Maximum Lawyer

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Are you a law firm owner who is thinking about integrating AI into your firm? In this episode of the Center Stage Podcast, host Danny Decker welcomes back Tyson Mutrux, founder of a thriving St. Louis personal injury law firm and host of podcast, Maximum Lawyer. Tyson shares updates on his firm’s growth, practical AI integration, and the challenges and opportunities AI brings to the legal industry. 
 
Tyson shares his approach to AI and automation within his law firm and how others can integrate it into theirs. To get started with using AI, it is best to tackle the low hanging fruit tasks as ways to ease into it. This could be tasks like scheduling meetings for clients. If you can show your team where the improvements are in your systems, it is easier to get them on board to adopting an AI tool. From there, you can move on to larger and more complicated systems.

There is a double-edged sword that AI brings that law firm owners need to realize. Although AI has increased productivity and accuracy for completing all sorts of tasks in the legal field, the problem arises where tools like ChatGPT are allowing clients to do some of the work that lawyers would normally charge for. One example for business law and estate planning is document drafting, which clients are using ChatGPT to do instead of paying a lawyer to do it. This is something lawyers need to think about when integrating AI into their practices. Think about what aspects of law could benefit from AI but will still bring you clients and make you money.

Listen in to learn more!


3:34 - Approach to AI & Automation
8:34 - AI’s Double-Edged Sword in Legal Industry
14:33 - Performance Optimization & Mindset
22:20 - Vendor Review Service
26:16 - Maximum Lawyer Community Overview


Connect with Danny:


Tune in to today’s episode and checkout the full show notes here. 

Creators and Guests

Host
Tyson Mutrux
Tyson is the founder of Mutrux Firm Injury Lawyers and the co-founder of Maximum Lawyer.

What is Maximum Lawyer?

Maximum Lawyer is the podcast for law firm owners who want to scale with intention and build a business that works for their life.

Hosted by Tyson Mutrux, each weekly episode features candid conversations with law firm owners, business experts, and industry leaders sharing real strategies and lessons learned in the trenches.

If you're ready to grow your firm with less stress and more support, this is your next must listen. Subscribe today.

Danny Decker 00:00:00 All right guys, welcome back to Center Stage Podcast. My name is Danny Decker and have a really great guest here today actually returning guest Tyson was with us last year as well. Some of you may remember. So Tyson, welcome to the podcast. Tyson is the founder of a P.I. firm in Saint Louis, as well as the founder of Maximum Lawyer, which is a coaching and mastermind community for law firm owners. So, Tyson, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for joining us.

Tyson 00:00:26 Thanks, Danny. I appreciate you coming back. I remember the last and after I got done I'm like that felt that felt great. Like we had I thought we had a pretty good vibe. So hopefully we can hopefully we can. We didn't set the bar too high. Hopefully we, you know, it's just right for people. Hopefully we're not we're not too underwhelming on this one I think. but I really did enjoy the last show. So thanks for having me back on.

Danny Decker 00:00:45 Know for Sure. And you know, we don't honestly do a ton of repeat guests, but we hopped off that episode and, I made a note.

Danny Decker 00:00:52 I was like, man, that was fun. We got to get Tyson back. And so, so so we made it happen. So. So, listen, last time you were here, I asked you to start just by talking a little bit about your background as far as your firm, right, your P.I. firm that you've built, because I think that gives some important credibility. Like, there's a lot of folks that are offering advice about law firm building and management and all this. And I think it's important to recognize, like, there's a difference. you know, there's experience gained when you actually run the thing yourself and you've done that and you've built a super successful firm. So we don't need to go through the whole thing because folks can just refer back to to that last episode and we'll link it in the show notes. But do just give us a quick overview, but what's going on in your law firm? Maybe what's changed in the last nine months since we last spoke?

Tyson 00:01:34 Yeah, that's an interesting one.

Tyson 00:01:36 when it comes to what's changed, because I'm not a huge I love change itself. I'm not a huge fan of, like, massive changes. Unless you absolutely have to. So what has changed? I know our firm has definitely grown. We've added some a few people. We've added a couple new attorneys since then. So that's that's been kind of nice. yeah. Like we still have our offices in Saint Louis and Columbia and we've added a few more. So we've got this ten, ten year plan, which is it ends in 2032. So January 1st of 2032, where we want to we want to have resolved a case which means settled or taken to trial in every state. So I know we've added probably about four new cases for four new states since then. So that's pretty good. so that part's I think that part's different, but otherwise no major changes. thank goodness. Knock on wood. But no, no major changes since last year.

