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This is FERMAT Fridays, your backstage pass to what’s going on at FERMAT.
Join us every Friday as we chat about what we're cooking up, the strategy behind it all, and of course our general musings.
Expect juicy insights on new features, our latest experiment results, and whatever else is making waves in our world. Whether you're an existing customer or just a little FERMAT curious, this podcast will keep you up to date and entertained.
Alex McEachern (00:01.164)
We are back with another customer for Mott Friday this week. I'm excited. I got Max Langlois, who is the head of growth at DOS and also the founder and CEO of Hype 10 joining me. Max, welcome to the show.
Max Langlois (00:16.368)
Thanks for having me, Alex. Excited to be here.
Alex McEachern (00:19.148)
Amazing. So I think it's best for these conversations, maybe with just kind of like a quick overview of you and maybe a quick overview of dose because we're going to be talking about that today. It just makes things a little easier in the conversation if people kind of know like what you sell kind of what the price point is so that people can kind of figure out okay, is this is what he's saying relevant to me.
Max Langlois (00:41.488)
Sure. Yeah, that sounds good. Yeah, so I'm the founder and CEO of Hype 10. We're a performance marketing agency based in New York City. I'm also fortunate enough to also have kind of a secondary job, which is leading up the acquisition side at a supplement brand called Dose. We sell functional wellness shots. We really like to actually more so say it's like a liquid supplement, which is focused on need -based
items, so for instance, cholesterol, liver, immunity, soreness, and skin. So we have a pretty small assortment of focus in terms of our SKUs. And our price point is at $90 for one time purchase. And then naturally we have a subscription offer as well because we are keenly focused on getting people to subscribe on the first order. So yeah, it's a bit about us.
Alex McEachern (01:40.396)
Amazing. And in terms of kind of like who your target market is, so if people are kind of like paying attention, like skewing kind of older, younger, who are you generally going after?
Max Langlois (01:51.408)
Yeah, generally our age demo is a little bit older. We naturally focus a little bit more heavily on our hero skew. And for that particular skew, which is liver as well as cholesterol, generally speaking, the percentage of people in the US populace struggle with elevated liver enzyme levels as well as cholesterol issues as they age.
It's kind of like a 45 degree angle. If you're to look at the percentage of the population that struggles with those two items, it just naturally increases the propensity to have those issues as you age. What's intriguing is that on the liver side of things, the target addressable market is actually growing in large part because of the consumption behavior patterns in the U .S. I think we're all keenly aware that the American diet is not great.
And so what that causes is a lot of excess fat to build up around your arteries, which then leads to struggling liver function as well as, you know, issues with cholesterol as well. so right now, you know, our general target demo is like, I would say, you know, 40 years plus, but the percentage of people that struggle with elevated liver enzyme levels, as an example, in people under 18 was never a thing.
And over the course of the last 10 years or so, now about like 10 % of kids under the age of 18 now have excess liver fat. So we'll see how that develops in decades to come. But for right now, it's predominantly focused on an older demo. And it's agnostic with gender as well.
Alex McEachern (03:36.78)
Gotcha. So low skew count around a $90 price point, mostly marketing to an older demo, but we that is broadening over time, where before it was a little bit more narrow. All right. So Max, you are the founder of an agency. You also are sitting in the growth seat for a direct to consumer brand. What's kind of like on your mind before we get into maybe like for Ma and talking about that, like
Max Langlois (03:46.096)
Yes, that's correct. Yeah.
Alex McEachern (04:02.988)
What's on your mind right now challenges opportunities as it relates to kind of like the growth and acquisition play for direct to consumer.
Max Langlois (04:10.832)
I mean, I think everyone kind of, what I have to say here is probably very similar to how most others are feeling in that, the traditional toolkit, is constantly evolving in this space. and you know, I'm, I'm going to steer towards for Matt since we're here, but you know, I think there was 2022 and 2023. It became abundantly clear that the media buying tactics of the past,
we're no longer going to generate the growth that was desired of brands. And so the focus squarely turned towards creative and depending on who you're talking to, a lot of people are testing loads of content, right? Upwards of a hundred pieces of content at scale on a monthly basis and trying to validate different messaging angles and all of these different things.
