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The Grind, hosted by business entrepreneur Eric James, is a talk show about local business professionals, entrepreneurs, politicians & people of interest, that chose to bet on themselves & embraced the daily hustle that we call the Grind.
#TheGrind, channels the stories behind successful individuals by exploring their ideology of what it takes to manifest a successful business in an ever changing economic, pollical and social media environment.
Announcer 0:00
This is a KU NV studios original program.
Wesley Knight 0:04
The content of this program does not reflect the views or opinions of 91.5 jazz and more the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, or the Board of Regents of the Nevada System of Higher Education.
Eric James 0:14
Good morning and welcome to the grind. I'm your host extraordinaire. Mr. Eric James. What is the grind? Simply put, the grind is a half hour conversation that speaks to local business entrepreneurs and explores their take on where our local economy is heading, and asks them to tell us their own story of the sacrifices and work ethic that it takes to have a successful business. All right, folks, we're back. We're back again. Good morning. Good morning. Good morning. Hey, it's a beautiful Sunday morning, and we got something different for you all this morning. So, and you might hear me talk a little country, because our guests today a little bit from the hood, or, as they they say, in the country, in from the cut. And so we got some special guests. Normally, I have three guests on the show, but today, because our guest is a unique individual, along with his beautiful wife, in her own right, she's a dynamic individual. I have the current attorney general for the state of Nevada, a Ron Ford. I want to say that right, because everybody says Aaron, but I think they really supposed to say a Ron Ford and and his beautiful wife, and she hibernates her name, so I want to make sure I get this right, but Berna Rhodes Ford, and I have them as my guest today, and I think we're going to have a fabulous show. And I want them to just knock it out the box. I just want them to be real with us. Tell us who they are, not what, just what they do, but who they are as people, as parents, as family members, as community members, I want them to express to you and to us today everything about what it takes to be successful in our current environment and in political arena as it is, because, you know, that is not an easy arena to be in these days. So I give anybody credit that can pull that off and keep their sanity and not put, you know, so it is. So welcome to both of y'all today. Y'all looking fabulous, and I, you can't see me right now, but I got my black cowboy hat on, so I'm gonna put it on, messing with my headset microphone, but because both of my guests are from Texas now, yo folks, you know like, so I'm gonna talk a little country. Yep, we we'll be about Queen Bee and her cowboy Carter, Beyonce, cowboy Carter album and other things. So we don't get to know them on a personal level and bypass all that rhetoric and yakyak talk you here on the talk radio shows and on the on a TV and this and that, we're not going to be partisan today. We're just gonna talk like fam, like people, like we had a family reunion in the barbecue. I think I could smell some ribs cooking in the back, if I'm not mistaken, already got the ain't a chitlin first. And so, you know that's more south. So you know, we'll keep it a little bit more west coast, since I'm born in here, raised in Nevada. So Aaron and Bernard, welcome to the show. Thank you for coming on. I think we're going to have a good time. So I'm going to start with the ladies first, because that's just out of respect. I'm going to start with Berna. I got some questions for you, Berna, I know. Tell me about Tyrell. Is it Tyrell? Terrell, Terrell Texas. Tell me about Terrell Texas, because when I looked it up, population last census was 17,500 now I'm not saying Vegas is a big city, but good God, we a little bit bigger than and then 17,500 So growing up, what was it like? I mean, did you have a one room school room? I'm saying it can't be that many kids up in the town, and I'm assuming, and again, my mama taught me never to tell a woman's age. You're old enough that the town may have had a few less people than it did. Now, okay, we're gonna put it out there like that. Well, you know, we ain't teenagers. So growing up couldn't have been a whole lot. It was a small town where the aspiration to come to get to where you are today. You know, tell me a little bit about
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 4:04
your childhood. Well, I think I had an amazing childhood. And first of all, I will say, yes, there has been a census or two since I've left home, but we have 14,000 when I grew up there. And there was only one public high school. There was also a Christian school with probably 100 people in it, but I graduated with 167 people, so we had more than one room for the school. It was now understanding that I grew up in a decade right after segregation, so my hometown was divided by railroad tracks. Black people lived on the south side of the tracks, and the white people lived on the north side of the tracks.
