2X eCommerce Podcast

Dylan Jahraus is a seasoned e-commerce expert and successful Etsy seller, with multiple 7-figures in sales on the platform. Dylan has a background in corporate e-commerce at Zappos and Zulily, she now empowers thousands of Etsy sellers worldwide through her coaching programs, helping them achieve significant sales growth.

Dylan Jahraus’ Free Webinar:
Dylan offers a free webinar that targets profitable customers on Etsy and provides actionable steps to increase traffic and sales within the first 30 days on the platform.

(00:00) - How to Effectively Leverage Etsy as an eCommerce Sales Channel → Dylan Jahraus
(02:02) - Meet Dylan Jahraus: From Side Hustle to Six-Figure Business
(03:18) - Dylan's Background and Journey to Etsy Success
(04:48) - Key Takeaways from Early eCommerce Experience
(06:34) - First Steps on Etsy: From Wedding Decor to Thriving Business
(08:41) - Etsy's Evolution from 2016 to 2024
(10:15) - Navigating Etsy's Marketplace and Customer Expectations
(21:45) - Strategies for High Revenue on Etsy
(23:48) - Balanced Product Mix for High Revenue
(24:29) - Importance of Product Curation
(26:22) - Running an Etsy Business Without Making Products
(29:41) - Optimizing Etsy Listings for Higher Conversion
(34:39) - Top Categories to Sell and Avoid on Etsy
(38:48) - Maximizing Customer Lifetime Value
(44:43) - Final Thoughts and Resources

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Creators & Guests

Host

Kunle Campbell

Host of the 2X eCommerce Podcast and Co-Founder at OCTILLION

Guest

Dylan Jahraus

Dylan Jahraus is a seasoned e-commerce entrepreneur with a background in corporate e-commerce at Zappos and Zulily. She has achieved remarkable success on Etsy, leveraging her expertise to grow her business rapidly. Dylan now teaches other sellers how to thrive on the platform.

What is 2X eCommerce Podcast?

Hosted by Kunle Campbell, who is an operator of a portfolio of consumer brands, 2X eCommerce is a weekly podcast for ecommerce operators by ecommerce operators. We interview remarkable ecommerce founders and leading enablers of ecommerce growth, with every episode promising to give you at least one growth hypothesis or idea you can test.

Our focus is growing your ecommerce revenues from a cross-functional perspective, be it marketing, your tech stack, operations, finance, or customer experience. We believe that by bringing together insights from a variety of experts, we can help you double the throughput of key ecommerce functions.

2X your eCommerce growth with insights from Kunle and handpicked experts.

Dylan Jahraus: A lot of people think,
Oh, I have to be at 20 or less in order to

get, customers or it has to be under 50.

I sell products that are over 600.

I have a student who sells 15, 000 tables.

Okay.

From Spain.

So you have, it's not a specific price
point, but I would say at different

price points, you have to do different
strategies to convert someone.

So what someone needs, the information
they need to make a decision that is, a

thousand dollar transaction, it's going
to be so different than what someone

needs to, buy a 99 cent digital download.

Mhm.

Dylan Jahraus: Etsy came out with
some announcements about new product

categories that they are allowing.

And they're very clear now on their
policies, which before there was a

lot of ambiguity about what you could
sell and what you couldn't sell.

And, when there's gray area,
People push the boundaries.

Mhm.

Dylan Jahraus: We focus really on Etsy
SEO because it is a search engine and.

It is improving and it's becoming
more dynamic and fitting, your

customer's previous behavior.

And SEO is so essential.

You could be selling like, a
500, 000 diamond in a listing.

And if you don't have the right
SEO and you were selling it for 10.

You're right.

Such a deal.

No one would find it.

And it could be on Etsy for a
year and no one would buy it

because they're not finding it.

Mhm.

Kunle Campbell: So on today's episode,
we explore how to leverage Etsy as a

powerful selling channel to expand your
e-commerce brands, reach and revenue.

