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NET Society is unraveling the latest in digital art, crypto, AI, and tech. Join us for fresh insights and bold perspectives as we tap into wild, thought-provoking conversations. By: Derek Edwards (glitch marfa / collab+currency), Chris Furlong (starholder, LAO + Flamingo DAO), and Aaaron Wright & Priyanka Desai (Tribute Labs)
00;00;00;00 - 00;00;20;03
Aaron
Another week. Another week closer to Marfa. You guys ready?
00;00;20;05 - 00;00;21;26
Chris
No, I haven't even booked my flight yet.
00;00;22;03 - 00;00;23;13
Pri
What? What?
00;00;23;15 - 00;00;25;02
Chris
I'm a little busy, you know.
00;00;25;05 - 00;00;30;21
Aaron
With your. What'd you call with your slave? But what do you call your AI systems class? Slave bots?
00;00;30;24 - 00;00;36;21
Chris
No, I call Curser slave. But I love my system. Cursors. The slave.
00;00;36;24 - 00;00;39;14
Aaron
Oh, man. I think that's all going to backfire on us.
00;00;39;14 - 00;00;43;04
Derek
Because I definitely think so. I think you gotta. You gotta watch your mouth, boy.
00;00;43;06 - 00;00;55;01
Chris
Yeah, yeah. Cursor down! Christoph! I'm running like the British Merchant Navy and my my production shop. Here you will shape up or you will ship out at the next port. Sailor.
00;00;55;03 - 00;00;58;19
Aaron
I'm picturing you like, what was that? Russell Crowe in that movie?
00;00;58;22 - 00;00;59;24
Pri
Have you? Actually, that's.
00;00;59;24 - 00;01;00;22
Aaron
Part of that.
00;01;00;25 - 00;01;05;12
Pri
Pretend like you are a merchant sailor in the British. Like, Navy.
00;01;05;12 - 00;01;23;10
Chris
I don't say that explicitly, but I will address them as chef. I will tell them to get their knees implausible. Like if I'm bored and like, I'm doing this, like, 12 hours a day. Some days right now, like, yes, I will totally put them in some job function, speak that lingo and Nagin talk shit to them.
00;01;23;13 - 00;01;25;26
Pri
You can make a coffee table book out of that.
00;01;25;28 - 00;01;38;08
Aaron
I really think we're going to see some like somebody streaming and coding at the same time. It'll be entertaining from the prompts to the outputs to everything else. I feel like that could be an emerging category.
00;01;38;11 - 00;01;44;11
Chris
It's certainly not in my workflow. You're going to need a performative vibe coder to hit the streams.
00;01;44;13 - 00;01;53;10
Aaron
I think you should do it ten hours a day. Live stream. Chris. You'll be huge. You'll be like the Hassan Piker of, of, vibe coding.
00;01;53;13 - 00;02;06;25
Pri
Dirty is a guy who does this. His name is Bhutto. She is like his YouTubes are wild, but like his discord. Like they kind of do these, like, live stream groups together. And just like, it's like tips, but also like building stuff together.
00;02;06;28 - 00;02;34;02
Derek
It's just slightly different, but along the same thread, we're doing something very similar. Glitch during our blocks week and Transient Labs is hosting this thing called Prompt Me if you can. It's going to basically be a live game show art competition where everyone is vibe coding, using transient labs. As you know, there's live audience participation voting. Ben Roy and aka Steve are the co-hosts and commentators and, it's the yeah, there's going to be one winner.
00;02;34;02 - 00;02;46;06
Derek
And, you know, the winner gets a couple of things. Plus the the acclaimed name of greatest artist of all time. So we're, we're doing something kind of like that at glitch this year during our box week, and it should be pretty fun.
00;02;46;08 - 00;02;47;25
Chris
Do I can anybody participate?
00;02;47;25 - 00;02;49;20
Aaron
Yeah, I want to do that Derek.
00;02;49;22 - 00;03;04;00
Derek
You you I think there's still a couple of slots left. There's a bunch of artists have already signed up Mitchell Chan, Vinnie Hager, Brian Brinkman, Dave Krugman DCA snow for his brother. Yeah. There's a there's a I think they may have a couple slots left. So if you're interested, I can put you in touch.
00;03;04;02 - 00;03;06;08
Pri
So bunch of legit artists and then Aaron I.
00;03;06;08 - 00;03;07;24
Derek
Think Aaron's legit.
00;03;07;27 - 00;03;10;26
Pri
Oh yes he is. But he saw like artist.
00;03;11;00 - 00;03;19;29
Chris
Aaron's too legit to quit. You kidding me? I put money on him over Brinkman. I mean, I can I can do it. I totally would probably the odds on favorite.
00;03;19;29 - 00;03;25;25
Derek
I think Brinkman is. Yeah. Low key sleeper for the victory here.
00;03;25;28 - 00;03;35;11
Aaron
I'm okay. I'm used to being the dark horse, so I'm just going to. I'm going to take take that and, and run with it. What is said Derek? What else is going on with glitch, by the way? We've got a.
00;03;35;11 - 00;03;36;09
Chris
Whole.
00;03;36;12 - 00;03;58;02
Derek
We've got a whole thing. I mean, a whole schedule that we just posted. There's a lot we've got, we've got a lot of activities that that particular activity is happening on Saturday. That's at 1:00 local time. But we've got I mean, we've got a bunch. So we've got we're doing a really cool exhibition at Chester Navasota to kick things off that, that first night, we've got a huge, huge country fair.
00;03;58;09 - 00;04;14;02
Derek
It's it's going to be kind of insane, actually, with at the most likes, an indoor outdoor exhibition. And there's a lot of, a lot of fun stuff that he's got planned there that he's doing that with transition as well. We've got, some hangouts with, you know, squiggle down as per normal. We've got our full set holder brunch.
00;04;14;02 - 00;04;28;16
Derek
For those that are full set holders, we we usually like to do this. This thank you brunch. For everyone that comes to Marfo. We usually get about 60 or 70 of our full set holders that come. We have this. Awesome. I don't know if you guys are familiar with this with this guy named Park. He's this object artist.
00;04;28;16 - 00;04;46;19
Derek
He's done a bunch of work for us and for for our blocks and, and some other projects that we've done. And he's putting his, like, Genesis artwork together. It's called Shadow Box, and that there's going to be a two show performance on Friday night. That's that's really fun with, a very acclaimed movement artist named Harriet Waghorn.
00;04;46;19 - 00;05;07;07
Derek
And then, yeah, we've got the big snow Pharaoh exhibition on Saturday night, which is, I think, going to be a a very fun experience that we've got, we've got it's going to be massive. It's like the only event in in Marfa that night. And I think we're expecting kind of the whole our blocks weekend crew to show up indoor outdoor.
