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My name is Jeff, and I'd like to welcome you on a journey of reflection and insight into the tolls and triumphs of a career in automotive repair.
After more than 20 years of skinned knuckles and tool debt, I want to share my perspective and hear other people's thoughts about our industry.
So pour yourself a strong coffee or grab a cold Canadian beer and get ready for some great conversation.
Brian DiCesare Full Audio
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[00:00:00] Brian DiCesare: And it goes back to our reputation in the industry. There's a lack of trust 'cause every time the car comes in, it's $2,000. It's $2,000. That's, you know, that's why we write everything up. Here's everything, right? I don't care if it's eight grand, but these are the couple things you need. But this, just be aware that you, you're gonna have this coming down the, the pipe.
[00:00:26] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:00:26] Brian DiCesare: That way they know in the back of their mind that, hey, I got some maintenance I gotta do. If everybody did the same thing, if we were, you know, uniform with that, a lot of that trust could change a lot of things in our industry.
[00:00:46] Jeff Compton: Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to another exciting episode of the Jaded Mechanic Podcast. It's another sunny Sunday night here in Ontario, Kingston, Canada. And, uh, not a Canadian tonight, guys. It's been an all-American weekend, so, you know, I'm trying to get us up to that 51st state that everybody thinks they should be.
[00:01:05] Jeff Compton: Um, but I got a friend of mine from Pennsylvania that I met at Tools. Um, and he kinda reached out to me. We, we hit it off pretty good at Tools. We had a lot of great conversation, and he's like, "I wanna be on the podcast." And I'm, "I wanna..." Uh, you know, I've got some difference of opinions and stuff that he wanted to share.
[00:01:21] Jeff Compton: So I'm with Brian DeCesare tonight. Brian, how's it going, bro?
[00:01:25] Brian DiCesare: Doing good, man. It's an honor to be on the podcast. A little bit out of my element, to be honest with you, but, you know, it's how we're gonna go about, you know, bringing some change into this awesome industry, you know, that I've loved my entire life.
[00:01:40] Jeff Compton: Yeah. You showed me... Now, before we got on, you showed me a picture with him and his father, um, and standing next to the... What's, what were you guys standing next to? Was it a Camaro?
[00:01:49] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. It was, uh, I believe it was a Mustang. Um- Okay ... yeah, it was a little Mustang. So that's little Mr. DeCesare right there, and, you know, my father back in the '80s in the, on a Polaroid, so-
[00:02:02] Jeff Compton: Yeah
[00:02:03] Brian DiCesare: you know.
[00:02:04] Jeff Compton: Now, was, was your dad a wrench? Was he a tech?
[00:02:06] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. Well, he was a body guy, you know. Um, he was, he was an awesome body guy, uh, you know. He, um, he, him and my godfather started a shop in Jersey, and, um, you know, there was a difference of opinion, and then he kinda, like, bounced around, um, after that. But, you know, from my earliest memories, I was in the shop.
[00:02:29] Brian DiCesare: That's, that was life, you know. Um, get dropped off, be with Dad all day in white pants, and my mom would freak out 'cause I'd come home filthy. And she'd be like, "You sent him to the shop in white pants. What'd you think would happen?" You know?
[00:02:41] Jeff Compton: Right. Yeah. Uh, 'cause it's the same thing, primer dust and body filler and...
[00:02:45] Jeff Compton: Yeah, I grew up in that, too. That was my dad, right? And I, I joke all the time, like, you know, he was forever working in the garage next to the house, 8:00, 9:00, 10:00 at night, weekends, you know, always, always doing side work, always putting together, you know, putting g- lots of Mustangs together 'cause I don't know if they do it...
[00:03:04] Jeff Compton: Like, you're in Pennsylvania, but I don't know. Up here, those strut towers on the Mustangs would rot right out. Like, and it didn't matter, right? From the first gen, like I call them. Like, I can remember him doing '65s and '66s all the way up to, like, you know, the '70s stuff. And it always seemed like everybody just thought it was a strut tower, and it ended up being, like, part of the firewall and, you know, the fucking what we call the dogleg.
[00:03:28] Jeff Compton: And, like, it was just, they were just rotten.
[00:03:30] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. We have a big problem with rust here, too, and it's, it's from the, the treatment on the roads before it snows, you know. Um, I mean, those are most of the memories with him, too, you know. It was either, you know, in the shop or at the, at the, the Veterans Stadium for the Phillies, you know.
[00:03:44] Brian DiCesare: It was baseball or cars One or the other, you know?
[00:03:49] Jeff Compton: So, a- and he was, he was a, an auto body guy. How did you decide... 'Cause, like, I tell everybody, like, I was bored of body work. Like, I'd sanded on so many cars by the time I was 12, you know, and been around it that it didn't, it didn't hold any interest in me at all.
[00:04:04] Jeff Compton: I'm like you, I knew my dad was good at what he did, but I didn't pay it any attention, right? Like, I was just like, "Peh," you know? "Wow," you know? Yeah. "Last, there was a hole there, and now there's a perfectly, you know, hand-fabbed repair panel, and it's straight and smooth," and, you know, all that stuff. I was just all about how fast did the freaking things go.
[00:04:23] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. I, and, you know, I didn't wanna do... Well, you know, as a kid, you know, I got tired of body work, too. You know, the sanding and the, and the dirt, and it's just not something that I wanted to do, you know? And as a teen, like, kinda rebelled a little bit. I actually, the, one of the high schools that I went to was a trade school, and I went for welding-
[00:04:44] Jeff Compton: Okay
[00:04:44] Brian DiCesare: and learned how to use a plasma cutter, and stick weld, and MIG weld, and stuff like that. And looking back on it, like, having that in my tool belt, you know, in this industry has been very useful over the years. And, um, it's funny 'cause I'm sitting here thinking about him, and he had this, like, '86 IROC five-speed.
[00:05:02] Brian DiCesare: I love that. I loved being in the back of that car. And I remember we pulled into this 7-Eleven one time, and it wouldn't start.
[00:05:09] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:05:09] Brian DiCesare: And, you know, we, he's pushing it down the road, and then hopping back in and, and dumping the clutch. Brr, brr. Y- you know, those are the, the memories that I have, you know, as a kid.
[00:05:19] Brian DiCesare: And then, um, you know, fast-forwarding to now, like, I got into this because, you know, I was always good with my hands, you know? I had built go-karts in the shop with him. Um, I have pictures of that somewhere, too, when... You know, as a teen riding bikes, I would strip the entire bike down, change colors, you know, do this, do that, you know.
[00:05:42] Brian DiCesare: I was always one of the ones in the family, "Hey, the lawnmower won't start," or, "This won't w-" You know. So, always really good with my hands, you know? Um- In the back of my mind, I kinda always knew I was gonna be a mechanic, 'cause when people would ask me, you know, I, that's what I'm gonna do. Um, but, you know, my path into the industry, you know, wasn't normal.
[00:06:05] Brian DiCesare: Like, when I got out of high school, I went into sales, you know?
[00:06:09] Jeff Compton: Okay.
[00:06:09] Brian DiCesare: I was doing... I was, uh... It was, it was a scam, right? But it was the white, the white van scam where, "Hey, I got extra speakers on my truck." They were actually speakers. I was a young kid. I didn't know, and these guys were making 200 or 300 bucks a day back in, you know, the early 2000s.
[00:06:26] Brian DiCesare: And, um, I did that for about a year and, um, found out that I was good w- at talking to people. You know, I'm very personable and, um, I ended up going to a trade school in Bristol. Um, it's Pemco Tech. It's still, still around today. I think they're celebrating, like, 100 years being open. So I went and got an associate's degree in specialized technology.
[00:06:50] Brian DiCesare: So you know, you had fundamentals and engines and, and everything like that. But I had already had that background. You know what I mean? So, like, getting into fundamentals, like, I knew some of the stuff that they were teaching, and I was just getting some of the theory of operation behind it, you know? Like, I knew how things worked, but then I knew why they worked, you know?
[00:07:11] Brian DiCesare: And then I had this, this, uh, engine teacher, Mr. Hamza, man, he was, he was unbelievable. Like, I couldn't remember the four stroke cycle, and it was... he just broke it down suck, wheeze, pop, blow, you know? Yeah.
[00:07:24] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:07:24] Brian DiCesare: And, like, that's gotten me out of so many jams over the years, just remem- all right, well, this isn't...
[00:07:29] Brian DiCesare: All right, well, all right, here we go. That... We're missing something, you know? Do you have fuel? You have spark? You have compression? All right. And, um- You know, during, during the schooling I went and worked, uh... So my dad and my godfather had started a shop, and my dad ended up going away, like going and doing his own thing.
[00:07:51] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:07:52] Brian DiCesare: And my godfather owns this property, in the front is a body shop and then behind it are a bunch of shops. So I went to him and I'm like, "Hey, like, I'm in school. You told me when I went to school to come back and that you would help me, you know, get in somewhere." So he's like, "Go talk to Jamie," which was one of the guys that rented a four bay shop behind him.
[00:08:11] Jeff Compton: Okay.
[00:08:11] Brian DiCesare: And, uh, he specialized in Subarus. Okay. He, he had worked at a Subaru dealership for, like, 20, 25 years and then decided to go out on his own, and then took a lot of customers, you know, independent.
[00:08:25] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:08:25] Brian DiCesare: And, um, you know, one of the things that we were talking about is I watch pretty much all your podcasts.
[00:08:32] Brian DiCesare: I spent some time today just watching them just, just to hear what people were talking about and, um, it's a lot of dealer guys, you know? Um, and I'm not picking, you know what I mean? Like, I've been independent my entire career. Mm-hmm. You know, I've never worked at a dealer or a chain or anything like that.
[00:08:50] Brian DiCesare: And, um, so I go to work for Jamie and, um, you know, I start out sweeping floors, you know, organizing, learning where things are, changing oil here and there, tires, you know, a lot of tires in the beginning.
[00:09:03] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:09:04] Brian DiCesare: Um, and I worked with this guy named Bob and he can have an engine, one of those Subaru 2.5s out in, like, 40 minutes.
[00:09:13] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:09:14] Brian DiCesare: Like, you know, I've pulled engines o- you know, prior to this and just watching him I'm like, s- just blown away. You know what I mean? And, um, I don't know how many Subaru engines you've ever done, but they like to, to freeze together right there at the bell housing and, um-
[00:09:32] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:09:32] Brian DiCesare: you know, learning some tricks on how to separate them and, you know, putting a little anti-seize, you know, on the guide pins and such and, you know- Just getting, starting to get the flow of a shop as an adult, you know?
[00:09:46] Brian DiCesare: Um, so I end up graduating from Pennco Tech in, like, 2008, I wanna say, or 2009. And, uh, in Pennsylvania we have, uh, yearly emissions and safety.
[00:10:03] Jeff Compton: Okay.
[00:10:04] Brian DiCesare: So it's, you know, '96 and newer, it's a OBD II. You plug into the car. Yeah. You test the gas cap. That's the emission side, and then the safety side is, is anything falling off?
[00:10:15] Brian DiCesare: Are the brakes metal to metal? Is the windshield cra- You know, just a lot of safety stuff. And, um, Jamie was like, "Look, I don't have enough work here for you," you know, and Bob, you know. So I kind of floated around a little bit, you know. Um, I had a membership to a junkyard, so I would go and pull parts and, you know.
[00:10:38] Brian DiCesare: At this time I'm, like, 21, 22, so I'm doing a lot of work on the street. And, um, one of the things I was taught, you know, early on was, like, if you can learn to work on jack stands, you can do it in the air. Your leverage points are different, your techniques have to be different, your process has to be different.
[00:10:57] Brian DiCesare: And, um, you know, like any young tech, the money's not good, and you're, you're, you're paying for tooling. Um, you know, on top of that, you know, I'm paying 30 grand to go to school, so I have that bill, you know? And, um, so I'm just doing my thing on the street, you know, $40 for a pad slap, no rotors. You know, just doing young stuff for young friends, you know.
[00:11:22] Brian DiCesare: Looking back at it, I did what I had to do to survive and, you know, those are things that I wouldn't do today. Okay. You know what I mean? Just for safety reasons.
[00:11:30] Jeff Compton: Yeah. When you, when you talked about, like you kind of said, and we've talked about this before, how it's a lot of dealer guys. I, I sometimes have to remind people that, like, a lot of the really angry people that contact me about wanting to be on and be heard, they work at dealers.
[00:11:46] Brian DiCesare: Yeah, that's true.
[00:11:47] Jeff Compton: And that's... So it's like... And I don't know if- Like, I wanna think that the podcast has got traction really good in, in both, you know, independent side of people and dealers. But for some reason, man, like, I get so many more people reaching out to me that have been like either left the dealer or are in it and hate it, or like bounced around and finally landed in a good one and they wanna share, like, it...
[00:12:12] Jeff Compton: But they've got a lot of negative to say. So I mean, sometimes I feel, Brian, like, it's like everything I'm saying is, like, being heard, but it's like in the, in the circles that we run in, which is more like ASOG and changing and, you know, we have the aftermarket side of things, right? Like you, where you grew up.
[00:12:31] Jeff Compton: And they're hearing these conversations, but they're hearing all these grumpy people from the dealers, and they're going-- Their ans- simple answer is like, "Well, just leave the dealerships."
[00:12:40] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:12:42] Jeff Compton: It's tough. Yeah. It's, it- It's a
[00:12:44] Brian DiCesare: tough transition.
[00:12:45] Jeff Compton: And it's tough to leave anywhere where you're... Like I say this, you know, the devil you know, right?
[00:12:51] Jeff Compton: So you're in some place and it's like you're kinda, you're, you're surviving, you know, you're getting some flow. It, it has its ups and downs, every job does. To turn around and just go like that and go no more, man, I did it and it, and it, and it's tough. It's really tough. It is really hard to decide. The first time I took a job that wasn't a dealer job, I was shitting tacks, I was so nervous.
[00:13:14] Jeff Compton: You know?
[00:13:14] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. And, and it's 'cause you never know what you're gonna get on a daily basis. And- Yeah ... um, listen, even in the independent world, like part of my, what we're, you know, eventually my story, just how many times I've been screwed. You know what I mean? It's the same. You know what I mean? Like, the dealer politics are different from a lot of guys that I've talked to it, you know, whether it be your podcast or just guys that I know in the industry locally.
[00:13:40] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:13:40] Brian DiCesare: You know, um, there is change coming, there is change happening, but it's-- There's a l- The te- I feel like the technology has to keep growing in order for some of these hole-in-the-wall places to finally fall off to where-
[00:13:56] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:13:56] Brian DiCesare: all the better shops can absorb a lot of that clientele. You know what I mean?
[00:14:01] Brian DiCesare: And a lot of those technicians can find places where y- it's good culture and it's a good living and, you know, you don't mind getting, getting up and going to work every day.
[00:14:11] Jeff Compton: Yeah. Now when you say, like, you were screwed, how, how were you screwed? Just, like, in the sense of
[00:14:18] Brian DiCesare: so- ...
[00:14:19] Jeff Compton: chosen times or
[00:14:21] Brian DiCesare: what? So I worked at, um, two different shops for a period of four years.
[00:14:29] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:14:29] Brian DiCesare: Um, I, I get to this shop and there's, there's one tech in there and, you know, they pay me very well, you know? Um, I'm there two months and the service writer quit. New service writer comes in, he's a good dude. They fire the other tech, and they're like, "We're gonna get you somebody. We're gonna find someone."
[00:14:48] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. Six months go by, you know, of me in this, a three-bay shop by myself, 10 to 14 cars a day. Not everything's getting finished. I'm making a killing.
[00:14:59] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:15:00] Brian DiCesare: But I am miserable. Y- I don't wanna get up. I don't wanna go to work. My body hurts. I'm angry at everyone. I don't wanna... You just... Life's... Like, money's one thing, but at what point do you enjoy life?
[00:15:14] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean?
[00:15:16] Jeff Compton: And five days a week or six days a
[00:15:17] Brian DiCesare: week? Five days. Yep. Yeah. Five days a week, man, and you know, I had to... I, I always say, like, one of the, the guys that I work with, I'm like, "Why do I gotta lose my temper for things to change?"
[00:15:28] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:15:28] Brian DiCesare: You know? I, I'll, I'll warn you and say, "Hey, we should probably do this," or, "Why don't we do things like this?"
[00:15:34] Brian DiCesare: And then when I lose my temper, it's like, "Whoa, whoa, calm down. All right. All right. We'll, we'll, we'll get somebody in." I'm like, "I'm going on vacation."
[00:15:42] Jeff Compton: Yeah. "
[00:15:42] Brian DiCesare: Who's gonna be here?"
[00:15:43] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:15:44] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? Like...
[00:15:46] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:15:47] Brian DiCesare: So in the midst of me being there, they bring in this kid, and, um- He doesn't really know much.
[00:15:55] Brian DiCesare: He had went to a trade school, you know, not a large set of tools. Uh, and I tried to bring him un- under my wing. Um, I'm a big torque spec guy, so, you know, torque sticks on the impact gun, and then when it hits the ground, double-check them. Yeah. You know what I mean? And, uh, his first two weeks there, he left six wheels loose, you know?
[00:16:15] Brian DiCesare: Um, I had him do a wheel bearing job for me, um, and I was, like, doing one thing, and I'm coming over and I'm checking, and I'm like, "All right. Make sure you tighten these bolts." And then I got pulled away, and he put the wheel on the car, and the next thing I know, the thing's coming back on the tow truck, you know?
[00:16:32] Brian DiCesare: So that was the help that I was getting. So in the midst of all that, I'm like, "I gotta find... I c- I can't do this anymore." Like, I'm mentally, I'm burnt out. Like, I'm, I'm physically worn out. Um, my mentality's not good. Um, you know, so I start looking for a place on In- on Indeed and, um, you know, I had somebody drive, like, 45 minutes to meet me at a local restaurant.
