folks who have prior experience to help with different kinds of initiatives?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, uh, so one of the things that we also think back, or I think back to is We, I have two contractors that basically their job is to do data research and that allows us to have our team focused on the selling activities versus researching and finding the right people to an account. And I hope that answers the question that you had.
Jarin Chu: Yeah, that's a great example. Because you've mentioned that the team is growing and you do have open headcount, I thought it'd be a good opportunity for you to share. What is your open headcount right now? And maybe some of the listeners who are on the job market or looking for a new opportunity can reach out and put their application in with you.
Chris Hudson: Yeah. Um, so again, across, across the board, we're hiring from AI engineers to account executives. So anybody who's listening to this podcast, uh, is interested in that, please feel free to apply, but I'm specifically looking to hire somebody for deal desk and for business system. So two, two roles. They're not open yet, uh, on the job board, but hopefully by the time this podcast airs, it will be on the website.
David Carnes: You heard it first here on RevOps Rockstars podcast, Otter. ai's new role openings for RevOps. Very cool. I'm excited for you, Chris. That's super. So, so Chris, your title is Director of Revenue Operations. What does your day to day entail?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, uh, my day to day typically is focusing on the, what I would consider like the ad hoc requests and helping the sales team, basically, whether it's. Booking an order or setting up a trial or helping figure out a report to more strategic projects. And I think that's really what I'm gold on. And what my my North star is is is being able to, you know, if I put an hour or 10 hours into something, hopefully 100 or 1000 hours worth of work is is saved or optimized for.
And So some of the strategic projects that I worked on initially was. Fixing the lead to opportunity flow or, uh, even the, the customer handoff and us now we, we do webinars for all of our customers from our, our sales assisted to our free customers. And so these really help drive certain things like adoption and reducing churn and retaining customers and basically helping them understand how to leverage Otter better in their day to day.
David Carnes: So how do you measure success in your role?
Chris Hudson: It's usually numbers driven. So we'll typically have KPIs. Um, and so for me, one of the initiatives that we had was sort of driving that revenue retention, right? So how do we put in projects to drive that, that number up? And that's one of the initiatives where it was like, we had a certain goal and because of the start of the quarter versus the end of the quarter, we're able to see the Delta and You could trace back to the projects that we ran that were ideally the driving factor to updating that number or improving it.
David Carnes: You know, one of the fascinating things from our perspective as consultants working with companies across many years is watching that initial struggle to grow the team and to justify the value for bringing on these headcount. How do you justify your team's existence and value in the organization, especially whereas you're trying to grow the team?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, no, that's, uh, it's been a bit of, a learning for me. Initially when, the head of sales was, joining our, was joining Otter, when he was talking to the board, he was saying, Hey, I need revenue operations. And basically it's Because of the fact that allows him to focus on the selling and training of the sales team for any of the backend stuff to be taken over.
And I think one of the main things that we learned was, if you are able to allow sales executives to focus more on selling it. opens up the opportunity for them to have more opportunities that they can work or more close one business that they can do. And so taking any of the admin work off of them and helping them understand from the reporting or analytics perspective, like where should they be focusing their time?
And so I think it was seen as both a strategic and tactical hire, um, and why I'm able to get also additional headcount, uh,
David Carnes: Yeah, that's super. So, so Chris, one last question about your role. What keeps you up at night?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, I think the biggest thing that keeps me up at night is Making sure that, that the team and company is successful. Uh, I believe that revenue operations plays a huge part in the success of the organization and, you know, also doing right by the customer. Um, we were working on AI back in, in 2016 and, and very recently OpenAI, uh, has come out with the chat GPT and all these other things.
And so there's been a lot of startups that have. Artificial intelligence layered on to their, to their platform. And so how can we differentiate ourselves and provide more value to our customers?
David Carnes: Yeah, that's super. So your team, I mean, you've already described some of it. You own cross functional corporate level initiatives. Uh, Woohoo.
