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Students share honest dialogue about love, relationships, dating, and sex on Michigan State University's campus.
(Anthony) When conversations about sex arise, sometimes people only hit the surface
(Elle) with us, we're gonna dive deeper.
(Anthony) I'm Anthony Brinson.
(Elle) I'm Elle Fromm
(Both host) and this is the Going Deeper a podcast.
(Anthony) So hopefully some of you guys came with us for Episode Two. Hopefully by the time you're hearing this episode one had been published. And for this episode, we have the love and sex reporter of the state news, we felt it was only right to get her on early for the show's beginning, and I'll let her introduce herself and she can go from there.
(Hannah) Perfect. I'm Hannah Holycross. As Anthony said, I'm the love and sex reporter this semester at state news.
(Anthony) Yeah, and we're very excited to have you we were talking a bit off the mic just by like, is this your first time being on a podcast which you didn't met? Remind me that you on Episode A Houselights are earlier in the semester. Just real quick to shout them out. How's that being on Houselights? We're live.
(Hannah) Oh, it was so fun. I love Liz because she's just everything she says is just hilarious. So being on the podcast was just so fun. So just like having like, a one on one conversation kind of where we're just kind of like I almost had to stop myself from just breaking out laughing half the time.
(Anthony) Yeah, I love Listen, I love Houselights. So shout out to them. But with that being said, Do you want to start us off with the questions? Or
(Elle) Yeah, so the love and sex beat is new to the state news. This is the first year has ever existed. Correct?
(Hannah) So it actually existed. I think um, as far as I know, Hannah Worley was it last fall, and then PJ Pfeiffer was it last semester? I'm not sure if it was before then or if she or if Hannah was the first one or not.
(Elle) In my defense. I was not here last year completely. I was before you said that. PJ was it? I was gonna say do you have to be named Hannah? Sorry. crazy coincidence. So but it's still relatively new. It's yeah. Okay. So what I'm, what dusk isn't? So its culture, its culture does. Okay. So tell us a little bit more about what it is. So how many stories you write what type of stories.
(Hannah) So I feel like it's a very much of a wider variety than people may think, you know, I cover stories about relationships. But I also cover a lot of stories about things happening on campus kind of related to that. Self love, self care, also have a lot of like reproductive stuff, too.
(Anthony) Definitely understandable. And we were talking a bit off the mic. Before we started recording just what led you to wanting to be this love and sex reporter and then how's your experience been so far? Being six reporter?
(Hannah) Yeah. So I kind of had an interest in it last semester, because a lot of the stories PJ was writing, like, I was always so interested in stuff, like I was like, Oh my gosh, like, I wish I could write about that. And so like, I can remember telling people every now and then like, Oh, I think I want to be loving sex next semester. And so over the summer, working on summer staff, you have a lot of flexibility. I wrote like a lot of feature stories. And when I applied for the fall semester, Morgan reached out to me and asked if I would be interested in the beach, she thinks that was was something I would be good at. And I was like, of course and I went like right into my notes app. And I had like, all these ideas just like a big lesson. I still have ideas I haven't used yet that I wrote down right when she texted me. So definitely, like just being able to like come up with stories on hand. Like, it's definitely like a beat that comes easy to me. I feel like
(Anthony) that's great to hear. And I had asked you what was your favorite story you wrote so far, you were telling me about your PCOS story. So if you want to kind of shout that out and describe that,
(Hannah) yeah, so I just finished writing that story a few days ago. And I was really proud of that story. Because it's a topic I feel is very important and isn't talked about enough. I had talked about it with my hairstylist over the summer, kind of like, how she handles it. And like I didn't know a lot of stuff about it, like I had heard of the condition before. But I didn't know just how severe and like, like day to day some of the symptoms are and also that there is no like definite cure for it. And some of the treatments doctors will give patients for like don't even work half the time. So I like personally really wanted to dig deeper into the condition itself and kind of like also how it's overlooked in the health care industry. And like kind of how it kind of collaborates with how women aren't taken seriously sometimes by doctors especially with like reproductive or uterine things. So definitely doing the story. I learned so much about the condition and like 70% of women who have PCOS, PCOS are on like undiagnosed. Wow. So the story was very eye opening.
