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Welcome to The Foster Friendly Podcast. We’re bringing foster care closer to home by sharing stories from the front lines. We're talking with former foster youth, foster parents and others who are finding unique and powerful ways to dramatically improve the experiences and outcomes for kids in foster care.
The Foster Friendly podcast is brought to you by America’s Kids Belong, a nonprofit that helps kids in foster care find belonging in both family and community.
Courtney Williams (00:01.495)
Hello and welcome to the foster friendly podcast. My name is Courtney Williams with my co-host Travis Vong's nest Travis. How are you today?
Travis (00:09.086)
Little tired, but you know, got the coffee dialed up, so here we go.
Courtney Williams (00:13.87)
I've only had one one cup so far and I feel like I need another but Today we have with us Kayla Moffitt. She is totally and completely exhausted Do you feel that way today Kayla? She's a Tennessee mom to five siblings who spent years in the foster care system and a new baby girl She can often be found sipping unintended cold coffee in the carpool line or folding tiny t-shirts while searching for every single left sock
Kayla Moffitt (00:26.79)
Absolutely, I do.
Travis (00:29.204)
Ha ha ha
Courtney Williams (00:43.49)
She has plenty of the right ones if you're looking for one. love your bio, Kayla. It's so real and authentic and sounds very much like my life. She's also a TBRI practitioner. She spends her days encouraging and educating foster and adoptive mamas and does hard and holy work. So welcome to the Foster Friendly Podcast, Kayla.
Kayla Moffitt (00:51.418)
Yep.
Kayla Moffitt (01:03.93)
Thank you. I'm honored to be here with you guys.
Travis (01:07.466)
Great to have you.
Courtney Williams (01:09.864)
So we hear Kayla that you married your middle school sweetheart. mean high school sweetheart is one thing, but a middle school sweetheart, you got to tell us a little bit about the story and your beginning with Jared.
Travis (01:16.35)
Wow.
Kayla Moffitt (01:20.006)
Yes, yes. So we have quite literally done life together from, you know, seems like babies to now 30 somethings. We, I say that like we were dating in middle school. My dad absolutely did not let us date. Like my dad was a fan. You know, I was not allowed to date this, you know, rebel boy who Jared was in high school. But I did, I was like 12, 13 years old and I
Courtney Williams (01:34.542)
Ha
Travis (01:34.632)
No, no, no.
Travis (01:39.806)
haha
Kayla Moffitt (01:47.034)
wrote him a note. saw him one day and I was like, I like him. You know, I thought that I was cool and popular. I soon found out he was not. But I wrote him a note and I was like, do you like me? Straight up George straight. I'll check yes or no. Yes. And then I found out that he was in band and this was like early 2000s band was not cool. Today, I wrote him another note.
Travis (01:58.154)
Ha ha.
Courtney Williams (02:02.222)
Ha ha.
Travis (02:02.794)
Pssss
Kayla Moffitt (02:15.302)
like nevermind, like this relationship is over. And I broke up with him one time and it was later. And then that was the start of it. And then I was like, I can't live without this guy. He wanted me back. So now he's like a traveling bandit in a major way.
Travis (02:17.671)
Ahaha.
Courtney Williams (02:27.214)
Thank you.
Travis (02:32.206)
wow.
Courtney Williams (02:37.005)
That's awesome. I love it. The background band wasn't cool. Comment.
Travis (02:41.994)
Hmm?
Kayla Moffitt (02:42.138)
wasn't like that was like top tier nerd i like that today though that was really cool today
Courtney Williams (02:46.446)
Bye.
Travis (02:50.378)
Yeah, I think what I marvel at is knowing guys most awkward stage and annoying stage in junior high and you saw him at his lowest and married him despite it. So you stuck with it.
Courtney Williams (02:52.11)
Yeah, I think it's a fun one. I marvel at knowing this guy. Uh, awkward to that I'm not. saw him as his roller.
Kayla Moffitt (03:01.827)
low.
Kayla Moffitt (03:07.441)
forever and we broke up one time and I remember I went in my mom's room and laid in her bed and just cried and I was like you know 16 years old and of course mom she was just like it's okay Kayla the same way I would do like my girls now you know you didn't actually think this is forever but no it was I was like this is a know I'm married in four years later
Travis (03:08.916)
Yep.
Courtney Williams (03:18.894)
Yeah.
That's awesome.
Travis (03:33.13)
Yeah, that's awesome. So, well, yeah, it's a great, some laughs and kind of a light start. Yeah. So as we get more into your story, let's just start kind of unpacking, like where did your foster care journey begin?
Courtney Williams (03:40.438)
Yeah, so we get more into your story, let's just start kind of walking back and like where did you or Fox or...
Kayla Moffitt (03:47.334)
Yeah, so my husband and I, we ended up being youth pastors. So we did that for nine years, youth pastors for nine years. And we were 28. So I think he was like maybe 29 or 27 or 28. And we started feeling that tug towards like, we've been married for nine years. We've been youth pastors for nine years. Like, what's our next move? You know, we started getting old, like we couldn't keep up with teenagers anymore. So on.
