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C3 Leadership Podcast with Ed Young — Where creativity, church, and culture collide. Join Ed Young and guests for ideas and stories that will help you lead stronger and think sharper.
Had that sick boy who shot him
gotten up to the microphone, Charlie
would have talked to him.
Yes you would have.
I know you're a good tennis player.
Do you ever play pickleball?
I have actively come
out against it.
I can tell.
Levi I can see that.
Tell me when
you were called
into the ministry.
You know I didn't go to some job
fair back in the 80s and go
I want to do that.
Yeah if they did put a recruitment
flyer out for it no one would pick
that one up.
Do you want to always get it wrong
and have people mad at you no matter
what you do?
But fortunately, the pay is bad and
the hours are awful.
Yes, right.
It's clear secularism,
all the woke, you know, all that
stuff. Like I think people have seen
through that.
That's right.
They are. They have. Yes.
And so I think now it's going to
be kind of this opening up of
hopefully people to Jesus.
Yeah.
He would put
his boots on when he would write
sermons to remind himself he was
doing hard work.
That, I've never heard that
Levi, drop the
mic.
Welcome
to C3 Leadership Podcast.
We have one of the greatest here
today.
I'm talking about the man from
Montana,
Levi Lusko.
Look at you, Ed, how you doing, bro?
Man, I'm doing well, Levi.
I'm really excited about
this and about talking to you.
I'm always excited to see your face.
I love you so much.
Thank you Levi.
Thanks for doing this. I know you
are a busy man with with
with kids and and
Fresh Life and speaking
around the world.
I mean you're international.
Seriously. That's that's a,
I really appreciate you taking time.
I do.
Are you kidding me?
I have an Ed Young, the answer
is yes. What's the question?
Oh gosh!
Come on, now. Come on.
Are you kiddin' me? You're such a
joy, such a gift.
I never forget the day I met you.
Well, thank you.
You've been a blessing to me.
I ran into you in the backstage in
Miami of a conference.
You had just given a terrific
message.
That's right.
Involving a life preserver
and a rope.
That's right, Levi.
You were so sweet.
And you were like, hey, what can I
do for you? I was like, oh, man,
there's nothing you can do.
It was just like a by chance
meeting. And you're like, we have a
conference next week. You should
come.
And you literally.
Paid. You're like, I just want to
pay for you to come to a be
there. You like, you bought me a
hotel room and a flight just, just
to come and be part of. You just,
and from that moment forward, just
like in my mind, that's just you,
your generosity, one of the open
doors.
You're just so kind and
encouraging always.
I love you.
Well, I love you, Levi.
It's great that worked out, but now
you're telling me the story you've
told me before. I remember it now.
I remember that.
It was a pretty big
conference.
It was huge.
It was at the Watsco arena.
Yes.
I think we're the Hurricanes
play? Is that what Miami Hurricanes
played? I think so.
It was Pedro Garcia.
I remember Pedro and
and I remember the Francis Chan
was there Yes, I'm
not mistaken and also
James McDonald.
Now it sounds, as you're
describing it, like it's a fever
dream.
And yes, Francis Chan was there.
The pope was riding a unicycle.
That's good.
That's great.
You had a life preserver.
The hope is the rope.
The ring is the thing.
Yes, that's right.
Don't be a
yacht club Christian.
Pull so the house will
be full.
That's it.
Amen. You are so good with all this
stuff.
Levi, I appreciate that.
Tell me, how's the family doing?
How are you guys doing?
Man, we're doing good.
You know, Olivia is a sophomore in
college.
I cannot.
Levi.
I know.
What is the world coming to?
She turns 20
in two weeks.
I know, right?
But I still have an eight-year-old,
so I feel like I'm an old, I'm
simultaneously an old and a
young parent.
Yes, you are.
But
I feel a little bit, and I don't
know if this is crazy, I feel
little bit like I am already in my
grandpa era, because we had that
first wave of kids and then when
Lennox came along, we were already
exhausted.
You are a little bit and
you know Levi what Lisa and I found
about grandparenting and
grandparenting is great by the way
but it's kind of a continuation
in a lot of ways of
parenting you know you're going to
the to the games and you're
you know to the birthday but the
good part is you can hand
them back.
Well, I don't hand Lennox back,
but...
No, no, but when you become
grandparents, I'm saying, not now.
No, I'm looking forward to...
