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Geek Therapy's anime and manga podcast.
Josué (00:06)
Welcome to Otaku Ryoho on the Geek Therapy Network. Here at Geek Therapy we believe that the best way to understand each other and ourselves is through the media we care about. And here on Otaku Ryoho, we're all about the manga and anime. My name is Josué Cardona and I'm joined by Rae Hoover.
Rae Hoover (00:21)
Ayo!
Josué (00:23)
Rae, I've been seeing a lot on social media. My my personal feed is just a lot of stories about people who are inspired by anime. It's very, very interesting. Some people I've been following for a while, like following their journey of discovering anime for the first time. You've seen it have you seen a lot of those?
Rae Hoover (00:48)
Not as much, but I think it's your corner of the algorithm.
Josué (00:50)
Okay,
Yeah, yeah, yeah. My algorithm, it's full of people who are like, I never liked anime and then someone told me to watch this and then now they're hooked, you know?
Rae Hoover (01:04)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (01:05)
a lot of that. And just a lately a lot of people just just I've been inspired to move forward to like a lot of shonen examples, of course.
Rae Hoover (01:19)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (01:20)
Right. So so that that that's what we're gonna talk about today. Just this general idea of inspirational parts of of anime and kind of what I've seen. We should I want us to share personal stories, see
Rae Hoover (01:36)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (01:37)
if you have any from clients or other examples, and then maybe some that we can recommend to people for different types of inspiration. So when I brought up the topic, any any first thoughts
On this?
Rae Hoover (01:52)
The the initial thought that I had there was how a lot of the examples of the protagonist being inspirational, like in past episodes that we've talked about, you've said like I don't find that inspirational anymore. So that's what's that's what's I'm curious
Josué (02:08)
Right, right.
Rae Hoover (02:11)
about. I'm really intrigued to hear what what thoughts you have here. Fair.
Josué (02:14)
Not about me. It's not about me today. It's
about my my my feed. My TikTok feed in particular. that's an excellent point. That's an excellent point that I Deku in particular. I was
Rae Hoover (02:31)
Yeah.
Josué (02:32)
like, that is not I don't I don't I don't know about that anymore. I think it's kind of dangerous.
Rae Hoover (02:37)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (02:38)
But there are universal concepts here.
Rae Hoover (02:42)
Mm.
Josué (02:42)
And
So fact check me, look this up, listeners, but you too, right?
Rae Hoover (02:50)
No, okay.
Josué (02:52)
Just in general. But my understanding is that a lot of Eastern and Western mythology differs in many different ways, but there's one idea. This idea of in Western mythology, there's a lot of chosen ones.
Rae Hoover (03:14)
Mm.
Josué (03:14)
Right.
It's like, you are special because you are chosen. Right. You are the gods bestow upon you a thing. We're an East right and these gods are otherworldly beings. They are supernatural, right? They're on another level. They they exist on different planes of existence. Right.
Rae Hoover (03:42)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (03:43)
It's like it's very
There's a there's a very clear separation between the gods and the non-gods.
In Eastern mythology, it tends to be more that the gods were once human,
Rae Hoover (04:00)
Mm.
Josué (04:01)
and humans can achieve godhood through different means.
Rae Hoover (04:08)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (04:09)
And so, in anime, especially the type of anime that we we tend to like and talk about a lot, there's a lot of training arcs and training montages, right? Because
Rae Hoover (04:19)
Yeah, yeah.
Josué (04:20)
The idea of leveling up is something that is possible. And so you train to become stronger. So that's one of the main stories that has been coming up over and over again in my feeds is this idea of like, I s I I I thought about it and I saw this character train to accomplish something.
Rae Hoover (04:44)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (04:45)
I saw them train to achieve a goal.
I saw them come up against a problem, realize that they that they were currently not capable of overcoming it, but through sometimes training, but very often perseverance, they're able to succeed, right? And so while we could discuss how Deku also does this, I think there's a huge difference between
watching Goku train at a hundred times gravity or
Rae Hoover (05:26)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (05:26)
like the thing is he there's something very interesting about Dragon Ball in particular where the hermit the turtle hermit way of training is equally like work hard but also rest and eat.
De Deku doesn't eat and he doesn't rest. Like he just he
Rae Hoover (05:48)
Yeah.
Josué (05:48)
just suffers and trains and breaks his bones and has
Rae Hoover (05:51)
Yeah.
Josué (05:51)
scars, right? Like there's there's all this stuff where it's like there are warning signs, you know? Like
Rae Hoover (05:55)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (05:56)
if in if I'd I I'm sure it has happened, but in Dragon Ball, usually like they keep pushing past these ridiculous limits
Rae Hoover (06:05)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (06:05)
and you don't see their bones breaking. You don't
Rae Hoover (06:08)
Yeah.
Josué (06:09)
see like they don't die in
in the middle of training, they die
Rae Hoover (06:14)
No.
Josué (06:14)
because they put themselves in in harm's way, possibly. And they come back, right? Like so so there is a very different tone, particularly between those two. If you look at
Rae Hoover (06:25)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (06:25)
Naruto, Naruto's the same way. I mean, there's no like he trains and he gets better, right? It's like you've gotta step aside. We've gotta go and and and get strong. We've gotta go and get help. We've gotta go and do other these other things.
So this idea of being inspired by a character who decides, Maybe I need to train a little more. Maybe maybe there's something else I can do. Maybe there's another avenue to achieve this goal. I get it. I completely get it.
Rae Hoover (06:59)
Yeah.
Josué (07:00)
I I have a few that have like done that for for for me. I think
Rae Hoover (07:06)
Yeah.
Josué (07:07)
in the the f in in more than just the physical aspect, right? Like there is a mentality here of Hey, I can get stronger, right? Or maybe I have potential, but I haven't met my potential yet, right? Like what is possible? I see them doing this. Could I do that? You know? Or even sometimes it's even just the the the villain who is
the one that pushes you, right? You're like, I didn't
Rae Hoover (07:31)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (07:31)
know that was possible. Can I can I go? and so I was I was watching a video the other day that was like critiquing Goku's training not from a literal like form and and how he's training, but the the mentality of it. So things like where Goku says, I'm training at ten times gravity. I want to
Like and and then later on he's in a hundred times gravity.
Rae Hoover (08:00)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (08:00)
And so the video it was pretty funny because he was critiquing like, well, you should like take a break and then come back and do like seven times gravity and then work your way back up to ten and then surpass ten. So like
Rae Hoover (08:12)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (08:13)
in that sense it's not good. But he said, But the mentality of Goku is the best possible mentality for training, which is I want to do ten thousand push-ups at ten.
times gravity
Rae Hoover (08:27)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (08:28)
so that I can then do 10,000 push-ups in 20 times gravity. Right?
Rae Hoover (08:33)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (08:33)
Like he wants to unlock the next level and he's constantly
Rae Hoover (08:36)
Yeah.
Josué (08:37)
thinking about unlocking the the the next level. And actually I would say two years ago, maybe one year ago, I actually bought there was a there was a guy on YouTube. I I can't remember his name now. I'm not gonna look it up either but I don't remember he was he
He cre he I don't even remember the name of the channel, but he would talk about different kind of this idea of how he was inspired by anime characters. And then he started selling basically training like like calisthenics workout plans based on different characters, but it was based on basically their body shape, right? It's like, hey, if you want like a thin waist and like broad shoulders, like these are the types of exercises you have to do. So this is this is a training program inspired by this person, right?
