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Fostering community unity through education, advocacy for patients and plants, and efforts to eliminate stigma.
00:00:08:25 - 00:00:32:28
Unknown
Hi, everyone. I'm Molly the Corcoran, and you've reached conversations with coach podcast tonight. I have a really great friend joining me, Mr. Jesse Christiansen. Doctor otherwise known as Doctor Merz. Hello. I'm cannabis DMP Therapeutics. So thank you, Jesse, for being here. Thanks for having me. This is this is my first podcast. Wow.
00:00:32:28 - 00:00:59:13
Unknown
Okay, I like it. We broke the seal, right? It's spirit. Many, many more to come. So we met last year in Madison at hempfest. And, I was just really blown away by your energy and your enthuses ASM for cannabis and, happy and excited to see another cannabis nurse doing the Lord's work, essentially. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's great.
00:00:59:13 - 00:01:24:14
Unknown
It's great. That was a fun experience. It was a fun experience. And right in your backyard there, you live in Madison, is that right? That's correct. Okay. So tell me about yourself and how you got into cannabis, what type of background you have or training and whatnot. Okay. Well, yeah, I've been a nurse since 2016. I was not always in this field.
00:01:24:14 - 00:01:47:15
Unknown
I had multiple other careers prior to getting into the medical field, but, I was kind of pushed into it. And I'm glad that it worked out this way. I've always been fascinated with cannabis in and of itself. But it wasn't until I actually got into graduate school that I got to learn more of the therapeutic application, and I also got to learn more about the evidence behind it.
00:01:47:15 - 00:02:04:27
Unknown
So, in graduate school, and UW, almost every semester for, one class a semester, we had to do some type of research project. We had to do some type of group project. And every project that I was on, the emphasis was cannabis.
00:02:04:29 - 00:02:24:26
Unknown
Whether it was cannabis and pain, whether it was cannabis and opioid use and state with legal, cannabis programs. It was it was always something based in cannabis. And then towards the end of our graduate studies, we had to do a project. It was about a year long, and nothing really stuck out for me.
00:02:24:26 - 00:02:45:07
Unknown
Like people doing catheter, issues or or cardiac cares or stuff like that. But none of that really kind of made me want to research anything. And I was like, you know, I'm just going to do some cannabis based. Yeah. You know, that always my spiel. I knew that there was a huge gap in knowledge, especially here in Madison.
00:02:45:10 - 00:03:08:11
Unknown
And what better way to kind of give back to the community? We're already trying to use different cannabinoid products, but they didn't really understand the pros, the cons, of using certain products. And I was like, you know, this fits me. I love interacting with people. I love science, I love farmer code, kinetics and dynamics.
00:03:08:11 - 00:03:32:05
Unknown
I love everything about it. And, it's just a topic that I like to excel in. So I still do. I'm still. Yeah. Well, I appreciate you. And so, first, the project was shunned, as I'm sure you can imagine. There's so much there's there's a lot of, concern behind cannabis. And in itself, it's a boogeyman.
00:03:32:08 - 00:03:52:04
Unknown
And, throughout my project, I was actually asked to come under the Wisconsin Nurses Association apron conference at the Minnesota Terrace and give an hour long lecture, and I had more, people in that lecture than any other conference. So. And it was the first one right after a lunch period and everybody stayed away. So it was absolutely wonderful.
00:03:52:06 - 00:04:13:07
Unknown
I had a lot of information in that hour. I had some old professors in there. I had some clinical professors in there. And it was just it was terrifying. But it was fun. Yeah, that is a tough, to be in that lunch spot that right after lunch. So I come in busy lunch and then it's like, oh, you're up next.
00:04:13:07 - 00:04:34:16
Unknown
I'm like, yeah, yeah, that big room over there. Yeah. So that's a really interesting challenge that you faced. And so you're here you are at a traditional school, you're at, U-dub Madison and, you know, you've got this great interest in cannabis and hopefully you'll tell me more about that later, whether, you know, kind of where that stem from.
00:04:34:18 - 00:05:01:01
Unknown
And you're talking about this boogeyman taboo subject and you've got all these people captivated, right? They all want to hear about you and what you have to say about cannabis. So, talk a little bit about those origin stories, like, did you you've talked somewhat about like noticing the gap in education and what were some of the questions you were getting?
00:05:01:04 - 00:05:26:27
Unknown
I know that I've had to defend my myself, pretty frequently, especially against those that are substance abuse professionals. That was that was a huge, you know, conversation that was had is I was calling it a medicine. They didn't consider it a medicine. So we both agreed to calling it a therapy. Hence the reason why my name is Cannabinoid Therapeutics because it is a therapy.
00:05:26:27 - 00:05:53:02
Unknown
It can be used as an additive or a mono, therapy. Some of the other questions or concerns, is the whole schizophrenia topic. Yeah. You can call it schizophrenia, you know, and, and we know from documentation and different research articles that cannabis doesn't cause schizophrenia. It can be incorporated in with somebody that's diagnosed with that, but it doesn't necessarily cause it.
00:05:53:04 - 00:06:13:11
Unknown
A couple of the other concerns are especially with the aging population, me being a, gerontologist is, you know, the falling possibility, the dizziness, falling, hitting their head, which hasn't really been proven. But it's and then also talking with legislators, where is the disconnect? Where are you getting your information from? How can I better help you?
00:06:13:11 - 00:06:38:23
Unknown
But at that point in time, being a student and being seen as somebody that is over here and not part of the in crowd, I wasn't taken very seriously. And that's okay. That's okay. But having those experiences with different people, allowed some form of communication, some form of dialog, and, that was actually calling itself.
00:06:38:23 - 00:07:03:07
Unknown
I got to be at the Capitol talking with senators. So that was awesome. Were they did they have a lot of reservations or concerns, or were they open to hearing what you talked about to hear at all? They here all the time? In my paper on my final paper, we I would talk about, you know, the cannabis topic as being a political pawn, as being more that is put on everybody's agenda to try to get more votes.