Where before, for being blunt, in 2018, 2019, and even 2020, we were maybe launching 10, 15 new ads on a monthly basis. And it was more so optimizing the spend and implementing different tactics from a media buyer's perspective. And so now the way that I see it is kind of the massive awakening of the additional lever on the post -click experience, because it's a lot more scalable naturally relative to an ad unit. Now...
You know, when you do find that one winning app, you know, it can really carry your ad account for six months to a year before it really starts to fatigue. And that's amazing. And can have a really profound impact on a business. But, you know, if you can unlock 10 to 15 percent gains in that conversion rate that you're seeing or, you know, unlock five to 10 percent improvement in terms of the percentage of people that are subscribing on your first order.
You know, it really changes the unit economics and the potential growth trajectory of your business. So, you know, originally to add more context to that, I launched the agency in 2020. So, or 2021 rather. So in 2021, our one service offering was paid media management. And then we had to basically tack on creative starting last year.
Max Langlois (06:31.472)
because we recognized that we were losing opportunities to other agencies and often times our conversations that we were having with our brands on our book of business was kind of capped to a certain degree because we were necessitating them to handle one of the most important pieces of the pie. And then now, you know, we basically offer landing pages as well and we work with Firmat on a consistent basis across the majority of our brands as well. So...
Alex McEachern (06:48.172)
Yep.
Max Langlois (06:59.024)
So yeah, it kind of shows the trajectory in terms of where we're prioritizing our focus over the course of the last couple of years.
Alex McEachern (07:06.956)
I love that the like focusing on creative and basically going from like, Hey, we can base, we can maybe have 10 to a hundred. And like something we talk a lot about here is building funnels the same way that you build ads. And like the way to win on like the ad creative side of things is to constantly be experimenting, building new things, trying things out and like, not just, let's change this or change that. But like, you probably see this a ton too is like, okay, let's go after a different value prop. Let's maybe try a different demo and like,
If you don't actually take it all the way through the funnel and you're just experimenting at the creative level, then like you can potentially have it fall off pretty significantly. Like to your point, getting an extra 10 to 15 % out of the post -click experience can be game -changing, especially when we know that the life of like something that crushes on the creative side, it does have a shelf life. Like very rarely can you find an ad that is just gonna carry you for, I don't know, let's say more than a quarter.
Max Langlois (08:03.728)
Yeah, that's exactly right. And, you know, I think one of the things, like what I like to say to clients or prospective clients is when this conversation comes up, it's like on average, somebody is spending four to five, potentially top of the spectrum, seven seconds interacting with an ad unit. And yet they're spending the average session duration across our book is probably like a minute and 45 seconds. And most...
e ecommerce brands out there are spending all of their time and attention and focus on an interaction of seven seconds and completely ignoring, you know, a minute and 45 second interaction with their brand and prospective customer. So it seems hyper logical and it's kind of comical when you phrase it that way that more people aren't testing landing pages and funnels on a more consistent basis. But yeah.
You know, to your point, there are so many different use cases for, for the format, you know, funnel building and, like PDP by box experience where you can validate different messaging angles and test different tactics that, you know, it's become one of our go -tos in terms of an additional tool in the toolbox, you know? and in today's environment, the more tools you have, the better off you're going to be.
Alex McEachern (09:27.02)
I love that. And without sounding like super creepy, I was taking a look at kind of like what you're doing on the acquisition front over at DOS. And like one thing I did notice is you are you are practicing what you preach here. Like there's so much variation in terms of where you are sending the post click. Like I've seen you guys go to PDPs, to custom landers, to from to the homepage. Like maybe would you mind giving our listeners kind of like how you think about that post click? Like what makes you send it?
to one place versus the other? How do you kind of like experiment and decide like, yeah, we're going to keep doing that or we're going to cut.
