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Yappin’ about real life and the OG.
Thing that you mentioned in your testimony that I don't hear a lot of people talking about always is, necromancy, where you're saying, like, either speaking to, for me, it was spirit guides or guardian angels. And so I love that you brought up angels because I do believe angels are real, but I don't think that it's necessarily something that we can or should communicate with. But I was kinda curious on your experience with that. And one, what is necromancy for somebody that might not know? And then two, kind of like what was your experience with that?
John:So this topic as well, this was one instance that made me realize and study, okay, what is sin? What is a transgression of the law? So, if you go to the New Testament, there there is nothing about necromancy in the New Testament at all. It doesn't it doesn't mention it at all. So, I am like, okay.
John:If the law is done away with, like, was what I was doing, was it a bad thing? Sure. You could say that it's not following the greatest one of the two greatest commandments Christ says, which is love the lord god with all your heart, soul, strength, and mind and then love your neighbor as yourself. You could categorize that in there because you're not loving him and trusting with with what he has for your life and all of that. But specifically, it mentions plenty of other things, what not to do in the New Testament that are pulled directly out of the Torah, the front of the Bible.
John:And when I saw that I was like, wait a minute, so how am I supposed to view this? Was what I was doing actually necromancy or not? And this is kind of what was the catalyst for me going like, oh, he what was actually going on in the Old Testament when the law was written to guard us from, the instances are so much more insane and like aggressive than what people are doing. So in my testimony, I says I was necromancy. Like it is because you are.
John:But it's unintentional. You're not like that's where that's where we would go back to, like, the fine line of what it is. It's like, yeah, you're doing something, and God is just. So you're you are dabbling in things that are not like, you'll be judged on that. But, like, are you condemned for it because you're not you're not you're unintentionally doing it?
John:I don't think so but the more you learn, you step away from it. You repent. Your sanctification is about, you know, trying to be more Christ like and walk like him and and repent and not understanding what you're doing wrong. Yeah. So, but again, extremely tangible, real experiences all through my life of doing that and like, so you're you're it's jarring to be like, I was wait, this is an abomination to God, what I was doing?
John:Well, I'm sorry. I wasn't intentionally doing it. And then you get to the stories of what necromancy actually is where you're summoning the witch of Endor and all of that stuff. It's like you're actually they were actually trying to summon the dead to get it to appear in front of them. But to the degree when you actually get to the context of what like the necromancy sort of things in the Old Testament, I don't think it's necessarily what a lot of, yeah, you're dabbling in things that you shouldn't be doing by trying to say you have spirit guides and all of that.
John:I don't necessarily know that would be necromancy. But so anyway, to kind of get to that, it's real and I I don't know. I also don't know if like dreams, like if if a dead one comes to you in your dream, if that's like, I definitely don't think it's really them. Like it's a vision that's going on. But where it could be is like you start, but this could then be like divination is like whatever they're like conveying to you or whatever you wake up the next day and try to interpret of that dream.
John:You're it sort of is, but it isn't. It's like divination and necromancy sort of like combined in a way. But again, you're without knowing it, like, don't know what you're you don't you're accidentally you're unintentionally doing it. You're lost. You just haven't had the word of God given to you and, taught to you.
John:So you're just you're lost. You're a spiritual person, but you just haven't came to the truth of what the Bible actually says. I don't know. Those things that it's a fact that it is super fascinating but it's very real. It's not like he would not tell us the all these things.
John:All the things that he says not to do in an abomination to It's not that they're fake. Like, he doesn't tell us not to do them because they can't be done. Like, it all can be done. So, yeah, spirit guides my whole life. All of that.
John:Anyone that would die in that died recently in my life, like when I was a child, you hear like, oh, they go and they, you know, they're they're up in heaven now. They're your guardian angel and all of that. And that that was like the foundation of my spiritual beliefs my whole life. I'm like, oh, okay. That's cool.
John:And I just went along with it. It's not like I denied anything of the Bible. I just didn't know I was complete. I was just deceived, massively deceived. And a ton of people are.
John:But it's, again, like, in the law, is forgiveness. There's a there's a complete process and system in place for that unintentional sin. It's it's there and so it's like, man, this is like god. He's that's how merciful he is. He loves he he loves us and he he's very, you know, he's slow to anger.
John:He's that's that's the character of god and so sometimes like there's an overreaction that happens with also I went through it and it happens to a ton of people that come out of new age. I see it all the time because you are being battled. I feel like when that happens, they know how vulnerable you are and how much learning you have to do to understand really what's going on in scripture. So that period of time where you're trying to like sort things like these things out. I I fully do believe that the adversary unclean spirits pester like no other for all these people.