Jenny and I always talk about it.
In fact, my baby sister
just had her child and she's
the last of my siblings to
procreate.
And when I met her son,
it felt to me, because she's just
always been just like baby sister.
So her child felt very much...
Jenny, and I both looked at each
other and I thought, we were like,
oh, this is a taste of what it's
gonna be like. And so, but I mean,
yeah, I mean we're having so much
fun, Ed. I mean you know,
the last night Lennox, I was sitting
out there and he's like, throw the
football with me dad it's like in
those moments throwing the football
with my son, like the fleeting
just joy as the sun was setting.
And we're also in the season of like
summer is on its way out in Montana,
and in 15 minutes we're gonna
be under feet of snow.
So just...
I was aware of the warmth
of the sun.
My son's smile, playing
catch, like this is the joy.
I like that.
In the moment.
That's it,
and just like the kids say,
touching grass, like being outside,
being off social media, being
offline a little bit.
Levi, looking at
your life, tell me
when you were
called into the ministry.
I've been going through the book of
Romans, and I
was talking last week about the
Apostle Paul talking about being
called, and,
you know, I kind of used an
illustration about being
a pastor. I said, you, know, didn't
go to some job fair back
in the 80s and go, I want to do
that. I mean, it was a
call. Tell me about how that
happened for you.
Yeah, if they did put a recruitment
flyer out for it, no one would pick
that one up. No, they would, Levi.
Do you want to always get it wrong
and have people mad at you no matter
what you do?
Chew next to the Air Force and
the baking booth.
Yes. That's good, Levi,
that's really funny.
But fortunately, the pay is bad and
the hours are awful.
Yes, right.
No, you'd have to
be called. Spurgeon used to say,
if you can, do anything
else, do it.
And he meant, if you can go be a
firefighter or a banker or a sell
insurance, go do it. If you can only
be a pastor if you can't hold
the fire back from inside your
bones. Because only then will you
have the inner fortitude to deal
with the challenges that come in
ministry.
Having a bullseye on your chest
for the enemy and then literally...
I mean, we just saw it last week
as we were recording this with
Charlie Kirk, I mean that bullseye
is on all of us. Now it won't all
take the form of a bullet, but the
Bible talks about the enemy coming
out for specifically people who are
gonna be outspoken in their faith.
And so I think the persecution, Paul
said, all who desire to live godly
in Christ will suffer persecution.
That's right. And when you actually
proclaim the gospel, even more
is coming.
So I think you need a calling,
you need to have major calling and
election sure. And for me,
my joke is.
Ever since I was two, I told
people I wanted to be a pastor.
That's the first time my parents say
I would say that.
I just started saying, I wanna be a
Pastor like my dad.
I wasn't saved yet, so once I got
saved, it was much better.
But I've never had any other
vocation that I was interested
in. So I just, I look at that
clearly like what Paul said about
Timothy, like look at the faith that
was in you as a child.
Yes, that's
it.
And it's even more precious now.
We lost my dad in 2024.
Or he went home to be with Jesus
after...
A really tough year with pancreatic
cancer that I'm still working
through. That's a really, really
tough season.
But the legacy of
faith like you have of my father
before me that I get to now carry
that baton into the future is
a gift.
Okay Levi, what would you say,
because God's blessed it and your
ministry and your writings and
everything, what you would say as
far as being a pastor is
your biggest challenge
like week by week?
And also, I'll follow it
up by saying, what do you enjoy
the most? What's the biggest like,
yay!
I mean, the challenge, I
think, is
self-leadership.
Leading me, you know, that's the
biggest challenge.
It's a great answer.
My own position, my own temperament.
I'm, without a doubt, the most
difficult person I lead.
I've got a staff of people I lead,
but I'm the most difficult I present
the most, I need the most
encouragement. I need to most
coddling.
I need most carrots and sticks.
But it's...
It's discouragement.
I think you go through all the
seasons, discouragement, there's the
normal stuff, like you and I both
have had to walk through the death
of a child.
Major discouragement there's
all the usual
things, all the times the
world's on fire and all the normal
stuff, the staff stuff, people
leaving the church angry, someone
quits, so-and-so is gone,
it's like.
You almost joke when you take a
vacation like with your team like
don't call unless it's
all really bad.
Levi, you are so, you're preaching
now, brother.
You know what's hard for me, Levi?