Danny Decker 00:02:26 Love that. So, so then just a quick snapshot.

Danny Decker 00:02:28 What does the team look like? Like, how big are you guys right now?

Tyson 00:02:34 it's it's always an interesting question. I do get it quite a bit because I there's two things I want to say about it because, we're right around 22, but it always fluctuates. So between 22 and 25. but what my what I always think is kind of funny about this question. It doesn't matter how big the team is. I think a lot of people think, oh, 50 people, 100 people, 200 people. Right now it does not matter. It is, I am tinkering with an idea that I'm not ready to reveal yet, but tinker with this. This thing that I've been playing around with that would allow you to do it with zero attorney or zero people. And I think that's going to be fun whenever I get done, documenting all of that, because I do think you could do it right now with zero people, which is sort of insane. But, I don't think that we're at this at the level of tech now where we can do it fully, like, be good at it fully and and have no people, but, so.

Tyson 00:03:32 Right. I think we're right around 22, I think.

Danny Decker 00:03:34 Love it, love it. And honestly, it's it's it's funny that you say that because I kind of tease out one of the things I wanted to get in into with you and, and I know, you know, you guys, your group and, and you specifically have really done a lot around AI and automations and efficiency. And I assume I'm going to assume that's kind of what what you're alluding to. and so so let's just let's just start there, you know, talk, talk, talk about, you know, how you guys have approached AI. maybe both philosophically, but then also, I know you've put a lot of a lot of time into, into, into researching and implementation and really have it pretty deeply integrated into your firm. So, so start there. How how do you approach it? Like is this something you spend, you know, X amount of hours on every single day working on AI. But how do you think about AI as it relates to your law firm?

Tyson 00:04:20 I'd say if I'm not working on something with AI every day, I'm at least thinking about it for several hours, because it is.

Tyson 00:04:27 That's one of the things I when you say that when we started it, I think the mistakes that I made whenever I was starting is I wanted to jump in and tackle really big things. That's what I wanted to do at first, and I think that that's probably a mistake in hindsight, because those things typically break and the technology has been changing so rapidly. If you tackle the big things, the big things are going to be easier to solve, I think, down the road. So the more the approach like our CTO is named Kashyap, and so Kashyap and I, we have we've been taking more of a lower level approach. We're the things on the on the bottom end that are just easy, like low hanging fruit? And I use this as a really basic example. For example, like when we have a car crash case, we always want to get the weather data. Okay, so what time did we like all of it when it comes to the weather data. So when did the the sun come up.

Tyson 00:05:18 When did the sun go down? Right. Was it raining outside? All of those things. Right. Temperature. Because a lot of that can matter when whenever it really comes to any injury case, if it was outside, it can matter quite a bit. Things like that done with AI easily. Boom. You can go capture that information. It doesn't take a human to do it. So really low level things like that is where we think you can get the most gains, where you're freeing up your time. Let's say you just take like the weather data, you probably take you five minutes to do that. You look it up really quickly, but you come down that compound that over every single case and every small test like that, you're going to see massive games. Whereas like the bigger stuff, like we've, we've tinkered with a lot of the bigger stuff, which is harder to achieve. It takes a really long time. You don't get those instant gains that you get with like the low hanging fruit.

Tyson 00:06:05 And that's where like getting the team adoption, that's it's hard to do whenever it's a big change. But if you do, if you show them instant instantly, hey, this is how we're getting this improvement here, here and here. It's a lot easier to get adoption.

Danny Decker 00:06:20 That's really smart. I honestly, I not thought of thought of it from that sort of standpoint of like, hey, what are some little quick wins? There's a lot less to break, right? Like, I imagine that that that whether note taking whatever, you know, zap you've got set up I imagine that's not going to break. And if it does break it's not going to take 100 other things down with it. That's really smart.

