Limitless: An AI Podcast

Big week this week. Moonshot Labs’ dropped Kimi K3, Thinking Machines Labs’ Inkling, and reporting on OpenAI’s upcoming screen-free hardware device. 

We also discuss Grok Build, XAI, a new dictation tool, Elon Musk’s energy company purchase, and reports that DeepSeek is preparing an IPO.

------
🌌 LIMITLESS HQ ⬇️

EMAIL US:           info@limitless.fm
NEWSLETTER:    https://limitlessft.substack.com/
FOLLOW ON X:   https://x.com/LimitlessFT
SPOTIFY:             https://open.spotify.com/show/5oV29YUL8AzzwXkxEXlRMQ
APPLE:                 https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/limitless-podcast/id1813210890
RSS FEED:           https://limitlessft.substack.com/

------
TIMESTAMPS

0:00 Kimi K3 Changes Everything
8:11 Thinking Machines Finds Its Niche
15:06 OpenAI’s Mystery Speaker Emerges
21:15 Elon’s AI Moves and Missteps
26:52 Dictation Gets Smarter
29:44 DeepSeek Eyes an IPO

------
RESOURCES

Josh: https://x.com/JoshKale

Ejaaz: https://x.com/cryptopunk7213

------
Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here:
https://www.bankless.com/disclosures⁠

Josh works with Anthropic as a contractor. All views expressed are his own and do not represent Anthropic, its leadership, or its affiliates. Nothing in this episode is investment advice.

Creators and Guests

Host
Ejaaz Ahamadeen
Host
Josh Kale

What is Limitless: An AI Podcast?

Exploring the frontiers of Technology and AI

Ejaaz:
For years, the battle between open source and centralized AI models has been very one-sided.

Ejaaz:
Anthropic open air has always dominated the field until this week where Moonshot

Ejaaz:
Labs, an AI lab out of China, has finally released their next model,

Ejaaz:
Kimi K3, and it is Fable 5 worthy.

Ejaaz:
Now, the craziest part about this is Chinese and open source models in general

Ejaaz:
have been behind American frontier labs. They haven't been able to close the

Ejaaz:
gap. Dario recently said that that gap is roughly around eight months,

Ejaaz:
having closed from about a year.

Ejaaz:
Today, with Kimi K3, that model has closed it to today.

Ejaaz:
It is as good at one-shotting visual prompts as Fable 5 is. It's amazing at

Ejaaz:
reasoning in general. And we're going to get into a bunch of cool demos that

Ejaaz:
we see on our screen today.

Ejaaz:
Other big news in open source, Thinking Machine Labs, which,

Ejaaz:
funnily enough, raised the largest seed round ever, $2 billion,

Ejaaz:
headed by ex-OpenAI CTO Miro Murati, released their first model called Inkling.

Ejaaz:
It's small, yet pretty mighty. We're going to get into that.

Ejaaz:
And then OpenAI themselves have revealed some secretive details about their

Ejaaz:
new hardware device. If you've watched the show at all, you know Joshua and

Ejaaz:
I are obsessed with this.

Ejaaz:
We're excited to get into the details and show you what is coming soon.

Josh:
Yeah, so to start, we have a new king on the block, and that comes in the form

Josh:
of Kimi K3. I mean, this very much feels like...

Josh:
I wouldn't say the DeepSeek moment, but something somewhat familiar in the sense

Josh:
that this is a really novel, leading edge, open source model coming out of the Kimmy team.

Josh:
And it was paired with this really lovely launch video that actually.

Josh:
I was shocked that it was coming from this lab because this looks like something

Josh:
Apple would release as a product launch video.

Josh:
It was beautiful. The sound design was amazing. The visuals were great.

Josh:
And it's funny, they launched this before they even officially launched the

Josh:
model. In fact, at the time of recording, they haven't even officially stated

Josh:
that the model is live but

Josh:
it's available it is available in the model picker for you to go and test it

Josh:
now the model comes in the form of about a 2.8 trillion parameter model which

Josh:
if you listen to the episode yesterday featuring grok that's about double what

Josh:
grok 4.5 was in terms of parameter count

Josh:
based on the early reviews that i've seen a lot of people have been using this

Josh:
model kind of early it seems like this is pretty incredible um it seems like

Josh:
people have been able to do really impressive long horizon tasks they've been able to do really

Josh:
impressive coding generation gaming generation 3d generation and a lot of people are comparing this to

Josh:
close to a fable worthy model and early testers they put it above gpt 5.6 actually

Josh:
on coding and almost fable worthy at coding which puts it in a really solid

Josh:
spot because the pricing of this thing is going to be very low and the quality

Josh:
of it is incredibly high and to

Josh:
our point yesterday talking about the two frontiers there is the

Josh:
intelligence frontier and there is the cost Frontier, this is placing a new

Josh:
point on that Pareto curve of cost and intelligence at a part of the curve that

Josh:
I don't think anyone's ever made to before.

Josh:
This is like very much a frontier model in terms of cost per intelligence.

Josh:
It's really impressive.