[00:16:58] Brian DiCesare: And they're like, "You know, we wanna bring you in to be our foreman." So I had said that I never worked for a chain like Mavis or any of that stuff. This is, like, a small independent chain. They have, like... I think they have, like, seven shops now.
[00:17:13] Jeff Compton: Okay.
[00:17:13] Brian DiCesare: And, um, they're based out of Delaware. They drive up and they're like, "Hey, listen, we op- opened a store in Delaware County.
[00:17:21] Brian DiCesare: You know, we want you to come be the guy over there. You know, we'll pay you w-whatever, you know?" And I'm like, "I'll think about it," you know? So, um, I go back to work after this vacation, after meeting with these guys, and, um, they fire the kid, my helper.
[00:17:40] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm. So you're right back to-
[00:17:42] Brian DiCesare: I'm right back to being by myself, and I'm like, "Fuck this.
[00:17:46] Brian DiCesare: I'm done." You know? I told my service writer, I'm like, "Friday's my last day." I don't think he told the owners. I pull up that Friday with my truck and a trailer, and I'm loading my toolbox onto the trailer, and he's like... I- I'm like, "I fucking told you I'm out." "Well, whoa." I'm like, "I can't do this by myself anymore.
[00:18:08] Brian DiCesare: Like, it's too much. I can't plug tires and do these timing chains on this Chevy Traverse." Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's... I can't... Uh, the, I remember the one day I had a Chevy Traverse subframe out, you know, it's getting timing chains, and then I got a, uh, water pump on a Ford, you know, that's a timing cover too.
[00:18:27] Brian DiCesare: And it's like, "Hey, can you plug this tire real quick?" Like- Bro. I got like $7,000 worth of work sitting in these two bays. Like- Yeah ... you plug it. You know what I mean? So, you know, I load up and it was a minor inconvenience for two weeks and, uh, you know, I get to their Delaware store and they're like, "Man, you're everything you said."
[00:18:48] Brian DiCesare: 'Cause, you know, in our industry, we get a lot of people, "I can do this, I can do that," and, you know, you get guys and they, they can't, you know? And, um, so they put me through this little... They told me I was gonna be in Delaware for two weeks, I was there for six days, you know. So they moved me to the store that they were gonna...
[00:19:05] Brian DiCesare: It was gonna be mine. So I get there and, you know, there's what? One, two, there was four, there was two service writers and three techs. And, um, the manager was a degenerate gambler.
[00:19:20] Jeff Compton: Mm.
[00:19:21] Brian DiCesare: Um, the one tech used to be a security guard, so he was like a year in doing tires and, you know, he had potential. And then there was another guy that was just, just a butcher, man, and, um, f- so for three months, you know, I got that place turned around.
[00:19:38] Brian DiCesare: We got into the black and then, um, they ended up firing the one service writer for reasons I have no idea, and they brought this other guy in and he was, he's awesome. I have, I couldn't say a bad word about him and, um, they ended up firing the manager that was there. So be- Yeah ... that pl- it did, they just turned the place over.
[00:19:59] Brian DiCesare: So, uh, the manager that they brought in, he was awesome. They ended up letting the other two guys go. So now I'm in a seven-bay shop by myself And I'm like, you know, the, uh, general manager and the owner's brother-in-law come in and they're like, "Look, it's only gonna be for four weeks. We're gonna bring people in."
[00:20:21] Brian DiCesare: And I believed them. Yeah. Jeff, when I tell you I believed them, they're, they have other stores. Like, I'm like, you know, I'm like, "I believe you." They had this floating tech, who I'm still friends with today, and, um, he would fill in at the other locations, you know, when people were on vacation or called out sick or if they, you know, were...
[00:20:43] Brian DiCesare: their workload was heavy. So he was there, so... But I'm seven bays, you know what I mean? And I- I'm getting all the cars that none of the other shops can fix, you know what I mean? Locally, you know. I'm tracing down broken wires on Hondas and, you know, cars that have had work done and it's, they're still not right.
[00:21:03] Brian DiCesare: I remember, I'll never forget this, this CR-V. This lady comes in with this CR-V. She's been chasing this. It was like a, a 2015, 2016 Honda CR-V. Had probably, at the time, like 140,000 miles on it. Okay. She comes in, she's like, "I had my car at this other shop, you know, they can't figure out what's wrong with the AC, and I got a oil leak and this smell."
[00:21:27] Brian DiCesare: I'm gonna tell you this story because I ended up working at that other shop, and she came to that place to get gas and rec- she recognized me.
[00:21:34] Jeff Compton: Right.
[00:21:35] Brian DiCesare: And she's like, "You fixed my car." I'm like, "Yeah, well, I'm here now." So, so she left them and came back to the shop that she had left initially, but, you know, it's, it's me and the, the floating tech, and I got a shop full of cars and I'm die...
[00:21:50] Brian DiCesare: It ended up being a, uh, clogged proportionate valve.
[00:21:54] Jeff Compton: Right.
[00:21:55] Brian DiCesare: Um, the, it would just spike pressure and the, uh, the compressor would kick off and then vent to atmosphere.
[00:22:02] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[00:22:02] Brian DiCesare: So ended up selling that, and then she approved the timing cover and, um, I'm like, "I'm going on vacation," like, and, and so is the floating tech.
[00:22:11] Brian DiCesare: Like, at this point, you know, so they fired everybody in February, it's June. All right?
[00:22:18] Jeff Compton: By yourself, yeah.
[00:22:19] Brian DiCesare: By myself with this guy that's like-
[00:22:25] Brian DiCesare: tires. Like he's looking, he's helping me set lifts up, he's kinda helping me do multi-point ins- like digital vehicle inspections-
[00:22:32] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:22:32] Brian DiCesare: and that's it. All the other work's getting done by me, and I'm getting to that point, I could f- literally feel it in myself. At this point I had been with them ov- uh, about a year.
[00:22:43] Brian DiCesare: It was about a year 'cause I, I got there in July-
[00:22:47] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm ...
[00:22:48] Brian DiCesare: the year previously. So here I am again, five months by myself. Like, what the fuck? Like how d- why does this keep happening? It's almost like it was me. Like, why is, why does it keep happening to me? Like I'm not... Am I that unique? You know what I mean?
[00:23:02] Jeff Compton: I, y- so I gotta ask because, you know, kinda if you're paid on straight commission, like that's good if you're getting that much work, right?
[00:23:12] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:23:13] Jeff Compton: That's what we think or we're taught to think in this industry. But I was the same way, like wh- I mean, it, it was so funny when I was straight time, and a lot of us are like this, you complain when there's too much work, and you complain when there's no work.
[00:23:26] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:23:27] Jeff Compton: You know what I mean? And so you're s- you're trying to...
[00:23:30] Jeff Compton: And it's, people go, "Well," like, "What's wrong with it?" Like, "Don't... Look at all the money you're making." It's the pressure of all these deadlines, you know, of trying to... The logistics of like whose car, Mrs. Smith goes today or Mrs. Smith goes tomorrow. Like, it's, it's all that that weighs on you too when you're by yourself.
[00:23:47] Jeff Compton: Like I, I'm not by myself at my shop, but I'm by myself every Friday. My, my coworker, he does four days a week, and every Friday he's off for medical stuff. So like, and you'll see it, it's the end of the week, cars start getting sold, stuff starts piling up, and every Friday for me now almost is like I'm slammed.
[00:24:07] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:24:07] Jeff Compton: You know, I'm, I'm... Or it's, and you know, I say slammed like I get out of there at 4:00, but like, you know, I'll come in on Monday And we've sold three cars over the weekend. And then it's like depending on if how long ago I might've worked on that, all of a sudden, because every salesman promises them like, uh, you know, "We sold it on Saturday, it should be ready to go by Wednesday."
[00:24:31] Jeff Compton: And all of a sudden you're like, uh, so we gotta order tires, we gotta order parts, we gotta like, this one's got an AC problem. Like, all this stuff that you wrote down, nobody did anything about because they never fixed this crap until it's, like the paperwork is done. Then we're not spending our money, we're spending theirs, right?
[00:24:51] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:24:51] Jeff Compton: And I- it's that workload of the, the deadline is the stressor that I think a lot of us in this industry don't necessarily give enough, um, weight to what the, what it is as a pressure, right? The flat rate thing of am I gonna make any money or not is one, but it's that deadline thing of when you're, when you're feast or famine that's driving you crazy too, so.
[00:25:16] Jeff Compton: So you've been there four months and they, and it's almost like you by yourself again with seven bays.
[00:25:21] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:25:22] Jeff Compton: Yeah. So what do they keep telling you when you go to them and go like, "I need somebody, I need somebody"?
[00:25:27] Brian DiCesare: So not only-- So they are bringing people in- Mm ... for interviews. So during the course of the day, I'm getting pulled off of what I'm doing to go sit in on these interviews now.
[00:25:39] Brian DiCesare: And at this point I'm like, "Just give me somebody."
[00:25:42] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:25:42] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? So Fast forward again, I'm going on vacation and there's nobody there. It's just this floating tech. And they ended up bringing another, um, tech from one of the other shops that they had been telling me for three months was eventually gonna come to my store 'cause he lived around the corner.
[00:26:02] Brian DiCesare: He literally lived around the corner.
[00:26:05] Jeff Compton: Yeah, but we
[00:26:05] Brian DiCesare: don't- And, um, I ended up finding out a little bit later that they didn't wanna break up the group that they had at the other store, which I... Listen, I get, but don't tell me you're bringing this person. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. Like, I've, um, had a lot of success over the years, like teaching younger guys.
[00:26:22] Brian DiCesare: Like, I was at a company for like nine years. Um, I ended up... I was started as a B tech and then was a foreman at one of their other stores and, you know, I ended up pulling kids off the gas pump. I'm like, "Just give me somebody that wants to learn." That's it. Yeah. Like, I don't even care if they've ever worked on a car, just they show up to work every day and they're willing to work.
[00:26:41] Brian DiCesare: That's it, and I'll teach them. You know what I mean? Like, I will show them. Have, let them have a little bit of desire, you know what I mean, to, to wanna work on cars, you know? I think that's the biggest thing in our industry too. It's like I hear it all the time, especially with Lucas and stuff like that, like, and, um, even going all the way back to the OG Wrenching Network days on Facebook.
[00:27:02] Brian DiCesare: Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? Like, how do we get young guys in? Well, one, we gatekeep. You know what I mean? Like I, me coming up, I had a lot of issues, you know. I got put into a position very early on in my career where I had to figure it the fuck out. Like, there was nobody was coming to save me, and I had to sink or swim.
[00:27:23] Brian DiCesare: And that's when I really dug in and started to read. Uh, the, the amount of reading, like I really appreciate what Brian Pollock talks about all the time, like the first 40 hours you make your income, the next 40 you hone your craft. Like between Scanner Danner, um, Jason Garopis on YouTube, the Snap-on trainer guy, and, you know, Royalty, uh, now we have all these other ones, but Scanner Danner, I bought his book in like 2014.
[00:27:50] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? Yeah. I read that thing probably 30 times, you know, and part of his private classes and stuff. But, uh, like that's- That's what-- Like, just to share the information. Like, at these days, like, especially the young guys I have with me now, it's like, "This is why my tools are organized like this.
[00:28:07] Brian DiCesare: This is why I do the things I do," you know? Yeah. Uh, we're a team. We pull in, horn, lights, wipers, racket. You know what I mean? And y-y-you save 15 minutes right there. But it's about community. You know what I mean? Like, I feel like coming up, uh, too, a lot of the older guys were about like it was so feast or famine about feeding their families that they didn't wanna really share that information.
[00:28:33] Brian DiCesare: Mm-hmm. Now, I feel like the pay's catching up, you know.
[00:28:37] Jeff Compton: It is. It's-- We're getting almost to a point now where I think everybody can kinda slow down a little bit. I, I had a great conversation yesterday, and he's like, "Yeah, we're all on, you know, incentivize. We're, we're hybrid pay." Yeah. But we all... You know, if somebody, if you gotta push a car in, if you, somebody needs help, we all stop and are, are available, and it's like nobody's sitting there going, "Hurry up and learn this 'cause I gotta go back to my bay or else I'm gonna be behind."
[00:29:02] Jeff Compton: And n-none of that happens, right? And I think that that's what this industry, it, it-- Finally, if we can get there, I think we're gonna-- It's not about flat rate or pay or whatever, but if we can get that attitude changed where it's like we all need to just slow down and be, like you said, a community. It-- This industry is a community finally, and I'll, I'll say this.
[00:29:23] Jeff Compton: The, it took the internet getting as big as it did for that to happen because I can remember 14 years ago when I worked in a shop, you know, a young apprentice would ask me like, "How did you learn all this stuff?" And I'm like, "Dude, YouTube." Like, I wasn't getting sent to training classes. So it was like, I can remember...
[00:29:43] Jeff Compton: Well, like, as long as Paul Danner's been on YouTube, Scanner Danner, I've been watching his stuff. Yeah. It was... And then it's like there was Eric the Car Guy before there was Scanner Danner and, and it was like... And then there was, you know, Ivan from Pine Hollow comes along, and Eric O from South Main comes along.
[00:30:02] Jeff Compton: And now it's this jo- y- Humble Mechanic, you know? Like, there's all these people that are all over YouTube that are teaching guys and girls how to fix cars. And I was there at the, like, the opening of that right? So when these people now, these young people, and it's like They know of Check Engine Chuck on TikTok, or they know of these people on TikTok.
[00:30:26] Jeff Compton: I'm like, "You gotta know where the OGs are. They're over on YouTube, right?" Yep. That's where you get your long format. That's where you really get your education. Yeah, guys will show you little tips and stuff on TikTok. It's six minutes. But if you really wanna learn, I tell all these people, "How do you not know by now in our industry who Paul Danner is?
[00:30:44] Jeff Compton: How do you not know who Eric O. is, who Ivan is?" Like, how do you not? But it's because whatever TikTok is showing them, that's the, that's how they find their people. So it's, it's cool to me because it's like when I recorded last year and I got to have Check Engine Chuck in the same room with, like, Keith Perkins and, and Scanner Danner, right?
[00:31:07] Jeff Compton: It's kind of like this... Not to say that Paul Danner's old, but you know what I mean. It's like the OG. And then we have the guy that like when you step into the different Streaming service is their number one guy, Chuck, right? And it was like to bring those two together and put them in the same room and just watch them like sit there and listen, it was the coolest thing in the world, right?
[00:31:30] Jeff Compton: Like it really was. And then, you know, so I tell people all the time like if we can stop fighting over money and start getting back to being craftsmen and teaching people how to do this, we'll solve so much of this BS. But it's the money first that is like why we're all, like you said, why we're gatekeeping.
[00:31:51] Jeff Compton: Sorry to-- I didn't mean to-
[00:31:52] Brian DiCesare: No ...
[00:31:53] Jeff Compton: take the conversation there, but yeah, like I think that's what you were getting at is, you know, you had to, you had to sink or swim. Nobody's gonna come and save you, you know?
[00:32:01] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. And, uh, and to be honest with you, like I think that was a little bit of kick at ass that I needed.
[00:32:06] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? Like I al- I always have the attention to detail, and that's what I tell my guys now, like if I'm walking through the yard and there's a piece of trash and I have my gloves on, I pick it up. You know? Something's out of place, I put it away. And the one kid came up to me, he's like, "Why do you always do that?"
[00:32:23] Brian DiCesare: I'm like, "It's a-- If I know that I do it, I'm gonna do it on everything else I do today." You know what I mean? And if nobody else... If I don't do it, who else is gonna do it? You know what I mean? And like some of the, the leadership classes like that they, they send you to and they talk about leading by example, so like I, I really take that stuff home with me and try to do it on a daily basis, you know?
[00:32:45] Brian DiCesare: And, um, like you were talking... The-- one of the guys I started following recently was The Car Care Nut, and I, I kinda like him because he tries to break it down to the, now to the customer because I feel like now we gotta bridge the gap because I, I still run into a lot of people that have the old way think, "Well, can't you just plug that thing into it?"
[00:33:04] Brian DiCesare: Like, "No. Have you ever been to a baseball game?" "Yeah." "You know how you have the section and then the row and the seat? Well, that scanner only gives you the section. You gotta find the row and the seat on your own." You know? And when I explain it to people like that, they're like, "Oh, well, yeah, that's why we have to charge you for the testing."
[00:33:21] Brian DiCesare: You know? Yeah. But, uh, I kinda forget what... But, but the training part, like, I've been doing training my whole career because of being in the independent world. So like a lot of the stuff that the dealer guys were getting right off the bat, I was getting five years later. Oh. You know what I mean? Or six years later.
[00:33:40] Brian DiCesare: And it was through like our auto parts places. It would be like, uh, Eastern Auto Parts warehouse would have classes in the fall, NAPA would have them in the spring, and then like, you know, Snap-on would have like one a quarter, you know? And I would go to all of them. And, uh, they would cover like test cases and stuff like that, and that was pre-internet days, so if you didn't go, you didn't get the info.
[00:34:03] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? And, uh, that's back when they still gave you the certificates, the paper one. Now everything's digital, you know? So, but, um, I mean, where we met that, at Tools, you know? That was my first time at a, a event like that. My first day there I had breakfast with Brian Pollock, and then I sat down and had lunch with Keith Perkins, and then you were sitting in the class.
[00:34:23] Brian DiCesare: I'm like, I'm like starstruck right now. You know what I mean? Like I, we watch you on, on... When you watch people on TV, it's like almost like, you know, you look up to people like that. You know what I mean? So it was, it was cool to be there, and then just to hear, hear them talk and like, wow, we really share a lot of the same beliefs and vision for this industry.