Tyson 00:06:41 Yeah, absolutely. Like one of the, one of the things we have not touched yet. And that's the actual acquisition of medical records. It's a it's a really big undertaking because like, we like I mean, I don't get paid by UCR, so I'll just give them a free plug.

Tyson 00:06:55 Yossi Ayers, they're an amazing company and they do an incredible job of getting our records. I'm not touching that unless I absolutely have to. I'm just not going to. They do such a good job of it, and it is such an undertaking. Major undertaking. We have. We have played with other things, that have been bigger tasks that we've been able to accomplish to a certain level that we've we've sort of hit some roadblocks, for example, like completing discovery. Like we can answer discovery with AI now to a pretty fairly accurate level, but not it's not quite to the standard we want. Like we can get it to right around, I say about 85 to 90%. It's close, but it's not quite as good as we want it. because the the goal, the goal with that is that it's done and completed sent for signature for by our client everything. So we need 100%. I mean, if not, if not like 99%, there's got to be a higher level. So we're not quite that quality.

Tyson 00:07:52 But it's that's been one of those ones. That's been a tougher one because it has to go through has access all the files, all the documents has got to it's got to know what's important, what's not important. So the guardrails on it are a little, little trickier to to to design on that one. But with that one, it's one of those things where we kind of promised that early on. And the team's like, well, when is it going to get done? When's it going to get done, when's it going to get done? We tested it out with them and it just it didn't work out. So we I mean we it's been a lot has been trial and error. I think that's the thing is there are a lot of people out there that if they're claiming that they're getting all this perfectly from the get go, they're they're probably lying to you or that or they're just they've got a magic wand that either of those is possible.

Danny Decker 00:08:30 I guess either is possible. Very true. okay.

Danny Decker 00:08:34 So so to me, like AI and and really, you know, all of the innovation we've seen over the last year or two years is like such a great example of, like a double edged sword where it's like, and I'm thinking for law firms specifically, right? There's all of this productivity, efficiency, accuracy, like all of these productivity gains like you've described. And we've leaned into it too, you know, as, as, as a marketing agency, we've leaned into it probably in different ways, but but big fan of the efficiencies and all of the, you know, everything that that AI provides. But, you know, I think one example on the flip side of this is, you know, we're hearing from law firms all the time. You know, especially in like estate planning, for example, in business law, of of lawyers that are now they're losing clients that would have needed to hire them to draft a contract. But now they're like, I can do it on ChatGPT.

Danny Decker 00:09:25 So so do do you see any of that? And maybe that's less of a thing in P.I., but basically it's like, man, you know, tools like ChatGPT have made it faster and and cheaper than ever to quote unquote, you know, draft legal documents. And we are starting to see that and hear that from, from some clients. So I have some thoughts on that. And we obviously have some advice that we share with our clients. But but I am I am curious if you're seeing that if you're anyone in your group is is seeing that and how you feel about that conversation.

Tyson 00:09:55 So I have I have worried about estate planning attorneys specifically or anything that's That's like trademark. Like anything that's like, can be very standardized. I'm worried about any of those niches for a while, and I have been a little surprised by how many have not been concerned. So I will say that I'm not I'm also not the alarmist type. So I think that a lot of this can be it's to our benefit.

Tyson 00:10:18 So if I were like an estate planning attorney, I would probably focus on higher end clients because they're not going to be the ones that are using AI. The lower the lower level ones are going to be the ones. The lower paying is what I mean by that. Lower, lower paying clients are going to be the ones who are going to be using AI. So I would try to worry less about that. that being said, I do I mean, there are lots of attorneys I know that have they have the I would call the lower paying, matter types that are doing just fine or doing really, really well. So I think there's some because I think part of that and then I'll answer the question of the in a second. I think part of that is I think that the general public does not know the freight train that's about to run over them. I really don't I think that that is I go to family dinners and all that. And no one's talking about AI. I bring it up and they're like.

