Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Le podcast JAMAIS ASSEZ est le projet de la Clinique Physiovélo.
Qu’il soit question de vélo, de triathlon, d’ultra-distance ou de remise en forme, on se pose la question: Pourquoi on fait ça? Pourquoi on continue de se donner des défis sportifs de fou? Pourquoi on n’en a JAMAIS ASSEZ?
This week on the podcast, I'm hosting Benjamin Tout-Temps. Benjamin is a cycling enthusiast, both for competition and commuting. Together, we discuss his work as a representative for the clothing brand Castelli, and he gives me his best tips for dressing for the approaching cold weather. So listen , >> this podcast is presented by Edica, from one enthusiast to another. Welcome to the podcast. >> Thank you. >> Benjamin Tout >> himself. >> Yeah. How would you like to introduce yourself? Are you >> Benny Toutou. >> Are you Benny Tout? >> Benny Tout, better known as Benny Tout in cycling circles, but never Tout-Temps, actually. Uh, yeah. >> And this Benny Toutou, does it come from your Instagram handle, or is it a nickname that became an Instagram name? >> It’s a nickname, actually. Even before it was legal to be on Instagram, they called me Benny Toutou. That’s it. It started in high school. >> In high school, >> exactly. Yeah. We all had little nicknames, and Benny Toutou has stuck ever since. >> That's funny. For those who don't know, we went to the same high school, Académie Sainte-Thérèse, and we didn't cross paths much >> or we weren't in the same groups, but we did flag football together. Did you play flag football? >> Not at all. Well, maybe maybe in elementary school >> like, for a year. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That’s possible. I had a nickname back in flag football. Oh. >> And people at the time called me Coco, but the coaches misheard it, so they called me Costco. >> COSTCO, so I was called Costco for the duration of a flag football season. >> That is legendary. >> A good size, you know, Costco size, after all. >> And okay, so Benny Tout >> on all platforms, but especially in person, >> everyone can call you Benny Tout. Benny Toutou, absolutely. In my emails, my electronic signature, Benny Toutou, Benny Toutou is there, exactly, so it's my, that's it, >> it's my second personality. >> And have you been biking for a long time? >> Yeah, since, since I was very young. >> Since you were young. >> Yeah, but fun fact: actually, before even getting into cycling, >> I was 95%likely to be a badminton player. >> Oh yeah? >> Absolutely. >> How so? >> Well, it was, it was my side passion. Yeah, I played badminton all through high school, and then I reached an age where I basically had no choice but to decide. So either a badminton sports-study program or triathlon sports-study; before, I was combining both. >> OK. >> Uh, and my parents chose for me. >> I wasn't able to make the decision. So we sat down at the table >> like any good parents to weigh the pros and cons. Then the final decision came, choosing triathlon even before badminton. Who knows where I would be today? Maybe a >> well >> a Yonex rep or something like that >> maybe playing whatever, that’s it. I might be a retired Olympic pickleball player. I don't know who knows. >> Oh yeah, right? If you—what was it that tipped the scales toward triathlon ? >> It was my parents. >> But in the pros and cons, can you remember or is it too long ago? >> Well, it's hard to say. No. Yeah. >> No, it's a little bit too far back. A little bit too far back for me. But even to this day, well, at university, I played badminton on the varsity team for fun. So I got to touch the sport a bit later, but younger, it was triathlon. >> So basically, that's it, triathlon when you were younger, but now, triathlon no more? >> No, no triathlon. It’s very trendy, though. I mean, it would be good for my following on social media, you know. Plug that I'm a triathlete, but no, only cycling. >> Only cycling, what made you specialize in that? >> Well, like any good triathlete, at some point you reach a level where you have your strengths and your weaknesses. >> And my weakness was, it was running, I was— >> I don't know, it felt like I had no speed, no endurance, I don't know what was happening, but as soon as I put on my running shoes, all the problems started. >> Oh yeah? >> Yeah, yeah, so I wasn't moving forward, and at a certain level, it's won in the running, you can swim fast and ride well, but once you get to the run, that's where it happens. >> OK. >> So that was it. >> So then after that, once you decided you were going into cycling, first of all, how long had you been in triathlon and did you switch directly in clubs or ? >> Well, it happened relatively organically, you know, it was a sports-study program, so until the end of high school, we were really, really well supported for sports, we were taken to the pool, so it was all managed within school hours, so logically. >> for a young person it's like exceptional, you go to school and there's someone who manages your training plan, you know. So that was exceptional. But there were always some parents, you know, who >> who would take it to the next level, a little step further, looking for a way to bring their child to another level. So in high school, well, parents started to sign their kids up for other clubs. You know, so you did your triathlon during school and in the evening, well, you went to Espoirs Laval to continue with extra bike training, you know. So my parents, they kind of, they pushed me into that a bit . You know, your friends do it, you do it. So that's a bit of what allowed me to develop my basic skills more specifically on the bike by joining a specialized club, Espoirs Laval. I was with Espoirs Laval, I started there. I spent 2 years there >> when I was younger. >> So yeah, it's a bit, it's a bit what gave me the cycling bug. I didn't do bike racing, it was really triathlon, triathlon, triathlon. And the races came, they came later, later for me. Yeah. And did you start with Espoirs Laval, did you do crits or was it more like, let's say, road races or >> it was, I didn't do any races, basically. I did the training sessions, >> I didn't have a license or anything like that. I just did the Espoirs Laval training. And still to this day, you know, it's, it's probably the, the best school. Well, actually it's a specialized club, but there are, there are quite a few throughout, throughout Quebec. The Boucherville cycling club is a really good school for getting started in cycling. But yeah, it was an excellent gift that my parents gave me, because logically, when you're training for triathlon, you know, you have to split your disciplines 100%. Uh, so you're, it's a bit diluted, they're like that, you train and thanks, goodnight. But Espoirs Laval and specialized clubs at a young age, the focus was really on technical skills. >> That's what I was going to ask, because after that, you know, in triathlon, let's say when you're younger, yes, you have to do volume and all, but then, you know, if you have no technique, >> You know, it must be difficult after that to make the transition to just road cycling with other people in a peloton, things like that. >> Absolutely. You don't get very, very far, you know. So it's a bit, it's a bit what taught us in a certain way. I still remember, we would take 30 minutes, even to this day, they do it because I coached the Espoirs Laval myself a little later. But that's it, there is a 30-minute block allotted in every training session for technical skills. So you have small courses, little pieces of wood, and it's regulated, in the sense that for the youngest ones, the beginners, the juniors, they do skill races, it's timed, if you knock over a block, you get a time penalty. And I think that was >> it's skill-based courses. >> Yeah, they're skill-based courses there . So that leads you to become one with your bike in a certain way, to know the limits of your bike a little bit. >> If I turn, well, how far can I turn without necessarily falling, you learn to pick up your bottle from the ground, you know. >> So you push yourself to your limits a bit, and there's nothing better for knowing your limits than pushing yourself to them. So when you get to competition, well, you know how to modulate your braking, you know how to position yourself on your bike, you know how to balance. So for me, it was like the, the best, the best school for me, you know. So for sure, it's when you're younger. So logically, a cyclist who takes up cycling at 20, 21, 25, 30 years old, well, they perhaps don't necessarily have that same chance. a bit thrown into >> Yes. And you know, it's interesting what you're saying, because you know, from riding, let's say in events or with clubs, specifically when we're invited, things like that, you can see that not everyone has the same comfort on the bike. And after