For me, one of the challenges
that I face is
preaching every week.
And I've been doing it for 35 years,
man. I mean, I know I'm called
to do it, but to put in
the hard
yards every week, that's a
challenge.
Yeah, I mean, if you were
comfortable phoning it in, it'd be
one thing, you know, but if
you're committed to having a fresh
word from God.
Yes.
And presenting it in a compelling
way and doing
it connected
to your culture but faithful to the
cross.
That's right.
You don't have to pick
one or the other.
Don't let them tell you, you have to
choose interesting or
spiritual.
Exactly.
I
think a lot of times depth is
just code
for like lazy,
but like make it seem really,
try and cry if you can, You know
what I mean? You don't want to
conjure up something, but I think-
connected to culture and connected
to the cross, a word from God.
Yeah, that's day and that's hard
work. I mean, I know one pastor who
used to say, this is a little old
reference, but W.E.
Sankster, he wrote this book called
The Craft of the Sermon back in the
1800s or whatever.
He said he would
put his boots on when he would write
sermons to remind himself he was
doing hard work.
That, I've never heard that
Levi.
Drop the mic on
that one, bro.
Alistair Begg said the
same thing. He always wears a suit
and tie to study because he wants to
show reverence for God's word.
Like, I like some of that.
I do.
I do like some of that.
That helps me.
There's nothing like
seeing someone respond
to God in it.
That's the great joy.
You know that moment when you're
preaching and the oxygen sucks out
of the room?
Yes.
Where people are leaned in or they
sense God's in this place.
That moment of salvation, someone
saying, I brought my friend, someone
saying I brought...
And they got saved.
My daughter Daisy, we were on an
airplane and she's pretty
quiet, but she invited the
lady sitting next to her to church.
And she found out where that woman
was gonna be at a conference and it
was closer to a campus that I don't
normally speak at.
She said, dad, could I go to this
other campus in case she comes, I
want her to have someone she knows
to sit with.
To see that happening in my own
family, that's it.
All of the criticism,
cancelations, all of that, which I
wish they, at some point, will give
like a Subway punch card for
cancelations. Like the seventh one's
free.
That's funny.
So, Levi, a typical week,
what's your
rhythm?
Sometimes people don't really have a
rhythm.
It's more dissonant sometimes
than harmony as far as the way they
study.
I mean, the exception
weeks would be a week with travel, a
week with a funeral, or a week.
How do you do that with travel throw
throw that in there? Like how are
you I mean because because you're
all over the place and then you got
to be back and
have a fresh word I
mean, that's hard.
The thing that helps me,
Ed, is I'm freshest in the morning.
And I decided a long time ago to
give the freshest
me for the most important task.
Right?
I'm the same way, Levi.
My most important is the sermon,
anybody communicating, that is going
to be your most important.
Yes. I'm least sharp
as the day goes on.
So because I'm an early riser, I've
already usually met with God,
done some reading, done something
for my body.
You and I have worked out together
in lots of different ways.
We both know the value of that.
Well, I tried to keep up with you
Levi. You're very strong.
I was, I was impressed that this
guy, I want to tell, I'm going
to tell the millions who were
listening to this.
The whole world, all the countries.
This is overdubbed in every
continent.
No, really,
Levi is in shape,
man. Anyway, go ahead.
Well, these days it's more cardio.
I've been doing a little more
cardio, a little less.
What have you been doing, like what?
I got into trail running,
Ed, have you ever done that?
No.
Oh,
it's so fun. It feels like a video
game. You know, when you're running
through trails up and down,
undulating through woods, you have
to always have your head on a...
Yes, you do.
Because of grizzly bears, you know,
because you don't want to surprise
them.
Yeah, you guys have the real deal up
there.
Yeah, and
when you surprise them it's bad.
So trail running is probably one of
the more dangerous things because
you're coming around corners quickly,
but I...
Have you ever seen one?
I mean, we've seen lots
of it. I've not encountered them
trail running yet, knock on wood,
you know.
Okay, so anyways,
Levi, so it's a typical week.
You're traveling.
Maybe you're in Los Angeles.
Maybe you are in New York.
How do you get your, so in the
morning, even when you're on the
road, you're studying.
Even on the road, I would give my
first four hours.
So that's kind of the beauty of
it, is that at home,
I have had quiet time, exercise,
some reading.
I'm just interested in whatever.
