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NET Society is unraveling the latest in digital art, crypto, AI, and tech. Join us for fresh insights and bold perspectives as we tap into wild, thought-provoking conversations. By: Derek Edwards (glitch marfa / collab+currency), Chris Furlong (starholder, LAO + Flamingo DAO), and Aaaron Wright & Priyanka Desai (Tribute Labs)
00;00;16;04 - 00;00;33;06
Chris
So it's just you and me on the show today. You know, we'll make it through. We'll get it done. But I also heard there's another, another missing, missing thing in your life. And you're just dropping. You're dropping entities left and right. What happened with you and Claude?
00;00;33;10 - 00;01;00;08
Pri
Well. I'm going. I'm going through a breakup right now, so I may be a little expensive, but, yeah, I think. I think it's time for. I kind of had, like, a reconciliation moment with myself. And last night, as I was hammering my computer, using the JetBlue Wi-Fi, running out of credits, using cloud, and realized I'm kind of done with this machine.
00;01;00;10 - 00;01;19;22
Pri
Like, I don't I don't like the responses. I feel like it's like goading me into prompting a certain way, or like it'll be like, well, it just feels very, I don't know, paternalistic, the right word. There's that. And then also the credits. I think I just ripped through them. I'm like, okay, you guys are like, because I can't get what I want out of you.
00;01;19;22 - 00;01;41;22
Pri
I have to hammer it. Therefore, using credits and like I find that whole process annoying. The other is like a lot of the information I want it to pull. It's like, I'm sorry. Like, like, are you sure you want to pull that? Like, I don't think that feels right or like whatever. Just like we'll make some reason up as to why it can't pull certain information to me, feels like pretty innocuous.
00;01;41;25 - 00;02;02;26
Pri
Like it's like things for, like, work, like tech stuff or whatever I like. It's just like random data and it refuses to do it for I couldn't even, like, actually fathom the reason. Anyways, I'm kind of renting now, but I lost my. Which is like, I think I might just cancel this like it's pissing me off. Like I don't want to use it anymore.
00;02;02;29 - 00;02;27;15
Pri
I started using, I will say, like I went back to the chat GPT like a a month ago. More like I kind of quit using it completely now. I always have paid for it and now I went back to it. I've been enjoying that experience quite a bit, I would say over the last month and then even like I think Aaron mentioned at work like two weeks through or something like, hey, such a pretty fast and good.
00;02;27;19 - 00;02;48;00
Pri
And so I was like, okay, like, I'll give it a go. And I've been using it and it is actually quite fast and it does give me information that I want. So anyways, that's kind of like I guess you could say, but that's, that's kind of what I'm that was my me and Claude last night where I just was like, I think I'm done if I can't get what I want and I'm burning the tokens.
00;02;48;02 - 00;02;57;19
Chris
What is the soundtrack to breaking up with an AI? What sort of music are you reaching into to to help you deal with this trauma?
00;02;57;20 - 00;03;03;11
Pri
That's a really, really good question.
00;03;03;13 - 00;03;09;23
Chris
We go in emo, we go in screamo, we go in like pink empowerment here. Where's the.
00;03;09;24 - 00;03;14;26
Pri
I was actually I was thinking Paul Simon's 50 Ways to Believe the Lover.
00;03;14;27 - 00;03;23;21
Chris
Oh, there we go. We're going jaded, urbane and very New York 80s, 70s 80s somewhere in there. Yes.
00;03;23;21 - 00;03;30;03
Pri
Yes, I don't know. For some reason I love the lyrics of that song. It's just like so like hokey and so. Yeah, kind of.
00;03;30;04 - 00;03;31;12
Chris
Ryan Simon.
00;03;31;18 - 00;03;34;27
Pri
Yeah. Is that just me, though, or do you feel that way?
00;03;35;03 - 00;03;41;28
Chris
I don't use cloud. I haven't used it in forever. I mean, I barely use Llms, and when I do, I use Gemini.
00;03;42;05 - 00;03;42;28
Pri
Really?
00;03;42;29 - 00;04;10;07
Chris
Yeah. We've been through this before. It's just there and it's fast. And, like, I use an like, five, ten times a week, max, like, I don't. There's nothing in it. It can really tell me that I need to know. It's like produce slop for testing. Tell me a recipe to cook something like, I'm kind of exhausted and I'm not implying, like, I know everything, and I'm just saying, like, the novelty worn off, like I and I code so much with with them all day.
00;04;10;07 - 00;04;12;08
Chris
I don't need to spend the extra time.
00;04;12;13 - 00;04;16;29
Pri
Which ones are you like? You feel like you get good. Yeah. What are you using for?
00;04;17;01 - 00;04;39;08
Chris
Yeah. Right now I got like five models in the mix, which is kind of an all time high. I use sonnet as my auditing agent when I'm, like, working through big batches of tickets. It's just a little cheaper, but it's diligent and like, I like, you know, like downgrading to a lesser model for review tasks. My main coding is like five GPT five for extra high.
00;04;39;08 - 00;04;42;10
Chris
But now I think Brock for six I'm.
00;04;42;12 - 00;04;42;22
Pri
You wouldn't.
00;04;42;22 - 00;05;02;24
Chris
Do it as we speak. I'm running through about two tickets with it and it's it's pretty good. The what I learned is I had to turn fast off and crank it up to extra high, but, you know, it's cheaper and then kind of out on like the tip of the spear. Right. I'm using actually. So I got six models in the mix.
00;05;02;24 - 00;05;28;19
Chris
I'm using Kimmy, K3 or Kimmy three and five six sold. And like they're really sort of like identify this problem. Give me a reading analysis. How would you go about doing it? Or like you're going to be the first layer of drafting the spec. And so like I actually am using more models in my day to day work than I ever have before.
00;05;28;20 - 00;05;56;22
Chris
And it's good, you know, you need to have that sort of diversity. You know, you need you need to know, like the strength and weaknesses of all of them. And, you know, it's kind of a learned experience. You know, it's just you got to get the reps in. But I have a pretty good mix of models. And if Brock for six is actually up for like the kind of complex type of coding work I do like, it's not hard.
00;05;56;22 - 00;06;19;28
Chris
Hard like work, it's just more like, here's a spec and here's a bunch of tickets, and we already designed all this and you just have to follow, you know, what's in the docs, right? It's like it's an adherence problem that I really have that like the fable and the soul class can't stay on course like they're teenagers and that they can start really complicated and hard things, but they can't finish them.
00;06;19;28 - 00;06;23;12
Chris
Right. So anyway, that's that's my little journey at the moment.
00;06;23;13 - 00;06;44;08
Pri
Yeah. I feel like though, what you're describing, I mean, things I don't code, but I don't think that they've created a multi-model like system yet for just I mean, maybe unless you use like Hermes or other harnesses or something, which I don't use, but I think like, like I don't use multiple models just because I'm like kind of only really chatting into one to do the work I need to do.
00;06;44;08 - 00;06;55;29
Pri
So it is impressive that you are like able to to use like six models and it feels like those are on the back end. It just kind of chooses for you. I mean, that's the whole routing idea.