Tyson 00:11:04 They're like, I'm talking about aliens or something. And it is the wildest thing. It is crazy to me to think that they're they're really not thinking about it. I think some people that are older, they're also like, oh, by the time this hits, I'm gonna be just fine. I don't know if that's the case now becomes a pie. I'm not noticed it. I've not noticed a significant difference I have. I it is funny, I've spoken to opposing counsel and they're like, yeah, you know, we'll be dealing with pro se and like you can tell you're sending us this, you know. ChatGPT ChatGPT generated, you know, demand letter and all these kinds of things because I do think the Pi field has a little bit of a of a fence built around it, and I don't know if it's going to stay a strong fence or if it's going to be weakened over time. It'll probably be weakened over time. But right now, like an insurance adjuster knows, okay, they send it to me.

Tyson 00:11:52 They deal with people without attorneys all the time, okay? And they're not going to adjust the amounts that they're going to pay simply based on a ChatGPT generated demand. They're not because the okay, let's say that they file a lawsuit. Oh, good luck with the rules of evidence. And ChatGPT getting that accurate. May it get it accurate at some point? Sure. But I mean, you can't be in the middle of a depot. You can't be in the middle of a trial referencing ChatGPT whenever you're needing to make objection. So I think that there is a bit of a moat, a bit of a fence around this space because they're not going to be the insurance adjusters are not going to offer more money, because with a pro se, based on this ChatGPT generated domain, because there's no risk of them actually filing a lawsuit and being successful with it. So, I think that's as of right now, like I said, that could change, but I don't see it changing when it comes to the court system.

Tyson 00:12:47 The court system has been very resistant to AI. As you've probably seen. There are attorneys getting hammered every single day for putting, fake AI cases into their pleadings, which is crazy at this point. Like we even have at this point, we have a procedure where we double check every case with a human, goes and double checks everything that's been generated just to make sure. And that's what you have to have to do at this point, because I'm terrified of that happening. but so I think PiS is fairly safe for now. Criminal defense is going to be safe for now. You're going to have a family law safe for now. That being said, I think there are the standardized ones that are going to be a little trickier.

Danny Decker 00:13:25 Well, you know, and one of the things like, I guess I believe philosophically is like, listen, you're not going to beat ChatGPT on speed and on on price, right? It's as fast and as cheap as it gets. And to your point, you know, so so you need to you need to aim for that clientele.

Danny Decker 00:13:41 That's values. You know, your expertise, your experience, the experience your firm creates. And just, you know, don't don't try to win the fast and cheap game because at this point, like it's it's really just it's impossible to it's possible to be it's possible to win that game. so so I want to shift gears just a little bit. So, so I had the opportunity to to to speak at your conference. Max. Lorcan I think it was in September. Thoroughly enjoyed it. And you know, one of the I love going to conferences and getting there a day early and listening and, you know, taking notes and learning from the other speakers. And, you know, one thing that jumped out to me from, from, from your presentation and, and multiple others to was the emphasis that you guys are putting into mindset and personal productivity. And, you know, everything from like sleep optimization, just just really a lot. I was really surprised. And I loved how much focus you guys kind of put on.

Danny Decker 00:14:33 You know, I'll just call it performance optimization. really curious like you personally, what was your what was your journey on that like, have you always been wired that way? like, how did you get to the point where you spent so much time thinking about about optimization?

Tyson 00:14:49 I'd say I've definitely evolved over time on that. that was one I it's funny, I think it probably started with diet in 2020. so because I look at pictures back from whenever like 15 years ago, and I'd say I look better now than I did 15 years ago because I was doing the whole thing where I was staying up till three in the morning working on cases, and I was getting no sleep and it was just terrible. I was really awful, really awful when it comes to health, wasn't eating healthy and then it changed my diet in 2020. I remember stepping on the scale thinking like, what the. It wasn't like I was like super, super big, but it was definitely bigger than I wanted to be, that's for sure.

Tyson 00:15:26 And so it just kind of evolved from there. And then I've really got to kind of gotten into sort of the whole health hacking because it really it's I think it's funny how we'd like to, to kind of separate, compartmentalize our lives. Okay. We run a law firm. We run a business that's over there. you know, we've got kids that's over there. You know, we've got ourselves. We take care of ourselves. That's over here. And, like. And the reality is, it's all wrapped into one, right? It is. The reality is, is that you can try to separate those things as best you can. But guess what? If you just had a kid and you're up really, really late and you're up till four in the morning because the kid's sick, and then you got to get up because you got caught at 9 a.m. and you're tired all freaking day. Like, you can't separate those things. So my conclusion was like, okay, you can't separate those things.