Next week was like, well, let's have kids, you know, and start a family. And somewhere along the way, God just started molding our hearts, reshaping our hearts. And we had a few families in the church that we were attending that were foster families. And we kind of watched them walk through that journey. And we started the process and opened up our home two years later to be an open foster home.
Courtney Williams (04:48.565)
So what year was that?
Kayla Moffitt (04:50.265)
That was 2019.
Courtney Williams (04:52.43)
2019, okay. And then you went from zero kids to five kids overnight, which just that alone is like five kids overnight. Tell us about that incredible leap and what that was like.
Kayla Moffitt (04:57.753)
the
Kayla Moffitt (05:07.523)
Yeah, I don't recommend it. That was a holy moly. I don't know how we survived season of our lives. When I look back, I think it was very disorienting. So we were an open foster home, but we ended up getting a dual license for adoption. As you guys know, with what you guys do, there are kids who...
Travis (05:10.922)
Yeah.
Kayla Moffitt (05:33.094)
Um, goals changed, you know, from reunification and TPR at the past, and they're looking for forever homes and there, we were living in Arkansas at the time and there was an organization similar to you guys called project zero. And we ended up connecting with the director and, um, our hearts just kind of fell in love with these. Kids who were considered waiting kids, you know, they're considered legal orphans of the state. And so we ended up navigating.
kind of transitioning from an open foster home to that dual licensure where we could also walk into just adoption. And that's part of our story. With bringing in our kids, adoption was the goal from the beginning. Like we knew when we brought in these five children that adoption was what we're going to be pursuing. But the same week that my kids were set in, set to move in, my dad passed away from COVID.
Courtney Williams (06:14.734)
with bringing in our kids, adoption was a goal, frankly, and I can't when it's brought in, children that adoption was, but we're going to be able to do it. So the same week that my kids were sent in, said they're commit my dad to have to wait. So the pregnancy was so great, I found it very difficult to make sure he was diagnosed with COVID. And August and.
Travis (06:30.417)
Kayla Moffitt (06:30.917)
diagnosed with so this was right in 2020 during the pandemic and he was diagnosed with COVID in August and he passed away in September. That was three-week battle. So I was literally in that piece of holding hands with the greatest joy of my life bringing in these five beautiful babies with the greatest and greatest grief of my life and learning how to parent while grieving a parent.
Travis (06:42.266)
man.
Kayla Moffitt (07:00.385)
It's not no wish on anybody and especially whenever you bring in the heart of it being five and being from immense trauma in hard places. was a disorienting word that I use for it. was what was supposed to be, we had planned to be just the happiest moment and unfortunately there's some deep grief tucked inside a lot of that.
Travis (07:00.596)
Hmm.
Courtney Williams (07:07.886)
So how old were they into each of them at that time?
Kayla Moffitt (07:34.743)
Yeah they were two, four, six, ten, and thirteen.
Courtney Williams (07:44.204)
and with your first placement as well.
Kayla Moffitt (07:46.407)
Yeah, we had done respite a little bit and just some like weekends, some single afternoons, things like that. But this was the first like, yeah, we had never, never parented before.
Travis (08:02.612)
That's a deep dive.
Kayla Moffitt (08:04.238)
Yeah, yeah, was a deep dive and immediately drowning.
Courtney Williams (08:04.398)
care.
Travis (08:10.334)
Yeah.
Courtney Williams (08:10.552)
Mm-hmm.
So one thing we like to do in our podcast is educate people. There's differences. Some things are the same across the state. Some things are very different. Here in Colorado, there's no such thing as open adoption in foster care. So once TPR happens, it's like, you're completely removed from this child's life. Of course, we as adoptive parents have a choice of reaching out and doing things. And that's what we did when we adopted our two out of foster care is we connected with birth mom. We were very close with her.
She recently passed away, but we had a very close relationship with her until her passing. What's it like for you? that the same thing? Like there was no such thing as open adoption all on you? And do you have a relationship with their biological family or what does that?
Kayla Moffitt (08:56.708)
Yeah, so in Arkansas, it's, you can like with project zero, a lot of families when they open up their home to adopt these kids, they have to be in the state because there are family members and relationships that the state wants to preserve. So I think Arkansas is different in that way that open adoption is something that they're leaning towards. have relationships with several members of the family. We talk, you know, not,
super frequently, but multiple, multiple times a year. Our goal has always been open communication when it's in the best interest of our kids and not out of, not whenever it's uncomfortable for me or just when it's comfortable for me. You know, that's something that I deeply struggled with was, you know, I thought that what was uncomfortable for me meant it was unsafe for my kids. And that's not the case. That's something that we have to, that's that's a switch in our brain that we have to turn off.
Travis (09:40.392)
Mm-hmm.
Travis (09:52.042)
Mmm.
Kayla Moffitt (09:56.743)
Because this is uncomfortable, right? It is a unique situation and just because something, just because I'm not comfortable with something doesn't mean that it's unsafe or that it's not good for my kids. But yeah, we have communication with several members of the family. It's not always reciprocated as much as we want to, but like our kids' family have, you know, our address, our phone number, and we hope to have more communication should they ever want that in the future.
