The StoryConnect Podcast

Now that the rules have been finalized, Dereck DeVries, of Vantage Point, shares the latest on what marketers, communicators and executives need to know about the where, what and when of broadband labels.

Creators & Guests

Host
Andy Johns
Vice President of Marketing

What is The StoryConnect Podcast?

StoryConnect features interviews with marketers, communicators, CEOs and other leaders at cooperative and independent broadband companies, electric cooperatives and municipal power providers. The goal of the podcast is to help listeners discover ideas to shape their stories and connect with their customers. It is produced by Pioneer Utility Resources.

Andy Johns:
Hello, StoryConnect listeners, this is Andy.

Thank you again for listening in on this new episode of
StoryConnect: The Podcast.

We are glad that you did.

I wanted to let you know of a quick update.

We have launched a page jointly with Vantage Point called
BroadbandLabels.coop.

BroadbandLabels.coop is built to be a resource for folks like
yourself who are trying to figure out all of the who, what, when,

where of the broadband labels requirements that are coming up.

And we just wanted to put that page out there again at
BroadbandLabels.coop as a resource for you.

We're going to post any new information we have is full of
frequently asked questions from the experts over at Vantage Point

and from what we're hearing from Pioneer members.

Hope you enjoyed the episode.

Hope that page is useful to you.

And now we'll get on with the regularly scheduled episode.

Intro:
A production of Pioneer Utility Resources.

StoryConnect, helping communicators discover ideas to shape
their stories and connect with their customers.

Andy Johns:
What are the latest details on broadband labels, and what does it
mean for marketing and communication staff?

That's what we'll be talking about on this episode of
StoryConnect: The Podcast.

My name is Andy Johns, your host with Pioneer, and I'm joined on
this episode by Derek DeVries, who is a senior analyst with

Vantage Point. Derek, thanks so much for joining me.

Derek DeVries:
Yes. Thank you.

Andy Johns:
Now no pressure Derek, but the episode we had with Jeff from
Vantage Point last year about broadband labels was our number one

most listened to episode of 2023.

So obviously there's a lot of interest in the broadband labels,
folks trying to understand it.

But, don't want to psych you out or anything to know there's
that kind of pressure riding on how we do here today.

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. Jeff, he's a very intelligent man.

Yeah, he does a great job with speaking, podcasts.

So big shoes to fill, but we're ready.

Andy Johns:
By all accounts, you are too.

So I think we're in pretty good shape.

But when we recorded that episode last year, there was still a
lot up in the air.

You know, we did some responsible speculating, some educated
guesses and, kind of the best we knew at the time.

But since that episode, earlier this year, it's come out with
some more firm details about what those

broadband labels entail.

What do we know right now?

And I know there are a couple of deadlines up here we could talk
about, but.

But what do we know right now about broadband labels?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. So, I mean, all the rules are out there.

Your regulation rules, what you need to do to be compliant.

Everything's out there.

There are some grey areas where you have to work through.

But, yeah, those dates are out there.

You have, if you're a larger carrier, if you have over 100,000
subscribers, you have until April 10th.

If you have less than 100,000, you have until October 10th.

So the dates are out there.

They've given you enough time to get these up and compliant and
up and running on your websites and such, where you need to post

them. So all the rules are there, and you just got to work
through the process.

Andy Johns:
Now, we'll get back to this at the end.

But, you know, it's been kind of a positive message from what
I've heard both from ya'll at Vantage Point and from some of the

other sessions at conferences I've been to where this has been
discussed.

But I really think, you know, the folks who are doing it right.

The folks who have good networks, the folks who don't have a lot
of gimmicks and promotional prices on top

or whatever. I think that this, overall the broadband labels are
going to be a plus for those folks.

Is that kind of where you come down as well?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah, I think so too.

I mean, you have to lay out all of your pricing information,
speed information.

So I think all those details being out there is going to help
your current customers and potential future customers in making

that right decision on which provider they would like to go
with.

Andy Johns:
Got it. Let's jump in.

