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Connecting Hope is a production of the Mississippi Department of Human Services. Join us as we explore the people, policies, and programs that bridge the gap from hopelessness to hope for Mississippians, young and old.
00;00;00;06 - 00;00;38;18
Speaker 1
Welcome to episode two of connecting Hope, the MDHS podcast. My name is Mark Jones, your host, and today I will be speaking with Legislative Affairs and Senior Policy Analyst Alex Bucklew and our Executive Director, Bob Anderson, as we discussed the 2024 legislative session. In today's episode, we discuss the role of the different branches of government in setting policies at MDHS. Mr. Anderson and Alex will share how MDHS has sets a legislative agenda and then the sources the agency utilizes to develop legislative solutions to our policy needs.
00;00;38;21 - 00;01;14;21
Speaker 1
It sounds like a lot. It's essentially what does the agency do to move forward with…with legislation that allows us to connect our services to everyday Mississippians. Once again, as you listen to today's episode, we hope it opens your eyes and gives you a clear picture of how your government works and supports the lives of every Mississippian through MDHS.
00;01;14;23 - 00;01;32;23
Speaker 1
Welcome, Mr. Anderson and Alex to episode two of connecting Hope the MDHS podcast. First, Alex, you're new to our podcast and fairly new to our agency. So, introduce yourself and talk about your experience in state government and how you came to MDHS.
00;01;32;25 - 00;01;44;03
Speaker 2
Well, thanks, Mark. I started on December 1st, and before that, I had spent four years at the Mississippi Secretary of State's office doing policy and legislation there.
00;01;44;05 - 00;01;51;03
Speaker 1
So, you're Mississippian…Mississippi native? Talk about a little bit about your background in Mississippi.
00;01;51;05 - 00;02;09;00
Speaker 2
Okay. Well, I grew up in Louisville and I think something like 9 or 10 generations of Mississippians go back a long way. So, it seemed natural to want to invest something for myself into the state. And here we are.
00;02;09;02 - 00;02;33;11
Speaker 1
We're glad to have you. As you mentioned, you began December 1st, and today we'll be talk–we will be talking about the 2024 legislative session. So, what was that first month like, knowing that in about 30 days you had to ramp up. Your–and in fact, you had to get to know your employees at DHS. Plus, you were going to be spending the better part of the next four months at the Capitol.
00;02;33;13 - 00;02;55;22
Speaker 2
Yeah. Well, on day one, Mr. Anderson told me to do my best to meet with as many division directors as possible. And I did that, and I cannot remember how many, but it was a lot. Double digits. And it's a lot. It's a lot of stuff to remember. And I had to review and I made sure to get everybody's phone numbers and things like that.
00;02;55;24 - 00;03;10;15
Speaker 2
So when I, had a question, I could come back to it because, yeah, a month is not a very long time to to learn enough about all these programs to really, speak as an expert.
00;03;10;17 - 00;03;21;29
Speaker 1
That first month of ramping up, those relationships that you had to quickly build, what role did it play in helping you get through this first part of the session?
00;03;22;01 - 00;03;48;29
Speaker 2
Oh, it was crucial. And I got to say that it was helpful that the agency is really cultivated some relationships that were independent of me. So I was able to come in and just really continue some good relationships that we already had with, legislators and legislative leadership. And if it hadn't been for those people, it would have been a lot harder to get started.
00;03;49;01 - 00;04;02;13
Speaker 1
So we'll transition. Alex, you had a long four months, and I mentioned that four months. Mr. Anderson lets explain to our audience why the first year or why we had a four month session the first year of a term.
00;04;02;19 - 00;04;29;20
Speaker 3
Yeah. Every–every session immediately after a statewide election, and everybody will remember, we had statewide elections last year in 2023, the first session after elections the legislature is always in town for 120 day session. So, it's–it's the longest session we have in the four years that the legislature is here, with, you know, with the governor and the other statewide elected officials.
00;04;29;20 - 00;04;48;01
Speaker 3
So, you know, if there was, a tough time for Alex to come on board, it was that first year when it's a super long session, and they took every bit of it. We'll talk about it, I'm sure, a little more. But they were here all the way into, May. So they took the full four months…
00;04;48;03 - 00;05;21;27
Speaker 3
coming into town about the, 2nd , I believe it was the 2nd of January it was when the legislature arrived in town. And, that–that's the long haul, that--that session, every first session of…of an administration is it's a long haul and it's, 120 days. Doesn't sound like a lot, but when you're back and forth, back and forth to the legislature almost every day, like Alex was and I was over there seemed like a lot more this year to myself…
00;05;22;00 - 00;05;28;06
Speaker 3
that–that four months gets to be a long…a long period.