00;05;07;07 - 00;05;24;28
Derek
We're kind of expanding the exhibition out to the outside this year. So yeah, it should be fun. I mean, I, I also selfishly just want to go check out other programing. There's so much good stuff I've seen come through on social this week, so I'm hoping to squeak out and and be able to kind of catch up on and catch a bunch of the stuff happening around town that we can.
00;05;25;00 - 00;05;30;02
Aaron
Yeah, it's going to be great talking about our blocks, I am pretty excited about Quinn, I think.
00;05;30;03 - 00;05;32;20
Chris
Oh, one more second.
00;05;32;22 - 00;05;35;21
Aaron
Oh, did I did I speak out of turn, captain?
00;05;35;22 - 00;05;40;10
Chris
Oh, no you didn't. Derrick, did you miss something when you were talking about all this programing? Oh, I.
00;05;40;10 - 00;05;55;20
Derek
Was listen, did. Chris, I was waiting for you to tee it up. I don't want to speak for for for you, but I am a star holder bull. And, we do we are doing something with Chris f but I. That's all I'll say. I'll let Chris share more if he'd like Derek.
00;05;55;24 - 00;06;13;05
Chris
No no no no, it's it's totally cool. Star holder me happens you do something right after that transient event. And so when Aaron walks out carrying what's his award here. Is you going to have a giant trophy? Is he going to like, get a t shirt. What does Aaron win for being the world's greatest artist?
00;06;13;06 - 00;06;17;26
Derek
You'll have to. You'll have to win to find out. So Aaron may or may not ever know.
00;06;18;00 - 00;06;42;00
Chris
I mean, I feel good about Aaron. I mean, I'm look, I'm, I'm putting my Usdc and Poly Market on Brinkman. Right. Brian's been doing this in, live comedy shows and performances for years, and so he's got the muscle memory. So I'm putting my money on Brinkman and in the prediction market. But I'm publicly rooting for Aaron. And I'm saying on this show that Aaron's going to win.
00;06;42;02 - 00;06;46;28
Derek
Wow. Okay. Geez, Louise. All right.
00;06;47;01 - 00;06;49;22
Aaron
As a bull, I'm ready for a bold prediction.
00;06;49;24 - 00;06;52;20
Derek
I didn't even Aaron wasn't even participating. Five minutes.
00;06;52;20 - 00;06;54;15
Aaron
Not even. Yeah, now I'm winning.
00;06;54;17 - 00;06;56;10
Derek
Now he's winning the whole damn thing.
00;06;56;13 - 00;07;09;05
Chris
Yes, he is, but once he wins and he basks in the laurels of his victory for like, four minutes, he's going to walk next door to the other side. Because at 3 p.m., I'm doing an event where I'm on retiring.
00;07;09;08 - 00;07;10;03
Derek
Let's fucking.
00;07;10;03 - 00;07;21;11
Chris
Go. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we've talked about this ad nauseum. I heard all my books are down there. I got 100 books sitting somewhere in your, your gigantic glitch party warehouse.
00;07;21;14 - 00;07;28;14
Derek
It's true. Steve has been, loading and unloading them, in the stores. They are there. I've seen photographic evidence.
00;07;28;17 - 00;07;49;28
Chris
Oh, for dude, man, having to schlep my books around, but I appreciate that. And so I'm going to do a little lecture because I know everyone loves the fucking lecture, and I don't even have time to prepare one. But I'm going to talk about complex adaptive media systems. Right. Which is what I'm building right now. And who knows if anyone's going to have any clue what the hell I'm saying.
00;07;50;01 - 00;08;06;22
Chris
Which is why I got to do, like, a little show and tell, and I'm going to bust out the apps that my slave bots have been laboring away below decks as we sail the seas of vibe coding. And I'm going to show off what the heck I've been building so that people can kind of get their heads around it.
00;08;06;22 - 00;08;21;18
Chris
And then we're going to take a little quick break and have some drinks. We're gonna have some food. And then, I think you're throwing me out back on a picnic table, and I'm going to sign 100 books for people for, hyper real hospitality. The special Martha prerelease version of the novel.
00;08;21;20 - 00;08;27;12
Pri
Best book ever. I actually think it'd be a great movie. Like a fantastic movie.
00;08;27;15 - 00;08;49;01
Chris
Thank you. Free. I really appreciate that. I do tend to write a little more cinematic. I think it helps keep me like I don't like to write like huge, long things. I like to respect people's time. I think maybe that also comes out and, you know, the the adaptability of what I, what I produce. Yeah, a lot of like the concepts in the novel are actually in the app.
00;08;49;01 - 00;09;11;26
Chris
And so like, I really wanted to pair the two together so that, you know, whoever makes it down and, and reads the book early, you know, I'm thinking, oh my God, this this shit's crazy. It's not even possible now. Like, you know, they'll they'll have a better grounding in sort of the system design I'm talking about because, yeah, I'll be showing off like the, the primitives, the early stage stuff with this.
00;09;11;26 - 00;09;21;19
Chris
Like, I feel like I'm, kind of been busy assembling the iceberg, and it just hasn't, like, tipped out of the water yet. Like, everything below the, the water line right now.
00;09;21;20 - 00;09;22;29
Pri
You're almost there.
00;09;23;02 - 00;09;26;27
Chris
Oh, I fucking hope so. Pre. I was up till 345 last night.
00;09;27;00 - 00;09;30;27
Pri
The funny thing is, is like, you're almost there, but you're also just getting started.
00;09;30;29 - 00;09;45;07
Chris
That's how it is with these things. That's like the, you know, if you're a builder and you're making something big, like getting it to public, it's like this huge relief. But in so many ways it's literally just the beginning.
00;09;45;10 - 00;09;46;07
Pri
You know?
00;09;46;10 - 00;10;04;18
Chris
And for me, like, I'm I'm literally showing off a prototype, right? And so, like, I actually have to go back and rebuild this entire thing after I'm done. Anyway, let's, let's not talk about, like, a crushing workload of, like, whipping I slave. It's below, below the decks of the star holder. Let's,
00;10;04;21 - 00;10;06;19
Pri
Have you use the term clinker at all.
00;10;06;21 - 00;10;09;22
Chris
No, no, no, I don't even give them that dignity.
00;10;09;24 - 00;10;10;27
Pri
It's too nice.
00;10;11;00 - 00;10;12;22
Chris
Now. Too nice? You kidding me?
00;10;12;24 - 00;10;17;10
Pri
Speaking of, I clinkers. Have you guys been messing with sorter yet?
00;10;17;13 - 00;10;19;23
Chris
No, I wish I could. Anyone else.