Because I know, like I said before, we pushed the record button,
most of the folks on this, or that listen to StoryConnect are are

not your regulatory folks.

It's mainly marketing and communications folks.

So the big question that we keep hearing that folks are asking
us here at Pioneer is "Where do I have to put these labels?"

So let's start there.

With the broadband labels, it's point of sale, right?

What does that mean?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. So any location that a customer could go request service or
sign up for service.

The main one is your website.

You're going to have to display them on your website.

They have to be easily accessible for a user that is on your
website.

So it can't be hidden through a bunch of links.

Most of the time they're right where your packages or services
are.

It's just a link saying, here's a link to the broadband labels.

Additionally, it has to be displayed at every ISP-owned
location.

It's pretty much just where your headquarters is, where a
customer could come into your office and get service.

Those could both be hard copied, or if you have a computer, an
iPad that they sign up service for, you could just have

them directly on your website saying, hey, if you want to see
the labels, here they are.

So it doesn't actually have to be a paper form.

However, we are advising to have some type of printout created
at your headquarter where they sign up for service.

Andy Johns:
Right now are you thinking that's okay to have have a paper on
the counter or brochure?

Or does this need to be plastered on the wall?

I mean, when folks have been talking about the, you know,
equivalencies or whatever, you know, a lot of the bars have to

have things about alcohol.

Or, you know, folks are just unsure.

But right now, do we know where and how they'll have to be
displaying these?

Or it just has to be present in the customer facing area?

Derek DeVries:
Correct. It just has to be present.

It doesn't have to be anything big or special.

It just has to be easily accessible for those customers or
anybody that comes into your headquartered office.

Andy Johns:
Got it.

Derek DeVries:
Nothing on like a bulletin board or anything like that.

Andy Johns:
Okay. So it would have to be at every office then, if they have
multiple buildings.

And then as I understand it as well, if there's, you know, some
folks will do like a mobile sign up or, you know, when folks are

going into a new territory, they've just got a CLEC area where
they're building out, and they're going to have a community

meeting where people can sign up for service.

Or whether it's a parade or county fair or whatever.

I mean, anywhere where people can sign up for service, it needs
to be there, right?

Derek DeVries:
Correct. Yep. It has to be accessible to anywhere that you could
potentially sign up a customer for service.

So like you said, a county fair, if you have a booth, or any
other community events, you're going to have to have the labels

accessible there as well.

Andy Johns:
Now, when we talk about the labels themselves one of the
challenges that I've seen from a lot of the telco folks that

have legacy packages.

You know, I forget.

For a long time I was keeping track of the record for the telco
with the most packages.

I think it was up around 16 or 17.

Derek DeVries:
Yeah.

Andy Johns:
Just based on, you know, folks still having some copper, you
know, anything like that.

If you're building greenfield, and you've only got 2 or 3
packages, that only means 2 or 3 labels.

But for folks that have a dozen or, you know, multiple packages,
they have to have one of these labels ready

for every speed that they offer, basically.

Right?

Derek DeVries:
Correct. And that would only be for packages or services that you
currently would offer to a new customer.

So if it's any old package, for example, you have some copper
that you only have three subscribers that are signed up

for, but you don't offer it to a new customer coming in, you're
not required to make any of those.

So only for new services that you would offer to a new customer.

Andy Johns:
Okay. That's a big, important detail.

Derek DeVries:
Yep.

Andy Johns:
So right now, you know, one of the questions that folks had asked
if on the marketing

mailer, or on the billboard or anything more like that, they
promote a price.

They can talk about speed and packages and all that, and they
don't have to have the label on those marketing pieces as you

understand it. And that's kind of the working assumption right
now.

Right?

Derek DeVries:
Yep. That's correct. Yeah.

So I mean, a lot of those marketing tools, they're still going
to have to call in or go to your website to sign up for service.

So you're not required to put those on any of those marketing
tools.

It's only when you they actually could fill out the form on that
marketing sheet and mail it in.