00:07:03:07 - 00:07:26:23
Unknown
Some people are gung ho about it, sure. And some people are just using it just to garner more votes. And, here in Wisconsin, I don't know how much you're following, but, there's really no leeway there. It's it's even though we have a recreational market with DACA, nobody is really open to talking about it right now.
00:07:26:27 - 00:07:54:22
Unknown
And you have hemp derived products too cracked up to have dried product, which are my products as well. Okay. So no medical program, no adult rec program, just the the hemp, the hemp line for the most part. Yeah. We have what I call a bathroom gin type situation. People are throwing, people are throwing a lot of different components together to try to get the, the most effect.
00:07:54:25 - 00:08:10:14
Unknown
The other the other thing that I think that is interesting about your market is that now, correct me if I'm wrong. I talked about this on a different show. Do you have a referendum or it's an up or down vote? If people want to get cannabis and they just simply need to like bring that forward and they can yay or nay it is.
00:08:10:22 - 00:08:29:28
Unknown
We've already voted on it. Everybody voted yes. I think about 77 or 88% of the people that voted voted yes. Wow. Yeah. No, it's it's a it's a large amount of people that wanted it in. And this I think happened in 2022. So is it up then to the legislation to like carry it across the line type of deal or.
00:08:30:00 - 00:08:46:26
Unknown
Yeah. And they won't do it has a reason why a lot of people will. We'll put it on their agenda. Sure. But there's really no step forward. When I was up at the Capitol out here, you know, you got to impress the old guard. Yeah. The old guard does not stand for cannabis reform. Well, here's the other thing.
00:08:46:26 - 00:09:09:21
Unknown
You can elect a new guard. Try maybe the. Yeah, you know, I don't know, maybe that can be, you know, a point of contention and, and, in a way, to rally the people. If there's 80% of people wanting this in their state. I mean, you know, it's a simple matter of going down to the voting booth every couple of years and getting those people that say they will make this happen for you happen.
00:09:09:21 - 00:09:36:08
Unknown
So we got a lot of barriers here in Wisconsin. Sure. For, my component of educating, comes into play of figuring out where is this fear? Where is this? Is this still from the 1970s? Even though more and more people are starting to use, you know, CBD products or, you know, CBD, AG products or THC products, where is this fear grounded?
00:09:36:11 - 00:10:00:22
Unknown
And don't know that when people are afraid, we act. Yeah. And sometimes violently or sometimes, very cautiously. And opening up that dialog, having that conversation with somebody that is knowledgeable and also friendly. Yeah. If you don't like it, that's great. I, you know, if it doesn't work for you, that's wonderful. Yeah. But but it does work for a lot of people.
00:10:00:25 - 00:10:23:17
Unknown
It sure does. You know, we've heard how legislators have responded. We've heard how academia responded. What about just like your average layman? Like your your neighbors? Yeah. So my neighborhood, a lot of people will consume a different type of product. I am now at farmer's markets. Okay. I set up a booth, kind of like I did at Midwest first.
00:10:23:22 - 00:10:46:20
Unknown
Yeah. But now I'm doing more farmers markets. And the amount of people that come up and talk to me is absolutely wonderful. That's great. Wonderful, I love it. That's probably my favorite. I love selling my product, don't get me wrong. But when it comes to talking with people and making sure that they're purchasing something that's going to benefit them or not, and then lead them in a direction or not.
00:10:46:20 - 00:11:09:19
Unknown
For instance, I had, somebody that suffered from alcoholism. My first question is, do you feel that this may trigger you? And they said, yeah, maybe. I said, I don't want you to buy my product. That, sobriety is more important than me selling a package. Yeah. So being able to talk with people instead of pushing your product is such a wonderful feeling.
00:11:09:19 - 00:11:36:09
Unknown
And then everybody's enjoying this on the farmers market. Yeah, right. But it's inviting. It's opening. And people either love to pick my brain or they like to test me. Yeah. And it's great because I get that, I get those, hey, I do know stuff, right? Are you still, practicing at the bedside? I am not, I am currently, I work with a psychiatric clinic, okay.
00:11:36:11 - 00:12:11:27
Unknown
On a referral basis. And I'm also interviewing with UW Ortho pain rehab. Oh. That's awesome. That's a perfect place for cannabis to be. So we're going to find out next week whether how how accepting they are okay. So that worked leading me into like how is the medical community response to cannabis and actually pretty good. The Carbon Center at UW, I have a couple of clients there, and, I get to work hand in hand with some of their primary chemotherapy and BS, with their approval, working with some of my therapies and also their chemotherapy medications.
00:12:11:29 - 00:12:34:14
Unknown
And it's going well, I believe I believe my credentials help me in through that door for sure. And that's that was kind of like a chess move. And I think it's working out great. But also just the influence and the people that refer me and then my name just continues to spread. Exactly. And it's great. It's it's absolutely wonderful.
00:12:34:16 - 00:12:55:05
Unknown
I hope that it spreads enough that other nurses catch on as well, because I'm always trying to look for places where I can elevate our profession and show that we are the trusted source of knowledge on cannabis. And like we are going to think about things like, hey, maybe cannabis not might not be the right choice for someone that has a history of alcoholism.
00:12:55:05 - 00:13:26:03
Unknown
You know, you're not going to get that type of a question at the dispensary, right? Right. And I to a lot of people, yeah. So, yeah, I mean, that's my hope for, for us going forward. So you've really positioned yourself at the intersection of like evidence based medicine and cannabinoid therapeutics. What inspired you to take this path, and how do you see your work shaping the future of integrative health care?
00:13:26:05 - 00:13:54:21
Unknown
Oh, boy. Like I said, I've always been interested in cannabis. But it wasn't until grad school that I got really into therapeutics. I would have to say you know, especially in grad school and doing clinical rotations, the amount of clients that would come in for, stress and anxiety or pain and sleep issues, and then we would just keep throwing, medications or we talked about cognitive behavioral therapy.
