What happened to Pixar? (Lessons from WALL-E)

Is Pixar still as good as it used to be? Lucia and Ameera Wilson revisit one of their all-time favorite Pixar films, WALL-E, and explore why they believe it surpasses many of Pixar’s recent releases. What exactly does WALL-E do so well? And what might newer films like Inside Out 2 and Elemental be missing? Find out what they have to say!

What is Help Help We're Being Repressed!?

Join Lucia and Ameera Wilson each week for discussions about story in all its various forms, but primarily books and movies.

Help Help We're Being Repressed! is presented by Canon Press.

And the other thing that this movie, like Winx's movie, I think really good for kids just message wise is all the fat people Things being easy Really not always a good thing, but the fact that they put them on onesies or that they're using sippy cups your big babies And as you rely on robots and not you do nothing yourself But this is the world kids right now are entering and you look at these characters Kid doesn't want to be that right like that's lame The violence, the hurting system help help on being repressed Bloody peasant. Oh, what a giveaway. Do you hear that? Do you hear that? I'm on about do you see him repressing me? You saw it didn't you? Welcome back to help help were being repressed Hazal We today are going to be talking about Pixar Specifically Wallace. I was like one of our favorite childhood movies Mm-hmm iconic Which happens to be a robot romance Something you can't really do anymore. No, I would not be down for that anymore I'd be like no not interested. Yeah, first a bit of a throwaway comment that we both thought Is that the appearance of actual AI which we won't get into but I hate with my whole soul Not definitely had its effect on Fiction and fantasy Because the AI that we have is not the AI of sci-fi like they're different things Like AI as the term has been used in sci-fi refers to obviously artificial intelligence, but it implies sentience It's like a robotic sentience. I don't know if that's how you say it Sentience that feels like the right word. Yeah, that's how you say it great And then the current AI is not that obviously Though some people do get it confused thanks to the name Love it, but the appearance of actual AI suddenly gives a real life connection To anything in fiction so AI used to be a theoretical thing Theoretical but you also use it like very metaphorically and yep Where's like okay, so you can get to a lesson through this concept You can let use the humanity Yeah, it's like a humanity of a robot In a film did not mean robots were human was more used to isolate certain Ideas or features. Yeah, or just explore certain philosophies Yeah, and now it's a little bit muddled because we have a direct association. So that's kind of like Yes, so now when we do something on the air, yeah It's like okay, so now when you make this like a romantic situation between a robot and a person This isn't actually hypothetical Yeah, it's no longer hypothetical I never would have liked that to be honest in any old situation Yeah, but still it has a direct association with something in the real world that we dramatically disapprove of makes worse. Yeah But when it goes back to the olden days like the 2000 Ancient when we were we when When Wally is being made that is like obviously just an entirely different thing So that was just kind of a throwaway comment as we jump into this that it's like It's too bad that any kind of modern attempt at a similar plot would be like you know if you pitched to the film to me now I would be less inclined to enjoy But But Wally's bigotry yes Exactly because of my bigotry and my I was gonna say racism, but robots aren't a race so We're not gonna go there, but Wally's fantastic Wally is genuinely amazing Got a core of my childhood memories I mean, I feel like we kind of say that a lot where I'm like is building block of my imagination But my imagination it's really big so it had a lot of building blocks, okay She's like it's like that that to get foundation is wide spread. It's expansive Mm-hmm. It's got a lot of pieces in there, but Wally is one of them and it's a big why Lucia why is it a big piece so Let's kick it off. We don't get a Single word from our main characters until about 22 minutes in oh you count you jacked I did nice So it's like I think there are there's some sung words on the TV. Well, he makes noises first. Yeah, he goes Like whistles Yeah, but there's there's no words 22 minutes I'm like so how is it? That a couple of squirmy Ancied children were so locked in for 22 minutes of relative quiet Yeah, and it is without dialogue one of the greatest flexes of showdown tell In a kid movie that I think there is oh, yeah, cuz you just enter the world right mm-hmm, and it's fantastic It's like they have the ads, but yeah, you have the ads everywhere. You have the little Robock I'd go and around trash skyg scrapers Yeah, I mean for one is Kind of stunning visually which is funny because it's a trash world But they do a really good job designing it and then not only that they like take care in the perspective and it just It does not feel lazy at all. So you enter it I think you start in like a bird's eye view and then you drop in and then you're like with Wally and his perspective It's just great. It's fantastic the way they do it Yeah, and then the way that he makes his little box of trash yes, and then you zoom out and you're like heavens He's on the top of a skyscraper of those little boxes of trash Yes presumably made by just him because he goes by and all the other robots are dead. Yeah, so another show Wally, so it's like just Wally you have all the dead robots you have the skycraper trash You have all the ads and they're all for the same company Like it's the all of them B and L right what was it? It's like bit by and large Yeah, something like that. I think that's what it's all areas, which is amazing But then you also have him like grabbing the metal thing and like keeping it with him and making his own collection Yeah, his collecting little bits of trash the when you're obviously like he dances around to the TV He's collected like a whole box of just lighters and he doesn't like just a whole box of lighters and then he accidentally runs over the cockroach See that little I was watching it. I was like I feel like that's his little like safe the cat What makes him likeable is his Taking care of the cockroach and then just taking care of the trash Mm-hmm So it's a very funny contrast because you have the humanity that left this world behind and thought it was completely You know not worthwhile. There's nothing worthwhile in it And then you have the little robot who's collecting all the little bits and pieces of civilization as something to hold on to Which I was really fun. So it's one of those kids movies that has a lot of depth In ways that people don't Like they don't underestimate kids By just making a crap or having it very surface level. So it's just like Okay with you not getting it all yes, you're a toddler and but there's more to be found as you get older Yes, but it's still there One of the funny things was just how to find his character was like you already mentioned Without any of that dialogue So I feel like in a lot of modern film right you get the girl who's just like well no one likes me because of this and this and this and this and I just get told and I'm so distinct you know whatever her little like