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Join us as we take a deep dive into the real estate market with insiders in the industry.
Episode 029 Transcript
00:00:01:17 - 00:00:08:05
Michael Conrad
You want the leader to be drawing inspiring magnetism forward?
00:00:08:09 - 00:00:25:13
Aaron Joyce
I've heard it expressed as. Do you want to be a lighthouse or a tugboat? Are you shining the light? Are you attracting not just success, but the right people to the right mission?
00:00:25:15 - 00:00:50:16
Michael Conrad
Everyone, welcome back. This is the Business of Homes podcast. And I'm your host, Michael Conrad. I'm back here offering you an opportunity to sort of get inside people's heads, hear great stories about those that are currently making their way in the world of real estate here in Tennessee. I think that just simply the top layer of the story isn't enough.
00:00:50:17 - 00:01:07:16
Michael Conrad
That's why this isn't just the Homes podcast. This is the business of Homes podcast where we really want to get into the grit and anchor ourselves to what are you really doing to make yourself better? And so for all your listeners here, I hope that you're come to the table with your questions in your mind and your ideas, and maybe you'll be a guest one day.
00:01:07:16 - 00:01:31:23
Michael Conrad
But today we are fortunate enough to hear from Aaron Joyce, a guy that I've known off and on over the years as someone who is going to go out and he's going to make the world around him. What he wants is successful real estate agent. He's built himself a team here and there. He's done different things. And I feel like he's coming to the table today with a lot of perspective to share.
00:01:32:02 - 00:01:33:14
Michael Conrad
Thank you, Aaron, for being here now.
00:01:33:15 - 00:01:34:10
Aaron Joyce
Thanks for having me.
00:01:34:11 - 00:01:59:11
Michael Conrad
Yeah, but I can't help but just kick us off with this idea of our beginnings, where we start, how we get to the table. We're here today, but you've been in business, what, 11 or so years. You know me about the same. And kind of what gets us to where we are today or even what got us the beginning of real estate is always interesting.
00:01:59:11 - 00:02:29:14
Michael Conrad
It's just a it's a common thread we're constantly tugging on here because where we came from, what our professional experiences and how we're breathing that into our practice daily ultimately is going to be our version of a special sauce. I'm not sure it's totally 100% replicable, but I'm hoping to dig out of you some of those real world stories and experiences that led you here to a place where you have been satisfied with this career and continued forward and had ups and downs and even a little failure along the way.
00:02:29:16 - 00:02:38:10
Aaron Joyce
Yeah, I, I guess I started with failure. So from the beginning I was ready, willing and able to fall on my face and get back up and keep going. That's so.
00:02:38:10 - 00:02:49:08
Michael Conrad
Good. Love that. That's we're not good at showcasing failure in real estate. Heck, we're not good at showcasing that in our personal lives. So you started with that and that pushed you into real estate?
00:02:49:08 - 00:03:09:15
Aaron Joyce
Well, I just just got married at 39 years old, and on my 40th birthday, oddly enough, I got laid off from the job sales job I had been interviewing just before because I had told myself, you know, this is the year I move up or move on from this company. And so when I got laid off, I had turned down a position the week before, so I called them back immediately.
00:03:09:15 - 00:03:26:03
Aaron Joyce
I was like, Hey, my position's changed. I can start Monday. So I took that severance, which was about a 60 day severance, and went and started that other job. But from that day forward, I was focused on getting my real estate license, which was something I had thought about for a while up until that point. So.
00:03:26:05 - 00:03:33:21
Michael Conrad
But wait, why were you getting a job and then wanting to pursue a license? And how does that connect to that terrible feeling of getting?
00:03:33:22 - 00:03:58:17
Aaron Joyce
Well, I was, you know, getting laid off. I was totally out of control. Right? I was the top sales guy on the low level team, community bank team for a marketing company. We had financial products for banks and so it was up or out with them and then they force this out. So I was already thinking that. And, you know, you go through the 12 stages of grief, What's wrong with me?
00:03:58:17 - 00:04:10:00
Aaron Joyce
What's wrong with them? Screw them, you know. But in that I told myself nobody would ever walk in and tell me my job was gone. So I had been in mortgages in 0708.
00:04:10:02 - 00:04:11:11
Michael Conrad
Great time for mortgages, right?
00:04:11:11 - 00:04:31:16
Aaron Joyce
Yeah. So, you know, had that fall apart when I was a little bit younger and realized that that wasn't the side of the business I wanted to be in, I was always one of the top salespeople every bought everywhere I went, because I look at sales as more of a connection than, you know, a trick. And I was like, Let's go.
00:04:31:16 - 00:04:53:00
Aaron Joyce
It's time to take control of my destiny. And I hoped I thought I kind of knew that this might be the right path for me. So I got my license. The layoff would have been February of 13, was licensed by October. And that job I took the following week set a goal to quit by June of 14 and June 1st.
00:04:53:00 - 00:04:55:20
Aaron Joyce
I was out the door and never looked back. So nice. Yeah.
00:04:56:02 - 00:05:01:09
Michael Conrad
Did you use that other job as a bit of like financial buffer or leverage? Was that kind of the. Oh.
00:05:01:11 - 00:05:13:00
Aaron Joyce
Absolutely. I mean, you know, the one thing I think most people think is you're going to get into real estate and start making money initially right away. You know, I got my first lead and then I got more leads and slowly but surely built up that momentum. So.
