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The Healthy Project is hosted by Corey Dion Lewis, Clinical Health Coach fora safety net hospital. Because of his experience working directly with patients in underserved communities, Corey felt the need to speak up address the issues, and provide solutions to improve the healthcare experience for the ones that need it the most. The Healthy Project Podcast addresses topics related to health equity, prevention, diversity, and literacy for healthcare professionals addressing today's and tomorrow's biggest challenges. Thought leaders, entrepreneurs, and industry experts share their approaches to transforming healthcare into something meaningful and lasting.
00:02
Hello everybody. Thank you for watching the healthy project podcast. I'm your host Corey Dion Lewis. I got the homie today. I'm not even taking this seriously. I told you we'd start laughing right away. As soon as you start it. Yes. So Dr. Chayla Morris.
00:21
I'll let you break down your whole credentials because I know there's an alphabet behind your name and I don't wanna disrespect you, but not only are you a panelist for My City, My Health 2023, you're a panelist.
00:35
2022 for the very first My City My Health. Yes. And we're running it back. So tell the people who don't already know a little bit about yourself and what you do. Sure. So as you said, Dr. Shaila Morris, I'm a pharmacist by trade. My current title is clinical pharmacy coordinator at Brown Lens Medical Center. Most people don't quite know what that means. But I like to explain it as my main role is starting different pharmacy led services throughout the hospital, focusing
01:05
clinics, ambulatory care, but we also do a ton of community outreach and patient education and advocacy. Yeah, so a whole lot. Yes. A whole lot going on. And.
01:19
I had the opportunity, so as the health coach, I had the opportunity to work before we even got to work in the clinic. That project's a whole other story. We ain't gonna do that today. Well, it's a good background though. Yeah, yeah. But I think for a lot of people, it's like, how could a pharmacist and the health coach work together? You know what I mean? It's like, well, it works really well. We have a patient that really, really loves that she can see both of us on the same day.
01:49
But you won't be doing that anymore because you'll be coordinating the people who will be in the clinic. But I think that speaks to health care in general. It's all about collaboration. Right? So a pharmacist doesn't just deal with medication, even though we're experts in it. We still help with lifestyle things. Some patients may tell one provider something and not another provider. So I think we work so well together because we can collaborate on what's best for our patient. Yeah. And it just.
02:16
It works well. It was my first time collaborating with anybody outside of like just talking to the other health coach. Yeah. Yeah. You just showed up. What's up? Yeah. It was my first time is it was, I knew it was going to be cool. So we had already, we had already connected. But like, it was just like more curiosity of like, I wonder what it's going to be like working with the pharmacist too. And it was, it was dope. It was dope. So
02:46
My city, my health. Yes. Tell me your first thoughts from the first one. Let's start with that. Going into it, what were your thoughts? What did you think about My City, My Health? Well, and I had just started at Broadmonts too in April. Brand new. And then I think maybe by like June or July, you're like, hey, I'm putting on this conference. You want to be in it? And I'm like, OK, I don't know what you want me to talk about, but sure. So I went into it, and I didn't know what to expect.
03:16
And honestly my mind was blown. That's dope because I'm from Des Moines and I've grown up here born and raised We just have not had anything like this before Specifically around health equity and then all of the different types of people that we have in the city Where can we all come together to discuss topics like that? So I think this was the first conference of its kind where we could all come and just listen and just take in other people's
03:46
back off of each other. And it was such a vibe. It was such a vibe. And people think, like, you wouldn't think that that little piece would make a huge difference. It does. Man. It's that inclusion piece. We didn't feel like. I didn't think it was the inclusion piece. It's inclusion. Just because you're in one sector or one field, you didn't feel separated. Right. We were all together and learning from each other. Definition of inclusion. Definition. Definition of inclusion.
04:15
the reason why not only because you were the homie and the reason why I wanted you specifically in the prevention panel
04:25
was because of my experience with being the health coach and working with the pharmacist. And I don't think we were really working, I don't know if you were in the clinic seeing patients quite yet, but the idea of pharmacy and prevention was intriguing to me. And I don't think a lot of people make that connection. I don't think so either, but I love that because I get to help explain it to people. So most of- Explain that to us. A lot of times, and well, it makes sense, right?