And when I say reading, I don't mean
spiritual necessarily.
It could be whatever I'm nerded out
on. Which right now, I'm reading
this book called The Power Broker.
I don't know if you've heard of it.
No.
Oh, gosh. Robert Gross is the guy
who built New York City, basically.
Never held public.
Elected office and yet is more
responsible for what New York City
became than any other single person.
Whoa.
He
was a phenomenal...
Like all the Triborough bridges and
Shea Stadium and Jones Beach and all
the infrastructure.
Yeah, he did all that.
All of it.
And... But was this corrupt, shady,
racist...
Really?
It's a fascinating book.
Anyhow, that's what I'm reading
right now.
Then I would give those first four
hours. Over the course
of Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday,
Thursday.
It's the first, it's just the text,
the text.
No commentaries, no other people.
It's just me and Jesus.
And then once I kind of have
extracted from God's Word using
only a treasury of scriptural
knowledge, doing cross-references,
it usually, I let the old bring the
new, the new old.
And as the week goes on, once I have
kind of a title, a concept, a
proposition, an outline, and kind of
basic skeleton, then I'll start
bringing in language helps and
commentaries just to see, am I off
the reservation?
Ha ha ha
Yeah, yeah, do
you ever use a chat GPT?
I use Grok, which is the
Elon Musk version of it, yeah.
I use it. I love it.
How do you use it?
Oh, like today I'm
the text this week is uh,
I'll ask you I'm sure you have a
great outline on this
Romans 1 18 through 25
So I kind of do the same thing.
But then today I was like, okay,
give me a compelling outline
I mean, obviously I knew how the
scriptures broken down but give me
something cool and you know a lot
of times I'll I'll take some of
those hints or maybe I'll say give
me some examples like
that or, you know, blah, blah blah.
And yeah, I use it like that.
And sometimes I, Oh, this is the
worst Levi.
I'll get it to critique me.
Brutal.
We put all of my stuff in
there and I go,
critique me it was, it was
a little brutal, but that's okay.
I've got to receive it.
The way I like to use it is,
if I imagined, like I've heard
Craig Groeschel say, he calls people
into his office and then reads his
sermon and asks them to talk to him
about it, which I don't really like
that, that I don't do that
personally doesn't, but using Grok
like that.
Once I have my outline, my title, my
flow, my kind of manuscript written
out, I would upload it.
And then I would say, talk to me
about the strengths and weaknesses.
Ok, yeah, that's what I do,
too.
Or should I put 0.3 or
0.2? I'll just use it like
someone. So I'm not asking it to
give me information.
I'm asking it interact with my
information, if that makes sense.
Yes, it does.
I do that, but I also will ask it
for some information.
And like, when I say, give me
examples, I would say one
out of 10 would be possible
that I would possibly use.
Have you ever had it tell you
something that was like just
completely made up.
Not to my knowledge but I'm
not, I mean, just
in other searches and
things I have, but not...
But nothing that made it to print or
nothing that.
No, no, no. Nothing that was
heretical or...
Oh, bro, I did.
I was like, hey, find me an example
of this from the news or whatever.
And it just totally
made up a
whole thing that later on I found
out was not true. Luckily, it was
for something
that didn't go on the internet.
It was just a little leadership talk
that I gave.
And I used to, and man, I'm
like, later on found out it was
completely hallucinated.
So I went back.
I was, hey you told me this.
I was like, hey, sorry.
I'm like, what are you, like on LSD?
What's this making, completely
making this up?
Well, Levi, I'm talking about just,
you did a great job, by the way,
of addressing all
of the tragedy that's happened in
our country over the last several
weeks.
What would you tell young pastors,
young leaders, how do you address,
as a pastor, I mean, you're
a well-known figure,
how, how to you approach
things like that and
address it? Because, you know, you
have strong opinions on
both sides and,
you what what do you
think about situations like that?
I mean, how do you process that?
It's hard because you don't want the
newspaper to dictate the pulpit,
right?
No.
So, and
quite frankly, every
day something awful is happening, so
are we going to let every weekend it
be the news now?
So I think, and
it shouldn't be that
the current events
chosen by the
news industry is
going to give the oxidant our
pulpit. We have to go to God.
That's right.
Bye.
But I also do think, you know, there
are historically cataclysmic
events that take place.
That's right.
9-11, the assassination of
JFK. There are some things that,
you know, there are pendulum moments
that things swing on.