John:And that's why it's so intense. And people will rebound and be like I was something that may not actually, you know, like, it's where you start applying like demons are behind everything and it's it's reasonable to say that because it's it's an intense period of time and it does feel like that like it really does feel that way Two people that are saying that stuff but it just it just takes more growth and understanding scripture to know and it's that also is more peaceful as well because yeah, you start to realize like, I don't I don't know if. Yeah, like, these things, there's a, we are in a spiritual battle, like, that's a, it's a, it's a real thing. But also to know and having got go through those crazy, that, that period of time where you're learning that, and knowing how intense it is. You're just a little baby.
John:You're on the milk of the word. And you're trying to learn tell me the answers. You're trying to ask everyone. And you fully know you're being pestered by unclean spirits. And it's a crazy time.
John:So you get through that. And you're like, you're essentially like, deliver, you get through that chaotic period, at least for me. I'm like, well, I don't think anything. It's like so hard for me to believe that anything can come my way again to equate to that. So that gives me peace as well.
John:I'm like, well, I made it through that. It was intense. There were so many things going on with me in that period of time from where I sort of first picked up the Bible. Girl had told me all my spiritual beliefs were completely wrong and abomination to God. And I was like, well, prove it.
John:You know, I asked God to prove it. And from that period of time until I like, I wanna say in my testimony, I there was periods of time where it went away. I had to like weight lifted off my shoulder but once I put that testimony out, I I had so much crazy stuff happen to me again and I was like, dude, this is insane like literally out like so as I was just about to put that testimony out, my truck so the last it took me a few weeks to put it together, edit, and all this stuff. The last, like, five days or something, like, right before I put it out, my truck the transmission went out in my truck. And from the April all the way till the July, I didn't have my vehicle more than five days in a row that whole period of time.
John:It was it was in the shot. Like, something new would happen to it every and then that made me go, like, can can, like, unclean spirits, can the demonic realm affect objects and like make this stuff like what's going on? This is insane. And it was right after it made me like get kind of like not remote like sort of like angry at god because I'm like, I just, what are you doing? Like, I just put a testimony out and in that period of time, I was like, I got humbled hard.
John:Like, it was crazy. And then shortly after that, July to October, and then that fed into the eschatology stuff, I was, I started to realize like, you know, you just, you learn, you learn more and you grow in the word and you start, there's just so many things that that started coming my way. It was literally, I was being like led through all of these, all meant to happen, all of it, every single one of it, like all of it because some things that I put in my testimony, I I included teaching in it, like, subtly, and like the gospel, it starts out that way, all that stuff. There's things in it. So much stuff in that testimony that I don't agree with at all anymore.
John:Like, my doctrines, everything, my understanding of stuff has changed so much and so, like, yeah, that's just, it's just part of growing and and understanding, you know, scripture and, and yeah, getting to the point where you are just, you're always supposed to be growing and studying the word and everything. But it's, it was very tangible. What was happening in my life as I was learning and growing and studying the word, things became more more, you know, and I repented of more things that I learned and all this stuff and I don't know. But yeah, the object thing, which is this was another thing that happened. I'm like, because it was wild.
John:I used to go to this Tuesday night home group. And one of the people went to my church and they were I kept sending them every time something would happen to my truck. It was literally like every three days. They were like, dude, this is I've never seen anything like this. It was straight like from the April, it was nonstop and then so finally, one day and they were very like Calvinist.
John:They they I don't think they're cessation or they were cessationist But they were like, yeah, I used to think anointing oil and all this. So we literally went out one day after I was telling everyone, I'm like, dude, I can't catch a break. Things are so chaotic in my life right now, all this stuff. And so we literally got oil. And a handful of us went out and prayed over my vehicle with anointing oil.
John:And it all stopped. Everything stopped. And I was like it made me like, okay, so can demons what is going on? And then that made me study what idolatry was in the Old Testament. Was like, they were trying to summon demons into objects.
John:That's like what false god idol worship was. It's like, okay, it is possible whether or not like demons were infesting my truck. I don't I don't know about that, but it it does seem to be that like that that spirit world can actually like tamper with the like tangible reality. I think that's what went on with my bookshelf as well. Like, that was that's in the testimony and stuff.