(Elle) For those of you who might not know PCOS is polycystic ovary or either polycystic ovary syndrome or polycystic ovary Orien syndrome, which is,
(Hannah) so it's a hormonal condition, where you frequently get cysts in your ovaries, and it can also affect fertility in the future. And some common symptoms include like harsh periods, cramps, abdominal pain, acne, and sometimes even facial hair.
(Anthony) Wow. And if you guys are interested in that story, definitely check it out on the state news.com. And with doing reporting on that story, and the stories you've already done, in general, I want to x, how has it made you more knowledgeable when thinking about like sex and love and just being more open to talking about those things and reporting them?
(Hannah) Yeah, it's definitely helped me grow as a reporter, especially going from like being an environment, I was the environmental reporter last semester. So it's kind of like a drastic change. And the thing I really love about this B is the personal interviews I have with people, because there's some stories I haven't released yet where I talked about, like changing your hair after a breakup, and I talked to a girl who kind of got her hair cut, and like got it dyed, darker after breakup. And just like, being able to have personal conversations with sources is very like eye opening. And it's very, like opened my eyes to the way people handle things, the way they take care of themselves. And like, it's kind of made me realize how important it is to put yourself first, and almost all situations regarding love and sex.
(Anthony) Definitely understandable. And do you have anything you want to add?
(Elle) yeah, I was gonna say you mentioned earlier, self love. And that never would have occurred to me, like when I think love and sex, I don't think of things like that. So that's, that was a definite blind spot for me. But yes, I mean, self love is obviously love, too. So that's, I think that's a really important addition.
(Anthony) Yeah. And I'm glad you added that aspect as well. And speaking of which, we asked off the mic if you are in a relationship, and you told us that you are so and I know you mentioned, he's a bit private, your boyfriend. So however much you want to share about your relationship, just shut her mouth and talk about it.
(Hannah) Yeah, so I've been dating my boyfriend for almost a year now. And I think the best part about my relationship with him is he is my best friend, but in healthy way. Like, I feel like he's always my support system. And one thing I love about him is he always has my back. But he's never afraid to call me out about things like he will always support me always like love. He always put up with my long rants, stuff like that. But he will always like, let me know like, Okay, well, like, here's another way you can think about the situation like, sometimes, you know, I'm always like, I'm always writing me for real. And he'll be like, Yes, you are. But here's another way you can think about this. So that's what I was like love about him, because he's literally my best friend. He's the first person I go to, to talk about things. But he's just like such a healthy support system, I feel like that's so important in a relationship is to have that person that you can just be authentic around, and just be able to feel like you can just tell everything to and there'll be no judgment.
(Anthony) And that's one of the best things of being a part of a relationship I know me and l talked about in our intro episode about just like, having views about love and just being like going from our relationship that didn't work out to now meet someone who like you feels like your other half. And I want to axe you with being in this relationship. What advice would you give people, whether they're in a relationship, or not just from a girlfriend perspective about just being in a relationship, and then getting in a relationship after a bad experience, like that transitional period as well?
(Hannah) Yeah, so one thing that's like very cliche, but that I will really emphasize is that communication is key. And you also need to also understand that sometimes relationships are a learning experience. And my boyfriend and I will always learn from each other new things like every day about, like, how we want to be treated and how we want each other to treat each other. And I feel like you just gotta take everything like okay, people make mistakes and kind of move on because I mean, obviously, there's certain mistakes and relationships you shouldn't move on from. But with communication, it's, I feel like communication can just help you like, move forward and like better your relationship. And like, that's why I feel like my boyfriend I've been able to keep our relationship so strong and so healthy for so long is because we're just always so honest with each other not afraid to be like, hey, this upset me. I'm not mad at you. But like, I just want you to know this.