that, even as an adult, we ride in a pack, we ride with other people, there’s, yes, a certain etiquette, but there’s also a certain , um, you know, there’s a need for skill that’s really important, I feel , because in the end, you know, if you have trouble modulating your brakes, for example, and you're always slamming them on, well, for the person behind you, it’s deathly stressful. It’s hard for you to keep up front. And then , if you have trouble avoiding potholes , well, you're going to end up... >> 100%. Well, honestly, I’ve been navigating, I’ve been immersed in the cycling world for a really long time. And, you know, what you’re saying, I think that’s probably the shortcoming for many people, you know. >> You know, a lot of falls could be avoided because of all that, you know. It’s that when you go to get your first bike at the shop, some advisors might be more experienced than others, and they’re able to bring you to that realization a bit. But often, you know, moving beyond just the bike fit... >> You probably even have issues with customers in the shop who come in and don’t even know how to shift gears. Yes. Absolutely. >> So that’s often, I think, the missing piece. >> Yeah. >> But, yeah, that’s it. Well, yeah, it’s... >> It develops, you know, 100%. >> As for the advice we give—and I don’t know if you have others to give to the people, or the hundreds of millions of people listening to us. Yeah. Hundreds of millions. >> You know, the idea, what we find is that, first of all, you know, being able to eat on your bike and drink too, and, you know, you start at a lower speed or by yourself, you know, that’s good, it will help you get comfortable taking one hand off your handlebars. And we realize that there are many people who, for example, will have pain in their neck, their hands, or things like that, and it’s more linked to stress in the end. You know, it’s because I’m holding the handlebars so tightly because I feel like I’m going to fall, but after that, releasing the tension is about being able to go for a ride on your bike. And after that, you know, if you're able to reach for your bottle, that means if let's say you hit a bump and one hand slips off your bike, well after that, you'll be able to catch yourself, you know, 100%. Well, I totally agree with you. And you know, we talked about it just a little bit before, but I think the best school for any cyclists looking to get into cycling really, >> it’s, we joked about it, but it’s commuting, you know. >> The more time you spend on your bike, the better you get. I mean, it’s like with everything, really. You develop something like a second nature. I mean, when I get on a bike, I don't think about pedaling. It just happens instinctively. Changing gears, I don’t have to think. It’s like the gear change happens instinctively, you know. >> So I feel that the more time you spend, >> you go from point A to point B, when you commute, you don't necessarily have a guy in front of you, you don't have a power meter. It’s >> you also have more obstacles, you know. If you're on, you know, there are cars around. After that, you can be on quiet paths, you're in nooks and crannies, you're on side streets because you're getting to a building or whatever. 100% , it's, it's for the purists, you know. You get on your bike, you head out and come what may, you know, and it’s exceptional because, like it or not, you don't control the traffic either. >> So you arrive at a light, well, you put your foot on the ground, obviously. Well, if you do that 10 times during your commute, well that's 10 times you've taken the time to unclip, put your foot down, and modulate your braking. So it’s like automatic training in my opinion, the commute, you know. So you practice changing your gears, clipping in, clipping out, you're attentive, you're aware of your environment. So you know, well you didn't ask me the question but >> someone let's say who wants to get into cycling and develop those, those elements, well, take your bike and go ride, you know. Commute. >> Commute. If you want to take it a step further, get a fixed gear. There, you, there you >> Yeah, but then you won't be modulating your braking. >> No, there you'll live the real cyclist life, you know. Uh, so >> Yeah, but it's true, you're so right. I hadn't even thought about the fact that , indeed, when I commute, there are way more skills put to the test and that, in the end, that's where I gain the most skill. >> Oh, yeah. >> And so, for you, let's say >> Yes. >> biking in your life. >> Yeah. A lot of commuting and crit racing. >> Pretty much that. Other than that, what else do you do? >> Well, that's an excellent question. Well, I wear several hats, but you know , if I go back to my path, you know, it's that, as a triathlete >> and well, very young, well, in fact, like any sports enthusiast, logically the first question you're asked is, what do you want to do later? Well, it's to do sports. >> Yeah. As a job, you know, professionally. Uh, but otherwise, the second answer to that question, well, is to work in a bike shop, you know, as mundane as it may be, you want to gravitate in that world, it's expensive too, let's not lie to ourselves. So, you know, getting discounts, sponsors, stuff like that, that was pretty much my focus. And I started super, super young in the industry because of my brother. >> Yeah. He >> yeah. My brother, who was also a triathlete and two years older. So, he had been hired earlier than me at Bicycles Quilicot in Laval. Ah. >> Yeah. Uh, and, that's it, so he was hired there, and, the time came for me to start working. I was 14, you know, below the legal age. I sent my resume to two or three places, and Quilicot, first interview. Well, we're hiring you because your brother is here, you know, in the sense that we trust you. >> And at that time, it was, it was, it was Jessica, not him. Not yet, not yet the legend. Yeah, well, he really left a mark on my path as a cyclist, in the sense that, inevitably, when you gravitate in that world, you have figures. >> who appear, uh, who are authority figures, but they become, they become friends over, over time. But yeah, that's it, they’re the ones who kind of taught me real life, because when you're a triathlete, you think you know everything, but you don't know anything at all. So that's it, I learned real life, the ins and outs of a bike shop, how to tune your bike, how to serve customers, customer service, all the, the jargon that, that revolved around that industry. So that's it, I think that's, that's like that, it gave me that second gear, that second or third gear, just gave me that little extra boost, that, that little extra push, to say: "Ah, this is really what I love, you know.""I love it, I love working in this." I love advising people. And still to this day, that's what I do in a certain way. So >> and so now, you’ve become a representative. >> Yeah. And how do you make the switch from working in a shop to, I'm going to work, you know, because in retail or any position in a shop, you're more, you represent an entity that sells variety >> versus now, well, you know, I don't know how you see it, but now you're really more of an expert for certain companies that are sold in shops. >> Yeah, expert, yeah, I like that, expert . No, but >> because, because in your own words, you're not a salesperson. No, >> that's it. >> No, well, it's, you're, you're a representative, you represent a brand. When I was on the, on the floor, they often said salesman, but a day came in my, uh, in my journey at Kiliko, we changed that. Customer experience expert. >> OK. >> Uh, because I think I had difficulty associating myself with the term salesman. So for me, I really cared about the customer experience. >> Cool. >> And still to this day, that's what I, that's what I want to offer, you know, really an experience rather than just pushing down someone's throat a product or whatever, you know, it has to be that, it has to, it has to come from the heart and it comes, it comes from the right place. But I don't know where I was going with that, but the, the rep job was like presented to me on a silver, silver platter. You know, when you work in a store, you always idealize the rep who comes in. Weekends , you rarely see them, but when you get a bit older and you're working during the summer or during the week, you get these little reps showing up, you know. >> At first, they just see the manager, but once they've seen you two, three, four times, you work up the nerve to introduce yourself, "Hi, how's it going ?" And in the end, there's kind of a relationship that gets built at that level. So, throughout the years, I've met some exceptional reps. Martin, who was the old rep at ALÉ, he acted a bit like a mentor, in quotes, every time I talked to him, he was super, super attentive, like Dom Desjardins from Pech, who's still at