Ejaaz:
I think this tweet that I have over here summarizes it the best.

Ejaaz:
He goes, the more I test K3, the more it feels like another DeepSeek R1 moment.

Ejaaz:
It is often Fable level, maybe a little worse, but consistently better than 5.6.

Ejaaz:
And that's a recurring theme across a lot of different takes from early testers,

Ejaaz:
that it's not quite as good as Fable. It's as good as Fable when it comes to

Ejaaz:
certain things, but not everything.

Ejaaz:
But it is certainly better or on par with GPT 5.6, which is a bold claim,

Ejaaz:
obviously, because OpenAI has invested billions and billions of dollars into

Ejaaz:
their thing. Now, enough of us claiming theory. Let's talk about some actual examples.

Ejaaz:
So on your screen right now, you're looking at the promotional video from the

Ejaaz:
Moonshot Labs themselves.

Ejaaz:
Now, what I'm going to shift to right now is Kimi K3 one-shotting the video entirely from scratch.

Josh:
Whoa. And building it from scratch. Oh, that's really cool.

Ejaaz:
Exactly. This is one single prompt. It was fed the promotional video that Moonshot

Ejaaz:
Labs themselves created from scratch using humans and all that kind of stuff.

Ejaaz:
And it only took 25 minutes to do.

Ejaaz:
Now, rumor, the cost to create this thing. Josh, actually, take a guess.

Ejaaz:
How much did it cost to create this video?

Josh:
Oh, my God. One shot. probably nothing right because the cost per million tokens

Josh:
is 95 cents i think so what would this take maybe five million tokens or say

Josh:
five five to ten dollars no more than 10 bucks.

Ejaaz:
It costs under 10 bucks, which is just insane.

Josh:
Oh, that's so cool. It's insane.

Ejaaz:
Now, like if you have used products from Anthropic or OpenAire that are relevant

Ejaaz:
to artifacts, the visual diagrammatics that they help you create,

Ejaaz:
it takes a while. It takes a couple of bits of prompting, sequential prompting.

Ejaaz:
With Kimi, it seems that it could just one-shot this completely.

Ejaaz:
And it's not just one example I have.

Ejaaz:
I have quite a few. If you look at this, you're looking at a 3D simulation.

Ejaaz:
Now, you would be excused if you thought that this was Fable 5 worthy,

Ejaaz:
because if you rewind a few episodes ago where we covered all of Fable 5's cool

Ejaaz:
demos and stuff, we showed you a Hogwarts demo, a bunch of other things like that.

Ejaaz:
It was of the same quality and par. Kimi K3 can now compete on the same level.

Ejaaz:
And it's not just for simulations. It's recreated Mario Kart from scratch.

Ejaaz:
Now, granted, it looks like Minecraft, but, you know, what AI model doesn't do that?

Ejaaz:
And you could imagine with a few more prompts and like visual graphics added,

Ejaaz:
it could get to, you know, maybe not a AAA, but like a AA type game vibe.

Ejaaz:
So the point is, it's a very impressive model and it's physically accurate.

Ejaaz:
It gets the physics of how things work, the mechanics of wings that you're seeing

Ejaaz:
On your screen right now, how it works. It nails it.

Ejaaz:
Now, where it falls or where it's a little lackluster is general reasoning,

Ejaaz:
writing and coding in general. Now, coding for visual prompts, it's very good.

Ejaaz:
Coding for hard specifically developer tasks, Fable 5 is still good,

Ejaaz:
but it matches the likes of GPT 5.6 Terra and Luna.

Ejaaz:
Maybe not quite Sol, but Terra and Luna and certainly Sol at least on medium

Ejaaz:
effort. So if you're looking for a comparison as to whether you should use this

Ejaaz:
model, it's pretty up there and you should be surprised that they've been able

Ejaaz:
to close the gap so quickly.

Ejaaz:
The final thing I'll say is on cost, it is super cheap. It is under a dollar

Ejaaz:
input tokens, and I think it is a couple dollars output tokens.

Ejaaz:
Again, none of this is officially confirmed. Just yet we're getting like leaks

Ejaaz:
as we're recording this episode.

Ejaaz:
That would price it at the same value as sonnet five or sonnet the sonnet model

Ejaaz:
from from claude themselves so we're not even talking about opus level here

Ejaaz:
we're talking about like sonnet cost which is like cheapest chips

Josh:
Yeah very impressive i mean it's funny as we cover this model i think about the open claw community

Josh:
and people who use these long-running agentic tasks i don't know where they

Josh:
are now i haven't seen many of the open clock community publicly in a while

Josh:
but this is such a dream model for them where it is so cheap it is so capable

Josh:
of these long-running agentic tasks it has all the visual understanding it seems

Josh:
like a very good companion

Josh:
and this seems like a legitimate kind of dent in the moat of these companies

Josh:
that are kind of holding the frontier of that pareto curve in terms of cost

Josh:
in terms of intelligence so it's a really impressive model coming out of china

Josh:
i'd love to know how this came to be

Josh:
what types of models were distilled if any kind of whose ip are you taking here

Josh:
whose stolen gpus are you training this on listen.