00;05;28;08 - 00;05;48;07
Speaker 1
It's been a little over 120 days. And that back and forth personally, what kind of grind does it have on you professionally and personally and emotionally? Because it's a long hundred. It's 120 days, and many times it's weekends and late nights as well.
00;05;48;10 - 00;06;14;20
Speaker 3
Yeah, I'll–I'll speak to that first and then I'll let Alex talk a little about it. One of the, one of the most frustrating things about the legislature. I mean, we–we don't control their schedule. They absolutely control our schedule during that session. So, from week to week and even from day to day, during each week, we don't know when a committee may decide, hey, we're going to have a hearing on this–this issue or on this bill today.
00;06;14;22 - 00;06;40;00
Speaker 3
And we may get, you know, we may get notice, 9 or 10:00 in the morning when they're not getting notice until when they're making the announcements, after they do roll call in the morning about which committees are meeting, and they call a committee meeting for one of the committees that has one of our bills. And so, you're constantly playing catch up, with the legislature when you say, Alex?
00;06;40;03 - 00;07;01;13
Speaker 2
I agree. Yeah, it's–it's unpredictable. And sometimes, just to add to that part about the committee meetings, you--you'll have some–some where you really expect something that's important to you will come up and then you'll go to it and there's no agenda and you'll show up and they don't talk about whatever you, thought you were going there to listen for.
00;07;01;15 - 00;07;20;21
Speaker 2
But then maybe on another floor, they're talking about something that is very relevant to you. So, you can't be two places at once very well. So, we are fortunate to have some help there. And we do have, Raegan Spears, who does a great job and keeping an eye on a lot of our bills and helping with policy and things like that.
00;07;20;21 - 00;07;45;16
Speaker 2
So, it's good to have more than just one person. And of course, when you can bring your executive director in there, that really–that really shows the legislators, that whatever you are there for is a priority and things like that, and even bring it in, division directors, it can be a team effort at times. And it's nice to know that you have people, to fall back on.
00;07;45;18 - 00;07;48;13
Speaker 1
That's one thing I think, Mr. Anderson, you were going to expound on something?
00;07;48;16 - 00;08;15;23
Speaker 3
Well, I'm just going to say. Yeah. Reagan Spears is a great part of this team. She's kind of the, back channel person who keeps up with the legislative docket. I'll–I'll call it the bill locator service we use. And she keeps us all, posted, every day. And then at the end of every week, there's a summary of all the bills that we're watching.
00;08;15;26 - 00;08;38;08
Speaker 3
And Reagan does a great job of of just making sure we all got that each week. And then, you know, she's kind of the—the–the voice on the other end of the phone line a lot of times saying, hey, this committee meeting today or this bill I think is coming up and she's just an extra pair of eyes and ears, that is invaluable to this process.
00;08;38;10 - 00;09;06;25
Speaker 1
As you were discussing that–that committee piece, I want to transition into helping our listeners understand the process of–of how the agency is administered under the executive branch, but also how the legislative branch and how those processes from filing a bill, working with the Legislative Budget Office, all of those pieces, how they are all brought together to keep us moving forward as an agency.
00;09;06;25 - 00;09;08;22
Speaker 1
I'll start, I guess, with you, Mr. Anderson.
00;09;08;25 - 00;09;34;17
Speaker 3
Yeah, it's–it's a real interesting, kind of, shared responsibility or shared accountability that we as an agency and all of our agency, all of our federal agencies who–who provide our funding for our SNAP program, for our TANF program, for child support, for child care, you know, all–community services, all of those are federal agencies…
00;09;34;17 - 00;10;06;07
Speaker 3
and–and they set the general parameters for most of those federal programs for how they're to be administered. But, the legislature has authority, within the federal guidelines, to set more specific parameters for us about how we operate within those federal guidelines. There seem to have been this year several child support issues where we were, seeking to bring our state program into alignment with the federal guidelines.
00;10;06;07 - 00;10;36;03
Speaker 3
And that's something we have to explain very carefully and–and frankly, on a continuous basis during the session to¬¬–to the House and Senate members. Look, this is not just, you know, the agencies idea, these are requirements from our oversight agency who funds, like our child support program, for example, 66% of our funding for our child support program is federal funding, and 34% of that is state funding.
