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Welcome to "No F**ks Given," where we redefine menopause as a superpower. Hosted by Holly Lamb, a women's health coach, who is navigating early menopause. This podcast offers empowering guidance on women's health and navigating perimenopause with confidence. From nutrition tips to fitness advice and mindfulness practices, we cover it all. But here's the twist: it's all about embracing your most authentic, unapologetic self. We're here to help you reclaim your power, say goodbye to societal norms, and live life on your own terms—no f**ks given. Welcome to the revolution!
Holly Lamb (00:00.92)
Hello and welcome to this week's episode of the No Fucks Given podcast with me, your host Holly Lamb. This week I am joined by Danielle Catherine, who is a mother, a retired nurse turned women's holistic health practitioner. And her passion project is to bring back women's circles, which has inspired her to write a beautiful book called Reclaiming Circle.
and she hosts circles online and runs bi-yearly Women's Circle facilitator training. And I'm super, super excited to have her on the pod. So welcome Danielle.
Danielle Catherine (00:39.809)
Thank you! Thank you so much for having me here.
Holly Lamb (00:43.52)
you're so welcome. I'm so excited. And I love to start the podcast with asking each guest how they got involved in this line of work. So what inspired you to transition from nursing to become a women's holistic health practitioner?
Danielle Catherine (00:59.969)
I know I need just like so many thoughts passing through my brain right now. So yeah, like you mentioned, I was a nurse. I was also a nurse in the army. So it was very masculine. Like it was like, I mean, when I say masculine, just mean it was very controlled the energy of that, of everything was so structured. I was living in a linear way and I was so disconnected from...
Holly Lamb (01:04.822)
Mmm.
Holly Lamb (01:12.462)
You
Danielle Catherine (01:27.425)
my body and also from having deep and healthy relationships with other people, not just women, just anyone in general, including myself. And I kind of just like blended in and I lost myself along the way. And then I came off the pill, the hormonal contraceptive pill, when I was in my early 20s, I will say.
And I was married at the time. And when I came off the pill, my life changed and I sniffed him and we divorced. mean, the pheromones, but I don't know if it was that exactly, but we kind of like started to see things. want to know that, or we started to speak our truth. I don't know what it was, but anyway, that ended in a separation and divorce. And I went.
Holly Lamb (02:08.142)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (02:26.387)
On my way down the spiritual path, I was caught on my journey by yoga and yoga said, come in, come and meditate and let's do some poses together. And I was like, that sounds great. That sounds healthy. That sounds like something that my body would like. So I went down that path and on this journey, I was like, I don't want to be in the military anymore. I'm done. Like the military and the nursing aspect, like within the system.
of the medical system is really, it was really tough on my body. And because I'm such a, the A type personality is more commonly used. I was really good at pushing myself to the limits and just like burning out and putting on a show for everyone. Like I'm great. I know how to do everything. And really underneath I was just drowning. So I went to India, as many people do, did a yoga teacher training course and I found some incredible people there.
And at this point, I'd actually already started to sit in circle with women. And I'd taken Uma Dismortuli's course at this point, who wrote the Yanni Shakti book, the big red book I always talk about. And yeah, she was just such a dream for me because she welcomed me into my body, actually. She said, here, here's the door, come on in. And she was...
just so soft and gentle and she showed to me by sitting in circle what it meant to feel safe in my own body, to feel safe, to communicate, that there's so much more to know about myself and other people and it made me feel alive again because I will be honest, I was going through really dark times throughout my life and coming off the pill kind of shocked my system a lot and there wasn't all this awareness around the menstrual cycle.
at that time that I could find online or on social media. don't even think I was really on social media then. And so anyway, when I was in India, I started to host these women's circles on the full moon and it was one of my closest friends, well, she became my closest friend. She said, we have to do a women's circle here. And I was like, yeah, I don't know if I know what I'm doing.
Danielle Catherine (04:45.397)
And she was like, you know, just hold the space and it will be magic. And she was like, you know, like my cheerleader. And cause she really wanted it too, but she didn't want to host. So she was like, she'll do it. So we did our first circle in India, in Rishikesh and like 80 women showed up. Cause my friend was just promoting it to everyone she spoke to in the cafes.
Holly Lamb (04:56.323)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (05:09.673)
and the ages were from like 16, there was mothers that came with their children all the way up to 85 because there was a group of women who had come over from Canada, I'm studying with my teacher, Devasu, and they were all sat in circle and I realized in that moment, this is so powerful. By listening to just one or two minutes of a woman's story, how much we can come to...
Holly Lamb (05:34.254)
Mm.