(Elle) There's been a lot of talk recently because there's been a, an increase of, I'm not sure if that's statistical or if it's just more recent stories of divorces in Hollywood. And people have been talking about how, oh, when you marry somebody, it's a commitment. You never walk away from that, like you can't do that. But I another perspective was that people grow and change together. And sometimes you you do outgrow a relationship. Maybe it's I think it was Hugh Jackman. 20 his wife of 27 years. Maybe it's you know, a few months but you People grow and change together. And I mean, I think personally, I think you can fall out of love just as easily as you fall in love. Really? Could you expound upon that a little bit more? Sure. Yeah, I don't think love is a constant state. Okay, because there is, this is another cliche, but there's a difference between loving someone and being in love. Yeah, so oftentimes, when you're in love with somebody, it's near the beginning, well, hopefully not like super beginning. But it's earlier on in the relationship, you have this rose colored glasses, you're infatuated with somebody. And that doesn't always last. But hopefully, it gives way to just loving somebody who they are understanding them. And then you will experience moments where you do fall, you know, people talk about falling in love all over. Like that's on anniversaries, or just maybe random things they do. And that's so beautiful that I do think people fall out of love all the time. Because the only thing you can predict, with 100% certainty about somebody is that they will change. Life throws so many curveballs at us, we go through so much. And to say that one person is going to be by my side throughout all of this is just unrealistic. Because people's goals, change their expectations, change their situations change. And as that continues, you could grow apart just the same way you could grow together and stay together. So when you talk about keeping communication intact, I think that is very important. Because like I said, people people change.
(Anthony) Yeah, that's definitely just reality, like whether it's ends up in a good or bad quote unquote, way. Like you said, and I'm I don't think we can get a chain guarantee is that people will change. And I want to act with you mentioned that, Hannah, I want to ask how do you maintain a sense of self in a relationship, like not being too dependent on your boyfriend, and still being able to be Hannah, outside of just like, your boyfriend, whatever his name is, girlfriend,
(Hannah) that's such an important question. Because that's something that's so valuable to me, because I am very, I value my identity, and I value my independence so much. And that's something that, like, I always get scared of with relationships is that like, I'll end up kind of losing myself. And then like, when that relationship ends, I'm just kind of left to scramble. And that's the thing with my boyfriend is he very, let's like, he wasn't like, let me but I'm allowed to like, I just can be my individual self. And like, I'm a very busy person, and I have a job and a sorority. And he's very understanding of like, you know, I'm not always going to have time for him with certain things, and there'll be weeks or I'll be busy, but I can always still feel like I can kind of put myself first and put like, my independence and my individuality. And he's like, never intimidated by that, or gets insecure by that. And that's one thing that's like really healthy in our relationship. And like, same thing goes for him, I will always support him if he has a goal or something. And if he needs to go out and do something, go do it. Because I'm very heavy on individuality.
(Elle) Could you tell us more about you said you're in a sorority? There are I think, a lot of misconceptions, a lot of stereotypes about sororities like I don't know if you've ever seen the TV show Greek. My roommate, and I love it like we are obsessed. The love story between Cappy and Casey, like I won't get into it, but it's a very good show. But it changed our perception of sororities a lot. Yeah, people make assumptions. And sometimes those assumptions are valid. Sometimes they are true, but like my, my cousin's wife was in a sorority. And for reference, my cut there, they're both lesbians. Well, her wife is bi, but that's not something people expect from sorority girls. But she had an incredible experience. She still keeps in contact with her sorority sisters, and I've never been in a sorority, but I do have two sisters. So tell us a little bit more about the love and the sisterhood that you get from your sorority.
(Hannah) Yeah. So I kind of fell victim back in the day to kind of like looking into those misconceptions. And it made me scared to join a sorority. But my mom was my mom was a Sigma Kappa here at MSU. And she's very, like, just give it a try. And so I ended up CO being my sorority. So it goes that mean, yeah, sorry. It's like a whole different language sometimes. So it means continuous open bidding. So I didn't go through formal rush. I ended up dropping formal rush because I got very nervous about it. So this Rotterdam and theta after formal rush, they still needed more girls. So they announced that they were going to do continuous open bidding. So I went on like a date with a senior in the sorority and she kind of interviewed me but it was a very genuine conversation. And I felt like I could be very authentic with who I was. And she was like very honest with me about what the sorority was like what they value And so that kind of made me feel very safe. And that's a big reason why I went with beta. And I'm getting a bit and I joined. And it has been such a great support system for me. My sorority sisters are always so supportive of all all the things I do, like, they always will come up to me be like, I read your stories like that, they'll always give me ideas, especially with a love and sex beat, because I live in the sorority house. And girls are always like, oh, you should do a story on this for like, I have this friend you can talk to. So it's very nice to just have like, a sisterhood with people who support me. And I feel like my sorority itself is just full of very, like ambitious girls a very, like push each other. So I feel like it definitely like kind of breaks that like stereotype of like, Oh, it's just all Party Party Party.