speech or whatever I'm not thinking of anything in particular here So I might be just slandering I haven't watched that. I was like I might be just slandering new cartoons, but This is like he doesn't have to say anything for you to know like so this is this likeable little funny character Well for me. I feel like He his character feels like a little Disney princess twist It's like little moment is that you talking to the cockroach because he's got its little cockroach friend and his hoarder's collection of fun trash I didn't think about that And he has his little song and dance as he dreams of love And while you're actually like so red Wally's a Disney princess little trash robot. See I always wondered what Disney princess I was You're Wally I'm a trash robot guys Okay, but the other thing that I've kind of noticed looking in this is where we visiting is That we used to have distinct main characters And I've seen people complaining about this people keep asking that we'd talk about book talk And maybe we will someday just we probably should vomit about it, but it will it will just be a great session for us Yeah, I did at one point here someone say that tropes are ruining books It's just because book talk is so into like here's all the tropes and my favorite tropes and the tropes And oh my gosh this trope and the the the books become like puzzle pieces of your Favorite cushy cutters you're like yeah, I like gingerbread men Yeah, and it's just that again, but this time he has scars Oh my gosh, I sure he has scars every time who am I kidding? but But it's just like the tropes, but it's you got a similar thing in movies where There is a system to making movies because movies are actually not Uh, well, it's a very specific medium It's you're trying to tell a visual story in this really short time frame And so yet there's a lot of different variations, but there is a form and a structure to it But On the flip side when you get way too into Structure you fall into this cookie cutter world Where you just have all your types and all your tropes And so it's funny because I was modern movies do both problems Where you have the cookie cutter tropes, but then you actually lack a little structure We threw out the structure of the medium and it brought in a ton of cookie cutters for characters Yes, and scenes But do you have any specific examples because I have washed a lot of new ones because I didn't want to yes, I do But I was looking over a movie of Pixar and we'll get back to like Wally specific and maybe Branch off because later on just wallying so we're sweating like so much because so wholesome When I was watching this I just started thinking about like what happened to our main characters Because in recent years we have leo Which is like anxious kid who's so different Elemental is very much a finding yourself girl Learned to deal with all our emotions turning elemental. I thought elemental the water dude was the main guy my wrong No the fire girl. It's a fire girl. Okay. Yeah I'm Turning red is a teenager with anxiety finding herself. Lucas a teenager with anxiety finding himself inside out too is a teenager with anxiety finding themselves Onward is a teenage with teenager with anxiety finding themselves and I'm like, why is it that I and don't get on me I know that there's minor variations to these. Okay. I know that not all them are exact the same But why is it that that's an accurate description for all of them? I also don't You guys ever well, I mean, I'm sure there's time and place, but generally I don't want to watch teenagers with anxiety Let's go back to The 2000s Pixar bugs life And you have You have a spazzy book slide is actually for the answer got villain is actually peaked like bugs life is actually an elite film that we got spazzy Creative type where he's just inventing at the speed of light That he's a non-conformist but desperate to actually help people And then toy story kind of weak, but with a strong personality. Yeah toy story. We've got our cocky leader cocky there kind of has a ton of sarcasm who's got Uh The first one is he's been threatened in his authority and his sway in this kid's life my positions at risk Monsters ink you have this absolute chat chat yeah, okay, Fair enough. Uh Who's just good at everything he dries top dog who gets saddled with a three-year-old And as to learn that everything he was doing is not Like something he should you know, yeah, finally out he's valuing all the wrong things fine thing Nemo if Controlling further super controlling father who thinks that he's doing everything right by his son And the son who's instinctively resisting his father cars. We've got another hot shot Being humbled incredible. So we've got the midlife crisis dad I was like that was fans out you're like midlife crisis super hero. It was also a fantastic idea. We've wally. We've got the curious But responsible loving trash robot Who collects antiques? Yeah, no he's just bursting with curiosity, but he keeps working just loves all Love himself. Yeah, yeah, even though he has a distinct character. He doesn't stop working He's just super responsible and he's driven by that responsibility But he really wants to find love he's a lonely boy. Yes, he is ratatouille We have a cocky inspired chef Where he's oh, it's like is that right? Yeah Where he's but who can't achieve his dream and has no method to he's really mouthy and determined to get his goal no matter what up We have the old dude The old grouch who's trying to achieve his dead wife's kind of a long list I know, but like just note how different all these characters are from each other I just don't know about a chunk of these. Yeah, if they're overlap sure But like none of these characters can be rightfully described the same one of the funny things is and I do think this is They're not cookie cutter At all, however, I think it was a more common thing to have that someone was proud and had to learn humility Yeah, we're learned to like serve others Versus insecure and learn to think about yourself. Yes, we switched lessons No, but even the ones who are insecure don't have the same Growth oh, yeah, no, because like Woody was insecure. Yeah actually because he was insecure in his like relationship with andine Whether buzz was gonna replace him. So there was definitely insecurity. It's not insecurities like something you can't deal with in film Yeah, but the insecurity solve wasn't think about yourself more. No, it's not love you It's actually like serve others or like you can also combo attack and this is something that's missing from a lot of modern once it's like brave is one Where she's doubling as she's got all her cockiness and parading about and her insecurities that she'll never measure up to this Perfection her mom wants of her. You know what's funny is that one of my least favorite ones and it holds up so well now and now I'm like Yeah, but you're better than oh this graph. Oh, so yeah still no definitely not my top movie From my childhood, but comparatively It's not that bad. Yeah, but it's fun. I also love her hair Oh, her hair's hair goals the animation is still flexing and the accents are amazing inside But the point is you look at this two thousands around two thousands lineup of Pixar And you've got so much variety and not all of those are great descriptions But some of that is because they actually can't be as concisely described I mean because it's not as it is not simple complex And they all have they're all