Rae Hoover (09:24)
Yeah.
Josué (09:24)
If you
want this kind of training and you want this kind of body, you should do this kind of training. And I think it's really cool to like
Rae Hoover (09:31)
That is cool.
Josué (09:32)
take, hey, you're speaking my language. I can see an example, right? Obviously, you're not gonna look like that character, but in real life, these are still human beings with human muscles. And
Rae Hoover (09:44)
Yeah.
Josué (09:44)
we can we can approximate what we want to, you know, what areas. you want to work on your shoulders, you want a back like this character, you want
abs like this character, you want legs like this. This is what what you want. So I think
Rae Hoover (09:58)
Nobody buy
the one piece ones, you're gonna look like a weird, misshapen human.
Josué (10:02)
Could could you imagine? There's no there's no character. I guess Zoro is the only like because he's he
Rae Hoover (10:12)
Kind of normal looking one.
Josué (10:14)
he is the only one that has like a normal I mean like human looking body, right? Like even Sanji is just like a stick figure.
Rae Hoover (10:23)
Yeah, he's he's real lean. And Zor Zoro has
Josué (10:25)
Yeah.
Rae Hoover (10:27)
the biggest bust on the crew, I think.
Josué (10:29)
Sanji should have huge legs. Right. His thighs should be
Rae Hoover (10:34)
CURSED!
Josué (10:35)
gigantic, right? Because right, right? Because he does
Rae Hoover (10:39)
Yeah, you're right.
Josué (10:41)
his arms should be super lanky and just like thin and no muscles. but his legs should be huge. Yeah, yeah, they're not. Yeah. Yeah,
Rae Hoover (10:52)
Calves of steel. that's so cursed.
Josué (10:57)
that is so funny.
I'd never thought about this. I think Zoro's the only one who has an like an anatomically correct anatomy
Rae Hoover (11:05)
Kind of, yeah.
Josué (11:07)
At least the yeah, he looks like he came from our world and not not that one.
Rae Hoover (11:13)
That's also kind of the freedom
of of One Piece there that you could you could just go full cyborg Franky on yourself and just invent yourself in a whole new way.
Josué (11:22)
I'll add Jinbei also. Realistic body type.
Rae Hoover (11:25)
I yes. I love Jinbei
Josué (11:29)
But only Zora and Jinbei The rest are not. They do not. Yeah. He's a fish man.
Rae Hoover (11:32)
And Jinbei's P's a fish he's a fish man.
Josué (11:35)
He is a fishman. Yeah. But body type. Yeah, th that's funny. Yes, don't I don't think this guy has any one piece calisthenics programs, I'm pretty sure. Because he don't want to look like any of them.
Rae Hoover (11:47)
'Cause he's a coward.
Josué (11:50)
It's too hard. It's impossible.
Rae Hoover (11:51)
Yeah.
Josué (11:52)
How could you do that? How could you the way to look like Sanji or or Luffy is not healthy. It's not healthy at all.
Rae Hoover (12:02)
and and
often impossible.
Josué (12:05)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just like don't eat and don't move.
Rae Hoover (12:09)
Yeah.
Josué (12:10)
You need your muscles to atrophy completely to to be that thin.
Rae Hoover (12:15)
And then we turn you into Stretch Armstrong.
Josué (12:18)
Yes, that's yeah, that part that part I don't know how we get to that. Flexibility? Yeah. No
Rae Hoover (12:24)
Maybe dexterity, if I can see it.
Josué (12:27)
maybe. I would pay for the training that allows me to kick so fast that it allows me to to
Rae Hoover (12:34)
Catch on fire.
Josué (12:36)
no no no to what is it called when they kick the the idea is that they're kicking the air so fast that they're bouncing off of it. That's how they fly. Yeah. Yeah.
Rae Hoover (12:44)
yeah, like the the air walk or moon walk, whatever they call it.
Josué (12:48)
I'll that training. I'll pay for that.
Rae Hoover (12:49)
I'll do that, yeah.
Josué (12:51)
It's not about the aesthetics at that point. It's about unlocking that ability.
Rae Hoover (12:55)
Yeah. Who doesn't want to just like essentially fly?
Josué (12:58)
Yeah. Now, all jokes aside, I
Rae Hoover (13:01)
Yes.
Josué (13:02)
will say that One Piece does do the thing.
Rae Hoover (13:05)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (13:06)
It takes when is this when does a time skip happen? Seven hundred episodes, six hundred I don't remember now either. Don't worry, this isn't a test. It's not a test. But
Rae Hoover (13:14)
I forgot.
Josué (13:16)
the time skip does is the only no no no that's not true. Luffy gets a training. No, does Luffy train on the di on the on the dinosaur island?
before the time skip or is that during the time skip? Both. I think he does both.
Rae Hoover (13:31)
little garden?
Josué (13:32)
Yeah, I think it does b no, not Little Garden. The
Rae Hoover (13:35)
which dinosaur?
Josué (13:36)
No no, there's like when he when he's
Rae Hoover (13:40)
When he's with Rayleigh? Yeah, that's during the timescap.
Josué (13:41)
When he's with Rayleigh, yeah. Is that Little Garden?
Okay. Cause I think, yeah. So well, One Piece does do the thing where they're
Rae Hoover (13:49)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (13:50)
like, We need a couple years, everybody needs to train up and get stronger. Because like
Rae Hoover (13:54)
Yeah.
Josué (13:54)
we've we've reached our limit. Things are really hard right now. We almost all died. We should take a break. And at least they don't come to that conclusion as a group. They kind of all come to that individually that they're like, we've got two years to come back. I should probably train.
Rae Hoover (14:10)
Yeah.
Josué (14:11)
And they all do. So that that does happen. It's it's not the same as in other shonen where they're they're going, you know, they're you you're watching them practice and unlock stuff. but but it does happen in One Piece. Congratulations on bringing up One Piece. So
Rae Hoover (14:26)
Mm-hmm. Yep. Before the fifteen minute mark. I had to.
Josué (14:36)
There is that physical part, right? Which I think I think transfer is fine, right? It's like, hey, I wanna work out, I wanna I wanna get physic or I wanna physically be able to do something that I wasn't able to do before. And it's you see these characters.
literally train right they're they're not just strong. And
Rae Hoover (14:53)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (14:54)
again, this I think I think this happens a lot. Right? They're they're either studying or they're or they're training really hard and that's how you unlock the next thing. I was I I I I didn't think about this until a few years ago. But that's why Batman was always my favorite superhero. He's really
Rae Hoover (15:17)
okay.
Josué (15:18)
the only like he doesn't have
powers.
Rae Hoover (15:20)
Yeah.
Josué (15:21)
So he goes and he trains with like the best he can afford it, blah blah blah, all that, right? But he
Rae Hoover (15:27)
Yeah.
Josué (15:27)
he decides like I don't have powers. How do I how can I handle these people, right? So he like he studies he and he trains really hard. And so he he never he's not superhuman. Like Superman, Superman doesn't lift weights.
Rae Hoover (15:46)
Yeah.
Josué (15:47)
The flash doesn't like
necessarily trained to get faster. He does get faster sometimes. There are like some things where like, I need to go faster. And it's like, but it's not like he's starting a training regimen and going off for a year and then coming back. You
Rae Hoover (16:00)
Yeah.