This is the 2x e commerce
podcast hosted by Kunle Campbell.

Kunle Campbell: Welcome to
the 2X eCommerce Podcast.

I'm your host Kunle.

Campbell and today's episode is tailored
specifically for established e-commerce

operators, looking to diversify.

And expand their sales channels.

We have Dylan Jahraus with
us, a seasoned Etsy expert.

Who has successfully transformed her
side hustle into a six figure business.

Dylan will share her insights on how
to effectively use Etsy to compliment

your existing sales channels.

Optimize your product listings
enhance your customer experience.

Whether you're seeking to tap into Etsy.

unique marketplace.

Or improve your current strategy.

This episode is packed
with practical advice.

And proven tactics from Dylan.

To help you grow your brand.

Stay tuned and make sure to
follow the 2X eCommerce Podcast

on your favorite platform for more
expert insights and strategies.

And without further
ado, let's get started.

Hey, Dylan, welcome to
the 2X eCommerce podcast.

Dylan Jahraus: Thank you
so much for having me.

I'm excited to be here.

Kunle Campbell: No, I'm super
excited because we haven't

had anybody speak to Etsy.

And I know it's a formidable channel, e
commerce channel, which audience would be

really looking forward to hearing about.

But before we jump into Etsy, I
would like to know your backstory.

Cause I know.

your background predates the last
eight years you've been in Etsy.

So I would just like to,
you to dive in and share.

Dylan Jahraus: Yes.

I'm from the Midwest in the
United States and I grew up

in Minnesota on a horse farm.

I think like a lot of entrepreneurs,
I had a bit of a tough childhood

growing up, some tragedy in the family.

I had a sister who actually had
a heart attack when she was 15.

She's two years older than me and
she is permanently brain damaged.

And then my dad is a drug addict, right?

he's been an addict for over 35
years and a lot of instability.

So I'm very driven, I would
say by achievement and

building a life for my family.

I went to school on the East coast.

So William and Mary studied
business, actually studied buying

and product development in London,
and then got into e commerce.

Out of college.

worked for Zappos they're owned by
Amazon and then Zulily, which is

the flash sale model up in Seattle.

Got married, met someone in the military.

You move a lot in the military
and started my own thing.

we actually just put something
random on Etsy from my wedding.

And all of a sudden, two
months later, it sold.

I started applying corporate
e commerce background to.

That platform and the rest is history,

Kunle Campbell: Wow.

What yeah, what to start but
I'm glad you sound like you have

balance and you've found a path.

Through e commerce through Etsy for
that stability, across the board.

Now I really like the fact that you
worked for Zappos, Zulily, I remember

those times early is 2010s, right?

Early 2010s.

What did you take away from
your early e commerce experience

that has been fundamental?

In your etsy journey,

Dylan Jahraus: right?

So I would say at Zappos, delivering
happiness, that's a big thing.

So I call a customer, the customer
experience, the invisible playing field.

Cause it's really hard to replicate
and it's really hard to repeat and

it's hard for people to compete
with you and take that from you.

So that is something I took from Zappos.

Really creating that bending over
backwards for your customers, even as

a buyer they put you on the phones at
Christmas to handle customer service for a

couple hours just to have that experience
and to keep your feet on the ground.

That customer experience part and
really being able to position yourself

as a premium brand and being able
to charge more because you sell to

people who value that experience.

That's really what I took
away from that company.

Kunle Campbell: okay, and then yeah
zappos Tony shay is he's the ultimate

when it comes to customer experience
and I was I was studying jeff bezos

You know the other time and There was
a time he was at the airport and, at

airport security, where they take on
shoes, where you take your shoes off

and, put it through the security.

He saw a Zappos poster there and was
like, damn, this guy's a well ahead of us.

In terms of the congruence.

And I think one of the reasons why he
bought Zappos was customer experience in

terms of they were well ahead of Amazon
from a customer experience standpoint,

and they had to integrate a lot of
those learnings into the Amazon model.

That is good learning for you.