different from each other But they also all have distinct flavors and behaviors So Versus just this Anxiety time so it's other thing, but it's it's like distinct flavors behaviors and then visuals Mm-hmm, which I really like the animation was not like I mean, it was just wasn't copypaste You know like the now we have our like everything's really soft Yeah, March mellowey. I don't like that up Well another commentary you give to the old ones is the fact that None of them look the same physically either Yeah, so you'll look at this lineup of characters and it's like they're all different styles Like some of them are Pixar does have a style, but none of the characters look the same They're in totally different settings that look different. They don't have the big snub noses and like the Yep, I will say this for turning red. I know a lot of people have really hated on the animation But I wouldn't have minded if it was just turning red because if you have a distinct style for one movie That's the style of that movie. That's great, but like why did that? It was immediately followed I actually don't remember which came first, but Luca turning red uh That one with the baseball Playing anxiety. I don't remember the name of it the baseball Yeah, it's a thing Eleo And even soul kind of looks like that too, but uh even the Onward a little bit. Oh, yeah onwards too. Yeah, it's they're not exactly the same, but it's like ooh that just got All of them are starting to blend together like most of those characters could be in the same movie as each other and it wouldn't stand out Well, when I forget which movie they're in that's kind of a problem. Oh, yeah, true But yeah, so wally 22 minutes in He doesn't get a word Eva and Like that's the first conversation from your characters I know that the ad talks and that's really good because you needed the context, but 22 minutes and little me was locked in I also think that was the personality yet. It was even a good touch to have him mispronounce her name Yeah, like just even like that little interaction There's just only like little details that you got in the film that people like just kind of skip over now Yeah, his little like wiggles of his eyes and like just all these little movements But like him just deciding like oh does the spork go with the spook? Yes, I loved that Where he gets at the spork and then just stairs at the fork in the spoon like uh Little things like that or little things like he gives her the Rubik's cube and you turns away it comes back and it's so fixed And he's like what I love that she can light up the light bulb and he can't and he's like what? He's confused But just like small little details like little but you really didn't have to put it in whether it's like movements or just like moments That make it so much better and feel more real when you have two little robots going around so it's like it's not real But it feels real yeah because yeah because of those little details also. I love Both of their introductions are amazing because obviously Wally we're talking about how much personality he shows immediately But like he's picking up trash all by himself Completely alone in the car. He has a cockroach Pretty sure you don't seem immediately though. I don't know, but you yes you do but I think the cockroach is okay But it's still robot all alone. It was so sad but ran over the cockroach Like luckily cockroaches are indestructible But yeah, luckily for us, but I mean your first shot is like Wally working like the good little boy He is in a world completely alone And then your first shot of Eva is you've got this beautiful shiny robot And she's flying around just having fun like so happy to be out And then he makes a noise and she's just guns blazing Well, she's very like put together Whenever when she's being watched Is very much the impression Very reactive but also like completely let loose I just was watching her like how fast she is to violence Yeah, you said it's really funny But it's also just a funny contrast with the like soft sweet little Wally Yeah, she's just they have a great dynamic. They're very very different But it works like wow Yeah So just Immediately so much Character even before you can describe them properly and fit them into a box as a character. There's so much personality there And I'll say another note on that on just main characters and the progress of main characters is I think we've commented before about there's this weird shift that we've made I say we like I have any responsibilities Yeah, I was like I'm sure I was not involved I would have disapproved vocally if people asked me in advance and it's this pivot from characters to admire the characters you relate to Yes, we've talked about so yeah, we've talked about this but when you look at those old Pixar movies obviously all of all of them that entire list that I listed all of them have Hardcore character growth None of those people are without character growth except like maybe Wally This will be like he's he definitely grows But it's just through circumstances. I think it's a little harder to note it actually he kind of got just like a little He like a little bit because in the end when he like she offers to hold his hand and he's like no and tries to get for the plant Yes, I love that because at the very beginning he's just doing his thing but even that From the very beginning he's responsible, but I'm just saying he is the least but all those others he doesn't know much and when you end There are characters you can admire So when you're showing your little kids Your little boys and girls At the end of the movie you want them to want to be like that Yeah, so and I think you want them to be selfless you want them to be strong you want them to be brave You want them to be humble. I also think that it's better if they have some qualities which you do also admire at the beginning Well, yeah, because they need to have potential. That's what the whole faving you the cat is It's like you need to actually have you want you want like ability at the beginning admiration at the end Yeah, that's typically that's typically where you want to go and that does show with Wally a bit uh, but we've made the strange pivot to Characters we relate to instead so when I've seen people Talk about like these new movies like turning red and the the defense is like, but that's how teenage girls actually are Okay, and I'm like, that's not how I want my teenage girls to be I don't think that's what we were like I haven't seen it. I some some teenage girls say this some teenage girls are but like similar like With like Luca or alia or turning red or any of these. It's like, but that's how we are And I'm like, but that's how we shouldn't be so movies are actually about they aren't yeah the point isn't affirmation and relatability Because he just like me for real. I'm like, I don't want that Here's the problem with having relatable characters, right? Because when you see people with relatable flaws It does not help no, it does not make you change. It's like, aha, you're just like me So if you're like, you know, on Instagram or whatever and you see someone joking about like Ha ha look at me wasting time or like procrastinating or like makes a joke about that And it's like And you see that that does not not all motivate you to go do something different and they go locked in No, you're gonna look at it and you're gonna be like, ha ha me too, dude now I have company and I'm not like It's