Courtney Williams (09:57.903)
So, it's a bit like comfortable, right? It is a really situation-intensive, because it's just that I'm not comfortable with something that I really can't get used because it's not so comfortable. But yeah, we have the ability to work together with a family. It's not always a super-mated, but that's we want to do. But it's like a gift for you guys, so you can see address and a better time to work.
Courtney Williams (10:28.172)
Yeah, I love that. And that's pretty similar to how we are too. And like you said, when it's safe, when it's viable, when it's good and healthy for them. But also like we have older kids, adult kids now who are adopted and the thanks they give to us for not shutting that out. And a lot of families don't see that until their kids are a lot older and we'll talk to them about the things that were really hard.
Travis (10:32.297)
.
Travis (10:43.274)
Mm-hmm.
Travis (10:54.122)
Yeah. And we talk about a lot, you know, we're, we're wired to go back. We're wired to explore that, you biological connection. It's just human nature. And so, um, they're going to really find it one way or another. And if it's way later in life and they didn't have sort of the safety and the kind of feel like kind of talk with us as parents through that, that's the law. So really cool that you guys are doing that and have such a great mindset on it. Um, let's talk a little bit about.
kind of in this journey and you know, even how it went like the support side of things. So looking back, I how did people kind of show up or not show up? That's kind of part one on this. And then what you know, what has been helpful and not helpful? Like, what is your guidance from just your own story around that?
Kayla Moffitt (11:38.181)
Yeah, so when I think in our early days, how people, well, people were kind of surrounding my family anyways in that time because we were going through the loss of my dad. But one thing I really remember is my sister-in-law setting up like a meal train when the kids first moved in. It was like two weeks of meals. And can I just say, if you want to support a foster adoptive family, bring them food.
Courtney Williams (11:55.439)
Yeah.
Kayla Moffitt (12:07.93)
food that is a simple, easy, tangible way to love and serve families in this space. And it is so appreciated whenever you have, you know, we brought in five, I call them babies, they weren't babies, but they were my babies, brought in my five babies. And I did not need to be in the kitchen worrying about, you know, if I was going to make
a dinner that they were going to enjoy. I needed to be sitting on the carpet in the living room playing a board game with them learning their favorite color, know, or, you know, sharing memories, the things that they like to do, knowing their birthdays, you know, literally to know these kids who one of them had had 13 years without us, you know. So, I mean, we had people for two weeks, had lasagna being dropped off on our front porch and enchiladas and we had
Give cards put in our mailbox and that door dash delivered. It was a huge blessing to be able to just focus on my kids in that moment and not worry about something is trivial but necessary as what was going to you know, what was in the kitchen? What can we cook for dinner? So when I think back of just a big help like my sister-in-law greatly blessed our family with that and that was that was so helpful. As far as what wasn't helpful.
I don't want to call out the church because the church surrounded us and they were the ones who were helping us, who were bringing those meals and things, but there was also just some lack of support there. We experienced some hurts, something that I've now come to realize like spiritual bypassing. It's kind of wondering, take something that there should be like tangible support, tangible help.
Courtney Williams (13:33.807)
I don't want to call it the first, it's just the roundabout. They were the ones who were helping us. You are bringing those kinds of things to their health health. We've got my health care, the experience of those. And they've got our reality and our lives, and so we're here to provide that. And it's not only state health care, but there should be like, a couple of reports, and we're helping.
Kayla Moffitt (13:59.919)
And you just kind of like, you got to pray your way through it. And there's a lifeline, but also we needed help. Our kids came from immense trauma and neglect. People talk about having like a honeymoon in this space. We did not have a honeymoon period. It was hard from day one. you first night it was, it was, you know, screaming at 2 a.m. and
Travis (14:20.234)
Hehehe.
Hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (14:30.2)
holes in the wall, hair ripped out of my head. I mean, it was, it was big. It was hard. we had behaviors from day one that we had absolutely no idea how to manage. we had no idea how to handle. And when we were speaking about them to leaders in our church or even leaders in a local nonprofit that was, you
families like ours that tell families like us, hey, you need to foster, hey, you need to adopt, you know, it's like these are our people and we're telling them about what's happening and that we need help and you know, we were met with, well, you need to pray more, you need to worry less. You know, we were told some of like the diagnoses with our kids could be like demon possession instead. Things like that. And then, you know, this was hard because our faith wasn't strong enough or that we were.
Travis (15:17.63)
Yeah.
Kayla Moffitt (15:22.404)
you know, weren't praying enough. And we were told, I'll never forget, you know, one person, she's like, there's nothing that I can do for you except pray. And pray is a lifeline. You know, I'm a person of faith. My faith is a huge part of my life, but also we need tangible physical help. We needed people to like literally show up in our home and they didn't. That was hard. That was a lonely season.
Travis (15:44.682)
Hmm.
Courtney Williams (15:47.946)
Yeah. We experienced Kayla adopting, bringing in older kids as well. A lot of people within the church community, friend community, were scared of our kids. Like they didn't want to hang out with us anymore. They didn't want their kids hanging out with us anymore. Did you experience kind of similar things?