Max Langlois (10:04.848)
That's a good question. I think like one of the...
One of the notions is that people will kind of direct, like, take the same ad unit and then direct it to do a redirect test and be like, which has a stronger conversion rate? And they're not accounting for the fact that like CPMs and CPCs are also going to be impacted by that post -click experience because naturally Meta and Google are going to crawl that experience. And so there's kind of this...
priority and focus on that one particular metric and it is not painting the full picture, right? And so one of the things that I like to do is think about things from a ad unit perspective relative to that post -click experience. And so a great example of that would be kind of thinking through the lens of
how educational is this ad unit? What questions are left with somebody experiencing this ad unit for the first time? And how much education is happening in that post -click experience? So the most basic way of thinking about that would be a static ad unit cannot be as educational as a video ad unit, right? It's not possible. And so...
What we oftentimes find is that a static ad unit generally performs best when it goes to a hyper educational, like listicle landing page. Right. So, you start to find trends. It's not going to be universal across the board, but like that is one trend in particular. So generally speaking, I like to direct a lot of our static ad units to the listicle landing page that we've structured, you know, set up with you guys as an example.
Max Langlois (11:55.824)
And then, you know, outside of that stuff, we test, landing pages, just like we test ad units. We have an ABO structure and anytime that we have a new landing page that we want to validate and test, we don't necessarily do a redirect immediately. We want to get a baseline understanding of how people are interacting with that particular funnel, before kind of moving it into that. Okay. There's, you know, so like step one, ABO structure, put some spend behind it.
reach a point of statistical significance so that you can start to interpret the results of it. And then the next stage is like, okay, does this warrant redirecting to our current hero top performing page? Right? And we've started to leverage y 'all's analytics tool in the forever links to take that next step when it makes sense, which has provided us with a baseline understanding so that we can actually compare things apples to apples. So that new rollout has been absolutely incredible.
Alex McEachern (12:53.868)
Yeah, well, Max is referring to their forever links. For those that don't know is basically the ability to remap these experiences. So once you have a forever link in place, you can change the destination even for an in market ad. And we've also just recently rolled out forever links v2, where you are actually able to split that destination between a Vermont funnel or Vermont experience and then kind of like that business as usual. So with Max is saying there is like, hey, let's send some of this to the business as usual.
funnel and let's have some of this go into the Vermont funnel and actually be able to have the apples to apples comparison. Cause like, if you try to test this by having one ad going somewhere, one ad going somewhere else, or even just at like a regular split, like things, like you said, it's not necessarily apples to apples, but we're trying to get as close as we can to that experience.
Max Langlois (13:41.608)
Sorry, I should have added that context.
Alex McEachern (13:43.628)
All good, all good. Max, I was wondering if, so you mentioned that listicle and I actually like, I think what you guys are doing is really smart with like all the additional learning, especially since the product that you guys are selling, like it obviously has a routine component to it. Like you guys are trying to get consumption long -term out of this. And I think having that more educational piece to it is like super important.
but to some listeners might seem a bit kind of like, I don't know, not the way like, I, if I got the click, like I want to try to just move someone to purchase like as quickly as humanly possible. But with this experience that I'm going to show right now, it's not necessarily that we have a lot of paths to that, but you're also presenting a lot of information. So I was wondering if we could kind of like go through this and maybe you could kind of give like your thoughts on like, Hey, why is this, why is this set up this way?
Max Langlois (14:40.72)
Sure, that sounds good.
Alex McEachern (14:42.412)
Let's do it. And for those that are listening on podcast players, this will also be available on YouTube if you want to see kind of like the walkthrough that Max and I are gonna be doing. But I'll do my best to try to give an explanation of everything.