John:So
Micaela:Yeah. That was a huge thing too because you were saying you were taking out the one eye symbolism from your product. And it wasn't around that time that you were like about to release, like why you did that as to like all those things. You said, I think it was like a three month period of time where like just things started going crazy. Is that what you said?
Micaela:Like in your testimony, it was because of that you think?
John:Well, it it was those books. So all of my spiritual beliefs and, like, my understanding of spirituality and all my searching of, like, trying to understand what the spirit world's about and everything, all of that, it was all in those books. They were all new age books. And, you know, some self help books, like all that kind of stuff was in those books. And it, you know, a lot of them were, you know, about like carrying over like psychedelic experiences and how do you like, you know, sort of a lot of people correlate the eye of raw with like any the all seeing eye with your third eye, your pineal gland.
John:That's like a it's a heavy thing that's people connect those two like pretty pretty heavily, even though they're different things, it's the different thing. But that's what I was doing that. And so a lot of what was in all those books and all my spiritual understandings and learnings and all of that nonsense was in those books. So 2020 is when I had to change packaging because of the supply chains. So I decided to change the logo because in 2020, I was starting to see this idea of like the Illuminati and the powers that be were controlling things.
John:And that was being associated with the one eye symbolism. So I was like, okay, this symbolism is now attached to your personal spiritual experiences through your third eye. And that blending, I thought was like a hijacking that had occurred with sort of, yeah, that sort of all that symbolism and Illuminati and all that kind of stuff. It's real. It is.
John:I mean, like Freemasons, like you look at all the depictions of Freemasonry, they have that eye, the all seeing eye thing. I won't get into it now, but it I I think that's where Satan's throne is. It's it's a long topic. You are you are like yeah. It is it is worshiping Satan full on, but it gets blended.
John:It got blended into like Egyptian culture and all of that because it it is all the same. Every every culture and religion and all the gods of all of those cultures and religions, they're found in the Bible. It's not like they're different. It's this Satan just repurposes himself to different cultures all throughout time. When the when the tower fell of Babel, everyone was on the same page worshiping the same false god and then their language was confused.
John:They get scattered throughout the Earth. Well, that same story stuck with them. So, those cultures that started popping up all over the world, that folklore and the story of that one god they were worshiping which was Satan is what gets what becomes their the the the religion and the gods that they worship in this. So, yeah, you start to learn that. So, in those books, like I said, all that was in there and I had learned all that stuff and I had incorporated with the logo.
John:I thought that that idea of like our pineal gland and spiritual experiences and like psychedelics and all of that. I thought that whole concept had been hijacked by, you know, the Illuminati and the people that like to use that symbolism. So I was like, I'm stepping away from it. I'd rather not be a part of it. I wasn't in the faith at this period of time.
John:I was like, I don't want to be associated with it. It makes me look like I'm part of this secret. You see the one eye symbolism in Hollywood and all that kind of stuff. And you're like, oh, there is something going on. Is this like a secret society sort of thing?
John:So I'm like, I don't want to be I don't want people thinking I'm part of that. I got to change it. But like I said, this was before Chris. Then two years later, I made a video explaining why I didn't why I changed the logo, kind of touching on that topic very briefly in a very quick short sort of beating around the bush video. But the day that I was gonna post it to tell the world why that was, I go to walk into this room, literally the door right here, and on like the bush bookshelves back up.
John:But I walk into the room and where I learned the the spirituality that is behind that symbolism and that understanding came from those books. So the day, literal day that I was gonna repent of essentially sort of a repentance of like why I didn't wanna be associated with that symbolism or why changed the thing I did, the logo in the way that I did. I walk into the room and yeah, the foundation, like where I learned about it, it was all on the ground, scattered on the ground. The bookshelf had came off my wall. I, since only a few weeks before that is when I picked up the Bible and I was in spiritual warfare.
John:Because I was brought into the Bible through the Old Testament. I was not brought into the Bible hearing about Jesus. It's like not at all. And so I didn't know Christ yet. I didn't understand.
John:So I think I that there is an aspect of being vulnerable in that period of time to where you're not your your faith truly isn't in Christ yet. He's not you don't fully believe that, you know, he's he's been given authority over, you know, all authority has been handed over to him. And so his name does have authority and like, it does seem to be that, you know, the demonic realm has to submit to that sort of that authority that like that is in his name. And that's why you kind of when we started, like you can call on his name and like things do dissipate. So I did.
John:I was in that period of time of chaoticness. I was calling on his name but I didn't know yet. I didn't like I was not taught in-depth as to like why Christ was given to us. So I didn't believe in. So I would think I was vulnerable in that period.