00:05:13:05 - 00:05:18:01
Michael Conrad
Well, they think that now. But were they thinking that in 13? I mean, it was a little hairy back then.
00:05:18:02 - 00:05:37:22
Aaron Joyce
I just knew if I had an opportunity to connect with somebody, I could sell myself. Right. And I think leads is what I needed. So I joined a team. I honestly had no idea what I was doing or what I was. I remember I was so nervous and just wanted phone numbers or connections or a way to find somebody that needed my service.
00:05:38:00 - 00:05:48:06
Aaron Joyce
And so like I said, I started with one lead and it took me, I think, six months to close my first transaction. So February of 14, I was off and running with the closing. So yeah.
00:05:48:08 - 00:06:28:17
Michael Conrad
You know, you bring up a little aside comment there and if you don't mind going down a rabbit trail with me here, sometimes I think real estate agents get defined as sort of the conveyor of houses you are a participant in, in selling houses or are you a salesperson of this product, the house. And then the way you described it just then, someone looking for my service, this constant reminder that, Oh, you're in a service business actually, you're providing a technical and sort of varying level expert level knowledge or experience about this, and it is a service onto others that could not or cannot or will not do it for themselves.
00:06:28:19 - 00:06:38:07
Michael Conrad
And so which is it is are we selling products, particularly when we're listing agents or are we providing services? Like how do you think about that?
00:06:38:12 - 00:06:57:01
Aaron Joyce
I mean, you know, there's a couple of different ways to think about it, but the first is our value, which is I'm not here to sell you a house. I'm here to guide you through the process. In that process, there will be several people I'll need to introduce you to. And because I've been doing this long enough to have great relationships, I'm going to take the stress out of the home buying for you.
00:06:57:02 - 00:07:02:20
Aaron Joyce
I always tell people, you know, you're going to choose the house you love and you're going to lean on me to make sure we get to the finish line.
00:07:02:22 - 00:07:13:18
Michael Conrad
So that is that is so true, but also so tricky in reality, because sometimes people don't know what the house is that they love. Maybe until they've seen it, lost it and then seen the next one though, that one's it.
00:07:13:18 - 00:07:32:11
Aaron Joyce
Well, yeah, I mean, that's the you know, that hot market. But I would say if you have an asking tough questions, right, you can kind of get an understanding and then you show a few and you're like, okay, I get what they're feeling for, you know, I don't think any house is perfect. You're going to outgrow it or maybe overspend or whatever it is that they choose to do.
00:07:32:11 - 00:07:41:22
Aaron Joyce
But I think at the end of the day, it's a feeling and with the right person by their side, they can feel pretty confident about that feeling and going for it.
00:07:41:22 - 00:08:02:18
Michael Conrad
Yeah, I've heard people talk about that before. This this idea of the more that you question in an educational way with your buyer or seller to seek what they need or want, the better the relationship you know will stand and the better you'll be able to serve and the more successful you be able to be. And so then immediately my mind goes to, Well, what are those questions?
00:08:02:18 - 00:08:15:07
Michael Conrad
Can we write them down in a book? Is it so custom person to person, practitioner or practitioner, or is it. No, there's a codified general list of questions that if you asked, is your chance for success is just like massive?
00:08:15:12 - 00:08:33:21
Aaron Joyce
No, I think it's more about, you know, let's just talk about buyers. The buyer console, right? The first 35, 45 minutes is about them. Who are you? Right. I mean, you've got the LP mom and the location price, motivation, agent Mortgage, all of that. But that's to get the appointment. Then you really want to dig in. Well, why is that important to you?
00:08:33:22 - 00:09:00:13
Aaron Joyce
Right. I think that's a great question you should ask at every turn. You know, why do you want to be here? Why do you want to spend that much money? Is it about the monthly payment, the down payment? Is it about, you know, the school district yards? I mean, there's just so much to ask and everybody's different. So I think the connection, if you care, they're going to see that you care if you spend enough time to ask kind of questions and find out just a little bit about them, they're going to be comfortable opening up.
00:09:00:15 - 00:09:22:01
Aaron Joyce
And then once again, you know, my job is not to sell them anything at all. It's myself. You know, I always tell my team, look, you know, we don't sell houses, we set appointments. And in those appointments we're going to convey our ability to care enough, provide enough value that they trust us. And we're going to show them that we're going to be experts to get them to the finish line.
00:09:22:01 - 00:09:41:10
Aaron Joyce
Other than that, there's not much more you can do. So once again, it's about personal connection. And those questions aren't, you know, in stone perfect kind of scenario. Say this and you win. It's more like, who am I sitting with? And I really give and, you know, I care enough right now to spend 45 minutes getting to know you.
00:09:41:12 - 00:10:13:05
Michael Conrad
Love this idea that the agent becomes a successful framework that's around the buyer or the seller. Or maybe you might even say that there are like a strong and stable boat for the buyer or seller in which to both inhabit and power forward, and that your chances for success come from not you powering the thing forward, but from you giving them the chance to self educate self know self direct self choose.
00:10:13:05 - 00:10:35:08
Michael Conrad
I mean, that's the maybe the greatest moment is when the aide or the client's like, yes, this is what I want. We've uncovered it together. And so I like that idea. And it it's a, there's a larger conversation going on about agent value and agent service and agent pay. And when you talk about it in these terms, it I feel like it clarifies the conversation.
00:10:35:09 - 00:10:52:02
Aaron Joyce
Well, I mean, everything that's going on the market is not scared us one bit because we've always talked about value, right? We've always known what we bring to the table. Use the buyer rep agreement. You know, Mary, my wife, who's on the team, she will not show houses without a buyer up. The 3% fee has always been written in there.