Josué (16:00)
know, like he started moving really fast because he got hit by lightning.
Rae Hoover (16:04)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (16:05)
Superman born on a different planet, right? And the sun just
Rae Hoover (16:07)
Yeah.
Josué (16:09)
he needs he needs to get stronger. He just flies up to the battery in the sky and gets and gets stronger. Right? Like when you put it that way, right? It's like that's not very inspirational.
Rae Hoover (16:16)
Yeah. Yeah,
I I always found
Josué (16:19)
In in this sense.
Rae Hoover (16:20)
like Superman and like the alien thing for in comics. DC's really egregious with it of just like, this is just a a normal dude on another planet and now he's come here and he's considered a superhero. Like that's lame. Like like get that out of here. I don't like that. That's my opinion on it.
Josué (16:39)
yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't I don't think it's lame. but it is consistent with like, you have superpowers, then therefore you have superpowers. You didn't unlock them, you didn't train,
Rae Hoover (16:50)
Mm.
Josué (16:51)
you just the idea is again, like the difference between those Western stories and these eastern stories. The Western story, Superman, now you have all this power. The story is how do you use it?
Rae Hoover (17:04)
Yeah.
Josué (17:05)
The story is that these powers may seem like a gift, but they also have a negative side. Right? It's like, okay, that's where the story is. But there's no nobody earned their powers. They earn being called a hero. They earn, they make certain decisions. Where Eastern stories, the person comes in weak, right? And then they still have they have these goals or these problems that are that they're confronted with.
And then through training, through perseverance, they they push through.
Rae Hoover (17:40)
You know, you said that and
that made me think of just how the the cultures of East and and West there. Yeah, exactly. I mean in the West, especially in in North America, in the US specifically, we're just handed a bunch of power and privilege by comparison and and the culture in Japan is very grindy, very like you must work hard, you must
succeed and because it's for the benefit of everyone. It's not personal power. It's like everyone like benefits from it. And so I'm I'm seeing a lot of that in that even in that basic summary there.
Josué (18:19)
Yep. I'm
Yep, yep, yep, yep. Yeah, I'm I'm not a scholar, I'm not a anthropologist, I'm not a sociologist, but I agree with a lot of what you just said. It's it's an observation you make, right? It's like,
Rae Hoover (18:30)
Yeah. Yeah.
Josué (18:33)
hm. There's a and and that goes as well to the being individualistic versus being like about the the group or about the collective.
Rae Hoover (18:46)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (18:46)
There
there's a lot there. I don't know how much, right, in in this in particular, but just the idea that right, it's not given to you. It's like you gotta work for it, you have to
I don't know, there there there's some interesting things there. I d I don't I don't know enough to say more on the
Rae Hoover (19:01)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (19:01)
on the cultural aspects, but obviously these stories influence, right? It's like you would wish it's it's so I Superman, I will say this is lame, right? Like, he's pushing like he has a like a plane is falling and he's grabbing it and he's struggling, but if he just wills it harder,
Rae Hoover (19:20)
Yeah.
Josué (19:21)
right? This this was my Sailor Moon argument, right? This was my Sailor
Rae Hoover (19:24)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (19:24)
Moon thing before.
It's like if you just believe in yourself a little more, you'll do it, right? And it's like, mm, okay. Naruto like believes in himself, but he also he has a lot of great teachers
Rae Hoover (19:35)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (19:36)
over time. And he simply like he worked a little harder, unlocked a thing. You're gonna need to learn this new technique. It's gonna be hard. Maybe maybe he does it faster than other people because like he still has some advantages, but you still have to see him.
Work at it. You know?
Rae Hoover (19:56)
Yeah. So it seems like you know, to you at least, the big appeal in the training is the seeing the struggle, seeing the failure even and the growth that can come from the failure.
Josué (20:06)
well what I'm what I'm saying is that real in real life, right,
you don't you don't just get things.
Rae Hoover (20:16)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (20:17)
You have to work for them, you have to again if you're talking about physically, you don't just get muscles, you need to train.
Rae Hoover (20:26)
Yeah.
Josué (20:26)
You don't just lose weight, you have to you have to exercise, you don't just
You don't just be smart, you have to study and you have to learn things, right? You don't just
Rae Hoover (20:34)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (20:35)
get the information downloaded. And so to see to see that, right like what media do you see that they I I don't know. My guess is that in a lot of writing rooms, the discussion of spending time on training, right, is probably now you look at something like there are training montages in Western movies that are famous.
Rae Hoover (20:59)
Yeah. Yeah.
Josué (21:01)
Rocky, right? Like and
Rae Hoover (21:02)
Rocky.
Josué (21:03)
you're like, how many how often do you see that? You don't see that very often, right? Now it again, it is a physical, it is a physical thing, but
Rae Hoover (21:11)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (21:11)
you see you see that. So it's it's not so much about struggle. It's just like, it's just a showing that there's a process. Things don't just happen.
Rae Hoover (21:17)
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Josué (21:20)
And and again, this is what the what I'm seeing in the story, in the in in my feed, right? People talking about examples of seeing a character, like
They wanted to do it, like, yeah, right. I have to it takes work to get things to get something. Sure, there's some people in the world who don't need to work, who they get money. No, it's like you need to work and then get money. But but another part of what I what I've seen in my feed is just the general idea of perseverance. So that you could get from Superman as well, I guess, but
Rae Hoover (21:52)
Yeah, yeah.
Josué (21:54)
these were all anime examples.
There probably the struggle piece is more prevalent where they are
Rae Hoover (22:01)
That makes sense.
Josué (22:01)
they're looking at somebody who is not giving up even though it is difficult
Rae Hoover (22:10)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (22:10)
because they have d because they want to achieve a goal or because they they think something is worthwhile. Right? It's like, you wanna protect somebody, you want to achieve a goal. Again.
Some things may or may not be selfish. We I wanna be Hokage, I wanna be King of the Pirates, I wanna be but it's the idea that like, okay, now all these these are all the obstacles in your way. And you're gonna have to push through them if you really want to achieve that goal. So again, anime full of examples of Shonen especially, right? Pushing
Rae Hoover (22:47)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (22:47)
through whatever the the hardship is sometimes it is
just yelling to power up to Super Saiyan, sure. But like how many people would have stopped along the way, you know?
Rae Hoover (23:04)
Yeah.
You know, as you were describing that, like I wanna be the the I wanna be that is in Shonen really. You know, I wanna be Hok Hokage? Hokage.
Josué (23:16)
Hokage.
Rae Hoover (23:19)
Forgive me. I'm ignorant. Hokage, I wanna be What? I've never heard of Naruto, what's that?
Josué (23:24)
Watch Notor already. How many times do I have to tell you to just watch Naruto? This wouldn't happen if you just watched it.
Rae Hoover (23:31)
Yeah, wanna want the the I wanna be whatever, you know, King of the Pirates, Hogak Hogake.
Josué (23:37)
Haga.
Rae Hoover (23:37)
Hogake god. Okay, this is gonna be a problem. I wanna be the the leader guy. Yeah, that's literally what popped in my head. Like the literal
Josué (23:44)
Very best, the best there ever was. Yeah.
Rae Hoover (23:49)
first Pokemon, like the iconic Pokemon theme song of I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was.