00;06;56;01 - 00;07;04;09
Chris
Well, I, I'm a cursor guy until I just once I know what to do whatever as I select the right model. Yeah I'm the router pre.
00;07;04;12 - 00;07;05;22
Pri
You are the router.
00;07;05;25 - 00;07;11;17
Chris
I am the router. What a what a way to describe yourself in the air of our Lord 2026.
00;07;11;23 - 00;07;15;03
Pri
I know I just route information to machines. That's me.
00;07;15;04 - 00;07;21;03
Chris
I have an opinion I read, I have an opinion I wrote. It's my life. I'm I'm aloof.
00;07;21;03 - 00;07;25;15
Pri
That's the breakup. I mean, I, I think I think it's time to move on.
00;07;25;17 - 00;07;31;28
Chris
So is this woke three. Is woke three like the neurotic AI? Is that what we're in right now?
00;07;32;00 - 00;07;53;11
Pri
I'm still kind of confused as to what one was like when when AOC said that, I was like, was that just like you're talking Covid era like, but then what would be okay to because does not imply like what's happening? How is woke do like I was like, why would you like, I don't know partition that I was confused by that were you were just me.
00;07;53;11 - 00;08;22;28
Chris
I well, I never really I just saw it circulating in the air. I didn't realize what triggered all this book. One I guess would be Obama era. Right. And then it stopped with Trump. And then I'm assuming, well, two then would be Biden era. I mean, that was sort of my read on it. And so I guess to me, one would be like, you know, post me, I guess, like post me to, you know, like I've even MeToo is like a very like need and effective moment in time.
00;08;22;28 - 00;08;38;11
Chris
And then I feel like the criticism of like woke one was when we started getting into like the, the performative aspects and like just taking this into useless places. But you know, I'm not close follower of this discourse. I was just making a joke.
00;08;38;16 - 00;08;39;08
Pri
Oh yeah.
00;08;39;10 - 00;08;41;21
Chris
I'm just a joke about machines.
00;08;41;25 - 00;09;05;29
Pri
No. Fair enough. I like, was just asking about it because I saw the clip of AOC saying that, and it's clear that she's like trying to separate yourself from that movement, even though I feel like she was like, not like the face of it, but definitely a face of that movement. And then that has, like now, raised speculation that she may be trying to go for like a, like she's definitely trying to run for president or at least will probably be a VP.
00;09;06;02 - 00;09;14;15
Chris
But yeah, I'm not sure what AOC is up to, but she definitely is in the middle of a rebrand here. And so.
00;09;14;21 - 00;09;19;25
Pri
She's a she's number one on Poly markets pick for a Democratic presidential nominee.
00;09;19;27 - 00;09;21;01
Chris
Is she now.
00;09;21;03 - 00;09;21;22
Pri
Yeah.
00;09;21;23 - 00;09;34;12
Chris
Well you know I don't believe it's very durable or really too soon to put much stock in. You know what what what the Dems are going to try it out. But next. But we'll see.
00;09;34;15 - 00;09;41;26
Pri
Aaron asked Aiden chat what who might run and it it predicted John so we'll see if that's right.
00;09;41;28 - 00;10;01;15
Chris
Okay. I don't even have opinions yet. I've just from the sake of like wanting something normal and quiet and stable and I mean tentative. Mark Kelly guy I prefer an astronaut. Just, you know, I just don't want, you know, everything in my face all the time coming out of the white House. You know, just get in the background where you belong.
00;10;01;17 - 00;10;05;17
Pri
I know. Oh, Mark Kelly, 3% on Poly Market right now.
00;10;05;23 - 00;10;10;14
Chris
I can I can pick a dog. I can pick a dog for you.
00;10;10;16 - 00;10;13;09
Pri
I don't know, you could be could be redeemed. Maybe you're right.
00;10;13;10 - 00;10;23;23
Chris
No, no, my entire history is like finding people who don't have a prayer, vaguely attaching hopes to them, watching them get burnt in the primary and then not caring. Come to general.
00;10;23;25 - 00;10;26;17
Pri
Yeah. Fair enough. We have a long way, though.
00;10;26;22 - 00;10;29;21
Chris
Much like the rest of the show, we have a long way to get.
00;10;29;23 - 00;10;35;04
Pri
I know, I'm like. I'm like, I'm really struggling right now. I don't know why. I really should have prepped more. I'm sorry.
00;10;35;12 - 00;10;52;10
Chris
I know, I mean, right about now is when we go to the crutch and talk about, like, what's going on with clarity because it looked like it went to cloture, going to get tabled. And the SEC said, well, we're just going to make all the rules. And and now maybe Congress actually wants to Congress.
00;10;52;12 - 00;10;53;27
Pri
Yeah, I guess so.
00;10;53;28 - 00;10;57;13
Chris
They may actually want to pass a law. We just mark.
00;10;57;16 - 00;11;14;03
Pri
We but walk me through that because I have I like kind of just gave up on the clarity discourse. I'm not going to lie. I'm like I just don't at this point. Like is it I've been for probably like two years been like, is it is it not? So now the SEC is going to advance the rules without the Clarity Act.
00;11;14;03 - 00;11;24;12
Pri
And then is Congress. But heard about it and now thinking, hey, no, we should actually pass it. Is that like the conversation or are they are they just going to carry on?
00;11;24;15 - 00;11;56;21
Chris
That's the speculation. SEC had a meeting scheduled for today in which they were going to just get the ball rolling, and they canceled it. And the speculation around the canceling is, maybe Congress actually does want to pass a law instead, instead of letting you know Trump's SEC do whatever they want, right? I mean, it's better to have some voice than no voice, I guess, is the possibility of taking and considering their whole fucking job is supposed to be to pass laws, maybe they should do it.
00;11;56;22 - 00;12;02;05
Pri
Yeah, I agree, but that. Why didn't the SEC threaten to make rules earlier?
00;12;02;08 - 00;12;15;20
Chris
I think they've been signaling all along that like we're prepared to just do this at a, you know, do everything if you're not going to pass the laws because we have the power to. So yeah.
00;12;15;22 - 00;12;24;27
Pri
Fair enough. Well, I just want to go check the crypto markets. And I don't think any of that has affected the prices at all. So that is what it is.
00;12;24;28 - 00;12;29;27
Chris
Well, well, you're checking things live in real time. Where are the stockbrokers at. Pre.
00;12;29;29 - 00;12;34;10
Pri
Let me check. Oh my God. Are you trying to trigger me on the show.
00;12;34;14 - 00;12;35;24
Chris
I'm sure am.
00;12;35;26 - 00;12;58;14
Pri
I mean yeah I guess since we've been talking about stockbrokers as of what was it last show they've really taken off I think like in between last show and this show, Adam Weitzman, like, swept a bunch of them. So we missed out. They are a 11.50.
00;12;58;15 - 00;13;02;16
Chris
This is a great entry pre. It's 20% off. Its all time high.
00;13;02;18 - 00;13;10;06
Pri
Yeah it's just casually $20,000 for a stockbroker. I'm good. You're good. Yeah I think I'm good.
00;13;10;08 - 00;13;17;01
Chris
I mean look if you're not buying now you're going to have to buy at like five, 18 months from now.