00:13:54:21 - 00:14:10:27
Unknown
You and I know we live in a time where everybody wants a quick fix. And I get that, if you look at my my slogan or underneath my logo, it's evidence based care for a better life. I just want you to have a better life. That's it. You know, if it's with cannabis or if it's not, whatever.
00:14:10:27 - 00:14:29:25
Unknown
Whatever we can do. I just want to have a better life for. What I'm finding out is those that are suffering from stress and anxiety or sleep and pain is they don't want to wait. The six weeks for an SSRI or an Snris to kick in, right? Some populations shouldn't have a benzo, and if you have a benzo, you shouldn't be on it long term.
00:14:29:25 - 00:14:53:02
Unknown
Or an opiate is the same way. So, unfortunately, my father suffered from a lot of chronic pain before he passed away. And that really pushed me into doing something more. It's like, why can't we in healthcare, when we talk about these tools that we can use and we talk to this person, we can try this medication, we can try these couple of medications.
00:14:53:04 - 00:15:15:21
Unknown
Cannabis in and of itself can be used as a tool in our toolbox. It can be used for those that would like to try it or have a history of of consumption, or are just intrigued and want to ask you questions. Right. Be a tool. And that's, you know, that's that's what I want is to have another resource.
00:15:15:28 - 00:15:43:14
Unknown
Yeah. So when I started doing this and I would have clients that would refer to me for stress and anxiety, pain and sleep and then getting the feedback. So I always check in like I did with you. I always check in with people. Always I text you, my phone is always on me. When I kept getting the feedback, positive outcomes, even when people that are going through cannabis withdrawal from high concentrated pens.
00:15:43:16 - 00:16:14:07
Unknown
I knew that I'm doing something. I'm giving back. Yeah. You know, I mean, and that's important is to give back, especially to your community, especially for those that may not feel that they have a voice, that you're approachable. Yeah, I think go ahead. I didn't mean to cut you off. Oh, no. You're fine. I think one of the one of the stigmas that we also have to overcome sometimes is like, well, you are out here, you know, acting like cannabis is going to cure everything.
00:16:14:07 - 00:16:41:00
Unknown
No, I'm not cannabis. And I've heard you say it now. I've heard Trisha say it. Trisha Brown cannabis is a tool in our toolbox. We also have to do the other important work of like fixing our diet, fixing our exercise program, fixing our personal relationships, you know, making sure we have good work life balance. Like, you know, these are cannabis is just one of the aspects that helps our overall improvement and wellness.
00:16:41:00 - 00:17:05:11
Unknown
Right? Yeah. So with the, therapy to just end. Yeah. Go ahead. I don't mean to stop you from the discussion ahead of it. What is the reason why a lot of people are taking certain medication, right? They're trying to get over a barrier in their life so that they can live. Right. So we can help them over that barrier.
00:17:05:11 - 00:17:24:11
Unknown
Maybe then they can confront whatever issues that they have, let's say public speaking. Right? Yeah. A lot of people will take, propranolol, which is a beta blocker, to help with public speaking. Well, if you do that a lot of times and you speak in front of enough people, eventually, you know, you're not amped up, right? Right.
00:17:24:13 - 00:17:40:04
Unknown
And now you're calm. And now, especially if you practice your speech multiple times like a when I want to practice that once a day for 20 days leading up to, you know, 30 days and then ten days, do I practice it twice a day in front of people? The more times you do it, the more comfortable you're going to feel.
00:17:40:05 - 00:18:10:09
Unknown
But how can we get you over that hurdle? Right? You know, it doesn't have to be long term, but just enough to get you over there. Yeah. Even as a, transitional, therapeutic. Yeah, absolutely. So you're with your products, the therapeutic edibles. You focus on the safe and effective cannabinoid solutions. So walk us through your approach to like, your product development and how you ensure both quality and accessibility.
00:18:10:12 - 00:18:35:26
Unknown
Absolutely. Oh, I had a buddy actually ask me about this the other night. If I knew that I would be doing what I was doing, I told him, absolutely not. To to to come up with a product. As I told you before, stress and anxiety, sleep and pain. And I saw that a lot. So I wanted something that targeted those issues.
00:18:35:29 - 00:19:11:07
Unknown
Okay. So I follow a lot of research. I talk to a lot of people. I get to listen to a lot of lectures like Ethan Rousseau and Tickler. Marcoux and and Rickard and all these wonderful people in onion. Taking notes and UW pharmacy program helped me out a lot to awesome people. All that. And I get to take that information and I get to go to different archives and libraries, and I get to cross-reference and cross-check as to what would be the best combination for a synergistic effect, for stress and anxiety and sleep and pain.
00:19:11:10 - 00:19:33:21
Unknown
And that's how I formulated my product. So not only am I using cannabinoids, I'm also using tear fields. Now, safe and, effective products. Safety is huge to me. I want to know that I'm giving you what I'm telling you. I'm giving you. Right. Because that's that's my ethical belief is I have to. That's that's what I'm doing.
00:19:33:21 - 00:20:03:24
Unknown
No harm. No harm. Right. Well, largely unregulated market. Well, you know. Yes. Yeah. And that's where I like the shine. Because I bring in my healthcare history and with a science backing, and I'm taking everything I've learned and I've put it into my products, and that's where I want to stand out. I want to be reliable, I want to be ethically sound, and I want to make sure that you get the same response every time my products are tested three times.
00:20:03:26 - 00:20:27:10
Unknown
Testing before and after each batch. I'm using DEA, grown hemp, I'm using cGMP compliant and food and safety and, and good manufacturing practices like, I'm as safe as I can possibly make these things to be right for critical CO2 extraction. It's it's just that more important to me that what I give you is what I give you, right?
00:20:27:14 - 00:20:47:14
Unknown
I love that thank you for that really important work. And as I spoke to earlier, you know, I remember being at Hempfest and, you know, picking up like a bottle of, I don't know, channeling. I don't even know what they would call it, but they're like, yeah, this is 1000mg. I'm like, oh, okay. Yeah. Like, how do you how do you know that?