Ejaaz:
Josh that's actually important context right you you raise a good point because

Ejaaz:
um moonshot labs the guys that created this model have been accused by not just

Ejaaz:
Anthropite, but also OpenAI and Google for distilling their frontier models.

Ejaaz:
So we have no proof whether they've done the same thing here,

Ejaaz:
but maybe it can be assumed. I don't know.

Josh:
I mean, yeah, I find it hard to believe that it's anything otherwise than they've

Josh:
just distilled the frontier models and turned them into cheaper models that are more capable.

Josh:
It seems like this is kind of well known, that they have smuggled GPUs into

Josh:
the country, that they have like kind of,

Josh:
nudge the numbers on how much the training costs were on a relative basis where

Josh:
they say it's a lot cheaper than it actually is

Josh:
there's a lot of malpractice going on behind these models which is why it's

Josh:
a little difficult to support them but man on just a pure open weight basis

Josh:
for them to publish a model like this it's pretty impressive and i think a lot

Josh:
of people are going to get a lot of use out of this so,

Josh:
i am going to go and try this i'm going to check my model picker after this

Josh:
just to test maybe we'll have a follow-up episode showing some of the demos

Josh:
all the interesting things you could do with it but if you are watching this

Josh:
chances are it is live it's available. Go try it out and let us know what you think.

Josh:
That brings us to our second topic of the day. And this one I am particularly

Josh:
excited about because, Ejaz, if you remember, 18 months ago,

Josh:
after leaving OpenAI, the co-founder of OpenAI, Mur Murati, she left and she

Josh:
went to go start a company named Thinking Machines.

Josh:
She is one of many co-founders who have left the company, unfortunately,

Josh:
for better or worse, and went off and tried to do her own thing.

Josh:
During this process, she raised the largest seed round in venture capital history.

Josh:
Now, seed rounds, generally speaking, I remember back in the day, a seed round of like,

Josh:
a couple million dollars if you raise like five to ten million dollars.

Josh:
That's a remarkable seed round. This was two billion dollars.

Josh:
And for those not familiar, the seed round is the first money into the company.

Josh:
You have an idea and you say, I'm going to go build this idea and an investor

Josh:
gives you some money to do it.

Josh:
She raised two billion dollars at a twelve billion dollar valuation right off

Josh:
the bat from companies like Andreessen Horowitz, NVIDIA, AMD and Jane Street.

Josh:
These are the largest ones in the game.

Josh:
So for the last 18 or so months, we have been asking ourselves the question,

Josh:
well, what are they actually working on?

Josh:
Two billion dollars is a tremendous amount of money to go off and build something

Josh:
and mira and the team are clearly very talented because they were one of the

Josh:
day ones at open ai who were building the gpt

Josh:
early gpt days and as of today we finally have an answer and it comes in the

Josh:
form of this model named ship shipling inkling what is this what did they actually release.

Ejaaz:
It to be fair it doesn't roll off the tongue but it's called inkling and it is a

Josh:
Model that falls.

Ejaaz:
Yeah yeah it's a model that falls just under a trillion parameters in size,

Ejaaz:
so relatively small given the landscape today.

Ejaaz:
But would it surprise you if I said it's a pretty unremarkable model that is

Ejaaz:
remarkable in a very specific way that not many people see? So let me explain what I mean by that.

Ejaaz:
It's trained on about 45 trillion tokens of text, image, video, and audio.

Ejaaz:
Now, the reason why that is pretty cool is that it's completely omni-model.

Ejaaz:
It's like a multi-modal model that you can send text to, you can send audio

Ejaaz:
to, you can speak to it, doesn't interrupt you.

Ejaaz:
It's that type of model that is very intuitive. It feels very human.

Ejaaz:
And Mira Murati released a really interesting blog post earlier this week,

Ejaaz:
which described her vision for Thinking Machine Labs.

Ejaaz:
It's not to be the frontier LLM, it's to be the frontier companion for humans.

Ejaaz:
And so she's building these models in a very specific way. So when we look at

Ejaaz:
the model itself, it was trained in under nine months.

Ejaaz:
It is quite good at reasoning. It is okay at coding.

Ejaaz:
It is nowhere near Fable 5 worthy. But where it gets super powerful is if you take their model,

Ejaaz:
And then you fine tune it for your own specific task department or team.

Ejaaz:
So what that looks like is, and there's a live example of this actually happening

Ejaaz:
right now, where you can take this model and let's say you operate like one

Ejaaz:
of the world's top trading hedge funds, right?

Ejaaz:
You could feed it data. You could run it locally, by the way,

Ejaaz:
feed it data, all encrypted,

Ejaaz:
train the model to understand how your team company operates,

Ejaaz:
what your investment theses are, feed it maybe even proprietary information

Ejaaz:
because, by the way, this model is completely open-weight.

Ejaaz:
So, you know, open sources come back to America. Well done, Mira Morati.