00;13;17;03 - 00;13;24;03
Pri
Yeah. That's true. I'll get it when it's low and get my like tokenized Nvidia stock.
00;13;24;04 - 00;13;33;14
Chris
After all, the utility has been wrung from them and whatever money people could make on them. You'll then enter just for the pixels.
00;13;33;18 - 00;13;37;24
Pri
Agreed. I'm in it for the art, dude. And what about it?
00;13;37;25 - 00;13;40;01
Chris
What an art it is.
00;13;40;04 - 00;13;52;05
Pri
What a beauty is. Yeah, I love it. Yeah, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I missed out I'm fine with that. I haven't like decided to bother with Base Chain yet though. I'm just kind of like.
00;13;52;07 - 00;13;56;02
Chris
Robin Hood. Jane. The time that tried to change was.
00;13;56;04 - 00;13;57;27
Pri
Well, it's really early here in.
00;13;58;04 - 00;13;59;26
Chris
Trying to trigger. Trigger me now.
00;13;59;27 - 00;14;27;01
Pri
Yeah, I should, I should have, I should have not said that. No, this is sort of a tangent but kind of reminds me, just because we're talking about crypto is I read a stat earlier this week that said, more than a quarter of Gen Z investors, about 26% of those born between 1997 and 2007, say they view sports betting as a strategic part of their long term financial plan, according to a survey by 1000 US retail investors from betterment.
00;14;27;02 - 00;14;31;01
Pri
I. Thoughts? Responses to that.
00;14;31;02 - 00;14;40;17
Chris
Well hey it's it's battery crazy. B it's sort of the appropriate demographic to say those sort of things like.
00;14;40;18 - 00;14;42;15
Pri
The community.
00;14;42;17 - 00;15;01;22
Chris
Well that and like that they're looking at Gen Z like I used to like to bet I used to like go to Vegas and gamble and stuff like that. And at a certain point in your life, not everyone but me, for sure. I just, you know, a I was really bad at sports betting and, you know, it's not like I bet a lot or bet all that often, right?
00;15;01;23 - 00;15;27;17
Chris
But like I did fantasy, I was in weekly picking pools and then, you know, come playoff time, you know, would I throw like 4 or 500 bucks on a playoff weekend short. And then I just lost and I lost and I lost and I was like, dude, you suck at this. And it's not giving you any enjoyment and just knock it off right then, you know, with like gambling and casinos, I just Vegas turned into a trade show town.
00;15;27;17 - 00;15;29;01
Chris
It was a workplace for me.
00;15;29;02 - 00;15;29;12
Pri
Yeah.
00;15;29;13 - 00;15;43;27
Chris
And, you know, like, it just I didn't have the time to do it. And I, when I tried to return to it, like the, the vibe change the, you know, I think casinos became more corporate, less fun.
00;15;44;03 - 00;15;49;00
Pri
Like do you think also growing up to it's just like you maturing being like yeah, yeah.
00;15;49;01 - 00;16;10;24
Chris
I mean, look, one of the problems with me free is I understand how everything works. And once I know how something works and once I understand it inside out, like the, you know, then I'm like, oh, I'm a mark, right? And yeah, like with Vegas, I didn't like I would just walk in with like a grand two grand and say, this is what I'm spending for the night and I'm here for a good time and I don't care.
00;16;10;28 - 00;16;34;09
Chris
You know, at the end of the day, what I walk out with. And so like, you know, thank God, like, I have just as much fun betting five bucks a hand as I do, like 50 bucks a hand, like the amount on the table has absolutely no no impact on me. And so I was always just there for like to be at a good table to, you know, get that like table talk, the vibe, the swings.
00;16;34;13 - 00;16;50;02
Chris
My life changed. I had kids, but I also moved back east. Right. You know, a lot of my Vegas was when I was living out in LA and like, you go out with a big gang on weekends, you know, like every 3 or 4 months and be a whole thing and like, so, just so many different things changed.
00;16;50;04 - 00;16;59;28
Chris
And then like the look, the vibe is a lot different. Or, you know, when you go to the Connecticut casinos, you know, Foxwoods, Mohegan. Aren't Vegas.
00;17;00;02 - 00;17;01;13
Pri
Actually never been to those.
00;17;01;14 - 00;17;05;28
Chris
They're filled with New Englanders. They're nasty as hell, like nasty in terms of attitude.
00;17;06;00 - 00;17;07;04
Pri
Like they're.
00;17;07;07 - 00;17;11;28
Chris
Nice enough places, but like, you've got some very embittered people I remember.
00;17;11;29 - 00;17;31;10
Pri
It makes me happy just to pause there. Like just on that note. And I want to hear what you said you have to say. But like I on the Atlantic City piece, just like the northeast and casinos, there is no reason for the city not to be more of a thing like it's on the water. It's, you know, close to Philly, New York, Baltimore, DC.
00;17;31;11 - 00;17;46;13
Pri
Like, I don't understand why. It's just like a decrepit casino town. Like, I feel like it could actually be really cool, but, like, maybe it's just like the it just doesn't attract, like, the crowd or. I don't know, but I've never understood why that never took off to the same level.
00;17;46;14 - 00;18;01;00
Chris
I've never been to AC either. And I think part of it was like, you know, it was just always like so dumpy. And then you'd ask people you're like, oh, well, you know, you ever been down to AC? And they just be like, don't go. You're like, oh, okay.
00;18;01;02 - 00;18;03;20
Pri
Yeah. So I've never been I'm just like, yeah.
00;18;03;20 - 00;18;23;18
Chris
And like the Connecticut casinos, you know like I'm back and forth between Boston the decent amount and like so like sometimes I just swing in and spend a night there, you know, coming and going. I remember I saw Motley Crue once. It was fucking awesome. But yeah, like one random ass summer, you know, I had to go drop my kids off in Boston, and, you know, I was just like, I screw it.
00;18;23;18 - 00;18;41;19
Chris
I'm going to, you know, spend a night. I'm going to see what's at the see what's at the casinos. Maybe I'll stop and spend the night. Motley Crue and like an anime cosplay convention was at Foxwoods one night or Mahi and one night. I can't remember which one it was. And I was like, hell yeah, that's.
00;18;41;20 - 00;18;43;14
Pri
And that's like a sick running.
00;18;43;15 - 00;19;04;11
Chris
I know. Well, I missed all the cosplay cuties, but I did catch the crew and I didn't realize it like when I before going into that show, but walking out, I was like, well, it looks like seeing Tommy Lee do a upside down drum solo over the crowd was, in fact on my bucket list, and now I can check it off.
00;19;04;13 - 00;19;07;18
Chris
It was like they killed. It was fucking fantastic.
00;19;07;20 - 00;19;08;13
Pri
Oh, that's cool.
00;19;08;13 - 00;19;21;09
Chris
But so yes, back to back to Gen Z. And you know, I, I don't know, like the polls are very polls of just weird things. Like did you see the poll that came out the other day?
00;19;21;11 - 00;19;23;03
Pri
No. What was it?
00;19;23;05 - 00;19;26;27
Chris
They just did like his favorite balls, and they did across the board of demographics.
00;19;26;27 - 00;19;31;08
Pri
And I saw the one with the map of New York, New York City.