[00:34:46] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:34:46] Brian DiCesare: You know? We're not really alone. Like a- as many times as I thought I was alone in this industry for doing the little things, trying to take care of the customer and their car and make sure it's safe and not, not trying to rob, you know?
[00:35:01] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:35:01] Brian DiCesare: There's a lot of that, you know? Where they just... You know, I worked with a guy, he sold, sold a brake flush, and he would laugh as, as he sprayed the, the brake reservoir with brake clean.
[00:35:11] Brian DiCesare: Like-
[00:35:11] Jeff Compton: Hmm ...
[00:35:12] Brian DiCesare: dude. You know what I mean? Like-
[00:35:15] Jeff Compton: I worked with guys that was like- That he would use a suction gun to pull, pull the fluid out of the master, right? So he wasn't-- he never cracked a bleeder screw. He never... Like, they would use a suction gun, suck that master dry, you know, pour in clean fluid, wipe it down, like you said.
[00:35:34] Jeff Compton: Um, and, and I thought, "Wow." Which, I mean, you can see his point. Well, you can't see it, but their, their justification was like, the customer can't prove anything. You know what I mean? Not that they're gonna bother, you know what I mean?
[00:35:51] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:35:51] Jeff Compton: If you go in and do a test strip, it's gonna show that it's new fluid-
[00:35:55] Brian DiCesare: Yep
[00:35:56] Jeff Compton: sure in there. But it isn't the whole fluid, it's not the whole system.
[00:35:59] Brian DiCesare: No. Uh,
[00:36:00] Jeff Compton: injection service was a one that I used to-- like, it would drive me nuts. I'd see other guys in the shop and they'd sell one, and at the end of the day, the can was sitting on their bench, never poured into the car. Never, never done.
[00:36:13] Jeff Compton: It was just they just wanted the quick two hours of selling a fuel system service, which was an injector flush and a, and a throttle body. And, and, you know, you get into the whole, do you take the throttle body off to clean it, all that jazz. Like, I'm not, that's, I'm not up to discuss- Yeah ... but, like, they knew then if the, if the can wasn't even there, they at least got one hour that the customer paid for that, that, you know, never did anything.
[00:36:36] Jeff Compton: And that shit would just drive me nuts, you know what I mean? 'Cause it's, that's blatant theft at that point.
[00:36:41] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:36:42] Jeff Compton: And then, you know, 'cause it's a situation of hypothetically say that the injector cleaning actually did something back then, you know, and you can... Did port cleaning, port injectors ever really do anything or not?
[00:36:53] Jeff Compton: Like, that's a whole thing. But- If it was doing something and nobody ever did it, the next time it comes in for a misfire, you're not gonna be able-- The next person's not gonna be able to sell it 'cause it was just done within the last year, right? Yep. Even though they fixed the car. So there was lots of cars that like it had already had it done, quote, unquote, "on history," and I would have to go and do it again for free-
[00:37:22] Brian DiCesare: Yep
[00:37:23] Jeff Compton: you know, as part of my process. And it... And I'll tell you, it did work on a lot of the cars 'cause it did clean up a lot of the idle. Does it... Is it ever gonna restore an injector? No, it's not. But it does clean up some of the, the idles on some of the, the older stuff that was, you knew, you definitely knew it was carbon up for sure.
[00:37:40] Jeff Compton: You could drive it and tell, you know. Um- At
[00:37:43] Brian DiCesare: least they get the spray pattern to change a little bit, you know?
[00:37:45] Jeff Compton: And it drove me nuts so that somebody was like... 'Cause these were guys that were already making 10, 12 a day.
[00:37:53] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:37:54] Jeff Compton: Like, they were making good hours. They were making more than me that was lucky to hit nine because I was doing diag heavy.
[00:37:59] Jeff Compton: Um, and you'd sit there and be like, "So why don't they just stop ripping the customer off?" And it... The thing that would stress me out is like the manager knew it was happening. Like, everybody knew who was doing it and it was happening. Didn't care.
[00:38:15] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:38:16] Jeff Compton: Keep your shop production numbers at a certain amount, right?
[00:38:18] Jeff Compton: What do, what do you care? So it-- When you, when you mention the guy like spraying the brake reservoir off and wiping it down with a rag and laughing, like, yeah, that's, that's shit, you know? And
[00:38:30] Brian DiCesare: that's... And then you wonder like in today's world when we have to sell two hours of testing off the, off the bat, why people are like, "Nah.
[00:38:40] Brian DiCesare: Why?" You know, "Why do you need to do that?" I, I know for myself, like, I need to be able to lay my head down at night. You know what I mean? Like- You see things in the, in every industry. It's not just ours, you know what I mean? Like, we may think that some of these under- other industries are glorious, but I hear guys all the time talking about, you know, you just scroll on TikTok, and any trade they're showing you where people are shortcutting this and, you know, these buildings aren't up to code and, you know.
[00:39:07] Brian DiCesare: So it's, it's- Foundations ... it's everywhere. Yeah. It's everywhere.
[00:39:10] Jeff Compton: Foundations are cracking. Like, there used to be a Canadian show up here on TV, it was called, um, Homes on Homes.
[00:39:17] Brian DiCesare: Oh, that's my guy.
[00:39:18] Jeff Compton: Michael. Yeah. Yeah. You, so you've seen him.
[00:39:21] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:39:21] Jeff Compton: Like, and what I loved about him is he'd go, "Well, see how this is done to code?
[00:39:26] Jeff Compton: So it's done to code, it's legal."
[00:39:27] Brian DiCesare: Yep. "
[00:39:28] Jeff Compton: See how when we do it this way, how so much better it is, and lasts longer for the customer, and, and all this kind of stuff makes the house worth more, you know, more efficient?" Like, that's what I love because that's... If you wanna see building code get changed, that's how you'd see it get changed, is by somebody out there advocating for the industry saying, "This is how we make it better."
[00:39:52] Jeff Compton: So shout out to Mike Holmes, like, as a fellow Canadian. I've watched him, and I'm not a guy that's handy around the house at all, but I would watch him and I'd be like, "That's the kind of what I wanna do for my industry," what he does for, you know, carpentry and construction and all that kind of stuff.
[00:40:08] Jeff Compton: That's what I wanted to do. That was the end goal. Um, because I think it's so, like you said, people don't understand. You know, they go and buy a house or they hire a contractor or get a car fixed, they don't know. They're trusting us that we're legit, qualified and, and, you know, honest. And it's, it's still bad that there's guys out there that are, you know, wiping down a master cylinder and putting an hour in their pocket.
[00:40:36] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. A- and, you know, I don't know about up there, but with the... So we use a lot of BG products. Mm. You also get a kickback from BG. So, like-
[00:40:46] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:40:46] Brian DiCesare: you know, it just... Some of the things, it's, uh, like, why? You know what I mean? Like, we're, we were talking about pay, and I'm sitting here thinking about pay structure, and it's like I got a very good guarantee with a very high flat rate number with a very good bon- bonus.
[00:41:02] Brian DiCesare: Mm-hmm. So it's like I'm in a position where I can do the right thing today, you know, you know what I mean? And everybody around me does the right thing because there's none of that cutthroat, there's four cars and 10 techs, you know, and everybody need... It's Thursday, and everybody has 10 hours in for the week, you know?
[00:41:19] Brian DiCesare: So- Which I'm- And, like, actually fixing the cars today and, and providing a good service to the customer is like It's a good feeling every day, you know?
[00:41:30] Jeff Compton: And that's why I keep saying I don't go back to dealers because all of them right now are-- There's too many techs for the car count, and then even then the, the ARO, the average repair order, is almost always straight warranty, you know?
[00:41:45] Jeff Compton: And everybody goes, "Well, like, uh, you know, you can, you can get the... You know, the times are not terrible." Yeah, like if you're one of those guys that, like, you're the transmission guy at that dealer, you can get like what Nissan CVTs, right? We all did them. Well, if you did enough of them, pretty soon that was a good job for you 'cause you could hit the time easy.
[00:42:04] Jeff Compton: Easy peasy. Some guys could even half it in the warranty time. Well, if there's no more trannys coming in, what's everybody doing? Yep. Well, you're back, like you said, to hoping that the service writer can sell all the BG Fluid flushes that have to be done on that vehicle at 90,000K. Which you know how, you know, people that have never worked in the dealer, you see all the comments all the time where it's like, "I only go to the dealer for the warranty stuff."
[00:42:31] Jeff Compton: Well, if you've never been that dealer tech and seen that reality, it is heart- disheartening every day to go in and know that you're gonna deal with, like, 10 people today, customers, that you're gonna prep 10 estimates, do 10 DBIs, and they're not gonna buy nothing. 'Cause it doesn't matter if it's fallen off.
[00:42:52] Jeff Compton: They are there because of a recall, they're there because of a complaint under warranty, and they're so irritated about the fact that it's broken under warranty or it's, it's so inconvenient to them to have to be there that you're-- they're not, they're not interested. It, it's like it could catch on fire on the way home and they'll be like, "I'm taking it to my guy.
[00:43:10] Jeff Compton: I don't want you guys touching it." So, you know, the whole thing of the dealer guys is like everybody gets so mad at them and says they can't fix anything. But think about what that would do to your psyche if you were doing all these inspections on all these cars and you know it needs work done, and you know that it doesn't matter what you do, you're hardly gonna get any of that work.
[00:43:31] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:43:32] Jeff Compton: Right?
[00:43:33] Brian DiCesare: It's like getting a work order that says Jiffy on it-
[00:43:36] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:43:36] Brian DiCesare: you know, for an oil change. Like, are you not gonna even attempt to sell this? You know what I mean? What do you mean Jiffy Lube? You know? Like, no. Like, we look at these cars. I'm still gonna look at this car. You know what I mean? No, I, I mean, I've never really thought about it like that, you know, as far as like-
[00:43:54] Jeff Compton: It's tough
[00:43:54] Brian DiCesare: the dealer guys. Like, I don't know if I could show up every day knowing that either my service advisor's not gonna try to sell anything or the customer doesn't want to do anything at the dealership.
[00:44:06] Jeff Compton: And it's not, you know, I'll say this, a lot of dealers hire, like a lot of service writers get their start in dealerships because it's like the-- it's, it's the same.
[00:44:16] Jeff Compton: A lot of techs get their har- start because they'll hire them and give them a chance. But man, I can, I can show you some really good wr-writers that eventually got beat down and were like, "I'm not, I'm not even trying to sell anything," 'cause it's like I've, I've, I've tabled eight estimates today, and all eight have said no.
[00:44:35] Jeff Compton: Number nine, like, is here for an oil change and a recall. Uh, why bother? You know? And it's that why bother thing of like, where I get so mad and people get on me 'cause it's like I always thought it was flipped, where advisors should have been the ones on a heavy commission, and the, and the skilled trades in the back should have been on some kind of salary.
[00:44:59] Jeff Compton: And that would have f-forced them because it's like you can say you're only gonna make $30,000 a year as a service writer. Shit pay. And a lot of them are just like, they just sit there, you know, and, and do that job year after year, and they eke out their living, and they manage to survive and live, you know, within their means at $30,000.
[00:45:18] Jeff Compton: And then you got a technician in the back who's like, they want you to, you know, pump out 50, 60 hours a week, and you're hoping then that you can do that, so you can earn this kind of living and pay for your tools and all this kind of stuff. And yet there's no cars coming in, and there's no work being sold.
[00:45:35] Jeff Compton: And then you have an advisor who doesn't really, is just kind of checked out and doesn't care and are not selling. Well, who really at that point is the bigger offender in the dealership or the business, period, of why it's not producing? It's the advisor.
[00:45:51] Brian DiCesare: Yep. And then it starts at the top, and unfortunately, they're at the- Right
[00:45:55] Brian DiCesare: they get all the praise, and they get all the shit too, and that's the same thing in the independent world, you know? The, the customers think that the service advisor fixed the car, and they also think he's the one that fucked it up. You know what I mean? So it's- Yeah ... it's a double-edged sword, you know?
[00:46:09] Jeff Compton: Yep.
[00:46:09] Jeff Compton: They think if... You know, they're so happy 'cause the, the service writer took care of them, but if a car has to come back, that damn service writer must have given it to the wrong tech.
[00:46:20] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:46:21] Jeff Compton: And it's like they don't, they're not in charge of dispatch. Yep. Like, I mean, some places they're not. You know, larger operations, definitely they're not, right?
[00:46:28] Jeff Compton: It's just a work order to them, and they don't... Now, you know, they might dispatch the things like your requisitions or, or your comeback or your diag or whatever, yeah. But otherwise, it's like when they come in and they go, "Well, we were just talking about that yesterday," and it's like The guy said to me, he's like, "I don't send a customer to a dealership or any shop unless I know one of the technicians personally there."
[00:46:53] Jeff Compton: 'Cause he said, "Otherwise, I don't feel good about sending them because I don't know what experience they're gonna get." That's very telling of our industry, eh, Brian, where it's like... And it's so common for us. "Well, what's that place like to work?" And it's like, "Well, you can go see all the Google reviews."
[00:47:09] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:47:09] Jeff Compton: "But I can't speak for it 'cause I don't know anybody that works there." Like, that's, that's a different level of insight into how is it really gonna be probably for my friend or a, the typical customer. If I know the person there, I can go and say, "Yeah, go see Brian. He's excellent at... You know, you've got a Subaru or whatever.
[00:47:27] Jeff Compton: Yeah, he knows them. Go see them." But it's like, now it's gotten so funky where it's like I-- people are like, "What kind of car should I buy?" And I'm like, "I don't know."
[00:47:36] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[00:47:38] Jeff Compton: Not only you can see all the Google stuff about they're having transmission failures or something, but I can't even in my confidence be able to say, "Yeah, go buy a Jeep from this dealer and service it there because I know a person there that's good."
[00:47:54] Jeff Compton: All the good people that I knew, gone, left. They've taken jobs for the city. They've gone to independent shops. You know, so it's like I don't know how to recommend anything anymore. You know, it's like, uh, I guess I'll work on it, you know. Unless you buy one of those Euros, and then don't, don't... You know, I don't even know if we can be friends.
[00:48:15] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. I'm, I'm-- As you're saying that, I'm thinking about, you know, all the people that, you know, I've known over the years that have g- made the switch to independent or left the industry completely, you know, that were at the dealerships, you know? It's funny too because, you know, along the way, like everybody was like...
[00:48:32] Brian DiCesare: You know, I was asking early on, like, "Should I go to a dealer?" They're like, "No, go independent." I had a, a steering and suspension teacher that he worked for Chevy way back in the early '90s, and he's like, "Go to an independent shop. You wanna work on everything. You wanna be able to do everything." And like- I could speak for myself, like I've been able to learn many different as- like different factors of the, uh, of this industry from the front to the back, you know, and, and everything in between.
[00:49:04] Brian DiCesare: And, uh Being useful, you know what I mean? The more you know, you know, the, the harder it is to be replaced. And, um-
[00:49:12] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:49:13] Brian DiCesare: I, I was waiting for you to bring up Jeeps, 'cause I got a 2019 Jeep Wrangler throwing all kinds of lights that came in on Friday. And, uh-
[00:49:22] Jeff Compton: Okay ...
[00:49:22] Brian DiCesare: the only module that doesn't communicate with the scan tool is the ABS module.
[00:49:27] Brian DiCesare: So I have a little bit more tracing to do, but, you know. I don't think it's the computer. I think I got a bad connection somewhere, but that's waiting for me tomorrow.
[00:49:35] Jeff Compton: Yeah, look for your star connector on that, right?
[00:49:37] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:49:38] Jeff Compton: That's kind of the doer. I mean, I got a '15, so, like, I don't get as much... Well, I mean, I worked on a 2020 Gladiator the other day.
[00:49:47] Jeff Compton: I mean, when I say worked on it, I evaluated it. They're trying to get me to buy it, and it needs a ton of work, and they're asking way too much money, so that's probably not gonna come into my personal fleet. I like the Gladiator, but I... And I do, eventually I will own one. I think they're pretty cool. But, um, this is not the one for Jeff.
[00:50:06] Jeff Compton: Right. Um, my '15 Wrangler is in way better shape than this '20 Gladiator, you know. And it's only, like... My, my Wrangler, so I'm gonna use the, the metric system for everybody that loves it so much. Uh, my, my '15 Wrangler's got 165,000 on it, and it's a '15. This, uh, '20 Gladiator has got 150. So I would be spending a substantial amount of money and only gaining, like, 16,000K less mileage.
[00:50:38] Jeff Compton: It's not worth the money. 'Cause it's like mine's been undercoated, mine's got new brakes, mine's got, you know, all the fluids have been done. This, I know nothing about. It looks like it has been worked really hard and put away in a bad way, you know. So-
[00:50:52] Brian DiCesare: And it probably needs the Dorman engine update with the metal everything.
[00:50:58] Jeff Compton: Right. You want... It, it's-- I'm surprised it doesn't have a, a, a failed thermostat like it probably should have by now, right? Like every Pentastar wants a f- uh, a thermostat. It hasn't, it doesn't tick, but it does have a 300 DTC stored in it. Mm-hmm. So there's something going on there. It's, um, you know, it's just one of those ones where it's like I ain't gonna touch it.
[00:51:19] Jeff Compton: But it's so funny to me how, you know, people get in their head that it's like, "Don't take your car here, and don't take your car there." And it's like we were talking yesterday. That can be based on one technician can be screwing it up for everybody. Yep. So, and, and we know, like, if you work in any shop, it's not just a dealership thing, you know your w- your weakest link.