Ejaaz:
And you can hyper-focus this model on your daily trading activities if you are

Ejaaz:
in that hedge fund position.

Ejaaz:
Now, if you don't believe me, there is a live example of this actually happening

Ejaaz:
from none other than thinking machines themselves.

Ejaaz:
They're working reportedly pretty closely with Bridgewater Capital,

Ejaaz:
which is one of the biggest funds in the entire world using their Tinker API to fine-tune models.

Ejaaz:
So the long story short is this model isn't meant to be remarkable on its own.

Ejaaz:
It's meant to be taken by you, whether you're a startup founder or a hobbyist

Ejaaz:
or whatever that might be, and fine-tune it to do the specific tasks that you can do.

Ejaaz:
If you end up doing that, you end up with a more powerful model that is less

Ejaaz:
generalized and more specific than a classic anthropic or open AI model.

Ejaaz:
And it is way, way cheaper than if you use any of these other generalized models.

Ejaaz:
And as we've spoken about on yesterday's episode and a lot of episodes recently,

Ejaaz:
actually, cheaper models might actually end up being the models that are used

Ejaaz:
more than the intelligent models themselves.

Josh:
Yeah, I think this is a really interesting angle. And I'm excited to see that

Josh:
this is the way that they're going. They're not trying to compete with the frontier

Josh:
labs. In fact, to use their own words, they said, it's not the strongest overall

Josh:
model available today, open or closed. So they're very much aware that they are not on the frontier.

Josh:
The interesting thing is addressing this common concern that we see talked about a lot.

Josh:
If you remember, there's this viral clip on CNBC a couple weeks ago with Palantir CEO Alex Karp.

Josh:
And he was describing how close frontier tools are too expensive.

Josh:
And they have very somewhat murky IP protection where you kind of feed these

Josh:
models. your contacts, and then perhaps they go off and use them to train new models.

Josh:
And what Thinking Machines is doing is basically building this infrastructure

Josh:
for you to build and own the IP custom to you. And I think this is the interesting

Josh:
thing where when you think about monetization for a company like this, they raised $2 billion.

Josh:
Now they're just giving away their technology for free. That's the reality to

Josh:
an extent because this model is open source. You can actually go and download

Josh:
it and use it for your own, but they have this platform called Tinker.

Josh:
That's meant to hyper optimize these models specific for your use case with

Josh:
a much less amount of data than traditional models would.

Josh:
So traditionally, these models need like terabytes of data in order to go through

Josh:
this reinforcement learning process and to become hyper specifically good at a certain task.

Josh:
This model and using this Tinker product, you're actually able to feed it a

Josh:
lot less context to get a very specific outcome.

Josh:
So if you want to train it to be a financial wizard, like Blackwater was perhaps

Josh:
doing, or if you want to train to be a professional private chef,

Josh:
if that's what you're doing.

Josh:
It requires a lot less context and you could kind of mold it to the form that

Josh:
you want specific to you and i think that's a really powerful thing this is

Josh:
mostly focused on consumer and enterprise but very specific use cases for it and i think this is a,

Josh:
novel angle in the sense that a lot of the frontier labs their general purpose

Josh:
you go to them with any question you want and they will answer to the best of

Josh:
their abilities generally better than everyone else but this lab will allow

Josh:
you to do a very specific answer

Josh:
with a very low cost using open weight models without any potential leaking

Josh:
of any of your intellectual property.

Josh:
And I think that's a pretty novel use case and really cool to see out of the

Josh:
Thinking Machines team.

Ejaaz:
I think an obvious question to come from this as well is how were they able

Ejaaz:
to achieve this? Well, I'm pleased to say that I think the Chinese are getting

Ejaaz:
a little taste of their own medicine.

Ejaaz:
What I'm showing on the screen here is in order to train this model,

Ejaaz:
thinking machines used DeepSeq's V3 architecture.

Ejaaz:
Now, if you've heard of DeepSeq before, it comes from an AI lab in China,

Ejaaz:
funnily enough, a hedge fund that built their Chinese model called DeepSeq.

Ejaaz:
And it uses this architectural mixture of experts. I'm not going to bore you

Ejaaz:
with the details, but basically, you can have a really large model and only

Ejaaz:
utilize the necessary parts of the model when you're answering a prompt.

Ejaaz:
It's way more efficient.

Ejaaz:
It's way more cheaper. And it allows you to customize it way more.

Ejaaz:
That's how they were able to pull this off.

Ejaaz:
And it's kind of nice to see this reverse distillation. And I say that justingly

Ejaaz:
because, obviously, all the Chinese models are open source.

Ejaaz:
But moving on, Miro Morati is my favorite topic.

Ejaaz:
Mira Marathi's former boss has been up to some good and some no good.

Ejaaz:
If you watched our previous episode earlier this week, you'll know that Sam's

Ejaaz:
in a bit of hot water right now.

Ejaaz:
The big boys at Apple are suing Sam and OpenAI for stealing hardware trade secrets

Ejaaz:
to build their new AI hardware device.