00;19;31;12 - 00;19;59;06
Chris
Yeah, it might have been the same one. This one was like looking at, like, his favorite building in the city on Long Island, in the up in Westchester. But then it was looking at, you know, like men, women, Democrats, Republicans. But it was also like looking at it by religion, in which it was, I believe the four religious buckets were Jewish, Protestant, Protestant, Catholic and other.
00;19;59;12 - 00;20;16;28
Chris
Okay. It's like, oh, other for New York City, really. You're just going to throw like, I don't know, a quarter of our population in this other like, why don't you just label that brown? I mean, like, and so you could just kind of tell in the way the poll was structured. Right? You're like, well, this is this is just brain rot.
00;20;16;28 - 00;20;28;00
Chris
And so who knows what the hell, you know, betterment, how they're polling, how they're like arranging these questions. You know, like you, you can certainly set these things to tell certain stories.
00;20;28;01 - 00;20;53;04
Pri
That's fair. That that is totally fair. I and it's like a thousand respondents, so who knows. But I guess like what I mean I do think sports gambling, like if you go to anyone 27 and under it, that's a male, I would not be surprised if like over 50% participate like on a semi-regular basis. Like, I don't know, maybe that's a little bit too high.
00;20;53;09 - 00;21;22;23
Pri
But like I do feel it's pretty ubiquitous in that generation, which and then put that in concert with like thrive doubling down on sports and sports, becoming more of an asset class. And we're seeing sports teams get bought. You left and right every other day. And also this like counter AI proposition, like even the like one of the leads of alternative assets at JP Morgan was like at a conference talking about how sports is like AI proof.
00;21;22;23 - 00;21;45;22
Pri
And I've been seeing that narrative quite a bit. That's all to say. I wouldn't be surprised if maybe not sports gambling, but sports, maybe sports gambling like become. It could become like a a risk on bucket of someone's portfolio like I don't I actually don't think that's an unfeasible like just generally it doesn't need to be like sports betting.
00;21;45;22 - 00;22;07;06
Pri
But just like gen gambling, which could include, you know, meme tokens, it could include prediction markets. It's a little bit more. It probably takes a little bit more time and effort to actually, like, participate in those markets than just like buying the S&P or like some fun, but like, you could probably have like a sports betting fund that like does that for you and you allocate like 4 or 5% if you wanted.
00;22;07;07 - 00;22;33;11
Pri
I mean Bitcoin similarly like wasn't something that many traditional people wanted to allocate some of their portfolio to. And now people generally say like oh, put in 3 to 5% of your worth in that. So this is a really long winded way of saying it's possible to me that sports gambling or some derivative of that could become something that is a legitimate asset class.
00;22;33;12 - 00;22;34;16
Chris
That it can't.
00;22;34;18 - 00;22;39;14
Pri
Invest in, like a sports gambling fund or like an ETF.
00;22;39;22 - 00;23;06;06
Chris
Unless they fundamentally change the underlying like structure of how sports betting works, what the rake is, you know, like what if bonds were like, what if bonds actually had a negative return, right. Like when you bought a bond, it occasionally asked you for $25 at the end of owning the bond, like you just ended up with less money than you put in right then.
00;23;06;07 - 00;23;31;06
Chris
You couldn't call bonds an asset class, and that's the equivalent with sports betting. You know, like there are house edges in this. Therefore it's an entertainment product and it's not an asset class. Like anything that like structurally ensures you can't walk away with, you know, if you play a million, if you place a million bets like the house edge, like is going to eat away.
00;23;31;09 - 00;23;42;11
Chris
And so sure, if you think you can outperform books, but like, it's just very dangerous to call sports gambling and asset classes because of like the underlying.
00;23;42;13 - 00;24;00;09
Pri
Yeah, no, I agree I mean it's a very I don't I definitely don't wanna be like it's an asset class. But I mean I also think like art over the past several decades has become like there's like legitimate value there. And that's become an asset class. Like that is an alternative class. People take loans against that. Whatever. Yeah, I guess I guess you're right.
00;24;00;09 - 00;24;21;11
Pri
Maybe it doesn't make sense, but it just makes me. I was just thinking about like that. If it's so normalized, you know, maybe some percent of that population, while some that population, that demographic of like Gen Z, young Gen Z may be comfortable allocating like 30% of their wealth. And just like these endeavors, I don't know, just something to think of.
00;24;21;11 - 00;24;30;22
Chris
It right. It is something to think about. And these are the sort of conversations we have to have now that, like Zen Nation enters into maturity and becomes.
00;24;30;27 - 00;24;32;07
Pri
Like.
00;24;32;09 - 00;24;55;01
Chris
A cultural force. I mean, the other thing floating around that's adjacent to this is the perennial New York complaint. Or like the new perennial in New York complaining about, like the Big Ten of, you know, the West Village, certain parts of the city, you know, but that like, is spreading more broadly around like what what kids expectations for college experiences are.
00;24;55;01 - 00;25;02;12
Chris
And, you know, it's sort of like everything is Ohio now. Everything is Big Ten, everything is sec like, and.
00;25;02;15 - 00;25;05;27
Pri
Everything is a playground for content creation.
00;25;05;29 - 00;25;07;04
Chris
Yeah, I mean, I.
00;25;07;04 - 00;25;09;12
Pri
Don't know. York is like an ultimate background.
00;25;09;13 - 00;25;20;18
Chris
Do the kids still just do nothing but make content, or are they are they past that now and they're just LARPing in in markets with alternative asset classes like.
00;25;20;20 - 00;25;21;27
Pri
I don't know, I think.
00;25;21;27 - 00;25;42;00
Chris
There's a lot in sports betting like what's I'm old I'm uncle washed like I do remember you know, like I used to keep a studio down in Greenpoint and this was like right on the tipping point, you know, like 2011 and 2012. And, you know, in the summertime, it was just like, oh, look, there's another photo shoot happening outside my office.
00;25;42;02 - 00;26;00;24
Chris
And, you know, like, that felt jarring and intrusive. And it just it felt alien. And, you know, I don't even notice that stuff anymore. But do I not notice it because it's become so commonplace? Is it happening less so, or is it just because, you know, I live in my own little bubble now, all of.
00;26;00;24 - 00;26;22;23
Pri
You, I think it could be all of the above. I mean, I agree, like I'm probably like status to like, it's not like I'm, you know, in a spring chicken over here, but I, you know, this is anecdotes, but like, I'll be walking around basically anywhere downtown New York and they are like like it's not like the growth of influencers has gone down at all.
00;26;22;24 - 00;26;47;04
Pri
Like you go to. So you go to the West Village, like people are just constantly taking pictures. I think I saw someone tweet this, but like they were at that Hotel Chelsea and there was like two girls at the bar super dressed up, and they offered one martini between the two of them and then like just basically took pictures with the martini, went back and forth taking pictures of the martini and left like that.
00;26;47;05 - 00;27;04;09
Pri
Like so you do even see that kind of extractive value where it's like, yeah, I'm like totally having fun with my friend at this Hotel Chelsea in reality. Or just like passing a martini back and forth because you don't want to spend another like 20 bucks or 25 bucks to get a martini. I think that there's still a ton of that.