[00:51:45] Jeff Compton: You know your f- your, your star player, and you know your weakest player. And they tend to tolerate that. So it's like they see it where the car, you know- Tech number, whatever. Another comeback, another comeback, another comeback, you know. But if he's staying within a certain production and it's only at a certain level, they tolerate it.
[00:52:05] Jeff Compton: Well, that person is continuously damaging the reputation Maybe affecting the Google reviews if you want to get in on that. But it's like, what are we gonna do at this point, Brian? Like we, you know, we're just in a shortage. We can't, we can't, you know, we gotta get cars fixed, you know?
[00:52:23] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. And I was, I was watching a thing the other day too, where, you know, they were saying most tech techs these days are B techs.
[00:52:30] Brian DiCesare: They're metal hangers. You know, unless you're, you're into the scope world, like there's very few master techs, and you know, for a whi- before I heard that, I w- I would tell you I'm a master tech. But after hearing that, like, I don't know. You know what I mean? Like, I'm very good, um, and I have all the tool, you know, I have all the, the testing equipment and all the knowledge, but, you know, am I?
[00:52:54] Brian DiCesare: I, I'm not into the programming a- aspect yet, which is something that I would really like to get into, but it's a bit of an investment. You know what I mean?
[00:53:02] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[00:53:02] Brian DiCesare: And- So-
[00:53:03] Jeff Compton: Yep.
[00:53:04] Brian DiCesare: And- You know, I bought the scan tools on my own and the, my scope on my own and, you know, because of, uh, Steckler, I w- had to go get an eight-channel because we sat in that class and saying, "If you're using a four-channel, you're behind," you know?
[00:53:17] Brian DiCesare: I'll tell you what, the eight-channel does work wonders, so I'll give him that. But, you know, and then the subscriptions to all these different, uh, manufacturers and, you know, the area I'm in, I'm, like Villanova University area, um, it's all Audis and Mercedes and BMW and Volkswagen, so, you know, everything's plastic and everything's a computer.
[00:53:38] Brian DiCesare: So-
[00:53:39] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[00:53:39] Brian DiCesare: you know, it gets very expensive very quickly to repair some of these vehicles, you know?
[00:53:44] Jeff Compton: And, and you know, Brian Pollock, I always remember, remind everybody when they talk about Brian says, "It's easy till it's not."
[00:53:52] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:53:53] Jeff Compton: You know? And that's the difference. Like it's, it's a lot of pushing buttons and cashing checks and making money, but man, when one goes wrong, it's like that's when you really start your work, 'cause can you recover it or how bad did it get when you, you know, flash the wrong thing or, or you know, like what hap- what, what it just decides to brick.
[00:54:16] Jeff Compton: Like, that's what scares me so much about programming and like, I mean, I've done it with the, you know, the Autel, like live where you go in there and find somebody. I've used the, the Snap-on wrap or whatever, I guess, which is like, you know, you call up Snap-on to the call center and they tell you when to log in and they sit there, you just sit there and put a tender on it and watch it and click a few buttons and, and they're handling it, right?
[00:54:42] Jeff Compton: But man, it scares me with the idea of like all these guys that are buying dedicated laptops and partitions within the laptops and then subscriptions. Like Brian tells you every Sunday night he's doing like two hours of work on his laptops to, to update everything so that Monday when he goes to work, the first car that he might have to flash, he's not gonna spend two hours like updating it before he can do it.
[00:55:04] Jeff Compton: It's already ready to go. Well- Like that's Brian doing that, and there's-- You know, that seems, seems to be the way it's done in the industry. Most of the guys that are heavy into programming, that's a big part of their weekend, is like making sure everything ready to go on Monday. But like you see the conversations, I've seen them.
[00:55:24] Jeff Compton: Guys are like, "How many times is this, is this General Motors site down?" All the- Several times a week. You know what I mean? It just can't keep up, and everybody's like... So you got a customer sitting there, and all they want is like an HVAC reprogram or something, and you can't do it. And then, you know, what happens then?
[00:55:43] Jeff Compton: How do you juggle that logistically? So it's like, I always wanted to be like, I could diagnose the car, but I always was spoiled from so many years in the dealership of programming, where most of the time it goes pretty smooth 'cause you're using the OE script, the OE subs- you know, tool. That I was just like, if we had a customer and it, you know, uh, Nissan 101 DTC, you know, you know that TSB that says first thing you check is this and that.
[00:56:12] Jeff Compton: Software update fixes a lot of them. I was-- I had no problems telling the customer, you know, "Just head over there and have them do it. They'll charge you, you know, 120 bucks or whatever, and it's done." And I, I don't have to... 'Cause for me, by the time I would like try and get a subscription or, or try to get somebody to come in through Autel and do it, I was paying the same amount that they would've paid.
[00:56:34] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:56:35] Jeff Compton: And you gotta mark it up above that, and then they're going, "Why is it costing more for you to do it than the dealer?" It's a fair question. It really is a fair question. Like I don't mind telling them that I have to charge more because I'm not the dealer, but it's just one more wrinkle, you know? Um, our local Dodge dealer, uh, radio frequency hubs and Ram trucks, really bad problem, right?
[00:56:57] Jeff Compton: Like common failure. And they were programming them so cheap that it wasn't even worth it for us to even try to go onto Autel and get somebody to remote in live and flash it. Wasn't even worth it Wasn't even worth it. Just tow it over there and have them do it, drive it back. You know, it was, wasn't worth the time.
[00:57:18] Brian DiCesare: And that, that's one of the, the challenges in the independent world. And, you know, reading a lot of the legislation that's coming out here in the US side with, you know, these forward-facing cameras that are gonna monitor the drivers and, you know, Ford and GM meeting with the president to try to block us out of fixing these cars.
[00:57:37] Brian DiCesare: Like, you know, at what point, at what point, you know, does it end? You know what I mean? And I feel like we're on a trajectory of, of technology that it's s- like we talked about earlier, it's sink or swim at this point, you know? And, and my gut's telling me to get into the programming now, you know what I mean?
[00:57:57] Brian DiCesare: And the conversation I had with Brian with, with the dedicated laptops and everything that he does, you know, ahead of time to make sure that it goes smoothly, and plus everything I see online in the change in the industry, you know, podcast group, and, you know. That's, that's where we're going. It's... We're gonna come to a point in the industry, dealer, independent, the guy in the garage, where you can't replace a tail lamp assembly without programming something, you know?
[00:58:24] Brian DiCesare: Ford's already there, you know? Oh. So...
[00:58:28] Jeff Compton: And, and the thing is, it's like People talk about Tesla and, you know, like self-driving mode is so cool. Well, there's other people that are gonna do that too, right? Yeah. To see it happen. And then the thing is, we had a really good conversation yesterday, and it's like everybody then is immediately gonna want that because what it means, like Mike Allen in his podcast last week, he said, "We're gonna get to where there's so many cars on the highways, and the highways are not gonna be able to get bigger, and the only way it's all gonna work that everybody's gonna be able to drive home at 70 miles an hour like they want to within 10 feet of each other and not have an accident is because the car will be doing the driving."
[00:59:06] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[00:59:07] Jeff Compton: That's the only way we're gonna be able to fit the car, the amount of cars on the highways that we can. So two things he-- like I took from that conversation is gonna happen. We're either gonna price it out so that the amount of cars on the highway go, go down, and then, you know, we're not overflowing the, the grid, or like the technology's gonna get to be at such a point where it's taken over everything and it becomes affordable enough that we're still gonna see the same amount of cars, but we're gonna have less control.
[00:59:36] Jeff Compton: And that scares me. And then it's like the programming thing, it's, to me, it's this kind of same idea as the ADAS conversation. You know, when we're already seeing like GM doing over-the-air programming, right? And then it's like so all these people all of a sudden it's like, "I'm gonna invest all this money into being able to program these cars."
[00:59:56] Jeff Compton: If they flick a switch and next week decide we're gonna... our next run that rolls out is gonna be able to program remote over the air, you know. They'll just tell the customer, "Hey, it's an EV anyway. It's plugged into the wall," right? "We're gonna go ahead and update that car while it's plugged in and, and, you know, timed down."
[01:00:14] Jeff Compton: People won't even know.
[01:00:15] Brian DiCesare: Nope.
[01:00:16] Jeff Compton: They won't know. And then all of those people that's made that investment, what do you do? What do you do with that investment?
[01:00:22] Brian DiCesare: It's, it's like my dad's scan. I have the brick with the cartridges. It's just sitting in his toolbox. Like-
[01:00:29] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[01:00:29] Brian DiCesare: I have old scanners that are outdated, you know.
[01:00:32] Brian DiCesare: Today I'm, I'm-- I got the ALLTEL Maxys Elite with the JBox. I do have the, the box, and then the Snap-on is the SOLUS Plus.
[01:00:41] Jeff Compton: Okay.
[01:00:42] Brian DiCesare: You know, 'cause I like to have the Snap-on, but- ... you know. I have one, I have a couple scanners just sitting in the, the case. It's like collector's items at this point, you know what I mean?
[01:00:51] Jeff Compton: Brian Pollock's got like a, I'll call it like a- I would call it a China cabinet, but it's like this, essentially this, this thing in his, in his house, and it's got vintage scan tools in it.
[01:01:04] Brian DiCesare: At some point they're gonna be like those old gas pumps with the, the glass things at the top. Like, "Hey, Dad, what's that?"
[01:01:10] Brian DiCesare: "Oh, that's a OBD1 scan tool, son." You know?
[01:01:13] Jeff Compton: Yeah. Brick in there. He's got the first gen Vantage, which I have one. He's got a, you know, a Vantage Pro in it. Like he, he's a collector of Vantage Pros. Like if you didn't know that like s- who was it? Volvo, I think, uh, it was an OE tool, was a Vantage, was a Vantage Pro.
[01:01:32] Brian DiCesare: Okay.
[01:01:33] Jeff Compton: But shipped in blue. Brian has one. He has to complete his collection by having... Like the guy's a bit of a nut when it comes to Vantage Pro. Like he's, you know, but it's like the Genesis, he's got one of those. I mean, I worked on that. That thing was a fucking wheel chock. That's all it was good for.
[01:01:49] Jeff Compton: Now other people are like, "No, man, it was a great tool." I'm like, "No." I had the brick from the time the brick hit, and then I saw somebody hand me a Genesis and I went, "This thing is, like should be thrown in the lake. It's so bad."
[01:02:02] Brian DiCesare: The keys, I remember like K27, I think it was K27 for GM, and then like key 12 or 16 or something like, but I remember I lost the keys.
[01:02:13] Brian DiCesare: I was, I was working for a guy and he's like You know, where the fuck are the keys at? I'm like, "They're on the scan. They're always on the scanner." I ended up zip-tying them to the thing. So like there was enough room where like you could get them off, but they never left that connector again, man. That was...
[01:02:29] Brian DiCesare: And then when they, they, they would break, you know. And that's how far-- And that's only within the last 15 years of technology that we're talking about right now. That's only been fif- look at where we're at, you know. My 2025 Camry has that auto- autonomous mode where you press a button and it holds the lane.
[01:02:46] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[01:02:46] Brian DiCesare: It literally updated its, uh, its climate control last night. I came out and it was refreshing. I'm like-
[01:02:55] Jeff Compton: Yeah ...
[01:02:55] Brian DiCesare: you know. So they're, they're, they're doing a lot of that remotely already, which would be a great-- It would be very helpful, you know what I mean? But then what if something happens and then you get like 100,000 dead cars because in the middle of the update their system glitched.
[01:03:11] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. So it, it opens up a lot, you know what I mean? Like-
[01:03:14] Jeff Compton: Brian, where do those cars get towed in?
[01:03:16] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[01:03:17] Jeff Compton: All of a sudden it's like, you know, there's 100 Silverados tomorrow that they tried to do an over-the-air update and something got bricked and now the ECM is offline.
[01:03:28] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. And is that on the customer? Is the customer paying that tow to the dealer or to the independent?
[01:03:34] Brian DiCesare: Or what if they're at a hotel on a road trip with their family? You know what I mean?
[01:03:38] Jeff Compton: Yeah. And so then do we put in something where it's like maybe you put a feature into the car where it's like, "Do you want your car to be able to receive over the air, or do you wish to go to your service provider?" And you, and you click a key- Select
[01:03:51] Brian DiCesare: it.
[01:03:52] Jeff Compton: Yeah. And say no. It's the same as I think about this ADAS stuff where everybody's like making all these huge investments in like, you know, targets and, and dedicated rooms with perfectly flat floors and, and you know, not too much reflective light and all this stuff, and then I'm going If they flick a switch and make these things dynamic, right?
[01:04:13] Jeff Compton: And, and all of a sudden, how many times do we need to pull out targets, and how many times do we... You know, like they're already talking like G- uh, I think it's Chrysler or Stellantis, I guess we're gonna call it now, I dated myself. A lot of them are dynamic. They do it themselves. You just go on a road test and it learns them, right?
[01:04:30] Brian DiCesare: So you know what the ADAS reminds me of is the early TPMS systems. Remember like the, the Ford magnets, you would have to use the magnet to trigger them, to wake them up and stuff like that before you... Like I feel like we're in that first phase of ADAS, and I, I like the AD- the, like there's, the ADAS is the future.
[01:04:47] Brian DiCesare: There's, we're not going away from it.
[01:04:49] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[01:04:49] Brian DiCesare: Just like the TPMS sensors. But now where we are, where you can get an All Tell with 50 sensors and they're universal and just go around, like it's gonna get easier.
[01:04:59] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[01:04:59] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean?
[01:05:01] Jeff Compton: Oh, I can remember that one. It was like, oh, I can't remember the company, the name of the company, but it was the OE TPMS tool for Chrysler, and it was like there was a magnet.
[01:05:11] Jeff Compton: Well, we all figured out that you didn't have to use that. We all had a speaker. Right? Box, right, that we changed on the warranty. That, that magnet worked just fine, and it was the same thing. You just left the key on, went around, ping, ping, ping, ping, ping, relearned. Done.
[01:05:24] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:05:25] Jeff Compton: You know? And if it wouldn't ping, they'd jam a sensor in it, right?
[01:05:28] Jeff Compton: And I made the argument and that people have, have caught flack and, you know, the comment thread blows up where it's like, think about how many times we see a car come in now, though, that the TPMS isn't functioning properly and nobody's fixing it.
[01:05:42] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:05:42] Jeff Compton: And that's what scares me with, with ADAS is because we're gonna put all this stuff in these cars.
[01:05:49] Jeff Compton: When it's broken, customer like in the wintertime drives up on a parking, you know, lot cement thing barrier, and they don't see it there 'cause it's covered in snow. And they drive up over it, and they hook their bumper on it, and they tear their bumper off, right? She was in a hurry. She was going she, she was trying to get to Starbucks.
[01:06:06] Jeff Compton: They're gonna keep driving that car.
[01:06:07] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:06:08] Jeff Compton: Like, they don't care that all of a sudden the cruise control, they could come up behind somebody and rear-end them. They don't care, man. They just wanna get to where they wanna go. And that's what scares me about this ADAS is because it's like at some point the public, without knowing, this is what scares me too, is I think the car is gonna get to where it's like if it can't self-drive, it won't drive.
[01:06:31] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:06:32] Jeff Compton: And then what's that say for people? And everybody's like, "Well, big deal. Like, I'll be able to afford to fix it." How? How many times do you have people come in that can't even afford four new tires? Yep. I mean, but-
[01:06:42] Brian DiCesare: They got to budget, you know, any, you know, a lot of w- a lot of what we're seeing now is like what's priority?
[01:06:48] Brian DiCesare: Well, you know, you need two, at least two tires, and you should probably do that, that outer tie rod end. And then when you come back, we'll look at the car again and, you know, maybe do some of the maintenance stuff. You know what I mean?
[01:07:01] Jeff Compton: Came in for my air conditioning. I didn't even know about my tires and my tire.
[01:07:04] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:07:05] Jeff Compton: Right? And now all of a sudden we're the jerks because it's like they want cold air. I totally get it. And we're telling them, "Before you can get cold air, Mrs. Smith, like you really should see the wire braid coming through the tire? Really should make that a priority." And, and the tie rod end that you don't hear because you got your, you know, you got your playlist on, on, on 10 all the time Like, I, you don't even know what that is.
[01:07:31] Jeff Compton: You're just, uh, trusting me that you need a tie rod.
[01:07:34] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:07:34] Jeff Compton: But I can maybe put a DVI, and I can shake the wheel and tell you that that's not supposed to go up and down, but you don't know, right? You just want it cold air. This is where I really am scared with how much people wanna surrender decisions and control back to the manufacturer.
[01:07:53] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[01:07:54] Jeff Compton: And I think that's scary, right? I don't think it's... It's a right to repair thing, but it's like I think the j- public is gonna willingly give a lot of it up.
[01:08:02] Brian DiCesare: Well, they've done a... They've gi- given up a lot of other things unwillingly, or just willingly without even... You know, the, the iPhone. Have you ever read the- Oh
[01:08:11] Brian DiCesare: some of the stuff in there? I just... You can't function without the phone these days, but it's like I don't want this thing around me either. You know what I mean?
[01:08:19] Jeff Compton: Yeah. Or why is it that I, why is it that I walked past, you know, something at my local Bass Pro Shops, and I picked it up, and I spoke about it to the person that was standing next to me, and I never went to my phone, and yet when I go home now, the next thing that Facebook is showing me is ads for this thing that I saw at Bass Pro Shops?
[01:08:42] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. It's, it's- Like- ... crazy too 'cause you were talking about the people leaving the dealers, and, um, like I'm in the Philadelphia area, and literally every dealership is looking for techs. Like, they're paying for ads, and it's just ad after y- If you scroll the Reels or Instagram, it's just ad after ad after ad.