(Elle) And that's a regional thing, too. Because I know sororities here are not the same as sororities downtown. Yes. They, every Yeah. It like I was saying like I know, in I know Wayne State can't have sorority houses, because Detroit has really old laws on the books about brothels. And like with the number of women, the way that it works is that it ends up basically banning sorority houses, essentially, which I think is a little bit funny. But sororities differ regionally. And I think that it's safe to say they might not be as intense here as they are down south. Because I know it's, it's a it's like a I know there's documentary about it. Like it can be a lot down there.
(Hannah) Yeah. And we do do a lot of work. Because historically, sororities were very discriminatory and stuff. And we do do a lot of work we do we do a lot of seminars on focusing on how we can improve our recruiting system to be more inclusive and like, kind of just focusing on like, how can we turn conversations, like, instead of like asking a girl like, oh, like, what were you involved in, in high school, because like, some girls might not have been able to join tons of clubs, because they had to work long hours to help pay their rent for their family. So like, kind of like switching the conversation to like, like, what what was the day after school? Like for you? That's
(Elle) the song rich kids by B. Miller is amazing. Yeah, that I think answers all my questions about sororities. Anthony.
(Anthony) Yeah. Had a couple. So you mentioned that you live with your sorority sisters in a sorority house. How is it living with other people just in general?
(Hannah) Yeah, it is fun. It's sometimes a lot living because it's like 50, some girls, and it can be a lot. Sometimes. Luckily, my rooms kind of like tucked away in a little corner. But I'm like right next to the coop, which is great. Because like, when I want my alone time, which I really value, I can have my alone time. But then like, I can leave my room and there's always someone I could talk to, or there's always something going on, there's always something like, funny happening, like our hair dryers keep setting off the fire alarm. And we keep having to evacuate and like will like take pictures in front of the fire trucks or like there was a bat in our house one time. So there's always like some kind of shenanigan happening.
(Elle) I would love to be surrounded by firefighters.
(Hannah) And it is just so funny. There's always like a going out top you can borrow. If you ever need like, Boy advice or anything, there's always a girl, you can talk to you. So like, although it can be overwhelming sometimes I honestly think it's a really good experience.
(Anthony) Okay, and with you saying that what's been your best memory so far with being in a sorority,
(Hannah) it's such a good, that's hard to pick, because I've just like met so many girls, I like kind of like when I first joined my sorority, it's like hard because like, there's so many girls you have to meet at once, you're not going to know every single girl right away. So I feel like my favorite memory was at every different event I went to I met a different girl who I just like in my sorority who I just vibe with, like, oh my gosh, like I got out of my private space, stuff like that, to the point where I just like kind of knew everyone in my story. So it's kind of fun, just being able to realize that like, you can just vibe with anyone we all all have like very like different but like similar personalities, if that makes sense. Like so like we all kind of bring different things to the table. So that's been like my favorite memories, just being able to realize that, like, everybody can vibe with each other and just realizing that like, there's always a friendly face around.
(Elle) No, don't really cool. No, I'm just gonna say that's cool. That is cool. I think this segues into what I wanted to ask you next. So living with a lot of a lot of people did you grow up with siblings? And were they sisters, brothers siblings in general?
(Hannah) Yeah. So I actually grew up with an older brother neck. He was such he's such a great older brother. I mean, he's three years older than me. So he was a senior at Michigan State when I was a freshman. And he was really great to have around because so he was in aka psi, which is CO Ed business fraternity. And so he had a car and his house was really close to my dorm. I lived in Brody And he was always like, if I ever needed a ride, if I was ever, like stressed about something, he would always come pick me up, take me to the grocery store, he would let me use drive his car if I needed to go I'm from South Line, which is Roa. If I used to go back home, he would always let me use his car. He would always like, he'd never gotten annoyed if I asked him for advice. So I was very lucky to grow up with a very supportive older brother, who just always like had my back always looked out for me, which I feel like also kind of carries into like my relationships to kind of has me set this high standard for the men in my life.