00;10;19;26 - 00;10;35;15
Pri
Yeah, I didn't get the invite code, but I've heard it's sick. I mean, people are shook up about it. Like it feels like huge progress. The irony. And I haven't actually watched any of this, but have you guys seen, like, the meta backlash on the thing that they came out with?
00;10;35;21 - 00;10;39;28
Derek
I actually I actually have not what was the backlash about?
00;10;40;01 - 00;11;08;06
Pri
It was like a meta release. Like, I mean, this is like on Twitter, but they like release that like video platform, that movie gen thing. And everyone just was like, okay, so now meta is just promoting slop and brain rot. And so I think people just sort of flipped out on it like that. It's like that what they called it vibes, that short form video feed of, I thought it was like pretty, pretty bad.
00;11;08;06 - 00;11;27;03
Pri
I can't remember if they like, ended up pulling it. I don't think they ended up pulling it, but like it just was a really flop launch. It's just funny to me that that kind of came out also on the heels of Sara two and the announcement of that open. I mean, it's like the Sora app too. In order to like use it, you need to download the app.
00;11;27;03 - 00;11;40;07
Pri
I haven't downloaded the mobile app yet, but the idea there is, I assume it's going to be something that's like TikTok like, but I, I generated I don't know if any of you guys dip your toes in either of those things.
00;11;40;09 - 00;12;01;01
Derek
I'm downloading Sora on mobile right now. I actually didn't realize I had access, but I will keep you guys posted. I'm excited to play around with it. What has been the feedback I've seen since some of these videos? They they're obviously like quite realistic and I know they have sound now. Are people enthusiastic about the the social network that it came with, or what's been the early buzz that you guys have seen?
00;12;01;03 - 00;12;19;17
Pri
I mean, this what I've seen is that it's mixed. I mean, you have the people who are just like, great. Another I saw generator and other people are like, well, I think it's it's hard because the tech is so profound that no one is actually talking, at least in my in my feed. Like, no, I'm not. As many people are talking about the social media aspect from it.
00;12;19;17 - 00;12;42;12
Pri
But what I have found interesting is people are tying that server up to world quite a little bit, and how the app could potentially tie into world. We actually talked about that on Metropolis today or excuse me this week. And the conversation was that the proof of human stuff on the saw AI social app could could be a wedge to integrate the two.
00;12;42;15 - 00;12;48;25
Pri
I'm not sure if that's like certain, but that was like some potential, you know, potential.
00;12;49;03 - 00;13;16;15
Derek
I have a thought. I have a thought on that, which is, so I definitely agree. Like for for social, let's just call it like social 2.0 what we know as like Twitter and Instagram and Snapchat, a lot of these products have become like quite unusable for not just like casual users, but like, you know, for all for even hardcore users who are even hurt, like, have, you know, really complex settings and are very granular with their control and how they operate on these things.
00;13;16;17 - 00;13;46;22
Derek
Given the fact that, like, you now have a gigantic bots that are basically just spitting out content and very quickly, and there's no real way to label them as like human or non-human. And so like, there's been this slow degradation of these products in general that like presumably proof of human can help solve. Right? Like if you have to become a verified user in order to basically post content, you're, you're, you know, separating the wheat from the chaff and you're only allowing kind of human beings to be able to participate in these networks, which I totally appreciate.
00;13;46;25 - 00;14;05;09
Derek
I'm on soil right now, so I just download it. I'm like scrolling through. It's like infinite scroll TikTok style or Instagram Story style. Like just you can flip through things very quickly. And the first thought that crossed my mind is like, that is not I don't I don't know if worlds and like proof of human is actually helpful for what I'm looking at right now.
00;14;05;09 - 00;14;33;16
Derek
Like, it's very clear that all of these videos are AI generated. It's very clear to me that, like the enjoyment that one could get from these videos that I'm scrolling through is not like verifying that the person that created it is real. I actually don't think that that's useful for the product that I'm currently using. This, this thing feels to me more just like an unhinged AI slop video based generator where like, you can have creative ideas flourish and like, the crazier the better.
00;14;33;18 - 00;14;58;09
Derek
And because you're kind of like not anchoring it in real world communications anymore. At least this is not the vibe I'm getting using this product. The role of like the human verified label around the content that I push doesn't feel necessary. Granted, I've only used this thing for 30s, but I can already tell you like my expectations for how world I could participate here is has like been, has gone, has swung in the opposite direction.
00;14;58;12 - 00;15;16;27
Pri
That's true, I guess. Like, well, what if you had a bunch of agents producing slop, like would you want to know if maybe you don't care? Maybe the end user doesn't care because you're just consuming the best content that the algorithm serves up to you. But would you care to know whether or not something that is AI generated was done by a human or by an agent?
00;15;16;27 - 00;15;20;22
Pri
Or does it? Is it just the quality of the content at the end of the day that matters?
00;15;20;25 - 00;15;44;12
Derek
Yeah, I mean, I think there's definitely times where I want to know if a human created something I'm looking right now at like a Sam Altman fake video, where he's like looking into, you know, the, into a window. And it's very clearly AI generated. And, like, he's doing funny things. I don't actually care whether or not AI or a human or an AI or a human.
00;15;44;12 - 00;16;10;04
Derek
Assisted by I made this. This is, I guess, the I guess the point I'm making is like there are certain thresholds of content where I think labeling human versus non-human not helpful or like, not even useful. And I don't know if the thing I'm looking at right now is useful for that. It could be useful for like verifying if somebody is making a Twitter post that's highly political and engaged and like trying to pass as authentic and real.
00;16;10;06 - 00;16;16;16
Derek
I just don't think like I'm now on a SpongeBob AI video. Like, I just don't know if that's useful here. Do you know what I mean?
00;16;16;19 - 00;16;17;19
Chris
Yeah, I think yeah.
00;16;17;22 - 00;16;34;07
Aaron
I think it's a great point, Eric. Yeah, that that's the feeling I got. You know, when you go to Twitter you want a mix of commentary and kind of news and absurdity works. And I just feel like I just felt myself like pausing when I saw some of those slap videos and asking myself, is this real or not?
00;16;34;10 - 00;16;50;09
Aaron
Which is just a feeling I think many folks are worried about, but I felt it kind of for the first time, so I don't know what the solution is to that problem, but it feels like it's going to be an emerging problem and you're seeing those OpenAI and meta kind of moving into this AI generated content and plus feed.
00;16;50;09 - 00;16;56;27
Aaron
And so it'll be kind of interesting to see where that lands, because it feels like the feed the feed mechanic is going to get an update again.
00;16;57;04 - 00;16;57;12
Chris
Yeah.
00;16;57;13 - 00;16;58;26
Aaron
Which is pretty interesting.
