Brian R Kenyon (00:02.702)
Jesus gave his wife a ransom number on Calvary, on Mount Calvary, cruel Calvary. Wave the wave by blood that we might wave. Hello, this is Brian Kenyon, host of the Harvest Seeds of Unity podcast, and I have co-hosts with us here today. Go ahead. Yeah, Forrest Enemissaris. This is Stephen Ford.
Alright, we appreciate your being here listening to this first ever podcast. And as I mentioned, name of this is Harvest Seeds of Unity, and I'll tell you why that name came about. And of course, that name is subject to change later on when we find a cuter, better name. But the idea is that there's unity in the Brotherhood we want to have, and we're going take a look at Ephesians 4 here in just a moment. But in my experience in the Brotherhood, I was baptized into Christ in 1982.
And there have been, ever since I've known brethren, people who divide over things that they shouldn't be dividing over. And so this podcast, with this podcast, we hope to show Scripture to show that we can have, some things are obligatory, some things are prohibited, but some things are optional, and there are many things that we divide over that are optional that we should not be dividing over. And so through this podcast, we're gonna look at many, many things involved with that.
many subjects and such. for this first podcast, we want to discuss unity and the basis of unity. so. Yeah, I mean, unity is obviously an important subject, right? It's something that we read about a lot in the New Testament. But I think that, you know, you can't really talk about unity without talking about.
what we have in common obviously, which I think is what sometimes is thrown by the wayside when we divide over things that maybe we shouldn't be dividing over, you know, when you talk about, know, one verse that always comes to my mind whenever we have this conversation is first Corinthians chapter 12 verse 13, where we talk about, you know, being baptized into the same body, into one body by the same spirit. And, you know, obviously you can't have,
Brian R Kenyon (02:20.234)
unity without a basis of unity and there's no stronger basis of unity than what God has done for us through his son Jesus. Yes. Yes. that unity, when I think of unity, I first think of chapter, Ephesians chapter four and verse three, endeavoring to keep the unity of the spirit and the bond of peace. And that endeavoring there is the idea of, you know, going at it full time. you know, making every effort is the Greek word there, that what it means
And so it's endeavoring to keep it. In other words, it's already set by the standard of Scripture, but to keep it is what our obligation is. I would also add that we need to know what unity is. You you hear the word thrown around, and you may mean one thing, and he may mean one thing. It's not necessarily that we're just all in one room together. It's not necessarily we all just look alike in that, but unity's...
definition as you can find in the scriptures has a lot more to do with what we think how we live excuse me in our adherence and faithfulness to God than it does with anything else so it's not just that okay we meet in the same room together same building together and so when we're thinking about maintaining that unity now we have to make sure that everybody involved understands what is it that we're maintaining how is it that we have
come to even establish it in the first place with each other. Yeah, and of course the word unity, I'm looking for that word unity, and it's the idea of oneness, it's the idea of sameness, and let me get the exact...
thing here. All right, intonation is the word there, at least in Ephesians 4 verse 3, it's a state of oneness or of being in harmony and accord. Unity, and Bauer and Gingrich does give Ephesians 4.3 is that definition, and so it's the idea of being of one accord in unity. And one passage I also think about that I think, I don't know if it's a misunderstanding or a misapplication, but in 1 Corinthians 1.10,
Brian R Kenyon (04:28.002)
We have that famous passage there about, you know, Paul heard from the house of Chloe that there's division among them. And of course he says, know, some I am of Paul, I'm of Paulus, I'm of Cephas, I'm of Christ, et cetera. But in verse 10, now I beseech you or plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that you all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. And I think a lot of...