Ejaaz:
And a question on Josh and I's minds was, what on earth is this device?

Ejaaz:
Josh, Maybe we have some light now. Can you give us some details?

Josh:
Oh my God. How many times have we spoken about this on the show?

Josh:
We got to be approaching like double digits now. This is probably the 10th time

Josh:
we've talked about this freaking device.

Josh:
We still don't know what it looks like. I am so desperate to know.

Josh:
I've never wanted to hold a product in my hand so bad in my entire life than

Josh:
I do want to hold this Johnny Ive OpenAI collab device.

Josh:
And it of course has not come without its troubles. They are currently experiencing

Josh:
lawsuits. I'm wondering if those lawsuits have impacted the trajectory of this

Josh:
suite and family of products that they're going to launch.

Josh:
But we do seem to have somewhat of a close confirmation to what the very first

Josh:
device in this family of devices will look like and when we'll actually be able

Josh:
to get our hands on it now mark german who

Josh:
some people might know as the apple leaker he is kind of the guy who you go

Josh:
to when you want to know about leaks he has very reliable sources he is generally

Josh:
right when he publishes these things for his publication i think he works with

Josh:
bloomberg i'm pretty sure that's where he publishes all of these and

Josh:
we have an idea of what this looks like and drumroll please it is coming in a form of a speaker.

Ejaaz:
Which is interesting.

Josh:
It is described as a screen-free smart speaker that will act as a new type of

Josh:
home computer for the AI era.

Josh:
So it's screenless, which is important to note, but it's certainly not senseless.

Josh:
The idea is that it will have a camera plus these environmental sensors, probably like light.

Josh:
It'll have microphones. It'll have a rechargeable battery, which I found interesting

Josh:
because that means that this will be a portable device.

Josh:
And then, Ijaz, I was asking you about this yesterday, is, does that mean that

Josh:
it's going to be something that fits in my pocket? Like, is this the puck?

Josh:
Or is this going to be, I think, of the Amazon Echo, like that little...

Josh:
Little block that sits on your desk and you could kind of carry it from room

Josh:
to room. I'm kind of now hypothesizing of what this is going to look like.

Ejaaz:
Well, the secret is revealed in this tweet from Mark Gurman and none themselves.

Ejaaz:
He says, as one of his first descriptors of this device, that it's a mobile device.

Ejaaz:
And the idea, if you open up this article and read through it,

Ejaaz:
is he talks about this device being somewhat portable.

Ejaaz:
It's meant to live in your home. It's meant to ingest and listen to everything

Ejaaz:
that is said, the conversations that you have, you can also speak to it.

Ejaaz:
But the goal, the stated goal of what OpenAIR is trying to build here is,

Ejaaz:
A companion, a companion that can sit by your side, that you can speak to,

Ejaaz:
that sounds very human, that understands the work or tasks or goals,

Ejaaz:
whatever you're trying to achieve for that day and over a set number of days,

Ejaaz:
and it can work productively with you.

Ejaaz:
Now, a big question for me is, how different is this from just opening up the

Ejaaz:
ChatGPT app on my phone and speaking to it?

Ejaaz:
And I think I've answered my own question, which is, it is quite different.

Ejaaz:
There is a big delta between having a device that is omnipresent,

Ejaaz:
that is ambient, that listens to everything you say, that can chime in when

Ejaaz:
necessary, like a real human does, like a companion or an advisor or a mentor does,

Ejaaz:
versus having something that is a little more archaic, manual,

Ejaaz:
that you have to trigger when you think of it.

Ejaaz:
And I think this kind of like jump going from kind of like manual devices where

Ejaaz:
you have to click buttons, swipe and go to the specific app versus having this

Ejaaz:
omnipresent artificial in terms.

Ejaaz:
It's funny. It's like I'm describing like the Terminator plot right now.

Ejaaz:
And I'm listening to myself and I'm like, oh, God, like maybe this isn't good for us.

Ejaaz:
But I get that that's where we are moving to. Now, of course,

Ejaaz:
all of this is really exciting to see.

Ejaaz:
But if there is a massive Apple lawsuit looming over their heads,

Ejaaz:
there are grounds for this potentially being delayed. Now, the target date is

Ejaaz:
early 2027, specifically February. Sam wants to ship around 100 million units initially.

Ejaaz:
Josh and I are probably going to buy up 50 million of those units.

Ejaaz:
But the point is that this is going to be really in demand, but it might get

Ejaaz:
delayed to later on in the year if Apple has grounds for them stealing secrets.

Josh:
I really hope not. The reports look like it's going to come out at around $200 to $300.

Josh:
And you have to imagine if they're building a hundred million of these,

Josh:
a couple hundred million of these, it's going to be a fairly simple design.

Josh:
There won't be a ton of moving parts. There won't be a lot of moving pieces.

Josh:
This will kind of be a solid machine is my assumption.

Josh:
If I know anything from my obsession of Johnny AI, his design.