And I do think we're
witnessing that. I mean, to have an
outspoken Christian like
him or hate him, an out spoken
Christian assassinated in public
on a college context like that.
To not speak to that
is crazy.
I mean, even Jesus would say, Hey,
you know that tower that fell over
and killed his people?
That's right. So I think a leader
does need to hear from God and
speak to his people and
help pastor.
That's literally the definition of
that.
Yes. And you know, you know what
I've tried to do and I've
been around a lot of different
people like you have who
probably talk about
political issues and things
too much.
Sometimes people will say
to me, well, hey, you, whatever,
you're using an example of
wokeism and Karl Marx
and Friedrich
Nietzsche.
That's kind of political.
Well, I preach the
Bible, and as
you go through issues in the Bible
texts, you can talk about
some things that people deem
Political so it's kind of
a I don't know.
I I just try to
I'm not always done a great job of
this Levi, but like
you I try to address it when it's
like major
Cataclysmic event yes, but
I I Man
definitely watch my words
and but but the guy like Charlie
Kirk.
He um, I didn't
know him. Did you know him?
Very limited, but I'll
tell you this,
in posthumously, the more
I'm hearing him,
the more like him.
Yeah, I just, I don't, I mean,
I know some about him.
I don't know him, but didn't
know him.
But what I respect about him
is he did a
great job, and I think this was his
focus, I dunno what it was, of
sharing the gospel, engaging
people on campuses,
and I just like the way he
gave people a fair shot.
I mean I really respect
that.
Oh my gosh, yeah, and I
think he's 31.
He's 31, oh my gosh.
Is he smart or what?
Was he full of
zeal and fire?
Yeah, and so was I at 31,
and I think, but
I also feel like, now
this is an outsider's perspective,
I'm not speaking for him, but it
does feel to me like there was,
not a cooling in like a lukewarm
way, like there, to
me there was a,
a tempering that still was happening
in him. You know what I mean?
Like when you start out,
you can't do anything big or bold
without some fire in your belly and
some sense of like, I'm gonna build
a tower to the moon, you know?
And I feel like that is what we all
loved about the boldness.
And I felt like some of the in your
face or some of some of that
intense, some of intensity, I feel
some of it by nature
tempers as we mature in
life. And so I still feel like,
I am sad not just by
what happened, but also we
didn't get to see that development
continue.
And he was a catalyzed.
Yeah, he was just a compelling, um,
compelling figure. I just
appreciated his,
um.
Courage. And again, the way he,
the way he approached it, but, you
know, as well as I do Levi, it's
easy, especially if you are
Charlie Kirk.
Oh my goodness. How many things were
taken out of context or this, and
we didn't see the whole situation.
So that's yeah... take one sentence. And now And Levi, I'm sure people have done that with you as much as you've spoken. Oh, Levi Lusko said, blah, blah blah.
Yes. And that's why, when I got up
at church on Sunday, I said, you
know, let's honor our fallen,
slain brother.
Like, this is, in my opinion,
and people can have their own
opinion, in opinion, it's a modern
martyr for free speech and for the
gospel.
That's right.
I said the exact thing.
A modern-day martyr, yes.
I want to honor a martyr killed
as TikTok
watched, as TikTok around the
world, unique in this, on a college
campus.
Had that sick boy who shot
him gotten up to the microphone,
Charlie would have talked to him.
Yes, he would have.
And instead, he rode on a bullet.
And so that bullet
was coming for everyone who steps up
to a microphone.
Did you think about that, how that
could happen to you preaching?
Yes.
What?
How did you feel? Levi your church
like could you just
feel I'm sure the heaviness and
the angst and I mean how
did it feel walking into Fresh Life?
I mean, like churches everywhere,
it was packed, which reminded
me of post-9-11.
That's right.
It did.
I've not felt...
I mean for... I think it was highest
attendance since Easter, you know?
So there was a surge of
a sentiment of spiritual
angst, and I feel like
it dissipated in
not making a
saint of Him.
Yes.
What I told our
church is, I'm not making a saying
of Charlie, God did that.
When he bowed his knee to Jesus,
we're all saints.
That's right, we're all Saints.
And I said, am I,
does this mean I agree
with everything Charlie Crooks ever
said? I said I don't agree with
every thing I've ever said.
So how could I?
I said the exact thing.