And then that would be an example where you may have to put that
on that marketing sheet.

But in most cases, yeah, they'll just go to your website to sign
up or call in.

Andy Johns:
Okay. You just mentioned calling in.

So let's talk about that piece too.

Because this is one where I've been talking to marketing people.

And, you know, most marketing people are not lawyers, but they
can spot a loophole at times.

So what are the guidelines that you guys are setting on the
recorded, audible versions of the

broadband labels as well?

Because I know that's kind of a different piece of it.

Derek DeVries:
Yep. So, yeah, that is one of the requirements.

You have to make this label accessible to everybody.

So that would be if someone calls in for service, you're
required to read that label over the phone to them.

One little loophole that we have found was if that person does
have internet service already, you can direct them

to the company website instead of having, your sales team read
the label over the phone or have a recording.

So, yeah, a good loophole would be directing them to your
website, but you're still going to be required to train those

sales people or have a recording.

Because not everybody is going to have internet service or
access to internet.

Or smartphone, for example.

They won't have access to internet.

Andy Johns:
I mean, to me, you know, as somebody that thinks about the sales
process or the, you know, kind of the fitting

process, nothing kills the momentum of a phone call like
reading.

Because they would have to read multiple of these labels.

Right?

Derek DeVries:
Correct, yeah.

Andy Johns:
Most folks that you're talking to, is it like a press two to hear
the recording kind of a situation?

Or what are most folks doing?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah, most are going to the recording.

We think that's probably the easiest solution.

So then you're not making your sales team get trained on how to
read these labels.

And someone reading it might take longer than a recording.

However, we understand that customers, they don't like listening
to recordings a lot of the time.

But it is a requirement that we have to work through, and that's
the best solution that we have found is going with the recording

stage. Like you said, press two to hear the recording of the
labels.

Andy Johns:
So that, I mean, and that could almost be at the beginning of the
call when, you know, we got like that boilerplate in there where,

where it says, you know, calls may be recorded for, you know,
customer evaluation or whatever.

Press two for Spanish, if you do that.

And then just right there at the beginning, if you want to hear
the mandated broadband labels or however you want to phrase it,

but it could go right there and still satisfy the requirements,
right?

Derek DeVries:
Correct. Yep. You're making it available to them, right away,
right off the bat.

So yep.

Andy Johns:
Got it. Now, you mentioned earlier, the goal of these labels is
to make them accessible.

The goal and the mandate is to make them accessible to
everybody.

So one of the rules in here that I'm not sure everybody has
seen, but the labels have to be available in the way that I

understand the wording is basically every language that you
market in or you send communication pieces in, right?

Derek DeVries:
Correct. Yeah. So in most cases that would be English and
Spanish.

However in some cases you might mark it in different languages.

But yeah, you are required to make them in every language that
you currently market in.

Andy Johns:
And is that marketing, is that defined well?

Is that one time we sent out a postcard in Spanish, and so
therefore we always have to do it?

Or is it, I mean, are there guidelines there as to what what
exactly that means?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah, there aren't too many guidelines.

On what we've kind of been pushing for is, yeah, if you
consistently market in that language, then that would be a

requirement. If you have, your packages, for example, on your
website, if they're able to switch that into different language,

those types of things.

Andy Johns:
Okay. Got it.

So that's an interesting point.

You know Google Translate can translate anything.

So that might be a gray area there.

And thanks for handling some of these, so rapid fire.

We, before this call, I went ahead and talked to our account
managers just to see what kind of questions they were getting.

So I appreciate you knocking these down.

Another one that folks are wondering about is updating.

So, is there a requirement on how often these need to be
updated?

Or is it basically, you know, whenever the speeds change?

Or what are the updating guidelines?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. So whenever you change a package, be that be speed,
pricing, any packaging changes,

contract changes.

If you're required to sign a contract for a year, those types of
things.

So any change to the actual service plan is when you'll have to
update these labels.

Andy Johns:
Got it. What are the right now – and I guess we'll see –ut what
are the teeth in this?