04:55
with you so you get a medication and so it's treatment but a lot of medications also prevent further disease further complications or further worsening of organs or other disease states and so sometimes people have to take a medication to prevent you know a future heart attack or stroke sometimes we're taking something to protect our liver or kidneys and then I always love to tell people my favorite part is if I can take you off medication too because while
05:25
uh solve or fix what's going on right now. We're also learning other skills like that lifestyle piece, nutrition, right or whatever else since I mostly work in chronic disease states and so once we're getting that information then we can back off of those medications. Yeah and I think I think pharmacists get a get a bad rap. Yeah you know I think it's slowly changing um for good or for worse the pandemic pushed pharmacy kind of out to the
05:55
forefront because we had to do a lot of things we weren't used to and you couldn't always go into your physician's clinic or doctor's appointments or anything like that. So a lot of the times the only person a patient was able to talk to was a pharmacist. Right. Something I heard during that time too from other pharmacists was, let me work at the very top of my license. Mm-hmm.
06:19
But what is that for you? What does that look like? If you were to work at the very top of your license, what does that look like for you? So a lot of people don't know that a pharmacist does have a doctorate degree. We went to school for four years. We learn all about the medications, but also what it does to the body. We learn about lab values. We learn how to interpret things and adjust management of disease states or medications. And so while I don't want to diagnose or tell you what's going on,
06:49
you figure out what's best for you in your specific situation. And so I think a lot of the people, especially when they think of the community pharmacy setting or retail, they're like, Ah, all right, you got my prescription, why don't you just slap a label on it and put it in a bottle and hand it out to me. They don't know we're checking to see if there's drug interactions, we're trying to see if you know, you're supposed to have this medication or it's the correct dose for you. And then there's other types of pharmacy. So we have
07:19
oncology pharmacists. We have anything where you have a physician, there's a pharmacist. And so in our primary care clinic and what we started, once the physician or provider decides, hey you need like a little bit more in-depth education or management, go see our pharmacist. I see those patients actually more frequently than they go see the physician. And we get to really hone in and focus on that. And from my experience, and I hope my patients
07:49
experience, they just come out so much more educated and empowered about what's going on with them. Yeah. And then from a health coaching perspective, I don't gotta worry about that because I already know you're gonna deal with it. You know what I mean? Even even if if they're seeing you before they see me or they're seeing me and then they're seeing you, I know that I don't have to work. They're they're gonna ask questions. Well, I'm on this medication. This that and the third. Have you said, have you met Shaila yet?
08:16
And I do the same thing So we talked a little bit about our eating habits, but have you talked to our health coach Cory? Yeah, he'd be great and I love when we get to tag team. Yeah, I'll see someone I'm like, okay go wait in the lobby and I'm knocking on your door. Hey Cory. Let me talk about this It's it's so it's so awesome and I think for a lot of people myself included because
08:44
sit the same way people don't think there's health coaches in clinics. Right. Like I feel like a lot of people think when they think pharmacists, they think Walgreens or whatever. And we need those pharmacists too. Absolutely. Absolutely. But
09:00
they're not thinking why would a pharmacist be like in the clinic? Oh yeah. You know what I mean? Even the first couple of times I might see a patient, they're like, okay, so who do I need to talk to to change my medication? I'm like, what? I can do that for you because I have an agreement with your provider and they've said, Hey, we can do this. Everything's charted. Everything's documented, but trust me, I know what's going on with this medicine. When you come in next time, when you're telling me all of these side effects or symptoms, the pharmacist is probably the one that's going to be able to identify what's going on.
09:30
talk about side effects and stuff like that real quick because um I think that's kind of maybe where a little bit of the bad rap comes from is they're gonna give me a pill that's supposed to help my left arm then my right leg goes numb I don't want that
09:51
neighbors grandma took it and we're in the hospital now and I'm not doing that. So how do you combat that because that can be any medication. Yeah that's not your fault but we did not make the drug. You didn't make the drug but how do you
10:10
knowing that there will be side effects. Do you, do you prepare your patient for that? Like, what are some of the things that you're trying to like, let them know, like, Hey, these could happen. They not like, how does that conversation go? Yeah, again, it all goes back to education and empowerment. So when we're deciding on kind of next steps, because I do have that extra time, I kind of talk through why I'm choosing that for them. So, Hey, we're talking about medication X. I think this would be good for you because it'll help. I'll just talk about
10:40
for a second. It'll help lower your blood sugars. You might see some weight loss here and I know those are goals of yours that you want to work on. Now here are some common side effects. Kind of run through the generic list. Some people will get that little pamphlet and it's got 20 different things on it so we have to kind of talk about that but I let them know hey these are common side effects. Some of them you know may go away over time. If it's ever overly
11:10
issue, patients will just stop but not tell anybody. So say you didn't have that close follow up, your provider started doing something, you have an appointment in three months. Well, you took it and you didn't feel good for a couple days. So you stopped and nobody knew for three months. Yeah. And so now we have some like clinical inertia going on where it's not like your readings or values are getting better. No one knows you're not feeling good because of the medication or it could even assess if that was the true reason. And I just kind of stagnant for three months.