00;16;58;28 - 00;17;22;04
Chris
I think that's where like my head is at right now is not around the verification of authorship here, but the efficacy of the actual package. Four years ago, if Derek had seen Sam swirling around and, stability toilet, he would have chuckled. He might have even forwarded it to someone. Now, Derek doesn't give a shit. He's kind of shaking his head here.
00;17;22;06 - 00;17;51;23
Chris
You know, he's already negging the platform. I, I suspect we've gone as far as we can with the dopamine extraction from scrolling media. Single scene. Like, I'm going to say TikTok was the apotheosis of the feed and that to evolve this, we got to get into group play slop construction, and we need to do it in different ways than video shorts.
00;17;51;25 - 00;18;15;28
Chris
I think we got to get them immersive. I think we got to get in the stew and like, you know, the problem is if you train your entire user base on quick hit dopamine, what happens when they develop a tolerance to it? And you know, it's not enough, like Axl Rose, Mr. Brownstone, you know, I used to do it little by little, but the little came more and more, right?
00;18;15;28 - 00;18;21;08
Chris
I think we're at the more and more part. And now they need to. Now they need to find a new model here.
00;18;21;08 - 00;18;40;14
Aaron
And I think they are. I don't know if you guys seen on ChatGPT mobile, the pulse feed that they're playing around with. It's also like another compelling or semi compelling like riff on the feed, which I thought was was pretty interesting. So the way it works, if you haven't played around with it, you log in. If you don't type or touch anything, it will.
00;18;40;17 - 00;19;02;15
Aaron
It will display to you things that OpenAI thinks you're interested in, and then it asks you to pretty much like tune their algorithm. Like, what are you interested in? Where do you want to go deeper? Like, what can I kind of do for you? So it feels like the glimmers of like, everybody is going to have their own algorithm instead of this, like centrally administered, you know, dopamine algorithm, which is optimized for the platform instead of for you.
00;19;02;15 - 00;19;07;00
Aaron
So I wonder if, like, the two things kind of begin to converge a bit more.
00;19;07;03 - 00;19;10;27
Chris
You're saying OpenAI is getting into the designer drug business?
00;19;11;00 - 00;19;32;05
Aaron
Yeah, yeah they are. But, you know, it seems like, the rolling, you know, they're dialing back the OxyContin or the numbing aspects of it to make it like a little bit more productive. It kind of feels like a mix between like an RSS feed and like what you get on, you know, a social media platform, which I think is kind of interesting, but it's really like you're designing your own algorithm for yourself.
00;19;32;05 - 00;19;37;18
Aaron
And they're hoping they're hoping that, you know, you guide it in some sort of way instead of it being guided for you.
00;19;37;21 - 00;20;04;25
Chris
Yeah, that that's definitely a pathway. So, let's get everyone making their own pink cocaine in their apps. Sure. Let's see how how far that goes. But yeah, like seeding some control over to the user is, is certainly a competitive advantage, right. If everyone's digging into stronger and stronger algorithmic control of the feed, that leaves space to zag into giving the user, letting them actually put their hands on the wheel on steer.
00;20;04;27 - 00;20;26;04
Pri
I like I like the this in concept. I am still struggling to understand how this makes the internet better, though fully. Because if we're all in or like in, you know, self silos, like, I feel like my favorite part of the internet. And of course, maybe this is a callback to just like when I first encountered the internet in third or fourth grade, but up until then, and then let's call it my mid 20s.
00;20;26;04 - 00;20;50;10
Pri
So in that ten year period, it was all about like connectivity chatter with other people. It was less consumptive. I just remember stumble upon discovery Wikipedia reading a lot about new things, educating myself. But I also felt connected with other people. I worry if this this, you know, now we're too exposed to other people and the algorithm sets us down rabbit holes, which in some cases has radicalized people.
00;20;50;13 - 00;21;07;27
Pri
Or in my case, I just see, like the dumbest stuff ever because I clicked into one thing and my feed is completely destroyed. But putting that aside, I do. I do struggle to see how this makes the like issue, which we all agree there is an issue with social media better.
00;21;07;29 - 00;21;10;10
Aaron
What's making it more antisocial, right? It's making it. Yeah, it's.
00;21;10;10 - 00;21;13;16
Pri
Forcing it more. It's just making more antisocial. But like.
00;21;13;18 - 00;21;34;12
Aaron
Yeah, but not in like the not in the way that it's bad for society, but more like it's not going to be as much about you connecting directly with another person on the internet. Or following them. We're kind of building audience. It's going to be much more, about what are you interested in? Like what can I do to kind of satisfy your, your attention and some capacity, which is just a little bit different, right.
00;21;34;16 - 00;21;50;05
Aaron
Like, I do think a lot of these big influencers get scale just because they're hacking the algorithm, for lack of a better way to describe it. And I wonder if that era is beginning to at least change where people are trying to change that a little bit so that the internet doesn't doesn't feel so crappy. Sorry, Derek.
00;21;50;06 - 00;22;11;26
Derek
No, no, no, you're bringing up a really good point, Aaron. And it just reminds me of something Chris said like a few minutes ago about Sora, or at least my initial impressions of Sora and short form video content. I definitely think in part one of the reasons why, at least like, you know, this, this hacking of the algorithm that happened from the creator economy around platforms like TikTok, I think that is just listening to your riff.
00;22;11;26 - 00;22;47;25
Derek
That's definitely translating a little bit into kind of like the how can I help you prompt when you log in to ChatGPT. And I'm starting to kind of like train, you know, your internal settings around, your preferences, which then, you know, creates a new type of like stickiness, a new type of, of of, you know, data training around personalization that allows for a better algorithm to exist for you upon entering and what that actually looks like and what is presented to you over time is probably going to be shaped quite a bit from how you use and answer these questions on a daily basis, which it definitely begs the question of like, are people
00;22;47;27 - 00;23;07;24
Derek
recognizing now that like the early work that they're doing, participating in these systems may have lasting ramifications on their personalities or like their how they interact with the world because like, they are, you know, starting the mile long journey now with that first step to kind of like training personalized AI that is very sticky and hard to kind of like, you know, unearth yourself from.
00;23;07;27 - 00;23;41;23
Derek
I think there's a there's another thing that you brought up too, which was interesting to me, like, and I'm just reflecting on Chris's point, the reason why I think I was so struck by Sora's products, like not feeling right, is because there's such a precision that exists around I think the two reasons why things like TikTok ended up, you know, becoming such important pieces of like, I don't know, the creator economy is like there's both like this, okay, we know the rules of the road, and we can figure out how to hack the algorithm in ways that allows the best content to or quote unquote, the the content, the best content to be produced, showing
00;23;41;23 - 00;24;02;25
Derek
up on your feed. There's like this precision part of it around like the constraints that I also think maybe isn't a set as much, which is these creators that are making content on TikTok, whether it's dance videos or cooking videos or quilting mamas or whatever birth videos it takes, whatever musicians, they understand the constraints of that medium so well.