Kayla Moffitt (16:04.199)
yeah, and even still, we just, just with some of my friends, like we have to have like safety plans. There are just, there's some things that go on with our kiddos that we just can't trust them in certain situations. And for some friends, that's okay. For others, that was the end of the friendship. You know, it was basically, I don't want your kids influencing my kids.
Courtney Williams (16:25.454)
Hmm.
Travis (16:25.972)
Yeah.
Travis (16:30.398)
Mmm.
Kayla Moffitt (16:31.023)
And I'm like, but what about this beautiful opportunity that you have for your kids to influence my kids? They didn't want to take me up on that.
Courtney Williams (16:35.822)
Yeah, so hard.
Travis (16:36.894)
Right.
Travis (16:43.38)
That's hard to, well, I was thinking too, like how you don't know until entering in what you did, who's going to be there, who's going to maybe surprise you that you, wow, you're here or, know, and then the losses that you face through that. So.
Kayla Moffitt (16:56.935)
Yeah, yeah, was a wake up call. You find your people quick and you find out who aren't your people anymore.
Travis (17:05.652)
through that.
Courtney Williams (17:06.32)
Yeah. Yeah, often say on this podcast too that love isn't enough. And I feel like I'm sure you've experienced it too. People just love them, just pray, you know, those types of things. And it's like, that's just not the reality for these kids and us parenting them. What do potential foster parents need to know about their role and what it takes to be successful when it's really hard?
Kayla Moffitt (17:06.759)
you
Kayla Moffitt (17:30.087)
Yeah, love is not enough. I wish I knew that before I walked into this space. think a lot of future foster adoptive families are a lot like me and how I was when I walked into this space because with our deep love that we think is enough comes really good intentions. Really good intentions. But what I found to be true within myself is that sometimes your good intentions
can also equal ignorance. And I was very ignorant in some of my thinking. You can have all the love in the world, and I did, and I do. I yet lack understanding of what you need to successfully parent kids who have experienced deep trauma, who come from hard places. And you can be ignorant of the unique ways that you have to show up as a parent in this space. That causes harm.
I have caused, you know, not physical harm, but just emotional trauma with my kids from my lack of understanding, my lack of preparation, my lack of accepting that my love was not enough to heal, unpack, you know, everything that had happened in their life. Future foster parents need to know that and need to prepare themselves for that, that you are likely not going to be.
Travis (18:36.778)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (18:59.047)
No, not likely. You are not going to be the savior of your child's glory and you're never supposed to. And some of us walk in thinking that we're about to save the day and that's dangerous. That's a dangerous mindset to have. I also think there's a lot of learning and unlearning that needs to take place. There's things that you, future foster parents, there's things that you don't know yet that you will one day know and there's things that you
Courtney Williams (19:01.038)
are not going to be the savior of your top story and you're never supposed to. And one of the thoughts in it is that we're about to face a dangerous and dangerous time. I also think there's a lot of uncertainty and uncertainty that needs to take place. There's things that you, you just have to translate things that you don't know yet, but you really don't have to know. And then there's things that you know today that you need
Travis (19:04.49)
Mmm. Mmm.
Travis (19:11.082)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (19:28.407)
know today that you need to unlearn because it's not going to work when you're parenting. It's, know, in this space. The best thing that future foster and adoptive parents can do right now is exactly what they must be doing is listening to this podcast and following along with people who speak truth in this space, getting your feet wet before you actually swim because that's going to be what's going to keep you from.
Courtney Williams (19:30.945)
Yeah.
Travis (19:58.12)
really good advice. Well, let's talk some about trauma. You are a trust-based relational intervention practitioner, which is a trauma-informed care model. what is the biggest, or if you could kind of think, what is one biggest piece of practical advice around that space that you could give to foster parents?
Kayla Moffitt (20:24.42)
Yeah. so I became a TBRI practitioner for the sake of my own home. I did not do it as like a career, like this is great. It's not good on a resume, which it does. so I'm thankful for that part, but I, we, our home was on fire. We were drowning. and I needed help. And so I dove into TBRI and trauma informed care because, my home needed it. And I wanted to.
leave a legacy of love for my kids. And the legacy that I was leaving was not that it wasn't love, but it was again a lot of ignorance and good intentions that really lead us anywhere. So the best piece of advice that has helped me since I started walking in the trauma-informed world was you have to regulate yourself before you can even attempt to regulate a child. That's
And I say that's the best piece of advice for others, but also for me, because I don't do it every day. I don't do it every time. I've learned a million times over that if I'm dysregulated, if I'm, my dogs are barking, they're dysregulated right now. If I'm dysregulated, I'm not. If I'm dysregulated, I'm just reacting. And my kids are not going to listen or feel safe to anything that a reactive, loud,
Courtney Williams (21:25.39)
And I'm that the best people tonight, others, but also for me, and for everybody. I've done a lot of work, and happy that my work is regulated, and that my work is upheld. So I'm happy to say that this regulator is upheld. My work is regulated the whole month. My work is regulated the whole month.
Travis (21:42.452)
Ha ha ha.