You know, we know that, well everybody who listens StoryConnect
and almost all of the folks are operating, you know, most of our

folks and, you know, they're going to operate in good faith.

But what are some of the penalties?

I mean, this is obviously something anytime the feds are
involved, you want to take it pretty seriously.

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. So right now there are no – you're not required to submit
these labels to the FCC or anything like that for as far as

compliance. That is something they might add down the road.

But as of right now, you're not required to submit any of this
information to the FCC.

One way that you might be, they can reach out to you and require
you to provide the labels to them.

Then you have 30 days to get them submitted to the FCC via that
email, or if that's going to be in their actual FCC portal or

system. As far as penalties, I believe it's for each violation,
it's $10,000, but not exceeding

$75,000. So there are some big penalties are coming from this.

How, urgent, or if they're going to give you some leeway on
okay, well, you've made the label, but

this is out of compliance. Just change it and update your other
labels.

We aren't sure how they're going to regulate that, but as far as
not creating labels at all, I think that could be a big red flag

to the FCC. And that's where you might get some fines and
penalties.

Andy Johns:
Yeah. Nothing blows a marketing budget like having $50,000 fine
or whatever it is.

Derek DeVries:
Yep.

Andy Johns:
Yeah, yeah.

Okay. So definitely something that folks are going to want to
do.

Let's dive in even deeper and get a little bit nerdy, as if
talking about broadband labels for 15

minutes wasn't nerdy enough.

But with the labels themselves, we've seen the templates out
there.

And, you know, everybody's familiar with the way kind of that
nutrition label was what folks were comparing to earlier.

It needs to be, as I understand it, machine readable is kind of
the phrase that you see over and over again.

So those labels must be made in a way that's machine readable,
correct?

Derek DeVries:
Yep.

Andy Johns:
Yep.

Derek DeVries:
And that's just for that ability.

Yeah. The disability act, where, it's accessible to everybody
that they can go to your website, and they'll read that for them.

So.

Andy Johns:
Got it. One of the questions that we've had quite a few folks ask
is the labels

require a UPI or a unique plan identifier number.

So let's break that down if we can.

So it's got, you know, when you see these, it's like a 15
character string

of letters and numbers usually starting with an F or an M, right?

Talk me through that.

Derek DeVries:
Yep. So it starts with that F or M.

That's just for the technology of that service.

So it's either F for fixed or M for mobile.

Andy Johns:
Okay. So if somebody's got fiber or copper, that's going to be
fixed.

Derek DeVries:
Correct. Yep.

Andy Johns:
Only if it's a mobile plan.

Have we figured out the folks that have a fixed wireless option?

I mean, it says fixed in the name, so I guess we're going with
fixed on those?

Derek DeVries:
Yep.

Andy Johns:
Okay. Got it.

All right. And then the next thing it needs is the FRN.

Which is not a firm I was familiar with, but that's a regulatory
number?

Derek DeVries:
Yes. So it stands for the federal regulation number.

So each internet provider should have an FRN associated to that
company.

Andy Johns:
Got it. And then it's the big long string of numbers behind that
and that ties back

to, I guess it ties back to the ACP?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. So that last string of 15 characters.

It can be randomly generated.

We're suggesting or advising to make that unique to that service
plan.

So, for example, if you have like a gold, silver bronze package,
literally spell out gold and then whatever your speed is of that

package, and then you can randomize the last characters to make
15.

How you mentioned, similar to ACP, that data collection,
whatever unique identifier you made for

that filing, that was back in this previous fall.

That service plan is going to have to match those unique IDs.

And that's where it was kind of backwards.

They were hoping these labels would be pushed out before that
ACP data collection started.

So, and then it was a little bit easier, but now it's backwards.

So whatever you filed for, that ACP data collection is now going
to have to match whatever is on these labels.

Andy Johns:
Got it. And with the ACP, you are advising folks with the future
of that being kind of up in the

air, to say the least.

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. Yep.