11:40
Yeah, because that communication wasn't there. Exactly. And so I always try to empower my patients. I'm like, you contact me if something's going on. If there's an issue with price, you let me know. If for some reason you couldn't get it for a couple of days or it's too expensive, we have different avenues. And so I think just letting the patient know that you're not just giving them something, but you're part of a team with them. Yes. And that's the other part. When we're talking going back to prevention,
12:10
Yes. Is.
12:12
the information that you can give a patient. Knowledge is power. And one, they don't know where to, I mean, I can only assume a lot of them don't know where to start. Oh, for sure. They don't know what questions to ask. And allowing them to ask those questions in a safe place and you being able to give them the resources. I've experienced you even finding resources for people to get maybe lower co-pays or prescriptions.
12:42
or whatever the case may be. And I think a lot of the times people, just like you said, they don't know how or what to ask. And so they don't know that there are resources available. And so that's a really difficult thing, I think, for some people to get over to. Because when you go into a physician's office or a doctor's office, you're like, OK, cool. They're going to tell me what to do. You have to advocate for yourself, too, and let them know what your health goals are. Do you feel like you do a lot more education in your session with your patients?
13:12
Oh yeah. Then you thought you would or? I would honestly probably say most of the times the first session I may not even make a change unless it's something like crazy. Crazy. It's more of like a hey we're getting to know you, what are your goals, what are things that you want to work on or what are things you want to avoid, right? Going back to that prevention piece, I have a ton of patients that have a huge family history for cardiac or heart issues, they have had someone had to get something amputated
13:42
happened to them in the past and they don't want that experience again. So I need to know that. So that way when we're making changes or coming up with a plan, we can keep that in the forefront. Right. Have you, have you ever experienced somebody that you were, you were helping them with their medication, they were doing everything they could do or they can. And there was a time where you're like, Hey, you don't need this medication, right?
14:12
someone being like scared of that. Yeah. Like, yo, like I don't want to get off this medication. Yes. And I think that it's such an interesting piece of our health care too, because medications don't fix everything. They do a ton. But especially in the primary care, you know, family medicine, chronic disease world, it's helping. But then there's other things we have to work on. And sometimes people will use it as a crutch a little bit. Yeah.
14:42
That's hard to tell someone, right? And it's like, no, you can do this. And so what I personally like to do with patients, I'm always like, OK, well, let's kind of reduce. We'll go down on the dose, see how it's going. If your readings go back up or whatever, cool, we know. But if it goes down and it's fine, that's a good thing, right? That's a good thing. That's what we want. You don't have to be afraid of change, whether that's starting something or stopping something. And again, I just think it goes back
15:12
to letting them know what to expect, letting them know you're available to answer questions and that safe space, especially when it comes to their healthcare. Yeah, I find that very, very funny. It's interesting. I also have some patients, I tell them they don't need to necessarily see me anymore and they're like, but I wanna keep coming to see you. I wanna keep coming. I'm like, so now I just tell them like, no, you graduated. You graduated. Oh, that's so, you've graduated.
15:42
Congratulations. If you need me, I'm here, but you don't need me right now. You got this. Right. Now go help somebody else. I know. I feel like people get so attached to the person that they feel like, you did save, you saved their life in a way, right? So it's like, well, if it wasn't for Chayla or whomever,
16:06
my A1C wouldn't be normal if I leave them. Now I'm scared. Even though they've done, they're the ones going out for the walks. They're the ones making sure they're taking their medications on time. And that's what I tell them, like, you did this. When you leave this office, you have ample time and space to do whatever, but you chose to do the right thing. And that's why you're improving and can stay that way. And you're preventing other things from happening to you.
16:36
What are some things that you're working on right now as far as prevention going into the fall, school, all that. What are some things that you're doing currently to get prepared for prevention? Yes. School season means kids need vaccines, kids need physicals, so we're kind of prepping the hospital, getting ready for that. Especially, you know, there's a lot of vaccine hesitancy and stuff and I won't get too much into that.
17:06
know what is safe. At the end of the day you do what's right for you but we also need to protect our community too. One thing we've been ramping up and we've talked about this before we started our meds to beds program so when patients are getting discharged from the hospital on the inpatient side we're able to bring up their medications to them and counsel them before they leave and I just think that's been fantastic because one patients know exactly what's being
17:36
me out of here. I'm ready to go. I don't want to stop anywhere and wait for like another hour for my medicines. But we're also catching you know, any cost issues. Sometimes patients don't always pick up their medicines. But if we know that we can send like a heads up to the provider and say, Hey, FYI, Johnny didn't take this antibiotic right now. So maybe you mentioned that or you know, discuss something at your follow up visit. So there's
18:05
great because so many things can go wrong when you leave the hospital. What if you don't exactly know what's changed and they told you stop something but you have two bottles of it at home. Now you're taking that with something new they gave you and it's not a good look. So just that extra counseling and education piece I think has been so great. So we're really hoping to expand that soon. Are there a lot of systems that have pharmacists as part of care teams? So like from.