Max Langlois (14:58.096)
Awesome. Sounds good. Yeah. So this is basically just a classic listicle. Five reasons why. We have tested different verbiage above the fold there, trying to go after different value propositions. This is kind of the most on the nose that we could find. And it basically was validated in the bounce rate that we saw from this particular page. So, you know, pretty self -explanatory there.
CTA, this is the classic kind of structure that you guys have in place for your listicles. And then as we scroll down, what we see is, well, I guess I should also reference like the discount that you see that's referenced not only in the announcement bar at the top, but then also in that first CTA that you see above the fold. Both of those are for 25 % off, which is our current offer for that of subscription. Naturally, if you're a subscription focused brand, you want to incentivize people to select that option.
because it really changes the economics from an acquisition perspective. Then we have call out of review count, and then we have a couple of different logos here, PopSugar, BedNut, et cetera. And then we start to actually get into some stuff here to validate that original headline. And so one of the unique parts about this SKU that has been amazing, and whenever you're talking about a supplement,
Right. If you have clinical studies that actually validate that this thing works, it puts a lot of people at ease. you know, even when you have those clinicals, you'll still get comments on your ads claiming that this clinical doesn't have enough people in it or, you know, tell me about the research component that went into this, all of this stuff. Right. So people have, there's a large barrier to entry from a supplement perspective. If you can't validate it with the scientific backing.
Alex McEachern (16:25.164)
Yep.
Max Langlois (16:49.968)
And so we are fortunately in a position where we can, you know, kind of speak to that directly. And so, you know, if you recall the original headline here is, you know, geared towards people who have like elevated liver enzyme levels. And then our clinical first value proposition of that listicle is speaking exactly to our findings from, from our clinical study. Right. So everything is, is geared towards validating that original headline. So people are moving through that.
So yeah.
Alex McEachern (17:19.756)
I love that. And as we scroll through here, like we're, we keep on referencing that original headline, the clinical studies ingredient lists, like I'm just going to scroll all the way to the bottom for a second, just to give people kind of like the breadth of how much information we have in here. and then we can talk about some of these other things, but like a lot of additional information here. And again, like some people might be thinking, okay, am I taking away from pushing someone to a purchase with this? But if we are trying to build a routine and like you said,
trying to get a subscription, which we'll talk about in a second. Like this is necessary information because if you're gonna subscribe to something, it's not gonna be a knee -jerk purchase. Like it's gonna be a considered purchase. And I love how you guys have structured this. And again, every single one of these CTAs as I jump through, like at any point, I can jump straight into the PDP. So like as soon as that person has enough information or enough context, they can kind of jump straight into here.
Max Langlois (18:16.56)
Yeah, that's exactly right. I mean, I think it's also like, you know,
It depends on the vertical, right? Not every single product that you're selling is going to necessitate this amount of information and education to a potential customer. But as it relates to a supplement brand like Dose, it's a prerequisite, right? And so, yeah, what's been amazing as well is the ability on Firmat to basically, you know, A, B, test different experiences as it relates to this buy box.
Alex McEachern (18:29.836)
Right.
Max Langlois (18:48.912)
so if we scroll down, like a lot of the testing that we've done is basically like, around these different value propositions that we have, how we have this messaging being featured. and you know, these are, are not new tactics, right? this is zero one -on -one, but to that end, what's been so awesome for, you know, in the case of FERMÀT is that we can test.
different small tweaks and adjustments as it relates to this buy box experience and set it up and get it running in a matter of minutes rather than having to loop in a designer and then having to get our developer to, you know, take a stab at it. And so we can have an idea and then validate that idea in a turnaround time that is, you know, exponentially faster relative to what we were doing in the past.
And then we take those learnings as well and can start to apply some of those things to our other landing pitches that we have that are more kind of traditional in nature outside of the firm experience.