Eric James 4:45
They call that H Street here. Oh,
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 4:48
yeah. So, I mean, that's literally everybody grew up together. So growing up was if I was walking down the street, you know, everybody knew me. Everybody knew who I was. So I enjoyed. Well, I don't think I enjoyed it at the time, because everybody knew your business. So in fact, I had I acted up in class one day, and I looked up that evening and my teacher was driving up in my driveway. Yeah, so let's just say I never did that again. But it was so small that everybody knew you it takes a village mentality. It takes a village, and it was a good village back when people weren't afraid to tell other people's children if they weren't acting
Eric James 5:27
right, so everybody knew if you was getting a whooping that day. Oh, bernadon acted out at school. Mama, Oh mama, driving up teacher at the house. You next day. Everybody talking conversation the backside, because I grew up when a principal used to still paddle you. Oh, Yeah, same here, absolutely folks don't know I went to Western High School back in the day, and the principal still had a paddle when I was in high school with with holes in it, with the holes in it, and they would still put it to your backside. And I also went, and I forget the name of it now, but it was for your folks that are from Vegas. It's right by seven C's. There was a little Baptist School slash daycare, and they would get the switch from the tree in the back of the daycare and put it to you. So it's a different generation, and what what some of these younger folks are dealing with right now? They didn't believe in mental health. Mental Health was getting them chores done and getting that backyard and your room clean so. So tell me about you attended a Texas let me make sure I have my notes right. You went to SMU right? Is that correct?
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 6:37
Southern Methodist University? That's right in Dallas and so
Eric James 6:40
not too far. Because my understanding is Dave was only about 3032, 32 miles from your your hometown. So, I mean, you was close to the big city. But as a kid, of course, she wasn't making that trek. I'm sure maybe on a Friday night. As a teenager, maybe we snuck away and got got out to a party someplace.
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 7:00
I grew up coaching. None of that happening. We ain't
Eric James 7:02
trying to put all your business back out there, but we might get a call, or somebody call and say, Yeah, I seen her at that party. She was turning it up a little bit. But so you moved to the big city, went to the University. What? What was the transition for you? What was it like going from that small and I'm not saying you had a small town mentality, but it's different, as you said, growing up in a small town, to transition to a major university, and that has to be a major leap. And then, of course, after that, you went to the University of Texas, so even larger, from my understanding, even larger school. Basically, you scaling up. Tell me what that transition was like for you.
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 7:40
Well, SMU, so SMU was, like I said, 32 miles away from home, and unfortunately or fortunately, whichever, however you look at it, I went home almost every weekend. So I had a good college family, but I also still had my family, and I went home every weekend. I mean, it was just adapting. I was 18 years old. Just never even thought about, really the differences I knew, because, again, my hometown, most wouldn't probably, probably call it diverse, but it was a it was a mix of students. So it was a mix of students at SMU, a lot less people who look like me. And so we formed a community of students. And this was back in the day when, I think was it Wednesday night, when, or Thursday night, when? The Cosby Show in different world, Thursday night, we all, nobody had TVs. We nobody could afford TVs in their own dorm room. So we would go to the lobby of one dorm, they were called dorms in our residence halls, and watch the Cosby Show in a different world, everybody and everybody else knew, do not come in here and mess with this TV. So because we were all in the same place, all together, you know, just doing what we did. And so we had a sense of community, and I got involved actively, you know, within different organizations at the university. So it was a great experience for me, how
Eric James 9:01
did you know you wanted to or what? What was the point that you knew you wanted to
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 9:05
be a lawyer? Well, I was in third grade, and I heard of this man named Thurgood Marshall that was on the Supreme Court, and I said, I want to be a lawyer, and the rest was history. I if I want to do something, I go for it and I do it. If y'all
Eric James 9:17
don't know who thurwood Thurgood Marshall is, little history lesson. He's an important figure in in world history, United States history, and African American history. So decided third grade, you want to be a lawyer. What? What? How did you decide what type of law you wanted to be on? I mean, because, because most folks think of lawyers, and we got on every every billboard, every advertisement, personal injury, lawyer, this lawyer, heavy hitter, this dude, that dude, data, the Panda, the dog, you know, what? What you know? That's when first thing a lot of times that comes to people's head, because it's just so common. What? What made you decide what practice you do? What is it that drives you?