Tyson 00:16:13 If I'm going to be the best of the best of the best and what I do, that means I've got to optimize this other, other part of my life, too. So, it's not the easiest thing to do. Getting sleep for me is probably the hardest part of the whole thing. I the eating healthy is completely fine. I can do all that I can work out. I, I we hired a trainer. I did all that stuff. Right. the it's the sleep for me. And that's probably one of the most important parts of this is that, I usually get up early. I usually stay up late. It's it's one of those things where it's, a bad habit I picked up from my dad. I think it's my dad. He's still, to this day, up late, up early. Just. He just retired last week. Two weeks ago. So, so he's he's still in good, good health for the most part. But, I think it I think it just it comes down to I learned a lot of hard lessons.

Tyson 00:17:00 Maybe I don't like. I don't drink. Like I used to. I'll have an occasional drink, but I rarely ever drink. A lot of that comes down to just how I want to feel the next day. I have a hoop, so we have a little hoop group. I don't know if you wear a hoop or not, but it's, You can. I mean, it really has gotten down to, like, looking and seeing what I've eaten the previous day. Okay. How do I feel today? How do I how do my numbers play out? Lots. All of those different things. So, it just I think it's just lessons learned over time, really. There was no, no major event that led me to. It is just things I picked up.

Danny Decker 00:17:32 Well, your, you know, your your success speaks for itself, right? You're you're growing your law firm. maximum lawyer is, is is growing and and really making a big impact in the industry. And that's awesome to see.

Danny Decker 00:17:42 So whatever you're doing, it's working. Keep it up. but then, you know, I'm always curious to, like, do you have any sort of morning routine or any sort of, like anything you do that, that, that like really, you know, sets the tone for your day. It doesn't have to be first thing in the morning, but like, just curious how you approach that.

Tyson 00:17:59 No, I don't. I. I tried to do the whole optimization of my morning thing and I don't. I think it works for some people. I don't think it's one of those things where, you have to do that. There are certain things that I know I have to do each week that I must absolutely do. And so I know I've got to go, like make sure like the sleep part of it is really, really important. We talked about that. Like, I even got to the point where I, I, Marco Brown recommended a particular bed. I bought that bed. So optimizing that part of it.

Tyson 00:18:26 But like working out, I know I got to work out when I've got to go, I've got to work out. So I got to hit that schedule. I got to make sure I eat right. I make sure I sleep right, so I don't I don't do a whole routine where I'm journaling. I've got certain things that I do when it comes to a mindset that my my coach, Jason Selke, has me do. So I do have I do those certain things. I usually do those in the morning, but otherwise I don't have this, you know, magical morning routine. I have tried it. It's just not for me. It's. I'm curious. Do you I I'm curious if you have one because I don't think it's necessary. I think it's overblown, but I wonder. I wonder if you do.

Danny Decker 00:19:04 Mine evolves. I think the first one that I jumped into was like Miracle Morning back in like 2018, 29.

Tyson 00:19:11 I tried that too. Yeah. That's cool.

Danny Decker 00:19:12 Yeah. And like there are pieces of that that, that have have stuck around.

Danny Decker 00:19:16 But like I kind of go through phases. I really do personally. You know, I get up early on, I try to get a workout in first thing. A lot of times it's just a bike ride or a walk, and I typically listen to a podcast while I'm doing that or an audiobook, and it's like, I do that before I check my email and, you know, you just get into that. At least I get into that state, you know, kind of as an entrepreneur where I'm seeing the possibilities and I'm excited about things and I got a million different, you know, ideas that I want to attack that day. And I find that like just protecting that space first thing in the morning so that like I bring, you know, my energy and my attention to the day as opposed to starting the day by responding to, you know, email or whatever else really helps for me. But like that said, like everything else kind of kind of evolves. Like I go through periods of time where, like I lift weights in the morning.

Danny Decker 00:20:01 Other times I do that at the end of the day. So it just honestly, it ebbs and flows for me.