00:20:47:20 - 00:21:10:02
Unknown
You know, it's it's important to have those like low dose, access points for people that, you know, need a small dose or microdose and even maybe even half of a micro dose. So you've got, just the taffy in your line, in your product line. So you have talk about what you have the difference in the two.
00:21:10:05 - 00:21:31:21
Unknown
So the sleep and pain taffy is, black cherry and it's, ten milligrams delta nine. Some evidence shows that low dose CBD is actually excited, jittery. And if I'm trying to get you calmed down and relaxed, I don't want you to be ramped up when you're trying to go to bed. The other component of that is the beta americium, which is a sedative.
00:21:31:23 - 00:21:52:22
Unknown
The beta care lean work, which works on the CB2 receptors, and then the little wall, which is that calming effect. And, I find that they work wonderful for people that either have trouble initiating sleep, will start the therapy earlier, or stay in a sleep, and we'll do it right at bedtime. So again, timing is of importance for sure.
00:21:52:24 - 00:22:19:23
Unknown
You want to make sure that you're taking it for the appropriate response. Right. The other one for the, the anxiety and stress is, the 1 to 1 component. It's ten milligrams l-theanine ten milligrams CBD. So we'll find out the 1 to 1 is actually an even more even way to kind of spread the cannabinoid, body without causing too much of a set and not enough of the CBD effect.
00:22:19:23 - 00:22:40:16
Unknown
So again, the working together, CBD being a systemic modulator and THC being a partial CB1 agonist, and what that what that translates to for me especially is like, you know, sometimes if I consume too much THC, I really like to have that CBD component in there because that really just smooths it out for me. Yeah, yeah.
00:22:40:18 - 00:23:11:15
Unknown
The paranoia, it's the way that maybe that anxious feeling that I might feel initially. So, it's important to remind people that growers, for one, and people that are making products that we are going to need, these products that are almost hybrid, so that we're getting a ratio sometimes of medication because everyone is going to have their each individual needs and, challenges that they'll use cannabis for.
00:23:11:15 - 00:23:31:07
Unknown
So absolutely. Yeah. Thank you for being intentional about that. Yeah. And then on top of that, the Terrapin profile in that one. Because I like like I said, I like to combat these things with many different angles is, the d limonene and then the little ol. So I'm trying to try to look for an emotional response.
00:23:31:07 - 00:23:50:05
Unknown
And then also that lavender to, to help kind of calm. Yeah. They're fantastic. They're Fanta. They are. I can speak to it personally. Yeah, I know you grab a cup and you get a sure bubbly, so. Thank you. Yeah, I just bought my sweatshirt yesterday. When I do out to the park, I'm like people, you know? Thank you.
00:23:50:11 - 00:24:22:07
Unknown
Yeah, cause you are doing like I said. You're doing really important work in a place that, really needs it. Thank you. Yeah. Really? That. Yeah. I'm very grateful to be doing this, to be honest. Yeah. It's it's fun, challenging, but rewarding at the same time. I talked to touch a little bit on, you know, how we change that stigma in our medical profession or how there is an existing stigma amongst our medical professionals?
00:24:22:09 - 00:24:48:25
Unknown
How do we how do we change that? How do we start affecting that change? It just kind of depends. So, working with some psychiatric specialists and substance abuse specialists, there's always that, no. Yeah. And I don't want nothing to do with it because in I feel this is my opinion when I talk with, these professionals, they, they only look at the recreational use.
00:24:48:29 - 00:25:17:15
Unknown
Right? Don't look at the medicinal use. Medicinal use of cannabis, is small amounts, judicious, judicious, judiciously spread throughout the day. Right. We're not giving you, you know, 100mg of THC one time a day. We're doing, you know, five milligrams, ten milligram, depending on the person, depending on how you respond. But I feel, again, this is probably my own bias that people are thinking about.
00:25:17:18 - 00:25:46:13
Unknown
People that are smoking all day, every day. Exactly. And I can understand that. I can because that's the that's the image that you paint in your head when you think of somebody using cannabis. It's the stoner mentality. To change that. It just it takes conversation, contrasting medicinal versus recreational use. Yeah. How open is the practitioner or how open is the person that you're talking to with actually hearing you?
00:25:46:13 - 00:26:09:02
Unknown
You know, are they willing to listen to you or are they just going to sit there with their mind shut off? Yeah, I make no delineation between cannabis as medicine and cannabis as adult rec, because I feel like even if you're a stoner, I mean, I know some pretty successful, highly functioning stoners that weed all day long, so.
00:26:09:04 - 00:26:42:20
Unknown
Absolutely. You know, but I think you're right. The the image, the negative connotation that exists in people's minds. And so that's what we have to get to the heart of. And it's just it's just takes time and persistence and, you know, continued, work that we do in the space. So I know, it's been brought to my attention numerous times about, the concern for the smell of coming of cannabis combusted cannabis.
00:26:42:23 - 00:27:04:05
Unknown
Yeah. You know, what are you supposed to do about that? When people walk into the, doctor's appointments or whatever? And I would ask them, I said, what would you say to somebody that came in smelling like cigaret smoke? Right. What would you say to somebody that maybe doesn't have the the resources to shower on a daily basis and would come in, not smelling the fresh?
00:27:04:05 - 00:27:21:06
Unknown
It's like, what would you say to people like that or, or if they have alcohol on their breath or if they have alcohol on their breath, and you do come at them with, with empathy or, is anger one of the responses that you're going to have like, oh, I can't believe you're coming in here smelling like that.
00:27:21:09 - 00:27:49:27
Unknown
Maybe they needed it just to come to the appointment. Exactly. You know, so you don't know until you talk. I love that. Thank you. For the patients that are seeking cannabis as an alternative or complementary therapy. In your experience what are some of the most transformative ways that you've seen this transpire in the population that you serve.