(Elle) If you've, we should keep count of how many times I've mentioned different songs, but there's a song by Jax called, like my father, where she says, I want a man who loves me like my father loves my mom. Beautiful song. So So sisterhood is kind of a new thing for you that
(Hannah) Yeah, yeah. So I grew up with one of my neighbors. So she is my neighbor that she's like a big sister to me as a year younger than my brother. And then she has a younger brother who's the same age as me. So we were kinda like always hanging out because we both had like, kind of opposite dynamics. And she was always such a big sister to me, she also goes to Michigan State. So I kind of had a little bit of sisterhood growing up. But being in a sorority definitely amplified that a lot. And it kind of gave me that but like kind of times 10 And she's still big sister figure to me is always texting me. And we always text each other about things at MSU. And she's always looking out for me. But definitely like that, that experience growing up definitely made me realize I wanted a sisterhood in college.
(Anthony) So if I've been paying attention correctly, Michigan status in your family, I was thinking,
(Hannah) oh my gosh, I so my MSU email is Holy crow seven because I am the seventh Holy Cross to go to Michigan State. But that doesn't even cover everyone in my family has gone because I have cousins and aunts and uncles who have also gone here but have different last name.
(Elle) I was gonna say I'm also the seventh because my grandma, my grandmother was here in 1961. She didn't graduate from here, but she was here. My mother graduated in 92. And then she graduated again with a master's degree in 2018. My cousin Betsy was here in the early 2000s. She met her husband and then my aunt Lindsay was here also in the early 2000s. Yes, I have a cousin and an aunt are the same age. It's a really long story. My grandma had my grandma's oldest daughter and her youngest daughter, like 17 years apart. So it's a whole thing. But so my aunt was here, and then she met her husband, so it doesn't make me whatever the point is. I've got a Spartan family too. Yeah, but I were gonna say something.
(Anthony) I was just gonna say ironically, I come from or where last time every time he's aware, ironically, no, I think he corrected me in a whole nother thing. But crazy enough. I come from you of him family. So that's just like my sister once you have them. And then my family I've unto you once you have them, and then my parents are big you have and when my dad simply big, you have him fan, Walmart.
(Elle) Oh, there's a joke. Wolverines because like a lot of Michigan State fans family, a lot of Michigan State fans went to Michigan State, whereas not a lot of Michigan, Michigan fans went to Michigan. Although to be fair, they've got a much lower acceptance rate than we do. But speaking of family, my next question, we talked about this a little bit, we have our I don't know if attraction is the right word. I guess interest in sex and love comes from the fact that we weren't raised in very, what I guess people would now call sex positive households. So these are two separate subjects, obviously, love and sex. And I think this conversation tends to go more towards the latter. So Anthony and I, we've talked about it, like I said, we're both raised not talking about sex, not thinking about it. Like it just wasn't a topic in our households. So how does that compare or contrast to your experience?
(Hannah) Yeah, so I'm very lucky, I was always very able to be very open with my mom, my mom is very, like, imagine, you can come to me about anything. Like I'd rather you tell me then kind of keep something from me and keep it secret. So I was like, always able to, like go to her about things. There was always that kind of initial, like, should I go to her about this? Like, maybe, but my mom has crazy intuition. And she's kind of giving it to me too, because I also have crazy intuition. But she always can tell when something's wrong with me or when I have something I want to talk to her about. But I'm like unsure, she'll always be like, Are you sure you're doing okay? Sure. There's not something on your mind. And she's on the dot every time there is something on my mind. So I was always very able to be open with her because she would know if I was it. But not in a way to get me in trouble just in a way to make sure that like mentally and physically I was doing okay, so I was very, very lucky because I know a lot of my friends and a lot of people I know didn't really grow up with that. But I also do have friends If I did go up like that, so it was a very positive experience was very lucky to have.
(Anthony) And you helped me perfectly transition to a question I wanted to ask you with your boyfriend and just relationship experience you've had in the past. Have you gotten comfortable with being vulnerable and opening yourself up when it comes to like intimacy or emotion or just all that whole spectrum?
(Hannah) Yes. So one thing that really attracted me to my boyfriend before we started dating, because him and I were friends for a few months before we kind of realized we liked each other was just how comfortable I was around him. I feel like sometimes that deters people from relationships, because they kind of seek that like, excitement that comes from the uncomfortableness but I feel, yeah, I feel comfortable around them. But there's also that excitement aspect. And like, one thing about him is like, even from like the get go on our relationship, I was always felt very comfortable being open with him and like telling him things about myself that were very intimate. So I feel like that was like very good. And our relationship was I just feel very comfortable. I think that's so important. And something that's very overlooked, when people are looking for a partner is like, How comfortable are you kind of digging deep with things in your life and your life story and stuff like that. And like, same thing goes for him. He's always said how comfortable he feels around me and telling me things and that also kind of goes along with the communication aspect as well.