00;10;36;06 - 00;10;55;10
Speaker 3
And that 66%, amounts to about $25 million a year. So it's a significant piece of our operating our child support program that we keep the feds happy about you know, our being in compliance with their regulations and their interpretations of the law.
00;10;55;12 - 00;11;10;10
Speaker 1
So let's be real to that statement. What happens if there is attention and there's actually within state law and federal rules, if we are up to date with that. You mentioned significant amount of money.
00;11;10;10 - 00;11;39;20
Speaker 3
Yeah. Well, I mean, ultimately the big risk is that our federal oversight agency and I'll just use the Office of Child Support Services, for example. They're the oversight agency for our child support program. If they determine, let's take a bill from a couple of years ago, or last year, they determined that it was inappropriate to consider the incarceration of a non-custodial parent as voluntary unemployment.
00;11;39;23 - 00;12;04;11
Speaker 3
And so they directed us to go to the legislature and get our state law in compliance with federal law, so that, chancellors would not be considering, incarceration as volunteer unemployment if we hadn't been. And we accomplished that last year. We got that law all the way through, and the governor signed it, and it's now part of our child support program.
00;12;04;13 - 00;12;28;12
Speaker 3
Had we not been able to make that legislative change, the big risk was that the Office of Child Support Services would have said to us at some point, well, we're going to decertify your program. We're going to decertify Mississippi from participating in the child support program now, the 25 million or so that they fund is the operational piece.
00;12;28;14 - 00;12;57;09
Speaker 3
But in the reality of our child support program, that 25 million that we spend on the program generates well over $300 million in child support collections every year. And so the risk is—is–is huge. If our program were to be decertified, there are about 200,000, famlies for children who would be affected by the decertification of our child support program.
00;12;57;09 - 00;13;30;19
Speaker 3
So, each time the feds make a suggestion to us like that or a demand to us, we do everything we can to explain to the legislature what the risks are. And some of the changes they recommend are advisory. They're not mandatory, but others like the incarceration piece, those are mandatory requirements. And so we have to negotiate, getting those bills to the finish line, very carefully.
00;13;30;19 - 00;13;42;15
Speaker 3
And–and–and be very persistent in reminding our, friends that in the house and Senate that, our program is at risk if we don't–if we don't get this done.
00;13;42;18 - 00;13;55;25
Speaker 1
So Alex, let’s go to you. You're the man in the trenches over at the Capitol. Talk about that process of–of the bill getting filed or finding someone to sponsor the bill. How does that work?
00;13;55;27 - 00;14;31;12
Speaker 2
Well, we'll have something linked in the show notes that…like a graphic to show exactly how it works, but just to talk it out a little bit. You know, we–we start with prospective authors. We have to, you know, we somebody within this agency has an idea and it goes through a process here, you know, where leadership decides whether or not this is a priority to be pushed in the upcoming legislative session. Then an author is sought out, which is, a senator or a representative.
00;14;31;14 - 00;14;53;08
Speaker 2
They either do or don't agree to author that bill. And if they do agree, they, they put their name on it. They take it to the draft in office. It gets drafted, it comes out, and then it has to go through a rigorous process where it goes, you know, from the House of origin. So, it's–let's just say it starts in the House of Representatives.
00;14;53;08 - 00;15;13;12
Speaker 2
It goes, you know, from the committee, if it passes committee, if it's single referred, it could be double referred or even triple referred. You know, if it's referred to that many–however many committees it's referred to, it has to go through all of them and get approved and passed through there. From there, it goes to the floor, and then it has to start all over again in the other house.
00;15;13;12 - 00;15;46;29
Speaker 2
So, in this situation, it would be the Senate. And then it's got to do all that again. And it comes back to the House of origin. And then if there, may be discrepancies in what the Senate passed through an amendment and what the House passed originally, then it could end up going to conference, which means there–there will be a smaller conference committee, and those conferees decide which version comes out, if any version comes out at all, then legislative leadership would sign it.
00;15;47;01 - 00;15;50;05
Speaker 2
And from there it would go to the governor who would sign it.
00;15;50;07 - 00;16;14;22
Speaker 1
You provided us–we'll let our listeners know–you provided us a link that has a diagram of kind of that the way a bill moves itself through the Mississippi Legislature. And we will put that link here in the description for our listeners to see that. And it's pretty good description. We've also seen the old Schoolhouse Rock. We're kind of talking before we came on air…I'm just a bill on Capitol Hill.