Josh:
Entire goal is to reverse the damage that has been done through the smartphone era in the sense that

Josh:
smartphones have taken so much of our lives away from reality and they've placed

Josh:
them into this digital world and i know he is on a mission hell-bent on reversing that

Josh:
and part of that is removing the screen but the second part of that is trying

Josh:
to make the experience more human and i think we got an early release version

Josh:
and look at this with the new chat model from chat gpt

Josh:
on how conversational it is how it feels very warm and friendly and i expect

Josh:
this to very much be an extension of that

Josh:
in a way it's kind of converging on the voice models and miramirati miramirati's

Josh:
like tinkering model where it will kind of build up this context window about

Josh:
you it will be able to be your personal assistant and allow you to remove yourself

Josh:
away from the matrix that he has,

Josh:
created such a large amount of through his hardware devices almost unintentionally

Josh:
and to me that's super exciting and i cannot wait to get my hands on it in early

Josh:
2027 so we will be keeping our eyes peeled any more rumors you know we're going

Josh:
to talk about it because we can't help but talk about it this is like the 10th

Josh:
time but that is the update on the open ai device coming soon.

Ejaaz:
I i will say that um apple is planning to at least announce their ai hardware

Ejaaz:
devices plural by the end of this year so they might just be doing this whole

Ejaaz:
lawsuit thing just to to front run them.

Ejaaz:
And I know that Apple is working on, I believe, some kind of a disc pendant,

Ejaaz:
AirPods with cameras, as well as some smart glasses. So I'm excited to see these

Ejaaz:
two honestly go at it because the end benefit is us. We get to buy a bunch of

Ejaaz:
cool gadgets and hopefully wear them every day.

Ejaaz:
Moving on to the next topic.

Ejaaz:
Elon Musk, surprise, surprise, is in a bit of trouble.

Ejaaz:
Now, he has this product called Grok Build, which is basically their Claude Code competitor.

Ejaaz:
It is Grok used specifically for coding and building different apps.

Ejaaz:
And some people leaked that XAI's Grok Build CLI, so their API basically,

Ejaaz:
or their front-end interface, was taking people's code,

Ejaaz:
uploading it to private servers for SpaceX AI and then using that data to train new models.

Ejaaz:
Now, if you've ever been in this model game for a while, personal data,

Ejaaz:
privacy, and encryption are incredibly important.

Ejaaz:
Anthropic and Open AI take this very, very seriously because,

Ejaaz:
of course, you want to make sure that they're not taking your personal information

Ejaaz:
that you're imparting to these AI models and using it for nefarious ways or

Ejaaz:
taking advantage of them.

Ejaaz:
Grok, or rather SpaceX AI and Elon were caught doing this And they had to do

Ejaaz:
a lot of damage control, which ended up being, a few days later,

Ejaaz:
them open sourcing the entire Grok build.

Ejaaz:
They apologized and basically said, zero data retention policies are super important

Ejaaz:
where we don't retain any of the data. And if we do, we will be upfront.

Ejaaz:
You can turn this off in settings, but it sounded like it was on by default,

Ejaaz:
which is the warning part.

Ejaaz:
But in order to retaliate, they've said, we've open sourced this entire product,

Ejaaz:
take it, fine tune it, do whatever you want with it, and see the code yourself

Ejaaz:
and see that we're not taking any of your stuff.

Ejaaz:
It's a bit of a roller coaster for them. I'm glad they're being able to do damage

Ejaaz:
control, especially as like Elon is like hurling insults to his enemy at Sam

Ejaaz:
and OpenAI, which arguably haven't done this yet.

Josh:
I respect it. It feels like the early days of Facebook, the move fast and break

Josh:
things where they're just going balls to the wall, full speed.

Josh:
If they make a mistake, they correct it. And in fact, I feel like they really

Josh:
even over-indexed on correcting it.

Josh:
They open source everything and they had zero data retention policies.

Josh:
They really went like fully locked down, almost Apple status,

Josh:
where now there is zero data that is going to cross the line.

Josh:
I think this is going to prove to be a very unique advantage.

Josh:
When you think about the Apple edge, a lot of it has to do with guaranteed privacy of data.

Josh:
And if Grok is going to be the only person who is going to provide that guarantee,

Josh:
that is a huge benefit because remember, they have the cost per token down about

Josh:
as low as it gets. They're on the frontier in terms of cost per intelligence.

Josh:
And now if they have privacy baked in, that's a very compelling product that

Josh:
I think is noteworthy to watch.

Josh:
There is a second bit of news about elon and it is about elon not about his

Josh:
company spacex not about tesla

Josh:
but about elon musk the individual who just acquired a company himself for an

Josh:
estimated one billion dollars which i found interesting i was like why is

Josh:
elon the person acquiring this company

Josh:
and i mean surprise surprise it's an energy company named apr energy.

Josh:
And they are a Jacksonville fleet of trailer-mounted mobile gas and diesel turbines.

Josh:
Why on earth would he want to buy this?

Josh:
Well, it's because they have a gigawatt plus of capacity. And to buy a gigawatt

Josh:
of capacity for a billion dollars, it turns out that's a pretty good deal.