Did you really?
Yes.
This is spooky.
I mean, I don't look as cool as
you, but I said the same thing.
Bars.
There he is.
Levi, do you think, because
you have a great grasp on history,
okay, let me segue.
Kind of still talking about this a
little bit, okay.
Obviously, the church was built on
the back of
martyrs, you know, the church.
And do you feel like that this
could be like a
defining moment, the linchpin, a
cataclysmic
event or tipping point that
really brings
out even a greater revival than
we're seeing, a greater spiritual
awakening because you know so many
young people and what I want to hear
you talk about that.
Yeah, I mean, there have been
moments like that, like martyrs
whose ashes were put into
the Rhine River, I think it was, and
they spread throughout, and
literally revival, like
it's not far from that, that Luther
spring up.
I really do feel, in my
bones, we've already been, all of
us, feeling a sense of
young people, specifically.
I mean I watch what's happening at
The Mix in
Fellowship, and the
spiritual hunger, I see what's
happening at these college
gatherings, what we've been seeing
at the Passion Conference, what were
seeing in our own church
and the youth with our movement
conference.
There's a youth movement
stirring.
The bones are stirring, and
I feel like this is
a catalyzing event
that is gonna be
used by God's grace.
The slaughtering of Charlie Kirk
is going to be a
catalyzing effect on the body of
Christ to rise up in revival like
never before. I really do.
I long, I believe that.
That's great. That's great to hear
that. I believe that too, but I
just know you have such a influence
and you talk to so many young people
and, and I mean, I'm, I I'm
seeing it, but man, I'm 64 and
you're like 24.
What's that quote?
The ship of the church has
never sailed so gloriously
along as when the blood of the
martyrs sprayed upon her neck.
Wow. I mean, and historically,
persecution has always been a
precursor to multiplication.
Yes.
And I think if we're going to stand
up for Jesus and stand up the
family and biblical
gender roles, and Satan
hates that.
And I think there's going to be
pushback.
And I there's a sorting.
I think what
can be shaken will be shaken.
And I pray this is this.
I mean, think about how
even the Jesus movement of the
70s emerged from
the violence of the 60s.
That's right.
MLK, JFK,
Robert, Bobby Kennedy, all these.
And then I think people were.
Well, maybe it's going to be in sex
and LSD and the psilocybin and all
the, you know, that
counterculture movement.
And there's like, there was an
emptiness
to that too. And then all of a
sudden you have the explosion of
the Jesus revolution.
So I pray this would all be the same
thing. The last five years and
all of, I mean, it's
clear secularism, all the woke, you
know, all that stuff.
Like, I think people have seen
through that as empty.
That's right. They are.
They have. Yes.
And so I think now it's
kind of be kind of this opening up
of hopefully people to Jesus.
Yeah.
Have you been gar fishing lately?
Bro, that was a one
and done with you.
I loved that though.
Alligator gar.
Captain Kirk.
That was the last time I went.
On the Trinity River.
Not been since, and you know,
Levi, since we
travel with Captain Kirk,
Garfish Enterprise, garfishing
has exploded, Levi.
Like, it is like the thing
to do with
so many young people.
And Kirk, of course, I mean, he
was out there ahead of everyone,
he still is. He had a guy, Levi
Catch, on his boat.
The world record gar, it
was I think over 300 pounds
on six pound test line.
Same boat we were in.
It took you like four hours to get
it in.
That's unbelievable.
But we caught some giant turtles.
I still have that picture of you.
That sea turtle was, oh, that
snapping turtle was good.
You know what I did catch?
You see it here?
Oh, that's
cool.
That's a bull trout.
Wow.
So,
do you know about the bull trout?
Go ahead, tell us, tell our
audience. Tell us.
It's the apex predator
of our river system.
It's a great white shark of our
River system.
Nothing hunts it, it hunts anything
it wants to. And there's a real
narrow season where you can go for
them and you have to have a
permanent and be in the right place
and all the things and.
Well, tell me about how that
happened.
My dad
had it in his head that he wanted to
catch a bull trout, so I booked
it, and when
he came, the rivers blew out.
It was the 100-year flood that
washed out a lot of Yellowstone, I
don't know if you remember that.
Yep, I do.
So we had to cancel, and then
we rescheduled next year while he
went to be with Jesus two months
before I had already...
Oh, man.