just kind of a firm's bad behavior But I would argue that Wally is a great watch for kids because it is not even a little bit like that Because starting strong Wally is not just likable. He's admirable because He's first thing you see of him is working hard when what No one is there no one is watching And really when the top of quality is not actually possible for him to complete Yeah, like he's like he's working on something hard basically impossible Working alone working with no one watching And that's genuinely admirable And you see him prioritizing like he makes Lots of silly moves with evo Not always like 10 out of 10 IQ What do you mean that man at risk No, he was great, but like they weren't all the smartest moves you could make But he's like I'd go to statue of you Ha ha ha he was a solid dude the entire time But for one Wally's admirable because he works hard when no one's watching Then like you said when he's in danger When she's finally reaching out to him He prioritizes what's actually important not himself He also like goes through when we were talking about like the work that he does when no one's watching when either yeah Like found the plan yes And he's just taking care of her when she's asleep. Yeah when she's asleep And she finds out later when she has like this Akeer in the video is so cute the security video that was recorded of him doing it like standing in the rain with the umbrella Getting shocked by lightning and like all the little things It's a door of like but it's also like Yeah, he was doing it. She he wasn't getting any reward. Yeah, we're taking care of her Working for no reward Working because it's right But yeah, like you said when she offers her hand and he gives her the plant. He's like yeah, this is what we're doing And he's a very strong little guy and he's strong when he's weak So there's definitely value like we love strong characters Like we we love strong physically strong characters tough characters all about that But it's really great and it's really great for your kids to see Is weak characters being strong at the very end when he's with the one holding like the little plant Diner up and he's just just a little Can he just just the little trash can and he is crushing himself For the mission and you're like that's actually really good to see because When you're so dramatic if you think about it. It is but when you're a kid Uh lots of minor trials feel rather major And because I mean It's like you're a kid. I'm awfully small Like what do I do in the face of stares? It's like when you're little everything's big And so like little hardships are big when you're little And so sometimes good to see the little dude doing it. Yes So it can be really healthy to see the little guy doing it Because it teaches your kids to be tough And the other thing that this movie like makes this movie I think really good for kids just message wise Is all the fat people Actually the one of the like really funny parts of this movie to me that just Really cracks me out actually is the fact that they use all the pictures of like real people Yeah We just look like this now this is what the realist is where it's like no that's actually what we used to look like Like now we look like now we look like this So it's like the transition is now we're animated but yeah now we're animated and fat We've talked before when we were talking about like bugs Not bugs like I like planet or thought of all the documentaries Where you like your kids watching things that make them want to do things? Yeah Little kids are just they're taking it a lot So this movie of all all the video's the screen addicts In their chairs being like lumpy lame smoothies losers Is really great for kids I mean especially right now so the mission all the iPad kids is like regardless of any like you know I yeah AI developments Actually, I think that makes this movie more relevant even if yes Because it's just like So you look at all of the people who don't do anything for themselves And you have all of the like oh do you want to say that? Let us do it for you So I've talked to four people about one of my problems with AI I'm gonna talk a little bit about it I guess okay apparently is So I'm like we already have like phones right and the way that's affected everyone's memory And I so I know like sometimes you know Older generations will be like well in my day, but sometimes it's just correct So it's like when we're told by people who are like oh we used to have all of these things just memorize like phone numbers Like the amount of phone numbers you could have had memorized And now it's like well there's no need because I can just save it on my phone So I have like maybe two three phone numbers memorized you have three oh wait I really am not really like five I only have three you have five Maybe not maybe I remember my In your high library card number Look at you go, but like even things like facts where it's like so if I forget it I can just google it like I have this little magic box right here My teacher would call out my pocket computer because he made a new years resolution not to say phone Anymore yeah, he's a strange man, but yeah stuff like that But now we've reached a point where instead of relying on phones for simply memory People are relying on like chat for thinking So it's like okay, you look at the way in which phones and having everything super easy access Just all this information has many stop remembering things People just ask chat what should I do Mm-hmm, and I see people do this or this is like yeah, they walk into a situation. They're like phone. Oh, no help their first question Is like oh, I will ask chat And it's like okay, so it's yeah So you're no longer teaching yourself not to remember you're teaching yourself not to think but this is the world Kids right now are entering yes and growing up in so you want to show them like who do you want to be and you look at these characters And it's it's funny that this was relevant then and it's more relevant now is this kid doesn't want to be that Right like that's lame So it's like this fact kind of tear like and watching those characters how much they miss out on When it just just by turning the screen off Uh, the girls is just like one of the girls is just like I think she's married or something married. Yeah, it's married Yeah, you know like yeah, there's a basic white people name and she's just like I haven't even looked at the stars And she's like wow, we have a pool Yeah, like and the things that she was You know like she's Then they're forever But even with like you get that from the people, but you also get walley and his appreciation of all the little things Mm-hmm And he just loves his little stuff or the captain looking through the videos of all the things on earth and it's just so much better than this life Yeah, getting excited about it and it's like turns out the hard things like things being easy It's really not always a good thing. No, and also what I really liked about it and this is I don't know how much of this is like For this reason, but the fact that they put them on onesies Yeah, really Yeah, I was like I really emphasize that part of it where it's like okay, you're being or that they're using sippy cups Yeah, you're being treated like okay, so it definitely was on purpose They all look like babies in one of these drinking Big your big babies and as you rely on robots and Not you do nothing yourself basically and the quote of the