Alex McEachern (19:52.716)
Absolutely, absolutely love that. And one thing I like to, as a user coming through here, all of that information coming to here, having the subscription be the default, but I feel like sometimes brands, this is like a, obviously you're going to have more subscription conversions if this is the default option versus one time. But I feel like a lot of people just kind of sneakily make it the default option. But the one thing I love about what you guys have done, that's not the case. It is the default.
but like this is clearly the subscription option with all the benefits listed of subscribing. And obviously you guys allow someone to get into a one -time purchase, but like this is the happy path of this entire funnel. And honestly, like the majority of your ads as well, focusing on kind of like the routine and building up like a healthy lifestyle.
Max Langlois (20:38.384)
100%. It's also, I mean, it is validated in our clinical studies. Right. So going back to the five reasons why somebody should subscribe here, it's, you know, our clinicals took place over the course of eight weeks. And it's not like, you know, you, you take this, this supplement once and you're cured of any issues. Right. And so we're very upfront, open and honest about that. And, you know, the natural intent of this brand is to try to help people with that are struggling with
You know, different health issues. And if they commit to this routine, we can actually support them in that endeavor. and so, you know, exactly right from a CRO perspective, naturally we have all the different value propositions and benefits of subscribing. and you know, when you do toggle on that one time purchase, this is a classic tactic as well. It's like, you know, there are no additional value propositions that populate there. So naturally we're gearing people towards that. I think like one of the most.
interesting aspects of leveraging FERMÀT added without, you know, providing too much detail here about like our numbers. But, the, from day one, the percentage of people that were subscribing from the FERMÀT pages was actually higher for first time orders relative to our existing post click experiences, the experiences that we were leveraging. And naturally that has a pretty substantial impact in terms of our allowable CAC right? So we can actually have a higher.
you know, CPA that we're seeing from the FERMÀT experiences when we're starting to account for the percentage of people that are subscribing because it's coming through at a higher, higher take rate.
Alex McEachern (22:16.14)
I absolutely love that. And just to go like even further funnel here, like if I am to add this to my bag, like the 25 % off that Max is talking about, this is just like ever present all the way through the funnel. Like you're getting 25 % off on that subscription all the way from, I mean, you might reference in the ad, you might not, but as soon as you hit that lander through to the PDP, the card experience always present 25 % off.
Max Langlois (22:41.424)
sure. Yeah, and then naturally you also see that we do have some upsells here for some of our other SKUs. We've got cholesterol and some of the other ones also being featured. So naturally trying to increase that AOV that we're generating as well.
Alex McEachern (22:56.844)
I love it. Before I jump out of the Format experience here, Max, anything else that you wanted to kind of like highlight from this that you think is a game changer or want to highlight for other people trying to like maximize that that post click experience?
Max Langlois (23:09.616)
No, I think, I think like reiterating that, you know, you can move so much faster on validating ideas when leveraging format. And that has been the case with those. So like we have a new, offering that we're pushing for dose, which is basically an access to a wellness coach. when, when you subscribe, right. So that people can actually kind of talk to a coach about.
Alex McEachern (23:32.843)
wow.
Max Langlois (23:38.544)
you know, their experience using dose, make sure they're sticking to a routine, talking about things ancillarily related to their health. and so like, that's one of the things that we have, it's been in the pipeline for a while, but now it's just about to come to fruition and you know, shout out to Sarah on y 'all's team. I just pinged her via Slack and she's like, cool, like it'll be ready by tomorrow. Right. so, you know, super excited for that one, that variation to come to fruition.
Alex McEachern (24:01.452)
Amazing.
Max Langlois (24:06.352)
And basically we're just tacking that on as one of the five reasons why in that listicle. And then as well, we've updated our card experience to have it be one of the value propositions when you toggle on subscription. And then we are going to basically leverage that AB redirect test that we were talking about earlier that, you know, you all now have available and I think you put it as V2 of forever links. So yeah, super excited for it.
Alex McEachern (24:35.66)
That's amazing. The coach experience to for the subscription side of things. And like we've kind of been hitting on it the entire time we've been talking here. But obviously you're having success, like encouraging a subscription, not, not only through this experience, but just kind of like through everything you're doing on the acquisition and growth front. Any kind of like top tips to other growth marketers that maybe aren't as established in like the subscription side of things. And they're trying to build that side of their business. Like any,
any words of wisdom for trying to generate more of those.