people read that verse they think we have to think exactly alike on every little thing even areas where we you know we do have a we can have a difference of opinion on something yet we have to have the same opinion writing right as a lot of people get a common the same judgment call right otherwise we're not really united right but that's that's not true as you know
And of course there's been ways to explain that. I've heard some say, well, that's the only way you can do that is with the elders. You know, the eldership makes the decision and then the congregation follows and thus they're all on the same page. But then that only applies to congregations with elders. so, what if you have a congregation that doesn't have elders? so, and then like of the three of us here, there's two different congregations that were under different elderships. And so how would that apply here? You know, it just wouldn't. But I think the key to it is, that
same mind and same judgment that we all understand whatever's obligatory is obligatory whatever's prohibitive is prohibited but whatever we have options just realize that we have options in that area right right well that's where the endeavoring comes in too because obviously i'm sure we'll get into this more you know as this podcast goes on maybe not this episode but if i thought my opinion was wrong i wouldn't hold that opinion
You what saying? Like that is so I do feel strongly about the opinions I have otherwise I wouldn't have them, you know, because that's kind of what makes an opinion opinion. So am I willing to look past that into what God has said and do the work that's necessary on my end to maintain unity through that? I think that's I'm sure we'll get to that more. I think a lot of times that's where the hurdle might be, you know, because you can only endeavor for something that you want. So for me, that's where that always starts. Do I want to be united? And if I want to be united,
Brian R Kenyon (06:44.846)
on the right things then then we have to work for it. There's also some humility that needs to be involved too to recognize that this is actually an opinion and so if I have an opinion about a thing I can't say well because my opinion is rooted in a scripture that I have now a right to impose that upon another person. to realize hey this is just an opinion whether or not I want to do this thing I can't say well Brian because I have this opinion.
and it is rooted in scripture now it's authoritative. It doesn't make it authoritative, it's merely an opinion of mine. Yeah, and there's differences of opinions at different levels, I guess we could say, like for example, you know, why did Nicodemus come to Jesus by night? You know, something like that. We could have disagreements and still be cool, but then, you know, how does the Holy Spirit end well? Or, you know, what is other areas that's like...
people are really strong about, if you don't believe this way, you're not in my group, and if you don't believe that way, you're not in that group. And so there's different levels, I guess, and I guess what are those levels, you know? You know, why Nicodemus came to Jesus by night is kind of peripheral, maybe. Whereas maybe Holy Spirit indwelling or, you know, can an elder...
if his kids go bad when they're adults can he still serve you and there's all kinds of opinions like that and that some brethren had divided over then of course you take in the non-institutional issues that's a whole different level of things too but it's still just matters of option that's why this passage that we're studying in phoesian chapter four is of great importance at least in my estimation because it kind of dives into
what are some things, at least in my estimation as I read it, some things upon which we must have agreement. And things upon which there can be no debate or opinion in polls. These are some kind of rock solid foundational doctrines and teachings that we have to come to agreement on and understand that these are true no matter what. Yeah, and that's a good point. That's a good segue into looking at that.
Brian R Kenyon (08:47.054)
In verse 4, there's one body and one spirit, just as we are called into one hope of your calling, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is above all and through all and in you all. And so I've often observed on those seven ones, we often call them, that, you know, nobody would argue that there's one spirit, one God the Father, one Lord Jesus Christ, but yet just as sure as there's one
Godhead there's also as he says here one body one hope in which you are called one faith one baptism and Etc and so so yes, but this is a good good foundation to start with and so let's look at those one by one There's one body Can I go to this and I was you can say kind of going backward a little bit to where force was like kind of leading in
in verse one, or excuse me, verse two, it demonstrates the method by which we have to do this also. So though you may have an opinion, or it may be something that's not an opinion, something we have to be agreed upon scripturally, the method by which I approach you has to be kind of reigned in by these things, lowliness, meekness, longsuffering, forbearing, with love. So I still have to recognize you're my brother.
And you can be dead wrong, or I can be dead wrong. But regardless, you're still my brother and I have to demonstrate the love of Christ. I love you like Jesus loves. So I can't just blast you and automatically jump off and say, hey, you're a false wicked teacher because you may be mistaken, or that I'm a false wicked teacher because I'm mistaken. We've got to have that sort of patience with each other to say, hey, let's study this more. Because I may have an opinion and think that yours is an opinion, but I could be the one in fact that's wrong. Yeah, that's a good point.