Kayla Moffitt (21:54.585)
angry, annoyed, bitter parent says. So what I may be saying to my kids if they lie to me about doing their homework may be true, but if I'm not saying it in a way that is regulated and calm and at their level and in a tone that shows them respect, it's pointless. There's no point in even sharing, you know, and even trying to parent in that situation because it's really not parenting. It's just reacting and being loud. Yeah.
Courtney Williams (22:20.4)
Okay.
Kayla Moffitt (22:22.906)
So when I find myself upset, I will literally take a moment to regulate myself somehow, whether that be walking away. Sometimes I will put like an ice cube in my mouth and wait until the ice melts before I speak. I will splash water on my face. If I'm in the car, I will turn up music and not scoop until the song's over. Basically just buying yourself some time.
to unclench your jaw, to free up your hands from tensing up, slowing down your heart rate that's being elevated, quieting your voice, and just getting your body to a regulated space to where you can talk with respect, to where you can correct without being ugly. Because I did a lot of correcting while being ugly and disrespectful to kids.
And that only caused for skin and fractures in our relationship and it was never worth it. It was never worth it.
Travis (23:28.648)
Yeah.
Courtney Williams (23:31.502)
Such good advice and so true. I like the ice cube one. I haven't heard that one before. That's I'm going to try that one. Yeah.
Travis (23:34.57)
Yeah.
Me too, I need to do that with my wife. I just am very reactive so I need, yeah.
Courtney Williams (23:46.082)
Yeah.
Kayla Moffitt (23:46.983)
Yeah, and I'll tell my kids too, like when they're upset, like, or I'll give them a piece of gum and I'll be like, whenever you can't taste the flavor anymore, that's when we're going to come and talk about this. And for some gum, it's like two seconds later because gum doesn't last either. Sometimes it works. It's just buying yourself some time to get your body and everything. Because so quick, I mean, I have red hair, you guys, like I, my anger.
Courtney Williams (24:03.918)
Yeah
Travis (24:16.318)
Ha ha ha, right.
Kayla Moffitt (24:17.254)
The ceiling like that and same thing with my kids like you know, they they don't have right here, but they They take after you know me with my anger I guess because they get they can get loud explosive quick So buying your body some time to regulate itself It's it's gonna be a gift that you can give not only yourself because you won't have regrets of things that you said how you said it But also a gift for your kids, know, they're not gonna be
Travis (24:20.202)
Yeah.
Courtney Williams (24:23.244)
Mm.
Kayla Moffitt (24:46.906)
hurt by your words or afraid by the volume of your voice. It's just a way to make your home a little safer.
Travis (24:51.604)
Yeah, it's great advice.
Courtney Williams (24:56.425)
Yeah. And teaching them regulating skills, right? We can model those regulating skills and do them together, the co-regulation, doing it together, but also just modeling for them that we too get upset, right? That's part of our nature. If we're going to get upset, we're going to make mistakes, but how can we bring that calm back to the storm?
Travis (25:06.89)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (25:14.982)
We call it catch your calm. You have to catch your calm. So we we're running around trying to catch our calm a lot.
Travis (25:21.482)
ha ha ha
Courtney Williams (25:21.518)
Yeah. Well, speaking of maybe some storms, Kayla, I, like you, have a kiddo diagnosed with RAD, which is reactive attachment disorder. I'm sure you've experienced this as well. I do feel like it's kind of maybe overdiagnosed all of a sudden. I feel like when our kiddo, this was years ago, was diagnosed, it was kind of a new thing. We hadn't heard much about it. But now I kind of feel like maybe it's a little more misdiagnosed or overdiagnosed.
But speaking truly to moms, dads, caregivers of kiddos with reactive attachment disorder, it seems to be lonely and again, misunderstood, misdiagnosed, but just this diagnosis that can lead people to a lot of fear, a lot of uncertainty. How do you describe what RAD is and how do you cope with that as a mom?
Kayla Moffitt (26:16.634)
Yeah, red is a beast.
Courtney Williams (26:19.534)
Hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (26:22.874)
Yeah, that's when I can start. Some of my emotions can, I can start feeling those tears prick my eyes. With rad, you really grieve the relationship with your kids that you thought you would have. Not, and it's not their fault and it's not your fault. And that's, that's one of the hardest parts about it because I think that we, if you're in the rad world, you'll understand what I'm saying when.
Travis (26:30.09)
Hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (26:53.186)
It's hard to describe what's going on within your home and not paint your child as a monster. But our babies are monsters, right? Trauma is. But it's still like, it's just, I wish that I had magic words to say like, this is the trick. This is how you, know, catch your calm with red, put an ice cube in your mouth with red. that's not the reality, at least not in my home.
at its core red is.
response to know profound early trauma that our children have experienced and their needs weren't met and so they found one person in the world that they could rely on and that's them. And so now you know years later they the idea of relying on anyone else seems dangerous because they've just been let down in the past and relationships haven't.
Courtney Williams (27:52.655)
relationship haven't helped in what they would have hoped to do for them. And it's difficult because I guess I've said it before, they come here with great expectations and high expectations. And another thing is that it's difficult when you're having a creative expectation of what you are thinking right now.