Josué (23:52)
It took Ash twenty
five years of our real life
Rae Hoover (23:58)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (23:58)
years. For him it was like it was only a couple years.
Rae Hoover (24:01)
Yeah.
Josué (24:02)
Twenty five years us watching him before he became a Pokemon master.
Rae Hoover (24:07)
Yeah. Th it's like they actually have a definition for that.
Josué (24:11)
Yeah, actually I mean, again, I need to fact check this. I'm I'm going off of memory, but I I don't know how many times he reached the final four and lost.
Rae Hoover (24:26)
is that what what it was? I have I have not followed Pokemon in many years.
Josué (24:29)
So
so so the Pokemon anime, them the main piece followed very much like the original game that came out over twenty-five years ago, which was that you you start beating the different gym leaders and once you have enough badges, then you can battle the final four. And
Rae Hoover (24:47)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (24:47)
once you beat the final four, then you become like you either you no, I don't think your rival
Rae Hoover (24:52)
You go up against your rival. Or whoever the champion is.
Josué (24:56)
yeah, yeah, whoever the champion is.
And then and then you can be like the Pokemon Master. Or or you just have to beat the final four. But like he would lose constantly. He used to lose
Rae Hoover (25:07)
okay.
Josué (25:08)
all the time. Like it wasn't twenty five years of Ash winning. Like
Rae Hoover (25:11)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (25:12)
Ash Ash was constantly losing. And that's like the anime for perseverance. His goal never really changed. It
Rae Hoover (25:18)
Yeah, really. Mm-hmm.
Josué (25:21)
was like, okay, I want to get strong. It's very much a Goku thing, right? It's like, okay, I beat one gym leader.
I wanna be I wanna beat this gym leader so I can go to the next gym leader. And I wanna beat all the gym leaders so I can fight the final four. It's like there's one ultimate goal. And but
Rae Hoover (25:37)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (25:37)
the but the anime did that often where it's like he him and his Pokemon constantly lost. And so it took twenty five years for him to accomplish the goal he set out at the beginning. Yeah.
Rae Hoover (25:50)
Yeah.
Josué (25:51)
Yeah. Crazy.
Rae Hoover (25:52)
Wild.
Josué (25:53)
Yeah. And then what he did, it ended.
Rae Hoover (25:56)
Yeah, it finally ended.
Josué (25:57)
They that's basically the end of his story.
Rae Hoover (26:00)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (26:00)
Yeah.
Rae Hoover (26:01)
Which I mean Yeah, he's been doing this for twenty-five years. He's allowed to rest. He's still somehow ten.
Josué (26:09)
Yeah. No, he yeah, he's again it took him a while, a couple years, but not not twenty-five.
Rae Hoover (26:13)
Yeah.
Josué (26:15)
Yeah. He I think yeah, again, b huge example of perseverance. But I'm just thinking if it were a Western show, he would have maybe they could I'm again, I'm sure there are examples
Rae Hoover (26:31)
Yeah.
Josué (26:32)
of trying to achieve something like that, but like it's very rare when you finish a season
with a loss.
Rae Hoover (26:40)
Yeah.
Josué (26:41)
Right? Like that doesn't in Western media, again, I'm sure there are tons of examples. But you don't usually that's like, we come up against the big bad and you lose. And everybody
Rae Hoover (26:51)
I
can think of one example off the top of my head with with that, like ending the season on a loss, and that is Star Trek TNG, Best of Both Worlds part one.
Josué (27:06)
the the part one was was a it ended on a cliffhanger, the season? Get it.
Rae Hoover (27:10)
It ended on a cliffhanger and that was when
Picard got assimilated into the Borg. And so they like ended
Josué (27:15)
Right, right.
Rae Hoover (27:16)
on that and then the first se episode of season whatever season that was, the next season, was part two and like it it naturally resolves it very quickly.
Josué (27:27)
Yeah. what's his name? I forgot what is his name when he becomes a Borg.
Rae Hoover (27:32)
Locutus.
Josué (27:32)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes, that's one example. I'm sure there were some.
Rae Hoover (27:37)
Yeah. And one one thing I do appreciate about T N G is that
like they don't shy away from talking about the PTSD that he developed. And just Star Trek
Josué (27:45)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Rae Hoover (27:46)
in general, they like keep bringing that up. Like he keeps talking about it in later medias too.
Josué (27:52)
Even in Picard it still comes up. Yeah, for sure.
Rae Hoover (27:54)
it's big in Picard, yeah.
Josué (27:56)
Yep. Yep. So that is that is one example. It's hard, right? To come up with multiple examples of that.
Rae Hoover (28:00)
Yeah. Yeah.
Josué (28:02)
It's usually usually by the end of the at the end of the season you've beat the big bad or you've solved the problem and then a new problem shows up later. And technically I guess that's kind of happening in in anime also, right? But you don't have
Again, the training montages, the the losses. I mean again, again, I'm I'm w we're generalizing, but is it it I I think we've made the point how how d how different it is.
Rae Hoover (28:29)
Yeah. Yeah. Like
I'm even thinking in Star Trek, like how it's largely so episodic that for a long time, I mean until what what Deep Space Nine, they really didn't even have like big through season storylines and arcs and stuff like that on on network television. but yeah, they they never achieve victory from leveling up in Star Trek, for example.
They they just think outside the box.
Josué (29:04)
Hey, actually this is this is good because in in Star Trek, what what I like about it is this idea we've talked about this so much off off of the podcast, right? With
Rae Hoover (29:14)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (29:15)
the idea that it's the only sci fi like positive utopian sci fi that we can think of, right? Where
Rae Hoover (29:20)
Yeah.
Josué (29:20)
it imagines a future that is different from now, not a future that where everything still sucks.
Rae Hoover (29:25)
Yeah.
Josué (29:26)
And and part of that like the people who want to be on the ship, maybe some of them no no no, that's not true.
Sure, some of them, it's merit based, right? And we know that there is an academy that they have to go through. But like there's no there's no money, right? Like there's not they're not doing it for money, they're not doing it for for like th they do again, we don't see them training. In in some shows you see you do see them, like they're you'll see that like Worf is like practicing
ride
Rae Hoover (30:03)
yeah.
Josué (30:03)
with his sword and you'll see like yeah,
Rae Hoover (30:06)
Sword?! you mean his bat'leth??
Josué (30:08)
yeah, yeah. And then like Dax will train like there's a few characters that you'll see like train, but for the most part nobody nobody's like at the gym. You know, you
Rae Hoover (30:16)
Yeah.
Josué (30:16)
don't see them constantly trying to keep up. Like you just don't show that. Why would you show that? That's not that's not what the show is about. They're just like you said, it's more of like thinking. But that that is a good examp I I just watched an episode of Doctor Who, which apparently is the only time that he ever lost
But he doesn't know that he lost? It's a very interesting episode.
Rae Hoover (30:36)
Is this a
a current season, Doctor Who, or an older one? okay. Capaldi.
Josué (30:39)
It it was it was the twelfth Doctor, so it was from the from I
guess it was Capaldi, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I just I just saw the ep I I'm I'm going through them all again. And there is Yeah, there was one episode where apparently it's the first time he ever lost, but he doesn't know that he lost. He's like Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's very interesting. But it's because very episodic, even though there are larger stories like
Is it is a children's show, and the point is that the doctor thinks through the problem and solves it. Right?