Pech. They're all just >> figures that I saw that made me >> want to know, "What is your job?" Like, you walk into the store, you say "Hi to everyone," you talk bikes, you talk products. >> Yeah. >> You get back in your car and where do you go after, you know? >> Exactly, so >> So what is your job, really? >> Well, that is my job. No, but you watch these figures passing through the shop, you know. Some reps are more present than others, and that's completely, completely normal. There are some you see a bit more, and a bit more, and a bit more. And at one point, it grabs you, and you're like, "Man, I would love to do that job," but for 3 or 4 years, I looked everywhere and there doesn't seem to be an entry point, you know, in the sense that >> you have to be in the right place at the right time, and that's actually what happened to me; Dom sent me a job offer. >> OK. >> It had absolutely nothing to do with cycling; it was agent Stéphane Balthazar, a mentor for me. Stef, uh, it's been 2 years, 2 years and a bit that I've been working with him, but yeah, it was to go >> so, Saucony >> running shoes, so it was really nothing associated with bikes. Then I spoke with D, and I said, "Yeah, but I don't know anything about running, you know." "I don't really like running that much. ""That's why I stopped doing triathlons , you know." So he said, "Yeah, that's not a big deal, it's a really great school." >> Because after that, effectively, you know, if you're capable of knowing products well and representing products that are basically unknown to you, then moving into something like Castelli for example, >> where you know more, after that, it's probably much easier to integrate the two. >> Oh yes, 100%. Well, the first thing I did, for one, you know, it takes you, it takes time to acclimate a bit to that job. And after that, well, you know, it's all a question of cycles; at the beginning, yes, it's harder, you don't know anyone, you know. So, it's all contacts, relationships to develop and create. But after that, these are relationships, these are contacts, and you know, whether they buy your product or not, the fact remains that you still met the human being behind it, you know . So, I am extremely grateful because in two years, I have never met so many people, you know. >> It's, it's, it's crazy. >> For sure. >> From small stores to bigger stores, you know. That's, that's, that's what's fun . You touch a bit of everything, you meet different people, different characters, and you realize in the end that everyone is essentially passionate about the same thing. >> But I think that's what brings us all together, the people who work in the world of [cycling]. When I left my physio clinic on the North Shore, it was Évolution Physio in Blainville. >> Well, you know, the objective was mainly because I was so passionate about cycling, but, you know, there weren't many of us who were passionate about cycling where I was working, or at least I was by far the most passionate. Yeah. >> After that, I wanted to surround myself with people who were just as passionate as I was, and who understood all the little nuances of the job. And, you know, I always kept coming back to the clinic here because, precisely, we were much more connected directly to the world of cycling. >> Yeah. >> And I think it's just so important to, like, talk with people who share your passion. I find it’s just so much, so much more rewarding in the end. >> 100%. Well, that's it, that's the role of an advisor, I think. You know, we could, we could jump into artificial intelligence, you know. You can, you can ask ChatGPT what bike you need. >> Yeah, we have people who do that. >> It will, it will, it will, it will offer you a good, I mean, a good service in a way. It'll pull up all the specs, the comparisons, you know. But there’s nothing like going into a shop, you know...I’ve spent hours there, you know, with clients, you know . They’d come in, knowing nothing, and they’d leave the shop with a bike , or without a bike, but you know, at least when they left, well... >> they know more. >> They know more, you know. >> Yeah. >> And chat, it’ll tell you, right. Ah, uh, >> excellent choice, captain. >> It's a good choice. But you know, after that, I want to ride it, you know. Can you recommend good groups or events? Like, if you go for a 40 km ride in Laval, chat doesn't know that. It doesn't know where the potholes are, or if the road is good or bad, you know. >> So, there’s a human side that you’re looking for, you know, and that was always the side I wanted to bring in the end, and still to this day . >> Yeah, clearly, and you know, from having spoken with you at events and seeing you in action, it's clearly one of your strengths, being able to connect with people and really have fun . >> Well, we try, eh? >> It's cycling season and some pain appears. Don't panic. First, ask yourself: have you changed something, or has everything stayed the same? Have you changed your volume, your intensity ? If so, try to reduce that a little bit. Take it easy for the next few rides. The pain is still there, the pain won't go away. Call Physio. 450 486 388. And don't forget, we open our appointments on the first of the month for the following month. See you at the clinic. So, Stéphan Baltazar. >> Yes. >> And the Castellis, when did that happen ? It it happened in in July in July '20 . Cool. >> Always have trouble with my years. But yes, July July '25 actually. I’d been bugging Steph for a long time. I was like, you know, it’s fun, we have some some brands, well, exceptional brands. I mean, it’s it’s it’s really I’m lucky to have arrived and to arrive with such such mature brands, you know. >> Yeah. >> And then, well, Castelli, you know, the whole the whole organization there changed. So, they were looking for, hm >> hm >> an agency to represent the brand throughout throughout Quebec. >> Very >> so >> there was a big rebranding of of Castelli, I think you were explaining to me as well. >> Yeah yeah, quite a bit. Well yes, all all companies evolve, you know, through through the years. So, it’s for sure even harder when you’re a century-old company, you know, with over over 150 years of of of experience under your belt, but yeah, the rebranding, you know, they have they have a new new designer, Monty. Uh if you go on social media, I highly recommend you you stalk him. He’s a he’s a character, he’s an exceptional human being. >> Uh Monty something or other. We should we can put it in the description, whatever. But I forgot I forgot his >> Monty something or other who the the OK >> well it’s not something or other, you know, it’s it’s Monty, but anyway, so yes, that’s it, Monty, new designer who brings a bit of a breath of fresh air to the brand >> and it it shows, you know, I arrived I arrived at like a a good time, you know , logically, with a slight rebranding regarding the the scorpion that persists but that >> that actually evolves like every species >> which is actually my next question, which is probably the question that when I I told people I was having you on the podcast that was often I I have the habit of asking people around me what’s the question I should ask, let's say >> and >> why is it a scorpion? >> That’s an excellent question, but I could turn the question back to you, actually, to know what what is it for you, actually, if if you had to picture the scorpion, what does the scorpion represent to you, actually? Oh wow! The scorpion, it seems like it’s like a well you know, it’s an animal that is a major predator, first of all. >> Uh it is uh it is a bit solitary, but it’s also uh it looks like it’s a hybrid of a lot of things. >> Yeah. >> Am I, am I on the right track here? >> Well, 100%, it was, it was open, you know. I don't have the exact answer, actually. Uh, but you know, logically, Castelli hasn't always been Castelli in a certain way. Uh, it’s always been associated with technical clothing. Uh, but >> when, uh, when the Castelli family took over the reins of this company, uh, well, they were looking, that's right, for a logo, an emblem for the empire that Castelli had developed over the years. That's actually when the scorpion arrived. So they were looking for an icon. And after that, well you know, everyone has a bit of a vision of the scorpion, a bit like you said, uh, that withstands the elements, you know, in an arid climate, so it will always find its own way to survive in a certain way, uh. >> Something immortal, a, well yes, indeed , an immortal side, also a side of resilience, you >> know, for several weeks it can, it can sneak around and at some point go and grab its prey, so a side of resilience, and also it's a small animal, uh, but it's a small animal that can still cause a lot of damage. Uh, so that's where, that's where the scorpion came from. And that's where the scorpion became, in a way, the emblem of