Okay.

So you talked about your wedding.

What did you sell initially
on Etsy from your wedding?

Was it like a wedding gift

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah.

You're welcome.

so we did a lot of our flowers
for the wedding ourselves and

they were artificial flowers.

So my husband and I he's
like a, he's in the military.

He's a submarine officer, very,
technical and everything, very

much an engineering mindset.

So we basically took foam and
toothpicks and we put together a

letter J, which is our last name
initial, and we stuck flowers into it.

So it was a flow.

It looked like a floral letter J.

And we, I took a picture of
it to send to my mom and I'm

like, I'll just put it online.

I think I was thinking about eBay or Etsy.

I was like, Oh, which one?

Sure.

I'll throw it on Etsy.

Open this Etsy account
through one picture up.

No SEO.

No, I can't believe someone
bought it to be honest.

And then it's sold two months later,
we're leaving for the honeymoon and

someone bought it and I thought, Oh no.

Now we're going to have to figure out
how to make this in a way we can ship it.

Kunle Campbell: Interesting.

And then what was your
first year on, on Etsy?

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah, between month two,
so it took two months to get one sale.

But by month four, we were
doing over 10, 000 a month.

And that was solely by applying everything
from corporate e commerce to Etsy.

I don't know why I was treating it
like, we call it in the U S like

Craigslist Or just like a marketplace
where you just threw something

up, like a garage sale online.

That's how I treated it when
I put the first thing up.

And then I thought, look
this is a marketplace.

I should apply everything I know to this.

Why didn't I do that?

And then, 10, 000 a month and
way beyond in the first year.

So about 134, 000 year one.

Kunle Campbell: Okay.

And you were selling just one skew, which
was the fact that the artificial flowers.

Dylan Jahraus: It expanded
into two products.

So it was floral letters, all
custom, made to order, and then

baby mobiles for nurseries.

Kunle Campbell: Okay.

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah, it's like a
something that hangs above a crib.

You call it like a pram?

Or no, maybe that's a,

Kunle Campbell: It's a quarter baby court.

Dylan Jahraus: There you go.

Kunle Campbell: Okay.

So from year one you've been In Etsy
for about eight years, how has Etsy

evolved where in 2024 which means
that you started at about 2016 if

my math's correct, what's been the
evolution from 2016 Etsy to 2024 Etsy?

Dylan Jahraus: It is.

Yeah, exactly.

2016 and 2016.

It was not very difficult.

I sold something that had one picture
and it was maybe like a three word

title and hardly any description.

there was so much
friction in that listing.

I can't believe someone
actually bought it.

Now you could never put something
up like that and have it sell.

It probably wouldn't even get traffic.

So I think the number of
sellers has increased greatly.

And I think a big shift happened
in 2020 where a lot more people

were home and just trying to do all
the different online side hustles.

And Etsy is probably one of
the easiest, much easier than

Amazon, easier than Shopify.

It was, a low barrier to entry, which kind
of flooded the marketplace with some low

quality sellers who weren't very serious.

combine that with the stimulus checks
here in the U S people getting hundreds

of dollars a week, thousands of
dollars a month from the government.

Some of them didn't even need the money
and they were spending it on Etsy.

They really were.

So after that money dried up and there's
all these sellers on the platform.

It looks saturated, but it's really not
saturated with high quality listings.

So the landscape is different and also
consumer spending is different now.

Kunle Campbell: Okay.

That's super interesting.

And would you say that Etsy is still
a handmade marketplace or has it been

infiltrated with mass production items?

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah.

So last week Etsy came out with
some announcements about new product

categories that they are allowing.

And they're very clear now on their
policies, which before there was a

lot of ambiguity about what you could
sell and what you couldn't sell.

And, when there's gray area,
People push the boundaries.

And it's also a less secure marketplace
when there's so much gray area.

So now they've become much more black
and white about what's allowed and

you can actually sell things that
are not handmade digital products.