Chris Hudson: Yeah. Um, some of the first things that we did was driving, uh, data and insights from our backend system into Salesforce to, to leverage that. Directly within Salesforce and, you know, our account executive team is, uh, probably not the most versed in SQL, uh, myself either. And so what we're able to do is take our data to make it actionable within Salesforce, and that was cross functional from, I mean, getting approval of our CEO to back end engineers and data scientists to help build that pipeline.
Some of the things that we've also realized is, you know, we do have several adoption metrics, but another cross functional initiative that we're, that we're doing is how do we Use the information that we have from the sales team, learning from our customers, and how do we push that back into the product teams or the engineering teams to understand what's going on and what are people talking about?
And so it's, um, it's a lot of really cool stuff that we're doing and leveraging our own, our own tool as well. Um, yeah, those, those are some of the top, I would say, uh, initiatives that were cross functional. Oh. Actually, one other one. Uh, we just launched our Salesforce integration, and so I had to work with an engineering team to be like, this is how I would like to see it.
Um, totally forgot about that one, but.
David Carnes: That's super. That's great.
Jarin Chu: That is really exciting when the primary user is able to help inform the direction of the product. And I know you must have shared some really good recommendations. Um, I know we're going to geek out a little bit about tech later, and I want to ask you, you know, you briefly mentioned, hey, we're using Otter.
on our own team. I want to kind of hear what that's about, uh, in a bit. But first, one of the key things that RevOps teams are asked to do in supporting, um, C suite with board presentations is the prep of board material. Can you share what is your process today? When is it the end of the month or the end of the quarter and your sales leader or your, um, C suite comes to you and like, we need all the reports.
We need all the dashboards. How do you go about Preparing board materials and staying on top of just being organized with those metrics and KPIs that you're tracking.
Chris Hudson: Yeah, I think of, you know, the set it and forget it in terms of like you build the report or you build the dashboard the one time because you know it's going to be scalable and be used again. And so all it is is quickly, Hey, we need this, Chris, like, you know, give us the top customers in this vertical or what was this pipeline or how much closed one business did we have?
Because I've built it once, I'm able to just refresh that, that reporter dashboard and then provide it to them. And so it's usually a little bit of back and forth of, okay, how do we, you know, this, this customer logo or, you know, this certain set of data. But I would say the first time was a little bit of an arduous process, but now that it's built, it's sort of a couple, couple clicks of a refresh And be able to provide that data.
I
Jarin Chu: And because we like to ask the questions that other people don't usually get to ask, uh, or discuss, was there some kind of metric that you found the C suite or board to care a lot about that was particularly difficult when you were setting up that dashboard the first time? Or maybe something you're working on right now that you're trying to be able to say, I want to be able to automate this so it becomes much easier moving forward.
Chris Hudson: think David, you're gonna like this. Uh, it was activity metrics, right? And because, because the way that Salesforce, uh, captures the activity, it was hard to report on. And so I actually had to purchase another tool to be able to capture that, that task and activity data. So it's understanding, you know, how many emails, how many meetings, how many, um, you know, calls are being done from, And so.
That's one of the reasons that we had to purchase another tool is to be able to get that accurate level data of, you know, are we touching accounts? How many accounts? How many meetings are people having per week or per month?
David Carnes: And just one quick update to jump in on that, um, uh, in the winter release of Salesforce, uh, related to the Einstein Activity Capture 360 product, they've given us what, what they're calling unified reporting across the, EAC 360 auto captured activity data plus the standard, maybe manually entered activity data.
Up until this point, it's been a real challenge for people to report on these two separate data sources, but they've actually combined them through the ability to create custom report types on that data.
Chris Hudson: I learned something new. I, I, I am so glad I joined this podcast just for that, that information.
Jarin Chu: David always has the latest on Salesforce product developments, especially related to reportable things. So, continuing this thread on, um, tech, I would love to know, especially right now, as a mighty team of one, is a tech stack tool that you could not live without. Where without it, it just would not make sense in terms of your efficiency or this tool just makes your life so much easier today.