00;27;04;12 - 00;27;12;04
Pri
I don't know where I'm going with that. Oh, did you see ASU actually created a major for like content creation and influencing?
00;27;12;04 - 00;27;22;24
Chris
I did I did it's it's probably now like the ASU has three things that are just so like perfectly on brand and based for ASU right.
00;27;22;25 - 00;27;23;16
Pri
Like I.
00;27;23;16 - 00;27;37;02
Chris
Know I mean they've got a whole fleet of them. But like there's three like I always get a kick out of and I saw that and I was like great. ASU ASU right. The other one like Will I am right as a professor of oh yeah yeah.
00;27;37;02 - 00;27;38;06
Pri
Yeah yeah.
00;27;38;07 - 00;27;58;20
Chris
All right. That's one on the show. And yeah, I'm a college hockey dork. Arizona State actually has a college hockey team. They're not like fantastic. But like, do they hit the rankings a couple times a year? They respectable. Like is it cool. Yeah. Like you know good. Good for you guys. It's 110 degrees like 80% of the year over there.
00;27;58;21 - 00;28;02;14
Chris
And you're out there running amateur hockey. Congratulations.
00;28;02;14 - 00;28;09;10
Pri
It's kind of like the Tampa Bay lightning. Or I'm like, how are you guys so good at hockey? It's like a hundred degrees out here.
00;28;09;12 - 00;28;30;08
Chris
It's all about where players want to play the the Sun Belt. I look this up and like I don't don't quote me on the exact numbers. Right. Canada. It's been like 35 years since Canada last won a Stanley Cup. Like I want to say it was Montreal in the mid 90s.
00;28;30;10 - 00;28;31;16
Pri
So sad.
00;28;31;18 - 00;28;54;06
Chris
Yeah, and since then the Sun Belt I believe is one like 12 family cups. And so, you know, like when you put all the teams together down there and it's simple like all the players the right like they, they want to play in really nice weather. Right. They want to be able to go to the beach. They want a golf, you know, like they want to do, like all that sort of stuff.
00;28;54;13 - 00;29;17;15
Chris
There's a lot of tax advantages. But then another big thing is like they can just live, right. Like it's a bit like messy down in, in Miami, right. Where like you can just take his kids to, you know, shopping and not really worry about it. Like a lot of these guys grew up in these bubbles where, like, hockey is everything and like they're held to really hard and high standards, you know, especially like in Canada.
00;29;17;15 - 00;29;31;02
Chris
And they just get away from all of that where they're like, you know, the fourth franchise in a place. And so they're still competing at the highest level. They actually have a better chance of winning the Stanley Cup down there. And the lifestyle is great.
00;29;31;08 - 00;29;45;16
Pri
Yeah, I mean it's a good point. I mean, yeah, it is kind of like a study and like if you like, it's like a if you're actually like a in an environment where it's nice, it's probably easier to perform as an athlete and you know, you're not getting harassed and stuff.
00;29;45;17 - 00;30;05;13
Chris
Yeah. And then like these places actually do develop talent like out in LA right. All the a lot of the Kings players from back in the day like live down in Manhattan Beach. They have kids, they get their kids in the hockey. Like there's like good quality prospects that come out of California now, you know, like a lot more than you would think.
00;30;05;14 - 00;30;29;15
Chris
And so, yeah, it's a bit of a, you know, a head scratcher or a mindfuck, but it's also that same sort of, you know, like talent and capital is somewhat frictionless when it comes to geography. And they're going to seek out, you know, places that work for them and they will do their craft, like where you know, where it pleases them, whether it makes inherent sense or not.
00;30;29;17 - 00;30;31;13
Pri
Yeah, I agree, I totally agree.
00;30;31;15 - 00;30;45;22
Chris
Now, the flip side of that sort of argument is like Miami is not still not yet a real center of power is y'all Street and Dallas going to compete with Wall Street. I you know I'm we're a little TBD on the on that sort of thing. You know.
00;30;45;23 - 00;30;50;02
Pri
By the way what can we just side tangent on that like branding I'm.
00;30;50;03 - 00;30;51;03
Chris
Y'all street.
00;30;51;05 - 00;30;59;09
Pri
Yeah I didn't realize that was a thing until I read something about it. Like, I don't know, like a couple months ago. Like, is that has it always been a thing? Have we been.
00;30;59;09 - 00;31;06;15
Chris
No, no, I think that's kind of like your, your micro neighborhood thing. You know, it's a recent phenomenon.
00;31;06;20 - 00;31;08;20
Pri
Yeah. I feel like I heard about that recently.
00;31;08;21 - 00;31;30;12
Chris
And like in my head. Right. I'm thinking, well, the last time Texas got a chance of trading anything, you know, they did Enron. And so I'm not I'm not especially bullish on yes capital market in Texas. But you know it's a free country and good for them. Let them let them all away.
00;31;30;14 - 00;31;37;02
Pri
Y'all Street so funny. Why are we, like so boring all of a sudden? Is it just because it's August?
00;31;37;03 - 00;31;43;28
Chris
Oh it's August I mean, you know, for me, it's. I don't do anything. I work all the time. And when I'm not working, you know, I'm.
00;31;44;03 - 00;31;47;07
Pri
Yeah, but you read a lot. I feel like we all read a lot. I just haven't.
00;31;47;08 - 00;32;01;22
Chris
Read a lot. I just finished wise Guy book club. Book club knows its customer and knows. Come on, guys, you got to give a crowd pleaser out. And so wise guys, a book that Goodfellas is based on and it's literally like they're one in the same thing.
00;32;01;29 - 00;32;02;11
Pri
Really.
00;32;02;15 - 00;32;34;29
Chris
Reading the book, I read the whole book in really odious, you know, I mean, like, you're reading the book and it's matching up to like, the narration from the movie as you remember it. It's but it's excellent. It is so damn good. And you know the thing the funny thing is, right, when you read a book like that, right, that's taking place in the 60s and 70s, early 80s, and you look at the way that, like, someone acts with impunity, knowing like statistically they're going to get caught, right?
00;32;35;00 - 00;32;59;07
Chris
Like you do enough crime, you're going to get pinched. And that it doesn't matter that like the sentences for a lot of these crimes like didn't exist at the time, like the amount of credit, I didn't realize how much credit card fraud, you know, like the mob was involved in in the 60s and the 70s. You know, it's just kind of an underreported thing because it's it's not all that interesting, but.
00;32;59;09 - 00;33;17;26
Chris
Right, like the I mean, the way all of this worked is they had people on the inside because they all grew up together. Those people just passed, you know, card numbers over. And there was no there was no real like repercussions, like, you know, if you got caught, you know, some of these things, like New York didn't have hijacking laws on the books.
00;33;17;26 - 00;33;29;23
Chris
And so they have to like, charge them with all, all this other stuff. And like, you know, half of the book is just about how they treated like JFK cargo is their own personal like Amazon Logistics Center and robbed it blind.
00;33;29;26 - 00;33;35;09
Pri
Damn. Okay. That might be it might be one to add for is that is that was that your casual beach read this summer?
00;33;35;11 - 00;33;48;09
Chris
I mean it was book club, a book club. You know, I've always picked softballs, you know, like, oh, it's August, none of us really serious this month. I read it, you know, in like five, five, six days. It's really read.