Yes, one body, yes, so the attitude behind it is loneliness, long-suffering, etc. And that's true in a lot of things. In fact, as Stephen was talking, I was just thinking about how many passages of instruction are preceded by similar descriptions as that. You know, I'm thinking Philippians 2,
Brian R Kenyon (11:00.238)
you verse five where he says let this mind be in you but if you go back to verses three and four it's the same type of thing that we have here in Ephesians four two. like some of that's like in Colossians three as well, you know, that idea of you know, because there's all, I mean there's always a lot of passages to your point, you know, when I was at Freed, Ralph Gilmore used to call the stake in the sizzle, you know, where you kind of have like the essence of a thing which is usually what you're supposed to do.
That's the stake. But then you have the sizzle, which is like how you're supposed to do it. Right. Oh, wow. Where it's like you're supposed the stake here, I think, is endeavoring to keep the unity and the bond of peace. But the sizzle is with the humility, with the lowliness, with the love, you know, where it's like we could say, hey, we're all going to be united. And I just come and beat you over the head and get you to submit to what I'm going to do. And we could be united, but that's not united with lowliness and love and longsuffering, et cetera. You know, so a lot of times, you know, it's not just
how you do a thing, or not just what you do, it's how you do that thing, you know? I think there's another example of that where it's, hey, here's what we're united on, to Stephen's point, here's the basis, but here's how you gotta go about doing it. that, sometimes people wanna elevate one above the other, and I don't think you can, right? We could be united on those things, but without humility, without love, without long suffering, we still got some work to do. And no matter how we receive the word, whether it is you and I conversing to try to find unity,
Try to understand what the Bible says we must be unified on or if it's me Receiving the word myself is still attitude involved. I'm thinking of James 121 he says laying aside all Filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness receive the meat does receive with meekness thing grafted word, which is able to save your soul so even before The word, you know is able to penetrate take root
I have to put away some stuff so in the same regard we come back to Ephesians I've got to put away arrogance I've to put away anger, wrath or any of those things that are contrary to verse 2 there in order to maintain that unity but also in verse 3 says in the bond of peace
Brian R Kenyon (13:06.734)
So it's not just make sure, like you said, for us to make sure that we're all on same page. We have to do so in a method of peace so that we're not beating one another over the head, so to speak, or any other sort of thing, but to make sure it's done in the same way that our Lord did when he was teaching, preaching, and so on. Yeah, very good point. I mean, that's a great point. It kind of just brought to my head a phrase. Maybe you all have heard this before. But we should do Jesus things in Jesus ways.
Right? Because you could do a Jesus thing, you know, but not maybe not in a Jesus way because it's like, okay, that's not the way Jesus would go about doing that from what we have from the scriptures, you know. So I think we see that here. Yeah, very good. All right. So endeavoring to keep the unity of the spirit, bond of peace, there is one body. And of course, it's clear what the body is, especially through Ephesians, and that is the church. And so there's one church and we definitely, you know, that's a basis of our unity of one church.
And as one said earlier, I think maybe Stephen said earlier about 1 Corinthians 12-13, or was that four? We're all baptized into one body, okay? 1 Corinthians 12-13. So we're baptized into that one body. And so anyone who is truly obedient to the gospel and is baptized as part of the one church, the one body. Yeah. And I think Ephesians especially is one of those books that really helps us understand what
What the Bible is talking about here when it talks about body, know, Ephesians 1 22 to 23 the body of Christ over which he's had Ephesians 5 talking about, know, especially verses, you know, 22 through 33 down in there where, um, you know, the, the church is not only the bride of Christ, but as the body of Christ, you know, throwing back all the way to Genesis with the institution of marriage, but so we're kind of sandwiched between there's no, and
Maybe not a lot of people, I think, in churches of Christ, but I met a lot of people, friends in the denominational world, who will argue, like, how do you know a body there is talking about the church? And it's like, well, what else could it possibly be talking about? Especially here in the book of Ephesians, when you've got Ephesians 1 and Ephesians 5 right there sandwiched between it. Yeah, and that's a good point. He's a savior of the body in Ephesians 5. The body is the church.