(Anthony) Okay, and with being in your relationship you're with, you're in now and then past experiences and then being in love is exported the state news, how does it help you grow mentally? And when thinking about like, love and sex and just as a person? How does it help you grow?
(Hannah) Yeah, so I have changed, like with like, my mentally and like with how I approach relationships so much since high school, and so much since I've like started dating my boyfriend, like, he has helped me grow so much as a person and like, I'm his first girlfriend as well. So I'm sure he can say the same thing about growth. And he's like, kind of just helped me just like, almost like, feel better about myself and like, kind of appreciate self love as well, because he's always hyping me up always like bringing me up when I'm down. And so he's definitely helped me grow a lot as a person. And then like, being the love and SOX reporter, like I said, being able to have like, personal deep conversations with sources like I'm rattling deeper, if you will, yeah, going deeper. It's almost like being the reporters a lot is a learning experience. And every story I write is something I want to learn about. So it's kind of like, I want to learn about it. I'm sure. You know, one time a professor told me when it comes to writing stories and thinking of story ideas, if you're not interested in it, interested in it, other people won't. That's so true. And I think with like the love and sex be it's like if it's something I want to learn other people want to learn about it, too.
(Elle) Absolutely. This brings up something we were talking about off the mic, because you mentioned High School. We were talking about I think it was first kisses. Yeah. And I this is I know this person isn't is a little is a little by little, I mean a lot problematic. But when I was pretty young, I saw Shane Dawson. He was in some video data. Don't make that face at me. Don't make that face at me. Okay, I know, I remember Shinae okay, I was that was like 12. Anyway, but I saw him in a video and he said that he didn't have his first kiss until he was 23. And that was really reassuring to me. Because in the books I read, and like I said, I think it was around 12. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. But it was always 1213 was the first kiss and I didn't have my first kiss until I was 19. So it can be one of those moments where what you see and what you're exposed to, can be so impactful, because I never forgot that even after he. Yeah, that's, that's a story for another time.
(Hannah) But it is so impactful because I always thought I was late to the game because I had my first kiss when I was 17. And I remember like always talking to my mom because I was like sad because like, I never really had like dates to dances until my senior year, I'd never been on a day never really like talked to a guy nor held hands. So I just felt very like late to the game. And like a lot of my friends were like, similar in that aspect. Like a lot of other people at my high school, you know, had relationships had had boyfriends for years. And I was still here like I've never even held hands. So I always just felt very insecure about that. But as I've gotten older, I'm like that's so normal. Like I talk to girls, I'm like met in college. Like I was the same exact way in high school. Like some of my friends haven't even like had boyfriends yet. It's just so normal. It is nothing to be ashamed about. And I wish I could just like go back to my younger self and be like, you're fine. You're doing great. Because like I honestly do not care that much. It's kind of like a security thing. Just kind of like I just felt insecure about I was like why am I not good enough but most people that are like, kind of like had that similar experience. I'm like you're literally gone. This smart, amazing person like there was no reason for you insecure. And I wish I could just go back and tell myself that
(Elle) 100% I think the insecurity that comes with being a teenage girl is overwhelming. Like, I don't think I have ever met a woman in my life. Who was not insecure in their teenage years. It's it's crazy. I mean, I know always the, the feminine hygiene products company. Do they make tampons? That's not important. I know they make pads. But they did a whole campaign for young girls talking about how, how extremely common it is to have the self esteem issues. And I also remember thinking, like I said, I was 19 Very late to the game, but I've not even not even very late to the game, just late to the game that is shown in movies and TV. And I it's almost a blessing in some ways, because I think I did hold hands with somebody when I was like, 14, but neither of us were like out yet it was she was a woman it was it's a long story. And I kind of talked to like one person. But I found that and this is not always the case. Sometimes you sidestep a lot of drama. Because when you're young, and you're figuring out what love is, and not even love just crushes and stuff, it can go very wrong when you're in high school. And I've met people who have had bad experiences, because they did those things. In in, like at a younger age. So when I think about people who don't have their first kids to college, or even beyond that, Steve Carell and 40 year old virgin are just getting good movie though. They, they, they tend to have avoided stuff like that.