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 9:56
Well, interestingly, even though Thurgood Marshall was really known for silver. Rights I did not go into civil rights work. The thing about being a lawyer is your first job dictates what kind of work you do. You can try to steer yourself toward a particular area, but it's a lot of this is a job offer you received, and that's what you do. But my career was very my trajectory was very different because of this man I married. And so I ended up, before I was even finished with law school, having to move to DC, ended up working on Capitol Hill, and then moved with him when he worked on his PhD. So worked, started working for a judge, and then transitioned that to working for a federal judge here in Las Vegas. So my career was kind of all over the place. By that point, I knew I did not want certain work I didn't want to do, and by that point, I had decided I wanted to do employment law. Well, I've
Eric James 10:53
seen Now you talked about your husband, because we're going to get to him, so we still talk about you, but he got five degrees and looked like he went to like, 25 colleges. You had to follow him all over the place, over the place. Every time you start getting your feet wet on something he talking about, whoa, we packing up the van and moving to Beverly Hills, you know, right? And they moved to Beverly. See, that's old school reference. Y'all. You can catch that on YouTube or something like that, if folks and I know what we're talking about, but so you're moving around. You're finding your place in the world as a young African American woman, which, again, that, in and of itself, is a challenge, but now you've tied your wagon to this young man here, and he's got these aspirations. Because y'all, y'all, you know, y'all got that Michelle Barack vibe going on over here. You know, y'all got that glow about you, you know, but he's got these aspirations. Now, I don't know, at what point, you know, you decided, maybe politics was in your veins or whatever, but there was a trajectory for both of y'all. So at what point, how did you decide whose direction we were going, because every marriage, or every every relationship is a partnership, and at some point you got to decide, we going right and left, you know what? Let's make a decision together, or where did the directory? And how did we end up in Las Vegas, from Texas to DC to, you know, everywhere else that y'all have been, and you end up in Vegas. How does that work?
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 12:20
Well, actually, when we were dating, we met a man named jawanza kajufu, and he was at a conference at Texas a&m, which is where my husband went to college, and he asked us about our dating and all of this, and one thing he said is that make sure you live your lives in a way that you never live to resent each other, and so because of that, we have always supported opportunities for the other. So sometimes we move for him, a lot of times we move and sometimes we move for me, and but we don't ever want the other to forego opportunities or to miss out on things because we don't want the other to resent. So we've tried to live our lives in a way such that we support each other and uplift and
Aaron Ford 13:08
build each other up. And frankly, I'd use a different you
Eric James 13:16
ain't talking. We get to you. Don't worry, I got some good questions for you too. Okay. Okay, so Ernie you AKA, you know, go ahead, do your shout out to your people. Oh, well, I'm not gonna
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 13:25
ski wee because I might burst some eardrums. But to all my aka 1908
Eric James 13:31
All right, get the shout out there. Now we know there's some famous AKA, Martin Luther King, Kamala Harris, Coretta Scott King, Rosa Park, on and on and on, absolutely, much respect to the ladies, much respect to everything they've accomplished. So now we gonna get down, back down to this family thing. How does it work? How does it work in the family with two lawyers, How do y'all make a decision for the kids and stuff? Do Is there an argument? Do we have a debate? Is there a trial when we putting a kid on restriction. Do we? How does that work? You know, is, do we got to get a jury of the other the other siblings account as jury? How did two lawyers figure out how to make a family work in this world? Well, the
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 14:13
discipline issue and the raising issue was actually probably a big we always struggled over that like he Well, because I had a very strict upbringing, he not so much, and so we kind of disagreed on some of the things that our children would do. So I mean, we just figured it out, and one person won. I mean, sometimes he I'll say I'm putting one in air quotes, sometimes I won, but I mean, ultimately, we just figured it out. We tried to do what was best for our for our sons, and I think they've turned out, okay, okay,
Eric James 14:45
so what's the aspirations for the kids? Because y'all didn't set the bar pretty high. You know, my parents had a seventh and eighth grade education, but there was no question, and it wasn't the greatest household in my you know, I've said it on the radio. I'm pretty much an open book that way. Nobody. It can never hold anything against me. My father was abusive. Man took a shotgun to his head when I was 23 my mother died when I was 26 so I had to figure out a lot of things my own, but I took from what they said and tried to go to next level, graduate UNLV economics and join the military when I was above things, but y'all have set a pretty high bar. What is it that your kids see, or the aspirations, or how do you manage them, feeling like, am I going
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 15:26
to be enough? Well, so our children are enough, and they know they are enough and we are not their measurement. They are their own measurement. We have always raised our children in a way that they know they are wonderful, they are amazing. They can do anything they set out to do, but they don't need to judge themselves by us. And so we really just always encouraged and supported them with whatever it is they want to do, and they know they're amazing and awesome, so they can do whatever they want to do, but we are not the measurement, okay?