00;24;02;25 - 00;24;20;26
Derek
And there's a there's such a precision around lighting and color and beats and timing, the form factor itself and like down to the millisecond. And when I opened up the AI, we just don't have that precision yet with something like Sora. And so when I opened it up, I was just like, wow, this is just, like, very not compelling to like.
00;24;20;28 - 00;24;58;22
Derek
And mostly I think the answer is because nobody knows how to use these things yet in very sharp ways. They're not being wielded correctly. There is no precision. It is like, for lack of a better word, just slop and I do. The thought did cross my mind listening to you talk, Aaron and listening to Chris make that point, which was just like, if communities if individuals figure out how to become incredibly precise with what it means to wield AI and, you know, gen media in ways that are precise, that are very like, thoughtful are we are we just like, laughing at what, like this toy that exists today, but not really recognizing that there's this
00;24;58;22 - 00;25;13;23
Derek
huge spiritual power around, like getting that precision right, that bass basically locks us into our devices forever. And I don't I don't know, this is just like where I don't have any of these answers. It's more just like I think it's a very curious conversation just listening to you guys talk.
00;25;13;25 - 00;25;40;17
Chris
I got some thoughts here. Wow. All right. So thing one is when you're interacting with the Sora, right? You're completely unbounded. You're not you're not in a constrained environment, right? Like, you talk about these videos, they're all going out to specific communities. They all have an etiquette. They all have constraints. There's a structuralism to what is expected to operate within that world.
00;25;40;23 - 00;26;10;17
Chris
The LMS and Sora have no context for that. They literally have the ability to conjure anything. And so I think that's the first problem, is that you've got this mismatch between what the local geography is and the LM having a universal view. And I think like you can solve for that. Right. Like the instar holder, I'm basing my entire app off a corpus I developed, like 400 articles, docs, short stories, etc., right?
00;26;10;17 - 00;26;37;25
Chris
Like I'm literally defining the universe in which for all playing and it's it's big, but it's small. Like, you get used to it, you can know the inhabitants of it. And when you're talking about the model, the model is bounded in that geography. And so there is a whole forcing function of bringing this down into a, a local geography in which, like, it's like a neighborhood now.
00;26;37;27 - 00;27;06;10
Chris
And as you walk around that neighborhood, day in and day out, you get to know who's on what block, you know where to get your coffee, etc., etc.. And so I think that's one part of it. But then the other thing you're gesturing at is the lack of a preference engine associated to you. Right? You don't have a personal graph of your preferences explicitly defined in and yet or in most of these AI products.
00;27;06;12 - 00;27;29;15
Chris
And I don't think we're all that far away from, you know, as you answer these questions, as you ask these things that like, it's creating an explicit set of embeddings, an explicit set of vectors that are solely tailored around your preference and act as that decision tree for when you then step in and hit the tire. Right.
00;27;29;15 - 00;27;54;18
Chris
Like, sure, some of that exists, you know, like ChatGPT, you can throw a rag against it, you know, and you can have it, like live within your rag or, you know, there's some knowledge in these limbs, but it's not it doesn't really act as a filter that sits between you and the entire unbounded universe. I think both of those things will be coming and will start to get applied in these products to make them stronger.
00;27;54;18 - 00;27;58;07
Chris
It's the fact that it is the widest of nets right now.
00;27;58;08 - 00;28;07;14
Aaron
Yeah it is. I mean, and it is too wide and it's going to just get wider and wider, right? Because your possibility space is effectively infinite now.
00;28;07;16 - 00;28;15;19
Pri
Yeah, but isn't it also Chris suggesting it's going to be wider and wider, but at the same time it's going to be more narrow because it'll be tools to help with the precision piece.
00;28;15;21 - 00;28;22;18
Aaron
Yeah, I think it is a way to we're going to need those tools to kind of navigate that. Yeah. That's that's what you're saying Chris. Right.
00;28;22;21 - 00;28;44;10
Chris
Yeah. Well I'm just saying like Derek's talking about like TikTok as like a blade, you know, a master like, crafted piece of, like, hitori Hanzo Japanese steel. Right. You saying like, that's where TikTok is evolved to. And right now, LMS is the strongest club in the world. But that's all they are is a big stack.
00;28;44;13 - 00;29;02;04
Derek
Yeah. You got I think that's a great analogy, Chris. And I feel strongly about that. I think to your point and to Aaron's point, that aperture will only increase as like we fumble around in the dark and figure out what else people can do with these things. But I also think it's it's so human to try and figure out how to sharpen that blade.
00;29;02;06 - 00;29;26;26
Derek
Maybe the thing that I'm flagging is like, as that blade get sharpened, are we are we indirectly creating like the most compelling, most sticky type of media content that humans have ever had? Because this thing is such a pass, this these tools are so powerful. And what you can do and what you can create that inevitably, when this blade does get sharpened, it's just like, hopefully it doesn't.
00;29;26;29 - 00;29;44;29
Derek
I just to extend the analogy, force us to, you know, commit seppuku, right? Like we're not like, you know, like digging our own graves with this thing. I think there is a there is a, a tendency here. It's maybe under I think, you know, my first impressions of sorry, I was like, okay, this makes very little sense in this current packaging.
00;29;45;01 - 00;30;02;28
Derek
But like the more you guys were riffing on it, the more I was just thinking about it. You know, the more this conversation has gone on. I'm like, okay, this is exactly what a product that is like a very, you know, sharp blade would look like for everyone. So yeah, anyway, I, I don't know, he's just, you know, Friday morning ramblings it's Friday.
00;30;02;28 - 00;30;09;20
Chris
Wow. I mean, I know that implicitly because we're on the podcast, but I don't know, days are a blur for me right now.
00;30;09;23 - 00;30;33;08
Aaron
Yeah. Dirk I think that I think that is probably going to be the risk here. Right. You get something so customized to yourself with so many dynamic possibilities, like it becomes super engrossing, right? It's like all encompassing and attention grabbing. I'm I'm assuming we'll see more and more of that. At the same time. I do think it's a little bit like, you know, people rebel against sugar or fast food.
00;30;33;08 - 00;30;51;01
Aaron
You know too much of that. I think everybody knows it's not good for you. So I wonder if there's some constraints on that over time. But I think kind of to walk down that path, you're just moving away from more collective experiences and like into more personalized ones, which is changes the nature of like, how the internet's organized.
00;30;51;03 - 00;31;01;27
Aaron
It's less broadcast, it's much more customization, personalized algorithms versus like these, like mass futile listing algorithms that we have now where you just like an attention serf, like, oh yeah, on X.