(Hannah) That's like one thing my mom would say to me verbatim. So it's funny that you bring that up when I would like us to talk to her. Like before I had a relationship writing about how I wish I had had a boyfriend and stuff like that. And then like, after my first relationship, my mom was kind of like, see, wasn't it wasn't that great? I was like, Yeah, you were right. Like, it wasn't really all that I thought it would be like, that's the thing is like, I feel like in high school I like was like always, like very insecure about now that but like use your right? You sidestep so much drama, and I'm very much like I try to be as least problematic as possible. And high school relationships are extremely problematic. You are in such an enclosed environment. Everybody knows everything about everyone. Meanwhile, like in college, you can have more privacy, because it's more of like a bigger environment.
(Elle) Absolutely. Anthony.
(Anthony) And with all the things you guys have been saying. I just wanted to ask a couple more questions before we let you go. So question for both you and l. We and l mentioned in the intro episode. Like there are a lot of the biggest problem when it comes to having these type of conversations is sometimes especially guys don't care about like knowing about like a woman's body or about like a lot of things in general. So both of you, what advice would you give to a guy or just someone who maybe isn't as aware with these type of topics? What advice would you give them as far as emotionally sexually about love just about women or just about something you feel they should know?
(Hannah) I would, I would say don't take it personally. Take it as a learning experience. I feel like sometimes guys can kind of get very, like, put down or like sad when like a woman is kinda like, oh, like, here's something like emotionally and sexually, like, here's something you can do better and stuff like that. Like, I feel like they kind of think it's like a hit at bomb. Wow. And honestly, it's out of a place of love and like learning and just wanting to improve the relationship. So I feel like honestly, just don't take it personally. Just take it with open ears and understand that it's only going to make the relationship. What in whatever form it is better.
(Elle) Absolutely, absolutely. Particularly when it comes to sex like women, particularly in college and early on. We are not expecting Owen gray. Like that. We're not we're not really. And it's okay, if like, we talked about this before, like, I mean, I I have kind of a different experience because I had a very good first relationship. I mean, there was a learning curve, but it's fine. If the first couple times you have sex, you don't really know what you're doing. It's okay. It's not a big deal. It's before you've met somebody and learned what they like or miss especially if it's like your first time if you guys have heard our first time by Bruno Mars. Incredible song. Absolutely incredible song. But yeah, that would be my advice to men is it's okay to ask. It's okay to not know like, hopefully your your girlfriend, your partner, whatever. She's not gonna laugh at you. She's not gonna run and tell her friends. I mean, I mean, some people do that. But it's, it happens less than you think. Because hopefully she respects you and you respect her so.
(Anthony) And the last question I have in my mind for you, Hannah is when you think of the word love or when you see like sex and love and when you think about it, what does it mean to you and And how would you describe it?
(Hannah) I feel like love is just such like a, it's like so hard to describe because it can be different in so many different ways. And I feel like there's just so many different like, self love relationships, love family, love, friend love. And this is always so different. And I feel like one thing is just always just like, what makes you feel the best. And like, what makes you the happiest and like when I think of love, I think of someone who I want to spend every day with who I want to turn to whenever something good happens in life, or whenever I'm feeling good about myself that I can turn to and be like, Hey, this is how it's going. And like they can kind of feel the same way as well.
(Anthony and Elle) Great answer. And with that being said, I think that's all I have. Do you have any additional questions? No, no, but this was wonderful. Yeah, I really loved it. Before we get out of here, do you want to shout out any plans you have moving forward with any stories you have ideas about or just your social medias or whatever you want?
(Hannah) So my Twitter is Han Holycross because Hannah Holycross was taken. And I do have some fun stories coming up. Like I said, science behind changing hair after a breakup. I'm doing a story on desex really sell and advertising still just with how politically incorrect it is. And then also, I'm planning on trying to pitch a story about situation ships and the harmful concept of body count. So I'm very excited for those stories.
(Anthony) Sounds like you have a lot of amazing things coming and I can't wait I know can't wait to consume those stories. And again, like I mentioned earlier with another story, please go to the state news.com to consume more of Hannah's content and hopefully our podcasts as well. And with that being said, we're always going to take a deep dive but sometimes good to come up there.
(Elle) This has been the going deeper podcast.
(Both hosts) Bye, guys. Bye