Chris Hudson: Yeah, Um. Obviously Salesforce. Salesforce is the number one and I'll be all, if it's not in Salesforce, it doesn't exist. I'm sure everybody listening to this has, has heard that mantra, um, Otter as well is, is another one. Obviously, uh, it, it brings in the data into, into Salesforce that allows me to, to look at, dashboards and the sales team to be able to get the information that they need.
And I would say if I could plug one last one, it would probably be Rattle. Uh, the sales team likes to call me the man behind the curtain in Wizard of Oz and Rattle allows me to have those sort of insights actionable within Slack and yeah, I really love that tool.
Jarin Chu: Yeah, I can sense the excitement and net promoter you are behind those three. Uh, you had quickly referenced that, um, you're starting to use or you've been using Otter to help manage your internal team. You mentioned that you also worked with the engineering team to create that Salesforce and Otter integration.
Talk about that a little bit more and what gets you excited about how you're using Otter internally today with Salesforce.
Chris Hudson: Yeah. Uh, So, one of the main things that I think I really like about Otter is the entire company has an Otter account. And so what this allows people to do is all the information is shared into certain repositories, and they're able to use our AI chat feature, which allows people to search and say, okay, what competitor was discussed, right?
Or what product features have customers been asking? And it really helps align sort of from the executive level all the way down to you know, a product manager or an engineer saying what did, what was the question or answer from a certain prospect or customer on what they needed Otter to do. And so it really helps inform, I think, our strategic product roadmap.
But also allows, you know, our, our sales executive team to look at, Hey, how are we doing on these calls? Like what, what work can we do to improve or as new sales people come on board? How do you, um, show them really good pricing conversations or, or what were really good, um, you know, objection handling as well.
David Carnes: I have to ask you a question about reporting. Where do you go to get an at a glance view of what's going on in the business?
Chris Hudson: I have a few dashboards. Uh, and so for me, the, uh, I have like what we consider a sales ops dashboard, which is like. What is going wrong if there's anything that's going wrong, right? So, okay, here's a, uh, uh, you know, uh, opportunity That's been closed 1, but has been provisioned or here is a, um, you know, a lead flow or somebody hasn't responded at a certain time to.
Having direct forecasting dashboards to see, like, what is our current attainment? What is, you know, how are the reps doing? What are the top open opportunities? And has any pipeline changed or shifted over time?
David Carnes: That's amazing. We here in the Salesforce community, people talk of the zero dashboards. So, you know, just, you want to see a bunch of zeros. If you see numbers, then that's bad. And you need to go pounce on those things. So it sounds like what you've done with the SalesOps dashboard.
Chris Hudson: That's exactly right.
David Carnes: Chris, what do you think the next big disruption will be in RevOps?
Chris Hudson: I am really excited if AI can help certain tasks that need to get done, but we spend a lot of time on. Like, I think nobody cares about, hey, I deleted all these duplicate activities, or I deleted these accounts that, you know, Or out of business, but really, I believe that the data foundation allows you to, or a good data foundation and CRM hygiene allows you to accurately report on the business.
And so if there is certain tools that can help. automate or, um, sort of keep the CRM clean or even repetitive tasks like, I mean, account assignments sometimes is a pain, right? Hey, I need a hundred new accounts and it's like, okay, I got to upload these accounts. I got to reassign them, right? And so I'm really excited if there are certain things that need to get done and there's a tool that allows us to automate them.
David Carnes: Well, super. So, so Chris, we want to shift now and talk a little bit about your background. Uh, you live in the Bay area and I think the entire time I've known you, you've been in the Bay area. Uh, you studied at UC Santa Barbara, super cool area, uh, did a, did a BA there. Uh, your previous role was at branch and sales operations.
I'm, I'm curious. So I, I don't know this origin story from you the whole time I've known you, you've been in SAS RevOps. How did you get into SAS RevOps?
Chris Hudson: That's a, that's a great question. Um, when I went to school, I had no idea what I wanted to do and I basically went there, um, and found what was called the technology management program, which was, it came from the engineering, uh, department. And it was really for people who were interested in entrepreneurship.