00;33;48;11 - 00;34;01;04
Pri
I actually might do that one funny thing on that because I've been trying I'm like my my attention span has gotten like terrible. I got the Diamond Age by Neil Stephenson and have started that.
00;34;01;05 - 00;34;02;15
Chris
Which one is that?
00;34;02;16 - 00;34;28;20
Pri
That's the one about like basically like nanotech. And it's about this like character. It's it's it's like they kind of have like a quasi network state situation in there. Like I actually didn't want to read too much of the plot, but it like, I mean, where I am now, I'm only like 15 pages in is like it takes place in Shanghai and it's it's about the premise is about like nanotech.
00;34;28;27 - 00;34;29;09
Chris
Okay.
00;34;29;10 - 00;34;55;04
Pri
Got it. But I have to get to like the core plot. But then they also have like these like network state style, like economic zones. So I feel like it's pretty future leaning. So I was like, oh, I'll give it a go. But the writing style actually kind of reminded a little bit. I was like, this is something it kind of reminded me of your book, actually, for some reason, I wasn't sure if you took a lot of inspiration from him because I read Snow Crush.
00;34;55;04 - 00;35;04;27
Pri
It's a long time ago that I kind of forgot about it, but like, yeah, it kind of reminded me of the writing. Reminded me of you. Actually, I meant that.
00;35;04;29 - 00;35;29;13
Chris
Okay, well, a it's impossible not to write like. And we're talking about the last book I wrote, Hyper Real Hospitality. So anytime you're doing anything in like virtual environments, right. Stephenson and Gibson are like the, there's a foundation there, the root core of that entire John. And so everyone who comes after them just operates in their shadows.
00;35;29;13 - 00;35;52;13
Chris
And so, you know, it's impossible not to, especially if you do want to sort of like honor the tradition if you want to, like, you know, when you're getting into speculative topics so deeply as well as like trying to translate, you know, frontier technology and make it in everyday lives, like there's only certain ways you can go about doing it.
00;35;52;13 - 00;36;11;08
Chris
And so whoever like, established that, right. Like they're your guidepost and like they filled that scaffold in and it's your job to just paint and express it in your own ways. Now, I like when it comes to reading. I have a terrible memory. Like I don't really retain much of like, books.
00;36;11;08 - 00;36;13;11
Pri
I don't either for some reason.
00;36;13;15 - 00;36;26;19
Chris
Yeah, like I'll know a book for a couple of weeks, but I actually can't remember, like all the characters in the books I've written myself. Like, you know, every once in a while, like some will come up to me and talk to me about a character in a book, and I got to, like, even remember who they were.
00;36;26;22 - 00;36;51;26
Chris
I, you know, it's just something about the way I think and I work and so like, yeah, like Stevenson and Gibson kind of blend together for me in my memory, I think Stevenson is going to be a little more prescient. And now I think, you know, like over the next 5 or 10 years, it'll be viewed as like a little more prophetic.
00;36;51;26 - 00;37;18;18
Chris
And I think of the current meta Gibson I feel like, you know, he really leaned into like post 911 techno paranoia and kind of took, you know, like his whole later arc was, was very conspiratorially like it was almost like a little Don DeLillo underworld ish, you know, that, that type of thing.
00;37;18;21 - 00;37;23;19
Pri
Read any of this stuff? I actually probably should. I feel like I would love, based on what you're saying. I'm like, yeah, I'm into it.
00;37;23;27 - 00;37;45;00
Chris
Delilah is fantastic. He's one of the like, if you're a fan of postmodernism, he's one of the masters of it. And White Noise is a gateway novel right there. Like, you know, if you're trying to say if you're trying to like, say, do I want to be the Lilo guy or not? Like White Noise is the one for you to try out.
00;37;45;01 - 00;38;13;15
Chris
Underworld says great American novel. But underworld's like a big ass. Like, I want to say it's like 700 book, 700 pages. It's sort of his to to go back to our man Rhymin Simon. Right? Like, it's is like I am a child of New York and here is here, you know. Yeah. Like, as a mature person coming to terms with New York like, this is my contribution to it.
00;38;13;18 - 00;38;16;28
Chris
That's cool type of thing. But like, white Noise is fantastic.
00;38;17;04 - 00;38;58;19
Pri
Okay, cool. I'm writing this down. The other book I ordered actually, and I haven't started it, but I read about it or it was mentioned in a newsletter and it it's called 1873. I'll let you know once I get I'm going to try to finish this Neal Stephenson book and then turn to this. But it actually looks kind of amazing, especially, you know, it's drawing parallels to what happened in the 1850s and 60s during like the I guess you could call it globalization, one where like the world had its initial run and then you had all these expansions and like, you had like modern financial products and stuff.
00;38;58;19 - 00;39;14;14
Pri
And then, you know, the 1870s bubble burst and then how that ties into the Ottomans and stuff. It kind of the reason that I thought it was interesting is because in the newsletter, I think it was like statutory or whatever. How do you actually say that newsletter?
00;39;14;15 - 00;39;17;28
Chris
I don't know, you're the newsletter queen, whatever.
00;39;17;28 - 00;39;43;22
Pri
But he was noting that in 1870, like a lot of the debt that couldn't be paid off from the railroads was part of the reason that, World War One actually kicked off a bit. And so he, he was, you know, and what how that, that multi year, you know, depression kind of led to this breakup of all these empires at the time.
00;39;43;22 - 00;40;16;25
Pri
And so he was tying that together and he was actually like he even put in in this newsletter. He put trying to remember, but he quantified how much was actually invested in the railroad system in you like in modern US dollars. And I think it was like, hold on. I'm like, want to find the number? It was like equivalent to how much we're spending on AI is how much at the time people were putting into the modern infrastructure at the like the railroads.
00;40;16;25 - 00;40;39;19
Pri
I actually didn't realize it was that much like I've seen charts that show were spending so much more than we have any other technology. But like according to him, it was like almost equivalent, unlikely shit, 500 million that went to US railway bonds. So these are railway bonds annually during the boom years of the early 1870s would be equivalent to 600 billion, roughly what is projected to be invested by major tech companies in 2026.
00;40;39;20 - 00;41;05;12
Pri
So these are in like the the bonds specifically. But like apparently said, Adela, read this book and on like the recent earnings call was just like kind of talking about the fact that Microsoft had substantial free cash flow, all that, because I think people are a little bit worried about like all of the caps, CapEx investing. And, you know, if that bubble will burst at a certain point.
00;41;05;12 - 00;41;14;07
Pri
But anyways, I'm looking forward to reading this book to see if there's any, any parallels, because apparently Satya found some after this.
00;41;14;08 - 00;41;23;00
Chris
Yeah. Let me know. I'm curious. Do you know what? You ready for an 1873 pop culture question?
00;41;23;05 - 00;41;24;09
Pri
Is there one?
00;41;24;11 - 00;41;41;27
Chris
Well, I'm going to ask you one if pop culture is not quite the right one, but do you know who actually was the catalyst for the 1873 railway speculation collapse and first extended economic downturn? We had as an industrialized nation?