Castelli, you know. So it will always remain. >> Logically, you know, at the Tour de France, there was, there was the Quick-Step team. Now, if you look at the jersey, there was the 150th anniversary edition, but what's fun is that all, all the Castelli logos since, I think, 1970, were on the jersey, you know. So it shows the evolution a bit, and, like it or not, like anyone else, we evolve. So that's a bit of the story behind, behind all that. >> Behind the scorpion, it's cool and >> it's funny because, thinking about it, there aren't many other companies, especially in cycling that I know of, that have an iconic logo as iconic as the Castelli scorpion, you know. I think, blindfolded, we could just show the scorpion logo without the word Castelli on it and almost everyone would know. You know, maybe you don't know who Castelli is, but you've already seen the gear and all that. >> Yeah, it's like, it's like Apple, all, all the, the big brands actually. >> Yeah. >> But at the limit, you know, Apple is an apple in the sense that, well, Castelli is definitely a scorpion. >> Indeed, indeed. Yeah, yeah, but I remember in high school, we played a game, and that's it, they would show the logo and you had to find the brand, in a way. I agree with that. >> But Castelli wasn't there. But indeed, it's the same principle. There, you... well, in any case, in the cycling community, I think it's >> in Europe too, it's >> it's recognized. >> It's very, very cool. So, Castelli's 150th anniversary is this year. >> Yes. >> And did you... >> and was there, like, some kind of celebration or some event that was organized for that or? >> Well, it was done more internally on the European side, actually. So, yes, they released a jersey for this, for this celebration, in a way. But yes, yes, they worked on it with the Giro as well. They, they did a launch with Castelli as the official provider of the distinctive jerseys for the Giro. It was a nice way to mark all of that. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> It's very fitting. >> It's very cool. >> Exactly. And if we come back a bit to you, through your >> path and all the fun, probably for you, representing a cycling apparel company now, is that since you've touched on many other cycling categories and you haven't really talked to me about gravel, but I've crossed paths with you at a few gravel events throughout the year, so in short, you get around, so >> you wear your gear. >> Well, definitely. >> So, one of the big things we chatted about in the pre-interview together is that we wanted this podcast to also serve to help people know how to >> How to create a cycling wardrobe efficiently and without, you know, sometimes we're like: "Ah, I feel like I could use this piece of clothing" or "I won't go out because I can't, you know, I don't have the stuff for it, it's too cold" or "oh well, you know, it's a bit misty out." I'm not equipped for that. So, I told myself that one of the best people to talk to me about how to get equipped had to be someone who rides a lot. >> Yeah. >> In many diverse conditions and who knows it like the back of their hand. >> 100%. >> So >> yes. >> I don't know how you wanted to do this, but we could go by climate and time of year. >> Yeah. >> Know what kind of biking you do at that time of year >> and then after that, how you dress for those things, 100%. Let's, let's go. Let's dive in. >> So, do we start with summer or winter? >> Well, summer. >> Let's start with summer. >> It's a beautiful season, I find, summer . >> After that, I mean yes, summer. Let's start with summer 100%. Why not? >> OK. So, summer for me is road biking, gravel, summer commuting. How do you dress in the summer? Well, right off the bat, I don't think there's a product, a brand, or anything, you know , that >> I think the beauty in our, let's say, in the Quebec universe, whether it's nutrition, clothing, or bikes, is a bit of the diversity, really. So, you know, disclaimer right off the bat, what I'd say is I don't think I have all the answers, >> it's not >> in a way, but I have, like, 15 years of cycling experience under my belt, you know, I've tried different products and that's that. And I think the best way to start is without asking too many questions, you know. It's really just to get out there, you know. I mean, the number of times I've commuted in jean shorts and a shirt on my back, it flies , in the sense that your engine is your legs, you know, no matter how you're dressed. >> But often, the more ragtag you're dressed, I find there's, like, a performance coefficient. >> I think so, too. >> The more ragtag you are, the faster you go; I've never been very good at math, but that's it, you know, I don't know, there's a vibe of being a bit disorganized. >> I find cycling has become very organized. >> Yeah. >> Before your events, you plan everything , you calculate everything, it's grams. Fine, but after so many kilometers, in the end, once you're out in the field, a lot can happen, you know. So >> is that what you like about commuting, being away from your training groove, from your triathlon past, 100%? >> 100%, you know. And, uh, you know, you challenge yourself to head out—well, we’re drifting a bit off our main topic, but you challenge yourself to go do the cross race, you know, you head out for 200, some will head out for 1000, others for 2500, you know. But I think the best thing is just to head out, you know, you just take the start. >> Yeah. >> And when you commute, you know your destination, but then, how am I going to get there? Yes. >> Well, we'll see today, you know, if the road is blocked, well, I’ll take an alternative route. So that’s how I see cycling, you know, we’ve become too logical, too orderly. >> Oh yeah. >> Let it go. The best way to learn is to mess up, you know. It’s a different kind of learning. Anyway, that’s my little takeaway. Yeah, I totally agree with you. I think it’s cool. So, basically, it also means that, let's say we decide how we dress, >> for you, it's because, say, you lacked a certain type of clothing, or you were like, "Man, I was freezing today." So, >> you learn it once, you know, you do it once, and let me tell you, the next few times, you learn from your mistakes. So , you know, that’s it, that’s the best school of thought, you know. If when you're buying it, you feel a connection, you like the piece, it suits what you're looking for, go for it. Then, >> you'll know three weeks later when you put it into practice if, well, >> if it was the right choice or not. >> Whether it's the right choice or not, that's where the advisor comes in, they can maybe help you >> That’s what I was going to say. Is the advisor able to, let's say, give feedback to people, to know if—I feel like cycling shorts are the most important thing to size correctly, I have the impression. >> 100%. So, do you have any quick tips for someone trying on shorts to know if they’re the right size or not? >> Yeah, well my boss Stéphane would tend to say that I buy my cycling shorts a little bit too small. >> OK. >> Yeah. So, otherwise, my advice would be , first of all, to try it on. You know, it's about pressure points like with everything, you know. >> Logically, you get on your bike, if you have pressure points, well... >> after 10 minutes, you feel it. But after an hour or two, well that's where it probably starts to be a little bit more irritating. So, tell yourself that if you put it on right away in the changing room at home or wherever, and you feel a seam, you feel a pressure point, well there's a good chance that, as nice as the color may be, or the nicest product, if you feel a pressure point, whether it's at the straps or the chamois, you realize that logically not all companies work with the... >> well yes, >> the same chamois, the same fabrics, so in the end it's always good to try two or three, but pressure points, that would be the key. And you know, I listened to a podcast lately and what they said is absolutely true. But you know, normally when you put on your cycling shorts there, >> Yeah. >> you know, you really have to work at it in the sense that when I put my shorts on, I pull it up, you know, I'm careful with the seams and everything. >> But let's say it's like those who have ever put on a wetsuit. >> Yeah. >> You know, a wetsuit, you're practically fighting your wetsuit. Some people even tear it. Well, I feel like when I put on my cycling shorts, a skin suit, it's even worse. But when you put your shorts on, you know, you have to >> you have to fight a little bit. >> It's your warm-up there. I don't understand those who do a warm-up on Zwift. Put on your shorts. >> Yeah. Then >> you're ready, you're ready to do your intervals afterwards. But no, I think that would be the key, especially for shorts, >> because you don't want them moving, right? You know, once it's in place, if it starts