Rae Hoover (31:15)
Yeah.
Josué (31:16)
The doctor is a great example of we know that he knows a lot just because he's been around for so long,
Rae Hoover (31:24)
Yeah.
Josué (31:24)
but he is very much a god figure.
Rae Hoover (31:28)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (31:29)
I just saw an episode that it made me so laugh. It made me laugh so hard. Someone said something and he's like
Don't talk to me that way. I'm almost two thousand years old. I could be your messiah.
Rae Hoover (31:42)
my god, that's funny.
Josué (31:44)
I'm old enough that I could be your messiah, he says. So funny.
Rae Hoover (31:46)
could be your messiah. Such a
such a dig, I love it.
Josué (31:52)
But again, one of those things where it's like, no, we don't have to we don't have to do anything. We we we have everything we need already is really
Rae Hoover (32:01)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (32:01)
in Star Trek and here, right? Like it's like, we have everything we need, we just need to think harder and figure it out.
Rae Hoover (32:07)
Yeah.
Josué (32:07)
In anime, it's like, nope, we gotta get the band together. We've gotta unlock things that we've never had before. We need
Rae Hoover (32:15)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (32:16)
to reach surpass limits that we didn't know existed.
Plus Ultra, Super Saiyan, whatever.
Rae Hoover (32:25)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (32:28)
it's yes, like I get it. I get that it's inspirational to
Rae Hoover (32:32)
Yeah.
Josué (32:32)
people to see that. It is interesting to see like I I I think the this goes into the affinity piece,
Rae Hoover (32:41)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (32:41)
from the from like geek therapy training where we're talking about like, hey.
if you look at media that already speaks to you, those things will resonate a lot
Rae Hoover (32:52)
Yeah.
Josué (32:52)
more, right? So it's like if you if you like the straw hats and you see them take a break and go train, you might think way more about, maybe I could I could get better at something. I didn't
Rae Hoover (33:10)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (33:11)
I forgot. I need I just need to
spend time on
Rae Hoover (33:14)
Yeah.
Josué (33:15)
it. Maybe step it maybe make time for it. And so having a show where they you're already emotionally invested in it. You're going through and it's like you don't start the show off with with the training arc, right? Like you you ach you reach an obstacle and then again this is a full trope.
Rae Hoover (33:35)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (33:37)
Complete trope. Like it a shonen without this? I don't think it's a shonen. I don't think it counts. Yeah,
Rae Hoover (33:41)
Yeah, can you really call it a shonen?
Josué (33:44)
I don't think it counts. You gotta have training. You gotta have gotta unlock new levels of something. Huh. Huh.
Rae Hoover (33:50)
Yeah. I say that's
more of a requirement for a Shonen and then even the tournament arc 'cause not every like one piece doesn't have a tournament arc per se.
Josué (33:59)
Also, you can have tournament arcs and it'd just be that.
Rae Hoover (34:03)
Yeah.
Josué (34:05)
There's a there's a show on Netflix called Record of Ragnarok. Have you seen this? It's
Rae Hoover (34:09)
Mm. I've heard of it.
Josué (34:11)
it's and it's got basically figures from history
Rae Hoover (34:15)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (34:16)
and mythology, and they're all fighting it's like Mortal Kombat, but with mythological figures
Rae Hoover (34:20)
Okay. Yeah.
Josué (34:23)
and
But it it's just one giant tournament arc. There's no development there's only one character that I remember them showing him training as a human. But it's one of those things where it's like, he trained as a human and it's so hard that he he can fight with gods.
Rae Hoover (34:40)
Yeah.
Josué (34:41)
Because the show is mostly about gods, god action figures just fighting in an arena in
Rae Hoover (34:47)
Super Smash Brothers.
Josué (34:49)
a Coliseum, just yeah, but it is just a trimmark. I I agree with you.
I think I think surpassing a limit and getting stronger and training arcs are way more representative than a than a tournament arc
Rae Hoover (35:02)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (35:02)
for shounen. Yeah. So have any have you been inspired by any anime? And in like and it can be in a general way, but I'm curious in any specific way?
Rae Hoover (35:16)
I've been thinking about that since you've been been talking about all this. And it's like I mean, the first thing obviously came to my mind was One Piece because I'm just one piece pilled like crazy.
the thing about One Piece that inspires me is
How it always it focuses so much on resilience and hope and it is hopeful. And that's the part that inspires me. That it's like, it's showing me a better world or a way that we can get to a better world, or just a way that we can keep going and not lose ourselves.
Josué (35:50)
I think I I remember seeing a few videos of people bringing up Luffy specifically
Rae Hoover (35:54)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (35:55)
as an example of how to be.
Rae Hoover (35:59)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (36:00)
Just like, like what would what would Luffy do? Right? Like, Luffy
Rae Hoover (36:04)
Yeah.
Josué (36:05)
like when faced with this, this was Luffy's reaction to it. He did not back down. He stood up
Rae Hoover (36:09)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (36:10)
for his friends. He he said these words. I wish I could say that and
Rae Hoover (36:14)
Mm.
Josué (36:14)
maybe it pushes you forward to stand up for something, right? Like all of all of that counts.
Rae Hoover (36:20)
Yeah.
Josué (36:20)
Seeing
these characters do something like that. Yeah.
Rae Hoover (36:22)
soon as
you started reflecting that, when he punched the celestial dragon in the face. I was very inspired by that. I think we all were.
Josué (36:30)
Mhm. Mm. Mm. Yeah.
Absolutely. for context for people who who haven't watched One Piece, there is like the elites of the world. And they're like are I don't know if we have an equivalent, right? But like it would be your billionaires, right? Your billionaires,
Rae Hoover (36:49)
It's a billionaires. Yeah.
Josué (36:51)
right? They're they're untouchable, they get whatever they want, they
Rae Hoover (36:55)
They get around the government.
Mm-hmm.
Josué (36:57)
The rules don't apply to them.
And so you would never cross them for any reason. And Luffy just straight up when one of them was like, stop right there, I'm doing what I want. And he's like, actually, boom.
Rae Hoover (37:11)
Actually, no. And
it was so deeply satisfying. Anyone who's ever seen the the scene and the build up and everything just if you didn't like even internally cheer a little bit, like what what's wrong with you? It was very it's very satisfying.
Josué (37:26)
It was earned. It was definitely like
yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. So I mean, I'm sure some people 'cause I again I've seen the videos and people talk about this particular scene as well.
Rae Hoover (37:42)
Yeah.
Josué (37:42)
Right. And I think the part that like may not have been in those videos is the piece where there are limits that are set or there are boundaries, right? Where it's like, hey, you cannot do that. You're not allowed to do that.
Rae Hoover (37:53)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (37:54)
And then just
learning this might be a j a general like inspiration thing from from the from these shows just like sometimes everybody's like we don't we don't cross that line but what if we did?
Rae Hoover (38:06)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Josué (38:09)
What if someone did what would happen? You know? Like you would you wouldn't you wouldn't do that. You wouldn't pun you wouldn't even look at a celestial dragon, let alone punch one in the face.
Rae Hoover (38:18)
Yeah.