Andy Johns:
Even if ACP winds up going away before these labels are
required, just with all that up in the air, I guess you guys

are still advising. Go ahead and use those anyway.

Derek DeVries:
Make them match.

Yep. That was something they added.

I mean, in the last I think it was when they released the final
report or final order back in

last October to add those to make them match whatever is
reported in ACP.

Is that just for their future regulation comparing the two?

Not sure.

Andy Johns:
Got it. Well, I think, you know, I was looking over my list of
questions here.

I think that fairly well, wraps up most of what I had, but just
in closing here, what advice do you have

Derek, for folks that are looking at this, maybe they're scared.

Maybe they're, you know, when you talk about those fines and,
you know, small staff, whatever it is.

What advice would you have for folks who are looking at having
to get these out?

Most of the folks on listen to this, probably looking at that
October date, what tips would you give them or advice do you have

for them?

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. I mean, I would start looking at those rules, regulations
now.

We all know that later this year is going to get very busy.

There's a lot of funds out there being released.

You're going to have to create applications for those funds.

BEAD funding is a big one.

So start working on these now.

Obviously, you don't have to get them up and running until
October.

But start working out of getting these curated, getting ahead of
the game is going to help you in the future.

So, especially with the busy fall and coming up.

So, the other thing is, there's more regulation than just.

Andy Johns:
And on that, do you have folks that you're working with that
already have theirs up?

I mean.

Derek DeVries:
A few that have them up and running on their website.

I mean, they were up and running right after this October date.

So we have a few that are have them up and running already, but
many are waiting until after this April 1st or April 10th

deadline to see what these larger, carriers providers are
doing, learning from their errors, mistakes and then working

forward through them.

Andy Johns:
Got it. And I'm sorry to cut you off.

You're you were talking about the other regulations.

Derek DeVries:
Yeah. So there are some other things that you should be looking
at.

For one is your network privacy policies, getting those
updated.

Some of those might not have been looked at for a couple of
years.

Going through, updating them, making sure they're in compliance.

So that was the other thing I was going to mention is, yeah,
some of that back end stuff.

Andy Johns:
That is different than CPNI that folks are familiar with?

Or that's going to fall under the same piece there?

Derek DeVries:
Yep. So these network management privacy policy stuff should be
on your website already.

A lot of them are just linked to your website.

So part of the label is just link to your website to those
policies.

Andy Johns:
Got it. Yeah.

I've learned a lot on this call.

I know that a lot of the listeners that we have on here have as
well.

So, Derek, thank you for for sharing that wisdom.

And of course, I would imagine folks would be welcome to reach
out to you or folks at Vantage Point if they need help and need

somebody to hold their hand through this process.

Derek DeVries:
Yes. For sure. Yeah.

We are in the process of creating a tool to help create these
labels, archiving them for the two years.

That's one of the compliances, and as well as creating an easy
copy paste tool that you can

copy into your website to make it machine readable.

That is one of the nice bonuses of the tool that we're creating,
as well as a possible recording created for

you based off the label.

So, we're working on that process.

We're hoping to get that rolled out by early April.

We're really pushing for early April time frame to give enough
time to get these up and running for internet providers.

Andy Johns:
Perfect. Sounds like a good, important resource for folks.

Derek DeVries:
Yes.

Andy Johns:
And if you're listening and you have a Powerful website from
Pioneer, we've also got a tool there, that will

help build the labels and keep it updated on the website as well.

So be sure to reach out to the folks, if you are in that
scenario, be sure to reach out to either the folks at Vantage

Point or the folks at Pioneer, if we do your website to get some
help.

Derek, thanks for joining me.

Derek DeVries:
Perfect. Thanks, Andy.

Andy Johns:
He is Derek DeVries.

He is a senior analyst with Vantage Point.

I'm Andy Johns with Pioneer.

And until we talk again, keep telling your story.

Outro:
StoryConnect is produced by Pioneer Utility Resources, a
communications cooperative that is built to share your story.

StoryConnect is engineered by Lucas Smith of Lucky Sound Studio.