chafing, that's not any better. >> Absolutely. So when you put it on, it has to be >> you have to fight a little bit, it has to be tight. And after that, it's often what people do when they put on their jersey. For me, it's the first thing I used to see in the shops. But you know, they look in the mirror standing straight as a board, you know. I don't know about you, but I've rarely found anyone who rode riding like a cucumber, you know, or whatever. >> So, >> you know, >> relax. >> Relax, relax your shoulders. >> Yeah. >> Lean forward a little. Look. Oh! Oh! Now, I have fewer pressure points on my shoulders, you know. So those would be the two points, you know. Because you want to be adjusted while you're actually riding. >> Yes, when you're having your coffee, it's fun to look cute, to look good. But it's normal that when you stop drinking your coffee, your shirt rides up a bit. It's normal, because when you're on your bike it >> is the right length, it's good. OK. >> You're well, you're well positioned. So that would be that, you know. And you have to start somewhere, everyone started somewhere, you know. >> So when I was 14, my pockets weren't exactly deep. So you start, I think that's it, you start somewhere with a first bib, a first pair of shorts, and then as the seasons go by, well, >> you change things up, >> you cycle through them. >> Yeah, >> a cool thing you showed me earlier was a thermal bib, and you told me it was like your favorite when the weather starts to get cold. Yeah, 100%, I brought that for you, F. >> Yeah, but it's funny because you see, I didn't tell you earlier specifically, but I discovered thermal bibs last year >> because I started being less, less stressed about the cold weather. I was like, at one point, I'm going to keep riding outside because it's fun. Yeah, and I discovered thermal bibs when it's cold. But riding like that, I find it so useful, tell me, I'm a bit like what you were saying, >> I love being able to stay out for a long time. >> Well, I think that's it, you know. We’re, we’re, we’re quick to get chilly, I feel, here; in the sense that the moment it rains, the moment it starts getting cold, you know, we put the bike, we put the bike on the trainer and we train, you know. But the best way to lose your feel for a bike is to go on a stationary bike. I mean, even I, in the winter, I put mine on the trainer; it’s effective, an hour, an hour and a half, you do your training, you punch in your intensity, your intervals, you can just pedal, watch your show of the moment and everyone’s happy. But >> the years where I only did indoor trainer, you go outside and you’re like, "Good grief, I don't know how to pedal anymore," you know. Yeah, >> it takes you two or three weeks to get your, your feel back. And I think that, well, dressed well, and there are plenty of ways to dress well, you can really extend your, your seasons. So yes, a little thermal bib, you know, it’s rare that your knees get cold, or your calves, you know, it’s the extremities. And logically, if, you know, you’ve had an e-bike specialist on, well, you know, the cold, the cold will attack the motor, will attack your battery, you know. So, logically, your motor is your legs, you know. >> Yeah. And if your legs are cold or you start your ride and you’re >> Yeah yeah yeah >> the, the, the cold has taken hold, well , it’s sure it’ll be harder for you , you know, to ride longer or to have a little more endurance, so I think that just having a short thermal bib >> you can simply extend your, your rides or simply >> agreed, and I see such a middle ground, in the sense that, you know, sometimes you don’t necessarily want a full bib because, well, otherwise you’ll be way too hot once you start riding a bit and you’ve done some hills. >> And for me, that’s what happened too, you know, like, let’s say, late autumn. You don't necessarily want to put on a full bib, because otherwise you’ll get too hot climbing. But then , if you put on a short bib, you might freeze your legs off because it’s that little aerodynamic fabric, it, it lets the wind right through. Exactly, so, you know, I think it’s a happy medium. After that, you know, there are plenty of ways, you know. I mean, there are some who buy shoe covers, and you know, I remember during my years at Espoir Laval, and still to this day, some people buy, well... >> ok >> they put them over their shoes, they take their scissors, they cut little holes underneath, and you have, you have makeshift shoe covers, you know, >> it's not the most effective thing, but >> it gets the job done, you know. So there is always a way to get around the , the standard mold, the traditional mold, but yes, that's still a, a technical piece that goes with your thermal top. >> Long sleeve or short sleeve, >> it depends a lot. But you know, I would tell you that, well, we skipped a few steps, but you know, logically you, you equip yourself with a good pair of shorts. That is, is the first thing. So , step 1. Let's say, let's say you're in a store and you have to gear up for 365 days. >> Yeah. >> You buy shorts. >> Yeah. >> Shorts, thermal shorts. >> 365 days. 365 dollars, 1 dollar a day. It's a good investment. Let's get mathematical. But yes, good shorts, you know, logically. And some people will only ride when the weather is nice. And that's 100%correct. So, a jersey, shorts, thank you, goodnight. You know, then after that, well, >> people who are in their 2nd or 3rd cycling season, well that's when you're like, "Ah, my friends are riding a little longer, you know, I'm going to gear up a little bit more." But I would tell you, even before a long sleeve or short sleeve, it's a little vest. Yeah. >> These little classic vests. >> It's, it's so effective, vests like that. When I, when I first started getting one too, I went to get one at Decathlon because, you know, it feels like every time I had a fear of, "Am I buying the right thing or not?" >> 100%. >> I tried to gravitate towards something a little bit cheaper to start trying it out. >> And vests like that, it's crazy how, once you add a windbreaker layer, there was, there was a study done on the number of fans it takes to simulate wind outdoors. I don't know if you'd ever seen that go by. >> Never. So, >> I know how many watts it takes to run a toaster, but otherwise, uh, there was, there was, there was a video of a track cyclist. Well, it’s been a long time since I saw it, but from memory, I think it was something like, well, actually, his power was probably in the 2000s, but you know, he still pushed like over 1000 W for 15-30 seconds to generate the power to toast his bread. Oh yeah. >> So next time you eat your toast, you'll think about the energy it requires. >> Oh yeah. >> To get it toasted. >> Like 1000, 1000 W for 30 seconds. >> Yeah, you know, you have to, you have to. >> Still, basically. >> Or, yes, or a good electric bike, whatever. But excuse me. Yes, go ahead, the fan for 30 km/h. >> Quite a lot, right? >> So that means, you know, you can think about it in reverse. So the goal of the study was to show people that when you ride indoors, if you want to be able to do a proper FTP test, >> and not overheat when you do your workouts, buy yourself a good fan, because even with just one, you can't get the cooling effect of being outside . And that was at 30 km/h, no external wind, it's just like the effect of >> riding at that speed. Which means that, well, in the end, you know, if it’s already cold, but cutting the wind hitting you, I find it makes such a huge difference, much more than just the number of layers you have, or, you know, just cutting the wind. >> Well, it’s going to be your number one enemy, you know. So you, you said it, I think the key word is windstopper , you know. So getting something that blocks the wind, but logically, if the wind doesn't get in, well, nothing gets out, you know. It’s a bit like a raincoat, nothing gets in, but nothing gets out either, you know. So at some point, you can quickly, you can quickly get warm, you know. >> Yeah. Overheat in a way. So that’s where, you know, to start with the basics, you know, getting a windstopper , a good windstopper in front, same thing for gloves, feet, etcetera. But you know, after that, when you get into the >> within those tiers, without necessarily saying so, but when you go up in price range, that's where you're going to get something a bit more technical, you know. >> OK. And you won't necessarily have to make compromises, you know. You'll have a membrane that protects you from the wind, but also a membrane that allows for a little airflow, a little bit of airflow. So, for ventilation, for example, the back of this jacket here is fully ventilated. So it's all micro-mesh. So right there, it blocks the wind in the front, but the hot air you generate is able to escape out the back, so you know, you always have a feeling of