Eric James 15:54
But they do, they still do them chores. And we got a mate.
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 15:57
Oh no, they do chores.
Eric James 15:59
They do chores because that's my kids. I get up in the morning. They sleeping in I'm like, what? How does this work? My father would have woof. He was up at 6am I was up at six. My kids be looking at me like they crazy. All right, so Mr. Ford, we're gonna get to you. But oh, you know what? I have one last question for you. Burner, what'd you think of Beyonce cowboy Carter album because I'm more of a Rainer Roberts type of person.
Burna Rhodes-Ford, Esq. 16:23
I'm just tell you, I'm not being from Texas. I am not a country and western person. I do like a little Patsy Klein every now and then. But I loved it. There were so many messages in cowboy Carter and about patriotism, and it doesn't just belong to one group of people. Patriotism can belong to all of us. We are America. Just so many messages. I loved cowboy Carter, right?
Eric James 16:51
We're gonna get the queen bee her props, but listen to some Rena Roberts, okay, all right. She could put it. She could throw it down, especially to my my favorite one is lil get raised, right? Lil get right. Okay, all right, Mr. Ford, now I've known you, and I'm pretty sure it's going on close to 20 years, somewhere up in there. We served on the urban Chamber of Commerce Board of Directors together way back in the day, trying to do some things for the community. What you probably don't know is I used to serve on the governor's board under Brian Sandoval, among 20 other boards that I've served on. And I'm currently serving on the VA rep board, helping veterans housing initiatives, among other things. And there's been Workforce Investment Board and V and goodwill of Southern Nevada, among other things. But your career, I mean, it's impressive from just an individual standpoint, to a lawyer, plus now your position with the state and everything coming from Texas, A and M that opened in 1976 state, first public institution. You've made it a long way, because, you know, I've been to Galveston, Texas, and ain't that much up out there, and even now. So your journey has been inspirational. I mean, you graduated. You have five degrees. Who does that? I mean, come on, stop. It wasn't for his wife. Yeah, you making the rest of us look bad. I got a degree in economics, feeling pumping my chest out like I did something on Tuesday, and you like, that was Tuesday. I already got, I already got this done. How did, how does that? What drives you?
Aaron Ford 18:23
Yeah, well, 1876 when the and then was founded, and it's, you know, it was an interesting experience for me, and it's my experience there partially is what drives me. But before I do that, I just got to go back, and I think offer a different analogy for me and my wife. You said that she hitched her wagon to me, frankly, I consider us equally yoked where we are pulling the wagon together, okay, right? The fact is, we are, if you know what equally yoked means, it's, it's, you know, horses have have those yokes on their necks, and they pull the wagon. And she and I have been walking together side by side the entirety of our relationship, whether it's orphan or girlfriend or as a married couple, and that's how we've decided where to go, right. I can't turn left if she wants to turn right. Equally yoked means you got to be going in the same direction, right? And to her point, it's never been a competition. It's always been about going in the right direction, right, and figuring out how to ensure that both of us can be professionally satisfied and beyond professionally satisfied, just satisfied, generally with life. And so I want to throw that out there, because I think that's an important message for a lot of folks out there understanding. And this isn't about her following me or me following her, although we did do that like quite literally. But the fact is, we were equally yoked even at the time we were doing that. So anyway, I forgot your
Eric James 19:42
question, what's aspirational to you? Because, oh yeah, getting up. I mean, you guys had the first African American owned legal shop in Henderson, which is there you're groundbreaking. Then you went on to your current position, groundbreaking. Now you're even setting the bar even higher low. Looking at the governor's mansion and what in the morning gets you up and says, I need to conquer this next mountain.