[01:09:01] Brian DiCesare: Hon- it doesn't matter the, the brands. I'm close to New Jersey, so I get some of the, their stuff from over there, and... You know, you got me thinking about the ADAS thing. The amount of cars in Philadelphia, you gotta think about the parking situation. It's very tight. If you park in South Philadelphia, Center City, you're, you're buttoned up with those parking sensors.
[01:09:22] Brian DiCesare: So if they start shutting those, people don't fix that. Like you said, like it, with the TPMS lights. And, and one of the problems in, in Pennsylvania is with the safety inspection, like a lot of times, like some of the, the way the, the safety book is written, like people look at us like it's, it's me. It's, I'm like, "It's the state," you know?
[01:09:41] Brian DiCesare: So as the technology advances, this, these, this book hasn't really been updated, like, or rewritten in a very long time. You know, they give you different, like, updated pub numbers, but it's still basically what it's been for, like, a very long time. Mm-hmm. And there's nothing in there about ADAS or TPMS or, you know, the automatic parking brakes or anything like that, you know?
[01:10:05] Brian DiCesare: So...
[01:10:06] Jeff Compton: And I mean, I safety, I safety cars every day, all day, right? Sure. For, for our standards up here, and people are amazed when I tell them that it's like I can safety your car with an ABS light on. Like, technically that's legal.
[01:10:20] Brian DiCesare: Yeah, here too, as long as the red brake light's not on.
[01:10:22] Jeff Compton: That's the, that's the one.
[01:10:24] Jeff Compton: And I'm like, "But I don't." And it's like, I've caught flack 'cause it's like the TPMS light's on. We get them all the time. Up here, you know, people get a winter set of snow tires and rims, right? Like they do down there. And, you know, because people were so behind the times in trying to embrace TPMS, they all have rubber valve stems in.
[01:10:43] Jeff Compton: So these cars will come in on trade, and they've got a winter tire package on there with no TPMS. Well, me, I can technically sign that car as safe with the TPMS light on. Do I? Nope. It gets four new sensors, right like that. And everybody gets mad at me, and it's like, "You don't have to do that." I'm like, "Explain to me how you've disabled a safety system in the car," right?
[01:11:08] Jeff Compton: The car now, say it's a Nissan, it's just got four bars instead of four pressure readings- Yep ... 'cause it's got rubber valve stems in it. Tell me how I didn't disable a system.
[01:11:18] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:11:19] Jeff Compton: They're like, "Well, technically you did." Well, in the eyes of the government, they're like, "Put the lights on so the customer knows they're liable for checking the tire pressure."
[01:11:26] Jeff Compton: When's the last time you ever saw anybody check their own damn tire pressure?
[01:11:30] Brian DiCesare: You d- you don't.
[01:11:32] Jeff Compton: Right?
[01:11:32] Brian DiCesare: At all. The people don't- I had- I had to show somebody how to, a grown man how to check his oil the other day, and I'm just... I'll show you once, you know what I mean? But- I
[01:11:41] Jeff Compton: had, I had a guy that works in our company, and he brought in his, his, uh, Ex...
[01:11:48] Jeff Compton: It was a Ford. What was it? 2012 Ford Escape. All right? And he brings it in last week, and it's because somebody told him, "Hey, Moe, your right front tire is soft." So of course then we, we looked at it. Well, I think it's been soft forever because the tire- ... it's starting to dry crack, right? It's got one of those rims on it that, remember Ford when they had, it was a steel rim, but they had a chrome, the piece, like plastic that went over top, and they're hard to get, like, guys with- The
[01:12:20] Brian DiCesare: poverty caps.
[01:12:21] Jeff Compton: Right? But they, they leak through those style of rim- Yep ... all the time. And I'm wetting the tire down trying to find it, can't find a leak. And I said to him, I said, "Well..." And I go, of course, I get in to drive it in, and it's showing me TPMS' lights on. I'm like, "Well, like, how long has your TPMS light been on?"
[01:12:38] Jeff Compton: Oh, he says, "Years." And I'm going like, so, you know, we can put all this shit into cars, and I really don't think it's gonna matter because I don't think people are gonna fix it. Like, I think until they're forced to fix it, which is what's gonna happen, is the cars are gonna get to a point where they're gonna be like, "Hey, I'm a Tesla and I self-drive.
[01:13:04] Jeff Compton: I can't rely on you to be a good enough driver anymore with the amount of people that are out on this, on the roads. We're all self-driving." As soon as something disables self-driving, you're not gonna be able to drive the car. I think that's the ultimate end game that the, the manufacturers wanna play. I really think it is, you know.
[01:13:22] Jeff Compton: And that's just, like, if that's not scaring everybody, it really frigging should.
[01:13:26] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. And, and it's, you're not even really owning it either, because even with my car, like, listen, I have a, I buy a brand... I have a beater and I have a brand-new Toyota. The Toyota, I drive to, to shore, wherever. It's nice to have.
[01:13:41] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[01:13:41] Brian DiCesare: I have to pay a subscription fee for the remote on my phone to have, to be able to start it, adjust the climate. Yeah, it's cool, but I pay 15 bucks a month, so even though I'm, I own the vehicle, I don't own the, the car.
[01:13:56] Jeff Compton: That's right.
[01:13:56] Brian DiCesare: You know?
[01:13:57] Jeff Compton: Yeah, so it's like my Sirius Radio subscription is 28 bucks a month.
[01:14:01] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:14:02] Jeff Compton: And then it's like, if I want my remote start to work, I gotta pay that as subscription base too.
[01:14:07] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. So I think- So it's like they're finding ways just to, to keep... Th- even with PlayStation. I'm a GTA guy, I can't wait. Now they're saying no disc. I like collectibles. You know what I mean? Like- Yeah ... I got The Godfather back here.
[01:14:20] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? Like, I want the map like we had, you know, 13 years ago when Grand Theft Auto V came out, you know?
[01:14:28] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[01:14:29] Brian DiCesare: So.
[01:14:30] Jeff Compton: It, it's, it, I, and, you know, I don't know what this means for then the technicians coming forward because, like, you hear them talk about how they're gonna go to Trump, right? Or they did go to Trump, and Trump kind of like sent them home.
[01:14:43] Jeff Compton: "No, you guys are talking crazy. People should be able to work on their own car." That's the synopsis of that conversation. But the real reality that's coming forward is there's gonna be a lot more talks where it's gonna be like, "Oh yeah, you, you're free to work on it if you want. But we're gonna price everything that you would need to do these ADAS calibrations and these updates to make the car continue to operate the way it was designed."
[01:15:07] Jeff Compton: It's gonna be at such an astronomical price, I think that you're gonna see people not pay the money for it.
[01:15:12] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:15:13] Jeff Compton: You know? And then it's gonna be the same old thing. Everybody, the right to repair, "Well, we should have access to this and access to that." Dude, they've been playing with us for years because it's like they'll say, "Yeah, we'll give you access, but it costs this amount of money."
[01:15:27] Jeff Compton: And everybody goes, "Well, that's such a ridiculous price, I can't afford it Nobody said they were gonna make it affordable. They just, the government said you had to make it available, we make it available
[01:15:37] Brian DiCesare: Yeah, and at what cost, you know? And some of the, you know, speaking with some of the parts reps and some of the tow truck drivers, like a lot of shops are aging out.
[01:15:48] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[01:15:48] Brian DiCesare: You know, in the next five years there's gonna be a lot of shops closing, so that-- it's gonna shrink down, you know what I mean? It, uh, as, as far as options to have your vehicle repaired, as well as skilled people. And then all that knowledge dies with those guys that retire and don't pass it on to anybody, you know?
[01:16:07] Jeff Compton: Well, and, and, you know, it's not for me to sit here and wave the flag of the dealer, that's not what this is about, but, like, we talked about, like, some of the guys that I've had on that were 20-year vets of the dealer, and they got fed up and they left, right? You-- I, I don't care how you think you've gonna hire somebody young and they're gonna be great and everything, you have lost 20 years of brand knowledge that you cannot replace.
[01:16:34] Jeff Compton: You can't do it. And they went to your competition, which is they're now in the aftermarket, and they brought that wealth of knowledge on that product. It's like me. Like, when I left Chrysler and I hit the independent, like, I-- they were amazed at what I knew about that product in terms of the common failures.
[01:16:53] Jeff Compton: Like, I knew TSBs that weren't published, I knew recalls that weren't-- I can remember central timer modules in Dakotas and Durangos were a real common problem for everything from lighting to, uh, four-wheel drive actuation. And I remember working in a shop where it's like I, I condemned the, the central timer module.
[01:17:15] Jeff Compton: That was why it wouldn't, the four-wheel drive wouldn't work. And they went and got a price and it was like $700 for one back then. And I'm like, "Um, go pull up this recall," which of course the vehicle doesn't apply to the recall, "but pull this part number from the recall and ask them how much it is to buy that module under the recall part number."
[01:17:35] Jeff Compton: 70 bucks. And it works. Yeah. It worked fine, you know what I mean? And it's, it wasn't like I had to do programming. Back in the day it was a plug and play. So if I hadn't have known that from my experience of doing the recall over and over again- Like, is the information out there? Sure it is, but it's not at the level of the f- of the speed of somebody that comes with that-
[01:18:00] Brian DiCesare: Experience
[01:18:01] Jeff Compton: experience in that van. So when you have guys that just all of a sudden go, "F this, I'm done," I don't care what you hire or what you say, you, you, you lose. You've lost. Yep. Now, that doesn't mean that they get to come in every day like me, like I was towards the end, and be toxic and, you know, um, stop caring and stop...
[01:18:20] Jeff Compton: I didn't stop caring, but I was, like, I was fighting every day. I was fighting every day. I woke up every day and chose violence. Like, I had a chip on my shoulder, and you were gonna know it was there and why it was there, and I would fight you on everything. And so when you lose those people Yes, you lose that toxic problem, but you also lose a ton of knowledge that goes along with it.
[01:18:46] Jeff Compton: And this is, this is where we have to find this happy balance of like how do we keep, you know, our veteran, you know, happy and satisfied and paid well so that we don't lose that knowledge? But at the same time how, you know, if they become damaging to the culture, you probably can't fix it, you know?
[01:19:10] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[01:19:10] Brian DiCesare: And I think where the independent world and the dealership guys share the same pain is that we become toxic because of the bullshit-
[01:19:21] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm ...
[01:19:21] Brian DiCesare: uh, with whether it be the manufacturer, the cars, parts, the customers, the service writers, personal stuff, you know? 'Cause there's, as much as I try to separate my personal life from work, you know, there was a stretch of time there where my me- mental health working in the shop by myself and going through a breakup with a female, man, it just, it wasn't good.
[01:19:43] Brian DiCesare: And, you know, and our-- we're, in our industry we're the toughest of the tough and you just don't talk about that stuff, man. And, you know, there, there was a crumbling point there for a little while, you know what I mean?
[01:19:55] Jeff Compton: Well, I mean, as a man you're not even supposed to talk about it, right?
[01:19:58] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:19:59] Jeff Compton: That's, that's the whole thing, you're really not.
[01:20:01] Jeff Compton: You know, it's... And, you know, I- I'm not trying to throw shade at different careers, but I mean, if you're a first responder, you're a fireman, you're a police officer, you're a correctional officer, it's becoming more acceptable that yeah, you can talk about your day and you can talk about it and, and... But I mean, man, like where we are, you can't just immediately go over to your friend and go like, "Listen, Brian, I'm having a really tough time here, right, with what's going on at home," and, and then, you know, this place is this place.
[01:20:30] Jeff Compton: We can joke about what's going on at home, but we only joke about it.
[01:20:33] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:20:33] Jeff Compton: We're-- It's not so accepted yet and become the norm that we can share with our coworkers. And I say, everybody's like, "Why is that?" A lot of the time the guy that I'm working with, he's my competition. He's not my teammate, he's my competition.
[01:20:48] Jeff Compton: I'm trying to catch him or he's trying to catch me, right? Through the pay structure and the culture and all this kind of stuff. So when we talk about culture in this industry, it's not just about pay, but it's about that ability That I can stop what I'm doing and go help somebody, or I can just be there to listen.
[01:21:07] Jeff Compton: And it doesn't mean at the end of the day it was a absolute, like the wheels fell off the cart because we took some time to be there for our coworker, you know? Or they were-- took time to be there for me. Right now, I think we're running at such a fever pitch that most shops can't stop and do that. Yeah.
[01:21:25] Jeff Compton: And they talk about their KPIs and everything, but what's the real, what's the real metric? Or is every- And the- You know? Is every- The
[01:21:34] Brian DiCesare: funny part is they all talk about family culture, family this, and you get there and it's, uh, it's laughable. Yeah. And, and that's why I'm grateful, like the group of men that I work with on a daily basis, man, like The other lead tech knows every...
[01:21:51] Brian DiCesare: There's-- We've, we've stayed after and talked- Mm-hmm ... more than I've talked to anybody in my career, and it's like he knows when I'm off. I don't even have to say anything. He'll just let me be. He knows I'm the type, "Just leave me alone. I'll eventually come around, and when I do, I'll talk to you." And I could read it on him, you know.
[01:22:10] Brian DiCesare: And that's-- I think we need more of that in the industry. It's just somebody to lean on, 'cause this, these cars, uh, you know, there's days I drive home with the music off 35 minutes, man, just like, "Why, why do I do this to myself? Why do I choose these battles?" You know? Absolutely. And then when you do fix it, it's that, that dopamine hit that you just can't describe.
[01:22:30] Brian DiCesare: Like, man, I, I fucking fixed that thing. Nobody else could. You know what I mean?
[01:22:34] Jeff Compton: I was just gonna a-ask you, but then you answered it, because it's like I think the optimal p-place that we can get is where it's only the cars that are problem for us, right, that are stressing us, but the culture is so good that it's like I don't, I don't go home hating my job because of, you know, this guy, you know, I had to fix his comeback and nobody said thank you.
[01:23:00] Jeff Compton: Or, you know, I, I watched him pull another car in and he hit 20 hours today, and I hit seven because, like, he won't do anything but the easy shit, right? They feed him. If we could ever get to where that's not even a problem anymore and all we had to do was just stress about fixing the car Then I think it would be a lot more like the mental health in our industry wouldn't be so bad, right?
[01:23:22] Jeff Compton: But it's that, it's that culture and then the complexity of fixing these vehicles that I think for a lot of us right now is just too much. And, you know, we talk about the suicide numbers in, in our trade and all that kind of jazz, and I can't remember them now to quote them, but it's bad.
[01:23:41] Brian DiCesare: Yeah, it's really bad.
[01:23:42] Brian DiCesare: I just saw it the other day. We're like number one in the trades for, for, you know, unaliving. Mm-hmm. So ... And I mean, you know, my dad died from alcoholism, you know what I mean? At 55, seven years ago, you know what I mean? So ...
[01:23:57] Jeff Compton: Brian, how many techs do you know that have addictions?
[01:24:00] Brian DiCesare: I mean, I'm mo- I'm sober almost 13 years, you know what I mean?
[01:24:04] Brian DiCesare: It just-
[01:24:05] Jeff Compton: Human ...
[01:24:05] Brian DiCesare: without it, y- you know, it's, it's rampant, you know what I mean? And especially in this area, you know, I mean, when the opioid crisis started, man, Kensington's one of the biggest open air drug markets in, in the, on the continent, you know what I mean? So,
[01:24:22] Jeff Compton: you know. I know so many technicians that, like, the only way they got ahold of their alcoholism was to switch to, to marijuana.
[01:24:30] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[01:24:31] Jeff Compton: So I mean, and, and now they're like, they are ... They smoke a lot of it. And I'm not judging, but it used to be that they used to pound, you know, a bottle of vodka a night.
[01:24:42] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[01:24:42] Jeff Compton: Because they were so, you know ... Now they go home and smoke a joint, and they're, they're way more even keeled. I'm not sure that that's a solution, but when I, when I know so many technicians that, like, they go home and they drink four or five beer.
[01:25:01] Jeff Compton: Like, I grew up with my dad as a bodyman.
[01:25:04] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:25:04] Jeff Compton: Probably did too, where it was, that was every night. Yep. Not my dad so much, but it was, like, for a while it was. Every Friday afternoon, that used to be the joke that you couldn't get your car out of the body shop on a Friday because everything at noon shut down.
[01:25:20] Jeff Compton: And in the lunch room, I can remember walking in at eight years old, I can remember walking in to pick up my dad 'cause they would let him go at, like, 2:00 instead of being there till 5:00, 'cause nothing was rolling anyways. End of week. And there'd be six cases of beer on the lunch room table.
[01:25:35] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:25:38] Jeff Compton: Now, I'm not judging, but I mean, that's, that's six cases of beer.
[01:25:43] Jeff Compton: They didn't have, like, 100 people working there. But
[01:25:47] Brian DiCesare: like- When you look at it from this side, it, it puts it into perspective. You know what I mean? I'm sure you've gone through your struggles, you know, and I get it now. Like, when I was younger, I didn't understand. I could've been angry or whatever, but now looking back, it's like, man, like how we t- you talked about before with the pressure of the deadlines of being by yourse- you know, in the shop and then, you know, this bill's due, and I'm, I'm not making any money here, and the car's broken, and the cat's gotta go to the vet, you know?
[01:26:16] Brian DiCesare: So...
[01:26:17] Jeff Compton: For me, I never got into the addiction, knock on wood, thank God. But I was, I was so angry with everything. I was so angry with my workplace. I was so angry that it, like, it, it affected my relationships. Like, I could, I could, I... You know, I was essentially, for all intents and purposes, I was married and, and, you know, we never walked down the aisle, but we lived together for a substantial amount of time.