00:27:50:00 - 00:28:20:22
Unknown
So like what are some positive outcomes? Yeah, sure. From like real life examples without violating hip are anything. No, I know I'm in my head. I'm trying to figure well, I've had some individuals that would rely on the meds personally. Sure. And like I said, I always check in with everybody, some people that rely on opiates, daily, and then some people that are going through some sort of withdrawal, whether it be alcohol or whether it be cannabis.
00:28:20:24 - 00:28:43:23
Unknown
And, I can only speak on my products, because I don't know very much about it. A lot of others here in, in medicine, but when they use my product, they've had some really good outcomes. A couple actually just happened the other day, and I couldn't be more proud. So does it work? Yes it does.
00:28:43:23 - 00:29:04:00
Unknown
Does it work better in the right hands? Yes it does. Does it work better if you follow up with people and titrate? Absolutely. We know that cannabis is biphasic. We know that too much or too little will not have the outcome that you're looking for. That happens with a lot of different medications. Okay. So where can we keep it safe?
00:29:04:03 - 00:29:29:15
Unknown
Well, we know that cannabis has a very wide safety profile. Okay. What other medications are they using? So these are some of the questions that I like to ask people before I start initiating the conversation. What is your past history? What medications? But the people that I've worked with, it's been wonderful. Good. And I check in at least once a week.
00:29:29:18 - 00:29:58:27
Unknown
Good. I'm glad because, they need to hear about these positive outcomes, too. And spread the word and and know in their, in their within themselves that, you know, this is working. This is one of the things that can actually help. And so I hope that in those or those spaces, you know, I'm always surprised by like the number of people because people come in, you know, I work in the emergency department, people come in and you have cancer or whatever.
00:29:58:27 - 00:30:27:26
Unknown
And I'll be like, oh, well, are you using, you know, medical cannabis? And they're like, Now I'm like, what the hell? Like, you are the exact person that should be accessing medical cannabis, you know, and you could be afraid they could be a friend or they don't know who to talk to. I know that I've had a couple of, of instances where, they would be afraid of letting their primary know, especially if you're under some kind of contract, like an opioid contract.
00:30:27:26 - 00:30:47:07
Unknown
You mean a pain contract? And, you know, what do you do with that information? And I hear this a lot, too, when it comes to employment. What do you do with that information? Okay. So you're 30 for cannabis. What do you do with that information? That could have been months ago or not months ago. About a month ago.
00:30:47:07 - 00:31:08:06
Unknown
A couple weeks ago. Are you inebriated or under the influence right now? What does your job consist of? Right. What is the purpose of the testing? Right. I feel like here that is largely going away. And do you feel like also all that is going on in Wisconsin, too, like, kind of ending on the job? Sure.
00:31:08:09 - 00:31:32:13
Unknown
Depending on the job, I know that there's still a lot of fear. You know, there's a lot of fear of people that want to try for, you know, certain reasons in their life, but they're afraid of their job. Yeah. But I also know, especially in healthcare, that, some new hirings or even in other jobs, if you come up what is considered dirty for cannabis, they don't care.
00:31:32:15 - 00:32:00:20
Unknown
Yeah. And that's as long as, under the influence at work. Right. To the point where you can't do your job safely. Right. So there's a difference between consumption and impairment, right. And that is the differentiation that I think needs to be pointed out. Yes. Then and regularly. No, I agree with you and has the reason why we say, you know, if you're getting a new prescription, you're not supposed to drive for a while until you know how it affects you.
00:32:00:26 - 00:32:24:08
Unknown
Yep. Same idea, right? To know how much you're taking to see how it affects you. Exactly. No, I mean, you have to we have to counsel people. Like when we even give them Benadryl. Like, don't drive or operate. Having me for four hours. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, there's always those considerations that need to be taken into account.
00:32:24:08 - 00:32:48:22
Unknown
But you know, there's considerations for people having surgery that are going to go have surgery. Are you a smoker? You know, there's a lot of, a lot of things that we need to keep in the back of our minds when it comes to cannabis. It's not for everyone. There can be adverse effects, but largely it is really, as we spoke of, a great tool for wellness.
00:32:48:22 - 00:33:22:27
Unknown
And, you know, happiness and amongst other things in your life. Yeah. Better quality of life. Homeostasis, right? Yeah. Yeah. No. Can I have. So you've already talked about kind of what a big research nerd you are. What are some of, like, the exciting developments or changes that you hope to see in cannabis, both in the medical industries and in the retail industries?
00:33:22:29 - 00:33:59:03
Unknown
Are we talking about me personally or just. Yeah. Yeah, both. Oh, well, personally, I will be expanding into Minnesota. Okay. I love okay, snap. So that, making five milligram, 50 milligram packages perfect for Minnesota. Okay. So that's that's awesome. Awesome. I love, your guys's market. You guys, have good regulations in my in my, in my opinion, D9 is pretty much all you guys work with.
00:33:59:03 - 00:34:22:23
Unknown
And minor cannabinoids. There's none of this other stuff out there that, frankly, kind of terrifies me. Yeah. So I'm very grateful that, my packaging passed my edibles test. Awesome. I look forward to coming up there in about a month, I believe. Okay, what? To shop around and see who wants to carry your products. Nick, I believe is going to take.
00:34:22:23 - 00:34:45:06
Unknown
Oh, Nick. Oh, yeah. Okay. Oh, I love the I love this collaboration. This is so when I came out there to see you guys. Yeah. Which allowed me because I was given a little samples. Yeah, everybody was loving them. And I had to drive back to Madison, so I was there for about an hour. Then I had to drive for four hours back.
00:34:45:08 - 00:35:06:09
Unknown
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we talked and, he loved them. And the only problem was I had to make sure that they fit Minnesota's guidelines. Exactly. These shall help me out. Trying to figure out what I need to change. Okay. And then, when I finally decided to pull the trigger, I reached out to Nick, and he said, absolutely.
00:35:06:14 - 00:35:30:05
Unknown
That's perfect. So you're also not just making medicine that people need, but you're supporting veterans through that process. I love that, veterans are some of my favorite, patient populations. There are some, like I will say that hands down, they are some of my favorite. Yeah. So hard. Like, service to everybody, right? Oh. Outer shell. But once you get in there.