Aaron Ford 20:06
Well, you know, what's interesting is my motivations have shifted over years. Frankly, you know, when I was at Texas A and M, my motivation up into a particular point was to not return from the neighborhoods I grew up. I grew up in, in Dallas, right period, two miles west of Terrell, Texas. Tell me a little
Eric James 20:24
about that. I mean, I mean, I had one of my guests, my one of my guests couple months ago, very successful. Tell me how he got shot on the radio, how he got shot when he was 15 years old. I mean, if you come from a neighborhood and that drives you, either you turn into the neighborhood, or you turn the opposite of the neighborhood,
Aaron Ford 20:42
what was the distinction? For you? Look, there were several neighborhoods I didn't we didn't stay in many neighborhoods, I mean, in the same neighborhood for my for my childhood, but all of them were difficult neighborhoods, so to speak. My high school life was such that I had a neighbor a couple couple doors down for me, who got arrested for still in the school bus. He was how and crack when he did it. So that was one of my one of one of my classmates, you know, around the corner, cater corner to me, were two twins who were selling dope, and they got murdered for selling dope in the wrong neighborhood, right? I have a friend who lived cat, according to me, who later in life we learned had been undiagnosed as a schizophrenic. He ultimately murdered his father. And so these are the types of experiences, you know, obviously not the later in life murder of a father, but these are types of experiences I grew up with and did not want to go back to right. And so transitioning from what I call tough times and tough neighborhoods to Texas a&m was, was, was an effort to move forward and to improve my opportunities. But on a particular day at Texas A and M that will always remember, June 29 1993 is the day that my trajectory changed. My focus changed, and it was not on having myself go backwards, but to ensure that I could move forward, because on that day I became a parent.
Eric James 21:55
What was this? What day again? June
Aaron Ford 21:56
29 1993
Eric James 21:59
I can't even remember my kid's birthday, you let them know the day that I became a father.
Aaron Ford 22:03
Well, it's interesting, you would Well, it's interesting, you would say that, but, but that day, I was a junior in college right afterwards, and I became a parent, and six months later, became a single parent. And so my focus became when ensuring that my son would have a father figure that was a little different than mine, you know, rest of soul, my father did the best he could, you know, and my folks divorced when I was 10, and my motivation was ultimately to try to be a good father for my son and eventually become what I think I have become, which is a good
Eric James 22:28
husband to my wife. Talk about that later. Yeah, we're gonna put all the dirt out. There's a family show,
Aaron Ford 22:37
but my family has quite literally been the motivation for me to ensure that we continue moving forward, right? And, you know, running for office was motivated because that son I had in college was cracking a joke about me moving him to Nevada, which was ranked worst in education in the nation, and he said, How is his best for the family? Right? He was joking, but it was something I took seriously, right? And that's what encouraged me to run. The first time I ran the second time for re election because we were talking about an economy that wasn't working for folks, specifically my children. I wanted to come back when I got through a college and he said, no jobs. Excuse my colloquialism, but that's what he said, right? And the third time I ran for this particular office I'm in right now, for attorney general, was another E word, one of those e words I learned in the SAT prep class, existential. I viewed, I viewed what was happening at the White House as an existential threat to people who look like me and others who have aspirations to to improve their stations in life. And so I ran to ensure we had someone in the AGs office that was going to push back and stand up for the constitutional rights of everybody. I know this sounds wonky, but you asked me, what motivates me, and these are the answers. This is, this is what it was. And now, as you've indicated, I know we're not on the political show. I'm running for governor for comparable reasons, ensuring we have someone taken
Eric James 23:46
care of. Yes, so I'm a firm believer. We're all products of our childhood. Do you think the neighborhood that you grow up in, seeing as you said, somebody steal, steal a school bus because they were on crack or anything else that? Do you think that is part of that motivation to now, given your current position, that drives you to make certain changes or make those as you're saying, you get up, you have kids, you have aspirations. You want the world to be a better place for them, but for yourself, because we all carry scars. If you've gone through some tough times, do you think those things is what keeps you grounded in it? Because, which I won't know this morning and when I rolled up, you know, there was a car next to me, and I was in, you know, I have a decent car, you know, normally ride my old truck, but to have my Camaro, I rolled up, and they, two people are sitting in a standard vehicle, and then Mr. Ford gets out, and most of my guests, especially if they're more higher end, they're, they're riding in the luxury car they're riding. There's a humbleness about about you and how both of you carry yourselves, given your statures or given your positions in life, there's, there's a certain humbleness and that I can respect, because sometimes people lose touch of where they came from on the way to getting to go where they're going. So if you lose chuck for where you touch of where you've been. It. How do you help the folks that are left behind you? And I think, and I'm not speaking, because this is not a political show. I'm a registered Independent, you know, I'm a business owner and this, but I see something in people that's one of the things I'm good at. And I can see that humbleness about both of y'all, and I think that's what I want to convey for you to people, even though we're on the radio and people can't see your faces, even though we're doing some filming here in the office. I want people to know that there's a humbleness about both of y'all, and I respect that greatly, and I want you to know that