John:And also I think the the spirit world, the unclean spirits and the adversary, I think they knew just my character of who I am, was not gonna hold back of like sharing any of this and being someone that's like starts telling people about Christ and all that. They didn't want to make it easy for me. So it was like, was being attacked to the point to where I walk in this room and bookshelves on the ground. I'm I curl into the fetal position. I'm like it was like literal spiritual attack.
John:Like, I felt like I'm being I couldn't function. My brain was like locked, seized and locked up. I'm like, dude, this is this is unreal. This is and so then I'm like, okay. Was that a demonic thing?
John:I still wrestle. I'm like, would that have been demons that tried to knock the bookshelf off the wall? Because that seems to be, like obvious. Like, why would they wanna do that? You get what I'm saying?
John:Like why? Like, why would they wanna to reveal themselves in such an obvious way to knock books onto the ground? It seems to be more like that would have been an angelic thing that happened where it was like possibly angels ripped it off the wall as to be like, well, you prayed to God and asked, show me, like prove it to me. And then it did happen.
Micaela:Your books are on the ground. Yeah. Yeah.
John:I get that. Yeah. For sure. It's a hard thing but that does. It it fits exactly with what you said in the beginning where you're asking is like, where's the line?
John:Like, where do you go? What was I? You get what I'm saying? So, it's it is hard but yeah, I think I think the more there's there's there's a topic or something about scripture where it's like, I can't remember where it was, but if you were to like, look up something along the lines of, you're not supposed to look back, like whatever you were brought out of, just make sure you're you're preaching the word of God and you're you're growing more and not to not to look back and dwell on the things that you were you were like set free from to constantly like, you don't necessarily want to always be like using your testimony as like a way of teaching. Like you're supposed to move on from that in a way.
John:If you kind of like summarize that in a way and like were to Google it, you would probably pull up the scriptures. It might be in Hebrews. I don't know. There's definitely something in the book of Hebrews that says like like it's time to move move away from the elementary things about Christ and like get into the but it's very contextual because that book's written to Hebrews and that's written. It's about Christ's priesthood and like you have to really understand the priesthood that was from the front of the Bible to like really really grasp and understand what's being talked about in that book And so that's what I think that that's talking about.
John:But there are things that talk about that. I wish I knew where it was, but you're kind of like, you can after a while move on, but it's not to say that you can't always incorporate your testimony to like reach people, but yeah.
Micaela:So I found that with testimonies, lot of times it can hit people, at least for street evangelism. Anytime you say Jesus, it's like it's almost like a cuss word. You know what I mean? So I feel like opening up with like, dude, like, you know, my life has been changed. Like, I struggled with depression and, like, cutting myself, wanted to kill myself.
Micaela:I saw no future. You know what I mean? Like, in sharing the depths of what I've been delivered from, I feel like clicks with a lot of people where they're at. Because a lot of times, for example, I shared my testimony with this guy last week and he had the exact same testimony just from, like, a guy's perspective. And he ended up giving his life to Christ.
Micaela:Like, he was like, I want that too. And so I think it can be super powerful to share a testimony. But I do agree with you. Like, trying to condense, like, the gospel in a tangible, like elevator pitch is so hard. It's just like, wait, but like it just, it goes, it's so hard.
Micaela:But yeah, I agree. You don't want to take away from the gospel, but you also don't want to add to it either. Because like Paul talks about how he shares the gospel of the truth that it is and doesn't add to it. And so it was like, okay, like, how do I? Yeah, it's a fine balance.
Micaela:It's one I'm still It's
John:fun though.
Micaela:Yeah, yeah. Yeah, for sure.
John:It is fun sharing testimony. And I'm not saying that you're not supposed to, like, we are supposed to do that. And you could know. I think at the period of time, this is where the more you grow, this would be more applied theology of like how the more you grow and you learn, like when you're convicted, when the Holy Spirit is actually working in you and you know, like when you come up against the situation, like you'll know like when when it's right, like, is this person ready to like, what are they ready to hear? Are they just are they at the place of where you can't just use your testimony and that will be powerful for them because it'll be extremely relatable or are they perhaps like the person at the beginning that prayed for you where it's like, they have some sort of understanding of Christ but it's wonky.
John:So you don't want to like, it's probably not the best thing to then start overlaying your testimony onto that because it's like we're in agreement. We've all we've both had crazy testimony that we're spiritual people. So then it's like you that's where you want to would take like what you're saying with Paul says like make sure you're just giving them the truth. And that's where you're using the word of god to kind of fight and combat combat little deceptive things but.
Micaela:100%. Absolutely. So, I know you said a lot of your because I'm going off of your personal testimony. I know you said a lot of it has changed with time. Has your idea of, like, the spirit guides and, like, the, I guess, spirit spiritual entities that you're talking to, do you still believe that those were demonic, or do you think that that was maybe something different?
John:Yeah. I think a lot of it was. I fully believe. The convulsing experience, I believe that I was possessed. I do.
John:Because when I was yeah. Well, first of all, any like when when someone convulses in scriptures, it is that they're being delivered from a demon. And so, I mean, that's a that's a truthful indication of where you can, directly go to scripture. It's not to say that everyone that convulses is it's a it's a demon causing it, but the context of the situation of what made me start start convulsing the first time I ever confessed out loud like I'm grateful for God. I'm grateful for the Bible laying in bed, doing a practice that was sort of like, yeah, with the girl that I was with at the time, like, we what are you grateful for before you go to bed?
John:We were doing that as a practice. First time I confessed out out loud, I forgot in the Bible, I started convulsing. So, it's it that's where it is. The thing is when you start to learn more stories, there are things where it's like, god uses and this also, it fits into like Job, the book of Job, and like, kind of what we're talking about is like, if someone starts hardening themselves, like, god will let people, like, he'll harden people's hearts and he'll he'll like give you over to the things that you're desiring to do and I think it can even happen to believers like it's not necessarily to say that's going to make you that you're not going to make the resurrection or like that sort of thing. I don't know if it's like a sell but he puts us through things like it.
John:It's he's a father. He he disciplines us. So it's like where you want to go and your intentions of things you're trying to do. So, yeah. Before you know him though, like, is he already working in your life that way?
John:Is like, I think so. I do. It says he's like, I think Christ says no one no one can come to the father or no one can come to me unless the father draws them to me. There's things like that where you pop up like, So, like, at what point is god starting to, like, try to, you know, get you to to draw you in to bring it to him like probably your whole life. Like, to me, it's probably and that's why I think there is angelic realms and like, why was Satan?
John:Why is Satan still allowed to be out right now? Like, why? If Christ died on the cross and like, he said it's finished. Well, why is Christ? Why does Paul say Satan is the lowercase G god of this world right now?
John:He's still roaming around, right? Like, he's still out. So, there's something about like this like god is very, he's he's a he gave instructions. He's not going to veer away from them. So, so it seems to be like Satan is like a lawyer.
John:He's like a very good lawyer and he has never done, he's the accuser. So, he hasn't like tangibly done anything wrong according to something but at a period of time, when Christ returns, he's bound and he's like he's taken and he's brought into Tartarus. He's locked away for a thousand years in this millennial reign period of time like when Christ returns. The beast and false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire before that starts but Satan's bound And there's this idea in the Old Testament of a scapegoat. Like, there would be two goats.
John:It would be the goat that was gonna be offered on the day of Atonement, and then another one that would be sent off into the wilderness. And it seems to be there's like a typology or like a a corollary aspect of like Satan is that. And it says Azazel, I think like, I think the name of that scapegoat is Azazel. And some people say that's the name of Satan, the actual like name. It's not in scripture, but there's other, I think it may be in the book of Enoch where it's like, that is his actual like pronoun, his actual name is Azazel.
John:And so this idea when the law comes along of like a scapegoat, like it's this idea of like, Satan made me do it. Almost there is sort of an aspect of that. So as we're that's always going on. No matter what who you are, we're in a spiritual existence. It's a thing.
John:So like what aspects of spiritual like what is the battle and where's the line? Like what you're asking of like what is maybe what is God using as like angelic refining? Because we are. Like I think Hebrews 12 is like kind of all about that. It's about like fatherly discipline and he loves to discipline his children.
John:So, but that's that's obviously in context about believers but like I mean, what his character changed with people that are not not believers yet and how much of like the the of spiritual experiences are being used by him and like to allow things to happen like with Job or how much of it is like free reign, Satan having authority over unclean spirits to have have them kind of pester and you know, manifest as whatever, you know, they have the ability to like appear as to people whether in dreams or like possess people, whatever it is. It's it's a hard thing to know. I think you can you you can kind of almost find any any experience you've been through. You can kind of find it in scripture some sort of story that like. Is very similar to what you've been through.