00:35:30:08 - 00:35:47:20
Unknown
Yeah, once you break that shell, they love you. And they can still be hard headed, but they will respect you, and they will look at you as a friend, and then they will actually start to listen to what you have to say. It is wonderful. Exactly. A friend for life. Oh, it's so great. It's so great, I love that.
00:35:47:20 - 00:36:18:00
Unknown
That's so. Yeah. When I found out about, kind of his stance and his history and so I was like, I couldn't think of a better place to start. Yeah. So to the audience, were referencing, Nick and I'm forgetting his last name. What's his last name? For the years garden in Saint Paul, the beautiful, dispensary located right there in Lowertown, near the farmers market with many, Minnesota brands.
00:36:18:00 - 00:36:42:06
Unknown
And he is a supporter. He is a veteran and he's, a supporter of veterans in a variety of ways. So please grant, what was it right for? Nick ran? Yep. That's it. Yeah. Great guy, great guy, totally great guy. And he does a lot of things just to build his community there. I know that on Thursday nights they have an open mic night.
00:36:42:06 - 00:37:10:21
Unknown
They do a comedy night. So he's really trying to bring folks in and and make sure that he's curating a community of people that can support each other. So it's it's Yeah, man. Right. Oh, great. So how about on a broader scale, what are some of the things you see kind of happening throughout the country and research and, what are you excited for?
00:37:10:23 - 00:37:35:14
Unknown
I'm excited. What? I hope to be more excited, if we're able to take cannabis from schedule one to schedule three, I would love it. I know what's going on politically with research. I would love to see more research. I know real world experience. In cannabis, isn't relied upon as much as it is with other pharmaceuticals.
00:37:35:17 - 00:37:55:03
Unknown
I would love for that to be incorporated too, but I just I ask that during an NIH meeting when they didn't reply. So I feel like that was kind of a mute point. Yeah. I would love to see some regulations here. Wisconsin. I would love that. I would love to be a part of that.
00:37:55:05 - 00:38:16:03
Unknown
I know for my final project that provided a senator which would have pages of bullet points for a cannabis proposal. Also, whether or not that's going to go through or whether or not that's even going to be used is another question. Everything is so, interesting right now politically. It's a nice word. And so you just never know.
00:38:16:03 - 00:38:43:03
Unknown
But I have hope. I have hope that things will even out. And I have hope that things will become safe. And, yeah, that's, on a larger, broader scale. I would just love to see more research. And I would love to see better options. Yeah, more research that are actually done on on humans. A lot of the research right now is done on animals and.
00:38:43:05 - 00:39:06:01
Unknown
Yeah. Yeah. So I think as that research opens up, we'll really get to see, the dynamic ways that cannabis can be helpful. And I'm, I'm a little excited for that. Are you going to be at Camp Med? You have to. When and where is that? Oh, June is can med. It's in Puerto Rico, I think.
00:39:06:02 - 00:39:33:17
Unknown
Oh that's right. Doctor. Done. Just a bunch of speakers. Doctor. Dustin. Sue, Las Vegas. Yep. Sandy Goldstein will be there. Yeah, I know he brought that up during our last meeting. Okay. It sounds absolutely. You know, I've never been out of the country. You know, it's still in the country. It's Puerto Rico. So have never been out of the, you know, and like, never.
00:39:33:19 - 00:40:00:20
Unknown
But, you know, be the passport to go there, buddy. No, but that's like just in my head, like anything I, I would love to. Yeah, that was wonderful. I will sign up for that. What's that? We got to get you signed up for that. I will work on it. Perfect. So one of the things I wanted to talk to you about, I had a really couple interesting guests.
00:40:00:20 - 00:40:32:19
Unknown
Come on. A couple of weeks ago, from new Jersey, where they have a. It's an insurance company that allows. It's like an employee benefit. So your employer can elect this program to be available to you, where you get discounts on, like, your cannabis therapies or discounts on getting your medical card or, you know, they also do like ketamine assisted therapy and, psilocybin assisted therapy to cat and pet.
00:40:32:19 - 00:41:04:06
Unknown
So they called it Pat and Cat. So this is really interesting to me. Another thing that they talked about was they have developed guidelines for the helping professionals in their city, Trenton, new Jersey, that allow them to access cannabis in a safe and healthy way. So let's say you're a police officer. The role would be then no cannabis consumption eight hours before your shift.
00:41:04:08 - 00:41:33:06
Unknown
And I just thought, this is incredible. We need these guidelines to be dispersed throughout the United States. And so, one of the things I hope that we can work on and we'll solidify things as far as like the legitimacy of cannabis, is working on some of those guidelines for helping professionals, because who doesn't love nurses? EMT is teachers, police officers, firefighters.
00:41:33:06 - 00:41:57:18
Unknown
You know, we're the people that get all this trauma dumped onto us. And so cannabis, you know, can be part of our toolbox again to, to navigate that and have a, a happy and well-adjusted life. So I need your help. Can you help me with that? I can do my best to enforce those rules. Those guidelines.
00:41:57:24 - 00:42:19:26
Unknown
Well, how would you test to make sure that, you know. Yeah, yeah. I mean, those are all really great questions, right? And and would have to be pieced out. So I just thought, I'm glad someone's thinking about this. Like someone actually cares. You know what I mean? Like I'm glad someone has given some forethought to like, helping professionals, being able to use cannabis.
00:42:19:26 - 00:42:43:15
Unknown
Like, you know, we have this chronic post-traumatic stress from Covid. Like, how many times have you heard someone story about I came to cannabis during Covid? I mean, I just heard it earlier today, you know, such a big part of what's happened to us. And, I don't know, I just was really excited about it. And I know how excited you get about stuff.