00;16;14;22 - 00;16;17;18
Speaker 1
And if–good reference point, Mr. Anderson.
00;16;17;23 - 00;16;18;27
Speaker 3
Yeah.
00;16;19;00 - 00;16;39;22
Speaker 1
Thinking through–thinking through that, you know, kind of brought that piece together. But it's not just working with a bill, but there's also the appropriations process, and the agency being under the purview and working with the Legislative Budget Office. And let's talk a little bit about that, too, because it's not just passing a bill, it's appropriating the money to do our–
00;16;39;25 - 00;17;09;15
Speaker 3
Yeah, that appropriation process is even longer than–when the legislative session is long it seemed like a long time. But actually, the appropriation process begins as far back as August or September, when the joint legislative budget committees meet their members of the House and members of the Senate who comprise the Joint Legislative Budget Committee. And we will be preparing we, MDHS, the agency we begin preparing our budget.
00;17;09;18 - 00;17;54;11
Speaker 3
Actually, in late May, in June and July, and we have to submit it by early August in preparation for that joint legislative Budget Committee hearing. We usually are invited to–to attend and to present our budget request but then, the joint Legislative Budget Committee passes are our recommendation, our request over to the Legislative Budget Office, which, you know, works hand in hand with the¬–the Senate Appropriations Committee, chaired by Briggs Hobson and–and, the House Appropriations Committee, that's chaired by John Reid.
00;17;54;14 - 00;18;15;11
Speaker 3
And when they get to the beginning of the session, we also often get an invite, when we in the four years I've been here, we get an invite every year to come over and present to the–the appropriation committees in the House and Senate. A lot of times, that looks just like what we presented to the Joint Legislative Budget Committee.
00;18;15;13 - 00;18;43;07
Speaker 3
But, we may have a subcommittee. The House had subcommittees for the first time this year, I think, of their appropriation committee. And so we met with subcommittee chair and the Senate has always used a subcommittee process. 3 or 4 senators will be a subcommittee for health and human Services. Agencies like us. And so we meet with them and make another budget…
00;18;43;09 - 00;19;09;15
Speaker 3
proposal to them. And, in all honesty, and, Alex, you can kind of chime in here. We don't hear–that happens early in the session, usually the second week or so of February, and we don't hear a whole lot about what's happening with our budget until we get on over into April, often near late April when they start, you know, making the real decisions.
00;19;09;15 - 00;19;14;13
Speaker 3
And, Alex, I'll let you talk a little bit about what conference weekend is all about.
00;19;14;16 - 00;19;39;10
Speaker 2
Yeah. Well, for us this year, it was, all of our general bills had already gone to the governor to be signed. So, we really were only looking at our appropriation at this point. But you can't operate an agency without money. So, it was very important. And we were just what we–conference weekend is a lot of waiting around.
00;19;39;10 - 00;20;06;04
Speaker 2
You spend hours and hours waiting around for possibly a crucial two minutes, when some information is asked of you and you need to be able to convey it quickly. So, I think, this year, conference weekend…I spent something like 16 hours at the Capitol, and then Mr. Anderson was there for a significant amount of time, too.
00;20;06;04 - 00;20;33;05
Speaker 2
And in fact, Monday afterwards was a state holiday, and I was home. And then found out that, they were probably about to start signing the appropriations bills. So, I called Mr. Anderson and he was like, “well, I'm happened to be five minutes from the Capitol. I'll just go”. So, Mr. Anderson, waited at the Capitol and fortunately, I think a, a senator or two and, representative came and talked to him and–
00;20;33;09 - 00;20;33;22
Speaker 3
Yeah.
00;20;33;23 - 00;20;49;13
Speaker 2
Anyway, it's a…it's kind of out of your hands. You're just in–in that situation, if you can give them some information that they need to–to demonstrate the needs of your agency, then that's, that's the most you can do.
00;20;49;16 - 00;21;11;19
Speaker 3
Let me back up, add a little bit of detail that we haven’t mentioned. Our appropriation bill, you know, different agencies bills begin…some in the House, some in the Senate, our bill always begins in the House. And so the House makes the first cut, so to speak, the first recommendation. It's usually at a level that we call it'll be our, you know, legislative budget recommendation is what the legislative budget office recommends.
00;21;11;19 - 00;21;38;23
Speaker 3
It's almost never is it–the number we requested. It's often, you know, millions of dollars less than what we actually requested. But that goes to the Senate. And the Senate looks at it and they often will, you know, add more to it, thankfully for the agency. And that's what brings then the conference weekend requirement, because each house is passed a different version of our appropriation bill.