movie is I don't want to survive. I want to live. Yes, very dramatic fact guy like Yes, but it's true. It's like they had they'd stopped Actually doing anything hard and anything for a while which is part of why it's a really good message for especially like You know, we got this all first world kids Where like it's actually very possible for you just sit there and do nothing And it's one of those things that I think a lot of parents weren't aware of because they didn't grow up with the dangers of like social media or Interment like because you weren't raised with it you didn't realize how much it was gonna affect your children And so you did get a lot of kids who are just online Like the chronically online like I mean a lot of millennials where it's like oh, you grew up The social media or you grew up. Yeah, disastrous But you see much happens So it's a good worse now So but it's what you said about the fact that it was unintentional for a lot of people who is unaccident Yes, I've seen Gen Z complaining Different Gen Zers complaining about like Gen X if your childhood was so good. It was so amazing. Why didn't you give it to us? Which is what a fair complaint or is they did Okay, that's actually because Gen X is childhood by all accounts that I've been told by my parents and others Was somewhat feral It's like the TV But it is are like do you know where your children are? Which is amazing, but it was feral, but the thing is There was a whole world out there and they didn't have and there wasn't a whole world on this great here You know, so they live this feral childhood and a lot of them sound like they enjoyed it a lot So they started to have kids made memories and so they went we're gonna give you the same thing we got and gave their kids this feral childhood Except they didn't take into account the fact that we have these now Especially a little pocket dimensions of evil Yeah But and so they just went have fun like I had fun except the thing is As people have pointed out before If you give the decision to children they will 100% make the bad decisions Or the easiest decision Yeah, so we got given the choice we didn't we had very active But us as a generation got that kind of feral like do whatever you want except there was the internet there Yeah, and so you did just have this nothingness available to you everything and nothing just sitting around Yeah, and so it's like you have to be more purposeful now as parents Yeah, you can't make sure you're king. I think you had to be I think you had to be purposeful then but the ditches were different The ditches of course. Yes, so it's like It's a good reminder for kids watching it like you're like oh we want to do things But it's also a good reminder for parents where you're like you're raising kids who have Well, depending on your Then you grew up with it's always very very different world And so world where you can ask things to think for you Which really makes it important that you teach your children to think Because once you teach your kid to think they no longer will want someone else to think for them Yeah, they're gonna get offended by the fact that other people want them to let a robot think for them I hate it so much I was yeah, so you this is a movie that it's a really good job of encouraging living Yeah But also doing the hard thing so when he there's this like little moment, right? And it's obviously it's a cartoon kid baby, so it's like yeah, it's funny, but it's also like okay. Yeah, this is Kind of deep where you have the guy find the plant and Well when Eva brings him the plant it's a captain and the plant is wilting And he's like oh no, and he's like wait. I know what to do I don't know brings it and gives it water and he's like you just need someone to care for you And they like phrases just like Looks at the globe looks at the world and it's like and he's like wow Phone in responsibility You're just like hey peace out. We broke this. I'm not gonna fix it Yeah, so that's that's another message of the movie. There's more than one fun times, but uh Is the fact that You need to do something right? It's also a fun part you don't get to see something wrong And not do something and that applies in tons of areas of life where it's like okay if you break it you fix it But also you take responsibility for things even if you did not cause So it's like I'm not that someone else broke it and left it and you're picking it up the captain in space It was what like 700 years yeah, he didn't break the art. It was not him But it's like okay wait, we have to take responsibility for this we still have to Deal with it because that's the only way anything gets better is if you take responsibility for things even when you did not do them And that's that's such a good message for right now because right now people are obviously allergic to accountability but Especially cases where it quote-unquote wasn't their fault Because as us at a certain point it becomes your fault So it's like you didn't start something you didn't break something you didn't set yourself on this road But you have autonomy And at some point you got to you got to do it You got to fix it you got to you got to step into unless you want to live like this forever and living Like this forever whether it's like any number of situations, but say it's this one The just I'm going to be an infant for the rest of my life But it wasn't my choice. I didn't pick this life. I didn't wreck the earth I'm like, but noticing what's going on and resigning yourself to it because you didn't start it makes it your fault It's like you're you're now doing it if you see it and you do nothing Congrats, you're a participant. Yeah, we love participation prizes Oh One of the funny things about that there's a couple other funny things about the maybe one spot that I really enjoyed that really made be think of Chat GPT or AI is when you pick up the book And he's like Manuel like absolutely Instructions relay instructions sometimes just get the menu well. Okay, I'm like oh shoot We really like that's gonna happen to kids where they're like read it to me Alexa Yeah, so real oh, I'm like, oh no read a book, please Learn a book Yeah, no It's a good one, but so the messaging is good several times ever, but this is part of why I'll add this on It's good to talk to your kids about what you show them Yeah, so I'm sure we've talked about this before, but like it's good to talk to your kids about it because A movie can have the world's best messaging And people can not notice and or ignore it Yeah, I do think here's it depends because yes, I fully agree another you stuck to your kids about it However, a really good movie like this one Like we already talked about shows things you want to imitate yeah But it is it also say like why you want to imitate that it's not just I'm not saying that everybody needs a full breakdown of the movie But their kids every time they watch a movie, but I was like, I don't remember having that like no there's there's an but that's because we got taught a way to approach stories Yes So it's not like I said, it's not that you need a full breakdown every time and like guys what is the theme like you don't have to do that with your five year old oh, but that's not um That's the old baby thing. Yes, you did that with the kids you babysit you're like no I have new issues with this bill eh No, but the thing is somehow they still like you we had movies that we talked about But we also had a lot of