Aaron Ford 25:29
well, thank you, man. I appreciate that. And you know, I'm gonna offer you a quick story, because that humbleness part is absolutely part of my life, intentionally, right? I mean, my earliest memories. I tell this story all the time, but my earliest memories are having to eat stale candy bars for dinner. My dad worked at it was called Safeway. It's like the Vons down the street here by UNLV. It was called Safeway. He worked at the grocery store lining up fruits and vegetables. Was throwing away some of them at the end of the day because they were ro next to the dumpster was a big box of candy, all types of candy, Snickers, Nestle, crunch, almond, joy, watching my colleagues score bars, s, k o r, I came to find out later in life that he brought it home, but it was next the dumpster because the store was throwing it away. It was stale and they couldn't sell it, but the boys got to eat. So my dad bought home this stale candy, and then for weeks, we ate, until that box of candy was empty, right? And to this day, my favorite candy bar is a score bar, s, k, O, R, my wife would testify to this. Is that on my nightstand right now, I keep a score bar at my office at work, both in Southern Nevada and Northern Nevada. I keep a score bar on my office, at the desk at home, I keep a score bar. It's the first thing I say when I wake up, last thing I see when I go to bed. I said, all day, do out all day, throughout my work day. And it's a reminder of where I come from, purposely so that I don't get too big for my britches, and I can remind myself of who I'm working for those who are less fortunate, who come from more you know, difficult times and different difficult circumstances, and that's part of what drives me to do what
Eric James 26:53
I do. Okay, so now, no, we're running short of time, so do my engineering, but they need to know who you are as a person, if people will follow somebody. I was in the military, and I always said there's somebody ranked above me and there's somebody ranked below you, once you get a little rank, and you got to be able to lead and you got to be able to follow if you're going to be successful in the military and with you, I wanted people to know how you lead and how you follow, because then people can know whether or not they can follow you, and that's what we're trying to convey. But we had a couple we got a couple minutes left. Tell me what is it that as a governor, you want to give to the people
Aaron Ford 27:31
in Nevada? Yeah, look, I think Nevadans deserve to have someone who's going to look out for what I call the entirety of the Nevada family, everybody, not just some folks, everybody should have the ability to depend upon in the government, pardon me, to rely upon, or to have faith in, a government is going that is going to help them get to the next level, not one that's going to hinder them. In my experiences are such that, you know, our current administration isn't doing that, and so, you know, I'm looking to help address the issues of affordability. Right now, we're hearing about everything's too expensive. I've spoken to folks all across the state, rural counties, urban, suburban talk to men and women, to Latinos, you name it, and that's the story. And so as governor, look to address those issues that they've said to me are those that want to be addressed.
Eric James 28:15
Okay, well, that you have the right mindset. I think you have the right mentality. You dang sure got the right education. You've got the wife the back you the backbone of the household is always the woman the house. I know you're a son, you have two younger brothers that help also to make you a strong family man, and you seem like you're a strong father. So I just want the best for both of y'all, and I just want to make sure that we see what we need to see in the next governor. If that's the case again, I'm not saying one side or the other. I think people need to vote their consciousness. Times have changed. Times are hard, and times can get worse. If you don't think times can get better, they can definitely get worse. So you've got to speak your mind, speak your conscience, and make sure that you're heading in the right direction and following or leading in the right way. So I want to thank both of you for coming on the show today. I think Wesley that we're just on time here, and I really appreciate. I'd love to have you guys on further. I wish we had more than a half an hour to share with both of you, because I had a lot more questions, and I think there's a lot more stories that we can tell, but I did, I do appreciate I've enjoyed the time with you folks, and thank you for being on my show. Thank you for having us. All right. Have a good day, everybody. Joy. Make sure you get that played after church and peace out. Hashtag the grind. Hashtag the grind. Hashtag the grind. Thanks for listening to the grind again. My name is Eric James. We hope that today's show was two parts entertaining with a dash of education. Feel free to reach out to me at my office at 702-836-0953, and remember to always stay on your grind. You.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai