Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Small group leaders, pastors, and more discussing strategies for growth and community in church groups. The Small Group Network is an international ministry that equips churches to engage in deeper discipleship and community.
James Browning: Hello, and
welcome to F G squared.
Steve Gladen the global pastor of small
groups from Saddleback church polls
from his over 25 years of experience.
To encourage and equip listeners like
you to lead small group ministry.
So let's listen and learn together.
Derek Olson: Welcome to SG squared.
Steve Gladen on small groups.
Derek Olson here with
the main man of the hour.
The man whose very initials stand
for small groups, Steve Gladen.
Steve, how are you, my friend?
Steve Gladen: Derek, super great
to be together and, uh, look
forward to this, uh, this show.
I mean, it may have to get broken up
a little bit, but man, we gotta, we
got the mailbag of all mailbags that
we're looking forward to breaking into.
So it's, uh, it's pretty
exciting and pretty fun.
Derek Olson: Yeah, stay tuned everyone.
We are going to dive into a plethora
of mailbag questions.
These are the top small group questions
people are asking and plethora.
Steve, uh, what movie does that come from?
A good old eighties movie plethora.
Steve Gladen: plethora.
Maybe I was reading my Bible too
much and I don't know, or Oh my gosh.
Derek Olson: A plethora.
Steve Gladen: Oh man, that'd be a
good video clip just to slice in here.
If we had the great
production team around us.
Derek Olson: So Steve, we got,
uh, before we jump into this epic
mailbag of mailbags, I mean, father
of the bride talking about movies.
You lived out that infamous
movie father of the bride.
Just a few months ago, your only
precious daughter got married.
How are you doing my friend?
Steve Gladen: Well, like father,
the bride, but the great thing
is I didn't go to prison.
So that, that was a, that was
a major win and everything,
but it was, it was priceless.
I mean, anyone who's
married off their daughter.
Uh, understands it and it's crazy
and it was full of tears, full
of laughter, full of everything.
I mean, uh, you know, it's, we,
Lisa and I wish we could relive
it over and over and over again.
And did, uh, got through the speech
and then on the father daughter dance
that we did, uh, butterfly kisses.
That's when the song came
out when Erica was born.
And man, it just broke
us both up and all that.
Now, the great thing was is
that the, they had a live band
for the, uh, for the reception.
And what was great was they edited the
song from four minutes to two minutes.
So the guy who can't dance, I
was super grateful, uh, of that.
So it was priceless.
So it was good.
So it
Derek Olson: So wait, were you, you, did
you say you guys were dancing to the song?
Butterfly kisses?
Were you just like.
Sobbing your eyeballs out.
Steve Gladen: Yeah, it
was, it was, you know.
Derek Olson: Wow.
Steve Gladen: can't
think about it too much.
Cause I'll
Derek Olson: Right, right.
Okay.
Well, to give you to change the mood here.
I'm picturing you.
I'm picturing the father
of the bride movie.
If you guys haven't seen that
movie, you got to see it in
90s classic with Steve Martin.
But one of my favorite scenes in that
movie was when he's basically going insane
and he finds himself at the grocery store.
And he's removing hot
dog buns out of the bag.
Steve Gladen: You know, I felt like that
many times, you know, going, why did
the hot dog company and the bun company
get together to mess us up and, uh,
we, we paid way too much, I mean, it's,
you know, this is the negative side of
capitalism when you're on the receiving
side of them going supply and demand,
it was, it was painful, it was painful.
Derek Olson: Your pocketbook's
probably glad that that whole
wedding experience is over.
Steve Gladen: Well, Lisa and I are
going to be moving in with you guys.
So we appreciate, you know, you and
Julie just opening up your home and
just saying no problem whatsoever.
Derek Olson: Love it.
Steve Gladen: Hey, let me
let fair fair fair turn.
Now.
I get it.
So I hear through the grapevine
brother that you are now a music
teacher on the side volunteering.
Give me this coupon that piece.
Derek Olson: The things
you get talked into, right.
Or I should say the things
you do for your kids.
Steve Gladen: Yeah,
Derek Olson: Yeah.
So my daughter started her second
year at a, a private school in town.
And she's loving it and they've
been trying to fill a position as
of a music teacher Which is like
a paid position and I guess they
couldn't you know Find somebody or
they had someone and then lost them.
And so next thing I know
I'm being recruited.
They're asking me.
Mr.
Olson.
Would you consider?
teaching the kids music and
I So I had a meeting, kind of
found out what this was about.
And, and, um, I said, look, if I'm
going to do it, it's got to be fun
and it can't just be using some stale
curriculum and we'll teach the kids
some theory, but we're, I got to also
make it fun just so that I'm having fun.
And they're like, okay, you're hired.
And so, but I'm doing it volunteer.
But anyway, yesterday was my first
day teaching K through sixth grade.
Okay.
Music!
I had to do it three times.
First to, uh, a bunch of
kindergartners, and then first through
third, and fourth through sixth.
And, let's just say it was fun, but,
um, I underestimated the mayhem of
giving that many kids recorders.
Steve Gladen: Oh, my goodness.
How I remember my daughter playing the
recorder, my son playing the recorder, and
I'm sure there are a bunch of parents who
hate you as much as I hated that teacher.
But did you ever think when you
were a worship leader that someday
your audience would be K through
six going teach me how to worship?
Derek Olson: Right?
No, it's crazy.
And I'm also having glimpses of
like that School of Rock movie.
It's crazy.
Where like I'm this old fat guy
and I'm trying to teach these
young the next generation.
But it was fun and hopefully they don't,
they don't run me out of town too fast.
Steve Gladen: Well, you got
two great throwback movies that
our listeners can go watch.
You know, schoolhouse rock and, uh, and
Derek Olson: father the bride.
Steve Gladen: Oh my gosh.
Crazy.
Let's jump into a mailbag.
We do have a lot that came from the.
Uh, the 2024 lobby, if I remember right.
And a bunch of questions came in that
we couldn't answer, uh, at the lobby.
And so Derek and I decided
to kind of jump in.
There are a lot of questions that
you guys, uh, submitted, um, this
pro it's going to have to be broken
up into multiple shows, but, uh,
it'll be fun for you to be able to.
Check it out and, uh, you
know, just listen to it.
Uh, however we break this up,
each episode will, um, uh, have
the questions in the show notes.
So you can kind of know what
you're getting into, uh, as you
open it up and listen to it.
So it should be fun though.
It's going to be fun.
Derek and I are going to, uh, kind of play
off of each other and kind of go back and
forth and see, see what kind of wisdom
we can shake out of both of our heads.
Derek Olson: Yeah.
And so real quick question, um, for people
that might not know what the lobby is,
you want to give that just a quick plug?
Steve Gladen: Yeah, especially
since in 2025, it's going to move
from generally, we have a February
of other year of every year.
It's a networking event.
We bring because of the ranch is limited.
We bring about 120 small group point
people together to network, get
ideas, share concepts in the evenings.
We usually bring speakers in who
kind of take us to places that
we wouldn't naturally go to.
Uh, a small group point people just
to get us thinking and everything.
But you, uh, you can come, uh, solo.
You can come with a team, uh,
you can come however you'd like.
But the great thing is, is that it's a
great time to meet other small group point
people from across the United States.
And generally we have a couple of
international people who fly in for it.
Uh, this particular year coming up as
we're, you know, filming this in 2025 next
year, it'll be in May, not in February.
So, uh, you can go to smallgroupnetwork.
com, kind of, uh, look up
the lobby under our events.
And, uh, it is really one of the
most fun events that, uh, I enjoy
personally because, uh, we kind of
hardwire in a bunch of downtime.
So that you can, uh, kind of pair up with
people that you have met throughout the
lobby to take it further, where the name
came from was that I ended up going to a
lot of conferences throughout my years.
Many years as you can, if you're
watching on video, you can tell.
Uh, but I've gone to a lot of throughout
the years going to conferences and
I'd find myself spending a lot of
time out in the lobby, not that the
plenaries weren't great, but I knew I
could listen to the plenaries anytime.
uh, and get the content, you know,
post the conference if I wanted to.
And, but what I couldn't get was the
time that we spend in the lobby, uh,
meeting people and talking to people,
find out what's working in their
church and just meeting new friends.
And so, uh, thus the lobby came out.
And so it's been something we've
done, wow, um, 15 years and
counting and still moving ahead.
So, um, it's sold out every year.
So sorry for those of you
that couldn't come last year.
Uh, we will try to fit as many
people as we can, but because
of, uh, group dynamics, we really
try to limit it to that 120 mark.
So, uh, but it's a fun time spending
time in, uh, Orange County, uh, Derek,
maybe in the show notes, you could
show up your clip of one of the lobbies
where you had your drone footage.
Uh, you just said that you're just
a master of all kinds of traits.
If you don't know, Derek also has
a couple of shows on Instagram
that you should check out on.
Ancient pyramids and ancient
writings and stuff like that.
Uh, what's the, what's the
Instagram channel real quick.
Derek Olson: Stargate Voyager
is the Instagram handle.
If you want to go down the
weird history rabbit holes,
check me out.
Steve Gladen: So we'll, we'll throw,
we got to throw that in the link.
We'll throw that in the link.
We'll also, if you can dig up the drone
footage of the lobby, throw that in there.
It'd be some free to get a little
snapshot because this, uh, this, the, the
video clip that Derek did, uh, it will
communicate far more than, than I can on
the beauty of what the lobby is all about.
Derek Olson: Yeah.
Having been there several
times, what a great event.
It's in one of the most beautiful settings
at this incredible campus, um, in the
sunshine, lots of downtime, like you
said, to go to the ocean, see the beach.
But then you're learning from
premier smuggler ministry leaders,
some of the top in the nation.
Um, but like you said, the best part
is the lobby, what you would call
just the lobby, the in between times
where you're networking and you're
meeting all these other small group
ministry leaders from around the nation
and stealing all their best ideas.
What's not to like?
So go to smallgroupnetwork.
com and sign up.
Steve Gladen: Yes.
Spell group network.
com.
Sorry to cut you off there.
My friend.
Derek Olson: So we got this huge mailbag.
So I'm thinking I'll, uh.
I'll ask you the question, Steve,
you can answer, share from your
vast 25 plus years of experience.
And then I might chime in
with a little extra nugget.
Sound good.
Steve Gladen: Yeah, sounds super.
Let's jump into it.
Derek Olson: Okay.
Here are the top mailbag questions.
And there's so many of them.
We're probably going to break this
up into a couple, uh, maybe two or
three episodes, but number one, Steve,
the question is drum roll, please.
Steve Gladen: Hmm.
Derek Olson: What advice would you give to
someone brand new to vocational ministry?
Steve Gladen: Yeah, I think there's
a number of things when you,
when you're new to, to ministry
that you got to understand.
And one that is, it is
all about relationships.
It's relationships,
relationships, relationships.
And the more you can spend time getting
to know people, uh, it is the economy of
getting things done in the church world.
And if you don't enjoy kind of
getting to know people, then that is
going to be a tough route for you.
But specifically in the small group,
uh, ministry is that one of the things
I would suggest that you do is you've
got to network with other people.
We're just talking about it in the lobby.
Uh, but also just networking with
other churches in your community.
Okay.
I am shocked that, um, gosh, since 80,
85, I've been delving into the small
group ministry world and, um, it's, it's
crazy that small group point people.
work about building community and we tend
to be some of the most isolated people.
And, uh, I can't tell you how
many small group point people I've
talked to that are not networking
with the churches in their area.
They don't even know the
churches in their area.
And I would just encourage you if
you're new in that, spend time, call
churches up, look on their website,
Discover, you know, who they're,
who's handling groups and just say,
can I get a cup of coffee with you?
Rarely.
Uh, even when I have people ping
me locally and when they say,
Hey, can you get a cup of coffee?
I'll make room for that because all
of us who have been In the ministry
for a long time, no matter how many
decades it's, we remember what that
was like, and we always want to
give back, uh, to the other people.
So I'd encourage you, you know,
uh, and small group network.
com.
We have circles that you can join.
Uh, if you can't find one in
your area, start one and just,
you know, put it out there.
Uh, there's lots of information on
the small group network, uh, dot com
page on how to do that under circles.
Uh, so I'd encourage you to network.
I'd also, uh, a thing off the top of my
head would be, uh, know your playbook,
get to understand, you know, what is
it that is going to be your playbook?
Uh, you got to know your end in mind.
You got to know the pathway
to get to the end in mind.
You got to know the, the head
guard rail and the heart guard
rail that kind of encompass.
leader training and curriculum pathways
and the tools you're going to develop.
And in the heart guard rail, you got to
understand the who are the people that
you're kind of trying to minister to and
what kind of data are you trying to keep?
And then how are you going to
get people on this pathway?
I mean, it's a, there's a, I could
talk for hours just on, you know, the
structure of a small group ministry,
but you've got to, that is, that
will become, uh, your playbook.
And so you've got to understand,
uh, you know, where that's at.
And then I would, another thing
that, um, I probably didn't do enough
of is ask, ask people questions.
And, uh, the beauty of email,
the beauty of texting, the beauty
of social media to DM people.
Um, you have the ability to talk to
people all around the globe and just, you
know, asking them some great questions.
So just don't go it alone.
Don't try to figure it out yourself.
I've been in small group
ministry way too long.
There's some things that are so
common to small group ministry.
Once you figure out how your church
defines a disciple, Everything
else is pretty much the same.
And so don't stumble
through all that, uh, solo.
Derek Olson: You said so many
great things there, Steve.
That's a crazy factoid about small
group point people being some of the
loneliest ministry leaders around.
That is crazy.
Again, when you consider the
nature of what we do is small
group point people, but,
uh, go
Steve Gladen: it, it is funny, man.
Just even on our Facebook group.
I mean, we have tens of thousands of
people that are on it, but you know,
a lot of, and we see the, we know
that you're looking at it, but you
just tend not to participate in it.
So it's yeah.
Derek Olson: I would, I
would, uh, encourage people
new to vocational ministry.
Yeah, pace yourself.
Steve Gladen: Mm.
That's
Derek Olson: Being in
it for the long haul.
Um, I mean, so much of ministry seems
like it's event driven and that's awesome.
But ultimately, don't go
to home like Steve said.
Ask questions.
And just, you know, Care for people,
you know, I think about Chick fil a and
then amazing customer service they offer
and that sets them apart to most other
fast food chains you go to because it's
you feel like they care about you and so
Again, how much more is ministry leaders?
Should we care about the people
that we're, you know shepherding?
So that's my one piece of advice
is care about people Love them.
That's more important
than all the busy stuff
you could do.
That's what they're going to remember
is man, Pastor Blank or so and so
leader, man, they really care for me.
They remembered my name.
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
It is such a balance on, on,
you know, balancing care and
balancing, uh, working the system.
It's people and processes and,
um, people always have to win.
So that's a good thing.
Uh, as I'm thinking about that too,
when I was talking about questions,
uh, I wrote a book called, uh,
planning small groups with purpose.
And in that there's 20 questions that
you can ask yourself or go take those
questions and ask others those questions.
So
Derek Olson: Okay.
On the mailbag question, number two.
What is key to moving from good and
high part, sorry, let me do that again.
What is key to moving from good
and high participation to great and
highly effective in your groups?
Steve Gladen: yeah.
Um, it is, yeah.
When I saw that question come across, I
was like going, wow, good, good question
for how do you move from good to great?
I think there's a book on a good
to great, but we'll go with that.
A few things I would go through.
One would be a consistency.
Uh, uh, you know, we always say the
Bible's made up, uh, in a family system.
And the, the great thing about that
is, is that, uh, the church, the more
consistency you get, uh, you see that a
lot when the senior pastor changes every
few years, there's, you know, almost a new
playbook that comes in with a new person.
Uh, the more consistency you can help
bring, bring to your church's system,
um, that they can build upon it.
It's, it builds the stability
that, that they need.
Uh, another thing that would take you
from good to great is, um, the buy
in with the senior pastor, the senior
leader, the lead pastor, um, you know,
the Bishop, whatever their, the, the
title they hold, but whosoever the Senior
leader of your church, the more buy in
you can get with them, the, the better
off you're going to move from, you know,
good to great, because when the, when
the stage isn't involved in it, uh,
then it just helps build that, um, that
culture of what you're trying to do.
It's interesting that when.
Rick started moving from
preaching about groups to in
many sermons throughout the year.
Um, he would talk about his small
group and him talking about his
small group was, was doing more than,
than the, than that aspect of it.
Um, another thing I was
thinking of is, uh, training.
Uh, a lot of times we don't
have a clear training pathway.
that gets your leaders to maximize
who they are and developing
the people in their groups.
And that would be a big piece of it.
And, um, then I would say another thing
is, um, getting your pool of people,
because a lot of times when churches
are good in small groups, Um, they don't
have a pipeline that's feeding them.
And, um, there's all kinds of things you
can read about a churchwide campaign.
I wrote about it in my first book.
Um, but I would encourage you to do
a churchwide campaign because it kind
of helps defibrillate your church into
from children, students, and youth.
permeating the culture
of small group ministry.
So it'd be a great thing.
Um, Derek, any ads you have on that?
Uh, you, you've been in the trenches
like myself when you had to take it
up a notch or two from good to great.
Derek Olson: Yeah, I would say the
greatest little nugget I could offer,
and you already kind of said it,
Steve, was senior leadership buy in.
Uh, having worked at Saddleback and
a couple churches that had a lead
pastor that was all into groups or,
or really passionate about them.
And then having worked at churches
that had a senior pastor or leader
that wanted lots of groups, but
wasn't necessarily championing them
from the stage or in one themselves.
To me, that was one of the key
ingredients of this good to great
participation was getting that senior
leadership buy in to where they're
talking about groups often from the
stage and talking about their group.
To me, that's the next level that,
uh, really takes it to great.
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
Well, we'll talk a lot about, you know,
building that relationship with your
senior leader because You're right, Derek.
It, it, it really, it probably
is the number one key that
you're bringing up there.
So I think it's a, it's a good piece.
Derek Olson: All right, on to
number three, How do you navigate
creating a small group culture if
senior leadership isn't on board?
Steve Gladen: Oh, well,
let's, let's address it now.
Um,
It's hard.
Let me just, let me be upfront with you.
If you don't have a strong piece of
tenacity in your fiber, then you might
be a little bit harder than I think,
but it's hard, but it's not impossible.
Um, because a lot of times your
senior leader is so involved in
trying to get the weekend going
and trying to build the church.
They just don't have, they haven't
spent time thinking about groups.
And so most times it's not that they, they
go, Oh man, I don't want small groups.
I hate small groups.
Why would we do small
groups and things like that?
But a lot of times it is, they
don't know what they don't know.
Um, but so part of it, what do
I encourage you to do is help,
uh, help move them relationally.
Uh, one of the things is help them
see you as a friend, not a foe.
Many times I've seen a lot of small
group point people, they, they
try to drive their agenda so much.
They almost feel the senior leadership
feels they're in competition with you.
And what you got to do is, um, uh, what
I tell a lot of people is, you know,
there's a book called love languages and
the, it, it talks about in a personal
relationship with a spouse or your kids
or someone you're dating, you know,
you get to know their love language.
I know my wife's love language,
Derek knows Julie's love language.
Um, and you do, you get to know their
love language because you want to show
them the right affection for them.
And in the same way, have fun.
A lot of people were so
busy driving our agenda.
We don't know the love
language of our senior leader.
And what can happen is when you don't
know that and you don't try to build a
relationship with them, it's like, they're
talking Italian, you're talking English
and you'll, you'll just never connect.
And so I would encourage you to find out.
And I remember with Rick, when I first
came on, He was really driven by our class
system, which is our cognitive process.
Kind of helps people discover
the DNA in our church.
And, uh, he loved baptisms.
Groups weren't on his radar.
He was still building the church.
The church was young enough
that he was still building it.
And so I worked really hard
on working those two angles.
to earn the relational credits that
groups would be important for him.
And, uh, you know, it, you know, it
moved from that place where he really
wasn't on, he was on board talking
about it, preaching about fellowship
every once in a while, but still trying
to figure pieces out, uh, that we were
able to take it, uh, a lot further.
Um, but the other thing too, is spend
time with your senior leader, find
out, You know, what was their journey?
How did they, what's their story
about getting into ministry?
What's their story about the church?
Where, where do they
want to take the church?
Where do they want to see the church?
And, uh, so often we don't want to
bother them or do anything like that.
I just encourage you, uh, before you
start pushing the, the small group
ministry, furthering your church,
uh, start to get to know the senior
leader a little bit better personally.
And you'll get a lot
further down the road.
So it's kind of goes
back to Derek's thing.
Uh, the very first question
you're in it for the long haul.
And so don't try to short
circuit it, but try to build it.
It's kind of like, you know, when
you're trying to raise your kids,
you're in it for the long haul, so
you don't have to get everything
right away in the first year or two.
Yeah.
Derek Olson: with your senior leader,
get to know their love languages.
Obviously, most senior pastors
and leaders, are so busy.
They've got so many hats they're wearing.
They've got so much pressure
to grow often, and they want to
see the weekend service growing.
So I think one of the secrets is how
can you show them that small group
ministry, a thriving small group ministry
is complimenting the weekend services.
And so when they start to see
that it does, They get more
excited about small groups.
And the greatest example I can give
is a couple of churches when I cast
the vision to the senior leader
that we needed to have our small
group campaign launch on a weekend.
And we're going to pair it now with the
weekend services for six to eight weeks.
When he saw how that grew the weekend
service, especially at that small group
launch, His eyes got that big and he
was getting really excited about small
groups because it was growing the weekend.
And, um, he got to teach this
series and so it was, he was
still getting to lead this.
So that's one little thing to consider.
Steve Gladen: No, that's good.
Derek Olson: All right.
So that was three.
Uh, let's jump to number four,
how to encourage attendance
after a busy work day.
Steve Gladen: I'm assuming
this is the small group
Derek Olson: small group attendance?
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
I think, I think that's
where this question is going.
I'm going to guess let's, let's
assume that's where it's going
and we'll, we'll go with that.
Um, yeah, I, we, you hear it all the time.
Busyness, business, we're
too busy to be in a group.
We're too busy to do something, but
I really don't think You know, I'd
try to encourage you to change your
paradigm that the issue is not busyness.
A lot of times the issue is relevance
and, um, because if, depending on what
your culture is, but Derek and I are both
college football nuts and as somebody gave
us free tickets to our favorite college
football team, um, Washington Huskies or
the, Ohio State, Buckeyes, uh, then, you
know, we would make time for it 'cause
it's relevant, something we wanna do.
Or if we got, you know, free, free, you
know, weekend away for our, for us and our
wives, uh, we would make that a priority.
And so, uh, a lot of times you
would, the question is what, what
makes groups relevant for people?
And a lot of times it's content.
And I know you can get content anywhere.
But when content is relevant, um, it's
like, and this is where titling helps
people understand what it is, but we
have ones that, that deal with, um,
uh, spiritual warfare and it's, it's
called, um, uh, the hidden, um, the
hidden war, uh, or for young families.
If you have one that is about, uh, how
to raise your kids without raising your
blood pressure, or we have one for teens.
So how do we, uh, G rated kid in
an X rated world or you know how
to find your purpose in life.
Uh, there's a lot of different
curriculums, but when the
content is relevant, then that
can help drive relationships.
People come for the content,
they stay for the community.
And so that would be one thing that would
kind of help them make that a priority.
The other thing too, is it's
how you form your groups.
Um, yeah.
We, we choose to, to use
existing friendship networks.
So we always say, if you have two
friends, you can start a group.
I know somewhere throughout the
episode, uh, if it's not this
one, it'll be the next one.
It's not the next one, the next one,
or how many, how many parts this is.
But, um, we do, uh, We started groups
via existing friendships because
you've obviously made time for them.
They're a priority because
they're your friends.
And so what we try to do is take
existing friendships, who already
have carved out time and help
build purpose into those groups.
Reason why my book is called, you
know, small groups with purpose is
we're trying to take small groupings
of people and their existing friends
and help build God's purposes in them.
Because one of the inerrant fate, one
of the inerrant, um, relevant issues
in people is spiritual formation.
They're trying to follow up being kind.
There was a vacuum in us that is
driving us to, to understand there's
a spiritual void in our lives.
And that's why it's so
important to help them fill that
spiritual void in small groups.
And how are you doing that?
And through spiritual formation, because
that's the thing that will help trigger
them to happiness and purpose and
understanding why they're on this earth.
So, uh, those would be a couple of things.
If that was the correct question
to answer, that's where I'd go.
Derek Olson: Yeah, I think
you made the key point there
is if it's relevant, right?
And who's not going to want to go every
week or every other week, uh, to a small
group with a group of friends in an
inclusive, warm environment, eating great
food, maybe playing some games, and then,
you know, you know, growing together in
their faith and, uh, finding support.
I think everybody's
looking for that, right?
Steve Gladen: Mm hmm.
Derek Olson: the key question
is, are we making it relevant?
And I think like you said, Steve, if we're
doing, uh, if we're, if we're putting
the small groups together, uh, in a wise
way, like this friend strategy, everybody
wants that everybody's looking for that.
And we've got what, uh,
the world can offer.
Right.
So,
Steve Gladen: Yeah, there's a high degree
also of people who may not have a friend
and you can help connect them in a, in a
centralized fashion on, on campus groups
so they can get to know some people.
But the vast majority of your communities
may already know who, who they're with and
so you're just maximizing time that they
already spend, uh, with their friends.
Derek Olson: And I like
what Saddleback used to do.
It was so easy to start a group, but I
know we'll talk more about this later.
It was basically, Hey, grab two or
three friends, grab this curriculum
that we just made for you.
That's, you know, let's say six weeks
long and do it for six weeks together.
So you made it so easy, right?
It was grabbed the curriculum and then
obviously you gave him some little
pointers on how to lead a group,
but, uh, simple stuff like that.
All right.
That was number four.
Hopefully we answered your
question on the number five.
How do you best prioritize time
and energy with ministry friends?
Steve Gladen: Okay, so I'm going
to assume this is the small group
point person trying to balance his
ministry people and staff or in other
ministries of the church with, um,
trying to get his priorities down.
Um, I think one of the things I would
say off the bat is that, uh, friendships,
relationships throughout your church life.
Uh, partnerships inside your church.
Uh, they're never a waste of time.
Uh, they will always return a yield
for you somewhere down the road.
Um, one of the things I've always valued
at Saddleback is that, uh, I always try to
get to know as many of the staff as I can.
And I know a lot of our churches that
are listening to this, you don't have.
a ton of staff, but the point is key
volunteers, key staff, the more you
get to know them, regardless of whether
they're helping in groups ministry
or not, that will always return well.
Now how do you balance that with what
you're trying to do in your day job?
Part of that is, is focus and priorities.
And a lot of times you've got to look
at your work week and you've got to
carve things out blocks of times.
There's many times in my calendar.
that I block.
And because my kids are now out
of the home, I work from home.
Uh, but when my kids were in the
home or, you know, you know, things
were, you know, the kids were younger
than I would go to a coffee shop or
something, but take chunks of time to
block out for your major priorities.
I would also say, take time to
also make sure that you understand
you're at the tip of the spear for
small group ministry at your church.
You have to stay focused.
And so this is where your planning
is going to be super important
because you've got to plan what's
ahead for your small group ministry.
Nobody else is thinking about it, but you.
You can pull people in to help
you think about it, but you've
got to be that tip of the spear.
So, I would value all relationships,
but there comes a time where you've got
to, you got to prioritize and you've
got to focus on things you have to do.
And so block that time in your
calendar so that you can be able
to get away and to map that out.
Um, Derek, do you have
any thoughts on that?
Derek Olson: Oh, just maybe one.
I remember being a youth pastor in
Sacramento way back in the day and
Steve Gladen: You're not that old.
I get to say way back in the day, you
don't.
Derek Olson: I had some
great guys on staff with me.
And I remember one guy who was our,
um, Hispanic groups, uh, Hispanic
pastor for the Hispanic services.
His name was Walter.
Walter, for some reason, if you're
listening, you're still the man.
Walter was an incredible leader,
older than me, had a wealth of
experience, and he was very relational.
Well, I'm kind of more
of a high strung person.
I got a checklist, And I'm
trying to get all this done.
And if I don't, I start feeling pressure.
And back then I didn't
know what I didn't know.
Right.
I just didn't know what we're
saying now, just balance it.
But relationships always come first.
And anyway, I remember him
stopping me saying, man, you
need to put down your to do list.
And, uh, You just need to have
relationship and we need to grow
together because we can help each other.
And, um, I just remember that really
spoke to me, um, that a older, wiser
leader was telling me, Hey, it's cool that
you're, you got all this stuff you got
to do, but let me help you balance this.
And, uh, it's important
to have relationships.
So thank you, Walter.
Steve Gladen: Walter, thank you because
I have to work with him, so it's great.
Uh, but no, it is funny because
Derek and I are wired very similarly,
and it is interesting that, uh,
one of the phrases that was always
told me is relationship over task.
And so often I'm a planner.
I know how to build strategies.
I know how to do things, but you gotta,
it takes people to work with them.
So you can't, you can't
sacrifice one for the other.
So, um, good word from Walter to,
uh, spoke, spoken to my life too.
Not that I know Walter, but the Walter
in my life relationship over task.
Okay.
Derek Olson: kind of a statement.
So let me read this Steve and you just
take this in and get your answer ready.
It says starting healthy I am from
a church plant and want to establish
firm foundations As we look to continue
the process of growing more into the
likeness of christ in community help
Steve Gladen: Okay.
Uh, so church planter person,
um, uh, feel your pain.
So one of the things I would encourage you
to do is you've got to build the weekend.
Uh, if the weekend isn't built,
uh, there's nothing to assimilate.
And that's the beautiful
thing about small groups.
They can work in tandem with you.
Uh, I think it's going to be important
for you to, uh, know how the systems of
your church can work with the strategy.
And the small group structure, uh,
we have a course at the small group
network, uh, dot com, uh, called a line.
It's, um, it's something I wish I would
have watched, uh, 40 years ago, uh,
because it has saved me so much time.
But bottom line is what I would
encourage you to do is understand the
systems of your church, uh, that they
tend to build off three groupings of
people, the weekend, small groups, and
serving God with where you're gifted.
How those groupings of people outside
the weekend message, uh, the groupings
of people that are serving, uh, God
with where they're gifted and the
groupings of people that are trying
to work on discipleship and mobilizing
people to serve, uh, have to, you
have to understand how they work.
Uh, with each other, how the weekends work
with helping people get into groups and
getting into serving, uh, what we call it.
Saddleback now, uh, groups and teams.
We want everyone to
have a group or a team.
When Rick was the senior pastor of
the church at Saddleback, he would say
a relationship and a responsibility.
So just be thinking in your church
planting, how you can always move people
into a group or into a team, uh, that
are serving with where they're gifted.
Uh, another part of that is too, is
while you're building, The weekend
be looking for a volunteer who's
passionate about community, passionate
about groups that you can dub them as
a volunteer, small group point person.
The one thing that we created the
small group network for was to
make sure we gave the tools and the
resources to help a volunteer run
an effective small group ministry.
As your church grows, maybe you
can hire someone to do that.
But you know, one of the things you
always got to do is focus on volunteers
that are passionate about that.
Uh, people in our small group who have
been with us for decades just moved
out of state, uh, and they stumbled
onto a church plant and they just,
uh, on our call with them, we did a
zoom, we do a zoom call with them.
frequently and they were just
saying, Hey, just checking in.
Guess what?
You'll never guess what we're doing.
And they're now the volunteer small
group point people at this church plant.
So, uh, they're, they're, you're
having the time of their life
and they're, they're doing it.
So I'd encourage you with that.
The other thing I would say is during a
church plan, uh, don't overcomplicate it.
Um, so much of what's how a
small group ministry is held
together is through relationship.
Uh, there's many things you can add
to it, which, you know, like I said,
the aligned course can help you with.
Uh, we have other courses
that can help with that too.
But the thing I would just say
is just don't overcomplicate it.
It is about relationships.
And so the more.
You're staying in touch with
those small group leaders.
Uh, it may not be perfect.
You may not have all the
infrastructure set up.
Uh, we can help you with that.
But at the same time too, uh,
it doesn't have to be over
complicated with a bunch of people.
It's just a matter of, you know,
getting someone who's helping be
the point that can help answer
group questions and help move them
in the direction that they need to.
So, um, kind of just to sum it up,
Know your systems of your church
because the systems will be with
the fabric that holds you together.
Derek Olson: I think you said all that
could be said there for number six.
So, uh, I guess the one thing I might
add is if you're at a church plant,
look at the exciting good part is that
you've got a kind of a blank canvas.
And so obviously I work with your senior
leadership, but man you get to do If
you get to start from scratch, you
don't have to build on top of something
somebody else did or maybe put up with
all the tradition and history of like
another church would just go for it and
make discipleship and community fun.
Steve Gladen: Yeah.
It's a good word.
Good, good
Derek Olson: Okay, number seven.
What percentage of regular worshipers
being in small groups is typical?
Steve Gladen: Um, common question.
Uh, first off I'd say, what
are you satisfied with?
Um, because everything is going to
stem off of where you're going with it.
I would say, um, part of the
important thing is to have a big goal.
Vision that you're going after,
but at the same time have a
realistic goal that you're doing.
And so, um, I guess the analogy and
the story I would give with this, when
I first came on at Saddleback, one of
our goals was to get 110 percent of the
people connected into a small group.
Um, thanks to COVID, I have a new
goal, uh, that's working with that.
So, you know, we're trying to
build that all back up, but, um,
that was our big time goal that
we were trying to move towards.
Now at that time when we wrote
that statement, we had about
30 percent of people connected.
And so this is where I want
you to spend most of your time
focusing on year over year.
How do you get more people connected?
So our short term goal is how do
we move from 30 percent to 35?
Um, which was, I was new on
staff at Saddleback at the
time at the beginning of 98.
And, and so there was a, you
know, we're trying to, I was
trying to get my feet under me.
And so, Um, that was a big goal for
us to move from 30 to 35, but we led
with, this is where we want to get to.
We want to get 110 percent of
people connected in a group.
Basically people are reaching
outside the walls of our church,
pulling people into community.
So it's one of those important pieces
to be able to say, you know, If you're
only satisfied with 30 percent or
you say someone tells you 50 percent
is the ideal number and you go,
great, that's all I'm going to do.
I would pray and say, what do you want?
How satisfied do you want to be?
And then pair it up, realistic goals
to get you to where you want to go.
Derek Olson: Well stated.
Well, we made it through the first
seven small group bag questions.
Steve, how you feeling?
How's your, how's your heart rate doing?
Steve Gladen: Good questions.
Uh, good questions with everybody,
but, uh, may need to take a break
and, uh, let our listeners, you know,
uh, digest all that and, uh, look
at the show notes and get some of
the good stuff that we put in there.
Derek Olson: Yeah, we're
probably going to break these up.
So, uh, check the show notes
to see these questions listed.
We might also have a link to the
lobby gathering and, um, we hope you
guys are enjoying these episodes.
Thank you for listening.
Don't forget to subscribe
wherever you listen to podcasts.
And to dive in deeper get more resources
or join the small group network just
head over to small group network.com.