Josué (38:20)
there's this oppressor, there's this villain, you wouldn't
ask for your freedom. You wouldn't
Rae Hoover (38:25)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (38:26)
ask to be and there are other different versions of this too. You are not allowed to go to this school. You're not allowed to enter this profession. You're not allowed
Rae Hoover (38:35)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (38:35)
to do this or that. And then right we'd see these characters go through that. But never just it's never just given to them. They have to do something to either prove that they
Like they have to prove something or surpass a particular limit to
Rae Hoover (38:51)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (38:52)
to get there. In in in in that example of the Celestial Dragon, it's just a showing of like, that that line is imaginary. It's not true. Just because we all say we can't or we mustn't, or we should we should not what if we did?
Rae Hoover (39:10)
Yeah. Yeah. It's like the the line's only in our heads.
Josué (39:14)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Definitely that's I mean that's that's how I've always seen
That particular
Rae Hoover (39:19)
Yeah.
Josué (39:19)
episode.
Rae Hoover (39:20)
What about you? Have you been inspired?
Josué (39:22)
I think just like you said at the beginning, in a general sense, there is something that hypes me up about
Rae Hoover (39:29)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (39:30)
seeing this, right? About just the general idea of being able to achieve another level. And I I I wish I had a better answer.
Rae Hoover (39:41)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (39:41)
And I think it goes into kind of the cultural aspect that we that we were hinting at before, that
Rae Hoover (39:47)
Yeah.
Josué (39:47)
when you're surrounded by these stories.
they influence you in ways that you may not realize.
Rae Hoover (39:53)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (39:53)
I don't believe in many limits or like if somebody says like
You can't go there or you can't do this thing, right? Because no one like you has done that before. Or like it's very rare. I'm like, well
Is it? You know, like I'll ask the question, you know, like why?
Rae Hoover (40:13)
Yeah. And yeah, that's that's every reason
to do it because it's never been done.
Josué (40:18)
Yeah, what if I train harder, right? Like what if I
Rae Hoover (40:20)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (40:21)
study? What if I do this? I think it and and and it may be a chicken and egg thing where like I've moved around a lot and I know a lot of people who like they would never leave where they live, right? Because it's like it's a scary thing, you know? And I'm like, okay, no, but and then maybe what I'm saying is maybe stories about
Willing to to leave the town where you grew up to to go on an adventure, maybe spoke to me more because like it's a good reframing of of my experience.
Rae Hoover (40:55)
Yeah.
Josué (40:55)
But I think I think it's more the other way around. Every time I come across that, it's like, no, a new adventure awaits. Sure,
Rae Hoover (41:03)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (41:03)
it's scary, but a new adventure awaits versus
Rae Hoover (41:06)
Yeah.
Josué (41:09)
choosing not to leave out of fear, for example. Which is usually the first feeling.
Rae Hoover (41:14)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (41:15)
It's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like fear and inconvenience. And it's like, no, but like maybe maybe there is something better, right? if
Rae Hoover (41:21)
Yeah.
Josué (41:22)
I if I move on to the to the next one. And it's not necessarily always true, but just like overcoming that particular fear. Just the general I mean, this is something that I wish I would have learned outside of anime and media. But just and this this comes up often, but every time it's like it hits me again.
the reminder that like if you're not scared then you're not actually brave. Right? If you're not
Rae Hoover (41:49)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (41:50)
scared then what you're doing is not hard. It's not it like there's nothing courageous about seeing a problem and be like, I could do that, no problem. And then move forward. Bravery
Rae Hoover (42:00)
Exactly.
Josué (42:01)
is being very scared be and then doing it anyway.
Rae Hoover (42:08)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (42:08)
Which is like, yeah, right. I need I need that reminder all the time.
Rae Hoover (42:12)
And you know
what what character is great to remind you of that? Our Straw Hat boy Usopp.
Josué (42:18)
Usopp man Usopp...
I guess?
Rae Hoover (42:23)
What do you mean you guess?
Josué (42:25)
I'm tr I'm I can think of specific times when is that again, you you you're I defer to you to anything one piece, but
Rae Hoover (42:37)
Yeah.
Josué (42:38)
do you think that that is a defining characteristic of his? Okay.
Rae Hoover (42:40)
Absolutely. Usopp is
both terrified and brave because he he never he might even run a little bit, but he goes back. He'll like takes it as a moment to go, wait, what am I doing? I need to be there for my friends. My friends need me. And he goes back into the the fray. Like he is incredibly brave. And he is absolutely the the shining example of do it scared.
Josué (43:06)
Interesting. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna be unfair to to Usopp then with my interpretation like my memories of him. I don't remember him that way.
Rae Hoover (43:15)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (43:16)
So I will I will defer. But there are examples, yes, when when that happens.
Rae Hoover (43:21)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (43:23)
I still think of him yeah, nope, we'll leave it at that. Usopp, good if Usopp inspires you, good
Rae Hoover (43:27)
In in in the in the moments
of like where it really matters. Like on the day to day stuff, he'll be scared of like the little things and be and and cry about it. But like that's not when it matters, you know?
Josué (43:41)
Okay, well I'll I'll I'll disparage him a little bit, but then to lift him back up.
Rae Hoover (43:46)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (43:48)
my memories of him are more of like people dragging him in to doing something than him returning on his own. But the Sniper King, I think, is a great example of like him needing a little he he needs to reframe it in a way. Like he wants to help, obviously.
Rae Hoover (44:05)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (44:06)
most of the time I think he wants to help.
And he and so like he ca he comes up with this persona that allows him to be the version of himself that he thinks he cannot be, which
Rae Hoover (44:18)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (44:19)
obviously it's still him and everybody knows it's him, except probably Luffy.
Rae Hoover (44:21)
Except Luffy. Luffy and Chopper think it's a completely different guy. It's so funny.
Josué (44:28)
But like he comes up with a persona to be able to do it and
Rae Hoover (44:31)
He becomes Batman.
Josué (44:33)
he kind of becomes Batman. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so
I do I do like that, right? Which I think I think it's cool. It's like, hey, it's it's okay. You you maybe you need something extra, right? Like,
I when I do public speaking, there's something about wearing a jacket, like something that covers my body, that makes me feel safer and less afraid than if I'm like just wearing a shirt. Like I will I will go up in front of if I can sit behind a table, I will
Rae Hoover (45:17)
Yeah.
Josué (45:18)
give I will talk for I will talk
about whatever. If I have to stand with like a microphone in my hand, I feel exposed.
Rae Hoover (45:26)
Yeah.
Josué (45:27)
And there's like there's a there's like a physical
i it it it's it's harder for some reason, right? So so I understand if Usopp is like, if I hide my face, you know, and I like I pretend to be somebody else, I can I can accomplish this.
Rae Hoover (45:40)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (45:40)
Which is which is is something a lot of these videos also show, right? It's like, if I if I think of myself like what would Luffy do? What would Naruto do? And then I put myself in that position, I think about it like them, it's easier for me to do it. Because like I'm
Rae Hoover (45:54)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (45:55)
putting you're just changing your mindset. You're you know, you're becoming
you're embodying this other person. So
Rae Hoover (46:01)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (46:01)
in that sense, I think Sniper King is is is a great great thing. Can't wait to see it in live action.
Rae Hoover (46:08)
That's gonna be amazing.
God, I hope we get Sniper King in live action.
Josué (46:16)
I'm sure we're no, I guess I guess no, we're we're a couple seasons away from the Sniper King showing up in the live action actually.