And So I learned, uh, entrepreneurial marketing and new product development. And when I graduated, it wasn't the best time to enter the workforce. It was, uh, during the great recession. And so, um, I did, uh, did a startup job. Um, I worked in real estate and then I started up a company with one of my high school friends.
Um, and what he was doing was taking mobile applications from Japan and localizing it to the, to the English speaking market. And I thought. Oh, this is, this could be a huge opportunity. And, um, so we, we basically worked together and long story short, we, um, you know, we, we put the project in, in cold storage, so to speak.
But, um, I realized that there was a lot of things that I didn't know about operations. And I had a mentor, um. That I eventually joined, uh, Arena for, uh, and he really looked at, uh, getting me, you know, looking at the technology management and project management and, uh, technical writing to help sort of mold me into what I would say, like an operations professional is.
Uh, and so I, I sort of found myself in this role, um, from, from basically my, my background and my interest in, in startups and technology.
David Carnes: So you're coming up on two years at Otter. ai. If you could go back to day one and give yourself advice, what would that be?
Chris Hudson: I was talking to a colleague prior to, to joining, um, and to give a little bit of context, uh, the head of sales joined in, I want to say June of 2021 with a CSM and I believe an SDR. And he was basically selling stuff yesterday, helping him, uh, manage the inbound leads and the CSM helping sort of onboard onboard the customers.
And I joined in January with another account executive, another SDR, and we've since grown the team again to 16 hiring many more. Um, I. Thought that it would take me about a year to get everything ready and what I needed to, to get done. Uh, being more reactive versus proactive. But everybody who I talked to said, oh yeah, it's gonna take at least like a year and a half to two years.
I was like, no, no, it's gonna only take a year. Uh, lo and behold, I, I should have listened to, to people that were smarter than me saying it. It, it, it'll, it'll happen, but it will take some time.
Jarin Chu: That's really, really great reflection. And, you know, reflecting back on your background, you've mentioned that you've founded your own business, you've worked in real estate, and then you've since dedicated yourself to sales ops. It kind of seems like the possibilities are all over, you know, they're endless.
You can continue in, uh, RevOps, you could continue in the corporate world, or you could pick up one of your cold storage projects at some point. So, in an ideal world, What might be one of the things that are on your career bucket list? May not be next, but one of the things where you're like, Oh, it would be awesome to do that at some point.
Chris Hudson: Yeah, uh, for me, one of the main things that I love about my job is I get to teach, right? I, I love to, instead of, hey, Chris, can you build this report? I go, hey, let's spend some time and let's build this report together so I could show you how the data structure is. And I really found myself enjoying teaching, uh, David, I think, I think that resonates with you as well.
Um, but yeah, I, I think one of the things that I want to do later on my career is definitely to, to teach.
Jarin Chu: So maybe the next time, uh, there's a Salesforce reporting workshop, it might be Chris at the helm, uh, in addition to David. Legal rev ops, especially In a growing company, especially supporting this many people as currently a team of one, soon to grow again, um, that can be pretty intense. Like you're, you've got your hands in all sorts of pots, you're wearing all sorts of hats.
I mean, you've just mentioned four of them, but I'm sure there's plenty more ad hoc and one time requests that come up. What are some things you do to unwind, especially given that you're in beautiful California?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, I would say the number one thing that I love doing is going out in nature and hiking. Uh, as you can see I'm actually in Tahoe right now, um, and one funny story about this is it's hiking for me allows me to sort of get fresh air and like work through any problems or de stress and one of the things that I did was with my fiancé, we were I had a problem.
I needed to figure out how to get the data from our backend into, into Salesforce. I knew the tool, but I didn't know sort of the automation or the way that I was going to build these custom objects. And So bless, bless my fiance's heart. I spent about four and a half hours talking her ear off and walking Miller Park in Oakland, trying to figure out how I'm going to build this, this system.
And sure enough, as soon as we got done, wrote it all down. And that Monday basically built. built out the beginnings that we are still using to this day.
Jarin Chu: So she's an honorary Ops rockstar as well, given all of the sounding board she's been for you.
Chris Hudson: Absolutely.