00:10:52:04 - 00:11:17:03
Aaron Joyce
So now it's more about, do you know your value? Can we explain it? Can you convey that that value is worth what, maybe an extra 3% if they need to pay you now out of their own pocket? I think we can. I think we always have, and I don't think we're really scared of that. So as far as, you know, creating this new market or this new ability to have to sell 3% know it's about value.
00:11:17:03 - 00:11:27:13
Aaron Joyce
And if you see that I care enough and that I'm there for you, you know, hopefully they don't have to pay it. But at the same time, I don't think most people balk from that document when we put it on there.
00:11:27:15 - 00:11:46:04
Michael Conrad
So, yeah, the buyer's rep agreement is nothing new in Tennessee. We're one of the states that's better at it than most, but I have heard plenty of relatively new agents over the years talk about that fear of that awkward conversation starting out with that, you know, putting that paper in front and be like, we got to be steady, we got to go exclusive.
00:11:46:04 - 00:12:10:23
Michael Conrad
We got to I got to wear your pen, you know, And so but if it's about relationship and the relationship is the key to the success and the depth of understanding what they want, how best to serve them, that the relationship agreement, the buyer's agreement is setting the expectations early on. You know, and in fairness, I'm not going to say that the buyer is stupid or the seller is stupid, but they just don't know what they don't know.
00:12:10:23 - 00:12:20:12
Michael Conrad
And if they don't know how to self structure the relationship, which is likely, then it's upon us as practitioners to help structure the relationship for maximized success.
00:12:20:14 - 00:12:29:05
Aaron Joyce
That's right. And you know, we're going to do a lot of work, put a lot of time in without any guarantee of pay. Right.
00:12:29:07 - 00:12:43:18
Michael Conrad
Which I don't love. And could sway me easily into a conversation away from commissions and into fixed rate services because I don't love the roll of the dice that is very much present in real estate. I don't love it.
00:12:43:18 - 00:13:04:04
Aaron Joyce
Yeah, that roll of the dice, though, starts to disappear. I mean, when you're ready for opportunity and you've practiced your ability, do you know your 32nd elevator pitch or your value proposition? You know you're going to lose a lot less at the end of the day, I think it's like 74% of people will hire the first agent they meet.
00:13:04:04 - 00:13:24:06
Aaron Joyce
So you just have to be prepared to be the first to meet with them. So always set the appointment and to with your value proposition in a confident way that conveys care and professionalism. And more than likely, you're, you know, it's less of a roll of the dice and more of a you know, I would say it's more than 5050 that we went.
00:13:24:06 - 00:13:43:04
Aaron Joyce
I know if I meet with somebody and I go through my buyer's consultation or if I happen to catch them at an open house that I can, you know, feel confident that if they don't choose me, then it wasn't something I said it was either they were already locked into relationship. Yeah. Or, you know, just for whatever reason, we didn't have a connection.
00:13:43:04 - 00:14:10:05
Michael Conrad
So, you know, that 74% statistic is a funny one because there's another terrible statistic about repeat usage. Yeah. And so you might want to make a full joke out of it. We would need to say, well, then the tiny portion of a buyer or seller is brain that's dedicated to like longevity of relationship of agent is is not working correctly in some way because they keep thinking that every agent they now meet is the first agent they've met.
00:14:10:06 - 00:14:12:06
Aaron Joyce
I would say. Yeah. And I would say that's.
00:14:12:06 - 00:14:13:23
Michael Conrad
The key meeting. The first stage is that they keep.
00:14:13:23 - 00:14:29:08
Aaron Joyce
Adopting the next one. They may Well, that's the tricky part about building a long term business. That's, you know, because all of a sudden you go from, Hey, I'm an agent and I did X, I made a living right, doubled my business and I added somebody to staff. Now I've got more agents, which I have to support, right?
00:14:29:08 - 00:14:53:22
Aaron Joyce
This would be building a team over time. Connectivity with your past clients gets like, Oh my gosh, hard, right? I think in 11 years we're somewhere six 700 pass clients and you know haven't always been great at keeping up with them. But at the same time it's always a focus, you know shoot, it's been six months now. I got to re re introduce myself, you know.
00:14:54:00 - 00:14:56:19
Michael Conrad
Or you want to be the new second introduction.
00:14:56:19 - 00:15:14:03
Aaron Joyce
Of course. Yeah. That's a good twist on it. And we're lucky that we get a lot of repeat referral business. But now I focus on listings. I'm like, Oh, wait a minute, When these listings sell, if they're not buying, they're not going to repeat, right? So there's just always another layer of connection that you have to think about adding.
00:15:14:04 - 00:15:30:20
Michael Conrad
I think the roll of the dice that I was sort of commenting on earlier is has more to do with things that are outside of our control. I think you rightly say that if you put the work in in the relationship building and you know what you're talking about and you've got the depth of experience and knowledge, then know that piece.
00:15:30:20 - 00:15:55:07
Michael Conrad
Your piece isn't a roll of the dice, that you have controlled it to a certain extent, but there's a lot of market condition, there's a lot of personal matters that go on in people's lives that prevent us from always having linear success with the efforts we put out there. You know, people, to your point, are making choices that have nothing to do with me, have nothing to do with my success.