Rae Hoover (46:27)
It depends on what they what they're gonna do in the next couple of seasons. Like they seem to have a timeline that they want like arcs to hit. that's I mean I get it. No.
Josué (46:34)
mean season season three is Alabasta, all the whole thing. So so it's not gonna happen there.
They could bring it earlier. I think they should. I think they could.
Rae Hoover (46:45)
Maybe.
Josué (46:46)
Just yeah, I'm okay I'm okay if they bring it
Rae Hoover (46:48)
Just to get that hit?
Josué (46:49)
earlier. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 'Cause it's a good thing. I think you bring it forward if you're never gonna get too far in the show. Anyway,
Rae Hoover (46:55)
Yeah.
Josué (46:55)
but Sniper King is a is a good example, right? This idea of putting on a mask just to it's it's like, it's a little extra of what I needed.
Rae Hoover (47:03)
Mm.
Josué (47:03)
just
to to be able to be a little braver. And if that
Rae Hoover (47:05)
It's LARPing.
Josué (47:06)
inspires you, right? Again, there's I forgot what this is called, but you know, just choosing a name for yourself, like like a title, right? As you as you set forth on some kind of new new mission. There's a there's a book called Super Better. It's like it uses gaming concepts and psychology. And one of the first things that she does and she sh and she shows the research that supports this idea of like
assuming a persona, giving yourself a hero name. like because you're you're creating this whole narrative and then and then how helpful it can be that you're like, okay, and then and you and you tell yourself, right? You're like, I'm Josue, I am, you know, the sniper king and I can, you know, I I I can and will accomplish this goal and I will
Rae Hoover (47:52)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (47:53)
do it, right? When things are getting hard feel when it feels hard to do,
Rae Hoover (47:57)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (47:58)
it can be very helpful. And
So of course you see a a character that does this, you're like,
I'm gonna be super saiyan, right? Or I'm I'm I'm hitting gear two, I'm hitting gear three, right? Those things you're not literally doing it the same way as these shonen characters,
Rae Hoover (48:14)
Yeah.
Josué (48:14)
but but you're adapting it to your own self, right? It's like, I'm locking in. I just hit gear two. It's like, man, like what happens to you? It's like I unlock gear three. I'm there, you know, and they're like, What? You just unlock your three gear two, what happened? It's like, I know, I know.
Rae Hoover (48:29)
Yeah. Two
and three at the same time.
Josué (48:33)
That was one of those like rare shonen things.
Rae Hoover (48:35)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (48:36)
Cause that was it was it f it was it was three, right? Like right after two.
Rae Hoover (48:40)
Yeah, two and three were in the same arc and
Josué (48:42)
Yeah. Everybody's like, What?
Rae Hoover (48:45)
Yeah.
Josué (48:46)
You've got a second year, now you a third year. When did you do that? I think I kinda I I don't remember if there's actually a question about that. Right. There's
Rae Hoover (48:51)
There is, yeah.
Josué (48:53)
right. There's like, when did you do that? And he's like, I've been practicing or something, right? And he just says like, you know, when you weren't looking.
Rae Hoover (48:58)
Yeah, I was I was practicing off
screen or something. It's like, What?
Josué (49:01)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've
been practicing, which okay, cool. We do get more training for gear four, but it's yeah, it's so it's so funny. Anyway, I any any others that have been inspirational to you or a specific example.
Rae Hoover (49:20)
Trying I'm trying to think.
Like favorite just arcs of a character.
Josué (49:26)
Show character arc?
Rae Hoover (49:29)
I mean obviously I'm just thinking about One Piece now. Let's not gonna even pretend to do anything else. I know I like I have one mode and we having I am in gear five of
Josué (49:34)
Do you ever think about anything else?
Rae Hoover (49:41)
just being one piece. one thing I was thinking about is how I do appreciate how in One Piece for the Straw Hats training is not just physical and
Nami and Robin especially are I mean, even Sanji like his his training arc during the time skip has less to do with like the physical aspect. Like Sanji's thing is learning different cooking techniques.
And we're not gonna talk about the rest of it. That didn't happen, that didn't exist. and like Nami and Robin like Nami learned more about what weather, weather control and stuff like that. Like and it's not a physical thing by any means. It she became a weather wizard, you're right, yeah.
Josué (50:26)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Nami became a wizard. A s a
sta a staff wielding the staff too was like she upgraded her staff skills for sure.
Rae Hoover (50:38)
Yeah, her Clima-tact
Josué (50:39)
Yeah, yeah.
Rae Hoover (50:41)
But yeah, that's all like mostly intelligence based. Robin like she doesn't do a lot of physical stuff. She's a she's a nerd. She's an archaeologist.
Josué (50:54)
but she's very powerful. Like she can because
Rae Hoover (50:55)
yeah.
Josué (50:56)
she doesn't need to, basically, 'cause her power is just ridiculous.
Rae Hoover (50:59)
Well she
it yeah, her powers are ridiculous and she's gotten strong because she's had to survive. Like she is resilience in incarnate. But like if she never had to fight, I don't think she would. And that's that's a big part of her character.
Josué (51:14)
Yeah, yeah.
Rae Hoover (51:15)
And yeah, Chopper's training was just, you know, learning medicine and stuff like that. Franky's was well rebuilding himself after he blew his own face off. which there there's there's so much that could be looked at and examined with Franky in particular, and you know, when it comes to disability and and also body image and Franky tends to resonate pretty heavily with like the trans community too, of just choosing
The vessel you embody.
So yeah, training can training can come in many forms.
Josué (51:49)
Yeah. Yeah I can I can see that.
Rae Hoover (51:51)
Yeah.
Josué (51:51)
And and I think
that that's much more applicable to real life as well.
Rae Hoover (51:55)
Yeah.
Josué (51:56)
Right? Like it's not all physical. These are
Rae Hoover (51:59)
Mm.
Josué (51:59)
like, my I gotta study harder to and in in this particular in the in the case of One Piece, the straw hats all they always complement each other, right? Like they try to be they're helpful in the way that they can be helpful.
Rae Hoover (52:17)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (52:18)
Like sure, Luffy Luffy has power.
Rae Hoover (52:21)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (52:21)
And Zoro is a swordsman,
Rae Hoover (52:24)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (52:25)
right? But Sanji, most of the time he's cooking for everybody. When we need to fight, he's literally kicking the bad
Rae Hoover (52:31)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (52:32)
guys, right? Because he can, and that's what he does, Usopp is your sharpshooter, right? He's
Rae Hoover (52:36)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (52:38)
he's your gadget person, right? You've
Rae Hoover (52:39)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (52:40)
got your engineer and like each one of them just leveled up what they
what they were either doing before or tried to find ways that they could be more helpful, which I think was mostly Usopps, right? Usopp was like, I've discovering these things. I these things can be helpful in our fight. which I like this about that part where Usopp is always like, what can I do? I
Rae Hoover (53:04)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (53:05)
can't do all these other things. What can I do? so he finds what he's good at.
Zoro's same thing. He's well, there's only one thing I'm good at, so I need to get better at sword fighting. I'm gonna go to the the one guy that almost killed me one time. I
Rae Hoover (53:18)
Yeah.
Josué (53:18)
think that's probably a good idea. If he if anybody's gonna try he's the one person that I can't beat. If he'll
Rae Hoover (53:24)
Yeah.
Josué (53:24)
train me, I think that's that'll be worthwhile. Even if it cost me an eye, I'll do it.