Danielle Catherine (05:39.377)
remember and pieces just was like slotting together and I was like crying. I have goosebumps now thinking about it because it was a very embodied experience of what it means to, to sit in circle and to witness one another. And that was like the first opening to this. And from there, holding all these holding circles online and in person,
Holly Lamb (05:58.702)
you
Danielle Catherine (06:06.953)
I learned something new every time. And, you know, there's things that I did in the beginning when I held space that I wouldn't do now, but I've only learned that from actually observing and putting myself out there. And so when I wrote the book, I was like, these are all the things that I would have needed to know when I first started. And a lot of it really is to do with
Holly Lamb (06:18.99)
Mm.
Holly Lamb (06:28.43)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (06:30.901)
being able to listen to ourselves and not get in our own way and not get in the way of listening to other people. So that's really how I got here. And because I love learning about my body, I find that doing it with other women, they see things that I don't see and they say things that I've been trying to put words to for a long time. And that just gives me that inspiration to continue to do, to hold these spaces.
Holly Lamb (06:35.167)
Holly Lamb (07:01.614)
Wow, that's so beautiful. I could just feel it. I could just feel it in my heart what you were saying. And it's so true. When women come together and the stuff that I've been doing with the menstrual cycle and the fact that women don't know these things, that we aren't told these things that are just so basic that we have four phases and we should honor each phase. And just by doing that, you're able to tap into your body so much more.
Danielle Catherine (07:05.705)
Ugh.
Holly Lamb (07:31.564)
Well, we know why it's hidden from us because they don't want us to know how powerful we are and how powerful women are. And I think what you're doing is just amazing. And clearly there's so much passion and power gone into what you're doing in that book. And it's something that all women need. And I've sat in women's circles and there's so much power, like you said, when women start to just share a little bit of their story.
and you don't realise how much of an inspiration your story can be to other women. And yeah, it's just, it's just beautiful. I just resonate with everything you've just said. It's so lovely.
Danielle Catherine (08:12.927)
Yeah, and I want to say like, well, I'm seeing you face to face. Thank you for the work that you're doing, because it really matters. You know, we all talk to our little group of people and they it resonates like whoever's saying that information or sharing a tool, whatever it is to some people really resonate and some people it won't and that's okay. And I think that's the beauty of
having many different spaces for women to come to because some women might not want to go to a goddess circle, some women might not want to go to an ecstatic dance or drink a cow, they might just want to sit with a cup of tea and not even call it a women's circle but just gather and become...
conscious of themselves, of their thoughts, of their body, and be around people that they really feel that they're safe with. And you know that because your body softens and you start to talk. That's why there's so much talking. When women feel safe, it like comes up to be seen. And I think one of the most important things I've learned is when that thing comes up to be seen, like it doesn't need words a lot of the time. Like if I'm listening to you, I don't need to say so much.
Holly Lamb (08:57.292)
you
Danielle Catherine (09:25.789)
Maybe you ask for advice, but most of the time when people are sharing, they just want it to come out into the world and someone to look at it be like, I see you, I love you. Like you've totally got this. And that has been the most powerful lesson for me. And it's easier to be in space with one another. If you show up and you know, you don't have to fix anything or change anything. You just have to remember
you're connected and you deeply love this person. Like that's it. And that's easy to do. Yeah, right. It's easy to do if you get your mind out of the way and you can see your fears like then. And that's why I think so many heart-based practices, heart-based practices are so...
Holly Lamb (10:00.108)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (10:15.137)
Powerful because there we see always There's a simple way. There's not so much that we need to know actually it's just about slowing down enough to to see someone to really see them and feel them and like you mentioned with the dimensional cycle when we get permission as women to go through these four different phases of our cycle Then we actually get to we have a moment where we're slowing down to feel our body
Holly Lamb (10:20.078)
Hmm.
Holly Lamb (10:28.846)
Mm.
Holly Lamb (10:37.454)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (10:45.321)
just before our period, say, or during our bleed, somebody said, it's actually good for us to slow down and maybe do certain practices that bring us back to our body. And then suddenly you start to listen to ourselves and we do the practice that we're practicing with other women. We get to listen, see them, I love you, show me what it is that is happening, let me feel it all.
Holly Lamb (10:56.27)
Mm-hmm.
Holly Lamb (11:10.872)
Yeah, exactly. And that's what menstrual cycle awareness is at its heart, is awareness of your body and how you're feeling at different points in your cycle in order for your body to show you what may be out of alignment. Because that's where PMS symptoms and all that comes up because there's something out of alignment, whether that's energetically, physically, whatever that is. And by bringing awareness to the four cycles and moving through it and not...
hiding it and shying away from it and just putting up with it, then that's how you can move through some of the more difficult things. And that's what helped me move through when I was diagnosed with early menopause at the end of 2022, to move through that by connecting back to my body and understanding that we already know everything, it's already in there. You just need someone to help you remember the power and draw it out of you.
Danielle Catherine (12:10.961)
so beautiful and it makes me think about all the times that I've been to see a doctor or a specialist and they have gone and honed in on my symptoms, you know, we'll get rid of them for you and it was only through, you know, like my
Holly Lamb (12:22.915)
Hmm.
Holly Lamb (12:30.72)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (12:36.553)
love for Ayurveda and being in India where they really see you as a holistic being, they see all layers of you and sometimes that can seem really spiritual or it can seem like we're being too much in like focusing on our emotions because we're not really in Ayurveda they're looking at all the different layers of our being and that there is when we get to see
Holly Lamb (12:42.84)
Bye.
Holly Lamb (12:56.878)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (13:01.825)
a thought that we're having or a past experience or something that we're carrying through our ancestral line, maybe something that's coming up in our dreams can actually have an effect on our overall health. And I feel like I can say that now with a knowing that there's so many layers to us that are important to look at, but I also know...
that it's so new to some people. And that's why these conversations have to keep flowing because probably in the circles you're in, maybe, I don't know, but my circles, it's like, okay, we kind of get the concept that there's so many layers. And it's easy to forget that there's so many women living without this knowing. And so just by role modeling it, I think by living.
Holly Lamb (13:46.072)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (13:51.553)
through living as a cyclical being, like giving ourselves a chance to rest, giving ourselves a to slow down, to be with our body, that really role models this whole thing that we're talking about. And that for me is what I try to do instead of preaching it to everyone that I meet. Like I've been there, I've done that, but it can close off like connections, communication straight away. Cause people are like, what are you talking about right now?
Holly Lamb (14:18.99)
Sorry what?
Danielle Catherine (14:22.497)
You want with your menstrual blood? okay. Goodbye. See you later.
Holly Lamb (14:25.554)
okay. Yeah. Yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah, the look, the stare, the light. Okay, sure. Yeah, I'm not doing that. But yeah, if you're living it, you're honoring it, if you're embodying it, then that's what comes across. And then that's when people connect and can see the changes. And that's what I did. I embodied it. And then in order to...
Danielle Catherine (14:36.033)
you
Holly Lamb (14:54.936)
to help other women, because I've been embodying it, they get it and they understand. And the women that I'm working with now, even like in a couple of weeks, it's like, wow, look at just by bringing awareness to your body how much things can change.
Danielle Catherine (15:10.517)
Yes, and I love how there's so many practices out there. There's so much circulating now in the collective about feeling our body, not trying to fix it. And I think that can also come with a confusion of, well, what does it mean to feel it? I can feel it, but how is that gonna help me when I'm out in the world? Like things don't seem to be shifting like.
Holly Lamb (15:19.406)
Yeah.
Holly Lamb (15:34.606)
Mmm.
Danielle Catherine (15:37.619)
there doesn't seem to be any deeper connection with the body. And many questions can arise, I think, around that. And what I noticed with being in Circle is when we sit, and I mean, Circle could just be one woman, like this is our Circle right now. It could be online, it could be a massive group. It's just a moment in time where you intentionally step into a space to be seen and to see somebody else truly. And...
Holly Lamb (15:44.44)
Mm.
Holly Lamb (15:53.752)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (16:06.589)
What I noticed in the beginning was when someone's speaking, sharing the story.
It could trigger something inside of me. And then suddenly my mind has switched on and it's thinking about me and my situation and my experience. And I'm looking at this person blindly. I'm not really seeing them anymore. And that person on some level will feel that they will feel energetically that you have disconnected from them. Yes, your eyes are looking, your ears are there, but you're not really seeing them and you're not really listening.
Holly Lamb (16:33.048)
Man.
Danielle Catherine (16:41.085)
And so one of the biggest things that I found is being in women's circle is thinking of it as a practice. It's like a deep meditation because it takes a lot to be present with.
with ourselves, with others in the space. And so we have to treat it like a practice, like a tool to develop skills. And we open the circle and that's the ceremony. That is the space where we can play and we get to know ourselves better. We can practice these skills of listening and we can really open our heart to connect.
And so when somebody is speaking and I become triggered in some way, maybe it's a deep love, like I'm so connected with you, I totally resonate, or maybe it's like, I don't really get why you would say that, or something inside of me brings up something of my past, know, my child, and a child gets triggered in some way.
Holly Lamb (17:36.526)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (17:40.361)
And that is where I feel the gifts are, because we get to know ourselves more deeply. And one thing that I do, that I practice that I found so powerful is to imagine this, like a beam of light between our hearts to the person that's talking and just whispering like, I love you and I see you. So if I notice myself getting triggered, usually sensations first, maybe I'll be moving around, like because I'm getting a bit like my energy isn't with that.
Holly Lamb (17:56.59)
Mm-mm.
Danielle Catherine (18:10.227)
person anymore maybe I'm just uncomfortable but you know my body's starting to move and maybe I am clenching my hands or my jaw or I'm singing a song in my head there's so many ways that you can see that you're distracted and it's just like a whisper into the self like I see you I love you I'm with you and when you give that to someone else it's much easier to give it to yourself in everyday life and the people who are in your close circle so you know like my daughter or my
my partner or my friends or the people in this community when I show up and I buy some food and I see them, I'm like, thank you. And it might be a short interaction, but it's so heartfelt, like it's meaningful. I don't have to have.
Holly Lamb (18:53.315)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (18:54.195)
in-depth conversations, but it's just that is so powerful. One second of just like if I walk into my partner's room and I look him in the eye and I say, Hey, how are you doing today? And I really mean it. That is so much more than just sitting and talking loads of crap at him. You know, there's a space for that too, but it's just, it's just a practice that I found in Circle that comes out in real life. Like it's, really just helps us in real life. yeah.
Holly Lamb (19:05.038)
Mm.
Holly Lamb (19:10.21)
Yeah.
Holly Lamb (19:17.838)
Mmm.
Yeah. Wow. That's so beautiful. It is and it's so true if you can learn to be present more and more. It does change your life because again, it's awareness, bringing awareness to the present moment because I mean, well, depending on what circles you move in, time is not linear. There's only here and now. There's no past. There's no future. There's only here and now. That is another rabbit hole. We will not go down, but being present.
Danielle Catherine (19:34.397)
One, two.
Danielle Catherine (19:48.799)
I went down there this morning. was literally something I said this morning. Literally. Well.
Holly Lamb (19:50.284)
Wow, yeah.
Holly Lamb (19:55.596)
Wow, yeah, it's only an hour in the moment they're here, like just be present with everything. So if someone was wanting to like go to a women's circle or was interested, like how would a woman, you know, go about finding something, finding the right one for them? What would they be looking for? How, where would they even start? they're listening to this going, this sounds a little bit interesting, but maybe it's a bit too woo woo for me. Where would I start?
Danielle Catherine (20:26.204)
So I think, well, I can say from my own experience from moving around to different communities so often.
A lot of the times there isn't one. So this is my experience. But some places I've been, there have been. And the way that I found them is going onto local Facebook groups. Usually there's an events page or something like that. And I'll just say, hey, is there any women's circles happening around here? And that's all I'll put. And I'll wait for any feedback. I usually do that whenever I go to a new community. Like just to mention to the audience, I...
Holly Lamb (20:38.936)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (20:59.649)
we'll say we're nomadic family. We don't live anywhere specifically. So every few months we travel around. So I'll put it out on the Facebook group just to see if there's anything already happening there. And maybe there is. And I'll ask myself, is this the space that I want to be sat in? And just to see what comes up in my body.
Holly Lamb (21:19.032)
Mm.
Danielle Catherine (21:19.123)
And then I'll connect with the person who's running the circles and just have a chat with them, see how that feels in my body. And it might be that I have a resistance from an insecurity or a fear. And this is where I would go into a practice of asking the question.
Holly Lamb (21:31.256)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (21:38.091)
What do I feel about going to this circle? And if I notice my nervous system contracting, usually I feel it around my cervix and around my hips as a contraction. Then I know that there's something that I need to really sit with around this space. Cause maybe it's a, let's just say it's a goddess circle. And suddenly I cringe. like, I don't want to be a goddess. Like I don't want to do that. So I'm like wondering, well, why don't, why don't I want to be a goddess? Like what, why not?
Holly Lamb (22:00.046)
Thank
Holly Lamb (22:03.886)
Why not? Come on.
Danielle Catherine (22:10.257)
And it might just be, I don't resonate with that circle, but it might be something in myself. So always the curiosity and going, like I do push my boundaries.
I push my boundaries gently. So if there's a space that I feel is intimidating me for whatever reason, I'll maybe just go and check it out just to see how I feel. There's so much to this, but when I show up, I'll just say to myself, I'm just coming to explore. I'm coming to experience. It's not to say that it's gonna serve me. It's not to say that I'm gonna come back every week, but let's just go ahead and be open to this.
But sometimes I just haven't gone to some circles because I just really know like that is not what I need in my life right now, but it might be in the future. So there is that.
I really believe there is a circle for every woman and they might shift over time as well depending on how the group is evolving because the circle will evolve as new people come, as new things are being explored and that is actually one of the amazing things about circle. It's there, it's its own entity for the community. So as people from the community come and show up and they sit there with their energy and they create this circle, the circle comes alive and it
Holly Lamb (23:05.485)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (23:25.553)
offers to the community what is needed for that community. And so everybody's giving their little bit of energy in there, feeding their wisdom into the space. And then the circle gives back. But sometimes, you know, there's different threads that people want to follow. There's different things that people are working through and it just doesn't resonate. And that's totally okay. And just, I like to keep them open because maybe one day I will want to go back there and be in that circle.
Holly Lamb (23:46.926)
Mm-hmm.
Holly Lamb (23:51.523)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (23:54.111)
But for myself, I started just to ruin them myself because there wasn't any in the communities. And I was so surprised because I was going to a lot of like, I know, say it like...
conscious communities, spiritual communities. And I was like, there's gonna be a women's circle here, nothing. So I started to run these circles and I would just have them open. No money exchange, just come in, bring some fruit into the center, some flowers. And we would just keep it simple to begin. We would just pray together, share some stories, do an intention for the full moon or the dark moon. And then as the circle got tighter, so this is in Peru, as we found there was the same women showing up every week, we started to go deeper.
with exploration of ourselves. So we would go down our ancestral line, our mother line, our father line, get into some deep wounds and then.
Holly Lamb (24:44.238)
Hmm.
Danielle Catherine (24:45.885)
As we did that, we didn't stay there because there's a point when you stay in the trenches too long and it can be kind of addictive, you know, to stay doing that work. So we'd come out and we'd be like, let's just do a dance party this week. And we'd just come and dance or we'd do an offering to the earth. Like there's so many ways that it can look. But we were contributing it. We were asking one another, what do we want to do this week? And that's beautiful too. So if you have a group of women, you know, if you put it on a Facebook group and they say,
Holly Lamb (24:55.042)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (25:16.699)
there's no women's circle here. Then the next thing is, who wants to start a women's circle? You don't have to take it all on yourself.
Holly Lamb (25:21.207)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (25:24.817)
I found having one person for myself, I found that having one person organizing it and kind of like making sure things happen on time, making sure that they're regular so people can tune into that. It's like a feeling of safety where there's a bit of structure like it's happening every full moon or dark moon. It helps to have that like rooted in and then everything else can dance from that really. But yeah, and also setting, if you just sit down or lay
down with your body and really just get soft where you feel your body is like, my body is so relaxed, whether you're doing energy healing or breath work or yoga, nidra, whatever it is that makes you feel that softness. And then just put it out there to the universe. Like I'm calling in my women's circle and there you go. Like you've planted the seed and, that's it. Just leave it there. Like you can pray with that in the day, like meditate with it, visualize it and, and it will come like.
Holly Lamb (26:13.752)
Mm.
Danielle Catherine (26:24.311)
for sure, whether you're hosting them or someone's calling you into a space, that's not even called a women's circle, it's called a knitting circle. And you're like, I like knitting, so I'm gonna go.
Holly Lamb (26:32.861)
Yeah, exactly. I love that. And obviously like women's circles, so your passion, I can just tell just by talking to you and how eloquently you talk about them. And you know, your new book, Reclaiming Circle, what is the most important message you want to convey with this book? And...
what made you want to write it down and get it out there to the masses.
Danielle Catherine (27:07.891)
I think what's coming through, so I just got a visual of when I was pregnant, I was sitting with my harmonium. was like playing music. I was doing a mantra and I was feeling kind of lost when I was pregnant. I didn't have a community around me. I was living in France on my I had a retreat center there. And even though there was people coming in, it was kind of lonely. I'd only been with my partner like four months and I didn't know what was happening.
and I sat and I was just like asking for help and I had I'm trying to put it into words because it was more of like an experience but my my daughter when she was in my womb
she brought me back to womb practices. She brought me back to my red thread. And not so much like I heard her say, okay, you need to go and, you know, touch your womb or breathe into your womb. It wasn't like so specific, but it was where my awareness was moving to. It was the things that were coming into my life, like certain practices that really dropped me back into my body. It was the stories that I was listening to with the women around me. It was the way that
Holly Lamb (28:05.229)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (28:22.945)
Women were listening to me. They were listening. I was sharing for the first time probably in my life so vulnerably because I felt so afraid and so alone. And so...
I think from really going into the women's circles and creating these spaces, especially the online ones as well, is that there's a space for every woman. There's a space where you can be seen and you can show up and just be who you are. Let down the walls. Have a moment where you can be in your heart where there's nothing to do. There's nothing to be fixed. There's no chores. There's just you being with your body.
Holly Lamb (28:53.742)
Hmm.
Danielle Catherine (29:08.425)
with women who are each carrying the whole wisdom from their ancestral line. Each woman that you sit with will have a wise woman, medicine woman in their lineage, someone who knew, knew the body, knew nature, knew how to communicate.
with themselves, with others, with things around them. So it's very surprising to women when we sit in sickle and some things come through when we're speaking, like where did that come from?
Or it might be that something comes through an expression of some kind of pain inside of them, and it might not make sense in the moment, but it's there then to unravel. And just like my daughter guided me to wound practices, because I became conscious to my body, I became aware of my body more deeply, the same thing happens in circle, because we're encouraging each other to feel more deeply and reclaim the rites of passage through
Holly Lamb (30:06.094)
in
Danielle Catherine (30:14.339)
throughout our life, even if they've already been, you know, like there's still healing to be done if we didn't, wasn't able to experience menarche in a way that was nourishing for us or a pregnancy or a birth or a miscarriage or abortion or...
the death of someone grieving if we weren't able to fully like experience these rites of passage for whatever reason maybe they've been disrupted because of work that you have to attend to there's a pulling from the system or someone from the medical system has said you know like take this medication or someone from the funeral service said you know you have to get this body in the ground asap or we can't do it right now we have to pump them with chemicals and you see
the body and it doesn't look like them and just like this suddenly this grieving process is becoming traumatic and disconnected. It doesn't seem real like you're watching a movie. And so I feel when we sit in circle when we have different themes maybe or meditations we're able to bridge that gap from the unknown to the known these rites of passage that were ours to experience and they're ours to experience for reason because we get them in our life.
because the wisdom and the gems that come from each of them experience are meant for us and our community. So it's like this rippling out effect. So I feel like even though you might have missed.
Holly Lamb (31:38.124)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (31:44.001)
the full presence of yourself in a rite of passage, whatever it is, you can reclaim it and you can go back and you just like fill your bag with all these gems and crystals and you're like, all right, let's go, I've got this. And you bring them back and you unravel it in some way. You're like, okay, it doesn't make much sense, but this is what I've got. And you start putting the pieces together and you sharing with people and suddenly you're like, look, I get it. And it makes sense in your body. And then this becomes a knowing and you.
Holly Lamb (31:57.784)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (32:09.341)
live life differently, you perceive life differently, you show up differently, it's like you evolve. And that might take years of just like coming to Circle and being like, had this experience and wanting to talk about it over and over again. And then one day it clicks. And I think that's another thing that I'll just add is like, if someone comes to Circle and they're sharing the same thing over and over again, in my, you know, growing up as a kid, you might call that this person's like a broken record, know, saying the same thing over again, come on, get over it.
Holly Lamb (32:11.397)
And.
Holly Lamb (32:23.971)
Mm-hmm.
Holly Lamb (32:36.141)
Yes.
Danielle Catherine (32:38.165)
pull yourself together. But as that person keeps sharing and they keep using the words, every time it will be different and they're like looking from an outside point of view. And then one day it will all come together. So that is such a gift to give someone to listen to their story that they're just like stuck on it one point and then suddenly they look up and they're like, my gosh, I get it.
Holly Lamb (32:57.528)
you
Holly Lamb (33:02.124)
Yeah, that's so true. And that's that is what happens the more you can go over it again and start to perceive it in a different light, then eventually you will get to the answer that you need, which is which is what you can do with your cycle as well. You'd the same repeating patterns come up, especially in your luteal phase, come up again and again and again. there's a reason for that because you need to move through it and you're not. bringing awareness through it helps you.
Danielle Catherine (33:18.516)
Yes.
Danielle Catherine (33:23.105)
And again.
Holly Lamb (33:31.736)
been able to move through it. And that sounds exactly the same in women's circles as well. It is my way. When you start to get into this work, like the changes that can happen is just, it's just crazy. And for people who, who, who don't do it.
Danielle Catherine (33:38.441)
It's like you have your own inner like women's circle happening with all the phases. That's so true. Wow.
Holly Lamb (33:59.486)
or who haven't been to women's circles, who aren't practising menstrual cycle awareness. It's really difficult to explain these things until you start to experience them yourself and you start to see the changes within you that then ripple out to your life, which is what's happened with me. But what would you say is the biggest thing that you've learnt about yourself since doing women's circles?
Danielle Catherine (34:33.459)
I think the biggest thing I've learned about myself is that...
So ironic. But I put other people first over and over again. So sometimes I've held circle and I'm not in a good place. You know, like I actually didn't really want to show up. And this is where if I would have listened to this very early on, I would have, I would have heard very easily.