00:15:55:07 - 00:16:04:04
Michael Conrad
The quality of product or service or my acumen has everything to do with bad timing or it's unfortunate, unfortunate circumstance.
00:16:04:06 - 00:16:04:11
Aaron Joyce
For.
00:16:04:11 - 00:16:19:00
Michael Conrad
Them. Yeah. And so that roll the dice again. Time back to earlier this idea of I always want great practitioners who provide great product and great service to be well-compensated. Yeah, sort of just like a basic understanding of the world that I like.
00:16:19:00 - 00:16:48:09
Aaron Joyce
I think, though, you're not wrong about the roll of the dice. I guess what I was saying more is if somebody who's maybe newer or hasn't found success yet or is wondering what the trick to the business is, is listening to this, I would say consistently focus on your value proposition, that ability to sit across from somebody and gain trust and explain why they need to work with you and then hustle to be the first person to meet with them when they're in the market.
00:16:48:09 - 00:17:03:08
Aaron Joyce
Or a few months before. I always say to people, Look, would it make sense for us to sit down even though you're not quite ready, put a plan together so that when the time is right, I can be the agent you choose. And that's just a question. They won't say no to it. Well, yeah, that makes sense. You mean.
00:17:03:10 - 00:17:08:21
Aaron Joyce
And if you do that early and often, you build a pipeline. And if you build a pipeline, you can build longevity.
00:17:08:23 - 00:17:22:04
Michael Conrad
This early adoption of relationship allows for an element of forecasting and sort of spreading out of your work, which then creates long term success so that you can pour back into the first thing that got you where you are.
00:17:22:06 - 00:17:22:17
Aaron Joyce
That's right.
00:17:22:17 - 00:17:52:10
Michael Conrad
That's good stuff. I want to dig in a little deeper to where you started us off today and this idea that we fail forward sometimes if we're lucky, and that failure is a piece of it. I heard recently that baseball is a game of mistakes and failures is described to me this way, and I love it. And I loved being able to teach that to my ten year old son, who was struggling with his own grappling of mistakes and failures in the game.
00:17:52:12 - 00:18:14:02
Michael Conrad
And I said every person on the field or at bat is going to either make a success or failure and one person is going to get a success and one person's going to get a failure. And so if you're the guy who's making success, somebody else getting a failure and sometimes you are the guy getting a failure. And so this adoption and acceptance of failure as normal or a learning opportunity is no surprise to us.
00:18:14:02 - 00:18:37:17
Michael Conrad
I mean, this we've heard this part of the conversation. So I want to know where you took this experience of like, no, that's not going happen to me again or no, even the first things I did in my business didn't work. And I've got to start over again. Give me give me some concrete examples from your early career where you were leveraging that, because honestly, the more we normalize this part of the conversation, the better.
00:18:37:19 - 00:18:38:22
Aaron Joyce
In real estate or.
00:18:38:23 - 00:18:39:15
Michael Conrad
In real estate.
00:18:39:15 - 00:18:47:13
Aaron Joyce
Yeah, I mean, something that just popped into my head was I saw the yellow book, Yellow Pages, like, right. You know, I moved here as a musician years ago.
00:18:47:13 - 00:18:49:13
Michael Conrad
You all know what that is? A Yellow Pages.
00:18:49:13 - 00:19:13:08
Aaron Joyce
Yeah. No, most people probably don't, but that was the first experience I had in the professional world, I guess. And I really learned there that you don't take objections personally, Right? Beautiful. It's it was always about more information. Now, believe me, I didn't believe in that product one bit. So it was really tricky to be super excited about going back in and re pitching in.
00:19:13:08 - 00:19:36:08
Aaron Joyce
But you know, it's a request for information when a client sits with you, and especially if it's a I guess they're not a client yet, but a prospect that you've just met, they're wanting to know, you know, what is it about this person that's going to make me walk out of here feeling good and once again, the objections are always going to be the same, right?
00:19:36:09 - 00:20:07:01
Aaron Joyce
It's either time or money, Right? And at the same time, trying to get to the bottom of that to uncover their needs and motivations and then turn that from maybe doubt to a win. It's just always been fun for me, like a game, treat it like a game. But failure, I mean, from investing into Zillow and the Realtor.com leads, you know, where you get on this this wheel, this hamster wheel of, you know, it'll just need one.
00:20:07:01 - 00:20:24:07
Aaron Joyce
It pays for everything. And then all of a sudden you, you have a team or taxes and all sudden one deal turns into you got to have four or five. So now you're answering the phone and your life has just taken a massive turn for chasing the phone call. The prospect or just showing up to open the door.
00:20:24:08 - 00:20:54:09
Aaron Joyce
Yeah, but learning real quick. Whoa, This is not the life I want. I failed. I'm getting deals, but this is not working. And then turning that off and then turning the ship around to being more about relationships. I think that was one that I learned early on. It's like I've made some of the best friends I've ever had through real estate transactions that I started out as Prospect, and next thing you know, we're having dinner with these folks and several of them.
00:20:54:11 - 00:21:10:22
Aaron Joyce
So I think, you know, the failure is always, what did I learn from this opportunity? Win, lose or draw. And when you lose, you can either let it beat you up, right? Or you can you can turn around and say, okay, that didn't work. And I need to learn quickly not to do that again.
00:21:10:22 - 00:21:17:13
Michael Conrad
Yeah.