Josh:
And as we know, Grok has these Memphis data centers. They have Colossus 1,

Josh:
they have Colossus 2, they need to spin them up.

Josh:
And one of those big constraints has been power. And we've seen how much in-demand

Josh:
power has been in the ability to deploy quickly through companies like Bloom

Josh:
Energy. We've talked about Bloom Energy a lot on the show.

Josh:
Their stock has gone basically vertical recently because they are one of the

Josh:
few people who can modularly deploy energy to these data centers quickly.

Josh:
This company that Elon bought now is able to stand up these projects in about

Josh:
15 to 30 days, which is really exciting because these grid interconnection queues

Josh:
to tap into the mainline grid normally take a couple of years.

Josh:
So this really shrinks that time to get energy to the data center by like a

Josh:
order of magnitude and i think that's a really big deal so this is exciting

Josh:
it was kind of under the radar it didn't get published

Josh:
anywhere it was just kind of discovered through these filings that elon had

Josh:
made the purchase and i think it's a testament to how fast they are moving they

Josh:
need power elon's going out he said i'll get you a gigawatt myself he bought

Josh:
it they're going to deploy it in 15 to 30 days they're going to bring way more gpus online

Josh:
and that's a testament to the velocity in spacex ai so again really bullish

Josh:
news like keep an eye out on them they're they're making their way up to the frontier very quickly.

Ejaaz:
The problem Elon's solving with this is he has way too many GPUs to the tune

Ejaaz:
of like 1 to 1.5 million of all the latest NVIDIA GPUs, but he has no means

Ejaaz:
of bringing them online.

Ejaaz:
The actual wait time to get your GPUs hooked up to the energy grid is around five years right now.

Ejaaz:
And New York City, or rather New York State, this week became the first state

Ejaaz:
to pause or ban data center development and it's following a trend of a few other states.

Ejaaz:
If this continues to happen, workarounds like this, like acquiring companies

Ejaaz:
like this to get portable gas turbines and powering your GPUs may be the only way to work around it.

Ejaaz:
And the important part about this, why is this important at all,

Ejaaz:
is you need compute at the end of the day to build the best models.

Ejaaz:
We've seen Meta release MuseSpark 1.1, which isn't quite Frontier, but is pretty good.

Ejaaz:
And you've seen Grok 4.5 be able to compete with the big boys unexpectedly.

Ejaaz:
And the way they've been able to do this is because they've acquired so much

Ejaaz:
compute, but none of your GPUs make sense. They're worthless pieces of metal

Ejaaz:
if you can't power them up in the first place.

Ejaaz:
One thing I will say is we've spoken about Bloom Energy a lot on this show.

Ejaaz:
Leopold Aschenbrenner, who runs one of the biggest AI funds,

Ejaaz:
24-year-old kid, has made a big investment in Bloom Energy.

Ejaaz:
This is their direct competitor. And Elon just went out and looked at Bloom

Ejaaz:
Energy and thought, I don't want to have to deal with this. I'll just acquire

Ejaaz:
the company themselves and integrate them into what I'm doing here at SpaceX AI.

Ejaaz:
And I think it's an incredibly smart move. Now, moving on.

Ejaaz:
Yeah, there is a popular product that I believe both of us like to use quite

Ejaaz:
a lot called Whisperflow.

Ejaaz:
And the way that that works is instead of typing prompts, it takes a lot of

Ejaaz:
time, you can tap a button, hold it down on your laptop or on your computer.

Ejaaz:
And you can speak into a microphone or speak to your computer and all your words are recorded.

Ejaaz:
And it has been a major unlock for me. Voice to AI is just the way forwards

Ejaaz:
and I honestly can't see anywhere else where it doesn't result in that.

Ejaaz:
Now, this guy, Farza, released a new product from his company that is called

Ejaaz:
Screen Aware Dictation.

Ejaaz:
Now, one problem that I have when I hold down the button in Whisperflow and

Ejaaz:
I speak into it and it records exactly everything that I say is,

Ejaaz:
I'm also thinking in real time.

Ejaaz:
I'm like, oh, I want to say something in a tone that is kind but not too assertive.

Ejaaz:
And I want to talk about this topic. I don't know the definition of this topic,

Ejaaz:
but I need to do some research on that. And if I was using Whisperflow,

Ejaaz:
it would record everything I say verbatim and put it in that email.

Ejaaz:
With this new feature, it listens to you, it understands when you don't understand

Ejaaz:
something, it goes away, does the research, comes back and formulates the reply

Ejaaz:
or the response that you want.

Ejaaz:
And it's this massive jump up where you now have this feature which kind of

Ejaaz:
like simultaneously listens to what you want to say exactly,

Ejaaz:
also understands when you don't want to say something or what you don't know,

Ejaaz:
goes away, does the research, pulls all the context from your personal files

Ejaaz:
that it's connected to, and then comes up with the perfect response.

Ejaaz:
You can literally say, hey, I want to create a Google slide deck that is to

Ejaaz:
do with this document that I have on another screen or another tab.