18:35
my own experience, health coach.
18:38
I don't know of a whole lot of places in Iowa that have a health coach and a pharmacist are part of a patient's care team. I personally don't know many. I have a friend who's a health coach in New York. He's a part of a care team and they do. They almost had almost the exact same setup as far as having a pharmacist, health coach, they have a social worker and their provider. So they've got everybody.
19:08
I love working with social workers too. Yeah, they have the whole thing, right? Is it not as common to have a pharmacist as a part of a care team? Or is it more common than I just don't know? A little bit of both, if that makes sense. Explain, please. So in the hospital setting, there's definitely a pharmacist. I think it also depends on your size too, right? Because you said your friend is from New York. So they've got a ton of people, a lot larger teams. Somewhere like Iowa.
19:38
have them just not in every single one at least in primary care or family medicine like because I'm ambulatory care right so that means you walk in and you walk out because I don't know every single day
19:54
Um, but ideally it's just another supportive piece and one pharmacist can help, you know, multiple physicians, obviously. And so it's just one thing that takes something off of the provider's plate. It's something that offers more education and support to the patients. And then it's just a different viewpoint too. One person can't do everything. Like we need that collaborative team. Absolutely. That's so cool. So talking a little bit more about the conference this year, you're back on the prevention panel.
20:24
Is there anything that you're excited about talking about something that you want to talk about? that maybe we talked about last year we didn't or whatever is there anything that is That you're hoping comes out of this year's conference
20:41
That's kind of a loaded question because last year was so awesome. Last year was so awesome. Ma'am. And I, another reason why I think this conference is so cool is because it's so organic. Yeah. And the conversations and the ideas that come out of it, you can try to prep but you can't really prep so it's cool. Yeah. But I think that one thing I really want to reinforce is we're all in this together, right? Even if you're not in healthcare, there's someone that's having health issues.
21:11
that listens to you and there's someone that maybe just needs that extra push or extra you know in words of encouragement to do what they need to do yeah and so that is so important I don't think people realize the weight that their words have yo that's that's real
21:33
Because don't know the weight that their words have. Yeah. Because I've had patients come in and they were like, you know, this person said this to me, or I've been through this. And it just takes one person to push them in that right direction. And you can do that regardless of if you're in the health care space or not. Yeah, that's so true. And that's what, Chayla, if I'm being honest, I have an honesty moment right now.
22:03
Yo, I'm so nervous about this conference. Why? Let's talk about this for a second. Let me interview you. Let's talk about this for a second. Because the first conference went triple platinum. It did. And everybody's waiting for the second album to drop. Oh, and you don't want to hit that sophomore slump. I don't want to hit that sophomore slump. Now mind you, I had Iowa City. I'm not trying to discount Iowa City.
22:31
You know what I mean? This is the OG conference. But this is the OG conference, right? There's a higher expectation for Des Moines. And don't get me wrong, we got some killers on the, like we got some heavy hitters on this, on this, we got some coming back. You, we have a couple other ones that come back from last year. But man, I am like, please, why do I gotta hit somebody with a folding chair to make this thing go viral?
23:05
Like, I can't, this can't, this can't. I'll say this, cause it can. I mean, I don't have any control. Whoever's there is gonna get very valuable information. Oh yeah. And it's gonna be fire.
23:21
But I just put so much pressure on myself for it to be the same level of energy as last year. I think the energy was there because, like you said, it was never inclusive. And it was never really done before like that. So as people were coming in and seeing it, you could see the energy level rise. Like, yo, this is not what I was expecting. Well, let me put on my supportive team member
23:51
hat for you. It's not just you, right? So especially because some of the panelists have been there before, people kind of know what to expect a little bit, right? Not everything. I think they're already going to come in with that energy. Yeah. And that's what makes it amazing. If you come in there with your authentic self, you're open, and you're just accepting what's going on. And you're really willing to listen and
24:21
have those conversations, that's what makes it amazing. Yeah. It's not just you. It's a lot you, don't get me wrong. No, no, I know exactly what you're saying though. It's a team that creates that atmosphere. Yeah, absolutely. That's gonna keep making people want to come back. You know what I'm excited about? Because last year, you were hella nervous. Oh, I was so nervous. So nervous. Because it was like, listen, like I said, you asked me to do this.