00:21:17:14 - 00:21:43:10
Jake Hall
Hey, everyone, it's Jake, director for the Business of Homes podcast. I hope you have been enjoying today's episode, starting with showcasing failure in real estate agents being a successful framework around a buyer or seller, and the difference between closings and relationships. When we return, Michael and Erin dive into real estate being a team sport. Questions to ask when joining or creating a team and top down team culture.
00:21:43:15 - 00:22:02:18
Jake Hall
You don't want to miss it. Don't forget to follow us on Facebook and Instagram @thebusinessofhomespod, where you can interact with us and see some great bite sized pieces from all of our episodes for you listeners out there. Did you know our entire podcast are filmed and are on our YouTube channel? Check it out next time you want to see our amazing guests tell their stories.
00:22:02:20 - 00:22:21:05
Jake Hall
And are you currently watching this episode in video format? Don't forget to follow us on your preferred audio streaming service to take us with you on the go. Lastly, do you have any feedback or one to suggest someone for the show? Email us at thebusinessofhomespodcast@gmail.com. Please enjoy the rest of today's episode with Erin Joyce.
00:22:21:07 - 00:22:31:09
Jake Hall
Let's get back to it.
00:22:31:11 - 00:22:58:21
Michael Conrad
I'm aware that one of the failures that is common in real estate is that we're failing to convert the people that we know into true believers and users of our services. And I go back to what you just said. This idea that we we got to know what it is that we're talking about, be passionate and confident in it and give people a reason to believe in us.
00:22:58:23 - 00:23:24:22
Michael Conrad
I think that we've we've found ourselves in a place a little bit where we're obsessed with the idea that we're indispensable, you know, and that if we're just present in the sphere, that it will be a natural fit for someone who likes us enough. You know, you get so many friendship points that they'll say, well, you're you are this person that I need, you know, and you are my friend, you know.
00:23:24:22 - 00:23:57:07
Michael Conrad
And I think that we need to we need to give people a little tiny smile on the corner of their mouth when they think about us and say, oh, man, they really know what they're talking about and they're passionate about it and they're dedicated it and they're kind hearted and they're knowledgeable and they have a deep bench of resources and a great Rolodex like they need to be aware of all that can be offered by someone with all these services instead of just being aware that you are this profession of some sort.
00:23:57:09 - 00:24:20:22
Michael Conrad
And that's, I think, a big difference is that we're not doing enough to go beyond just touching the sphere, but into educating. And I love that idea of you know, going to them before they're ever in need and just being like, let's just preload the gun here or reload the machine or whatever the charge is. Yeah, you know, and do you, do you find that that is being trained at the brokerage level?
00:24:20:22 - 00:24:24:14
Michael Conrad
Do you find that's in the conversation? I mean, this is a relatively new idea to me.
00:24:24:15 - 00:24:37:13
Aaron Joyce
You know, we're pretty busy nowadays, so I don't have as much time as I used to to connect with people the way I want to, because that's like my thing. I just loved it, right? Like, most people don't like calling leads. I loved it. To me, it was like I knew I could nail potential new friends. All right.
00:24:37:13 - 00:25:10:13
Aaron Joyce
And make a friend see what happens. And at the end of the day, I think we're studying leads. They say when somebody pushes that button says call agent. You know, they're 12 to 18 months away from buying, even if they're hey, meet me at the house. I want to buy. Now, you still have to be able to maintain that relationship through a you know, let's call it a 90 day process potentially if they don't buy that house or if they do, maybe it's quick and easy, but that doesn't happen a lot these days.
00:25:10:15 - 00:25:38:08
Aaron Joyce
So I was always prepared to say, look, let's put a face with the name here. Let's sit down and walk through. You know, you create a problem and sulfur X walk through some of the process so that you know exactly what you need to do and exactly how we can get you ready. Put a strategy together for the next six, 12, 18 months so that you're confident not only in my ability, but who I am to put me on your team.
00:25:38:10 - 00:26:01:01
Aaron Joyce
So I think for their team, well, our motto and this is trademark, by the way, is real estate is a team sport. So you're natural agent. Real estate is a team sport. So part of, you know, the conversation is, look, when we put you on our team, you know, we we made it. You know, we're going to do everything we can to go to bat for you as a fiduciary, as a friend, to get you in the best possible position based on your needs.
00:26:01:03 - 00:26:22:13
Michael Conrad
And I got to be worried about royalties here. I think real estate is a team sport for a lot of years. Holy cow. Oh, yeah. It's it's so true. It's so true. And it's a it's a team sport in more way, more perspectives than one. Yeah, you're kind of related. You get the idea to the client of I'm on your team and we all have to work together to get to the goal.
00:26:22:15 - 00:26:29:14
Michael Conrad
And sometimes I've spoken about it is that no one gets to the goal if we're not all on the same team. Well, the universe.
00:26:29:14 - 00:26:46:19
Aaron Joyce
And the team too, is like, you know, I'm going to maybe start the conversation, but somebody else might show the house or the listing coordinator might schedule and be at the photos. And then, you know, you've got our transaction manager who's going to run the process and then, well, then, you know, you've got your vendors that might be on the team.
00:26:46:19 - 00:26:58:16
Aaron Joyce
So we're on the team together, you and me, buyer and seller. But there's a team behind us that's going to support this. I mean, there's just so much in so much depth, but the conversation starts with the lead.
00:26:58:20 - 00:27:25:08
Michael Conrad
Right within the team. Yeah. Okay. So 100%. Yes. And this idea of team isn't exactly universal real estate. You know, tip of the spear or real estate agent from afar appears to be an individual. So there's a lot of representation, both the fake representation on Instagram and the real representation out there that is a solo operator and that cloudiness of what's behind that.