Brian R Kenyon (15:30.875)
Though in Colossians as well, 118, the church is the body and the body is the church. And so we keep, so we're all, that unifies us one body and there's one spirit, even as you were called in one hope of your calling. And of course there is just one Holy spirit, but notice that hope of your calling, one hope of your calling. I think this is one of those areas where I think two of these, in my experience, there's debate over, obviously this is the foundation of
what we're unified on, but these terms themselves sometimes are debated, right? So at what point do I divert from the one hope that the Bible is talking about here? Maybe that's something we could talk about in another episode, but because I've seen brethren kind of, know, disfellowship and debate over what we might call, you know, eschatological things or end times things based on violating this idea of one hope.
You know, does one hope, you know, what's the extent of that one hope? I think is a good question that that a lot of people are asking, you know, obviously, you've got the whole renovated earth discussion and that debate and things like that, where it's like, what point do I forsake the one hope that Paul is talking about here in Ephesians four. So that would be something down the road, you know, here. But here, I think hope and faith are two things where, especially faith, it's really easy sometimes to smuggle things in where.
There's things that I say are a part of the one faith that maybe are a matter of opinion. And I might disregard you because I say you're not a part of the one faith. But how I define the one faith is what I read in scripture plus these strong convictions that I have. Right. So I think the basis is the basis here in Ephesians 4. we have to be honest about, you know, to what extent do we make these, you know, make sure we don't smuggle anything in.
especially with the faith topic is what I'm talking about here. Make sure we don't smuggle anything into the one faith and make sure that the one faith that we're building on is the one faith presented in scripture and not scripture plus something else. It'd be a good discussion to then parse out each one of these words. Right. Right. what all is involved in each of these words is like you mentioned there, you could try to stuff in a lot, especially with terms like body I think is
Brian R Kenyon (17:53.839)
especially through the book of Ephesians, you can very clearly see... Pretty cut and dry. Spirit, Lord, God, think, you know, even baptism. Yeah. And then when you get into hope and faith in particular, you might be able to be a little bit more, or those terms may seem to be more ambiguous, at least in this particular book, perhaps. so you might have some variety on what a person might think that means. And I think it's easier to smuggle things in.
because you somebody says you know my hope is to walk on the streets of gold and if you say there's not going to be literal streets of gold there now we've got a problem right because i'm saying you violated the one hope now i'm not saying anybody says that i'm just saying like we could get to that level where you know like what what is the components of this hope and i'm not trying to open a can of worms here or kick the can down the road or anything like that it might be has to have to be something we talk about later but
the a lot of these things i think in the bible super current i would say even faith you know we're willing to just see what the bible says about the faith and maybe if they you know people argue is that personal faith is that the faith delivered once for all but the faith delivered once for all i think there's no we have to do you get a dig into the book but you can see what comprises that and even personal faith has to be based on the faith was right right great point yeah but the first thing i think about my read
Ephesians 4 anyway with the one hope is just what what is the basic principle of our hope? You know, that's of course is Jesus Christ where Jesus Christ bind all those but you know, I think of Colossians 127 Christ in you the hope of glory, of course, there's a different hope maybe of glory But you know, what is the basis of that? Hope and of course we get to include with that, you know God's plan of salvation. Yeah, in other words I look at it as the the basis behind the hope not the
The itself. Not the end of the hope, but what's foundational to it versus the extent of it. The end of it. But I just jotted that down for maybe a future discussion, the one hope. Yeah, I would love that discussion. And I do think there are, I mean, there are groups that, you know, would say, especially if you read 1 Corinthians 15, if you read, you know, Paul, when he talks about, when he's on trial somewhere in the book of Acts, you'll probably know where this is, where he says, you
Brian R Kenyon (20:14.545)
Regards to the hope of the resurrection of the dead, right? So I think that the resurrection of the dead is a big part of that and if And there's groups. I mean there's people who you know are trying to be in the brotherhood who deny a Future resurrection of the dead and in my opinion I would say like once you're in that territory that I mean that is like you're you've departed from the one hope So I think it is possible you can have a hope and it not be the one hope. You know what I mean? Yeah, it has to be I think we need to have a
describe, define, to hope, and not just what I personally hope for, you know? There are things that, you know, I may hope to find out this, you know, I wonder what happened if I can ask the Lord this question when I get to have those sorts of things, but the hope, I think, is defined in Scripture. And if you look at various passages, you can find out what the components of that hope are, you know, it's mentioned in a few places. The singing of Hebrews chapter 6 in particular about that hope.