movies that we didn't talk a ton about But we had an approach like how we looked at stories And specifically we had it in our minds That stories are real and we're living a story Yeah, and so because we are living a story That made made movies in books a little more applicable than a lot of other people think of them It's like if I'm a character who do I want to be Who do I like who should I be more like who should I be less like and you kind of just got this applicability that a lot of people don't have because they don't Think of stories like that. Yeah, so That's kind of a thing that is learned Mm-hmm. So it's very easy. I've seen it like it can be actually kind of funny when you see people be really really into a story without Any kind of connection to their lives at all Not like it should be connected to their lives. It has very applicable things And they just don't think like that is when people love like a really like you know hardcore like underdog hard work story Yeah, like Lazy person you know Yeah, get up. Come on. Yeah, so there's you don't get to watch that Yeah, well, I've talked about this before it's like you can't there are certain things that you can't in good Conscience admire and not emulate Yeah, so you can't be really into a story where people stand by their beliefs and fight for their faith and refuse to be cowed or ashamed in public and then like be a whooess about your own beliefs Yeah, like you don't get to do that You fully can it just makes you it makes you suck but it makes makes you a whooess. Oh Yeah, but I'm just saying I know a lot of people that create a total and complete disconnect from stories they consume And their lives. Yeah, so this is something it is something that you do have to teach kids It's like do you yeah, like it's not the full Convo every time but it can be like who do you like? Like do you want to be like that character? Do you like and that kind of reframing in your mind or like who are you in your story or a big one is who are you in someone else's story? Yeah, that's always a helpful for me. You can see people doing like you're the protagonist of your own story No, definitely always helpful What can be helpful though is you're a side character in your little brother's story Do you want to be the nasty older sister or do you want to be the fun older sister? Yeah, it's like Because you're not just a protagonist you're a side character because we've watched the Incredibles so we know like What a sister can look like and it's like do we want to act like that to her brother? Oh, she's great. What's the problem? But yeah, no, there's a bit of a reframing but I do think that this one is one with lots of good messages for kids It's an excellent film and I would know I do think pretty It's so it's like for one just quality wise. It's great. Like good soundtrack the animation the soundtrack's great The characters are the characters the messaging the binoculars. I'm also like I don't think conservatives in any way should be put off because you have like Oh green messaging like take care of the earth because I'm fully for taking care of the earth Yeah, I might not agree with all climate activists because some of them are turkeys who are making crap up But having the message of like actually take care of called to be good stewards. Yeah, it's a real thing What you were given is completely valid. I will say it's it's kind of tricky sometimes like it's actually genuinely tricky to navigate But just because people are having a stupid argument doesn't mean that the topic is not a valid one to discuss Yes, so that's something with the green earth where I'm like y'all being dumb bunnies climate change being a good steward easy valid discussion and like how you can't you can't flinch away from the conversation just because All the people talking about it are kind of horrible You get a similar thing with like race issues or different cultural thing is just like there can be a valid discussion Where everyone talking is being an idiot, but that doesn't mean you get to ignore that there's a valid discussion Yeah Congrats. It's now you're calling to be the non-addiant talking about it. Always a fun role to play, you know, so much fun But yeah, it's It's a really good movie. It's a superb film in everywhere. No flaws a plus Do you have any things that you would change about it because I will say of course it's very fast and there are some things that are over some That's an hour 30 like yeah, and dick Which is actually something I appreciate it's got hidden movie science. Yeah movies have gotten longer. Is that just me? No, okay, it's fluctuated. Okay, so you can't say that okay No, okay actually it roller coasters. Let me fix that movies feel longer now. Yeah, cuz they're terrible So I have to sit there and I was just like I want to leave But when you actually like enjoy a movie it doesn't feel super long Yeah, but another thing I did after Watching this if I started going through Pixar movies and watching just to the first 10 minutes Hmm just for like pacing or openings look what were you looking at can you make me care about the character? That's a question because it's yeah when you're talking about things feeling long A big reason that things feel long is when you don't care You're like that's that's the biggest reason bad pacing features obviously But the biggest thing that makes a movie feel excruciating is if you just don't give a rip if I'm not interested in the person you're showing me Yeah, so I'm like okay, let's go through Pixar movies give them 10 minutes So obviously Wally passed with flying colors Nailed it you would change would you change you? Because I think I wouldn't I think I don't think I would obviously there's lots of things that are like little silly like the flack that When if you turn in space We're not talking about gravity We're not talking about science or the sound in space but I think all of that's totally fine for a kid movie the kid mind did not question it at all So I don't have any edits for that one. This was the golden age of Pixar and it was amazing But you have so much affection for Wally in that first 10 minutes. He's adorable like Very effective affection and like you pointed out it does have the little save the cat with the fact that he runs over the cockroach and like Squawks And backs up to be like are you won't see but I think a save the cat includes the cockroach But it also includes just his collection of things And the way he like it like stems. Yeah, he's doing love things Yeah Also him showing Eva all the things he's like behold my stuff Yeah, but how did the other movies? So let's just say Wally passed with flying colors. I'll go back and forth. I started elemental first 10 minutes of elemental Heavens Who that's that Okay I am afraid I did not put that effort into watch it for one it was like really hardcore tell don't show But the other thing is when we're talking about allegories the purpose like the fat allegories stories Fantasy fantasy and sci-fi and all that stuff has the unique ability to isolate messages By entering it into a foreign setting. Yes, we talked about that. We've talked about that before so Essentially the reason that's good is because you can remove all of your emotional baggage with the message And just look at the message, but you remove all real life things so like you look at the road You removed basically everything Like literally everything and it's just isolated just survival Yeah, and