Max Langlois (25:11.312)
I, you know, it, it's so product dependent. I think I saw, I'm forgetting his last time, but Taylor, who's the, CEO of common threat collective, he was giving a speech to like, and he was comparing retention and LTV to like height and weight and like how you can have a large impact on weight, but can't have a large impact on your height. And.
Alex McEachern (25:23.388)
Taylor Holiday, yeah.
Max Langlois (25:38.672)
I think there are many brands out there that try to kind of push into subscription to improve their unit economics, but their product category does not necessitate subscription. They're kind of fooling themselves. so I think like honesty, you know, about whether it's a height or weight situation, you know, would be kind of my, my first take on that. Now, naturally, if you're in the supplement space, then deploying some of these tactics and also being, if you look at.
how we communicate with prospective customers across different touch points, whether that be ad units, post -click experiences, email welcome flow, et cetera. It's all geared towards that, right? Everything is about building the routine. So it's not just about having a higher percentage discount, it's about ensuring that every touch point that you're having with a prospective customer is leading them to take that desired action.
Alex McEachern (26:34.924)
I absolutely love that the height and weight. I saw that one as well. It's fantastic. I'll link I'll link it in the show notes so people can give that one a watch or a listen. But I think you're right. It is very product dependent. And I think like one one good piece of advice I got on subscription is like, OK, yes, it's better for the business, but you need to be presenting why it's better for the customer. And I think in a lot of product categories, you're kind of lying to yourself on like the benefit to the customer. And I think maybe it was Eli.
Max Langlois (26:38.256)
Awesome.
Alex McEachern (27:04.14)
that told me like, sometimes subscription is just like a handshake. It's like, yeah, you want to commit to this? Like we want you to commit to this. Like, hey, here's a better price. Like let's do this. But in the supplement space, like everything you guys are doing and like, if you go see any of any of the dose ads, like Max is even in some of them, really hitting on that routine building and like the longterm benefits, like every single touch point, like this isn't just like, let's drive someone to this landing page and then present a subscription. It's like,
We have put this thought in their head for like in every single touch point that you need to be committing to this long term. And then subscription just seems like it ends up being the happy path towards. Well, if this has to be an eight week thing, then I should subscribe to this because look at all these benefits, especially with the coach. My God, that's going to be amazing.
Max Langlois (27:48.784)
Yeah, we're super excited about it. And then what I would also tack on Alex is being mindful to not be so aggressive in your discount for subscription and kind of lose sight of how that's going to impact naturally your back and LTV. Many different skincare brands over the years have tried to mirror Lumen, if you recall. So Lumen's acquisition.
Alex McEachern (28:14.86)
Mm -hmm.
Max Langlois (28:15.696)
Gratty G for many, many years was hyper successful for them, but it was basically a free trial and then you're locked into a subscription. And I think some brands are so focused on getting that to be the case that they don't think about the customer experience after that fact. So they're just trying to acquire as many new customers as possible and hopefully the highest percentage into subscription as possible. But like my personal experience with women, and sorry, anybody who worked on that sees this, but
Alex McEachern (28:43.884)
you
Max Langlois (28:45.712)
I didn't recognize that I was subscribing when I took that free trial. I thought, great, this is awesome. I'll just pay like 15 bucks or pay for shipping or whatever it was at the time. And then I was locked into the subscription and my ability to cancel, I remember was an absolute hindrance to my day because I was like calling and emailing and all of these different things. So be open and honest with prospective customers and make sure that they're keenly aware of what's happening.
that they are in fact subscribing. Do not try to push them. I mean, one of the other things that I loathe is when you only have the ability to subscribe on a landing page, like talk about a way to infuriate people, you know, like, yeah, better for your unit economics as a business, but let's not try to, you know, fool people or trick people into subscribing just for the benefit of your.