freshness. And honestly, fun fact, for any coat I buy, having a two-way zip is a must. >> OK. That applies to all areas of your life. Whatever it is. >> OK. Sell me on the two-way zip. >> Well, you go skiing, you go anywhere. You know, we're talking about bikes here, but in everyday life, I find it incredibly practical. You get in the car, you know, you just went to a restaurant, you unzip from the bottom, no hassle, you know. But all jokes aside, it's just super easy because, well, you keep it, >> you keep it adjusted a certain way, and you just unzip from the bottom. So if you start getting warm, you unzip it slowly, air can get in, you know, air flows in. >> Yeah. >> And you're basically like a simple heat exchanger; that's what it does. I would say that would be my go-to. >> OK. >> Underrated. You want to be able to unzip from the bottom, unzip from the top? >> Yeah. Yeah. Ah, >> you know, it's funny, that's a feature I think I have on my jacket, but I'd never thought of using it because I just, like, open it completely and zip it back up. But it's true that you can modulate it more when you can open it like that. You leave...and you get style points too, right? >> Style points. >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I try to stay away from that, but sure, there is an aesthetic side to it, a bit. >> But you'll see, you have a kind of vibe you give off. >> Ah, 100%. If you're fully zipped, you're like, OK. >> But you'll see, if you get passed by someone who only has it half-zipped, you're like, ah, >> that speaks to me, you know. so anyway I have a special eye on certain on certain items, but yes shoe covers I think that would be my go-to, so that's a second piece of gear that's pretty essential or >> more and more of you are following us on social media; to keep offering you quality content, Physiovéo needs you, so subscribe to our various platforms and let us know what future topics might interest you. We talked about shoe covers briefly, for or against covers. Do you have an opinion on that? Well, >> I am 100%for them. >> Yeah. >> 100%for them. Well, there are actually two reasons. We don't need to go into the details. Well we can we can or not. I don't want to set a precedent here but you know, the majority of our shoes are now white. >> Yeah. And well, white logically can stain, it can get dirty relatively quickly. >> So when the weather is bad, you put on >> when the weather is bad, you cover you cover your your shoes. >> Do you need white shoe covers or uh >> well it's always a question, I want to know about the style points. >> Always a question of style. I think you hit the nail on the head. But no, I stay away from the stigmas. You know, shoe covers are a free-for-all. Meaning you just take what you have 100%and you can thank me later. >> Uh so shoe covers, I think it's a must. >> Yeah. >> But you know, you were talking about picking white ones, I don't know. >> And those are long. See, I feel like I'm a fan of the toe covers. >> Yeah well I brought them all for you today. >> But >> yes I have exactly that. >> This, well this for the camera here. That's what we call not a product placement, uh but essentially these, we call them toe warmers. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> The fun thing is that it's one size fits all, so you don't have to ask questions. It fits it fits. Uh but it's neoprene, so like your wetsuit >> is neoprene too. If you go swimming with them, they float. No, that's that's not the main reason. But actually the the fun thing is that there's often like a small threshold there. >> 100%. You're starting uh more and more now, you know, we're going to get to the point where the start of the days will be cooler. Well, it's just the sweet spot because you don't want cycling shoes, whether for road or mountain, they're made to be ventilated . Take your road shoe, look underneath, it’s open right there. Don't ask yourself why your feet are wet when you ride in the rain. >> It gets in from underneath, it gets in from the top. So at least what's fun about this is, well, it covers the front, so the toe box where the air actually enters. So you protect yourself from the top, you protect yourself from the bottom, and well, it creates this kind of little cocoon of warmth that's really fun, you know. And these aren't accessories that cost excessively much, but they're fun, they're little uh little accessories that are fun to have to definitely extend the season. >> 100%, so you have your little jacket, you have your little shoe covers, you put on your gloves, you put on your little neck gaiter, you know, you can find that anywhere, you know, everyone who has >> who has already done a little bit of outdoor sports activities all have different products that can serve, that they can use. And after that, well, as the day goes on, well, that's when you start shedding layers. So that's where multi-layering is fun, even when cycling. Uh >> huh >> so you start off more layered up and then you take them off as you go. >> It's cool. And you see while shopping, you see specifically on the Castelli site, and not to mention product placement again, I find that one of the company's strengths is that there's a huge variety >> of plenty of same subcategories, so. You know, for example, I don't have a cycling jacket. >> Mm-hmm. And that, I was waiting to ask you the question to see what your opinion is because I don't know what cycling jacket to buy. >> Well, I think you've got it pretty well . I mean, you know, there are a lot of brands out there. I think cyclists, but that's the case in all sports. You know , I also do running and there are an enormous amount of products there. I mean, you go into a running store >> and you have hundreds of shoes on the wall there. So, you know, it's hard after that to say, well, what do I actually need? Do I really need this, you know? But it's the same principle, you know, with our range, it's >> I mean for every 5 degrees outside, there could be a product, you know. So that's where sometimes, you have to unplug a bit from your >> But that's it. But now, my question is, if I have one jacket in my wardrobe, what is it? I have my little vest, I have my shoe covers. H >> So then, what is my how do I fill the next need? You know, >> that's an excellent question. Well, the next need uh well can I can I show it to you? Well yes, well yes, exactly. I >> me after that, you're going to make me a little list, a little list and I'll go buy what's missing from my wardrobe. >> But you know, as as trivial as it may seem, after that, it's always it's always a question of I'll I'll get to the the the jacket I'm going to introduce you to, this one. >> Yeah. >> OK. So we call it the Perfetto in our in our product range. But really, you know, if I remove the branding or anything, you know, really the technical elements I would look at, and this is a jacket I've ridden in down to -20 with, you know. In the sense that it really has an ultra ultra wide range . But again, what I would look at is really your membrane, how the fabric works when you're riding, you know. So like, say for someone who knows nothing about membranes, you know, how do you >> You know, logically, if if you want something that protects you from the rain, well you look for a membrane that will protect you from water, you know. But really in cycling, I feel that on a 50, 100, 120 km ride, you can face different climates. You know, logically , you can be hot, you can be colder, you can catch a bit of rain, you can get sun again, you know. And during your race across, you'll probably face these these different these different microclimates. But you know, what I would look at is really the most the most versatile membrane, you know. So go for a a jacket that will be water-repellent, you know. So if ever you catch a little bit of rain, well logically you won't end up soaked in the snap of a finger. You'll be able to ride for 20 or 30 km without necessarily feeling the water, or rather, feeling the effect of being wet . But then, I talked about it a lot earlier, with cycling you logically have the wind cooling you down, but sometimes having a membrane that protects you too much from the wind is where it can be a double-edged sword. >> Because you could be riding on the circuit and be perfectly fine in your jacket. Then you go do a few laps on your first climb up Camilien-Houde, and there's a good chance you'll start getting very, very hot because you're riding slower and there's less wind. Yeah, that's where having a jacket that adapts to the temperature. Is really cool. And, regarding the membrane, it's really just about having a membrane that also lets air pass through depending on the intensity, so depending on your body temperature. That's where you get a certain level of adaptation. So, at Castelli, that's one of our strengths. The pros ride with