John:It's all there. And then you kind of have to, you would go about it in a very loose kind of parallel situational sort of way to find your specific experience to go about it. That's, think that's what happens to people when they come into the faith. It's what I was doing. So I was taking that concept and I would go, it's the way that I was interpreting scriptures.
John:I was like, okay, what is my like what event in my life is equivalent to the event? Like, so say the the crossing of the Red Sea and the parting of the Red Sea, they're being delivered out of Egypt. And like, is that like, is that a literal event? Like, okay, that was a literal historical event. But for us now, like, what in my life is is the equivalent to that?
John:And that's how I was interpreting scripture. And now, you know, when you get into eschatology, you realize the Bible is like straight up a history. It's more of a history book than it is like a spiritual thing and it's a story about creation and and god reconciling his creation back to himself through through Christ. You realize like you should probably stop interpreting scripture that way and kind of, it's just about learning and growing. You start to take scripture more literally and like really understanding what's called authorial and and authorial intent like the intent of what the author is trying to tell you and it's it's fitting into an overarching story that that makes the Bible a complete amazing thing that it is with cross references and and all these things versus something like that style of interpretation that I explained that I was doing when I first came into the faith.
John:It would be called reader response. It's like it it happens all the time. Like you'll go to a Bible study like, what does this mean to you? It's like, it's not the best way to read the Bible or interpret the Bible, but it fits into that topic because we are supposed to find you know, things that we go through in scripture to know how we are to go about them in real life, like applied theology. But it's, yeah, you kind of have to, yeah, it just, it takes time to go through it.
John:It's part of sanctification and and kind of learning more about God and a lot of stuff. So Yeah. That's good. Yeah.
Micaela:On to end, I would love to hear your idea and thoughts and maybe advice to somebody who might be listening who heard you say something where they're like, oh, like, I didn't know. Maybe that was against God. Or it sounds like, there were maybe a couple topics here that maybe somebody's dabbling in and also Christianity. Where would you point them to or what advice would you have for them if they heard something and it's now maybe they feel convicted about it in a way? Like, what would you say the next step is for them to maybe come into alignment with discovering what God wants for them in their life.
John:This would be someone that's already put their faith in Christ?
Micaela:Yeah, we'll say yeah.
John:Okay, well then, because I mean, I would start there and I would try to explain like why Christ was sent but those finicky things. I mean, tons of prayer. Always be praying and like asking the father, should I like help me through this like like before I go to your words, know, send your spirit, the helper, Holy Spirit, the helper, he's our teacher and helper as we read and help me like reveal the truth from what's in your word, truth, all of the word of God is the truth, but make it so that I'm only walking away with the truth of what's being told in it and I'm not making something up and all of that. Start there, that kind of thing, like having a good, like understanding of how the Bible is meant to be kind of you know, interpretive and all of that. That's that's probably what I would kind of say to start other than that, it's sort of the last topic we were just talking about is like whatever you're wrestling with, try to find it in scripture, try to find that event, like that sort of thing and dig into the context of like what was going on.
John:You'll learn a lot about the Bible and just in that itself because you'll Yeah, it'll connect with you. You'll be like, oh, I experienced this. One thing that One thing about the bookshelf that felt like the Dagon God of the I forget the I think it's the Philistines where they had acquired the Ark of the Covenant. I think this is in second Samuel, like five or six or something, I believe. But it's generally the, to summarize the story, it's like they had acquired the Ark of the Covenant and they were taking it from their cities and then they set it up one one night next to their their god, their fish god statue.
John:And so then the next morning, their fish god is knocked over, toppled over on the ground when they walk into their sanctuary or their temple where they had put the Ark of the Covenant next to there. So that then it's very similar to a bookshelf. Like I walk in in the morning and my idols of my old spirituality, all the books that I learned things from were on the ground. So I heard that story. It's like, oh, it's very relatable.
John:And then it happened to them two times in a row, like two days in a row. They like built back up their statue. Then then the next day they walk in again, it's back in and like in pieces. And so they're like, we gotta get rid of this thing. So then the whole story, then you learn, then you that like it gets you like, oh, this is a thing and then you learn like, oh, this is really what idol worship is as well.
John:Like, this is the degree of which these people were like worshiping false gods is like so extreme and intense. It's not it and that brings you peace too because you're like, wait, like, because I fully did. Was convicted. Like, I'm I'm an abomination of god like full on. Like, I don't wanna be.
John:I'm being convicted by this Deuteronomy 18 passage about all these things that I was doing and then you freak out. You're like, oh my god. Like, I don't wanna be. So, you get all finicky and scared and then over time, it gives you more peace because you're like, okay. Well, one, god set up a system.