00:42:43:15 - 00:43:17:26
Unknown
So I was like, oh, I missed I like it. I mean, I do like it, because it's also more of a talking point, like, yeah, talk with people that are knowledgeable and safe. Yeah. And it kind of brings that into a conversation pressure. So I do enjoy that. Yeah. I do agree with you about those that face a lot of trauma, in, in their 40 hour work week, however many hours work and a lot of people will reach towards certain things.
00:43:17:29 - 00:43:39:16
Unknown
Right. Some of those will get you into trouble long term, and some of those things won't. And I'm glad that some people are choosing cannabis if they're choosing some kind of substance. You know, some people rely on exercise or, you know, cooking themselves a good meal. If you are reaching towards something, I'm grateful that some of them are reaching towards cannabis instead of pills or alcohol.
00:43:39:16 - 00:44:04:06
Unknown
And, that's my bias. That's my opinion. Yeah. Here, here. Yeah. That's that's what I prefer. I much would rather, talk with somebody that's under the influence of cannabis rather than something else. Yeah. For sure. I unfortunately spent a lot of time and a lot of time in the bar, so I, I prefer the cannabis because it's a little.
00:44:04:08 - 00:44:32:23
Unknown
The conversation is always a little bit different. For sure. It is. It's happier. It's easier. It's a little less intense. Nonviolent. Yeah. Any final thoughts? I'm just happy to be here. I thank you for letting us. Good to see you. Yeah. You too. I love what you're doing. And I just need, like, at least 50 more of you dispersed throughout the.
00:44:32:26 - 00:45:00:01
Unknown
So that week. And we got a lot of great people here. We got a great beard. We got some very knowledgeable individuals here, and I'm uncovering them or finding them or they're finding me. Yes. They're hiding, but they're here. You're right. And the more that I promote stuff on social, the more that, you know, I come up in random conversations like, I don't know what's going on behind my back.
00:45:00:01 - 00:45:21:07
Unknown
I don't know what is it said or discussed, but I do know that people reach out to me, yeah, that my products are going well. And I do know that the feedback I'm getting for my products has been nothing but positive. Yeah, you're right, those people are out there. And that was very evident by Hempfest. I met, almost all of the vendors out there.
00:45:21:07 - 00:45:45:21
Unknown
There was incredible growers that were throwing different chemo bars and really being in touch for saying that word. Yeah, being intentional about the medicine that they were growing and how it could fit into a patient's life and, and, and therapeutic regimen. So there was, you know, the shop owners that I spoke to really knew a lot about cannabis.
00:45:45:21 - 00:46:13:16
Unknown
I mean, they were on their ship. So incredible to see. And and, you know, Bobby Beans from legalized Wisconsin. He is a great advocate. And, yeah, I'm rooting for you guys big time. Thank you. Yeah, we could use all the help we can get. Just to make things safe and. Yeah, More open. Yeah. As it stands, the market is not super.
00:46:13:23 - 00:46:39:29
Unknown
From what I've seen, anyway. Isn't the most supportive of the cannabis patient the person that wants to access cannabis for as medicine, you know, needs a lower dose or needs a small entry way into the use of cannabis. So, but you know that that will change. We just got to keep banging that drum, right? Yeah. And I do want us to jet out here.
00:46:40:01 - 00:46:59:25
Unknown
There's the idea of of the more of the better. Package. We got that here too. The package says 35,000,000,000mg of THC in there for 50 bucks. That's what they want. Even though you can't really prove that that's what's in there, right? You know, but it's the package. It's right. It says it's all. It's got to be, right.
00:46:59:26 - 00:47:20:18
Unknown
I'm like, not necessarily. We don't have an oversight committee. There's no regulatory body that's checking our P's and Q's. And, that's why I like to stand out is, I know what mine are. I trust mine, it's got my stamp of approval on it. It's got my name on it. It's my baby. This is my baby.
00:47:20:22 - 00:47:42:15
Unknown
Yeah, exactly. So. Yeah. No, I'm. I'm very happy. Pleased. And I'm grateful for being here with you. Yeah. Awesome. Thanks again. Tell my audience where they can find you. Jesse. Yeah. I'm in Madison, Wisconsin. You can find me at cannabis gmp.com. Come to Madison. Oh, no. Madison. I'm here. Actually. I'm everywhere. I'm in Milwaukee. I'm in all types of places, but, yes.
00:47:42:21 - 00:47:57:03
Unknown
Visit me. Cannabis dmp.com. You can see a little bit more about me. You can see how my products are made. You can see the locations. I got Google Maps on there for you as well. And I'll be up there in Minnesota hopefully next month to say hello. And hopefully before that I'll be able to come up there.
00:47:57:03 - 00:48:18:02
Unknown
I'm sorry I couldn't make it this weekend. That's okay. Yeah, something kind of popped up and this weekend got a little good. Yeah. Like yes. You know. Yeah. No, you're not missing. I haven't even been yet. It starts tomorrow. The today was the industry day. So we're referencing Lucky Leaf. It's a big expo that's going on in the Twin Cities this year.
00:48:18:04 - 00:48:42:08
Unknown
So today was the industry day. I'm going to go tomorrow. I'm going to do a bunch of interviews. So, Yeah. Did I tell you remember when I told you that I would ask them to cut down the fees if I would? Yeah. No, they didn't never responded. Oh, I'm sure. Right. Sweet, I would, I would help set up and get accounts so I can set up a table how to respond.
00:48:42:16 - 00:49:05:17
Unknown
Oh, here's what they told me. I asked them for a press pass. They're like, yeah, you're not actually the press. No. I was like, oh, that's okay. That's that's kind of what I was like, check on me next year. Is it generally pretty large? Is it a big event? I think so I feel like they probably had maybe like, 15,000 people last year.
00:49:05:17 - 00:49:30:07
Unknown
I mean, there were quite a it was a pretty large production. I heard a couple of little whispers about people not really being so pleased with the production both this year and last year, but, you know, it's anybody who wants to do something better or thinks they can go for it. Yeah. So this is your first time?