Hey, you need to make more time for yourself because you're drained. Like you're a, you're really great at holding space. Like you're really good at sharing meditations and making things digestible for people. like, what about you? And so when I,
Holly Lamb (35:19.544)
you
Danielle Catherine (35:21.349)
When I become depleted in any way, now I just take a look at my... I use the menstrual cycle awareness. Like that is one of my biggest things. I look and I see, did I push myself too hard during my bleed? Was I all like go, go, go and now I'm playing catch up?
And I think that has been the biggest gift for me because like you mentioned, you're able to check in. Like you're able to just check in and be like, what's happening now? Why am I not making time to rest? Or why am I not nourishing myself? And...
Holly Lamb (35:57.934)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (35:59.999)
So yeah, it's been a thing that I really, I'm glad that it was shown to me because I thought by doing women's circles, by practicing like womb, know, practices, womb healing, menstrual cycle awareness, I thought that would be like tick, tick, tick, like everything's gonna be better, but these are just tools. So if I wasn't showing up, doing the practice in full presence and I wasn't fully melting into it, then.
Holly Lamb (36:24.398)
you
Danielle Catherine (36:27.763)
I'm really limited in how far I can go to deeply like meet myself and nourish myself. So instead of it being like, okay, I've done my womb steam tick or I've done my womb massage tick. It's more like what does my body want right now? Maybe it doesn't want a womb massage. Maybe it just, I just want to lay there or maybe I want to dance around whatever it is. But I think that is the biggest thing of really.
getting to know myself of what I like, what I don't like, what I do when I'm feeling insecure, what I do when I'm feeling afraid. And also,
really showing me that I had no clue about conscious communication when I started this. I had no clue. It might look like I was listening, but underneath I was just insecure. Only listening to myself, only wanting to show up in a way that people would appreciate me. So Circle really taught me that about myself and helped me to grow as a woman, as a person, as a human, wanting to connect and just be in love, be in the feeling of love.
Holly Lamb (37:33.932)
Mm-hmm. that's so beautiful. Everybody wants the feeling of love. When she can get to that place. Yeah, it's beautiful. I know, you're so cosy. And where do you kind of see the movement of women's circles heading in the next few years? Do you think this is something that's gonna start to ripple out more? Because I know in my community, there's a couple that I'm aware of now.
Danielle Catherine (37:34.08)
You
Danielle Catherine (37:39.369)
So cozy. So cozy.
Holly Lamb (38:03.608)
whereas maybe a couple of years ago there wasn't any.
Danielle Catherine (38:08.609)
Yeah, it's a good question. mean, as far as if we look at what we have in history, there's women have been gathering in circles since the beginning of time, since we can look at history and see, you know, where we have these artifacts that are showing that the women are gathering, that the women are placed in the center of the community. And that was a really big thing. And maybe, you know, it wasn't the label of women's circles, but it was it was just happening because it was all happening in rhythm.
Holly Lamb (38:17.986)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (38:38.633)
women would come together to bleed together under the dark moon when we didn't have like the artificial light and we didn't have these linear ways of living. So it would just be a natural thing to come together and bleed into the earth. And then so much has happened between then and now. So much oppression, trauma.
so many things, disconnecting, separating us from ourselves, from other women, from our family, and like lining us up and saying, you know, listen to this information and do what we say. then suddenly we, families are having babies and they're brought into this world of, you know, go to school and do what your teacher tells you. Don't go to the toilet. If you need the toilet, just hold it in. And,
Holly Lamb (39:22.323)
Yep.
Danielle Catherine (39:23.731)
And so I feel like the circle, like I said before, it's its own entity and it will evolve in the way that the community needs it. So I feel like it's always been there. Sometimes it's looked different, maybe because it's needed to be hidden to protect women, to protect their lives literally. So it would look a different way at a certain time when gathering in circle was a threat to the system.
Holly Lamb (39:34.029)
Hmm.
Holly Lamb (39:50.862)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (39:52.811)
So we then evolved and it looks different. then we come to now where we're very open. We're for most, so not all countries, but where I'm from, where you're from, we are privileged that we can have this life where we can, you know, put period blood on our face and dance around naked under the full moon and talk about women's circles all day. Like we can do that and probably we're gonna be okay.
Some countries, no, it's not like that at all. We have to remember that, because it seems like it, because we see it all on social media. But some countries, you cannot do that. Still, there's so much to do. So.
Holly Lamb (40:27.032)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (40:30.771)
When we think about it, think it will continue and it will continue in the way it will evolve in a way that is meaningful to the women who are calling it in. So it could look so different. Like who would have thought that it would be online, you know, like online circles. first I was so resistant, but it's the only way I can be in circles sometimes and same for other women, you know, like it's that they're working at certain times of day, have kids or like other commitments. It's tough. So.
Holly Lamb (40:43.918)
Bye.
Danielle Catherine (40:55.84)
I feel like we can see how it's evolved over time and how it will look in the future will be its own unique, beautiful way. But the only way that it will continue is obviously if women are here, that's a really big thing. And that means if they're not, then something terribly wrong has happened. Humanity is gone. I feel like it's... We're done. So as long as we have women, then it's going to still continue to happen. And I would love to see how it unfolds.
Holly Lamb (41:08.174)
you
Holly Lamb (41:11.662)
Yeah. Well, that's it, isn't it? Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (41:24.641)
You hear that lizard? That's a lizard. Can you hear that?
Holly Lamb (41:26.636)
yes, yes.
Danielle Catherine (41:30.081)
It's like a dog. That's a lizard. Yeah, he's massive. He's come. Maybe it's a she. yeah. Yeah, she's gonna pass this message on to the lizard friends and then like in the future they'll be doing their own lizard women's circles, however that looks. So yeah, I believe that they'll continue in their own beautiful way. How that will look, I will be so intrigued. My grandchildren, my granddaughters will hopefully.
Holly Lamb (41:32.165)
my god.
Holly Lamb (41:37.996)
Yeah, it's a her. She's joining Circle.
Danielle Catherine (41:59.485)
be experiencing that if I continue the red thread. I don't know what happens after this life but yeah I pray that it will continue to thrive.
Holly Lamb (42:03.054)
Mm-hmm.
Holly Lamb (42:10.242)
Yeah, wow. This has been so beautiful. I feel like we could probably talk about anything to do with the women and the womb and women's circles all day long. But I'd love for you to just share how people can connect with you, how people can work with you, what office you've got and where we can buy your books.
Danielle Catherine (42:16.138)
Yeah.
Danielle Catherine (42:19.695)
Danielle Catherine (42:30.145)
All right, all right. So where am I? I'm on social media. So alongside Women's Circle, have, I'm just going to mention this for any mothers out there. So I have my podcast, is Depths of Motherhood podcast, and that's been going for three years. And that's basically going from anything from conception, preconception all the way through whatever, like motherhood.
Holly Lamb (42:34.094)
you
Danielle Catherine (42:56.807)
And so I release weekly episodes there so you can listen to me there. And then in the women's circle, I host live gatherings once a month now on the dark moon. And then I'm uploading meditations to different workshops every week into the membership space. But you can join the live events like it's donation based.
Give nothing, give what you want, it's absolutely fine. Come, if you can't make the live, then I send the recording. I just recently set up a six week Women's Circle facilitator training. You don't need to do training. You don't need a certificate to host Women's Circles yet. It sometimes helps just to...
understand yourself, your community, how to, you know, create themes, structure. So I started to do that this year and that filled up straight away because I only wanted 12 people, women in the space. So we're going to do it again in January and my aim is to do it twice yearly. I think that's from the women's circle space and I do do take private
Holly Lamb (43:51.726)
Mm-hmm.
Danielle Catherine (44:03.393)
clients, but right now I'm full. So I do have a wait list and whenever I have space free, I put it out there to the email, but I'm only, I only want to take two or three calls a week because I'm full time mama right now. I'm like getting into Waldorf schooling with my daughter and it takes a lot of energy. So I can only take one hour day away from her or like the whole thing collapses. So what about me?
Holly Lamb (44:21.39)
you
Danielle Catherine (44:30.593)
and my book is you can find it on my website or on Amazon so either way it's either way if you book from if you buy it from my website it's still coming from Amazon anyway I just send it but it's cheaper on my website cheaper on my website by one pound
Holly Lamb (44:36.216)
amazing.
Holly Lamb (44:41.398)
Okay, amazing. is it? nice, yeah.
Well, I'll pop it all in the show notes anyway, so people can find you and connect with you and buy your book and yeah, come to one of your lovely women's circles. Yes, absolutely. I will be there 100%. Thank you so much. Thank you, Danielle, for joining me. It's been a beautiful conversation. Yeah, it's been lovely. Thank you.
Danielle Catherine (44:52.683)
Thank you.
Danielle Catherine (44:59.681)
Thank you, and I'll see you there soon. Thank you.
Danielle Catherine (45:10.944)
Mm.
Thank you, Holly. Thank you for the work that you're doing. You're amazing. It's been such a pleasure. Thank you.
Holly Lamb (45:19.182)
Thank you. And thanks everyone for listening this week and I'll see you all next week.