John:He's very forgiving. It what I was doing was unintentional and then you comparatively not to say that you're supposed to do that. A lot of time you'll get yelled at by trying to go about your life by comparing your sins with others and like, I'm being doing better than they are. You don't wanna do that but the yeah, it just it it makes you realize the the extreme and the extent of like how like what what was making god actually angry at that time. It was like pretty pretty intense stuff that was going on.
John:And so, yeah, that's that's kind of yeah. That's sort of how I would go about it in terms of, yeah, knowing, I don't know. Yeah, it's a and it's all part of it's all part of like, yeah, it's part of the product. Like, I think accepting and knowing that that to knowing that we are in a place in time, even though we are like proleptically, like we say, we're allowed to say we're saved, that's a thing, but there's a literal point in time where that's gonna happen. Like to know that is very yeah, it's very peaceful to me to know that like, oh, we aren't, we aren't actually perfect yet.
John:Like, we we're not, like, we we're supposed still supposed to say that we're we're we confess our sins to the father and all this stuff and knowing when we're wrong. So, it's a hard thing. That's like a whole sort of topic in itself of how to like navigate that like the right righteousness righteousness we're given through Christ and the grace he has for us to practice, you know, turning away from our sins and that it's no longer that the law is what's going to, you know, save us but it's all part of it. It's a it's a whole huge topic. But it is knowing that, okay, it's not so much a one and done, like sanctification isn't just like, it's part of it and that's part of the process and knowing that, like our father loves to see us grow and work through these things and again, back to what we just said, like, it does seem to be like he'll let things.
John:He does discipline us. So, if that is a way that he's disciplining to where you're trying to find that line of what you like, where you're struggling with, like the line of where where it's wrong or right and all of that. Mhmm. It's part, it's just part of our sanctification. It's part of the process in in our walk.
John:It's we're not supposed to be stagnant. We're not we're supposed to be always trying to grow and and better ourselves and and understand the character of god and that's it's it's just part of it. So, like having this idea that like, it's just going to be done with and all of that's going to go away. You're going to figure it out. I don't think that's a good mindset to have at all.
John:Because you're going to be let down if you think
Micaela:totally,
John:and that fits that fits in with sort of like a prosperity style, like you're going be delivered and healed and not to say that like people have been healed of crazy things that are going on with their body or whatever but to think that's that god is going to grant that to everyone is not it's not a good place to be because you'll get resentful toward god if like your prayers aren't being answered in that way. So, yeah, that's
Micaela:a good point. I love that. Where if people wanna connect with you, where can they find you?
John:Yeah. I like, my YouTube or my website is breadfromstone.com. I I haven't updated in a bit. I'm I I had this big kinda you you've probably looked at it. I had a a sort of idea of how I was gonna try to bring people into the faith because like I said, I was brought into the faith through Deuteronomy 18.
John:I didn't hear about Christ. Leading up to that, what made me start like thinking about God more and the Bible and all of this stuff, it was sort of political things, but I was seeing things like what people would call synchronicity type things. Was seeing crosses on my morning runs and all these things. So I was like, that ended up to be way more impactful to me to like bring me into the faith than me hearing about someone yell at me about Christ or like hell. It just never, it didn't work.
John:So I was like, oh, I had already had this rock project that I was doing where I was putting Bondo on rocks and molds and forms and then I would paint people's pets or whatever on it. I was like, oh, this would be perfect to put a QR code on the back of a stone and then put a mold of a cross on it and then put the QR code on the back and then just go set it in public and then whoever ends up picking it up, they scan the QR code, it goes to my testimony. And then I started to learn this whole thing about how we're supposed to actually be reading the Bible. And I was like, well So I sort of put that on pause just so that I could sort of build up more sort of understanding and teaching kind of videos so that when I start doing that again, because I don't think I'm I haven't fully stopped doing it. I wanna do that because it's such a simple thing to do.
John:It's fun to do as well. And I feel like the stories that would come of it, if it did end up reaching someone in that way, would just be it's just super awesome to do. But then to have resources when they get to the website, that's not just a testimony. So if they hear this testimony, they watch it, it's powerful. We've kinda talked on this topic just now.
John:It's like they have other resources to where they're to where they have a better understanding of what the Bible fully tells us about the story of the Bible. I wanna have those sort of things in place so that if they do scan the QR code, perhaps it's they start with the testimony and then there's a page where it has sort of more more teachings. So, it's like, it's not, they're not just left hanging. They watch a testimony and then like, what do I do now? Yeah.