Tyson 00:20:05 I think what's maybe more important is the things you shouldn't do. Like because like I do like I go to the gym in the morning, but like there are certain things that like, I want to absolutely. I want to take my kids to school in the morning. So I take my kids to school in the morning, like, so. I'm not going to go sit in the sauna for 30 minutes whenever I could actually take my kids to the school. So like there's certain things where, like I, I do have my morning very tightly timed. But I mean, the thing you mentioned about like checking, not checking messages, like I'm not going to check messages first thing in the morning, I'm not going to do that. I'm like, I rarely if ever get into my email because I've got I've got my assistant who's sitting out there. She does that. She does an incredible job.

Tyson 00:20:39 I don't have to do that. So there's certain things that you should like. You shouldn't start the day with a donut. Okay. That's just it's just one of those things you shouldn't do these certain things, so I don't I don't do those things. You definitely should not start your day with an email because all of us have woken up. We've checked that email. It's from a it's a nasty gram from you name it person and it just starts your day off in a terrible way. So you shouldn't. You shouldn't do it. So, anything where you can kind of keep your mind open in the morning, I think is a good idea.

Danny Decker 00:21:08 100% so. So, Tyson, how much time do you spend working in the law firm versus maximum lawyer?

Tyson 00:21:16 It's probably about two thirds, one third. So two thirds in the firm, one third. Max law. We've it it that does that's something that does ebb and flow based on. All right. Like for example this week it's going to be a little heavier Maxwell.

Tyson 00:21:32 Because we have a mastermind in Phoenix next week for the conference. It'll be you know, I mean the the conference week is 100% max law. So it in zero I mean 0% for the firm. It depends. But I'd say roughly two thirds one third is how it splits up. but because we have we have Maxwell pretty much optimized for the most part.

Danny Decker 00:21:50 Love it. When is the next conference?

Tyson 00:21:53 It is in October of this year. I was the the dates I don't have in front of me, but is in October. Max Lau. We have not released the tickets for this. We've. We've released one batch. The next batch is going to be coming out in the next few months, so keep an eye on that. But, and it's in October of this year. We also have an event in Chicago in June that's gonna be kind of cool.

Danny Decker 00:22:14 Very cool, very cool. You were also telling me right before we we hit record here, you guys have launched a new service.

Danny Decker 00:22:20 I think it's sort of like I think it was Becca's list. Can you tell us about that?

Tyson 00:22:25 Yeah. So this is this all started? It was kind of funny. there was someone in what we call it the Association. Now, it used to be called the Guild, but there's someone in the guild that was. They were complaining about a vendor. And then, like, it was this post that kind of led to just a flood of comments, and we're like, and Becca had this idea of like this vendor review site so that we could it's really about leveling the playing field because we, you know, people don't know what the prices are. They get screwed over by a vendor. I can't tell you how many times we've seen in the Facebook group someone getting, you know, screwed over by the vendor. We've seen vendors come in, they and they go. And so we have it where you can look up vendors. It's free for attorneys. You just you sign up with the LinkedIn, your LinkedIn account and you it's free for attorneys to sign up for the they can check they can review vendors for free.

Tyson 00:23:18 They can check out vendors. it's so it's it's a way of really kind of giving us a little bit more power as attorneys to, to control what we're paying for. I, I spent I'm not going to mention the name of the company because it's just the things like this where like we pay this attorney tax sometimes. I spent 20 grand for this service and got it. Did it. Got nothing out of it. Zero. Okay. And it's a it's it was a software that I paid for. And after a year it was not working. And so it's just one of the things we're like we are we're kind of handcuffed. And this is one of those ways of helping remove the handcuff.

Danny Decker 00:23:56 Yeah. No, I think that's great. And I mean, you know, as, as you know any. So so we're marketing agency right. And so we work with hundreds and hundreds of clients. And we've been doing this for like 15 years and and and are we perfect. No, I won't say we're perfect.

Danny Decker 00:24:08 I won't say there's never been somebody who we didn't deliver exactly what we wanted for. But but as somebody who's been part of this industry for like a really long time, I just think that's great. I think, you know, maybe most simply one of the ways that, that, that any vendor but, you know, us in particular learns and improves is, is, is when we hear, you know, feedback and, and sometimes that's not great feedback and you want to hear it. So like, I don't know, I think it's great that you're doing that. I think, you know, in the marketing space, which is where I spend all my time, I'm continually surprised by, you know, I think the average law firm owner really doesn't want to think about marketing, and I don't blame them for it. Right. They they didn't go to law school because they want to market. They would really just love it if, if, if clients showed up. So, you know, and I think unfortunately, there are folks that take advantage of that.