Made by a production partner, even sourced
commercially, which is a new category.

They've become very clear on
is sourcing things commercially

and reselling basically.

So there's different ways to do
that with like gift baskets or

supply category, event items.

And this I think is great
for sellers because it will.

I would say weed out the low
quality, ugly designs and it's

just opened up a new playing field.

Kunle Campbell: Speaking
of our customer experience.

What is going into the head of
an Etsy shopper, what are they

looking for when they get into Etsy?

Certainly not the same mindset
when they're on Amazon, right?

So do you want to describe that
experience they're expecting, their

expectation when they're browsing
through and what really pisses them off?

Dylan Jahraus: Yes.

So what pisses customers off

Kunle Campbell: Yeah.

Dylan Jahraus: you're saying?

Yeah.

So basically Etsy customers, they
are different than Amazon and there's

a different set of expectations.

So Amazon, they expect
free returns, right?

you expect on Amazon, you can
use a product and return it if

you didn't like how it performed.

And that is not going to fly on
Etsy because every Etsy shop,

they own their own policies.

You don't have to accept returns.

You can be very stringent on your
policies and buyers know that.

They typically don't try to pull some
of the same behavior that they do

with Amazon sellers, which is great.

But also Etsy customers are more patient.

They don't expect, this to be
at their doorstep in 24 hours.

This is not the Amazon
prime expectation here.

Now they still will value, Fast shipping,
but they value the uniqueness of the

product more than the turnaround time.

So if you can do things like
personalization if you can do things

that are unique custom made to order your
customers, they're willing to be patient

and they're willing to pay a lot for that.

Kunle Campbell: Makes sense.

And then from the.

I think I'll probe more into
the customer's expectations.

Are they looking for, are they always
looking for handmade items for artisan

items, things that you see in a
pop up market, town markets, or are

they more open to other categories?

Dylan Jahraus: They're very open.

And, we even see a large category of a B2B
market on Etsy where maybe it's digital

products for other business owners.

I had a student because now
we teach this to Etsy sellers.

And I had a student, she has
a very, I would say, Kind of

an engineering background.

She worked full time and she started
an Etsy shop with spreadsheets.

So these are high utility items.

They help people save time and make money.

Great things to sell online.

If you can save time, make
money or save money for someone.

And within six months, she's making
25, 000 a month with spreadsheets.

And these are low price point
items, a digital product.

So yes, it takes time upfront to
create that, but it just keeps selling.

Kunle Campbell: Yeah, that's really
impressive in regards to, selling digital

products and especially digital products
that appeal to a very mass market.

I'm sure with her, is she doing a
bit of advertising outside of Etsy

to push people through to her store?

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah.

So no ads actually.

And yeah.

So my big thing is growing organic first,
as big as you can with organic It does

have an ad interface that you can use.

It's Etsy ads, but it's probably one
of the worst ways to spend your money.

They don't even allow you
to set, your maximum bid.

They don't allow you to allocate
different spend for different

keywords, nothing like that.

So it's little control.

You just.

Put in money and they
spend it how they want to.

So no targeting, nothing
like that is happening.

If you needed to do ads, like
we would recommend Facebook ads

or something with meta first.

But no she did this all
with organic methods.

SEO primarily is, that's a huge
part of being successful in Etsy.

Kunle Campbell: Okay.

And is the SEO for Etsy search
or is the SEO for Google search?

Dylan Jahraus: Yes.

So the SEO, we teach it for both because
we definitely, there are products

that will be great for what they call
offsite ads, which is where Etsy is

promoting your products through Google.

We want to make sure you're ranking
appropriately there and that you will

fall under the terms they're bidding on.

But we focus really on Etsy SEO
because it is a search engine and.

It is I would say improving and it's
becoming more dynamic and fitting,

your customer's previous behavior.

And SEO is so essential.

If you could have the perfect
product and I told someone, I think

yesterday, you could be selling like,
a 500, 000 diamond in a listing.

And if you don't have the right
SEO and you were selling it for 10.