00;21;38;26 - 00;22;04;27
Speaker 3
So, they have to get together and have a conference and they'll be, you know, three senators, three, representatives on that conference committee to hammer out what the final number looks like. This year was even crazier. You know, usually they do that on the Saturday or Sunday of the last week in April, and you hang around like Alex was describing all night, Saturday and maybe come back Sunday morning.
00;22;04;27 - 00;22;34;22
Speaker 3
You hang around till Sunday evening and maybe 6 or 8:00 on Sunday, they'll finally, you know, start signing the bills. And if we're fortunate enough, a senator or representative will, after our bill of sign, come and give us the final number and let us know what it looks like. This year, things kind of went, off the rails a little bit because for reasons I don't begin to understand, they didn't reach an agreement on Saturday night, they didn't reach an agreement on Sunday night.
00;22;34;25 - 00;23;01;26
Speaker 3
And so all of the appropriation bills died, and they had to come back on Monday and suspend the rules in order to revive all the appropriation bills. And, they finally got together on the numbers for most of the agencies on that Monday evening, Alex was talking and it was still about 8:00 on Monday, which was a state holiday before they finally started signing bills.
00;23;01;26 - 00;23;07;25
Speaker 3
And like I said, we had a senator come out and at least share with us here's what your number looks like.
00;23;07;29 - 00;23;44;21
Speaker 1
So there's some underlying pieces there that–that highlight the importance of what both of you do year-round. Number one, you highlighted that the legislative session ended today essentially, and we are already in the budgetary planning session for the 2025 fiscal state fiscal year. But also, within that appropriations process, there's not only giving us the state appropriation, but also giving the agency the spending authority to administer many of the programs.
00;23;44;23 - 00;24;20;06
Speaker 1
So, there's–there's some heavy layers in there that we're working year-round. But also, more importantly, you mentioned senators and representatives coming out and being able to ask you questions, having your accessibility to you, availability of your time. So, let's talk a little bit about that year-round, that relationship building process and how when it comes down to those crucial 16 hours on a weekend, Alex, what role did relationships play for you as our legislative affairs director
00;24;20;06 - 00;24;23;15
Speaker 1
to be involved and be effective?
00;24;23;17 - 00;24;41;23
Speaker 2
Well, for one thing, it's just nice if you–when you're kind of–when you're sitting there and you've been sitting there for hours and nobody really knows anything, if you can get a hold of a little bit of information that tells you what your fate may be. I mean, it can be comforting or discomforting one way or the other, but at least you might get some idea.
00;24;41;29 - 00;25;15;25
Speaker 2
And I guess in theory, if you heard that something was happening that would–could be bad for the agency, at least at that point you could start trying to make some inroads to–to change. Change that. And as far as maybe some other bills go or, the relationships are important, not just for the information, but for…just having, I guess, quality advocates and things like that.
00;25;15;25 - 00;25;41;29
Speaker 2
And I think it really, like a fundamental part of that is something that I've thought about since Mr. Anderson mentioned it to me, I think, before I started working here. In the interview process, when he said the most important thing that we prioritize communicating anything to these legislators is always…always presenting the facts exactly as they are.
00;25;42;01 - 00;26;08;26
Speaker 2
And, just being being somebody that if legislator comes out and they may be speaking on behalf of one of our bills, they know that what they're saying is right, because, if you prove to them that you're not a good person to work with and they–they really don't have to work with you, so…they can stop at any time.
00;26;08;26 - 00;26;29;25
Speaker 2
But, you know, if you–if you can build a good working relationship, based on, I guess, mutual trust, then…
Speaker 3
Yeah
Speaker 2
those can go a really long way and that those people will–will…will do a lot to help out the, you know, the constituents of this agency.
00;26;29;27 - 00;26;30;05
Speaker 1
Mr. Anderson, did you want to add anything?
00;26;30;05 - 00;27;02;08
Speaker 3
Yeah. I was just going to say, yeah the–the–the political capital that we have such as it is, is the, the fact that legislators can trust us to shoot straight with them, to tell them, you know, exactly what the circumstances are, what the numbers are, what the facts are, and if they need something from us, a lot of times we get requests for information for certain pieces related to a piece of legislation or, or for our enrollment in a certain program or something.