Jarin Chu: You've picked up operations, sales ops, rev ops along the way. You've mentioned, Hey, I noticed I have these gaps in my ops learning. What do you turn to today in terms of communities or resources or groups to help you stay on top of what's such a fast, fastly expanding and developing field?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, it's a good question. Um, I definitely have a few people I would consider mentors that I, I bring questions or, or issues to. Um, there's also some amazing communities out there. There's like RevOps Co op, there's Wizard of Ops. Um, I love also being part of Modern Sales Pros. So I get the emails in a digest to see what people are talking about.
And it's really keeping my ear to the ground of like, What's changing or what's happening within, within the industry. Um, and so, yeah, that, that would be the, the three things that I would say is it's newsletters, um, having mentors and being part of communities of, again, standing on the shoulders of giants of people that are smarter and better than I am in certain areas.
Jarin Chu: Yeah, we've got quite a big fan base here for, um, we've heard Wizard of Ops many times, RevOps, Co Ops many times, and for folks, especially who are more focused on the sales ops side, uh, MSPs just seems to be such a great recurring resource. Are there specific people you follow or folks that you've admired that you've worked with in RevOps where you're like, Hey, I think they would be a great person to maybe join season two of the RevOps Rockstars podcast.
Who would you recommend that you respect?
Chris Hudson: Uh, I didn't give him a heads up, but Steven Daniels, uh, he was somebody that I worked with at Branch. Uh, today he's at Cresta. He's definitely somebody I would recommend getting on. He's, he's one of the people I would consider a mentor. Um, and yeah, that's, that's top of mind. Um. I would probably, uh, Jeff Ignacio.
I'm, I'm subscribed to his, his new LE newsletter. I forget the name of it off the top of my head, but I think he would be somebody really cool to, to have on as Well,
David Carnes: Well, that's super. Thank you so much for the suggestions and we'll include links to their LinkedIn profiles in the in the show notes for today's episode. So, Chris, where can people find you? Are you out there on social media? Are you active on any of the, uh, different sites?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, uh, you can find me on LinkedIn. It's the linkedin.com/in/cj Hudson Ssf and I haven't wrote a blog post in a while, but if you ever are interested in looking at my random ramblings around Salesforce and what have you, uh, cj hudson.com.
David Carnes: Well, very cool. And how can somebody learn more about otterdata. ai?
Chris Hudson: Yeah, go to otter. ai?
uh, and you're able to see everything. If you wanted to get in touch with our sales team and see some of the cool stuff that we, that we do, uh, you can go to otter. ai forward slash sales. And yeah, it's, uh, we'd be happy to, to show everything about Otter and what it can do and help you not only in operations, but if you're in sales or what have you.
David Carnes: Chris, what a pleasure it's been to have you on the podcast today, not just because you and I have known each other for a very long time, uh, but also to hear the cool things that you're doing at otterdata. ai. Uh, at the beginning of the episode, you talked about relentless prioritization and learning how to say no, which is really great.
And then, uh, you shared quite a bit about how you're thinking about building your team and, and the responsibilities that you're looking for, for your team to take on. Um, uh, and then I really appreciate you sharing the groups that you're part of. It, it, it's so meaningful for our listeners to hear about the different groups that people find valuable, different resources and people in the community.
So thank you so much for being a guest on the podcast. It's really been a pleasure to see you again, Chris.
Chris Hudson: Thank you, David. Thank you, Jaron. It was a great pleasure as well.
Jarin Chu: I also want to thank the many, many Rev Ops rock stars who followed this podcast through our 30 some, close to 40 episodes. Um, this is one of our last episodes here. I think maybe second to last episode. So if you've learned something today with our conversation with Chris or throughout the season, uh, please tell someone about the podcast.
Subscribe. Leave a comment for us on LinkedIn. We'd love to hear about what you want to hear about more for the next season. Chris, so great to see your face again after many years. Congrats again on Otter and, um, we're so glad to have you today on the podcast. Thank you.
Chris Hudson: Thank you so much.
Jarin Chu: And this has been another exciting episode of Raph's Rockstars.
See you next time.
David Carnes: Stay classy, rock stars.