Christ but there are several places. As I mentioned, I would really love to be able to spend some time, you know, on that episode, kind of just on that alone. Yeah, we will. We'll do that in the future for sure. Alright, but one hope. One hope of your calling, one Lord. I think it's, well, I think it's apparent that he's using Spirit in verse 4, the Holy Spirit, Lord as Jesus Christ in verse 5. In verse 6 he does say God. The word and, as you know from Greek, can mean even, the Father.
God, you know, it's not two people, but God the Father. so, but anyway, one faith, and of course one faith, kind of, it's probably in that same category as the one hope, pretty broad, you know? Yeah, yeah. And so maybe we can do one, well, one faith later on too, but anyway, but one faith definitely is the objective gospel plan of salvation.
Well, you know, not just salvation, but everything that's involved. Jude 3, once for all, delivered. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The faith. Yeah, that's a whole thing. You know, the faith, of course, we would kind of talk about the gospel, but even what is the gospel? I think that we can sometimes minimize it to only, my sins are washed away, you know, which is not the full picture, I don't believe. You know, there's a lot more to say about the good news about the reign of Christ.
Brian R Kenyon (22:36.425)
about the kingdom, things of that nature. So even with the faith, it's like, what all is made up of that as well?
Brian R Kenyon (22:47.577)
yellow include like the doctrine of christ i mean one thing about well gosley steven mentioned gospel and i've always thought you know well death barrel resurrection is the foundation of the gospel of course but i would compare that to the ten commandments you know it's the foundation to the old law but there's a lot more to the old law that just the ten commandments it's a good analogy never heard that and that's good and the death of the resurrection the gospel's tied into it
But it's like in Galatians 2 verse 11 through 14 where Paul had to withstand Peter to the face. Verse 14 says, he walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel. And so the gospel would include how we treat one another and that kind of thing, which ties into the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ, but again, it's not limited to it. And so I think faith, the one faith is like that as well. It's inclusive.
Basically what Jesus taught of what through the New Testament. Yeah, absolutely. And even that, know, I think the one Lord, one God, father of us all, one spirit, you know, I think you can make an argument there. Maybe it's not a strong argument, but I think you could even make an argument there where certain flavors of belief in God that deny
that there is a God the Father, a God the Son, a Holy Spirit, who are all God, right? I think, because there, I mean, maybe not so much in the Brotherhood, but certainly in the world, you know, we can't have unity with those who are claiming to be Christians and they deny that Jesus is God. Because at that point, I mean, I would argue we're not serving the same Lord, right? We don't have that same one Lord. Like, you can't say, yeah, Jesus is my Lord, but he's not.
and just deny like the fundamental truths about who Jesus is. And then, you know, so I think that's important to keep in mind too, where it's not just, yeah, Jesus is my Lord. Where it's like, well, who's Jesus? Right? Like that, I think the nature of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit is a part of that too, I think. It's interesting also that he did not list them in order consecutively.