00;27;02;10 - 00;27;27;17
Speaker 3
And it's crucial that we be responsive, but that we be accurate with those response–responses. I told Alex, I think also the first time he and I talked, I said, look, it's much more important that we get the right information to the people who are asking it for than it is that we just get something to them. We may take a couple of minutes, maybe a half hour longer, to make sure we have the right information.
00;27;27;19 - 00;27;50;02
Speaker 3
But if we always endeavor to give the right information to the people who are asking for it, that trust that we build, that turns into political capital, that if we have a tough piece of legislation that, you know, it's going to take, a little bit of management on the floor to get a majority behind that bill in both houses.
00;27;50;04 - 00;28;14;25
Speaker 3
We have friends, in the House and Senate who are willing to work with us, who are willing to manage our bills. We have several senators and–and representatives who, you know, who come to us and say, look, I don't mind¬–I don't mind sponsoring or, presenting your bill because you've explained to me why you need it and what it's going to do for your agency and for the people that you serve.
00;28;14;25 - 00;28;45;07
Speaker 3
And there's just no substitute for that. You know, you just cannot fake, and you shouldn't fake, you know, being completely honest and–and straightforward and if, if what they're asking for, we don't have we don't do we can't provide, you know, telling them that too. And with TANF, sometimes there are some proposals and we have to just say we cannot do that with TANF money with, child support.
00;28;45;07 - 00;29;09;05
Speaker 3
We have, you know, requests about different ways people wish we would do child support. And we have to be very candid and say, I'm sorry, sir, madam, the federal guidelines don't allow us to, to do it that way. And they respect that and they don't agree with it, but they respect it. If we if they know we're just shooting straight with them all the time.
00;29;09;07 - 00;29;36;07
Speaker 3
and, and that is, that's, that is just for me a non-negotiable. We're going to be completely accurate, honest and, candid in dealing with the legislature. And I have found in the four years I've been here, that has put us in a good place. I think we've made, like Alex said, made some good relationships. And, they, you know, they get a little, deeper each year.
00;29;36;07 - 00;30;00;13
Speaker 3
The more, you know, legislators feel like, yeah, we can trust that that that agency we can trust the leadership in that agency like we talked about, in our first podcast, you know, this Operation Restore Trust, it extends over there to the legislature as well. And we–we've got to build a trust relationship with them so that they know when we tell them we need something, we really need it.
00;30;00;13 - 00;30;11;09
Speaker 3
We're not just blowing smoke. And if we tell them we can't do something, we can't make something happen. They know we're not just trying to, you know, say no for the purposes of saying no.
00;30;11;11 - 00;30;37;15
Speaker 1
So, it's coming back to those core values of transparency, compliance, integrity, honesty.
Speaker 3
Absolutely.
Speaker 1
Again, you mentioned that–that key area, key time frame. Four years. It's taken four years to get where we are and we are still building and working towards…
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 1
better relationships. Again, go to new relationships that happen at the first part of the term.
00;30;37;17 - 00;31;03;01
Speaker 1
New committee chairs. We're–I think we're blessed to have had many of the same–of the same or, committee members that have moved up into writing chairs, but those committee chairs, they become–let's talk a little bit for you about how they become your advocates. Especially we had an experience early in the session this year with the joint session of the two committees.
00;31;03;05 - 00;31;31;02
Speaker 3
Yeah, we¬–we I think we have a new friend in, Sam Creekmore, a representative who's now the chair of the house Health and Human Services Committee. He invited us. He–he–he actually facilitated a joint meeting of the House Health and Human Services and the¬–the Senate Public Health and Welfare Committee. and, we had not had that opportunity before.
00;31;31;02 - 00;31;58;12
Speaker 3
We not had an opportunity to speak to our House and Senate committees in one–in one setting like that before. And Representative Creekmore, chairman Creekmore made that happen. And, I was really¬–I was really encouraged after our budget presentation, he came out and talk to me briefly and said, Bob, I think you presented the needs of your agency very well.
00;31;58;15 - 00;32;18;06
Speaker 3
He said, the way I see it is, you're doing a lot of great work out there in the counties, and if we can get you some more money, you can do even better work. And I thought, wow, he really gets it. He really understands what our agency is–is about. We're here to help families and, he wants to be a part of that.
00;32;18;10 - 00;32;25;23
Speaker 3
And he's been an advocate. I think he's been a good friend to us this session. We look forward to working with him in the next three years.