24:51
three months into my job. I'm still figuring out what do I even do at work so I don't get fined and I still get this paycheck coming in. I've never been on a panel before ever. You have me up next to people that have done like such amazing fantastic things. Zekia with her business. Dr. Harvey who's like such a pillar and I'm sitting here like okay cool I guess Cory wants me to be
25:21
But I can't wait to see the confidence in the sweat. Yeah, I've been here this time. I know what's up. I will take that challenge. Yes, I am Dr. Chayla Morris. Well, and I think that it's hard to see yourself in that position, too. Like, you can say amazing things about me, and I'm like, boy, stop. And I can do the same to you. And you're like, girl, please. But that's kind of what it's all about, too. Like, we hype each other up because we're awesome as a community. We do great things.
25:50
Yes, and that's gonna be so much fun. I am not on a panel this year, so I'm like super excited just to like take it all in. Are you not moderating anything? No, well I wasn't supposed to moderate last year. Oh, okay, you stepped it up. Shout out to Jodie Long, because she was supposed to be the moderator for the first panel, but she got sick. Oh yeah, okay, okay. So she couldn't do it, so I stepped in. So that's kind of what I'm doing, I'm like the sixth man. So like if anybody has an issue or can't do it,
26:20
I'll step in, you know what I mean, and be a moderator. But honestly, I just want to soak it all in. It's like...
26:28
watch, like all these great people talking about great, dope stuff. Can I tell you one thing I remember from last year? So no, it's good. It's good. OK. So on my panel, when we had the Q&A, right? Yes. It kept going and going. Chayla. And I loved it. But then I looked down, and I was like, are we still supposed to be talking? Like, is there a time limit? No.
26:54
I swear I might have even looked over at you once I was like, are we? Because it was like
26:59
almost 30 minutes. It was something ridiculous. But I loved it. It was it was so good that we had to add more time. I wasn't expecting that. Yeah. How like that's how you know your audience is engaged. They're there for the right reasons. This is not a conference where you're like, OK, well, my job is making me go. So let me go. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I guess I got to do this thing. Like everyone was there because they wanted to be. Everybody had had something.
27:29
to say and you can tell it was it was from a sincere place it wasn't like a let me get the mic so I could talk about what I want no it was very authentic but imagine being the one running the conference and being like yo we supposed to have a break five minutes ago we gotta stop so then what can mean Larry
27:59
like say one more, like we got to. Just cut off the mic, just start playing the, what is that, the send off music from the stage? But it was such a natural back and forth. And so I'm very excited to see that again. It's been a year. People have learned, people are doing different things. So it's just gonna be a lot of newness. A lot of newness, a lot of excitement. And it's going to be dope. And hopefully on time.
28:27
As much as it can be. Chayla, thank you so much for doing it. Thank you. I knew it was going to be dope. I wasn't even stressed about it. But for those who are listening, watching, that uh...
28:42
want to connect with you, where can they find you? You can find me on LinkedIn, Chayla Morris, FarmD, BCACP. Open to any questions, comments, ideas. Consulting. Yes, consulting. Not only on pharmacy related things, but health equity, DEI, and the health care space, and inclusivity with collaboration on health care teams. Yeah. Can we talk about your consulting? Yeah, sure. Yeah. A little bit. Tell me.
29:12
Tell me, I know you just said, you know, DEI, pharmacy, everything. What can you do for like, what do you do for an organization? Like what you say? I can consult for you. What's the home run for them? What do they get? You are getting a new aspect in view of ideas of how.
29:33
in this super weird landscape of healthcare we're in right now, because it's very awkward. And I think there's a lot of changes, not only for providers and people on the team, but for patients as well, how we can open those doors so that everyone feels safe and everyone feels like they are cared for and they're in a place where they need to be. Like I said, whether that's the providers because there's been a lot of issues with staff being treated.
30:03
inappropriately, whether that's in an organization or outside of it from the patients, whether that's the patients coming in and feeling like they can be their authentic selves and deserve the best care that they need. That's what I can help you out with. See what kind of...
30:17
issues are going on and how we can effectively fix those. That's real. And I'll make sure I link your LinkedIn profile for anybody that wants to connect with you and rock with you on, um, getting their organization back on track. I appreciate you, Corey, from day one. You're like, we're into this together. I'm like, okay, cool. But you, you've always meant it. And I appreciate that. Oh, of course. You're the homie. Everybody again, Sheila, thank you for being here. Thank you for having me.
30:47
Thank you for watching the healthy project podcast. I'll let you next time.