Kayla Moffitt (27:53.253)
you know, been what they were supposed to be for them. And it's difficult because like I said, in this space, you come in with great intentions and high expectations, which is another thing that you don't need to have in this space. And it's difficult when you have these great intentions and high expectations because you are thinking like, I'm going to show up for this child every day. I love this child deeply.
Travis (28:09.578)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (28:22.282)
I am providing everything, every need, physical, emotional, mental need is met within my home. And you think like, the more I love this child, the longer I'm around this child, the greater opportunity for trust and relationship to develop. You think like, that's what's going to break down these walls. But what we have found is that's what makes the walls stack up even higher.
Travis (28:50.11)
Mmm.
Kayla Moffitt (28:50.798)
Because then there, you know, our kids can feel when they have a rad diagnosis, they can feel threatened by relationship and scaling those walls can be impossible. And tearing down those walls is just not something that we've been able to achieve yet. And it is extremely isolating. I recently touched on rad very briefly on social media.
and I was reprimanded for it. I was told that like, if this person was my child and they found out that, you know, they grew up and found out that their parent was talking about their diagnosis online, like they would never speak to them again. And even though like I didn't name my child and there was, you know, we have six kids. So like, you wouldn't know who I'm talking about. Like the...
It's a fair statement because our kids deserve dignity and privacy, but also I can't help but think that like, yes, this is my child's diagnosis, but this is also my parenting. This is my daily reality. This is what I'm walking through. And when we tell people that we're not allowed to speak about their reality, we isolate caregivers and we feel isolated and we feel lonely and we feel shameful and
Travis (30:02.154)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (30:15.012)
That's when shame breeds in isolation and burnout and hopelessness and parents who are silenced aren't supported. And support is needed in order to create a safe, physically, emotionally, mentally safe home for these kids. I don't know if I answered the question. I just got off on a tangent.
Travis (30:18.142)
Mm-hmm.
Courtney Williams (30:35.214)
No, that's good. How do you, if somebody were just to ask you, like, is rad? How would you describe it like in a sentence or two?
Kayla Moffitt (30:43.844)
Yeah, it's kids who early on in their years, they had trauma in the sense that their needs weren't met, but with the relationships around them. And so they learn to, you know, it's kind of like you hear about like the kid who cries and if no one shows up, they eventually stop crying. That's our kids. You know, there's no point in crying if I'm hungry because no one's going to come and feed me. There's no point in crying if I want love or a hug or...
some physical touch because no one's gonna come and give me physical touch. And so they learn to soothe themselves. And I don't, you know, I don't know like the complexity of it, like what, as far as what happens in the brain, you know, what switch turns off, I'm not sure, but yeah, it's just our kids who had profound trauma early on and who...
are no longer able to depend on or trust any relationship in their life.
Kayla Moffitt (31:49.414)
you
Travis (31:51.786)
Really difficult. mean, it's just, you, one of the things I've really appreciated in this conversation is just how real you are. And, you know, it's like, this is a lifelong journey. It's not the end. It's not the end of the story. It's not the end of your story, but also just the, I think the point you made about isolation of caregivers and how, aloneness and how that all breeds and kind of grows as a snowball effect. And it's just like,
Courtney Williams (31:52.448)
Thanks.
Kayla Moffitt (31:54.726)
you
Travis (32:21.576)
the shame and stuff as well. yeah, my heart goes out to those that I have my brother and sister-in-law have an adoptive child who I believe may at least have features of that. it's just like, it's incredibly difficult to kind of see the pain and ongoing just work and loss and rinse repeat.
Courtney Williams (32:41.642)
ongoing work and laws and rents for people. Yeah.
Kayla Moffitt (32:45.702)
Yeah, yeah, and you and with rad there's a lot of like I said, it's hard to share about what you experience as a child with rad because it is hard to like, it just sounds like you're like, you know, talking terribly about your child with some of the words that you like manipulation, you know, things like that. We don't want to say that our kids are manipulators, like, you manipulation is like a strength, like really high up there with.
Travis (33:01.77)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (33:13.26)
a rad diagnosis. So like there's masks that you know our kids can wear out in public. So people don't understand what's going on in the home. Like you look at pictures of my family, you would not think, man, you would not think that some of the things that go on in our home go on in our home. You you see our kids that our family at Cracker Barrel, you know after church on Sunday, like we have the most beautiful family. We have the most joyful kids.
But some of that, you know, comes off at home and it is very, very isolating for sure.
Courtney Williams (33:54.77)
Yeah, I'm sure you felt that I feel the tug all the time like social media or just talking with people of, know, I do recruit foster families. It's part of my role. That's part of what I've done for years. And I want to recruit homes, but you also want to be real and honest. And so it's like that fine balance of like of sharing and being real, but also
Our family is lovely and fun and beautiful, even though there is hard stuff. Yeah, just a balance.
Kayla Moffitt (34:19.334)
yeah, yeah because I'm like if we shared everything like nobody would ever do this right? Like if people told me everything that was going on inside their homes before we became foster and adoptive families like I would be like never mind you know like I don't know that I'm cut out for that like and I say all the time like thank God I didn't know what my family would look like.
Courtney Williams (34:25.548)
Yeah.