Danny Decker 00:24:54 Whether that's intentional or unintentional. And one of the frustrations for me is, is I think that a lot of marketing folks, you know, present things as a silver bullet, right? It's like, hey, listen, if you just drop $20,000 on a website or $10,000 on an SEO strategy or Google ad campaign or whatever, it's just going to fix everything, and and it's going to work perfectly, and you're not going to have to think about marketing anymore. And, you know, in my experience, that's unfortunately just not true. So I one of the things we're trying to do at spotlight is, is have real conversations about what it actually looks like to build, systematic marketing that produces leads, produces referrals, also understands that there's an intake component. Right. And so part of what we have to do is make sure that leads are being, you know, handled properly and that there's an efficient hand up in all of that. And unfortunately, it just is bigger than than, you know, a single silver, silver bullet that's going to fix everything.

Danny Decker 00:25:51 So all that to say, I love that you guys are doing that. I think you said it was Becca's list, so we'll be sure to link that in the show notes, because that's awesome. so very cool. and before before we wrap up here, I want to be sure. I don't think we did this up front. So just tell folks who are listening. And our audience is pretty much all solo small law firm owners. What is Max law exactly? What do you guys offer? just talk a little bit about your your program, your community.

Tyson 00:26:16 Sure. And thanks for that opportunity. And thanks for mentioning Becca's list. I appreciate it. The, I at some point, I want to ask you, I think that would be a great show that we could do where you tell us, like, how you can coach law firms to not squander the leads that you help generate. Because I bet that's extremely frustrating for you. Where you do all this work, you generate the business, and then they drop the ball at the goal line.

Tyson 00:26:40 I would that would be a really interesting episode. But so Maximum Lawyer is a is a community of law firm owners. We we started the association. So you go to maximum. Com and we used to used to be the guild. You may have heard it called the guild. We wanted to change the name. We're going to change a little bit a little bit to a different direction when it comes to the branding. And so it's really a community of law firm owners that get together and they share their best stuff. And we have masterminds. We have get togethers throughout the year where people different trainings like for example, and this and we have we moved off of Facebook for the, the small group, the big Facebook group still there, but we moved on to circle and we've got we got quarterly experts that come on. And for example, we've got some AI people, we've got Jeff Hampton that does helps with SEO. We've got someone that's helping with billing for people, that bill. So each quarter the coaches change so people can come on and they can actually ask real questions.

Tyson 00:27:33 And it's not out in this public form and they're not getting, a bunch of answers from people that are not experts. They're actually getting expert advice, which is kind of nice. So it's a it's a community. We've got big plans for what we have, for the, for the future. It's going to be, that's why we changed it to the association. It's a it's a broader approach. We we definitely take an approach where, there's a there's a lot of, a lot of membership groups that you can join in the legal industry. And I think a lot of people view themselves as competitors. We don't really view things that way. Like, that's why I like going on to other podcasts. I like going to other events where like, I kind of view this as like a big community where we can all just kind of grow together. And that's why we that's why we changed it to the Association. It's more of a like, we want we want everybody to be kind of under one tent, you know, like everyone sort of be together like help each other out, support each other.

Tyson 00:28:22 So instead of, you know, like, oh, you're a competitor. I don't want to I don't want to help you out. So it's one of the things where we like to help other people out. And so that's what we do.

Danny Decker 00:28:30 Love that. Super cool. So. So where can folks go to learn more about that.

Tyson 00:28:33 maximum comm. And then there's links when it comes to Max Lau con or the association there. So they can check things out there. If they haven't listen to the podcast. They can check that out to the, there as well.

Danny Decker 00:28:43 Love it. Well, Tyson, thanks so much for joining us.

Tyson 00:28:46 Thanks for having me, Danny. I really appreciate it. Lots of fun. I'm fighting this cold, but I appreciate you. You you're dealing with me. So it's, It's a as I I'm going to feel the same way after this episode that I did after the last one. So I appreciate you having me on.

Danny Decker 00:28:59 Love it. Thanks again.