You're right.

Such a deal.

No one would find it.

And it could be on Etsy for a
year and no one would buy it

because they're not finding it.

Kunle Campbell: Okay.

Makes sense.

And then what about price points?

What is the mindset?

How much is an Etsy shopper looking to
spend at individual sessions, do you have,

is there a range, a typical range in mind?

Dylan Jahraus: a lot Of people think, Oh,
I have to be at 20 or less in order to

get, customers or it has to be under 50.

I sell products that are over 600.

I have a student who sells 15, 000 tables.

Okay.

From Spain.

So you have, it's not a specific price
point, but I would say at different

price points, you have to do different
strategies to convert someone.

So what someone needs, the information
they need to make a decision that is, a

thousand dollar transaction, it's going
to be so different than what someone

needs to, buy a 99 cent digital download.

Kunle Campbell: in fact, the table next
to me, just thinking about it, I've

bought it from Etsy and, I spent a few
hundred, a hundred pounds, on, on it.

I think that, yeah, I spent just
under 500 pounds for the table.

And yeah, it just felt very
artisan if that makes sense.

So you're right.

You're very right.

It depends on what you what
you're in the market for.

And that price into furniture
is very high price point.

I also buy Natural skin and hair products.

So coconut oil for one kilo cocoa butter
and another one I just combined them.

Yeah it's interesting.

It's a very interesting marketplace.

Okay.

with working with this new policy of Etsy,
how do you think it's going to change?

And I'm speaking to the policy of using
suppliers as against manufacturing

the product yourself which I believe
Many sellers were doing anyway.

Dylan Jahraus: Now, yeah, many sellers
were doing this anyway, and they were

actually like drop, drop shipping.

For example, some furniture stores, I
actually know a guy in the UK who was just

drop shipping pre manufactured furniture.

Selling it as handmade, and
that's we don't want to do that.

Now, there are certain areas that
are, Allowed to be, where you can

source products and resell one is
the gift box, gift basket category

where you can source supplies for that
gift box from different suppliers.

You're not hand making anything,
but you're curating it.

So Etsy is really giving.

I would say the power of curation
to sellers now, and it is an art.

It still is a skill.

I would say to put together something
that is cohesive and that can be at the

right price point to convert someone.

Gift baskets, gift boxes, but also.

The traditional supply category, which I
played in, it's like craft supplies where

I was just selling artificial flowers.

So I buy a flower for 30 cents and
I would sell it for 2 and 99 cents.

And then someone in Germany, they
want to pay 20 to ship this thing.

And that's a real story.

And.

That's category.

It's still there, but they're much more
clear on the event occasion holiday

category, which is where you can
basically buy holiday decor and resell it.

And you don't have to do anything to it.

Kunle Campbell: Interesting.

And what do you think the
marketplace would look like?

If you look at eBay and you look
at Amazon say, I'm searching for an

iPhone 12 on Amazon's a singular.

Product listing, and that would have
loads of sellers latched onto it.

While on eBay it's a minefield, you'd
have pages upon pages of different

types of the same product of the
iPhone, whatever 11, if you search

for it so how in Etsy, How's that?

So if GC is.

From a shopper's perspective or user
perspective, do you see repetition

in the listings or does Etsy clean?

It's listings up to to
optimize customer experience.

Dylan Jahraus: Yes
that's a great call out.

With Etsy, it is a little different
than Amazon in this way, because with

Amazon people, even customers, they
say, where did you get your iPhone?

Oh, I got it from Amazon.

If they're not going to say, I got it from
seller, China, one, two, three, whatever

they say, I got it from Amazon with Etsy.

It is very much where you own your brand.

So I don't see Etsy ever getting to a
point where they are combining multiple

suppliers onto one product page and
giving you the option at that point, I

believe, it really comes down to a little
bit of a price war and reviews and.

If it's the same product, the only way
you'd have bad reviews is really, if

you were, doing counterfeit things.