Travis (34:26.887)
huh, right.
Travis (34:37.49)
Mm-hmm.
Travis (34:41.066)
Mm-hmm.
Travis (34:44.586)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (34:47.206)
Thank you, Lord. 2020 Kayla did not know what 2026 Kayla would have walked through. Because I don't know that I would have said yes to this life. Looking ahead, you know, in 2020, looking back in 2026, I can confidently say that it is the best yes that I've ever given. Man, what a gift it is, you know, to love these kids and the...
Travis (35:09.46)
Mm-hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (35:15.61)
the better person that I am, you know, because of what we've walked through. you know, I say looking ahead in 2020, I don't know that I would have said yes had I known what everything would look like. But I'm so thankful I did.
Travis (35:21.002)
Hmm.
Travis (35:32.564)
Hmm. Yeah. Well said. Well, that's actually a great segue kind of into as we kind of get this home stretch here in this conversation. because related to all of this and the tension between difficulty and staying the course and being encouraged and knowing when it is time to kind of quit because of our resources or capacity, let's talk some about foster parent attrition, which we've definitely hit hit in this podcast, in the past on episodes, but
Courtney Williams (35:54.954)
I'm talking about foster care and nutrition, which is definitely good. It's this podcast in the past, but your experience, Caleb, personally, but also in other fields, what do you really feel is my foster care and nutrition?
Travis (36:02.566)
In your experience, Kayla personally, but also just in dealing with other peers and friends in the space, what do you really feel is behind foster parent attrition? And then any ideas or insights on, you know, kind of, mitigating some of that.
Courtney Williams (36:12.974)
Any ideas or insights on that? I work in a place that's been here for more than a year. I think that lot of times it's just a of what I do. I think all of it is sitting in here. It's an unrealistic idea.
Kayla Moffitt (36:18.682)
Yeah, I worked in the space for three years and then have, you know, I've lived in it for five years. I've kind of touched on this a little bit earlier, but I do think that a lot of foster parents show up the same way that I did with, you know, big heart, good intentions, but unrealistic expectations, unintentional ignorance, and even a bit of a savior complex.
And if I can be honest, had no, I had no business becoming a mom to five kids overnight. I was not prepared. I was not ready. by the time I realized I needed help, my world was already on fire. I was already drowning and you know, we want to retain homes. have to normalize struggle early.
we have to show up and surround these families. You know, it's so many times and at least where I've worked and things that I've done, like families are reaching out for help after, like I said, their world is already on fire and it's really hard to put a fire that size out. You know, but if we are showing up early, if we are providing wraparound support, you know, if it's normalizing,
that this is going to be hard from day one, not meeting these families with excitement and simple texts like, me know what I can do for you without actually ever doing anything and actually lifting a finger. If we can get past that, then we can keep foster families here and we can keep homes open. It's about leaving a pan of lasagna on your front porch.
you know, the first Friday of every month or offering respite on, you know, one Sunday a month. It's less about being told how amazing we are, how nobody could ever do what we do. How, you know, like I said, let me know if you need anything and, and I end saying like, no, I can't be a foster parent. I'm not called to do this. This is not a season of life that I'm in, but I can support a foster parent and I can surround a foster family.
Kayla Moffitt (38:41.83)
and actually doing that and showing up. Not just, you know, not just saying good intentions of, let me know if you need anything. I say that because that's what I've met with a lot, you know. I have a whole lot of, I have a long list of people I can let them know if I need anything. But when you're in the midst of trauma and grief and overwhelm, the last thing I want to do is, is text somebody and ask them for help. You know, I'd rather, much rather just.
Travis (38:50.42)
Mm-hmm.
Travis (39:08.66)
Hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (39:10.118)
receive a text saying like, I'm, you know, bringing dinner on Friday. Do you have any allergies in your home? And you know, that that that's, say food a lot. Maybe I'm the south. You know, like I haven't had breakfast yet. But we have a big family, you know, so just things like that just literally are a lot changing. That's a lot. You know, if I know that, I can just get to Friday night because this family from church
Travis (39:23.048)
I'm getting hungry.
Kayla Moffitt (39:40.247)
every Friday night brings my family a pan of lasagna and a chocolate sheet cake, then I'm going to get to Friday night. And it's something that we can all look forward to. Like my kids will know, okay, every Friday night, like the Pattersons from church are bringing over chocolate, we get chocolate cake, you know, like just little things like that. That's what's key. That's what will keep foster families from closing. That's what keeps, you know, families from giving up.
Courtney Williams (39:48.482)
And it's something that we can all afford to do. I think it's a little bit of a shame. there's a of people we're going to have a Republican. We're going get a Republican. Like, if we're going to have that, I hope that's the best that we're going to be able do. That's what we're going
Travis (39:49.194)
Hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (40:09.892)
knowing that people are showing up and surrounding them.
Courtney Williams (40:15.008)
Yeah, so true. And I'm just going to encourage people, if you're listening, we have a new training out. It's part of our trauma sensitivity workshop. But also we have part of that is what is foster care, what's helpful and what isn't helpful. And it's specifically for people supporting foster families. they're not that I know of. There's not another training like that out there, but it is a training specific of people who want to help. And it goes through like.