Brian R Kenyon (25:06.449)
So there's something in between. So you see the separate nature of each one. You've got Spirit, then you've got Hope, then you've got Lord, then you've got Faith and Baptism, and then you have God the Father. And so you see the distinction of each one there. So religions like oneness, Pentecostalism, that would dash those sorts of attendance that they would teach, because he he's parsed them out to demonstrate that they are unique, one from the other. Yeah, that's a great point. Unique personalities. One nature, though, of deity.
right yeah very good so one faith we may do something more on that lady than one baptism and I believe that there's about eight different baptisms if I remember correctly if you go through the New Testament you know baptism of John Holy Spirit baptism baptism
in the exodus, you know, under the cloud, through the sea. Baptism of suffering. Baptism of fire. There you go. And so there's several baptisms that we can read in our Bible, but yet there's only one baptism that's good for all time. And of course, I think that's also pretty obvious through Scripture, that that's immersion in water for the remission of our sins, as per Acts 2.38, as per...
Matthew 28 19 as per mark 16 16 etc I think and I think Matthew 28 mark 16 are huge for that because I always kind of you know, I've been asked before you know, is that one baptism from Ephesians 4 and Maybe there might you know, there might feel free to poke holes in this but I like to refer to it sometimes just so people I know the people I'm talking to an hour on the same page as great commission baptism, right? They baptism that Jesus commanded his apostles for all time
to go out and do. That's the baptism we're talking about here. Because that's the only baptism that, one, you see Jesus kind of hand off to the apostles, and then you see them replicate again and again and again and again again. Right? Because, you know, a big thing, you'll be talking to somebody and they're like, baptism, well, is that in the Spirit or is that in water? And I said, well, that's kind of a moot point once you study what we're talking about when we talk about baptism, right? But
Brian R Kenyon (27:19.697)
I think that's a good distinction where you do have these multiple baptisms, but the baptism that Jesus commanded, that we see the Apostles replicate, Acts 2.38, all throughout the book of Acts, really, that it's very clear that that is the basis of our unity, that that is the one baptism. Yeah. In the Gospels, Matthew 28 and...
Mark 16, of course, that's right when Jesus is about ready to go back to the Father. And then it's publicly announced for the first time in Acts 2.38 on that day at Pentecost. And from that point on, as Forrest mentioned, that's the only baptism we see people being converted. Now we do have Holy Spirit baptism, chapter 2, and then also chapter 10, but really chapter 11. Vax. That explains, chapter 11, 15 through 17, explains the house of Cornelius in Acts chapter 10.
And I would say too, we know that that's not the one baptism here because that's not, you know, I would, I would say normative for a Christian experience, right? Like you've got, I mean, I'm my understanding you've got two groups of people who are, who have that Holy Spirit baptism. And from my understanding, that's it. Right? So if we're talking about the one baptism that all Christians share, it's not, it's going to be the baptism that Jesus commanded for people to perform with others. Right. And that's the whole point there is.
Jesus never tells anybody to baptize anybody with the Holy Spirit, because that's not how it works. So I think it's very clear when you talk about what do we work, because Ephesians 4 is about what we share, what true Christians share, and it's that baptism in water for the forgiveness of sins and immersion. Yeah, that's the one you'll find the command and the practice throughout. You'll find the other kind of interspersed in there, but if you look, which one is the common one that happened all the time when there's salvation involved, the one that's preached and taught?
it's always immersion in water, not the other. And I too, you see people get immersed with water and have the baptism of the Holy Spirit, but you never see people have the baptism of Holy Spirit, I would argue, and not get immersed in water. Right? So I think that even tells you which one is, you know, obviously we don't have the apostles, you know, the apostles we could talk about when they were baptized and how, cetera, but Cornelius and his household are still baptized with water.