00:27:25:08 - 00:27:41:21
Michael Conrad
So operator, you know, hasn't always been clear. And so when you talk about this, I love it because now we're getting into the meat and potatoes of business is that you don't really have a business if you don't have a team, you don't have a business, you know the process, you don't have a team, you don't have a business.
00:27:41:21 - 00:28:04:09
Michael Conrad
If you don't have repeatable product quality, right? And so as you start to say, Oh, well, there's all these people that are on my team and they're helping us achieve this success, I love this. And so how did you get there? Because you didn't just start Just Add Water team. In the beginning you said, Oh, I saw these uncles or I saw these people who were real estate agents and I wanted what they had.
00:28:04:11 - 00:28:08:23
Michael Conrad
What were you seeing that was face value versus what was real? Did they have teams?
00:28:09:04 - 00:28:25:11
Aaron Joyce
Well, I think, you know, as far as what their businesses were, I never really dug in. I just saw their lifestyle and that was real estate. So it was like, okay, that's interesting. As far as the team model, you know, ten years at Keller Williams, the INS and outs of how to build a team, if that's what you want.
00:28:25:11 - 00:28:44:02
Aaron Joyce
I mean, you don't have to, but there's definitely a way to put that together. Great training but I believe and did from the very get go I add your natural agent and all of that set up. Before I had actually left the team I was on because to me it was a it was an assumed sale. Hey, this is Aaron.
00:28:44:02 - 00:29:04:18
Aaron Joyce
I'm your national agent, right? So anybody that joined our team could be your Nashville agent. My Nashville agents. Kind of the initial reaction before they realize, Oh, wait, that's a brand. And so it's not about me. It's about me caring enough about the people we bring on the team to try to get them to where they want to be.
00:29:04:20 - 00:29:28:06
Aaron Joyce
And that doesn't always work. You know, we don't always align and value, but at the same time I remove myself from it immediately. You know, as far as Aaron Joyce Realty or, you know, smart, whatever it was. So I always kind of thought bigger from the get go. Like I want to create a business. I don't want to necessarily be hustling till I'm 70.
00:29:28:08 - 00:29:46:13
Aaron Joyce
And so that's what we're working hard to do, is really build a platform for people to come in, teach and train them a value system and an ability to connect with people so that they can grow their business. Now, the thing with agents is most of them want to go grow their own business, so you have to constantly be ready to kind of add to your bench and add more people.
00:29:46:13 - 00:29:51:09
Aaron Joyce
But once again, it's it's really not about me. It never has been. Hmm.
00:29:51:11 - 00:30:00:16
Michael Conrad
Okay, so case in point, you want to people want to start their own businesses. You were on a team? Yep. And you were already thinking, I want to start a team.
00:30:00:17 - 00:30:25:21
Aaron Joyce
I kind of outgrew the team pretty quick. Year one, I was the number one sales guy. Year two, I was helping to manage that team and the number one sales guy and I don't really feel like the value or the vision was there to make us kind of partners. While I help that team grow so pretty quickly, it was like, Man, I need to probably go somewhere in order to really accomplish what I'm looking to do.
00:30:25:23 - 00:30:32:23
Aaron Joyce
But I did go to this person and say, Hey, you know what? It's going pretty well. We should partner up and I've got some great ideas. And they.
00:30:33:00 - 00:30:33:20
Michael Conrad
So you did do that?
00:30:33:21 - 00:30:50:12
Aaron Joyce
Oh, yeah. Yeah. And they were they didn't really want to. Less interested. Yeah. Which is fine And believe me, I was nervous when I left when we, you know, kicked it off. But it's the best thing that ever happened to me. Same with getting laid off. I would have never done any of this if I hadn't actually been fired.
00:30:50:14 - 00:31:17:07
Michael Conrad
Nice. I love that. Okay, so for our listeners here who are themselves looking at should I join a team, how what questions do I ask? Who or maybe start a team? What were some of the questions you were asking at the beginning when you were joining a team? What is it that you were looking for that was going to give you place Tribes Security knowledge resource.
00:31:17:12 - 00:31:19:15
Michael Conrad
What are the questions you were asking to join a team?
00:31:19:15 - 00:31:23:20
Aaron Joyce
You know, honestly, I just wanted let's.
00:31:23:22 - 00:31:24:22
Michael Conrad
Give you the leads, right?
00:31:24:23 - 00:31:46:12
Aaron Joyce
No. Well, and I think other people or you know, people may look at that differently. For me, I understood what the lead was because I'd been a salesperson for so an opportunity to connect with somebody and kind of learn the process. I really was ignorant of or, you know, I just didn't have a general understanding of what it was I was getting into.
00:31:46:14 - 00:32:07:02
Aaron Joyce
I just knew that I could connect with people really well on the phone and and in person. So I have to admit I really didn't know what I was doing or why I was doing it. I just was like, Real estate sounds good. Do you offer leads? Cool, I'm in. But I would say now that I'm a little bit older and wiser and smarter, I would say, you know, culture is important.
00:32:07:04 - 00:32:31:04
Aaron Joyce
Who am I working with and how to their values align with mine. I think, you know, networks important. Does this poor person have the ability to walk in with or without leads to connect with their own people and create kind of their own business outside of what we're going to do to help them support themselves? And then I would say just, you know, you've got to be willing to do the work.