John:It's it's it's almost sort of like what I was saying earlier is like, you're if you try to condense down the the gospel of Christ and explain it to someone in a very, you know, like penal substitutionary explanation kind of way where your sins are, you know, like there's nothing you could do about your sins. So, like all all the all the sins of the world were put on Christ on the cross and he died and like the sins were put on him and they died with him essentially and so you're that whole thing, that sort of like style of presenting the gospel and you just tell someone that and then you walk away and you're not actually making a disciple out of that person. You're you're hoping that they that converts them and then they go and they find their discipleship at whatever church or whatever. It's I don't know. It to me, it's like I would rather have something in place that's a little more it's a little more substantive substantive than that, even though the testimony is good and a lot of people have I think I think even my cousin Teddy, I think that played a big part in his conversion of just hearing my testimony.
John:And other things like that. And there's been plenty of other people that have told me they picked up the Bible because because they watch my testimony. So, is a good thing but then to have and knowing how like how how crazy it is to weed through all of these things just to have something that's already there so they can perhaps just, you know, essentially like maybe a playlist or a page that says, you know, start here and then they can go through and really understand that, like, yeah, we're, like, it's it's not just like you die and go to heaven. Like, the the it's it's way way more encompassing and it includes creation. It includes so much more.
John:The Bible is like amazing and it's just these things that you don't you don't ever hear but as soon as you hear them, they are the truth. So, they're going to stick with you and then when you start reading the reading, going to scripture or you start going to church, those things are gonna be in your mind, and you're gonna see, start seeing how they fit in, and then it'll so anyway, I that's that's kind of like, I haven't got to that point yet, but I'm working on more video aspects of of teachings and everything. So Bread from Stone would be the place that you would find me that my I suppose like a ministry website. And then there's my personal Instagram. It's just john mada underscore.
John:That would be kind of where you would find me. Bread from stone is a YouTube where I upload videos. So on my Instagram and YouTube, the same same content just sort of reformatted for the for the format of the videos of the what the platform likes to see. And then, those I that's that's where you'd find me. And then I have a business act because I don't ask.
John:I don't ever ask for donations or try to ask for people to support my ministry or anything like that, because I already have a business. And so in a roundabout way, I think me kind of talking about this stuff and spreading the gospel kind of in a secondhand way, like people will find out that I own a business, supplement business and that they might hear about me that way and support me in that way. And it's beneficial to them, they're getting a good product. And that's called that's called RarLife.com. Rar Superfoods is the product.
John:So it's another way you can find me and support without me being like donate, you know, support me through donations or whatever. I I haven't got to that point. I don't know if I will. There's just so many things that I that I think and believe and I see in scripture that's not necessarily I I eschatology is huge. I, and it's something that's, like I said, it's very contentious in churches.
John:And I think it's so important, way more important that people like to like to, it's ignored. And so if I was to then really be plugged into the church, it would be hard for me now to avoid that. And I know how contentious it is. So I still go to church and still do that, but in terms of like how like plugged into a ministry or like sort of a group at the church of where I'm like whatever ministering to kids or something. I don't it's hard for me to like yeah to do that.
John:So I'm I'm to say that I'm like fully like soloing on my own, that's not it at But yeah, in terms of like, just having that sort of stuff and having things that I wish I had when I was going through my coming into the faith to being sanctified and learning stuff. I wish I had these resources. So I'm trying to sort of create those. So when I do, even if I do bypass the whole rock thing and I just start going to like street evangelize or it may be, those things are in place before I kind of like go super hard. And as I'm doing this and creating these videos, these resources, it's reaching people in itself.
John:So that's sort of like my idea and things like this. And you're like really good at this. Definitely, out of all the podcasts and things I've been on, this is, it's been so easy to go through because you did your research and you knew what questions to ask and and because it's hard talking about spiritual things. There's no it's like kinda endless. So you never know where to start or what to do or what topic to go down or how to get through it, but this has been great.
John:Yeah. It's been an awesome, awesome time.
Micaela:I'd love to hear that. I appreciate you being on and sharing your your testimony and kind of like what you've grown to learn and stuff like that. Because like you said, it's like a never ending topic and it's very controversial too. Like you said, like there's varying opinions everywhere. So I really, really appreciate you diving in and sharing your story and what you've learned.
Micaela:And I think a lot of people will find a lot of fruit from it.