[01:26:45] Jeff Compton: My-- The, the industry, my-- where my head was in that, uh, destroyed it, ruined it, because I could not... I would be so mad some days that I could not get how I was feeling out. Yeah. I mean, I could talk, I could bitch about it, I could complain, but, like, she didn't understand. I mean, she understood because, uh, she had heard me do it for years.
[01:27:08] Jeff Compton: She, she knew what flat rate meant. She could recite it. But I couldn't go to her and say, "What do I do? How do I make it better?" You know? Uh, that's where you can go to your coworker if you guys are working as a team, and you can kinda work through that. But I mean, my brother right now, his really good friend is, you know, found out that his wife has had two affairs on him, and they're trying to figure out, like, three kids under 10, what do we do?
[01:27:40] Jeff Compton: You know, and he's looking at this like, I'm liquidating this second business that I have now, which I think was probably part of the reason that, like, she strayed, because I think he's-- he already had a full-time job, very high demand. He's a first responder. And then he has this secondary business on the side, and I think it was eating up all the time that he had.
[01:28:02] Jeff Compton: And I think that's probably why she just felt at some point, like, she didn't matter, and, you know, she wasn't important. And I mean, I know in his heart of hearts, he was doing everything for the sake of the family. But this is where when we talk in this industry about, like, "Okay, you're gonna go to work this week, and you're gonna do your 40, and you're gonna have to do your second 40."
[01:28:24] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:28:26] Jeff Compton: What's the sacrifice when we're doing our second 40?
[01:28:32] Brian DiCesare: What are you missing? Uh, I mean, I can relate to it, man, you know?
[01:28:37] Jeff Compton: Like, are we sitting in bed at night, you know, uh, watching Scanner Danner videos to try and become better for the next day and everybody... Or, you know, so it's, yeah, I mean, we're all sitting there before we go to bed staring at our phones, maybe sitting in bed next to your wife and she's staring at something completely different.
[01:28:55] Jeff Compton: I'm not saying that's healthy. But if we come home every night and we decide, "Okay, I gotta spend two hours to make my craft better for tomorrow How do we find the time? Because that's, that two hours, that should be when I wanna come home and see my son or my daughter and, and hear about their day and spend time with them and, you know, take them to a hockey practice or watch them, you know, take them to a wrestling practice or...
[01:29:19] Jeff Compton: If I have to be doing this after I'm done that, this polishing of our craft, there's gonna be a sacrifice there.
[01:29:31] Brian DiCesare: And also, you know, with the anger, like, what are you doing for yourself too? You know? Mm-hmm. We had talked about it a little bit before beforehand, and I think for myself, like, once I started to find some hobbies outside of the industry-
[01:29:49] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm
[01:29:50] Brian DiCesare: is when I kinda was able to, you know, in essence, let my hair down and relax a little bit, you know? And, um, for me, that was playing rec- recreational softball. Like, it could look like fishing, it could look like whatever it needs to look... For a while there I was into mountain biking. You know what I mean?
[01:30:07] Brian DiCesare: And but just to... But then again, like, that's also taking time away from the family. You know what I mean? So, like, trying to include everybody in the, in the activity, too, you know? And it's not easy, man, you know?
[01:30:20] Jeff Compton: Yeah. Or we see people talk about like, "Well, I go to the gym," you know? Um, and I, I'm, I'm saying that that's probably a good idea for a lot of us because I think, like, that might be a cheat code to kind of extend our career a little bit without some of the aches and pains is going to the gym because it keeps us mobile and, and fit and, you know, strong or at least flexible.
[01:30:43] Jeff Compton: But man, that, that's a commitment and time, too.
[01:30:46] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:30:46] Jeff Compton: All of a sudden we don't have with, with our families and stuff and I just, I, I... You know, everybody says that, you know, well, if you don't that second 40 hours you're just gonna be mediocre. Man, there's a lot of people in a lot of other trades though that are not mediocre in the trade, and I'm not just talking from pay but from ability, that don't have to do that 20, that 40 hours a week, you know, that we have to do.
[01:31:12] Jeff Compton: And I think it's just like because going back to the, you know, the, the housing market as an example or, excuse me, that trade, they move slow. That technology changes slow.
[01:31:23] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. The code
[01:31:23] Jeff Compton: changes slow. Our stuff, what we work on changes next month, right?
[01:31:29] Brian DiCesare: Next model year.
[01:31:31] Jeff Compton: Yeah. And then the g- one model in that brand is different from the next one.
[01:31:35] Jeff Compton: This one runs a completely different network, you know, like completely different AC system, whatever, and you're sitting here going, "How the hell am I gonna learn all this shit?" And then the other people in the other trade, HVAC, are like, "Yeah, I walk out to the H... You know, this unit on the side of somebody's house, and I throw my gauges on it, and I throw a charge in it, and I fix the damn thing."
[01:31:54] Jeff Compton: Yep. "Or I don't. I know what I need all inside of two hours." "
[01:31:58] Brian DiCesare: And I swap a board out and hit power."
[01:32:01] Jeff Compton: Yeah. And, and that's it, you know? I remember them telling us that it's like we needed a new AC unit at our shop because, you know, it, it was tripping a breaker. And they were... They got this estimate for whatever, and I said to them, I said, "Are you really sure you need a unit?
[01:32:17] Jeff Compton: Maybe it's just like the breaker's tripping because the system hasn't run all season." "And, you know, after a couple times of tripping a breaker, it'll start... You know, the compressor will free up, and it'll start working." Well, shoot, if that's about all it took was just some time being used and it's working again fine.
[01:32:34] Brian DiCesare: Nope.
[01:32:35] Jeff Compton: But they were ready to dump $7,000 into a unit, you know? So I- I... When we, when we talk about, you know, that, the demands that are on us and, and why the culture's this and the, and everybody wants to get paid, you know, crazy amounts of money, $100,000. "God, they all want six figures, the greedy fucks." This is the very real reality is the commitment that we have to make to our craft, I think warrants that kind of pay now, Brian.
[01:33:03] Brian DiCesare: Oh, for sure. With the technology, you know. And, and I know this may cause some, some grief in the comments at some point, but I feel like even the lube guys deserve a little bit more, you know. Especially if they're gonna be the ones coming behind us. Like, how do we get them to buy the tooling, you know, and also wanna stick around long enough to learn the trade, you know, when everything...
[01:33:29] Brian DiCesare: When you can go to Chick-fil-A or McDonald's and make 24 bucks an hour.
[01:33:33] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[01:33:33] Brian DiCesare: Or-
[01:33:33] Jeff Compton: You know? ... you know, the, the truck that they pull in to do an oil change on costs $100,000.
[01:33:38] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:33:39] Jeff Compton: And yet we wanna pay them 12 bucks to be responsible for that thing, getting the oil back in it in the right spot. You know, the Subaru, right?
[01:33:51] Jeff Compton: They didn't drain
[01:33:53] Brian DiCesare: They drained the trans and filled the engine. Yep.
[01:33:56] Jeff Compton: Like, that happens how many times a day, you know, in our industry? Probably a couple times a day somewhere in our industry it's happening, right? Yep. I worked at a shop where it's happened. It wasn't me, somebody else. You know, and it's like, so we wanna pay these guys nothing, but they be responsible for $100,000 trucks, so they don't blow the engine up and the tires don't fall off.
[01:34:19] Jeff Compton: But we say we can't pay them more than $14, $15 an hour. That's, that's, that's BS to me. But it's like, it's these, this thinking that I c- I can't charge for this service Well, that's just-- that again is, is what Cecil calls stinkin' thinkin'. You certainly can, right? And are you gonna... Is everybody gonna bring it to you if you start charging $300 for an oil change and you do two a year on a car?
[01:34:47] Jeff Compton: Is everybody gonna bring it to you at $300? No. No, they're not. But if eventually more people go, "I'm gonna start charging 300 bucks 'cause I'm gonna pay the person this amount. It's gonna get an inspection done. It's a rotate with a, with a balance every time. It's an inspection. It's a good DVI," all this stuff Well, the people that don't want any of that, we're never gonna get them anyway, no matter how cheap we make anything more than the oil change.
[01:35:14] Jeff Compton: Doesn't matter how cheap we make it, doesn't matter if we give it away for free, we're not... We're just wasting our time. But if we all of a sudden start saying, "We're gonna charge 300 bucks," then at least a lot more people are finally gonna get maybe to 100. Yeah. I mean, our local Midas is still doing an oil change with synthetic oil up to five quarts around me for 70 bucks.
[01:35:34] Brian DiCesare: There's a place ar- around here that's like a independent franchise that's home of the $44.95 oil change, and it's, you know, it's... You know, when you look at it from a business side, all right, why are they doing it? They're getting it, the oil change in there to bring their car count up so that they could do more vehicle inspections, so that they could sell more stuff, but- Yeah
[01:35:57] Brian DiCesare: how many cars are you... What... Like, I would love to see the numbers. Like, what are you really selling off of that $44? The clientele that you're getting off of that, the bumper's fallen off, it's probab- you know, the car's probably not in good shape, and it... You're probably giving them a $6,000 estimate, and they're going, "No, I just want the oil changed,"
[01:36:15] Jeff Compton: you
[01:36:15] Brian DiCesare: know?
[01:36:16] Jeff Compton: That's right. Um, Midas up here used to be famous. It was $34.95 before synthetic, and it was $34.95 would get you a blend, and it gets you two free wiper blades.
[01:36:27] Brian DiCesare: Oh, man. Yeah.
[01:36:28] Jeff Compton: Think about that. It was, back then, it was 14 bucks to buy two good blades. Yep. And I mean good, like, good. Yeah. Like, they wouldn't fall off.
[01:36:36] Jeff Compton: They were screwy and noisy, but they didn't fall off. And people are like, "Hell, I need a wiper blade and an oil change. That's where I'm going."
[01:36:44] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:36:44] Jeff Compton: And it was fantastic marketing for him, but I'm old enough to remember when it was $34.95. So now when I look at it and it's 70 bucks for a synthetic oil change, and they're not giving away wipers yet, but they might this fall, you never know.
[01:36:58] Jeff Compton: And I'm sitting here going, "It's the same thing. It doesn't matter." And everybody goes, "That's the best place to take it. It's the cheapest price." And I go, "You do realize that at that price they have to find work on every car that comes in." Something. It's something. Has to be an air filter, cabin filter.
[01:37:16] Jeff Compton: There, y- y- here's your f- here's your fluid samples. Like, look at how this is dirty. Okay.
[01:37:22] Brian DiCesare: And it's y- y... Again, it goes back to our reputation in the industry. People are... That's where a lot of, there's a lack of trust 'cause every time the car comes in, it's $2,000. It's $2,000. That's, you know, that's why we write everything up.
[01:37:37] Brian DiCesare: Here's everything, right? I don't care if it's eight grand, but this, these are the couple things you need. But this, just be aware that you, you're gonna have this coming down the, the pipe.
[01:37:46] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[01:37:46] Brian DiCesare: That way they know in the back of their mind that, hey, I got some maintenance I gotta do, you know? And if everybody did the same thing, if we were, you know, uniform with that, you know- A lot of that trust, uh, uh, that could change a lot of things in our industry, you know, is what I'm getting at
[01:38:03] Jeff Compton: Um, I mean, I, I got a guy that works in our company, he's a driver.
[01:38:08] Jeff Compton: And like, I looked at his Caravan six months ago, and it was the first time that, like, he needed an oil change, and I just-- And I'm looking at his Caravan, I'm like, "Do you know how in bad a shape this thing is?" "Nope." Nobody told him 'cause he was going to this shop, and then in town has a reputation for, "They're great.
[01:38:27] Jeff Compton: They never try to upsell me nothing." And I looked at the van because, like, Caravan sliding door fell off, right? The rollers so worn it falls through the track. And so he has me fix it, and he has me do an oil change. Well, I rack it. Tie rods are shot. There's broken coil springs. Struts are leaking. Uh, engine's puking oil from, like, every orifice it can.
[01:38:51] Jeff Compton: It's a Pentastar. Uh, check engine light on, ABS light on, all this kind of stuff. And I'm like, "Bob, do you realize this car is in this bad shape?" "No, I didn't know." I mean, he's like, "I knew about the warning lights, but I didn't know about the oil leaks." Parts on gravel. Doesn't even look it. And I'm sitting there and it-- I'm like, this is the problem I have is because you're taking to somebody that everybody raves about because they don't try and upsell you.
[01:39:17] Jeff Compton: You think that's an advocate for you, that person at that shop? No. Now, are they angry at the dealer or at the industry for everybody that tries to upsell them, that person who runs that shop? Or are they so beaten down from years of trying to make people aware of people going, "F you, stop trying to sell me something.
[01:39:35] Jeff Compton: Just change the oil, Bob," that maybe that's what... So I don't know. That's the thing that makes me always the wonder is, what were they always like? If they were always like, "The customer's always right, I just do what they ask, I never make them aware of anything unless it's gonna kill them today," well, then I'm sorry, you need to get the heck out of the industry.
[01:39:56] Brian DiCesare: Yep. And I, I've heard you, you have advocated for, you know, um, licensing to be in this field. And, you know, in Canada, you have to-- I, I've heard that you guys have to go and get special licensing to do different things. In Pennsylvania, to issue stickers, the only thing you really need is your inspection licenses from the state, you know, biannually and every four years.
[01:40:19] Brian DiCesare: But other than that, you don't need a certification, you know? And- It's- ... there's shops that you could tell that there's no certification. You know what I mean?
[01:40:30] Jeff Compton: And it's not popular when we start talking about that, where I say-- And I say like, "Listen, I'm not trying to tell everybody that they should be. I'm just gonna give you the heads-up that it's very much whether you like it or not, going forward, it's gonna happen in the States."
[01:40:44] Jeff Compton: Yeah. There's just no-- It's gonna be unavoidable. Like, if we're gonna have everybody's car out there that's gonna be able to drive itself, the, the people that are responsible for, uh, letting you drive are gonna make it mandatory of some kind of certification to say you can't touch the car unless you have this, you've passed this test, whatever it may be, that says you're competent to put it on.
[01:41:08] Jeff Compton: And listen, I, I have to say it every time. It doesn't fix the problems. It's not like Canada is problem-free because we have licensing. Not at all. First of all, the test is too easy. Too many guys pass it, or gals. Techs, period. Canada is not problem-free with the certification thing and the licensing or whatever you wanna call it.
[01:41:27] Jeff Compton: It's not like it's this utopia of nothing happens that's bad. Um, the testers, like I was saying, tests are too easy. Um, it doesn't bring up the quality of work that every technician does, right? Like it's still, it's up to the individual. But there is some, like, you can't say Uh, after they're certified that they don't know that wheels are supposed to be torqued or that they don't know that, you know, uh, TPMS is a thing.
[01:42:00] Jeff Compton: Like, we could essentially sit there and if you didn't have any kind of training, which is what it is, it's mandatory training, they could go out in the workforce and, and they wouldn't be able to say, "I just have gone on 'em on 'cause nobody taught me any better," 'cause they've been taught to. So that's where it becomes, it becomes a choice if they know they're supposed to do it the one way and they choose not to, now they have no excuse other than it's a choice to not.
[01:42:27] Jeff Compton: Yeah. And that's where the, the lack of training is the only thing I can say that where I'm an advocate of certification or licensing, why I'm an advocate is because there's some basic level of competency and training that has to be proven. Whereas if, like, if the wild, wild west of wherever you wanna talk about, and it's, like, we have parts of Canada where it's wide open, too.
[01:42:47] Jeff Compton: Um, they could go work in a shop tomorrow and have no idea what they're doing. None. Or here's what's even scarier They could go and say, put a Facebook ad out tomorrow and say, "I fix cars."
[01:43:03] Brian DiCesare: Yep And I agree with you on something. There, there needs to be some kind of regulation with, with where we're going technology-wise.
[01:43:14] Brian DiCesare: And also, like anybody that c- goes to school or c- completes that kind of testing or training or whatever you wanna call it, at least it shows some willingness to wanna be part of the trade, right? 'Cause when you look at some of the other trades, they go in as journeymen, and you have to complete a five-year or, I don't know, I'm making it up, a four or five-year period where you, you wor- you, you work as a, you know, an apprentice basically, and then you get your card or whatever they call it, and they call you a journeyman.
[01:43:40] Brian DiCesare: So, you know, every other industry has some sort of apprenticeship program where, you know, you have to learn it. And they still have problems, to your point. They still have people that will do some, some stuff that's not up to code or their quality. You're gonna have that with any human being. We're foul- fallible.
[01:44:00] Brian DiCesare: Unless it's a machine doing it, it's not gonna be perfect, and even then you still get problems. So, you know, unless you have a solution to, you know, being perfect, there, you know, there's gonna be issues no matter what way we do it. But as long as there's some kind of background, I, I agree 100%, you know.
[01:44:16] Brian DiCesare: Especially when we go to hire in Pennsylvania, do you have an inspection license? Because most places are an inspection station. You know what I mean? And the state comes in and they audit our books and make sure we have the right tooling and make sure that we're not stickering cars that shouldn't be and-
[01:44:32] Jeff Compton: Yeah
[01:44:33] Brian DiCesare: you know, and they're really cracking down now. And, um, you know, Tools had the Mid-Atlantic Car Care Alliance. Mm-hmm. That's, um... We have a meeting tomorrow night because there's legislation in Pennsylvania where they might try to get rid of the safety or emissions program, and that's just gonna cause all kinds of pro- problems for us, you know?
[01:44:55] Brian DiCesare: That's a lot of bread and butter for a lot of us techs here in Pennsylvania, you know?