Ejaaz:
It'll go away, research that, come back, and put that into a very well-presented

Ejaaz:
slide deck. So it's a really amazing product or feature. I've been using it a bit this morning.

Ejaaz:
I think he got overloaded since he announced this literally under 25 uh 24 hours

Ejaaz:
ago and it's got like 3 million views but um i don't know i just want to highlight

Ejaaz:
this feature because i think it's it's really cool

Josh:
Cool yeah i'm excited to give it a shot this feels like something that like

Josh:
open ai can release tomorrow and kind of

Josh:
knock off the the grid and call it a day i think this is a

Josh:
thematically interesting project though because again everyone is really trying

Josh:
to collect the context if you think about what thinking machines released they

Josh:
are just collecting context so that they can give you a custom tailored experience

Josh:
the open ai speaker that is probably going to be coming out its job is just

Josh:
to collect context about you and to then customize your experience same thing

Josh:
with this so much of the ai story now is kind of pivoting to context because

Josh:
the more an ai understands about you understands about your preferences the

Josh:
better it can serve you and this is another interesting example of it i saw

Josh:
there's a few other kind of rapid fire points that we can get through the next

Josh:
one being deep seek is preparing an ipo which is kind of crazy

Josh:
um that's going to be interesting to talk about,

Josh:
are there any interesting talking points with this ipo or is this kind of a

Josh:
rumor you guys do you know.

Ejaaz:
Um it's it's kind of an unofficial confirmed thing at this point a lot of the

Ejaaz:
main investors have kind of been like referring to this ipo and referring to

Ejaaz:
this new raise the reason why this is like compelling news is

Ejaaz:
they literally raised i think 15 billion dollars a week and a half ago

Ejaaz:
so as soon as that round closed they've raised yet another round that values them at like almost

Ejaaz:
one and a half X higher than they were before.

Ejaaz:
And now they're touting the IPO rumor, which you know, they're going to join

Ejaaz:
cheapu and a bunch of other Chinese AI companies in that public race.

Ejaaz:
Another interesting fact is the founder

Ejaaz:
Liang Wenfeng of DeepSeek owns around, I think it's 94% of the company,

Ejaaz:
which means that his net worth is roughly around $26 billion,

Ejaaz:
making him one of the most wealthiest AI CEOs out there.

Ejaaz:
This random guy from China who was a hedge quant fund trader literally about a year and a half ago.

Josh:
It's insane. Good for him, man. He's doing well. And then with that,

Josh:
I think that is pretty much all the news for this week. That's it.

Josh:
Yeah, we got it all covered.

Josh:
It's been an eventful week. There's a lot going on.

Josh:
It's amazing. I'm always surprised at how every week we can sit down here and

Josh:
somehow manage to find so many topics that are interesting to talk about

Josh:
the just frontier and the world of ai and technology is moving so rapidly so

Josh:
if you've made it this far through the episode thank you for watching if you've

Josh:
listened to the three prior episodes this week which i encourage you to do so

Josh:
we had some pretty interesting ones

Josh:
one was about the gpt 5.6 release the other one was about open ai getting sued

Josh:
by apple and the third being about um why the price war actually matters and

Josh:
we referenced that episode quite a bit about how the new frontier is kind of

Josh:
being battled on price instead of intelligence

Josh:
so those were all really great episodes if you enjoy this one

Josh:
please do not forget to share with your friends and if you did make it through

Josh:
all of that congratulations you're caught up you can go touch grass enjoy your weekend

Josh:
and yeah each has any final parting thoughts before we head out for the weekend.

Ejaaz:
I want to know what people are doing on the weekend. Are you using any of these models?

Ejaaz:
What are we tinkering with? You know, pun very much intended.

Ejaaz:
We, I think 90% of our content this week has been about new models.

Ejaaz:
There's OpenAI releasing literally three different models of three different modes.

Ejaaz:
We've got all these new open source models and they're super cheap to use.

Ejaaz:
So I'm wondering what you folks listening to this are tinkering with.

Ejaaz:
What are you doing? What are you building? What are you doing with these models? Are they even useful?

Ejaaz:
Are you still just kind of like ignoring all of this and using Fable 5 or GBT

Ejaaz:
5.6, let us know in the comments, DM us.

Ejaaz:
And the final thing I'll say is we are on the lookout for sponsors.

Ejaaz:
Limitless has spun out. We are officially on our own. We're keeping the lights on through our own.

Ejaaz:
And we would love to partner with someone that has a product or service that

Ejaaz:
they feel incredibly passionate about and want to share with our audience of

Ejaaz:
users who love to use these different things. So if that sounds like you,

Ejaaz:
or if there's a friend that sounds like that, please reach out to them, reach out to us.

Ejaaz:
Our email is in the description below. You can DM us on X or wherever we are.

Ejaaz:
And yeah, we'll see you on the next one. You're all caught up. Yeah.

Josh:
Awesome. Well, have a great weekend, everyone. See you next time.