So with Etsy, I don't see them doing that.

But it is something where, yes,
there's going to be people side by

side who have something very similar.

Now it is never a good strategy
Etsy and then try to copy it or do

something very similar because you're
always going to be chasing success.

And that is not a business
model that you want to plan.

Kunle Campbell: Yeah.

Yeah, that is so true.

Chasing success is a business model.

You don't want to follow it's a no.

Cause it would eventually
come back and bite you.

You just never will get there.

We never ever get there.

So hypothetically speaking on
behalf of my audience of the 2x e

commerce audience, 2x as me now,
if, Someone listening now wanted to

get to, to, to Etsy, get into Etsy.

And they have a target that by
about this time next year, they

would be looking at generating a
hundred K per month through Etsy.

How would you map out, how
would you coach them to that?

level, what do they need?

What set of skills do
they need to have now?

And access to capital they need to have
now to get to a hundred K per month

in 12 months or less consistently.

Dylan Jahraus: It's going to take the
longest to get you to 20, 000 a month.

And then once you're at 20, 000
a month, it's really a matter of

pulling levers at that point to
get you to a hundred K per month.

And the constraints in the business are
going to be different at different stages.

So the 20 K to a hundred K,
a lot of times that's people.

Inventory bandwidth, right?

A little bit of marketing spend, but at
that point, your customer in the zero to

20, 000 a month you're getting feedback.

You're trying to learn which products are
going to have the highest order velocity.

Which products also increase
your average order value or

encourage multi item orders, right?

Which customer set you're targeting would
have the strongest LTV within your shop?

Cause you don't want to be
getting to a hundred K months by

acquiring new customers over and
over and being very transactional.

We need to grow this with
a compounding effect.

So what I would say is you need
to pick probably four to five

customers to target in one shop.

Okay.

Not competing customers.

I say like farmers and brides, right?

We don't want to not those in the
same shop, but four to five kind of

complimentary customers, and then we
build our product mix strategically.

So you want to front load with
loss leaders because Etsy's

algorithm works Where you need
a high order velocity happening.

So that's number of transactions or
orders per day in order to rank higher.

And then we wanna also
have products in your shop.

If you're trying to get to a hundred
K months, I would say you need

products in there that are over
a thousand dollars per product.

Yeah.

So it's a balanced product mix.

You might have a loss
leader in there that's $5.

You might have something
that's a thousand dollars.

And a good example, I don't know
if you know of anthropology.

Do you know them?

Kunle Campbell: I know anthropology.

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah.

So they have wedding dresses in
their store and they have, we call

them little like grandma grabbers at
the checkout, lip balms and things

Kunle Campbell: Yeah.

Dylan Jahraus: and their core, candles
that they're known for, they can sell

kitchen utensils and wedding in the same.

That's what you want to
think about your business.

Kunle Campbell: Interesting.

Really interesting.

How much of this requires like supply
chain prowess because it seems like from

a front end perspective if you get a
shopify store, you most definitely have

to get your you know Your products in
order, but what's most important for

success is brand And your ability to
track traffic performance, marketing,

what have you bringing traffic into the
store and then converting with Etsy.

It sounds like that front end in
terms of bringing traffic is sorted

most of the time through SEO.

If you optimize really well for
SEO, you'll get that visibility.

If your listings, optimized,
you get the traffic in.

So how much of your time.

From a percentage standpoint, do you focus
on product curation with an Etsy store,

especially in this trajectory of getting
to the 100 K per month versus marketing,

the products or listing the products.

Dylan Jahraus: Without the product
curation you're going to fall flat

when it comes to building a brand and
you're not going to get to 20 K months.

So that's a bit of a problem.

So you can't just do sales and marketing
without the focus on product curation and

making sure there's product market fit.

You can't even do sales and
marketing if you don't have

product market fit to begin with.

So curating the right product mix and
focusing on a profitable product mix.

And getting your costs down
and building those supplier

relationships, it's going to be so key.