[01:45:00] Jeff Compton: Yeah. And I've heard, though, people talk about, like in some states, like Lucas talks about North Carolina, like you can't hardly fail a car for anything. Like you-- It's documented, but you can't like let the car... Like he said, he can't remember the last time that it was an infraction that prevented the car from being allowed to leave.
[01:45:18] Jeff Compton: Like none of it. It's always like you can, you make them aware. Same thing, the, it, it can, as long as the brake red low fluid light in the master is not on, perfectly fine. You know, tie rod falling out, you can let them know. To- wire braid coming through tires, let them know. You know, all this, what is it? 1/32 is allowable tread.
[01:45:41] Jeff Compton: Like that's a joke. Like-
[01:45:42] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. I mean, that, that's where I'll give Pennsylvania some credit. I probably have the numbers backwards, and I should know them. It's two 32nds on brake pads for bonded pads, and it's three 32nds on tires- Yeah ... two adjacent treads. You know, and then their whole thing is manu- is it the way that the manufacturer put it, you know?
[01:46:02] Brian DiCesare: So that's where I will give PA credit. Some of the stuff's ridiculous though, with the window shading and, and, and different stuff, but
[01:46:10] Jeff Compton: The window shading, that's, that's a I'll say it, that's a police thing.
[01:46:16] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[01:46:17] Jeff Compton: That's for their safety.
[01:46:17] Brian DiCesare: That's a civil thing, you know?
[01:46:19] Jeff Compton: Um, you know, the idea that it's like I can't fail the car because the airbag doesn't work, like I think that's crazy that I can't fail the car because of that.
[01:46:29] Brian DiCesare: Well, if we're basing it off of lights, I think about the Keith Perkins thing with the resistor.
[01:46:34] Jeff Compton: I was just gonna-
[01:46:34] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? Like, and you could buy that pack of resistors on Amazon for 12 bucks. Yeah. You know? So if the... It's, it's, it's crazy, you know, with truck load of stuff.
[01:46:45] Jeff Compton: There was just another online creator, you know, that, that posted something the other day showing how that was a tool, a 12-ohm resistor was a tool.
[01:46:57] Jeff Compton: And I'm like, I'm sitting here shaking my head going, "Okay, I get it what you're trying to say here with your post," but like now we had 100 people that didn't know that we could shut off, uh, an ABS light with a 12-ohm resistor, and now we're gonna have 100 more people now that are gonna know how to like cheat it.
[01:47:15] Jeff Compton: And, and, and here's the thing. It's only gonna hurt us when, when we put that information out there on how people do it because it just means that the technology's gonna come along that is like, "You're not gonna be able to do it anymore." They're gonna up the system so that it's not so easily tricked. Yep.
[01:47:32] Jeff Compton: And is that progress? I guess so, but it's at the expense of everything. Like we're talking now, why does a truck cost $100,000? Well, because we're putting all of this safety systems into it, which all needs way more wires and way more network to work, and then they're not... customers not really getting a better engine or transmission in my opinion in terms of longevity.
[01:47:54] Jeff Compton: Maybe in performance or whatever, but certainly it's, comes at a, at a, at a trade-off. But because we keep, you know, ignoring the safety systems that are in place in a car, we just keep m- making new mousetraps, and it just drives up the cost to everybody, and then it's like we're not fixing the problem. Yep.
[01:48:18] Jeff Compton: And I guess it's like I keep going back to TPMS 'cause it's like people get mad at me, and it's like, "I wouldn't fail a car for that." I'm like, "If you can't sell the customer $200 worth of replacement sensors, you shouldn't be in the industry."
[01:48:32] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:48:33] Jeff Compton: And people get so mad 'cause it's like, "Why? I could check my tire pressure myself.
[01:48:37] Jeff Compton: I don't need a dummy light. I b- blah. I'm 50 years old. I've been checking tire..." You're the outlier. You're not who this system was designed for, right? Why did they take dipsticks out of engines? Yep. 'Cause they know most people can't find it or wouldn't look at it anyway. What's the point in them knowing that they're down a liter of oil if they don't have a liter of oil with them, and they're not gonna buy it when they go in and buy the gas anyway?
[01:49:00] Jeff Compton: What's the point in having a dipstick? Yeah.
[01:49:03] Brian DiCesare: And it's, you know, to your argument with the TPMS, it, it's not like it was in the early 2000s when that system came out and it was 200 a sensor. You know what I mean? We're, we're talking about 200 bucks, you know? I mean-
[01:49:16] Jeff Compton: But
[01:49:16] Brian DiCesare: you got- Most of the time it's not all four, it's one, maybe two, you know?
[01:49:20] Jeff Compton: But you got that situation where people are, "Well, how much for snow tires for my car?" Okay, so, uh, you know, $200 for four new steel rims, right? And, uh, four snows, you know 600 bucks, say, uh, you know, caravan or something like that. So they're like, all of a sudden it's like four, you know, 200... So $800. Let's make it 1,000 bucks and put four sensors in it as well, $50 a sensor Canadian costs, and, and now we keep the system the way it is.
[01:49:52] Jeff Compton: And all of a sudden some asshole, excuse my French, goes, "Well, I can sell a whole lot more tire packages than that guy down the street 'cause I'm selling them without the TPMS."
[01:50:02] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:50:03] Jeff Compton: And all of a sudden it's like everybody goes... And it, it drives me crazy. I worked at the dealership where they were throwing, you know, they were selling them as a package with the car when they bought it new.
[01:50:14] Jeff Compton: Not one of them had a flipping TPMS sensor in it. And everybody's like, "Well, we explained to the customer." Do you know how many customers that came in after it was supposedly explained by the salesman that drove out, turned around, drove back in and go, "There's a yellow light on. It was never on before." "Oh, yeah, that's your snow tire package.
[01:50:34] Jeff Compton: It doesn't have sensors." "Why doesn't it have sensors? Should it, should it not have sensors?" Like, this is all stuff that is common sense, and you have the customer asking you. But you mean to tell me because it's 200 bucks they wouldn't have agreed to it? Don't even tell them it's going in there, right?
[01:50:51] Jeff Compton: Just the right way to do it is if I'm putting, if I'm putting four, four rims on, I'm putting a fi- a $50, call it a valve stem then. Don't even call it a sensor. They ain't gonna know the difference.
[01:51:04] Brian DiCesare: It's included in the price of the tires.
[01:51:07] Jeff Compton: Right? But we, we, we screw ourselves up because we break it down. We give them so much information.
[01:51:13] Jeff Compton: Sometimes I think it's, they don't... I really know that they don't, a lot of them don't care. They just wanna know the price and when is it gonna be done. Yep. But as we say it, I look at my advisor and he says, "Sometimes it's like, 'Okay, so to do the tire pressure, you know, tire package is 800 bucks, but if we do sensors, it's 1,000.'"
[01:51:29] Jeff Compton: And I'm telling him, "Just tell them it's 1,000 every time, or whatever the number is. Just build it in." If they ask you why, "Why are you more than this shop?" Your question to them is, "Well, are they putting TPMS sensors in?" "I don't really know." "Okay. Well, Mrs. Smith, this is why it's, you know, they really should be.
[01:51:48] Jeff Compton: That's something, Mrs. Smith, you should be informed about." All of a sudden, you sound legit, professional, and informative. And they go- ... "Okay, I'm gonna give you my money." That's how it works. But instead of us going, "Ooh, gee, I better be really honest and tell her that, like, we could do it this way that's cheaper," but, like, the right way...
[01:52:07] Jeff Compton: Th- th- they don't wanna know the right way. They wanna know the cheap way.
[01:52:10] Brian DiCesare: Yep, and when's it gonna... Exactly like you said, what it, when's it gonna be done? And I, you know, I'm sure you've witnessed it where you have a service advisor that thinks it's their money You know? People come to us for service. And I, you know, I'm gonna be 100% honest with you, I am to blame for this as well, but, you know, years ago where I wanted to try to help people save money.
[01:52:36] Brian DiCesare: "Well, I'm gonna tell you the truth, and this is what it's gonna cost. If you ask me if there's another way to do it that might be a little bit cheaper, then I'll tell you, but this is the correct way." And once I got, once I got out of that thinking of Thinking like it's my money, and just telling people.
[01:52:52] Brian DiCesare: You'd be surprised, like people just want it done right. They don't wanna have to worry about it, and they don't wanna have to keep coming back. That's, that's the other thing. So give all the informa- like you're saying, give everything upfront, "Here. This is what we're gonna do." Don't break it down. "This is what it's gonna cost."
[01:53:07] Brian DiCesare: If they ask for it, give it to them then, and then they just want their car done, they want it to be reliable, and they don't want any genie lamps on their dash, you know?
[01:53:16] Jeff Compton: And I get it, and it... You know, the economy's tough for everybody, both sides of the border. Where you are, where I am, it's, it's tough all the way around.
[01:53:24] Jeff Compton: I mean, it, it's not getting easier by the day, it's getting harder. But if you have a customer in front of you and it's like $200 is gonna break them on this example of a, of a snow tire package or a tire package, or even doing four tires, and you bring it in before you do four tires, like that's another...
[01:53:42] Jeff Compton: We could talk about that process. What's your process, Brian, when you bring a car in and the customer's there for four tires, and, and you look and the TPMS light's on? What, what do you do? I worked with lots of guys that just assumed the TPMS light was on because they were coming in for four tires and it probably had a low tire.
[01:53:59] Jeff Compton: My process is I, you know- Boop, boop, boop, boop ... I test every sensor. Is it, is it dead or not? What's the-
[01:54:07] Brian DiCesare: Takes two seconds. It literally takes two s- it takes longer to find the year, make, model, and megahertz than it does to test it.
[01:54:13] Jeff Compton: Yeah. S- that's my process, but everybody else that I've worked with, for a lot of them, it's like, "I don't care."
[01:54:18] Jeff Compton: Like, and I'm like, "But what say you put four tires on, and you set them to the technical pressure, and you go drive it and the light doesn't go out, what do you do then?" "Well, then I look at it." Why? Why?
[01:54:30] Brian DiCesare: Now you gotta bring it back in, rack it back up, pull the wheel back off, break the tire back down, program the sensor, balance it, redrive the car.
[01:54:39] Brian DiCesare: You could've saved yourself 40 minutes.
[01:54:40] Jeff Compton: The customer is assuming that the tire light is on because they need tires. The customer doesn't know that there's a battery in there, and that the battery has failed, and that's why the sensor doesn't read. And then it's like they get flipping mad if you go, "Hey, all these sensors are OE."
[01:54:59] Jeff Compton: It's my, my mom's 2013 Equinox. I've replaced all four sensors now, right? I did two, and then I did two. I should've, as soon as I did the first one, did all four. I should've done it then. But it went another year before I had to put two more in, but it's the same thing. Mom's all of a sudden is calling me one day going like, "You just did my oil change last week, and now I got a tire light on."
[01:55:23] Jeff Compton: And I'm like, "I know it wasn't on when I looked at it, and I know that it's... So maybe you got a, a nail in the tire, Mom." She lives on a, on a road with a lot of nails. Nope, just the sensor went dead. But my brain immediately goes, "I must have made a mistake."
[01:55:37] Brian DiCesare: Mm-hmm
[01:55:39] Jeff Compton: But then I have these flipping customers that come in and it's like, "Oh, the light's been on forever.
[01:55:42] Jeff Compton: I don't even know about it." I'm looking, you know, like, "Mowed this tire last week." It just frustrates me 'cause it's something that's such a simple system, and in this industry we have completely disregarded... It's the same, Brian, how many times do you see an advisor tell a customer, "Oh, it's only an EVAP code, don't worry about it"?
[01:56:00] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. Oh. On the newer Toyotas, man, that EVAP li- light, so you have to, when you push the door release, it says "Ready for fueling."
[01:56:12] Jeff Compton: Mm-hmm.
[01:56:13] Brian DiCesare: If you try and it's a 30-minute window, well, there's a nozzle that releases the, the vapor so that you can fill the tank.
[01:56:21] Jeff Compton: Right.
[01:56:21] Brian DiCesare: Well, if you start filling gas and don't do it in that window, it closes and the fuel goes straight out of the tank.
[01:56:29] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? It's just a EVAP code- Right ... until that solenoid fails in the open position And then you just put $20 worth of fuel on the ground. Look at how- That's, you
[01:56:38] Jeff Compton: know? Yeah. And look at how many of the Fords, the little Fords, the Escapes, and all the, you know, those little turds that have that purge solenoid that sticks open.
[01:56:47] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[01:56:47] Jeff Compton: Right? And the light's been on forever. Hard
[01:56:50] Brian DiCesare: start.
[01:56:50] Jeff Compton: Ever. But all of a sudden they fill the tank up, they pull away from the, the pump, and it stalls out and they can't get it to start. Yep. It gets thrown away from the pump. You mean to tell me that EVAP then is not a safety related that can cause... He- hello?
[01:57:04] Jeff Compton: It just did. We just- Yep ... saw it. But for years we used to tell everybody, "Don't fix it. Don't worry about it. Uh, it doesn't matter if your mechanic isn't very good at diagnosing them because it, it'll never cause any drivability problem at all." And everybody went, "Okay."
[01:57:17] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. And people still have that knowledge, you know?
[01:57:20] Brian DiCesare: So...
[01:57:22] Jeff Compton: Yeah. What, um... How do we fix the shortage, Brian? Kinda to wrap this up with a really hard question.
[01:57:30] Brian DiCesare: I mean, I think we talked about it a lot, you know? Um, I don't know what the answer to that is. Yeah. 'Cause when you look at the world, y- I, I would say the generation coming up now is probably the closest one to, I would say, my late ear- 80s early 90s generation, where they're outside.
[01:57:51] Brian DiCesare: Okay. You know? And they're getting dirty. Um, so there is some hope for the future, but I think it comes down to us right now. You know what I mean? For when these c- 18 to 24-year-old kids wander into the shop, and, you know, they got a Mustang or whatever and, you know, they're into cars, and not be how we were treated.
[01:58:11] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. At least some of the experience that I had, I've had good experience and bad, you know? And obviously they gotta start from the bottom. Like, and I, I got a guy right now, like, "Dude, I know it's, it sucks doing tires, but you're gonna get to a point where, you know, that big 20-inch wheel isn't gonna jam you up and take you 30 minutes.
[01:58:28] Brian DiCesare: And then when you get to that point, we can move you on to something else, you know? And then once you get good at that, you know, you're gonna pick up on something." And it, speak, uh, speaking for myself, what I try to do is, like, a broken wire or some kinda testing I'm doing, like, this is why I'll bring them over.
[01:58:44] Brian DiCesare: They may not know what I'm doing, but, "Hey, this is what's going on with the car. You helped me push it in this morning, remember? Here, watch this. See, it runs now, right?" Mm-hmm. "This is what I did. This is what, why I did it." And well, you know, they'll ask, you know, "What's gonna fix it?" "Well, we gotta do X, Y, Z first."
[01:59:00] Brian DiCesare: You know what I mean? Whatever, whatever the, the cause and effect is at that point, you know? And I think, I think that's it. I think it's the culture. I, I feel like it's making them feel a part of- Mm-hmm ... to belong, and the... Like, you know, we all wanna be a part of something, and we all wanna be a part of something good.
[01:59:17] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[01:59:17] Brian DiCesare: I don't care what anybody says, you know? Um-
[01:59:20] Jeff Compton: It's... We harp about the pay, but I really don't think it's the pay. I think it's the environment that we're bringing them into that has to change. Like
[01:59:26] Brian DiCesare: the- Yeah. And the pay's gonna be there. I, I, I wholeheartedly think that with how- tough it is to get people, the money's going to be there.
[01:59:34] Brian DiCesare: I don't think that's gonna be an issue anymore.
[01:59:36] Jeff Compton: Even, even as we're starting to see more and more, Brian Pollock just said yesterday, like they've got these... 'Cause he's a, they're a big NAPA rep, right? Their, their shop, Wilco. Well, NAPA through Carlisle's got these basic tool sets for starting up, you know, mechanics.
[01:59:52] Jeff Compton: They're putting them on blowout. They're, they're making a bunch of... Brian's shop, they're buying like three of them, one for each- That's awesome ... station. And he says, "Because I'm just gonna hire..." Like he's got some people that are gonna move around, and he's like, "I'm just gonna bring them in." And he says, "That way I don't have to think about are they being held up because they don't have the tool?"
[02:00:11] Jeff Compton: He's like, "I'm just gonna provide them with the tools, and that way one obstacle that might be why they can't get the job done in a timely manner is removed." And I think that like we all talk about, and they all blurt out all the time in the comments about like, "I need to make more money. I need to make more money.
[02:00:26] Jeff Compton: Flat rate's the devil" and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I'm not disagreeing with any of that. But it's gonna be a lot easier if some of these young people come in here and it's like they don't have to immediately think about how do I find $5,000 to buy tools to do oil changes?
[02:00:40] Brian DiCesare: Finance my future away, you know?
[02:00:43] Brian DiCesare: And I, my guys, you know, I tell them like some stuff you gotta buy from Snap-on. Any, some of the electric you could either buy Milwaukee, buy Snap-on, but I'll take them to Harbor Freight. If you bring $150, I'll match it and you're gonna get $300 worth of stuff.
[02:00:58] Jeff Compton: That's awesome, bro.
[02:00:58] Brian DiCesare: It may not last forever, but it's gonna help get you started, and you're not in my toolbox.
[02:01:03] Brian DiCesare: Which sometimes I don't mind, but there's, there's days where it's like, dude, get... Come on, man. Like you don't got a fucking hammer, like a dead blow to get that wheel off, you know? Yeah.
[02:01:12] Jeff Compton: Right. But it's like, I'm, I, I come back to the ICON wrenches. Yep. Do you really need to spend $1,000 for a combination wrench set off the tool truck?