we we removed all distractions Mm-hmm But super cannibals and I think cannibals are pretty But just me though, you know you might be chill with them, but I'm like a little put off But It's just the fact that you can isolate and you don't need it to be that stripping you can do the Wally thing where it's an entirely foreign setting So you don't have you don't have any of your real life laziness To make you pity the characters Like all the lazy characters no you don't have any of that What's funny is Zootopia even did this better And I didn't really like I'm not a fan of Zootopia and it has itself some really bad propaganda in it But it did successfully isolate its messages and you can tell that because the whole predator prey dynamic you do not know Who in real life is the predator or prey Like it's it's not one to one with anybody I'm talking about Zootopia one I haven't seen too Oh But they've really isolated a situation By removing all association with real life other than just qualities Mm-hmm, right So we don't approve of all the messaging we actually disapprove of almost all of the messaging But it's But it did strip it of all The baggage of Reality which is what we actually talk about the message I think succeeded in making a fun movie Yeah, which but that's a little aside from I know but I'm like people don't do that anymore either But Little hand type there from elemental It was immediately one to one allegory with real life immediately So element city is felt like New York City Okay, as all the immigration boats are pulling up Okay, and fire is Asian Water is white Earth is Latin and air is black And it was just one to one Okay, well, that's also really stupid because like there's a lot of variety within those categories Yeah, I know but those aren't actually just like the per For patients and then the fire nation attacks No, but the thing is I Can not I could not escape my prior judgments as I watched the first 10 minutes Because every single thing that happened in the first 10 minutes. I was thinking of the real life political examples and arguments Okay, and so I'm like I'm trying to be fair, but I can't drop the baggage Because they made it one to one I think that might be one of the things that makes something So clearly propaganda yep is when it's one to one is when it's just one Well the other problem is you can't do a one-to-one fantastical allegory because you are pulling in elements that aren't true And leaving out elements that are true So like for example, we're leaving out the sheer amount of diversity Within those groups you're like no, we have dramatically Well, I didn't watch the whole movie. I watched the first 10 minutes, but we watched I haven't watched any of it So yeah, but the white people were like Ohio people But Just like Midwestern that's what white is guys Yeah, honestly a lot of the white stereotypes that here are just the Midwest And I'm like the rest of us exist too. I'm like the rest of us can tolerate spice Yeah, the rest of us love spice and flavor So Don't know what's with them, but So obviously it left out an intense amount of diversity, but it also introduced all of these extra elements lol Like the fact that fire burns feel like you just like the last your own speech. You know when you like in text Okay, I actually I do that like I've written like parentheses he he in papers and If I make up your paper grades, which is why I get great But they're probably amusing for me. I've had professors write little smiley faces by my puns, but Did they give you many of them? but Well like in the first 10 minutes one of the things that happens is these little Asian fire people Are trying to find a place to live in this big city and they're being turned away at every door because racism except no because they're literal fire And they're trying to room with people who are incompatible to fire like the first one they knocked on is a Earth person who's got like all these dry leaves over him and he's like ah no, no, you're literally gonna lie. I'm like you're literally fire so Especially since like their daughter actually like fire explodes periodically But I'm just saying it's like the one-to-one allegory made it immediately charged When it didn't have to be like we did not successfully isolate topics of culture discrimination in like Integration into another culture like if anything that we could have talked about with this Romeo Juliet setup was kind of failed from the get-go because it's so charged with real political discussion Yeah, even when the movie hasn't done anything like crazy yet. I'm just already like Feel myself automatically reacting Because I'm thinking of real things Yeah, the set you're not getting it. Yeah, so that's not great But the other thing is just that the the main characters Was the cardboard cut out immediately where it's like she was a hothead daddy's girl and that's it So like For the first 10 minutes. I'm like I have two descriptors And one of the things I've told you before is it's funny when you see a character and you're like immediate flavor before I have a description Yeah, so when you start f1 The first scene with sonny which is a great movie would you would fail to describe sunny accurately off of one scene However, you would like however, I do know sunny you know sunny because he was a Immediately distinct flavor and then you build up into his actual character And this is the opposite like a lot of current movies are Is you had immediate descriptions provided to you and no distinct flavor Yeah, so first 10 minutes of elemental did not pass first 10 minutes of brave did Nice, okay, which is funny cuz like I said Not one of my top ones It's like girl has a lot of growing up to do but like you immediately have Very distinct setting family dynamics and they're not over simple family dynamics So let me compare it to like Luca which failed you meet the mom Of Luca the sea monster and she's immediately like controlling anxious bossy restricting him from all his exploration and stuff and She's like no positive attributes Versus you meet the mom and brave where you would immediately have more complexity Is that the one where she like walks in and everyone gets quiet or is that later that's baller, but that's later, okay Well, I just mean immediately you see her being a super loving mom And one of the things that I noticed that I liked is that One of the first things that happens in the movie is that the dad gives Uh marida her first bow Does mom approve of that? Obviously not however mom does not disapprove of it in front of marida She tells marida to go off like chase your arrow and then she's like are you sure like confronts the dad about like you sure about this Yeah, and just that little detail of like we don't fight in front of the kid Like we're we're unified, but it's like you see her being a loving mom you see her being a very graceful lady And then you see her little elements of controlling perfectionist Well, I think Prioritizing or I think but you immediately have both you have good quality and bad quality. Yes, even the way she walks has personality Mm-hmm just the way they animated it Versus like that's another big thing thing with the old ones is really like movements having personality. Yes Right now I feel like people like animating spazes But just like the one type of spaz Mm-hmm, you know, I don't really know how to describe it. How would you describe it? Like Relatable Relatable. It's just like it's trying to be