Brian R Kenyon (29:36.209)
in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of their sins. So I that tells us too that if we're going to have this debate over which one's more lasting, which one's more important, to use that word, it's obvious that it's in water, in Jesus' name, for forgiveness. Yeah, that's a good point. also, baptism in the Holy Spirit or with the Holy Spirit, as all the context always has mentioned in there, for John truly baptized with water, but he, Jesus, will baptize in the Holy Spirit.
It always has that connected with it in Acts 1-5 and in Acts 10 or Acts 11 15 through 17. So that's an indicator that that's Holy Spirit, baptism in the Holy Spirit, not their usual baptism. And the usual baptism as was mentioned is throughout the book of Acts and beyond. All right, so one baptism, one God and Father of all who is above all through all and in you all. And so that's the
the basis of unity and of course included and I would argue included in the one faith maybe even the one hope but the one faith for sure would be different options you know and I always like to use a classic example of eating meat sacrifice to idolies right I mean is it okay to eat that yes unless it caused my brother to sin so but that's that option is part of the
objective, unchanging faith, you know what I'm And so it's still there as an option. And so as per 1 Corinthians 1-10, we don't always have to come to the same conclusion as to why, for example, Nicodemus came to Jesus by night. You know, we can still have a different opinion on that and still not violate any of those seven ones in Ephesians chapter 4. Yeah, that's a great point.
And where it starts, I I don't want to belabor this point, but where it starts is so important, you know, in verses two and three there, because if you don't have those things, the lowliness of mind, the love, the long suffering, et cetera, and the unity is really an impossible project, you know, and we can't make the unity. think there it's pretty clear that God is the one who unifies us. We're endeavoring to keep it, right? So it's like, hey, God's like, hey, look at what I got you.
Brian R Kenyon (31:59.281)
And it's like, okay, now are we gonna work together to keep it? Yeah, so God gives it to us and we just have to keep it, we have to maintain it. We have to, you know, it's already there. The system, it's already set, the parameters, it's all there. Right. It's just up to us. Yeah, he dictates what it is. I don't know if we're gonna get to, I don't know, talk about this, but also we would ask, know, okay, we know that we should have unity, but then what is its benefit?
Okay, we got Unity then, so now what? It's kind of a question. I don't know if we're gonna have time to get there, you hadn't determined to go there or not. Yeah, we can briefly touch on that, yeah. I don't I'm just podcasting, so I don't know if we have a certain clock time or There's not even a clock in this room, so I mean, we could. Well, I'll just.
Oh, there you go. Okay. We a timer. We just discovered a timer. No clock, but well with just a few seconds. I'll just you know, I'm thinking about the the benefit I guess you might say of unity and We know that we should have it But then What is its purpose? What does it do? And I'm thinking of the same book same chapter even but just going a little bit later verses 14 through 16 Where Paul would write that we henceforth?
be no more children tossed to and fro, and cared about with every wind of doctrine by the slight of men and cunning craftiness whereby they lie in wait to deceive. But speaking the truth in love may grow up unto him in all things which is the head, even Christ, whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplies according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, make an increase of the body into the edifying of itself in love.
And when we can be together, unified, scripturally on what we just read in verses one through six there, it strengthens the body. And there's a benefit in not just the local congregation, but the body as a whole can be strengthened, be stronger, more effective in the things that we do so that we're not busy trying to put out little fires of things that we are bickering over like we started out talking about opinions.
Brian R Kenyon (34:17.152)
that we can have unity where we need to have it and get out and do the work that we're supposed to be doing. And every person is contributing to the strength of the local church and every person and every local congregation is collectively working together to go out and save those that are lost. Yeah. Yeah, that's a great point. think too, you know, we've got Jesus's words in John 17 always come to my mind too, you know, that prayer for unity for us believers so that the world may believe Jesus says to the father that you have sent me.