Alex McEachern (29:43.18)
Yeah, that I think like, absolutely with like how steep of a discount or like how you're getting people into this experience because like the other thing too is that kind of becomes the like reference point going forward, right? Like if the subscription doesn't work out, well then like I value this at, well, it was free. Like it was so, it was so low friction. Sometimes friction is a good thing. And if it's too low friction, like you're just really setting yourself up to fail.
Max Langlois (30:03.792)
Yeah, 100%.
Max Langlois (30:09.04)
Yeah, exactly. And then if you too heavily discount, then naturally you're going the pixels are going to start to optimize to a different cohort. That's not going to serve you well in the long run. Right. So if you go to like a 40 % discount, right, like Facebook is going to understand that and be like, cool, like we're going to look for like, you know, steep discount choppers. Right. And naturally their LTV is not going to be as strong relative to when you were offering a 15 % discount on your subscription. So
Alex McEachern (30:20.588)
Yep.
Max Langlois (30:39.088)
You might feel great for that first week because you're like, wow, conversion rates up and we're getting more new customers. Exactly. Exactly. Right.
Alex McEachern (30:43.916)
That's what I was just about to say. Great conversions though, looks amazing.
Alex McEachern (30:50.732)
All right, Max, before I let you go, one question I like to ask all of our customers that come onto the show is how would you describe Vermont to your counterpart at another brand?
Max Langlois (31:02.939)
Yeah, I think I've probably regurgitated this a couple times, but I would say it's.
Max Langlois (31:11.376)
Let me see, let me see how I can phrase this. Okay. So it is a landing page solution that necessitates very little time to validate ideas and prove out theories for an e -commerce brand. And landing page friction is even with different builders that are available.
still quite high. And the user interface is so friendly that it doesn't actually even necessitate your team's help to go and build in there. After basically a 15 minute conversation with one of your team members, you can go and start tankering yourself, you know, within the platform. So I think that's how I would describe it. I know that you guys are talking a lot about like the funnel.
and how it's not just a landing page, it's also, you know, buy a box experience. It's also, you know, the initiate checkout experience, et cetera. And I think that that's probably the most eloquent way of putting it. It is.
It is the ability to completely change the post -click experience relative to your existing website and validate different theories that you might have very, very quickly. Hopefully that was a decent response.
Alex McEachern (32:40.908)
I love that. No, I love that. Like basically, basically what you're saying is, hey, it's a way to own that post -click experience and, but not only to own and to customize it, but to be able to experiment like at scale and quickly. I don't want to have, I don't want to have to have an idea and have it take a week to put into practice. I want to have an idea and be able to spin that up and not only see, is it working, but also be able to apply it.
Max Langlois (32:53.808)
100.
Max Langlois (33:04.656)
Yeah. And I mean, there are also so many limitations as we all know with, especially like heading into like, you know, August 12th checkout extensibility, it's coming to fruition for all Shopify stores. So like, there's a lot that can be done with the firm at shop experience that actually is kind of outside of that domain as well.
Alex McEachern (33:23.02)
true. I didn't even thought about that. We should talk about about getting right about getting ready for that one as well. All right, Max, this has been amazing. If anyone wants to follow along with you, you on Twitter, you on LinkedIn, anywhere where people can can get in touch.
Max Langlois (33:24.144)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Max Langlois (33:39.28)
Yeah, I'm a casual poster on Twitter. So come follow me, MaxLanglois3, I believe is my username. I'll post once every two weeks or so with a hot take and then disappear and then come back to we say, if you want to sign up for that, come on down.
Alex McEachern (33:54.316)
we'll get we'll get Max's Twitter into into the show notes for everyone as well as some of the other content that Max was referencing. But as always, if you're enjoying this content, make sure to subscribe to firm Fridays, and we'll see you all next time.
Max Langlois (34:07.472)
Awesome. Thanks Alex.