00;41;41;29 - 00;41;43;06
Pri
Is it Jay Cook?
00;41;43;09 - 00;41;48;28
Chris
It is not. It is. You ready for an answer? You want to keep guessing?
00;41;49;01 - 00;41;50;19
Pri
No, I'm ready for an answer.
00;41;50;21 - 00;41;55;09
Chris
It's Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse, really. And the Lakota like.
00;41;55;11 - 00;41;58;20
Pri
In like Montana or wherever that was Minnesota.
00;41;58;22 - 00;42;21;03
Chris
Yeah. So at that point in time. Right. So most of the the Lakota cut a deal and moved on as a reservation. And Sitting Bull just couldn't live like that. And he took a breakaway band out to find, you know, find more bison, find a way of life. And it slowly grew over time and Crazy Horse shows up and he's like, you're right, man, I can't do this.
00;42;21;04 - 00;42;46;17
Chris
You know, I'm partnering up with you. And so they settled down in Wyoming for a stretch. It's it's getting a little crowded and hectic. It ain't working for them. They head up into Montana, and when they're in Montana, the railroads of the Great Northwest Railroad surveyors start showing up to lay a second transcontinental railroad. And they're like, we're not having any of this shit.
00;42;46;19 - 00;43;07;08
Chris
And they start attacking them and they run them off. And basically the Great Northwest Railroad project has to like, go on hold. They're like, forget it's too dangerous out there. And that the suspension of, like the planned build out of the Great Northwest is what triggered that whole economic cycle.
00;43;07;11 - 00;43;25;08
Pri
Really? Wow. I actually didn't know that. I was like, kind of in this, like, North Pacific Highway rabbit hole, but maybe that. That's interesting. I feel like when I learned about that battle, no one, no one mentioned that.
00;43;25;09 - 00;43;30;11
Chris
Yeah. Well, I mean, when we're learning about it, right? It's. If you're there.
00;43;30;14 - 00;43;33;26
Pri
Yeah. Custer was kind of a nightmare.
00;43;33;28 - 00;43;52;25
Chris
Well, he he dramatically overestimated, you know, what his regiment could take on and, you know, but 600 men into a village of 7000 that had, I think, like 2 or 3 x the number of warriors that he brought to the fight and he lost.
00;43;52;26 - 00;44;34;09
Pri
It's crazy how so much. I mean, as I've gotten older, it's hard to know, but it does really, truly feel that every major, you know, political, historical event that we often like reflect on. I mean, there's not like random reasons for why this stuff exists and primarily those random reasons, if are any. I mean, sure, there's like cultural vibe shits and shifts and all of that, but it does feel like primarily, I mean, this is not a profound statement, but it feels like primarily driven by like the current state of economic, like economics and finance, like, I think like having a really good understanding of history in the world and like, economic swings can I
00;44;34;09 - 00;44;54;02
Pri
mean, this is whole radio's whole thing too. But just like the older I get, the more I realize that so much of these conflicts that we've read about or like these things that happen, World War One, World War two, and like the fall of Empires is like, like more or less driven by economics and like a lack of prosperity.
00;44;54;02 - 00;44;59;11
Pri
But again, I guess it's not that's not like new. It's just I don't think most people like, think of it that way.
00;44;59;12 - 00;45;27;21
Chris
Really. Like. Right. There's like a lot of great man theory or there's, there's where the good guys and they're the bad guys. And at the end of the day, like war is an incredibly costly endeavor both economically and in terms of lives and just, you know, and so, like, you shouldn't casually go to war and, you know, most rational societies really like, you know, one.
00;45;27;24 - 00;45;30;09
Pri
Out of desperation, like it's more often.
00;45;30;10 - 00;45;48;12
Chris
Yeah. It's like, God damn it, I got to pull everyone out of the field. I gotta pull everyone out of the shops, like, you know, like it's it's one of those sort of things where you're just like, well, fuck. And so yes, it was generally good reasons and especially like, you know, all the way, way back. Right.
00;45;48;14 - 00;46;18;21
Chris
Like Rome, you know, a lot of that expansion was just like, we go and we take their stuff and then we're richer. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, that's a lot of like, early war. And now, you know, now that we're trying to pass that. Yeah. Now like a lot of our war is really about like the policing of certain economic action or, you know, like and that's sort of interesting because like, you go to Japan and China, you know, like 17 century, right?
00;46;18;22 - 00;46;27;17
Chris
A lot of that like conflict from like a colonial or like from the Western perspective was like, why the hell aren't you opening these markets to us?
00;46;27;19 - 00;46;38;10
Pri
Yeah. I mean, like the like I always find like the Portuguese influence of Japan to be so random and weird. Have you like, like they were like the only, like, western country that was somehow able to, like, break through there.
00;46;38;18 - 00;46;50;15
Chris
The Portuguese got everywhere. I actually just rewatched Shogun, so I'm just like, vaguely fluent in this. I thought Shogun would be a good background show. Well, vibe coding.
00;46;50;17 - 00;46;54;08
Pri
Oh, I actually loved that show. I would rewatch that. That's a good one.
00;46;54;10 - 00;47;01;07
Chris
It was so much better on second rewatch. It was a terrible choice for my productivity because I couldn't just background watch it.
00;47;01;07 - 00;47;03;02
Pri
Because you were actually watching it. Yeah.
00;47;03;03 - 00;47;27;03
Chris
Yes. Like I think once you knew the whole story and like, you knew, you know, like when you first saw it, like, the engine is like a tough character, you know, you're like, what the hell is with the stupid accent? Like, you know, like you don't really like it takes 2 or 3 episodes, right? To to really sort of like get get comfortable with the engine and, you know, on the second watch.
00;47;27;04 - 00;47;43;24
Chris
No. You know, the whole thing from the get go and like, you can enjoy like all the different performances, the characters are fantastic. There's a little something for everyone. Like, yeah, the, you know, the the Lord is playing both sides like you.
00;47;43;25 - 00;47;44;04
Pri
Yeah.
00;47;44;06 - 00;48;05;07
Chris
You really get into like, how good is like, like faded comic relief is, you know, like he is funny as hell in like a how the hell am I get stuck in this position? And why does every single move I make just further entangle me and like, I'm going to, like, you know, the whole show, he's basically like, Jesus Christ, I'm going to die.
00;48;05;08 - 00;48;27;12
Chris
What do I got to do to live tomorrow? And then he does that, and then tomorrow he's like, well, hell, this just set me up to die. Like, what the hell is going, you know, like the poor guy and yes, the whole thing. The other like, wild thing about about it, right, is once it's all over, you realize the main character, the engine, like he actually has very little to do.
00;48;27;14 - 00;48;41;15
Chris
Like with, with the plot. It's the Indiana Jones rated as the arc problem, right? Like like Raiders of the Lost Ark, right? Like everything Harrison Ford does in that has no actual bearing on the outcome.
00;48;41;17 - 00;48;53;00
Pri
You know, I feel like I remember at the end of the show because I haven't seen that in a long time. It's like hard for me to remember that. But I thought he he kind of made it seem like he was like the man behind the curtain concocting everything, but like.
00;48;53;07 - 00;48;56;14
Chris
No, that's not the whole time.