And I think, you you think about, for me, I always think about in the first place, all the harm that is done because of a lack of unity. And by harm, I mean, you know, a division of resources, not working together. I think the world looking at us and seeing us be no more unified than the world is. And the shame and the reproach that sometimes that brings onto the body of Christ and the opinion that folks have about the church where it's like, okay, you guys,
because so there's brothers and sisters and you can't even get along, you but then to there's there's the bad part, but there's also all the good that can be done when we are unified, not only in the world, seeing that and saying, OK, there is a God, but also, you know, I just think about especially here in Florida. I'm sure we'll get into some of the non-institutional stuff, you know, if if all of us really worked together on the same page and could become united on what God has said.
just the manifold impact we could have when it comes to things like evangelism, when it comes to things like shining light in our community, et cetera, because now we could all work together rather than being splintered up, you know? So I think that you see how, you know, just like Jesus said, a house divided against itself cannot stand, you know? So we need that in order to be everything that God would have us to be. Yeah, that's a point, because when the
question was first asked was the benefit of me they thought of the exact same two points only i did have the john seventeen but i didn't think about four eleven to twelve right there but the benefit is it builds up the body when the bodies built up the evangelism part is there that the world may know that jesus sent and that's one reason why there's so much disdain for religion maybe doubt in religion something like that is because
Brian R Kenyon (36:40.127)
people see the world all around and you say you're right, you say you're right, you say these guys are wrong, these guys are you know, what isn't? So they just give up and throw it all away. But if we truly had the unity, and even to the point that both you brothers made about even the Church of Christ, if we just had the unity within the Church of Christ, the denomination world would lose a lot of its power, a lot of its attraction if we just had that unity. But unfortunately people look at the Church of Christ, one here, one there, and you know.
different things and so we're always seems like when evangelism, I'm a lot of times myself anyway trying to at least somewhere in the study comes up why is that a church Christ and you have anything to do with them or this that and the other thing and it's like I hate to have to tell them you know and sometimes it's not the right time to tell them at that point anyway but you know. it is a good question. Yeah. their you know in their defense I mean that is a good question. Yeah in fact Steve and I were studying with a lady not too long ago and she was baptized and right
two blocks away there's another Church of Christ. But it's like, we're not in fellowship with them. And so she didn't bring it up and she didn't ask and I'm kinda glad she didn't, but I woulda had to said something truthful about that. So I'm just glad we didn't have to, but that's a shame it has to be like that. Well doesn't have to be like that, a shame it is like that. And so we're trying to correct that. It really does say something about God when we are.
divided so much, know, that's one of the, I think the powerful points of our Lord's ministry is that people tried at every point to accuse Him of departing from God or departing from Moses and there was never departure in terms of teaching and living or any of those things. And so that prayer is so reflective of that unity. And he's saying that I want you all effectively to be like me and my father in the unity there.
And when you see that there was never departure in purpose, there was never departure in vision, there was never departure in any of those things. And so that is the sort of thing that we should have. And so when Jesus says, I want you to be like that so that the world can believe. I want you to love each other like I love so that the world can know that you are my people. Those are some powerful thoughts. not just, hey, you guys have unity.
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so that you guys can have the biggest potlucks or you can give out the most backpacks and knock on the most doors. Just know this is a reflection of...
what the Godhead is. I want my people, my body, the Church to be reflection of me, which is a reflection of the relationship that He has with the Father. Right, bringing glory to Him. Absolutely, which is the ultimate goal of the Church is to honor and glorify God. Yeah, because you have the Godhead in Ephesians 4 and the Godhead in John 17. Absolutely. It's all right there. But Jesus did go against their tradition of the elders and that's what got them in trouble and that's what gets us in trouble.
Sometimes because tradition is a big role, but as I mentioned the beginning of this we'll talk about some of that throughout this podcast but but this is about wrapping up for the first episode I appreciate all of us working together and join us again for the second episode of Harvest seeds of unity we hope to see you again
Brian R Kenyon (40:03.593)
paved the way by blood that we might win a bright shining crown.