00;31;01;28 - 00;31;17;20
Pri
Yeah. If that's a better internet or not. I mean, I think it's better than what we have now, but I don't know if that's like optimal. I do think like there'll be a way for, you know, and I've seen company there's several companies that are doing that are actually going to try to make it more social for humans, where humans are connecting with other humans.
00;31;17;20 - 00;31;44;22
Pri
And, you know, even dating apps are moving into more like AI pairing of people that would get along well, etc.. So I think maybe it kind of helps for the social connectivity part, because that to me was one of the more exciting parts of the internet, as opposed to just my like custom layer to like use these tools and do whatever I want with them, like I that also sounds appealing, but in some sort of like limited capacity, number or experience.
00;31;44;24 - 00;31;47;19
Chris
Can I go, can go a little nutty here?
00;31;47;21 - 00;31;48;17
Pri
Yeah.
00;31;48;19 - 00;32;18;23
Chris
All right. Let's, let's bring our friend Marshall McLuhan into the conversation and let's talk about humans as a bootloader species. Let's talk about human Homo sapiens diverging at a certain point because of the power of these machines. What I'm saying is, you can have both. You can have hot media, you can have cold media, right? And in McLuhan's world, he describes, you know, media as a tool that shapes like humans, right?
00;32;18;23 - 00;32;48;27
Chris
Like we our personalities are defined by our tools and our relationship to the environment. And when you change the tools, you change humans like full stop. Right. And so we had this whole period that Gutenberg, right brought ushered in where we moved away from the oral tribal collective, you know, form of human relationships into these mediated, personal, one on one sort of experiences with literacy.
00;32;48;29 - 00;33;18;28
Chris
And what that means is that when you're reading an author, right, and you have a direct one on one relationship, that author is in your head establishing their world, their views in an uninterrupted way. And so, you know what we what we talk about as, you know, literacy, reading, valuing all of that, that's an explicit rejection of our tribal collective, sort of consciousness that we used to live in.
00;33;19;00 - 00;33;42;27
Chris
And we ascribe all these, like, important qualities to it because the Western civilization is built on it, like enlightenment, Renaissance, yada, yada, yada. Right. Gutenberg had to make that happen. Now I right. And so actually, so one of McLuhan's hottest takes is that we will move into a post literate world. And I remember seeing that and just being like, oh, come on.
00;33;42;27 - 00;34;19;28
Chris
And that's a bridge too far. We're never going to forget to read. We're never going to forget to write. Like literacy is a core component of our cultural operating system and how we wield and interact with tools, we're never going to get past literacy. But as we start getting into brain rot, slop, right? That is very much a post literate form of engagement in which, like your dopamine said, your collective pooled right, because the velocity of these things on in TikTok, for instance, the digital physics is a result of like collective attention.
00;34;20;00 - 00;34;49;23
Chris
And so you're in this post literate mode. And I guess what I'm saying is that levels of powerful enough to operate extremely effective forms of both hot and cold media, and that they can do them in parallel, they can do them in competing products to the point where, you know, if you exclusively engage in only one mode of media, that is a mediated hot or cold, you're going to be dealing with an entirely different set of tools.
00;34;49;23 - 00;35;01;28
Chris
Your entire environment is going to change. And so we could actually like diverge as as people based on what our primary form media is.
00;35;02;00 - 00;35;12;00
Pri
That's an interesting thought, actually. That feels like like a fork in human evolution. Like, like transhumanism going in different directions.
00;35;12;02 - 00;35;39;09
Chris
Like, are you going to be the monk hiding out in the abbey, poring over your books, having this intensely personal spiritual experience in which, like you and your cohort of like acolytes and devotees, right, are like, all locked in this narrow quest? Or are you going to be like a roaming band of marauders streaming across the countryside, getting your hands on whatever you can and just ripping and running?
00;35;39;11 - 00;35;41;08
Pri
It's a good question.
00;35;41;10 - 00;36;02;08
Aaron
Yeah. Chris. I mean, I'm sure some folks may seen this, but I think that the number of Americans like under the age of 25 that are reading, it's like hitting all time lows. It's like something like 15% like reading for pleasure, like not for work or something like that. So it definitely feels like we're moving a little bit towards post literacy in some capacity.
00;36;02;08 - 00;36;03;20
Chris
Yes. Yeah, I actually.
00;36;03;26 - 00;36;28;14
Aaron
I've actually wondered if that like declining literacy rate or just, you know, desire to read is in part why everything just feels so crazy. They just because there's so much, you know, inherent in logic, you know, logical thinking that comes with reading that I think you lose, right? When we have non-linear media with like non-linear ways of consuming media, it's just like it's what's creating this insanity that I think a lot of folks are grappling with.
00;36;28;17 - 00;36;35;16
Pri
And I don't even think this was like, because of I, this was happening. I feel like this trend was happening even before ChatGPT was released.
00;36;35;18 - 00;36;51;18
Aaron
I don't think it's I think it's just the internet. I think the internet's nonlinear, right. It's it's very compelling. I mean, I even find, you know, the internet's more compelling than TV, right? TV, at least was linear. It wasn't as petit right for most, TV wasn't as heady, but at least it was linear.
00;36;51;21 - 00;37;06;08
Pri
Yeah, but sometimes you really like when you watch a really good movie and it's a great storyline, like that hour and a half of a tight story. Well done production. I mean, sometimes I'll like go on like Instagram Reels or I'm just like on the internet. I don't even remember and retain what I actually did for that time.
00;37;06;08 - 00;37;13;21
Pri
At least with the movie, you kind of retain that linear media and that story and like have it makes an impression on you. Like, I guess because you're.
00;37;13;21 - 00;37;41;25
Chris
In you're in conversation with a director, right? That director is Traktor beamed into a one on one relationship with you, right? Yeah. And it's such a great point. So like the whole 90 minute thing, just as an aside, like my new thing around movies is if, ang Lee could could in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, if he could do that in 90 minutes, no movie should ever be able to run over 90 minutes ever again.
00;37;41;27 - 00;37;58;23
Pri
I agree with you. 90 minutes is the perfect amount. It's interesting I sent you guys this article actually worth just reading. It's it's short, but it basically talks about how, like classical literature was the brain rot of its time back and like the 17th and 18th century and like even.
00;37;58;26 - 00;37;59;21
Aaron
You can see that.
00;37;59;24 - 00;38;21;16
Pri
Yeah. It's. Yeah. And a lot of the what was happening at the globe was considered lowbrow and, and like unethical to the puritanical society and like they draw from several examples and like the whole thesis of it, it's actually optimistic, somewhat optimistic. But showing how thinking will evolve. But this is just sort of the way of the world.