00:32:31:04 - 00:32:48:01
Aaron Joyce
I mean, you got to have so much opportunity to really make a living in this business. You know what ten to get five, We would always say, like, if you want five deals, you got to have ten because they're going to fall out. Or so I think just a you know, a general knowledge of what do I really want?
00:32:48:02 - 00:33:03:23
Aaron Joyce
Start with why, you know, why do I want this? Is it really, really, really what I want? Because, you know, you're going to be on your got I want are you going to be doing open houses on Sundays when everybody's hanging out? You got to be hitting the phones. If you don't like cold calling, that's going to be tricky.
00:33:04:01 - 00:33:16:21
Aaron Joyce
You've got to go above and beyond and just decide that whatever it takes, you know, real estate is going to be what I devote at least the next 18, 24 months to just to get out of the water.
00:33:16:23 - 00:33:40:03
Michael Conrad
And that's okay. I mean, I'm hearing to distill it down, I'm hearing that one of the base level questions you got to ask if you want to join a team is does the team genetic makeup look like what I want or need? And I'm not even going to put any judgments on it. If you're more relaxed person, you want a relaxed real estate life, then you need to be on a relaxed team that's not going to like hound you in for, you know, this or that and other.
00:33:40:05 - 00:34:08:18
Michael Conrad
And so if by by contrast, if you want to really pole vault yourself forward and use a big leveraging tool, then you're going to need to be on a team that's bringing you high structure, high challenge, you know, high requirement for success. So that's kind of a layer one. I'm hearing you dry out and then also to culture, but I want to dig in a little deeper that because, oh gosh, the number of podcasts and books out there are on culture, you know, God knows even what that is.
00:34:08:20 - 00:34:29:08
Michael Conrad
And so give me a sense of like, give me a couple touchstones here of like what you think bad culture looks like. Or by contrast, give me a couple touchstones what good culture looks like, because it's hard to recognize culture until you're like, in it, and then you're like, Wait, this is the culture, and I know what it is that it is good, bad, otherwise, whatever.
00:34:29:13 - 00:34:32:05
Michael Conrad
And so seeing it from afar, how do we recognize it?
00:34:32:07 - 00:34:51:06
Aaron Joyce
I mean, I guess I could talk about my own personal experience building a team and doing it wrong the first time where the culture was. I can't imagine what some of the people in my team thought when they looked at me because I was just grinding right like I'm sure it was. That looks like the absolute worst time ever.
00:34:51:06 - 00:35:11:05
Aaron Joyce
He might be making money and he but he looks hot. He does not look happy. Right? And so I would say it starts with the leader as the leader, you know, fulfilling a life that they want. Right. Or do they appear to be happy. So it's always going to be top down. But at the same time, you know, it's a vision.
00:35:11:07 - 00:35:34:03
Aaron Joyce
Is everybody on the same page to accomplish things together and individually? I know for us, once again, because of what you know, we don't have to go into it in depth. But the covenant thing with my family, you know, I had a complete realigning of my values pretty quickly, although I was on a search for it. You know what comes first?
00:35:34:05 - 00:36:08:02
Aaron Joyce
Just with Keller, it was God. Family business is the way they aligned it. Why was business family not much God in there? Because I just thought if I just work my ass off and I make plenty of money, my family's going to be fine. And, you know, really quickly that day out that that was backwards. And so a realignment of my personal values, which is, you know, my spirituality, my connection with gratitude and, you know, kind of not trying to control everything, letting it go because it's all going to be all right.
00:36:08:02 - 00:36:31:07
Aaron Joyce
You show up, you do the work, the results are come has actually made my family situation better, which is eased up. My ability to show up at work more present and more friendly and less like drive drive, drive. And now it's about them. You know, when somebody joins my team, what is it you want? Because I know how I can put a plan to get you there, but it's up to you to do the work.
00:36:31:09 - 00:36:49:16
Aaron Joyce
And when I check in with you, did you do the work because you said this is what you wanted and here's the plan we put together. So it's really not about me. Now, on another level, right? Because I know what I did to get what I wanted and get to a place that I thought I wanted. And then I got there and realized I had done it all backwards.
00:36:49:18 - 00:36:59:21
Aaron Joyce
And so now I really do just want to pour into the right people who culturally can help me, help them get where we all want to be. Yeah. Does that make sense?
00:36:59:21 - 00:37:10:05
Michael Conrad
It makes a ton of sense. I love that. I'm I'm so aware and resonating with what you're saying. This idea that the leader is not going to drag you anywhere.
00:37:10:08 - 00:37:13:15
Aaron Joyce
That's right. I was dragging everybody everywhere the first six or eight or so.
00:37:13:15 - 00:37:39:09
Michael Conrad
This maybe if that's happening, that's bad. We should not see that you want the leader to be drawing inspiring magnetism forward to the place, wherever it is you're going. And so maybe one of the first markers of good culture is that is a cohesive identity in a team rather than a loose affiliation of individuals. That bad culture is lack thereof.
00:37:39:09 - 00:37:51:14
Aaron Joyce
Well, I've heard it expressed as Do you want to be a lighthouse or a tugboat? Mm. Right. So are you shining the light? Are you attracting not just success, but the right people to the right mission?
00:37:51:16 - 00:37:54:10
Michael Conrad
Right. Not cajoling and pushing and, you know.
00:37:54:11 - 00:38:00:20
Aaron Joyce
Yeah. And once again, I did that for years just thinking, man, these people just don't know what they want. We're Get there. Just come on, keep go and pick up. You know.