So I went in his
honor, brought a couple of friends,
and I said, if I get a bull trout,
I'm gonna take a photo of it and get
it on my arm. And this is my Chip
Lusko bull trout I got that day.
That is cool.
Tell me about this fish?
It's
big. I mean, you will sometimes be,
you'll catch them by accident
because you'll maybe catch a
cutthroat or a rainbow
and it'll go grab it and
will not let go until you'll end up
getting two for the price of one
on accident.
You can't target them.
Levi, you gotta send me some
pictures of these fish.
Oh, bro, I'll text you, I will
text you.
My buddy caught one that was a
hog. I mean, it was enormous.
Like what kind of flies are you
using? Like mouse patterns or...
Streamers.
Yeah, streamers.
You're throwing streamers, but they
hit it like a log, bro.
You feel like you snagged in a bunch
of, it's incredible.
And then the fight, and they'll run.
I went to my backing when
this thing ran.
Levi, you are a true fisherman now
talking about backing and
hit like a log, that's
impressive.
I mean, compared to the stuff that
you're going forward with it.
No, no, no.
Fishing is fishing.
I'd heard of the bull trout,
but not, not in
that, but send me,
send me the picture.
You're in bear country, too, though.
It's not like tarpon,
double hole, all that
craziness.
This is different.
It's river, but it's a
good fun time.
You know what fishing is fishing
again. I enjoy catching panfish.
I enjoyed catching great white
sharks Yeah, and I had a
similar experience
Our daughter who's in heaven now,
LeBeth, her favorite thing to do was
shark fish.
So I went after, um,
after she had, had passed,
I went after the great white with
this guy and a small boat,
uh, right off the beach,
40 feet deep, and it took myself
and big Dave Clark, who's
massive. And then my son, EJ
two hours to bring in this fish
and it weighed nearly 3000
pounds drug the
boat for miles.
I mean, Levi.
I, and listen, I
knew it was a giant when
the captain, when
the Captain said,
I'll quote him, this
is a damn monster.
I was like, whoa, and then
the scientist, then the
scientists on board with
a shark scientist, she started
crying because the fish was so big.
I was, like, this is
legit, man.
Anyway, enough about me.
And I love
that you guys named that fish,
LeeBeth.
Yep, LeeBeth.
Yes. You can still tracker right?
Well she pinged so
many times one tracker is kind
of disintegrated it stopped but
she has another one that will that
will detach maybe
two years from now I guarantee it
you could do the same thing with
bull trout no doubt I
bet there's bull trout that are
tagged
I don't know if their life cycle
would allow that.
OK.
Because they come back
and die at the end, don't they?
They might.
River Fisher are different.
I will tell you, I did catch my
first shark.
Where?
Not a
great white shark.
Where was it?
It was a
bull shark. Is that?
Oh, yeah. Oh, yes.
That's legit.
Same exact name of shark.
Where was it?
Scary.
In Florida at
Rosemary, Rosemary Beach.
Oh, that's a beautiful beach.
Long fight, very scary, because we
were out catching...
My son and I were just regular
fish, red fish and
whatever else.
And then the dolphins started
eating everything we were
catching. We were so excited when we
saw the dolphins. The captain was
like, filthy poachers, you know,
and then by the end we were like,
yeah, the dolphins are terrible.
I mean, I love them, but I
understand what your captain's
saying. I do. I got it.
So then I said, oh, it'd be great if
we could catch a shark.
And he goes, oh you want to catch a
sharp? OK, we'll save some time for
that. So then at the end, he goes
I'll take you to where the sharks
are. And he just drove us to the
shore. Like it was like, oh wait,
there's people swimming.
He's like, OK, yeah, now we're where
the shark's are.
And he chummed for a minute.
And sure enough, maybe 75 fins.
Boom, you know, like that. And it
was, oh man, we're so close to
shore. So then he got
the chum bucket on me or whatever
the gut bucket.
Yes, yeah.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah the gimbal belt.
Yes
and cast into the midst of it and
dang, that thing.
Boom.
That was an experience.
How long a fight was it, you think?
Just under an hour of,
and it was a full body workout.
How big was this thing?
Maybe eight feet it was a...
That's a big bull shark.
It's a big bullshark i wouldn't
want to meet it.
Do you have any pictures of it?
Yeah, you text those
two.
I'll text it to you, yeah.
Levi, this could turn into a fishing
podcast, couldn't it?