00;32;25;25 - 00;32;51;20
Speaker 1
So you mentioned, the work we do in the counties. We'll segue into the legislative agenda from this year. I will start with one of the bills that affects our counties and our ability to do that work. And so, Alex, I asked you the question, what were some of the bills that or what were some of the legislative successes for 2024?
00;32;51;23 - 00;33;30;21
Speaker 2
Well, we had several and, let's see…we had six bills signed by the governor, not including our appropriations bill. And yeah, to the point about the counties, one very important bill that they passed was, it's a bill that allowed us to enter into leases with County Board of Supervisors. So we can hopefully get one either–either better buildings or have buildings improved, you know, for our–for our county workers.
00;33;30;24 - 00;33;56;29
Speaker 2
So that would be a better place for them to work and better for the clients to come visit as well or have their needs met. And I'm gonna have to pull out a list because I'm not very good at remembering numbers. But that was House Bill 1030 and let's see what else we have here. We've got an–we've got one that, relates to child support.
00;33;56;29 - 00;34;30;10
Speaker 2
And it was House Bill 1102. This was one that, would permit our agency to use additional methods of communication with financial institutions. That just basically allows us to start or to not only use certified mail when, transmitting different, notifications to banks and such, you know, regarding child–child support payments, it speeds things up and makes things cheaper for the agency.
00;34;30;12 - 00;34;38;07
Speaker 2
you know, more dependable things don't get lost in the mail when they're just delivered straight into somebody's inbox. Secured inbox.
00;34;38;09 - 00;34;56;00
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 1
Wait. It’s 2024.
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 1
And we had to get legislation that allowed child support to submit paperwork. Whether it's a garnishment or some form of legal, paperwork to a to a financial institution.
00;34;56;00 - 00;35;21;15
Speaker 3
Yeah, yeah. And, actually, we had to be real friendly with the financial institutions because the bill says if the financial institution will accept our documentation by electronic means, then we can use electronic means. And, you know, we all know the old–the old psalm…bankers are conservative. They are the most conservative. And they like that paper, you know, they like that paper notice.
00;35;21;15 - 00;35;51;21
Speaker 3
But, you know, we do everything as a society, electronically these days. We do social media. We, you know, we–everybody has an inbox or three or 4 or 5 inboxes. And so it's just, you know, common sense for us to be able to communicate with banks by electronic means. But we did have to explain that, you know, there–we spend hundreds and I daresay, thousands of dollars on postage…
00;35;51;23 - 00;36;16;20
Speaker 3
on those communications with banks each…each year that we will save as a result of being able to communicate with them electronically. Now, I'm an old fraud prosecutor, so I got to talk about a couple of bills that I like. You know, we–we had built a good office of inspector general here within the agency.
00;36;16;22 - 00;36;45;24
Speaker 3
We went, three years ago in 2021, we got law enforcement authority for our investigators so that they could, you know, go out and execute, arrest, and go get search warrants that they could do real law enforcement work. Last year we had some ARPA funds, and we went and bought them all, brand new vehicles. What we didn't realize was, with–without specific, legislation, those vehicles had to be marked.
00;36;45;24 - 00;37;11;07
Speaker 3
And they said MDHS OIG. And yet these investigators are out doing fraud investigations. You know, they'd like to do those, you know, covertly without anybody knowing they're investigating. But we had to go to the legislature and get specific authority to remove that lettering from our vehicles so that our investigators could drive unmarked vehicles.
00;37;11;12 - 00;37;39;10
Speaker 3
But we were success–successful in that. The other thing we haven't been able to do, when we investigate cases that go all the way to, criminal indictment and a conviction, either by guilty plea or by, jury verdict…we're not allowed–we were not allowed, up to now to get investigative costs. And sometimes we spend hundreds or even, depending on the amount of documents we have to access,
00;37;39;10 - 00;38;10;03
Speaker 3
we've made spend a few thousand dollars investigating a case. One of the bills that we were successful in getting to the finish line and getting to the governor, and he signed it now allows our, criminal fraud cases an opportunity for us to recover investigative costs on those cases. And we take those costs and we'll put them right back into doing more fraud investigations.
00;38;10;05 - 00;38;35;01
Speaker 3
All, you know, toward the end of being more accountable, to the public, to the legislature, who, you know, gives us a budget every year for those funds that we're spending, the ones that are improperly spent, we're going to recover those, and we're going to recover the costs that we spent recovering the costs as well. Those are two good, law enforcement type bills.