00;38;21;16 - 00;38;43;14
Pri
Like when Gutenberg and the printing press came out, like, of course, it took a little bit of time for classical literature to come out, but like that was frowned upon. And now it feels like something we can't live without. You know, I think it's like, hard to it's easier. It's easy to get lost in the source. But anyways, it's it's worth reading quickly this article because it's like a little bit of an interesting, like historical perspective on what's happening now.
00;38;43;20 - 00;38;53;16
Chris
The pre actors were once considered in the same peer group. Is like thieves and prostitutes. If you were having polite society, you would exclude actors from attendance.
00;38;53;19 - 00;39;03;00
Pri
That's ridiculous. Yeah, that's the thing. It's like this is just the way it is. So like we, we kind of overindex and like, think about things too deeply. Maybe.
00;39;03;02 - 00;39;28;12
Chris
I mean, you might have to thank, your man there, Louie the 14th. Right. For for elevating that entire creative class in verse II, like the role of fashion in society, the role of performance like it was in a way, the equivalent of, like Constantine converting Christianity in that like Christianity started becoming a slave religion and, you know, became the official religion of the state.
00;39;28;12 - 00;39;43;09
Chris
Like that was Louis saying, you know what? I don't give a shit about Cicero. I don't give a shit about your hymnal tracks like Martin Luther go sit in a corner, give me some goddamn good fashion designers.
00;39;43;11 - 00;39;46;13
Pri
Who who is that of our time?
00;39;46;15 - 00;39;52;00
Chris
Oh my God, that's a great question. Yeah.
00;39;52;02 - 00;39;56;05
Aaron
I think I think to answer that, you're going to have to see who, like, skips a generation, right?
00;39;56;13 - 00;39;59;22
Pri
That's usually Larry Ellison and his kid. Like, literally.
00;39;59;28 - 00;40;08;16
Aaron
I was thinking more like Mr. Beast, right? Like maybe he's the he's the Shakespeare of our time. Chris, if we're pulling this analogy, you know, he's got the eyeballs. So.
00;40;08;16 - 00;40;29;22
Pri
Well, Lou, the thing is, like, you kind of need capital and leadership to enable that kind of cultural shift. And so it's like trying to think about who that is and like, who has a lot of cap capital and is like going to change the cultural class to be more tech enabled and leverage these tools. It's like no one is standing out.
00;40;29;24 - 00;40;45;13
Aaron
I don't think you need to because you have just distribution. And so it really is like in many ways like a marketplace for attention. Right? So if something's going to be able to grab your attention more, it tends to win. I mean, like look at look at TikTok. Right. Like it built on the feed and it won.
00;40;45;15 - 00;41;15;11
Chris
But a part of like why our our current moment in time is so disconnected and just so tumultuous is that your mainstream media has a deep, deep like distrust of technology and you use it through like entirely skeptical lenses. Also, you know, there's this whole political issue. And so like the battles right now are in some ways and battles for recognition of belief systems.
00;41;15;11 - 00;41;36;24
Chris
And like feeling excluded, you know, like this whole conservative war on our our thought is under attack. We're not allowed to think the way we think. We have to tear down the New York Times. Right? Like that. That is a battle for, you know, basically recognition of what is worthy and important and should sit at the same table of ideas.
00;41;36;27 - 00;41;54;09
Chris
And we don't really view it that way because it's such a shit show and it's screaming and pointing and, you know, it moves at internet velocities, but like, you can you can kind of look at what the hell is happening right now through the lens of, you know, I mean, I don't want to call Trump Louis the 14th.
00;41;54;12 - 00;42;34;04
Chris
Right? But like, Trump is trying to like, take a whole worldview and give it equal footing, at the table. And so it's happening, but it's happening around existing entrenched things. No one, no one yet is wanting to break free from the pack and set a new ground because the, the spoils. Right, like what's available today to take it, to take in through, like, you know, establishing ideologies or establishing belief systems as dominant modes like that capture that prize is so freaking huge that there's no real incentive.
00;42;34;07 - 00;42;52;29
Chris
And Louis sat above all of that, and Louis was just like, fuck, I want to entertain myself. I like, I want to live a good life, like, what the heck? And like, turn me on and get me excited to, like, go to the Chase. The day. And so like, he was open, right? Because he was completely unfounded. He was in control of everything.
00;42;52;29 - 00;43;16;15
Chris
And so he was really just driving towards maybe his own pleasure principle in installing this whole new set of like cultural norms in society. And so like, yes, we can collectively sort this all out, but then no one maybe has the wherewithal and the institutional heft to say, you know what? This should all bores me to tears. I couldn't care less about politics.
00;43;16;15 - 00;43;25;07
Chris
I couldn't care less about prestige TV. I want to get turned on in a completely new way, and I want to build a world around it. No one has those incentives right now.
00;43;25;09 - 00;43;41;08
Aaron
Yeah, I think that's fair. I actually when you asked that that question, I thought Trump could be one of those types of characters too. Right. And he definitely understands the the need, the need for marketing, branding, you know, all the types of things. A pet like a king, I guess, Chris, which is part of the concern.
00;43;41;10 - 00;43;41;28
Pri
I mean.
00;43;42;01 - 00;43;43;03
Aaron
A huge concern.
00;43;43;06 - 00;43;47;08
Pri
I will say he does name culture more than most people.
00;43;47;11 - 00;44;10;13
Aaron
Yeah. I mean, it's even it's interesting and I don't want to actually comment on it, but I think it's it's interesting to note it, just seeing like the political parties start to engage in stuff that is like below what I would view kind of as like lowbrow, mimetic stuff, increasingly so with this government shutdown, you know, on both sides of the aisle, there's just like these like new memes that are just getting thrown out related to it.
00;44;10;15 - 00;44;19;08
Aaron
I do feel like a kind of like a new chapter's opening up when it comes to political dialog. And it's moving more mimetic, which is just kind of fascinating.
00;44;19;10 - 00;44;53;13
Chris
Yeah, that actually might be like what we were talking about earlier in in terms of like recognition of plays as like an elevated art form. Maybe it's the meme. The meme is finally starting to, like, have its power recognized. And we're seeing it in a political lens versus, you know, a critical or cultural commentary sort of lens. But like, that is totally the same sort of process, like, you know, 100 years from now, maybe we don't have literature majors, maybe we have meme medics.
00;44;53;13 - 00;44;55;24
Chris
I don't know, we have meme majors.
00;44;55;26 - 00;45;20;04
Aaron
Yeah, it could be that way. But yeah, I mean, you know, you're seeing like Gavin Newsom do it. The Democratic, you know, party's like official X account, you know, slinging memes. You see the white House doing that and it does seem like the white House social media coordinator has been pushing on memes for a while. Right? Some that people find incredibly distasteful or worse, but it definitely feels like they're pulling people in that direction.