You and me, we could host it
and bring in fishermen from around
the world.
My problem is, I've had this rotator
cuff thing, so I've been having a
little bit of a struggle getting out
fishing in the summer.
How did you hurt your rotator cuff?
You know?
Probably doing something stupid,
like too many pull-ups or something.
Well, I can't do pull-ups, never
have it. My rotator cuff is
not that great either.
My left.
Aging's not for the faint...
But you know, what you can do now,
Levi, you can fly cast and
just keep your elbow, I'm
sure you know this against, against
your rib cage and you don't
do this, you just.
It's been tough because it's kept me
off the tennis court and like your
son.
I know you're a good tennis player.
My big love is playing tennis.
Do you ever play pickleball.?
I
have actively come out
against it.
Levi,
I can see that.
I knew the answer before I ask you
that question.
Whatever the opposite of a fan of
it, it's the sound more than
anything, Ed, the sounds.
Like there was this article that
said, my neighbor put a pickleball
court in. This was the New York
Times article that said, my
neighbor, put a Pickleball court in,
I'm currently going through cancer.
Pickle ball is worse.
Levi, do you know who loves
pickleball?
My wife Lisa, I'm talking
addicted.
Oh, man.
I played a couple of times.
Everyone should have a racket sport,
so it's great for her.
Levi, I played a couple of times.
Last time I played, I took a tumble.
And it was, I'm like,
I don't know.
I have a friend of mine here.
He started these chicken
and pickle things.
Give me footage of
Wimbledon, grass tennis court,
white. Give me Djokovic.
Look at him.
Give me Carlos,
give me tennis all day.
You want to watch pickleball on TV?
Get out of here.
Levi, Levi, my son EJ
and his wife, his wife was
a great tennis player. She was
ranked top 10 when she was young or
whatever, but they
love tennis and they, you
know, play a lot.
Oh, we played together.
It's so much fun.
Yeah, it is.
We've talked about
life, ministry,
fishing, the church, martyrs,
all sorts of things.
Have we talked about coffee?
We haven't talked about the coffee
yet. What are you drinking over
there?
Yeah, this is not my best.
I just just.
I'm up here in an area where we
do podcasts and stuff
and it's just kind of...
Is it what is that you're like?
Espresso machine you have
up there?
I have an old school
Italian.
I'm talking it's an old old
one. I don't even know the name of
it. You would, Levi.
Like you put the espresso in the
little thing.
Oh, yeah.
Or is it automatic?
Oh, no.
I put it, shh, shhh.
Yeah.
And is that how you make it at home
still these days?
I have a little one
at home.
I don't know who makes the one I
have at home?
I mean, it's not super expensive or
anything, but it makes some good
espresso. How about you?
You like espresso.
I have an automatic espresso
machine. I just like an Americano.
That's my jam.
Well, I like Americanos too.
It's just it's a longer drinking
experience this gone so quickly
Levi, this morning when
I got up, it's crazy you said that.
I normally have an espresso, I'll
make it quick.
I was up at dark 30 this morning, so
I thought, I want to
enjoy the coffee more.
So I took this,
it was almost raw milk that I
used, put it in there,
steamed it up, espresso,
latte city.
Yes sir, that was my jam this
morning.
Amazing.
Well, we'll have to have coffee
together soon.
Do you remember, I just had this
flashback, do you remember watching
Will Smith jump out of a hot air
balloon together?
I do.
Levi, yes I do.
We have some weird memories.
Yes, we have some wierd ones.
But there's been many
good ones, and there's more to...
And then the time we worked out in
our garage, we had the weight room.
You had a great gym there.
Thank you.
And then didn't we go to the Star
together the Dallas Cowboys star?
Yeah, I think...
What a memory!
This is a cool facility.
Well, Levi, thank you.
And I'm going to say a prayer for
you, too, for us, OK?
Oh, that'd be great.
Before we go.
Lord Jesus, thank You so much for
Levi and his beautiful family.
And I just thank You for our
friendship. I thank You, for his
leadership, his creativity, his
heart for You.
And just continue, God, as I know
You will, reveal Yourself to him as
he walks in Your footsteps.
And Father, I thank you again for
our church.
I thank that we have an opportunity.
To proclaim your glorious
gospel because it is
the power of God.
In Jesus' name, amen.
Love you, buddy. Love you man.