So I'd probably say your first,
three months, it might be 60%,

70 percent on the product side.

30 percent maybe on the
marketing and sales side.

And then that will shift.

Once you have things that are getting
traction, then you can focus on the

marketing and sales and just, pulling
the lever where you have leverage really.

Kunle Campbell: And do I need to make the
products or can I run an Etsy business

by just being a really good buyer?

Dylan Jahraus: Yes.

If you can spot margin opportunity
in something, you can do Etsy.

You don't have to make products.

I have people who are like digital nomads.

They bounce around.

They do Etsy.

They don't ship anything, right?

You definitely don't need to be
shipping anything, making anything,

but I would say you still to be picky
when it comes to what you allow in

the shop, because it's not like a,
an Amazon or, it is, I would say it's

more like Shopify than Amazon because
you still want to curate that brand,

Kunle Campbell: and with, in that
scenario where they're not touching

inventory, are they strictly working
with localized suppliers or would they

still ship from outside the country?

Dylan Jahraus: Yeah.

So let's say you are doing
what's called print on demand.

that would be like using
a production partner.

Now people think of print on demand and
they think printify, printful t shirts.

There's so much more to it than that.

And you could use a production
partner that is more local.

And let's say you have one in the UK.

Who's, more local, they do
embroidery or engraving or something.

And then you have one in the U S you
have one in Canada, and basically they're

all making the same type of product,
but they're local to that market.

So you can find your
own production partners.

And that's sometimes one of the best
ways to have a competitive advantage

because then you can get products
and you have access to opportunities

that printify and printful.

It's not available on their site.

Kunle Campbell: What about non price
and demand, products like, as you

said, like the flowers you did, or
if I was selling mugs or just jewelry

and I had really good suppliers,
would I, should I keep the stock in

it with me or can I have the suppliers
ship and what's the threshold there?

Dylan Jahraus: Yes.

So you have to do some, I would say, very
careful diligence around this because

you need to be able to prove that you
somehow had your hand in the design.

So let's say it's jewelry.

you orchestrated, what the final
outcome is, maybe it's a jewelry

manufacturer, but you had them
create a specific design for you.

They can ship it for you.

It's the same thing of
using a production partner.

It's not on demand, but they are
still your production partner.

And you probably want to
list them in your shop.

Mary from, this factory is the,
Production, person on this product.

So you want to be really transparent.

You don't want to do anything shady.

And I always recommend having
your own packaging or at least

having your hand on the packaging.

Cause the last thing you need is,
using someone in China where the

customer gets it, it's, this ball of
plastic wrapped in duct tape, that's

not a good look, for your brand.

Kunle Campbell: Absolutely.

You need to control that
customer experience.

As you said, I'm going back
to your very first tip.

It's so important.

Okay.

It Makes sense.

And then let's jump into the
listings, the actual, listen,

what is the, what's the anatomy?

What's a breakdown of a
really good Etsy listing page?

Dylan Jahraus: Okay, just cut out.

Kunle Campbell: what is the
anatomy or structure of a really

good Etsy product listing page?

Dylan Jahraus: Yes, so you
want to make sure you are using

all of the listing photos.

So there's 10 photos and a video and you
want to have 10 different types of photos.

We actually have 18 types of photos
that will give you a higher conversion

rate because this is a sales page.

Don't think of it like a product page.

Think of this like a sales page.

You have to convince someone
to buy without getting them

to overthink or overanalyze.

That's really the goal.

So that's what your photos, photos are
really, I would say over 50 percent of

the thing here video, important video.

If you're listing has reviews, you want
to really be showcasing those because

proof in that track record, social proof.

So important to showcase in your
photos, not just under the reviews.

And then I would say your SEO, that's
going to be essential using all text

on all your images, of course, having
all the appropriate tags built into

the backend, but in a description that
is your place to convert someone else.

You need to make sure your
photos are good enough.

To where they don't read the
description and it's enough

information for them to buy.

Okay, so some people don't
click the button that says read

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