00;45;20;04 - 00;45;25;10
Aaron
Right? They just wild. Yeah. Have you got some new chapter guys related?
00;45;25;10 - 00;45;28;17
Pri
The year you guys been following with that Tilly Norwood thing?
00;45;28;19 - 00;45;31;17
Chris
I don't know what a Tilly Norwood is. I'm an on tell us.
00;45;31;19 - 00;45;32;19
Aaron
Yeah tell us.
00;45;32;22 - 00;45;39;27
Pri
It's like an odd thing but it's like that AI character that is an actress and it's like created and. Oh yeah.
00;45;39;27 - 00;45;40;08
Chris
Yeah, yeah.
00;45;40;08 - 00;46;05;08
Pri
Yeah, Hollywood. And like, all these actors and actresses are boycotting any agency that signs her. And Emily Blunt was like, she's really scary. A bunch of, like, really high profile actresses like Toni Collette. And there's like, we're just, like, barfing all over it. Everyone was saying like these, I, you know, actresses couldn't replace humans. Like, it's actually kind of blown up a little bit.
00;46;05;10 - 00;46;26;19
Pri
It's like the first time I've seen, like several actresses fully acknowledge that the tech looks really good. It's scary. And they're like, there's no humanity. Like there's no depth to this character. Like there's no feeling like this is like, you know, people were losing their minds. Like the number of articles and stuff I read related to this. Like it was kind of, you know, kind of blew up a little bit.
00;46;26;22 - 00;46;33;09
Chris
So wait, are you saying, like, little McKayla is all grown up and is now a fully operational Death Star that like.
00;46;33;11 - 00;46;34;04
Aaron
Yeah, it's coming.
00;46;34;04 - 00;46;37;08
Chris
Hollywood royalty is fired for or fearing?
00;46;37;10 - 00;46;41;01
Pri
Yeah, basically, there's so much to it. It's like a little bit of whoa.
00;46;41;03 - 00;47;05;22
Aaron
It's not the royalty, Chris. Right. It's the it's the workers, right? The studios are happy to push this down. But even like the Journal today ran an article just saying the title was LA's entertainment economy's looking like a disaster movie. So to the extent that the journal like a harbinger of like what's happened recently, it just seems like a lot of pain is going to come to the traditional media ecosystems.
00;47;05;25 - 00;47;12;14
Aaron
Just how many more updates of Sora do you need until you're getting just new long form movies and video?
00;47;12;16 - 00;47;43;23
Chris
Two Ellie's been there for 1010 years. It's probably at a tipping point. Like I got friends out there who are gaffers. I got friends who do production work that you know, and like, works in D&D for a long, long time. But I think it is starting to slip into like, you know, that sort of like critical point from which, like, if you slip below a certain barrier of activity, all of these like supporting industries that rely on like a certain critical threshold, it's basically like the trade will collapse and maybe we are we're getting there.
00;47;43;25 - 00;47;51;07
Pri
I think, I think, I think Creative Industries Hollywood might be next after coding. That's what I was thinking about as I saw that.
00;47;51;09 - 00;48;11;00
Aaron
Yeah, I think it makes sense that it be there because you have like really mature distribution channels with social media, so you can get scale pretty quickly. And I think a lot of folks love media, right. Like they want to play around. They're super creative. They just don't have access to the gaffers. Right? In this entire industry, that's necessary to bring, you know, complicated media to life.
00;48;11;00 - 00;48;25;09
Aaron
So I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case. And it does feel like this time next year we're going to be like, oh, yeah, of course. Like, I can't imagine that a Netflix show would take, you know, six months to, to put together. It'll probably take a couple weeks.
00;48;25;12 - 00;48;25;24
Chris
Yeah.
00;48;25;25 - 00;48;27;24
Aaron
Like like one person.
00;48;27;26 - 00;49;01;10
Chris
I mean, literally me. Yeah, I'm the problem. I mean, last night I implemented, like, my scribe system into my app in which you're just having, like a natural chat and conversation about the world with my, my friendly Laura agent, I now get a little quill in the corner of any output I click on. If I like something it says, I click on that quill, it dumps it in a scribe editor, and I can literally just say, hey editors doc and edit this chat, turn it into, turn it into a little story, change the tone this way, change the opening this way.
00;49;01;10 - 00;49;07;12
Chris
It rips it off in like, under 20s and it's all flowing just from natural conversation. Yeah.
00;49;07;12 - 00;49;30;04
Aaron
It's amazing. I think that that that feels like what you're playing around with, Chris, is just going to harden and become the norm over time. So excited to see that, to see that continue to materialize and develop. But I don't know, I feel like we talked about like creative AI for a year and a half now, and it finally feels like it's here, which is I'm I'm just super fascinated to see kind of what it looks like.
00;49;30;07 - 00;49;32;15
Aaron
I'm excited for, for kind of this chapter.
00;49;32;17 - 00;49;39;23
Chris
Worlds like complex adaptive media systems operating at world scale in real time.
00;49;39;25 - 00;49;53;18
Aaron
Yeah, which starts to sound a lot like what? Like metaverse. Right. And then we think back a couple years where, like, Zuck was getting skewered for it, but it feels like that's what they intuited to maybe maybe they didn't implement it the right way. But they at least intuited that direction.
00;49;53;21 - 00;50;14;06
Chris
I think they started it in the wrong direction because they only really had spatial available to them. And you actually have to work in the opposite direction. You have to work from upwards and like story and like meaning, and then you only treat that rendering layer as a final thought and you have to be multimodal.
00;50;14;08 - 00;50;25;29
Aaron
Yeah. And then like then it's just going to be like one of these genie, you know, from Google World building prompts. Right. Like it will just get easier and easier to build that world. It's wild. It's wild stuff.
00;50;26;01 - 00;50;28;15
Chris
Weird wacky wild stuff.
00;50;28;17 - 00;50;33;22
Aaron
Yeah, completely. But we lost our co-host. They had a jet. So maybe you see.
00;50;33;22 - 00;50;39;22
Chris
It in the air. And I think it's time to, we've come to the end of the road is, voice Tim NZ. Yeah.
00;50;39;24 - 00;51;03;02
Aaron
Play play that in the background. Finkel as we recorded this you know welcome to net society everyone. It's me Chris Perry and Derek talking about all things internet, crypto, AI and everything in between. Just a reminder that, everything we say is done in our personal capacity and is not representative of any organizations we're part of, and should not be construed as investment advice.
00;51;03;04 - 00;51;03;28
Aaron
Well, thanks, Joe.
00;51;04;00 - 00;51;16;07
Unknown
See you.
00;51;16;10 - 00;51;27;07
Unknown
For.