Rae Hoover (53:31)
We still don't know what happened there.
That's what I wanna know. I wanna know what happened.
Josué (53:36)
So yeah, okay. So no other examples other than one piece from Rae.
Rae Hoover (53:42)
I I have never
seen another anime in my life, apparently. I've never watched any other show ever, except for One Piece, in this moment.
Josué (53:49)
Yeah. I I will
recognize my my I always go back to Dragon Ball. Like for me it's it's Dragon Ball. It has
Rae Hoover (53:55)
Yeah. Yeah.
Josué (53:57)
all of all of that. there's something about the character of Krillin, who is human
Rae Hoover (54:07)
Love Krillin.
Josué (54:09)
it it's funny to hear people talk about like he's
He's the strongest human on earth.
Rae Hoover (54:13)
Yeah.
Josué (54:14)
He's just like compared to the Saiyans, he's not very strong,
Rae Hoover (54:16)
Yeah. Yeah.
Josué (54:19)
but he's still like the strongest human on earth.
Rae Hoover (54:21)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (54:22)
And he later on in the show, he becomes like he wants to help people. And so whether you agree or disagree, I'm gonna say I'm I'm gonna hope that law enforcement in that world is different than than in ours. So he's like, I'm gonna be a cop
So he joins the police, but he is he you know, he's trying to help people in
Rae Hoover (54:45)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (54:46)
a way that he he he can't keep up with the cosmic level threats.
Rae Hoover (54:53)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (54:53)
That's not his role anymore. So he was like, Well, what can I do?
Rae Hoover (54:56)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (54:57)
And he's not just like a vigilante or anything. He's okay, well, I'll you know, I'll I'll I'll I'll join the police and and I can help people this way. And so he becomes a helper. He's still very strong.
It's funny he can fly, but like he he still like rides around on a motorbike and but he he like accepted I think he he could probably get stronger, but he doesn't need to do that, right?
Rae Hoover (55:22)
Yeah.
Josué (55:24)
whereas the main Saiyans are just constantly pushing to get stronger because there's always a bigger threat.
Rae Hoover (55:33)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (55:35)
That isn't really Goku's motivation.
He gets excited when there's a bigger threat. But
Rae Hoover (55:40)
Yeah.
Josué (55:40)
again, that mentality from before. I think I think it is my favorite show. So I can't really think of another example right now of a show that I would I would think that I've thought that I can remember that I thought like, man, I feel so inspired by this particular show. Because I think I compare them. This probably happens to you.
We just compare everything to one piece. So I kind of compare everything to
Rae Hoover (56:11)
The Dragon Ball.
Josué (56:12)
to Dragon Ball when it comes to this to this type of thing. I mean probably in general. I think yeah. I think that that would be my go to. But again, so so the thing is like if you check in with a client or someone about what their favorite shows are, what their favorite like you said, favorite character, favorite arc. What is it about that particular piece? I
I think I really think that Naruto is one of the best ones at
Rae Hoover (56:41)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (56:41)
this. It does some really, really cool stuff. across the board. Across
Rae Hoover (56:47)
Go on.
Josué (56:48)
the board, yeah. I mean like I'm sure there's some people listening who are like you know, like Rock Lee and Sasuke and and all that yeah, the other day I heard this person go on like a ten minute rant about how
people well basically about how hard the main team seven the the the main characters on on Naruto how like how hard they had to work to overcome these different things and like how they don't get enough credit for it. But then but then she compared it like all these other characters in the world as well who yeah, I think Naruto does a great job of this
Rae Hoover (57:27)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (57:28)
actually. Because it doesn't have that
I th I think what makes Naruto special is what I I want to I'm not sure how correct this is, but in general everybody most people have access to become like a powerful ninja or in this world, which is like the people who who are like leveling up. Like like you can study
to do this. You can train to do all these things. And for the most part, everybody is all all the people who are fighting, like very few people are just given power. And if if they're given a power, it's not it's never really a gift
Rae Hoover (58:17)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (58:18)
that you just have. It's usually
Rae Hoover (58:19)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (58:20)
a curse and an another thing that you have to overcome. But
Rae Hoover (58:22)
Yeah.
Josué (58:23)
in general, there's no there's no aliens, right? Like in Dragon Ball, there's no there's no
devil fruits like in one piece. Right? It's like if you most people with devil fruits, like the ones that we meet, we don't really meet any that are like cursed by it, right? Like every it's like it's usually an advantage.
Rae Hoover (58:45)
I mean, there
is the jacket jacket fruit. Like that does exist and it's a real devil fruit that turns you into a jacket.
Josué (58:53)
What is a jacket jacket? Turns you into a jacket?
Rae Hoover (58:55)
Yeah, and it I think this was in Dress Rosa that it was like these two brothers I mean dr Dressrosa Yeah.
Josué (59:04)
But th for the most part, like they can be they can be powerful. Or like it's usually for the most part an advantage.
Rae Hoover (59:10)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (59:10)
If you don't have one and then you do have one, there are some bad ones, but for the most part, they level you up and they give you an advantage over other
Rae Hoover (59:17)
They can, yeah.
Josué (59:18)
people. Yeah. And so that's why I said it's not it's not universal. I know that they're not all great.
Rae Hoover (59:22)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (59:25)
But I I think Naruto has like a much more balanced world in that
Rae Hoover (59:30)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (59:30)
sense. And so there's a lot of
different versions of the perseverance thing of
Rae Hoover (59:37)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (59:37)
being inspired by the person next to you. Like early Dragon Ball, Krillin and and Goku push each other.
Rae Hoover (59:44)
Yeah.
Josué (59:45)
At a certain point, Krillin can no longer push Goku. So Goku needs other people who are more powerful to push him
Rae Hoover (59:51)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (59:53)
further and and inspire him. He needs different teachers. And and still, I mean I think that's something that's great too, is like having different teachers along the way.
showing you like to help you unlock different pieces.
Rae Hoover (1:00:08)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (1:00:09)
Yeah. Anyway, I've seen that trend a lot. I I thought it'll be good to to talk it through. I'm
Rae Hoover (1:00:16)
Yeah.
Josué (1:00:16)
and I'm and I'm curious. It it may just be that my algorithm is getting this, but I it feels like I mean not always feel so so, you know, take it with a grain of salt. Your your algorithm probably isn't the same as mine, but
Rae Hoover (1:00:26)
Mm-hmm.
Josué (1:00:26)
for some reason lots of people talking about that lately.
And and not like new shows either. It's not like, which hat atelier has me thinking about this or no, it's like it's people watching Attack on Titan and Naruto and Dragon Ball and One Piece for the first time and talking about like man when I'm having a tough time. I think back to like this character and I think you know how hard they worked and it reminds me of this. I'm like beautiful, I love it.
Rae Hoover (1:00:58)
Yeah.
Josué (1:01:00)
Very cool. All right. Closing thoughts? Anything to add?
Rae Hoover (1:01:07)
No No, this is solid. Mm-hmm.
Josué (1:01:08)
Okay. Well thanks for joining us
on this episode of Otaku Ryoho. For more episodes, go to Otaku dot Geek therapy dot org, visit geek therapy dot org for more info on everything we've got going on, events, trainings, and other podcasts. Remember to geek out and do good and we'll see you next time.
Rae Hoover (1:01:29)
Toodles.