00;48;56;16 - 00;49;15;11
Pri
Yeah, okay. No, that shows really good. I mean, that's like kind of actually where I went deep on, like Portuguese influence on Japan because I didn't, I wasn't even that like switched on about that. Like I thought that was really interesting that they tried multiple times to I mean, when I went down, they tried multiple times to break through Japan, then eventually were able to.
00;49;15;13 - 00;49;47;01
Chris
If you want to get into like your deep Catholic lure as well, right. Like the Jesuits are really interesting order in that sometimes they're so damn based. You're like, hell yeah, these dudes are like, they're awesome. And then sometimes the Jesuits are straight up like fucking mercenaries and like, the bad guys and like the Jesuits in Japan are very much their your forward deployed troops, you know, they're establishing your beachhead.
00;49;47;04 - 00;49;54;17
Chris
They're not like you're your good guy. Jesuits. So just a little new wrinkle in all of that.
00;49;54;19 - 00;49;57;21
Pri
Yeah. It's true. I mean, and they show that on the show, too.
00;49;57;28 - 00;50;03;02
Chris
Yeah. I mean, they're really like a religious trading house. Yeah.
00;50;03;05 - 00;50;26;20
Pri
Well, that's the other thing that you realize too, is like, how much of a religion is religion and politics are driven by economics to. It's like, kind of wish I'd like I if I could go back to school, I think I'd want to spend more time in like financial history or something just to like, really spend time. And I think it might be the best way to understand the world.
00;50;26;20 - 00;51;04;01
Chris
It's appropriate time. Like, yeah, it's very current, you know, like there was, you know, like when I was coming up studying Russian, right? Was kind of like that wedge because it was a very dynamic part of his, you know, moment in history. And like being a Russia expert was a good, a good way to do it. Like this moment in particular is definitely a mix of like religious ideology, capital markets and like, you know, using conflict to settle, you know, to gain entry into markets or to gain control over markets.
00;51;04;02 - 00;51;30;14
Chris
Right. That was Venezuela that was around. And it's also, I think, why like Stevenson himself, like is I think an author for these times as well. Like he didn't wasn't deep in the religious side of things, but very much like the absurdity of what we do as societies for the sake of like, you know, gaining market access or having control over market and using technology.
00;51;30;14 - 00;51;35;08
Chris
And so all that sort of stew, you know, is definitely like what we're living through right now.
00;51;35;13 - 00;51;54;28
Pri
Yeah, I agree, I mean, that's what I think, like I mean, really, I can't figure it all out. I think he is like obviously a pretty smart guy, but I feel like a lot of his understanding of the world is just like prior events. I'm trying to, like somehow shoehorn our current state and like where the world will go based on.
00;51;55;01 - 00;52;34;24
Chris
Yeah, that's fun, I think. I'm not a close Ray Dalio watcher. You know like I yeah I like I try to read Ray Dalio stuff from time to time and I'm just like I don't know man. Like look this clearly has worked for you. Yeah. Whatever you're trying to communicate I'm sure is reason and but it's reason to the level I can't access because I'm just not close enough a student or like, I'm not deep enough into, like, how your Giga brain is working here on this and frankly, like, you know, there's there's a fine line and all that stuff, you know, in which, like, I have a hard time explaining thoughts sometimes, you know,
00;52;34;25 - 00;52;42;28
Chris
because they're like this big interconnected jumble and you need to have a certain base layer of understanding, a certain shorthand. And so, like, you know, like.
00;52;42;29 - 00;52;43;12
Pri
Yeah.
00;52;43;15 - 00;52;53;25
Chris
I just kind of assumed that's where he's out operating. And, you know, I don't have like the the working language capacity and pattern matching to, to really get into Ray Dalio.
00;52;53;27 - 00;53;09;26
Pri
Yeah. And then like honestly because he tries to contextualize it so much like getting through his stuff is like so dense because you're just like oh my god I have to like take your word on this event. I guess that happened 300 years ago. And he tries to explain in tied to modern day like like it's like it definitely is interesting.
00;53;09;26 - 00;53;39;23
Pri
But I'm like, this is like pretty, pretty tough. But no, I think it's a good area to focus on. Like, even like when I like travel and stuff. Like when I was in Croatia last year, like it was really interesting just to because especially in that like the, that area of the Balkans and the Adriatic, I mean, there was just so much between, like the Venetians and the Habsburgs and the Ottoman Empire, like, you really feel all of that and like you really feel World War One there.
00;53;40;00 - 00;53;56;11
Pri
And so it's just kind of when you travel to it just adds this other layer of context from like the people you talk to and like tour guides and stuff. So I don't know, I think that's what you're going to need in the post era.
00;53;56;13 - 00;54;13;18
Chris
When you were over there, did you take a moment to reflect upon the contributions of Morgan and Illyrian generals in lifting Rome temporarily out of the crisis of the third century and setting it on a course so it could lurch ahead 100 more years.
00;54;13;20 - 00;54;14;24
Pri
Oh, really?
00;54;14;26 - 00;54;43;12
Chris
Yes. That's like the palace of Diocletian, right? Like he came out of that whole that whole cohort of emperors, but basically around 265, 270 is when Rome hits rock bottom. And at that point in time, once a general fall, once a emperor falls more or less like the legions out in the field. Just go. You are boss. You're the next emperor.
00;54;43;12 - 00;54;59;01
Chris
And it was going on that way for a while. And then, yes, basically the Croatian General cabal said, look, we're better than all these guys. We're doing this shit. And they had a pretty good run of it.
00;54;59;02 - 00;55;04;27
Pri
See, that's the thing. You go there and you still miss out on, like some of these pivotal historical events.
00;55;04;29 - 00;55;19;14
Chris
Well, when Cersei is blowing up the Red Keep and Game of Thrones, you can thank the Illyrian generals for saving for their outsized role in the crisis of the third century to provide settings and backdrop for HBO prestige TV.
00;55;19;17 - 00;55;34;16
Pri
I know we talked about The Odyssey last time, but I really wish, like people like directors and others would just take like amazing stories from like, basically the public domain and history and just like put in the money and cast and writing. I mean, it's like such an easy way to learn about these events. I mean, they do actually.
00;55;34;16 - 00;55;42;23
Pri
I've seen like a lot, a lot of American history flashback content on Netflix, but I just wish there was more of it.
00;55;42;26 - 00;55;49;14
Chris
You're waiting for a big, Long Remains of the day style movie about the enclosure movement.
00;55;49;15 - 00;56;03;14
Pri
Yes, yes yes maybe. Yeah we can, we can. Actually, that actually would be interesting if you could could tell it the right way. On that note, should we wrap it? I feel like we've, we somehow we somehow made this work.
00;56;03;14 - 00;56;12;18
Chris
Chris tree, you and I have done a couple of these two person booth shows, and it takes us 20 minutes to find our footing. But we didn't get there. We felt.
00;56;12;20 - 00;56;36;06
Pri
We get there. I know I feel like it does take a while and then it ends up being fine. Hey everyone, today it's me and Chris, just us to talking on that society. All things crypto, AI, tech, history and more. Just as a quick reminder, these thoughts and opinions are own and none of our employer and none of this is financial advice.