Travis (40:15.06)
Yeah.
Courtney Williams (40:40.482)
All sorts of things that are helpful, things that aren't helpful, language to use, questions not to ask, why, and all that. So I highly encourage you to check that out. We will link that in our show notes for people to find easily to that training because like Kayla's talking about, it does make a difference for me, our families and people surrounding us.
Travis (40:42.89)
Mm-hmm.
Travis (40:57.332)
Yeah. Yeah. I'm glad you said that Courtney. And you know, it's also a good reminder too, of what Kayla said of, that it's kind of a two way street, you know, they're there. I mean, we need to, as foster parents ask for help, you know, we need to, and, but when we know our people and have that support, also if you're that, that support that whether it's a meal or a tangible thing, but just being there to process.
Kayla Moffitt (40:58.064)
still in.
Travis (41:25.482)
loss, grief, what they're going through and know that just because you're not fostering, I mean, we want to have those peers as supports that really do know what we're doing and can really relate. even people that don't know they can still be there and be a shoulder to lean on or just share. Because a lot of it for some people is just feeling so alone. No one even knows what we're going through. It doesn't mean that the person has to have all the answers, but that they're there to listen can help us even process. So anyway, kind of a
Courtney Williams (41:45.921)
You know, mean that the person has got all the answers, but they're very different. Anyway, kind of one of our favorite questions is, how are we going to fix that? What is it possible for bullying to be serious?
Travis (41:54.77)
One of our favorite questions is to close the podcast is to ask, how would you finish the sentence? What kids in foster care really need is.
Kayla Moffitt (42:06.918)
I like, is what? Like, oh no, I'm supposed to answer it. I was like, waiting on you to finish it. Yeah, no. Oh gosh, what kids in foster care really need. I feel like there are a million right answers. I'll go back to what my kids really needed.
Travis (42:10.0)
Yeah.
Dah-hah!
Kayla Moffitt (42:30.018)
they needed to be met exactly where they were.
So I needed to meet, they weren't able to meet me halfway and I shouldn't have ever expected them to. I needed to meet them exactly where they were. That's what they needed from me. So that's, I needed to lower my expectations. They needed time to grieve and heal and process. They needed time to learn a new normal. Like it's...
We know what foster care is, but I think sometimes we forget that, we're, these kids are showing up in our homes and we are strangers, like, to them. Like, we may know that we're good people. We know, we may know that we're good parents. We may know that we've been fostering for five, 10, 15 years, but these babies are showing up on our front porch. They have no idea about that, nor do they really care. Their world has just been
turned upside down, no matter what that world looked like, they're about to have to, you know, walk into a new normal, navigate all new things. You know, they wake up at two in the morning the first night at your house and they don't even know where the bathroom is. So like meeting these kids where they are, giving them time to process, giving them time before you're, you know, trying to even correct or discipline or anything like that that we think is so important and it is.
but it's important later on. I was very, very guilty of trying to rush my children into a new life because like I said, we knew going into this that adoption was gonna be part of our story. And so it wasn't, I'll love you for however long you're here. It's like, this is our family now, know, that we're building a life together. Like this is it. And my expectations were too high. And you know, that's whenever you start.
Courtney Williams (44:03.822)
I
Kayla Moffitt (44:28.28)
you don't meet your kids where they are, start saying things like, you should know this or you know better than this or you should be doing this by now. You're nine years old. You shouldn't still be doing this. And that's just not helpful or beneficial. And that's not going to create, you know, cultivate a healthy relationship with these kids. For my kids, because of what they went through, their minds and bodies, emotions, they were not
you know, at a place to meet maturity or meet milestones. They were greatly behind everything from school and academics to just being able to share a toy and not, you know, have a meltdown at church. Things that, like I said, you would think that like you should know this by now, like my kids weren't there yet.
And me, you know, putting all these expectations on them, not meeting them where they were, that just caused, you know, some heartache in the beginning. So what kids in foster care really need is to be met exactly where they are, even if that's teenagers with toddler tendencies, you know.
Courtney Williams (45:48.316)
Yeah, so good. Kayla, thank you for joining us. Thank you for sharing real and honest and
Travis (45:51.338)
Thank
Courtney Williams (45:56.618)
I have followed you for a very long time on social media, so I know that you post great things and just you're like that on social media as well. Very real and make me think a lot, stop and consider things. And so how could other people follow you and find you on socials?
Kayla Moffitt (46:12.26)
Yeah, I'm on all socials. username is making them office. So it's my last name. Who else to tease? Yeah, if you need a friend in the foster care space, I'm here. I'm up today. I always say that I wanted to be what 2020 Kayla needed. I want it to be 2020 Kayla needed because she's still out there. And so that's that's to my heart's for.
Travis (46:33.652)
Hmm.
Kayla Moffitt (46:40.484)
So I'm here, I'm here if you need a friend.
Travis (46:43.476)
Awesome.
Courtney Williams (46:44.46)
It's awesome. Well, thanks again, Kayla. You have a great day.
Kayla Moffitt (46:48.932)
Thank you guys.