00:49:30:09 - 00:49:51:26
Unknown
It's my second time. So last year I participated, I was part of the women's collective. So a bunch of women owned businesses got together and kind of and, and, and we all got to, you know, highlight our own individual businesses. We were on a panel. We did a panel together. And this year. Yeah, I'm just a tending and, doing my, my special interview.
00:49:51:27 - 00:50:14:27
Unknown
So fun. Well, I hope this year was better for you. I'll probably check in with you next week. Yeah. Please do. Please let me know when you're here. Let's link. Yeah, we can meet up at Nick's. Yes. Yeah. For sure. Okay, so after I left there that last time, you know, my my car. Oh my God, how long it was?
00:50:14:27 - 00:50:30:29
Unknown
It was a while I left and I started walking. I could have sworn I knew where I was going, and it was like, oh, I figured I'd take a ride to have, like, oh, you mean I gotcha? And I was like, this does not look, like anything. And then there's just a right. Oh my God, it flares.
00:50:31:02 - 00:50:51:05
Unknown
And eventually I find my car. Thank God. If it wasn't, if it wasn't for, like, Google Maps or anything to get me out of there, I would, I would still be circling, blocked it. Probably you know, you're right. Entrance to 94 there too. Like it's the easiest. Yeah, but where I was so like, I was always in the middle of nowhere.
00:50:51:08 - 00:51:30:15
Unknown
Oh, goodness. Yeah. Because I do like Christmas stuff. Yeah. So audience, we're referencing, an event that an event that was held at the Warriors Garden where we invited nurses to come out and learn more about cannabis nursing. And we do, anticipating having more of those events come about. So if you're a nurse or if you're in health care and you're interested in learning more about cannabis as medicine, please make sure you're following, our pages, and getting and getting in tune with us and getting tapped into, how you can become a cannabis nurse if you would like to do that or how cannabis.
00:51:30:17 - 00:51:53:02
Unknown
Yeah, this. We had a great time. I, I couldn't believe the turnout. I was so impressed. Yeah. And he's great. So then, you guys, you guys sent me home with a care package. Who? What did you get? Oh, my God, thank you. Alicia's husband gave me, like, four cans of. Oh, nice. That's something. It was from Pearl Giles.
00:51:53:02 - 00:52:17:03
Unknown
That Pippin, the 15. Yeah. Yeah, that's. Yeah, that's something we didn't talk about. What's your do? Are you comfortable sharing your personal experience with cannabis and your personal relationship? Yeah. No, no. So, to be honest with you, I rarely consume. Okay. Maybe three times a year. I know I tried my stress and anxiety taxes. Yeah, I tried them twice.
00:52:17:05 - 00:52:39:16
Unknown
But I did a half a one the first time, and that was too much. Okay, so that lasted for about 8.5 hours. I watched three movies during that time. I don't have any paranoia, and I ate about five whole chicken sandwiches. Yeah. It was, it was. Wow. You need to tell me this. All of this is just high.
00:52:39:22 - 00:53:10:19
Unknown
Life. Is that what this is? And caffeine? Yeah. Oh, and your martial arts that you do? Yeah. Yeah. No, I've. I've been to 20 years. But, yeah, a half a piece was a lot. I watch Beverly Hills Cop one through three. I had a bunch of food. I could do my legs, which is great, because the legs are hurting you are not supposed to be telling these stories, right?
00:53:10:22 - 00:53:29:15
Unknown
Hahaha. And then the second time I did a quarter, I had a quarter piece, and a quarter piece was good for about five hours and I felt but there I no I haven't, I had no paranoia, no anxiety, no cottonmouth, no nothing. It was just an enjoyable experience. Yeah. Just to show you how microdosing can really be life changing.
00:53:29:18 - 00:53:51:00
Unknown
It's wonderful. Yeah. Back in high school, we would, you know, smoke weed. Yeah. Smoke off the can. Yeah, yeah, the pot. Yeah. But that was so. And the cannabis was not the greatest back then. No. It was like, definitely ditch weed. That gave you a headache. Oh, you're the seeds popping when you smile. Yeah. It's like oh.
00:53:51:02 - 00:54:12:25
Unknown
But other than that, like when I got older I, you know, I but I had to try my product out so I could really tell consumers what I felt like to know what to expect. Oh, yeah. I mean, vetting the product is the best part about being a cannabis nurse. Let's face it, the flavors flavor them with no chemical aftertaste.
00:54:13:01 - 00:54:35:29
Unknown
Yeah. They're just absolutely wonderful. So that's kind of my history. Like, it's not very extensive. It is there. I like Bill Clinton. I did inhale, Yeah. And I'm not ashamed. Like, that is good. That's the best takeaway. You're not ashamed. You're not ashamed of it. Seriously, that is the best takeaway we need to be brave.
00:54:35:29 - 00:55:03:06
Unknown
We need to be brave and talk about it. It's it's. Yeah, it's there's no lethal dose. You know, you gotta smoke a lot of weed to die from camp, like, 600 pounds. Like it's. Yeah. 15 over 15,000mg. Yeah. That was in 2022, a research article that I had used. Yeah. So 750 times more than the normal, intoxicating dose.
00:55:03:08 - 00:55:34:13
Unknown
So. So there you have it. Audience. If you're looking for an entry point into cannabis, reach out to my good friend Jesse here, doctor Mercer cannabis, DNP, backwards for products and for guidance. And, you know, always be looking for that trusted source in information. You know, try your best to piece that out. Don't buy your cannabis from a gas station.
00:55:34:15 - 00:55:59:24
Unknown
And, yeah, if you're a medical patient, if you're on multi, if you're on multiple different medications or you have surgery coming up, you know, you might want to reach out to a cannabis nurse. So that's it for me. This is Molly the Cochrane. And you have reach Conversations with cash podcast. Make sure you like share, comment and subscribe.
00:55:59:27 - 00:56:12:01
Unknown
I'm available on YouTube and all audio platforms as well as Facebook and Instagram. So that's it. Have a great night. P thank you. Yes.
00:56:12:01 - 00:56:21:07
Unknown
You.