[02:01:20] Jeff Compton: No, you don't.
[02:01:21] Brian DiCesare: No.
[02:01:22] Jeff Compton: You can go into Harbor Freight and buy the ICON set for $150, sometimes even less. And I get it, you know, people are gonna be like, "It's junk and it's not as good." I never said it was as good, but I- It
[02:01:33] Brian DiCesare: gets the job done.
[02:01:34] Jeff Compton: Yeah. 100 times, show me the value of 750 or $850 difference, show me the value between that tool and that tool.
[02:01:43] Jeff Compton: Nobody's been able to show it to me.
[02:01:46] Brian DiCesare: They can- You can hide the names, you can't. My oh shit bag in the trunk, you know, I keep a, a oh shit bag in case of flat, whatever, it's all Harbor Freight stuff.
[02:01:56] Jeff Compton: Mine too.
[02:01:56] Brian DiCesare: But it, it works, you know what I mean? I bought the little cheap tire inflator, the breaker bar, the little half inch gun.
[02:02:03] Brian DiCesare: That way I could change a tire, whatever on the side of the road if I need to, you know. Tesla, just, just dumb shit, you know?
[02:02:09] Jeff Compton: I have all that. Yeah, 100%. I've got enough that if I had to put a water pump, 'cause I used to drive crap forever, I would drive old Jeeps. I had enough tools in there that if I needed to put an alternator, starter, water pump, you know, uh, change a U-joint on the side of the road, something like that, I could do it all.
[02:02:25] Jeff Compton: I had all of it with me in the back of that Jeep to do that. And now Mine's not breaking down and leaving me.
[02:02:33] Brian DiCesare: Yep. I'm
[02:02:34] Jeff Compton: still carrying the tools.
[02:02:35] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[02:02:36] Jeff Compton: Right? And it's not because it's like I'm thinking I'm, I'm gonna pull over one day and help some woman and we'll be married, she'll fall madly in love. I don't...
[02:02:43] Jeff Compton: That ain't why it's there. It's habit to have it, you know? Because I would rather, like if, yeah, if I'm gonna drive to Pennsylvania, you're freaking crazy if you think I'm gonna drive to Pennsylvania in a 10-year-old car, which is what my Wrangler is, without some tools in the back. I'd be nuts to, right? Is it, do I, did I ha- I've made two trips now.
[02:03:05] Jeff Compton: Do I need them? Not yet. Not yet. But I'll-
[02:03:08] Brian DiCesare: Well, if you break down and you see some of them black bears I was sending you, you know, it's a good thing you got that tool bag.
[02:03:15] Jeff Compton: Yeah, I'm locking myself in the Jeep and letting them do whatever they want to it. I ain't fighting no bear. Yep. Like, I'll pet one, but I don't wanna fight it.
[02:03:21] Jeff Compton: Like, if it's in a bad mood, I don't wanna fight it. Like-
[02:03:23] Brian DiCesare: Yep ...
[02:03:24] Jeff Compton: I, it's, it's a beautiful part of the, of the country, it really is. Like I, I was telling you when we met at Tools, like I love that drive. That's like the highlight of my year is making that trip. I just think it's, it's so pretty. Um, is that the next show that I'm gonna see you at is Tools, or do you think you'll make AST in June?
[02:03:43] Brian DiCesare: So I'm gonna attempt to make, it might be, I don't know if you're gonna do Super Saturday. Um, that's, that's in PA too. I, I think that's through Mid-Atlantic Arc Airlines, but I'm definitely gonna go to Tools again next year.
[02:03:56] Jeff Compton: Okay.
[02:03:57] Brian DiCesare: Um-
[02:03:58] Jeff Compton: And when's Super Saturday?
[02:03:59] Brian DiCesare: Uh, I believe it's in September, but don't hold it to me.
[02:04:02] Brian DiCesare: I would have to look.
[02:04:04] Jeff Compton: I think it's- So that's be- be- probably happening before AST, I bet.
[02:04:09] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[02:04:10] Jeff Compton: Like early in September. Mm. That's tempting. That's tempting.
[02:04:14] Brian DiCesare: Super Satur- I've done the Super Saturday before. That's a, like different vendors and, and stuff like that. That's usually pretty good. Uh, 2025 Super Saturday doesn't have the date.
[02:04:27] Brian DiCesare: Uh, what date is Super Saturday 2025?
[02:04:32] Jeff Compton: 2026
[02:04:33] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. It says March 14th, 2026, but I feel like there should be another one coming up 'cause it's always at the end of the
[02:04:41] Jeff Compton: Yeah
[02:04:42] Brian DiCesare: November 15th through the 26th- Okay ... or 14th through the 15th
[02:04:46] Jeff Compton: So I will be back from, so I'd be back from Vegas, 'cause it'll be, like ASS is in September, and then I'll be going to Apex SEMA in November, the first week of November, always my birthday.
[02:04:58] Jeff Compton: I'll be in Vegas again turning 51. Like last year, I turned 50 in Vegas. Um, so, so after that, within like 11 days if you're having Super Saturday, I gotta figure out how to get back. Hmm. Drive down. Maybe.
[02:05:13] Brian DiCesare: I can always send it to, I can always send it to you just to be for sure on the dates, but if you do come down, it's gonna be in the Philadelphia area, man, and- Mm-hmm
[02:05:22] Brian DiCesare: you can check out some sites, you know? Yeah. But definitely Tools again, 'cause that was, that was awesome, you know? Yeah. Just to get to meet some of the people I watch on- online, you, your- yourself, uh, Keith and Brian and Ron, and you know, all them guys, so.
[02:05:38] Jeff Compton: I'm, I'm trying really hard for next year to bring a bunch of Canadians down.
[02:05:41] Jeff Compton: I really am, because I think it's like, it's a six-hour drive, like from- Yeah ... and you know, the guys that come from Toronto or up around Buffalo area or something like that, right? Like it adds two more, but it's still, it's a day. Like it, it's, you know, if you wanna take the flight, take the flight, but I mean, I really enjoy the, the drive at this point.
[02:06:00] Jeff Compton: Like it's, it's, it's such a nice drive and it's, it's not... Being six hours for a drive to me ain't terrible, you know? Like-
[02:06:07] Brian DiCesare: No, it's not. I mean, you come down through Upstate New York and then through Central Pennsylvania, and it's just, especially that time in the f- in the spring when everything's blossoming, it's just, it's awesome.
[02:06:18] Brian DiCesare: And I mean, even Tanya, I met her, uh, and I've pretty much caught up on every one of her podcasts since, so-
[02:06:24] Jeff Compton: Yeah. She-
[02:06:25] Brian DiCesare: You know. She's awesome, man
[02:06:27] Jeff Compton: She's killing it, dude. She's like
[02:06:29] Brian DiCesare: She's so good ...
[02:06:30] Jeff Compton: if you knew how many episodes she already has done, like she has... I'm so proud of my, my podcast family, 'cause like everybody has hit the ground running and been like serious about it, taking it serious and, and it's cool.
[02:06:43] Jeff Compton: But she's like a beast with, like she's got so many episodes already in the queue. Like it's, she's just, she's just taking it like, "This is my second job. This is what the..." You know, she said, "This is the Lord's plan for me right now," and, you know, she thought she was gonna be in a, in a house in Jamaica, but no, the, the Lord wanted her
[02:07:00] Brian DiCesare: to have a podcast.
[02:07:01] Brian DiCesare: The one with Zeb, with the one that she did with Zeb, I, like I think I was hooked after that, 'cause he was actually in all my classes in Tools, and like, I didn't really... I, I knew him from social media, but I didn't know him, and yeah, that dude's awesome, you know?
[02:07:16] Jeff Compton: He's
[02:07:16] Brian DiCesare: the- He's awesome. He's- His shop is crazy where he's gotta take a golf cart or whatever it is from side to side
[02:07:22] Jeff Compton: I, I say this with no disrespect to him, he is the smartest redneck I've ever met.
[02:07:28] Jeff Compton: 100%, like-
[02:07:29] Brian DiCesare: Dude, it's awesome ...
[02:07:30] Jeff Compton: you just think he's a good old boy, and like-
[02:07:33] Brian DiCesare: He's so smart. You know,
[02:07:35] Jeff Compton: he's, he's functioning at another level, dude. Like he is, he's legit. Like, and it, it... What I love about him is it's like he's never seen a problem that he can't solve, right? Like he's had cars that like they, they, you know, he was talking about a vibration he had in his truck, and you know, he went through it and finally just gave it back to the customer and said, "I, I, I can't, I can't narrow it down.
[02:07:57] Jeff Compton: I can't find it." Like it's, it's, we tried this, we tried that, tried tires, tried rims, tried, you know, everything he had. But like to him, he believes that like if, if I need a piece of machinery, and I'm talking like a machine, a, a milling machine, a head machine, he goes and buys it.
[02:08:15] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[02:08:15] Jeff Compton: You know? He's got machinery in his shop that's over 100 years old that he's still using because he comes...
[02:08:20] Jeff Compton: So like to him it's like, oh, when the crank gear on a, on a power strokes, you know, spins, he welds that sucker back together. Like he's one of the first that figured that out and how to do it. Everybody else is like, "Yeah, we put an engine in." Zeb's like, "Why? I take it out, I weld it, put it back in."
[02:08:36] Brian DiCesare: Make it better than it was.
[02:08:38] Jeff Compton: Exactly, right? Like-
[02:08:39] Brian DiCesare: You know? ...
[02:08:40] Jeff Compton: he does not accept that there's anything out there that he can't do. He does not accept that. And I, I gotta say I love it because it's the same Brian, Tommy, Chris, th- these people in this group chat, that's, that's the mentality they have, you know? They don't believe that there isn't anything they can get through.
[02:08:57] Jeff Compton: Now, there's a lot of back and forth and leaning on one another to help. It's a beautiful thing. It's going back to that w- it's a community now. This industry was never a community until the internet came along. I don't care what anybody says. Everybody was competing with the shop next door, around the corner, across the street.
[02:09:14] Jeff Compton: We were always competing. There's not as much of that anymore, and there needs to be even less.
[02:09:19] Brian DiCesare: I... And you, you asked me, like how do you fix a technician shortage? I think in 10 years if you look back at the state of the industry of where it is now, it's gonna be because of this. And like I said it early on about the r- I don't know if you remember the early Wrenchin' Network way, way back when it first came out, and Lozer and all.
[02:09:38] Brian DiCesare: Yeah. But like that was the first taste where it felt like, man, there's other techs out there like me. You know what I mean? And then it, it just grew into j- everything that we have now, and it's only going to keep going, you know? And that's, like you said, the community, the culture, all of it. Eventually the rotten apples are gonna weed themselves out because you can only keep that mask on for so long- Yeah
[02:10:00] Brian DiCesare: and you can only fake it for so long, and it, it's just gonna, you're gonna fall to the wayside. You just... And it's just gonna take over, and I think, I think there is a bright future. I think-
[02:10:12] Jeff Compton: It's...
[02:10:12] Brian DiCesare: Yeah ... I think there's a bright future, uh, for the industry moving forward. I like- I know there is for me. You know, I, after tools I've become re-enthused.
[02:10:20] Brian DiCesare: I was burnt out. You know, I, I was burnt out, man. Like I just- You know? And I went to Tools and it, it just, it was like a shot of adrenaline, man, and I'm like, "Let's go." When...
[02:10:31] Jeff Compton: And you and I had never met, but I could see that in you when we were there. You know what I mean? Like, I got that vibe from you right away where you were, like, really enthused about being there, and then you were really excited about how you were feeling, like, the, the training you were getting and, and all that kind of stuff.
[02:10:47] Jeff Compton: And I mean, that was, that was the key. Meeting you was one of the key takeaways for me of being able to, to be there and meet you, 'cause it's like, you know, you, you meet s- y- every show you go to you meet cool people. But it's like when you, you, you meet that person that you know they came away from the event reinvigorated, recharged, mo- you know, fired up, motivated.
[02:11:10] Jeff Compton: That's, that's what it's all about. It isn't about the classroom thing. It's not about, like, the, the, the textbook that you came home from the class with. Like, that's all important stuff, but it's that fire that it's like, "I want to fix this. I want to be better." That's what we do it all for, man, and that's why, that's why I ke- I just keep telling everybody.
[02:11:31] Jeff Compton: Like, I know it seems expensive. You know what it costs to go to Tools, you know? Yep. Um, you drove in every morning, right?
[02:11:38] Brian DiCesare: Yeah.
[02:11:39] Jeff Compton: Yeah. Yeah. Like, you didn't stay at the lodge. You drove in every morning and drove home every night.
[02:11:44] Brian DiCesare: They were, they were long days, man, and I was tired, but I... It was, it was awesome, you know?
[02:11:48] Jeff Compton: Yeah. Well, this year, you know, we'll try and get you so that you don't have to make such a long drive. You can just- Oh,
[02:11:53] Brian DiCesare: I'm, I'm staying next year. I'll tell you that.
[02:11:56] Jeff Compton: Yeah.
[02:11:56] Brian DiCesare: I'm staying next year. 'Cause
[02:11:57] Jeff Compton: y- y- you know, it's that networking thing. Like, you miss it, right? Like, you're there for the classes, but it's that, that being able to network till 9:00 or 10:00 at night or midnight or whatever, right?
[02:12:08] Brian DiCesare: Yep.
[02:12:09] Jeff Compton: You know, when you miss that, you're missing a big part of what really the magic is about these shows. But, uh, I wanna thank you for being here with me. Um, you know, thank you for the time. I kept enough of your time .
[02:12:21] Brian DiCesare: Oh, it's all good, man. I appreciate you having me on.
[02:12:24] Jeff Compton: Oh, dude, I... Listen, we'll do this again.
[02:12:26] Jeff Compton: Like, I-
[02:12:26] Brian DiCesare: For
[02:12:27] Jeff Compton: sure ... I generally enjoy talking to you whenever we do, and I mean, you know, it's It's one of those things where it's like, we need more of your people with your kind of attitude and your kind of perseverance, and you're... You know, y-you've been through it, and you're, and you still love what you do, and you're still making your dad proud.
[02:12:45] Jeff Compton: And I mean, like, that's, that's what this is about. You know? We-- It, it's, it's being able to say, "I know some days are gonna be tough, but I love what I do, and I want to be able to, you know, have more good days than bad." When we decide that we're gonna have more good days than bad days, we just inherently do.
[02:13:06] Jeff Compton: You know? It's as simple as that. That's the secret sauce, is just decide the thing isn't gonna beat you, and just decide that today is gonna be a good day, and it will be a good day. I guarantee- Yep ... you. You know? It's just a, it's a mindset. Don't accept that you can't do it. Don't tell yourself that you, y-you're at a disadvantage.
[02:13:26] Jeff Compton: Don't tell yourself that the car can beat you. Decide that you're gonna beat it. And then if you can't, don't kill yourself about it, 'cause you, you and I will meet a ton of techs in our life, none of them are perfect. Yep. The smartest guys I know have lists and share stories of cars that beat them. It's just how it is.
[02:13:44] Jeff Compton: Sometimes it doesn't line up, and it has to be the next person is the one that's gonna unlock the riddle. Whatever that may be, for whatever reason they're able to that you weren't, don't beat yourself up over it. You know, continue to improve and continue to pour into yourself, and you will have more good days than bad, you know?
[02:14:06] Jeff Compton: So, I wanna thank you for being here. The family at Tech metric and the family at LaunchTech, thank you for providing me with what I'm able to do here. Uh, without you guys, I wouldn't be able to do this. And I mean, I, I don't thank you guys enough, but, you know, you guys make this so, so possible. I'm able to give so much back because of what you guys give me, and I wanna thank you for that.
[02:14:28] Jeff Compton: And Brian, I can't wait to see you. We'll try then, I guess, to get to Super Saturday. You know, shoot me the info on that. People, spots are quickly filling up for ASTA, which is, you know, we're sitting here on the 26th of July, so you're, you know, you're two months away from ASTA. So if you're on the fence, get off the fence and, and make your, make your reservations to be at ASTA.
[02:14:53] Jeff Compton: I'll see you there. The next time I'll see anybody after ASTA will be at, you know, SEMA Apex in Las Vegas, which is always a great time. You know, Brian, we'll have to get you there one time.
[02:15:04] Brian DiCesare: Oh, for sure. For sure. So...
[02:15:08] Jeff Compton: Thank you, everything. Thank you, Brian. Appreciate you, man.
[02:15:12] Brian DiCesare: Same, brother. And, uh, yeah, safe travels, and I look forward to seeing you again, man.
[02:15:17] Brian DiCesare: Thanks for having me on, bro.
[02:15:18] Jeff Compton: Let me know what's going on with that Jeep, okay? In a day or two.
[02:15:21] Brian DiCesare: Oh, yeah. For sure. That's, that's first thing tomorrow morning. Yep.
[02:15:24] Jeff Compton: I'm beating you here, man. Thank you. All
[02:15:26] Brian DiCesare: right. Yep.
[02:15:26] Jeff Compton: All right. Take care, everybody. I love you all. We'll talk to you soon. Hey, if you could do me a favor real quick and like, comment on, and share this episode, I'd really appreciate it.
[02:15:37] Jeff Compton: And please, most importantly, set the podcast to automatically download every Tuesday morning. As always, I'd like to thank our amazing guests for their perspectives and expertise, and I hope that you'll please join us again next week on this journey of change. Thank you to my partners in the ASA Group and to the Changing the Industry podcast.
[02:15:55] Jeff Compton: Remember what I always say, in this industry, you get what you pay for. Here's hoping everyone finds their missing 10 millimeter, and we'll see you all again next time.