00;38;35;01 - 00;39;08;19
Speaker 3
People don't think about our agency so much as one that's involved in law enforcement, but we do spend significant resources on investigating fraud in all of our programs, whether it be child care, whether it be the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, the SNAP program, whether it's TANF, one of the other things we got this year along those same lines, our, our, benefit recovery unit, which is our collection arm, so to speak.
00;39;08;21 - 00;39;39;23
Speaker 3
They've had the authority to recoup federal tax income refunds for overpayments, but we didn't have authority to recover state income tax refunds until now. And, thanks to some help from our friends at the Department of Revenue who shared a little bit of language to kind of tinker with the bill we had initially presented, we got that bill, all the way through to the governor, and the governor signed it into law.
00;39;39;23 - 00;40;13;00
Speaker 3
And beginning, July 1st, our benefit recovery unit will be able to offset state income tax region–refund to recover overpayments. And again, that's all about being accountable, being good stewards of the money that is entrusted to us to administer, and going out and recouping the money that's–that's improperly obtained because somebody didn't share all of their household income with us.
00;40;13;00 - 00;40;30;24
Speaker 3
So they didn't tell us about the, you know, the, the actual composition of their household. And they got more benefits than they were entitled to. All those reasons and overpayments occur in addition to outright fraud. And we do encounter, you know, outright fraud where people just don't tell us the truth.
00;40;30;27 - 00;41;01;03
Speaker 1
And we're going to cover that investigative process and the strengthening of OIG in a future episode. But forward-thinking processes from really three sessions ago, or two sessions ago have led us to now getting a bill passed, and it–but it could be a process like that. And so, it–in essence six bills passing through of the thousands that are filed, just having sometimes one bill make it through can be a successful session.
00;41;01;03 - 00;41;22;22
Speaker 1
But six bills. Congratulations, both of you.
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 1
For a strong, successful, legislative session. And as we're coming to a close of our time, I'm just going to open it up for both of you to give kind of your thoughts, closing thoughts on how the session went and, where we're going, and…I always throw the crystal ball question out there.
00;41;22;24 - 00;41;33;07
Speaker 1
Where do you see us going? It's going to be a shorter session next year. But where do you see the agency going legislatively and policy was. I'll start with you Alex.
00;41;33;10 - 00;42;08;14
Speaker 2
All right. Well, I mean, I got to say, I think it ended all pretty well. Six bills did feel like a victory. And they're all going to do…they're all going to do things, you know, to make this agency perform better, more efficiently, and I just I've got to say that next year…what do I expect is that we'll pass more bills that'll, help the agency perform better once again.
00;42;08;17 - 00;42;14;10
Speaker 1
A little Occam's razor there. Sometimes a simplest answer is the best, right? Mr. Anderson, your thoughts on the session?
00;42;14;10 - 00;42;40;05
Speaker 3
Yeah. I mean, we–we, you know, we started the session with really nine bills that we were pushing, to get six of those to the finish line, I think is, a wonderful session, particularly since it was Alex's first session, like you said, he was able to connect with the relationships we had already developed and to build on those–we have a couple of ideas for next year already.
00;42;40;07 - 00;43;13;26
Speaker 3
Couple of child support bills, that we will, you know, we'll go back at it. We've¬–we've, presented a couple of ideas. You know, we're always looking for ways to collect more child support for the families that depend on child support. And, we have a couple of ideas regarding casino winnings and, and insurance settlements that will not be a new idea the next year, but we're going to go at it again next year and, and hope we get, you know, either to the finish line or closer to the finish line than we did this year.
00;43;13;26 - 00;43;52;26
Speaker 3
But it's all about just, continuing, like you said Mark, to look for ways that we can do more for the families that we serve. And we may not set out with nine bills next year, maybe we'll…we'll, you know, look at 3 or 4 and not, push ourselves so much. But those 3 or 4, whatever we decide on are going to be important pieces of legislation that we're going to devote all our attention to trying to make them get all the way through for the governor to sign those into law next year.
00;43;52;28 - 00;44;16;28
Speaker 1
Well, I want to thank you both for taking the time to sit down with us, to let our listeners and hopefully, Mississippians know that we are dispensing the work of Indiana with integrity and transparency, with compliance to the rules, and that we're working relationships to¬–to help the families that we serve. And thank you for allowing me to share these moments with you.
00;44;17;00 - 00;44;29;15
Speaker 1
We hope you enjoy this episode. As we close out the 2024 legislative session. Thank you for joining us today on connecting Hope. Hope.