relatable everybody nervous like 80 HD. Oh my gosh 80 HD anxiety combo that's all the main characters right now That's all of them. Okay, so I mentioned you don't have 80 HD. You're addicted to social media like yeah, there's a difference You got addicted to dopamine. That's different than having a chemical dopamine deficiency Yeah, but uh Luca is knockoff little mermaid Unlike which is a superior version of a mermaid like there's a difference between hilarious twist on a character and a failed replication of a character yeah, so He's just uh No, I just that one's hard to describe because I don't like the animation at all Also that also if the mermaids are all that scared of humans. Why do they live on the shore? Like the mermaid is li- right by the shore Yeah, that one just left So little like I just just like oh no, I'm I'm anxious and so curious and uh, I like go away Yeah, like I didn't like him non-flavor. I didn't enjoy the movie at all It was just lame oh no, I think so different because I'm awkward It said every kid ever Any who we love movies that don't make kids feel special Uh, no rata toee. You'll get a feel the first 10 minutes Excellent first. I do is perfection that is also a movie with you are so invested he is the this This is like more variation is because he is the he's eccentric and really into Okay, no, there is very driven But he definitely bickers with his dad so hard. It's just hilarious. It is an almost perfect movie The one issue I have with it is it made me want to eat rata toee and it's not good and When I he found real rata toee it was extremely similar disappointment to I was like delight There's no meat. It's just a vegetable pile. It's a vegetable It was a real travesty like but no that beat at Remi's funniness It was he's immediately such a funny guy. Yeah, everything else about the movie perfect also like pretty anti-victim complex And I love a movie that's anti-victim complex because the whole thing is that you figure it out Like you do that you pursue your goals regardless of the handicaps You do not let where you started hold you back. It's like you might be a rat, but you can become a chef Anyone can cook so basically kids you can be rats and still succeed Anywho but that one is once again just so distinct unique flavor right off the bat Yeah Yeah, so any other films you want to mention I don't want here's the thing I've I could talk infinitely about Pixar movies have I been real but I'm gonna end on another bad one Because I don't want to I don't want to do it like a three hour long podcast No, no one was to this is another movie that I watched the first 10 minutes and I didn't watch the whole thing I watched the first 10 minutes of inside out too Oh my gosh We are you weren't fans of inside out one So I can't imagine number two going up heavens so I was oh Why is that I did not join you in this endeavor of watching evil films so well here's a thing you I already don't like the premise of inside out because it It tries not to but it does completely surrender accountability You've been controlled by your emotions. Yeah, the the whole setup of my emotions control me I'm like wait wait rational part. I'm a little rational dude Where am I right there like in eating out the emotions Like going on a spree literally literally where is reason Yeah, I want to berserker a reason and where okay a berserker reason is great like where is reason but um So we don't like the whole surrendering autonomy. We don't like emotions in control obviously we were raised on a feelings our liars Doesn't mean that all bad just you don't accept that they're they're never the boss. Yes, exactly So I might be good. They're just not there never the boss So we don't like that whole setup But it also just it ends up Really flattening everybody because Riley's really flat Because she's being puppeteered Right Yeah, so she's she's been actively puppeteered so she's just not a compelling character and then all The emotions are relatively flat Because they're all dominantly one emotion. So they just won emotions. It's like okay, so we have like obviously they do not keep perfect consistency with that Joy gets sad, which means she has a sadness in her brain right there's another control deck and we've got this crazy Russian nesting doll situation but But like all the characters are flat all of them and the other thing is just like It's yet another not what teenage girls need to hear Kind of thing same with turning our head and insecurity yeah like what What teenage girls need to learn is not affirmation their feelings affirmation in Okay, turning red themselves as you know maybe maybe we should talk about turning red specifically another time because I have so much fire to say about that Well, I'm shelving that because I'm shelving that But the inside out setup is like everything's so flat nonconvincing and non compelling unless you're a girl with a ton of feelings you want validated That's the kind of person this appeals to If you feel convicted I'm talking to you or something but We're gonna both genders women of both genders women of both genders love this film But it's the sort of thing there I'm like no but but the thing that killed me dead Killed me dead in this intro and this will be the thing I have to end on because I just have to diss it is She now that she's 13 she's developed a sense of self Is something in her brain With this little this little like nest of White thread said is her sense of self so is it like and you know accountability or know what hurt Yeah, this is when you get baptized According to some people not to sweet baptize babies um, yep, not like other people I personally baptize all the babies I'm baptized you okay good to do some great movie um So she's got this like white nest in her head That's her sense of self and you know what her sense of self is Quote unquote. I'm a good person And that is the worst thing I've ever heard in a movie in a long time I'm too calmed as for this white Her sense of self the core of her being Revolves around the idea that she is a good person Whew Do we even have to explain why that's terrible or can we just like Total depravity okay, but uh the other thing is I know that it advances a little by the end of the movie But it doesn't get better. I googled what does it what does it hit it ends up still being I'm a good person But it pulls in acceptance of all the other emotions too Like I'm not good enough. I make mistakes all of that like we're accepting all of it So you know little shout out to all the the Christian women of uh If you Feel touched by this you should know that The biblical answer to anxiety is to not adopt it into yourself of sense of self It's to burn it with fire You don't define yourself by your flaws Especially not by your anxiety which is fundamentally a distrust I also think one of the problems the made a lot of American culture is actually like a here's the thing I I like a lot of American culture and the way it's very it's very independent Marco and in that however there's a hyper individualism Which defines yourself by yourself and you actually cannot do that your sense of self shouldn't have any I in the sentence no You need it can't be it can't be I'm a good person, but it can't be I'm a horrible person either no Because it can't be all about you Because it's not about you. That's how you end up miserable and alone Or just a pain for everyone else to be around Right and with that we should sign off very well