this on big, big stages in the Alps. I mean, they start their climb, and as it progresses and they reach the summit, they put more clothes on, but it's the same principle with a jacket like this. You adapt according to your climate, you know. So the Perfetto, I think it's a great jacket. You have a double zipper, so you can unzip it from the bottom. Same principle. Creating your air exchange. >> Yeah. You have a little membrane inside that's a bit like fleece, so it's a little warmer, it's comforting. So, when it starts to be 5 degrees Celsius and you're descending, it's a super practical jacket. And, if you look at the seams, the taping, well you. >> You have a waterproof thing. >> Exactly. So without necessarily being a triple layer, it allows a little bit more air to get in, but it's an ultra-practical jacket. So you know, that's where I'd say you have to look at what your jacket has to offer you. You know, when you're shopping for a bike, you think, "Okay, my gravel bike, I can do gravel, I can do a bit of road , I have a comfortable position." Well, for clothing, it's the same principle, you know. So logically, if your goal is to do your first 50 km, well, having aero socks, having sleeves, having a fit that's ultra-tight, well, that's maybe not what you need, you know. You might just need shorts and a t-shirt and you’ll be fine, you know. So that’s where the role of an advisor comes in, and I feel like we’ve kind of lost that, that approach, but >> yeah. >> What is it that you need? That’s that’s the real question, you know. >> Yeah. I mean, we can we can go back to Jessie and my years my years at BC Kiliko, you know, when when I started, >> he was he was kind of my idol, but he had an Allez Sprint, so an aluminum bike he’d built up a bit custom, and he’d go tear it up at the Mardi de la Chine on that, you know. >> Yeah. >> In the sense that he was the first one to tell me, "You know, you don't need the fancy bike, you don't need that at all." You have what you need. You need a little bit of confidence, be slightly crazy, and be skilled on a bike, you know. So it’s kind of the same principle with clothing. Go ahead, experiment with it. And I got cold in such and such a spot, well, I’ll find a product that might help me long >> term to address that, but seeking out advice, that’s what will >> 100%you know. >> And a product that works for me might not work for you. >> OK. >> But after that, that's it, you know, regarding the fit, just the cut, you know, in a certain way. Hm hm. >> Uh, we aren't exactly known for making clothes that are very baggy, you know. >> Yeah, that's it. I was going to ask you about, you know, let's say, how do you, do you have any idea how it's determined which, which clothing size is made for whom? You know, in the sense that, you know, without without necessarily speaking about Castelli directly, but there are plenty of brands where, for example, I’ll be a medium in one thing, a large in another . >> What defines that? Do you have, do you know? Well, I can I can speak let's say for uh for the brand we we work with, but you know, really, I mean, we've always prioritized everything research, development, wind tunnel, you know. So logically everything is everything is calculated to the millimeter, you know. >> So you have to shrink things down >> so on a silhouette on a relatively uh relatively thin one there, in a certain way, adjusted, sharp, very race position there. So logically, if you're in a race position, you'll find what suits you, so it's just about finding a bit what what works, but after that, every company has different products to meet different different needs. But >> it's for sure, it's for sure that the racing line isn't isn't made the same way as an endurance line for example or >> no. And then, and what's crazy too, is that you know, you and I could talk for a whole day about racing, about geeking out. But then, you know, I have the impression that if we always stay in the performance aspect, well you know, there's a public that we interact with in everyday life, you know, who who who is getting into cycling, that you cross on the P'tit Train du Nord, that you cross at the circuit; they see you go by in your fit, in your $ 350 jersey and your $ 300 bibs, like "I need that" . But no. You know baby steps. Yeah. Crawl walk run >> in that sense. >> It's like my evolution. You evolve slowly but surely. >> And after that, last step >> Ahip direct. >> Yeah, that's after the crawl. So after you get in you can move on to it all there, you know. But that's it, I would say uh trial and error trying different different products, different companies at some point you'll find what fulfills you. But it's for sure, there are certain products, certain companies that really stand out with the technicality of the products. >> Yeah. Do you have favorites, you, uh favorite preferred products? Not necessarily, you know, you didn't show me like a particular jersey, but like let's say a thing you'd say, you know, like for example the pouch, that's the kind of thing that cycling let's say >> but me honestly if if I can speak from personal experience and after that, we were talking about the whole kit there, but if we remove the whole performance aspect, well my favorite accessory and it's going to sound banal but it's a rack and fenders. If there’s one thing about a bike that really gives me a thrill, some emotion, >> well, there are some beautiful bikes out there, you know? Yes. Sure, there are more expensive bikes. But honestly, you're riding along and you see a bike with >> a nice fender. >> Yeah. >> And a nice rack. >> Yeah. >> That gets me excited right away. >> Oh yeah. >> Yeah. So, it’s really, once again, all about what you need. You know those pizza racks, they’re sick. They’re really, really—so yeah, for me, it’s the accessories that... >> big panniers on the racks or >> Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. You know, and more and more, with races getting longer and everything like gravel racing and cyclocross, you could have an ultra-performance road bike and still be able to have a rack on that bike. Well, >> yes, >> so, without naming brands, but I have —well, there’s T-Lab, I don’t know if you know them. >> Yeah. Yeah. But you should check out T-Lab online. Honestly, the day I win the lottery, I’m going to buy one of their racks. >> Yes, yes, because once you get it. >> It’s not cheap, but I think it’s exceptional. >> Yeah, and more and more companies, you mentioned T-Lab among others, but even bike companies are building their performance bikes with the capability to fit a rack on them. Absolutely. And I think it’s increasingly meeting a need, you know, frames that even have attachment points on carbon bikes. Things that, 15 years ago, we were told not to put bikes on indoor trainers because they might break. Now, it’s more like, "Well, you have to load it up because we're going on an adventure. " >> We’re heading off on an adventure. So that’s what I find fun, you know. And earlier, we were talking about clothing and all the gear, but the worst thing you can have when you’re riding is a backpack, you know. >> Yeah. And I learned that the hard way. I mean, I felt...I had my little Chrome backpack, I felt cool when I was young on my fixie, and I’d head out, just riding. But you know, you get to work, and you're sweating like crazy when you take that bag off. >> So it's the same principle for people who commute, put it all in your panniers, it'll teach you how to handle your bike. You know the balance, your center of gravity will be different. Once again, it's one more challenge. OK , so basically what you're telling me. Yeah, >> it's not clothing. >> Well, it's accessories. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And the fenders you like, what are they like? >> Uh, well, chrome. >> OK. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, they still exist, but they were SKS. And the real chrome ones, they were too expensive. So I bought the plastic ones , but >> with the >> imitation silver aluminum look. >> Yeah. >> That remains by far the best purchase I’ve made, you know. You still use them? >> Still to this day. >> And you commute all year, even in winter. >> Even in winter. >> What’s your commute like? You know, how many kilometers do you do, or is it , actually, with your job, do you have to drive a car so you mostly use it to visit people or... >> Uh, well, we have different, how should I put it, not seasons, but you know, the work dynamic varies depending on the time of year, you know. In booking season, you often have to hit the road to meet certain clients to present, while others will come to your office, you know. But I'd say my main commute is the office, you know, going from my place to the office, you know, which is about twenty kilometers. But otherwise, you know, I make it a point of honor when it's time to hit the road. So, for example, going to see our various different clients on the road. >> Well, logically, when it's nearby, like in Montreal today, I didn't come by bike, I had things to lug around. But you know, even on the South Shore, bike . >> Yeah. >> Bike, bike, bike, it's surprising how much faster it is than a vehicle. >> It's unbelievable. So that's that, you know, in the morning, it takes me 40 minutes to bike 20-25 km, and by car it takes 45 minutes, so why take my car, you know? >> So it's a lot of biking, and honestly, it's been 5 years since I've had a cycling coach. You know, my cycling coach is the commute, you know? There's nothing on TrainingPeaks. It's just blank pages. I do my intervals on the commute. >> Oh yeah? >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just exceptional . >> Yeah. And so we're going to go a little off the beaten path from what we planned, because I have a ton of questions for you. >> Go ahead. >> Because I'd really like to get into winter commuting. >> The thing that holds me back the most is how I prepare my bike for winter. >> Yeah. >> Do you have any pro tips? Buy two or three chains and you'll be fine. >> That's it. >> Yeah. Well, you know, at the start of winter, and then after that, we're lucky because winters are starting later and later. >> Yeah, well, last year we still had a winter with a lot of snow, but the winter before, in 2025 I think. >> Yeah. >> I mean, in December 2025, we were still riding outside. You know, as long as it hasn't snowed and there hasn't been any salt. You ride. >> It doesn't change anything for >> your bike. No stress, but you know, often at the beginning, like the first storm, the second storm, you're well-intentioned, you're like, "Oh, I'll wash my bike when I arrive," but come February, the motivation is a little harder to find. You arrive, you're cold, you're wet, or whatever, you're like, "I just want to go inside, " and then you're like, "I'll do it tomorrow morning," and then you arrive the next morning and everything is frozen, you know. So, the advice I can give you is don't be lazy. First thing when you arrive, well, you need access to a garage, a bike shower, something like that where >> you spray it down and you're done, but after a whole night, your bike is toast . Oh yeah. >> Yeah, totally frozen. >> And >> yeah. >> Can you do it at work, you know, like, or do you have to do it at work, is it like you have to do it once you arrive or where? >> Yeah yeah yeah back and forth >> oh >> yeah well after that everything is relative I mean it depends on how much you you are you are you are >> you want to neglect it or not but me what I often did was go to the bathroom , fill up two bottles with hot water and get the bulk off you know >> yeah >> So when you arrive, you remove the bulk , you dry it, you lube it, and that's it. So I'd say that would be like the bare minimum. Some are more hardcore than others, but otherwise, my my my future, it would really be to look for a real commuter bike. You know, we were talking about it earlier, but you know with straps exactly, you know without getting too too into the details, but I think a fixie is like the best bike because... >> just one chain >> yeah >> So but after that, riding a fixie in winter is doable. But if you have a 30 km commute to do, it's it's harder, you know, that's where you wear yourself out. But yeah, just go for it, you know , once again, it's the same principle as clothing or. >> Dress accordingly if you got cold. Well , you know, you know what to wear, what not to wear, not to wear again later. But winter riding, honestly, it's fun. You know, in summer, we tend to say: " It's dangerous, the cars...the cars pass too close." But in winter, honestly, that's when I've had the most respect from motorists. >> Oh yeah >> yeah. You know, I leave, well I leave from the North Shore, you know, and I cross I cross the whole of Laval, I cross Montreal and you know once you're in Montreal, the bike paths are plowed. But in Laval and the North Shore, you have to ride on the main roads. And uh Boulevard des Laurentides, you go north south south north and the motorists, they look at you, they ask themselves a few questions and honestly when they pass, they give you a wide berth, you know. so winter is fun. You're you're like in your own world, you do your own thing and you just ride. >> Very cool. >> Yeah. And it'll keep you in shape. >> Yeah, it's I need I need to get into it . >> Yeah. >> I have to admit, the biggest, biggest hurdle is the fact that I live on the third floor. So after that, >> I have to use the hot water bottle technique. >> You rinse it. >> OK. >> You dry it off, and then that's it. Done. But that's it, you know, it's also the best way to train if you don't have time. >> Yeah, >> but you know, your bike is heavier than a than a road bike. You know, when you switch from a commuter to your performance bike, let me tell you, you feel like you have wings. >> Yeah. >> So riding at 25 with a 50mm studded tire, you really have to push those pedals. Add, add some snow on top of that. >> Oh yeah. Let's say, let's say that riding at 25, it takes you, uh, >> you, you heat up a couple of toasts, you go, " >> Oh yes, yes, I can do it. I'll provide you with a full buffet there. I'll even make you an omelet, bacon, the whole kit. But, but you know, that's it, you know, it gets you in shape and you don't see the time passing. That's the, that's the crazy thing with, well at least for me with cycling, any occasion is a good one to ride, just go for it. Go for it. >> You just need to be well-equipped and, uh, get outside. >> The passion. >> Yeah. >> Do you have, uh, do you have any final advice for, for people who are starting , who might, who would like to get into commuting or who are afraid, let's say, of getting into the cycling world by being too over-equipped? That's a good question. Advice, it wasn't a Yeah. Advice, well, I think it's, it's just to go for it, you know. And, uh, and for me, it makes me think of my, my first coach I ever had. >> Yeah. >> Benoît, shout out to you. But he, he always told me, actually, the best way I'll know if I did my job well or not as a coach, is when I look at you in 15 , 20, 30 years and you're still doing sports, you know. Regardless of the sport, you know, for him it didn't matter. Whether you do speed skating, triathlon, badminton. To him, it's physical activity, you know. So for me, that's what I wish for our generation and for future generations, is that no matter what sport you start, the important thing is that you keep moving , you know. >> Yeah. Don't set limits based on what others are doing, you know, set goals that are personal to you and just keep evolving like that. You know, I feel like people have a tendency to set the bar so high now that they work for 2 or 3 years to reach that level. And after that, well it's a lot of work. >> Yeah. >> You know, training for an Iron Man, it's three sports plus working full-time, I mean. >> Oh yeah, >> it's a lot of work. There are some who will succeed, there are others who will get burnt out. So for me, I think that would be my advice. It doesn't come from me, I stole it from someone. So that would be it. If you're going to start something, tell yourself that in 15 or 20 years, you still need to enjoy it. And that's always how it's been with cycling, you know. There hasn't been a single moment where I looked at my bike and was like," Ah, >> you don't feel like it? >> I don't feel like it, you know. "The times it happened, I took 2 minutes and said," Okay, why are you doing this, you know? Why are you why are you cycling? "You know, so if you don't feel like doing your intervals, then don't do them, you know. If you go to a bike race and you're not having fun doing your bike race, well don't do it, man. So so that's it, I think it's about doing it for yourself and for your future self, you know. A healthy body in a healthy mind. >> That's perfect. >> Yeah, >> it's excellent. It's a good It's a good closing statement. >> That's what I had to say, and don't forget to breathe. >> Yeah. For for those looking for you, they can write to you on Benny Toutou. >> Yeah. Yes, absolutely absolutely. Yeah. Yes. If you need advice, a guru, or anything like that. But yes, me, that's it. Thanks for the invitation. You know , I I didn't necessarily know what to expect in a way. I've never done a podcast before. I hope it it >> I think, I’m sure that we had a good discussion. I had fun recording this with you and chatting about all sorts of things, both geeky and not so geeky. Hm hm. >> And we’ll just hope that people found what they were looking for in the episode. >> But absolutely. And yes, don't hesitate to write to me, you know. If, if you have any questions, whatever, let's roll. Let's roll. >> Perfect. >> Thanks. Thank you.