00:38:00:23 - 00:38:30:17
Michael Conrad
It doesn't work. Also, this idea of and I think that each successive generation I may or may not each the younger generations the grand scheme of thing are more aware of the mixture of life being not just work, but also family and community and spirituality and meaning and fulfillment and gratitude. All these sorts of things where we're better at that conversation than we've ever been previously in humanity.
00:38:30:19 - 00:38:48:23
Michael Conrad
And so I think maybe looking for a culture or a team that is even open to that conversation is even talking about those words. So they even have the language for that, because that's something that I've been trying to build in my companies. Is that again, like you said, where are you going? How can I help you get there?
00:38:49:01 - 00:39:13:23
Michael Conrad
Because the more that I can create a success environment for you to reach your own goals, the better that you will be able to serve within this environment, which will give great product quality to our clients, but also great satisfaction to all of us. And then maybe, just maybe, if I'm a participant in helping you achieve your goals, like we'll get a chance to work together for a lengthy period of time, which is which is sustainable and good, you know, as an employer long term.
00:39:14:02 - 00:39:38:13
Michael Conrad
So that's new. And I somehow still shocked that every once in a while at a coffee shop or something, I'll hear someone talk about the terrible bosses or terrible culture that they have. And I'm thinking myself, does that so exist? But no, it does. It very much does. People are still shackled to these bad work environments out of fear and anxiety, and they're populated with managers and owners that having these conversations, which is a shame.
00:39:38:15 - 00:40:00:14
Michael Conrad
And so maybe one of the things to look for if you if you listen, are here, are looking for a team, it's saying speak to the leader. Speed of the pack, direction of the leader, direction of the pack. Is this person going the direction I want to be going? Are they going to be able to lead parentheses to inspire, not drag me to that end?
00:40:00:15 - 00:40:23:21
Aaron Joyce
Yeah. I think once again, there's enough business out there and you know, one person can't get it all. Even a team won't get it all. But if you can help each other get somewhere higher than you are today, you know, through a joint conversation about achieving together, then you know, you're on the right path. Zig Ziglar said it best.
00:40:23:21 - 00:40:42:03
Aaron Joyce
You know, help enough people get what they want. You'll get what you want. And so I think if you apply that to team ownership or team management or building a business, you know, you should be bringing people in that want to buy into and help you build culture values and hit a goal. I mean, you got to have a goal, right?
00:40:42:03 - 00:41:06:07
Michael Conrad
So as we sort of come to a close here, the world around us is introducing an element of the unknown. And while you say that you are unafraid of the future and I love that confidence, there is in all of us an attempt to forecast through the fog. And so you're building this team. You're looking ahead at where we've been in real estate, where we're going.
00:41:06:09 - 00:41:16:03
Michael Conrad
What do you think real estate is going to start to look like in the course of the next five years? And that may or may not affect you, but it's going to affect somebody?
00:41:16:05 - 00:41:38:22
Aaron Joyce
You know, that's a great question. I think once again, I haven't even stopped to consider it because if it ended for everyone tomorrow, well, that's tomorrow, right. And I'll be affected by that, then I really have stayed focused on and with our team, we know our value. We are not scared to present and ask for the 3%. We've been doing it since the beginning.
00:41:39:00 - 00:42:01:07
Aaron Joyce
So if the industry changes that much and you know you're starting to see some reduced cost commissions already on listings, then we've either got to do a better job giving more value, stating that we do give more value than the average agent or negotiating that end, because at the end of the day we've earned it. And 3% is just a standard that we live by.
00:42:01:09 - 00:42:20:09
Aaron Joyce
So, you know, I really don't know. It doesn't seem that I buyers really work that kind of faded. I know that was a big industry scare tactic here a few years ago. You know, at the end of the day, robots aren't showing houses like we thought that was going to happen. I really think it's about a personal connection.
00:42:20:09 - 00:42:33:00
Aaron Joyce
And do I trust this person to start this conversation with me, guide me through the process in a way that looks out for my best interest? Give me to the closing table. And you know what? That was a great experience. I'm going to refer you people. And of course, you you've earned 3%.
00:42:33:02 - 00:42:48:13
Michael Conrad
Erin, thank you so much for being here. Thanks for having me. I really love your perspective. And I think that you lay down a lot of good stuff for folks who are listening here to take you into their own business right now. If you guys want to get a hold of Aaron, ask him questions about his team and his experiences.
00:42:48:18 - 00:43:07:23
Michael Conrad
Check the shownotes for all the contact information. And of course, check him out on all the socials to keep up with what he's doing. Thank you so much for being here. We love hanging out with you guys and hope that this is continues to be just a better and bigger part of your business as we're fueling the questions and providing little nuggets along the way and hope you stick with us.
00:43:07:23 - 00:43:15:00
Michael Conrad
Hit subscribe and we'll catch you next time, everyone.
00:43:15:03 - 00:43:36:23
Jake Hall
Jake again, director for the Business of Holmes podcast. I hope you've enjoyed today's episode. A huge thank you to Aaron Joyce for being a part of the podcast. Go follow him on Instagram @ajoyce24 and let him know how much you enjoyed their story. Don't forget to subscribe on your preferred listening platform and make sure to follow us on Instagram as well @thebusinessofhomespod
00:43:37:01 - 00:43:46:08
Jake Hall
Do you have any feedback or want to suggest someone for the show? Email us at thebusinessofhomes@gmail.com. Thank you again for listening and we'll see you soon.