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Feeling overwhelmed by your family's daily grind and looking for a way out? Welcome to "Dig the Well," the podcast that empowers you to build the life you deserve. Your hosts Vikki and John are top earners at Neora. Vikki is a # 1 best-selling author and John is a retired Los Angeles Police Officer. Together they’ve navigated family challenges, raised successful kids, and achieved financial freedom.
In each episode of "Dig the Well," they dive deep into the strategies and mindsets that can help you break free from the constraints of the traditional 9-5 lifestyle. They understand the unique challenges faced by stay-at-home moms and families who are juggling multiple responsibilities and struggling to find balance. Their mission is to provide you with the tools and inspiration you need to create additional income, gain more family time, and ultimately, transform your life.
Throughout their journey, they’ve had the privilege of working with renowned figures like Jack Canfield and Jeff Olson, whose wisdom and insights have greatly influenced their path to success. They’ve also celebrated significant milestones, such as raising two valedictorian children and supporting their son, an Olympic weightlifter on Team USA. These experiences have equipped them with valuable knowledge and practical tips that they’re eager to share with you.
"Dig the Well" is more than just a podcast; it's a community of like-minded individuals who are committed to personal growth and financial independence. Whether you're worried about your family's financial security, longing for more quality time with your spouse, or simply seeking a way to reignite your passions, this podcast offers actionable insights and real-life stories that can help you achieve your goals.
Our mission is to inspire you with the belief that if we can do it, so can you. We want you to feel empowered, educated, and ready to take control of your future. By tuning in to "Dig the Well," you'll gain the confidence and knowledge needed to break free from the daily grind and create a life full of possibilities.
So, if you're ready to transform your family's future and discover the greatness within you, join us on this journey. Subscribe to "Dig the Well" and start building the life you deserve today!
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John:Ever wondered how you could turn your side hustle into a full time gig and spend more time together?
Vikki:Hi. I'm Vikki, a number one best selling author.
John:And I'm John, a retired Los Angeles police officer. Welcome to dig the well, where we help couples navigate the world of business.
Vikki:We've been married for thirty five years, and because we built a successful side business, John retired nine years earlier than he originally planned from the Los Angeles Police Department after twenty five years on the job. Now we spend more time together, and we want to help couples like you do the same.
John:Join us as we help you overcome common obstacles, and we show you how to make extra income without sacrificing family time.
Vikki:Ready to dig deep and build your well? Let's get started. Hello. Hello, and welcome back to Dig the Well podcast. So excited to be here today with you all, and we have a special guest.
Vikki:Actually, John's not here with me today. I wanted all this special girl time fun with my my new girlfriend that I met networking, and we are part of a women's networking group. And we hit it off famously right away. I and I don't know if it's possibly I am half German and I am half Danish. So that could be you have something to do with it.
Vikki:But you're gonna find out, this special woman, has an incredible gift, and we're gonna talk about her business. And who is it? It is Jeanna Divine. And she has her own business that is called Jeanna Divine Hospitality. And I don't know if you're like me, but if you're listening to this in America, you're going to really love this.
Vikki:If you're listening to this in Europe, I know you're gonna get a lot out of it as well or anywhere else on the planet as well. But in America, what my husband and I have talked about so many times as business owners, maybe we look at things differently. We are entrepreneurs. But when we go to dinner and we are being served and we have to wave our arms or try to track down the server, we are shocked at how terrible that is, to be honest, from a business standpoint. Like, most of the time, we talk about it and we might really end up liking the server, but, the lack of attention to detail, the lack of noticing that we might want some water or we're ready to order and things like that, makes us not wanna go back to that restaurant.
Vikki:And, it's funny. Jonna and I, as we were getting to know each other, Jonna shared what she does with me. And I said, oh my gosh. You need to be on our podcast because this there is such a need in The United States for better hospitality and on all levels. So, Zana, I'm doing a lot of talking, but I wanna welcome you to the conversation.
Vikki:Thank you for taking time out of your busy day to be with us.
Zana DeVine:Thank you so much. I'm I'm so happy to be here, Vicky. And you're so right. You know, when we first met at that amazing networking organization that we're both part of, it, you know, it almost felt like we had, like, a different type of connection with each other. I know.
Zana DeVine:I don't it's almost like a soul sister kinda energy vibe because it was from the beginning, it felt like it was very authentic and very real. And, you know, we kinda immediately clicked on so many levels, and then we have private conversations about deeper topics. And that's really when I was like, oh my god. Who is this lady? Like, do know I have a sister that I had no idea about?
Zana DeVine:You know? And, like
Vikki:I know. Totally.
Zana DeVine:Yeah. So I'm I'm so happy to be here, and I'm so grateful that you invited me, and thank you for allowing me to be part of your journey on your amazing podcast. I really appreciate it.
Vikki:Thank you. Thank you. And I'm I'm just excited to bring, what you have to share to our listeners. And there might be lots of people in the hospitality industry listening. And, I hope you're gonna get a lot out of what Jonna is about to share, but also you may wanna hire her or refer her to a restaurant that you know, a hotel that you know that really could use some polishing up on their customer service and their hospitality.
Vikki:So, Jonda, tell us I was reading your bio, and I was blown away by all that you've done and accomplished on this planet already, and you're so young. But tell us a little bit about you and what got you started in the hospitality industry.
Zana DeVine:Yeah. So, you know, I honestly was born into it. It was my dad was a chef. My mom ran a smelly small, you know, housekeeping team at a medium sized hotel. And so, you know, from really little on, I was either at the restaurant with dad or I was at a hotel with mom.
Zana DeVine:And, you know, I saw observed my mom and my dad in different departments of the world of hospitality. Obviously, my mom was in housekeeping, so she was all about, you know, cleanness and detail and, you know, kindness and really understanding how to prepare the rooms for the guests. And, you know, she was working very closely with the reception, which gave me another look on another department of the hotel where really how the departments really have to have good communication amongst each other to really make sure that every room is prepared in the way each individual guest likes it. And then with dad, you know, it was so interesting because through him, I really learned early on how important it really is that consistency is a huge role in hospitality. Right?
Zana DeVine:Like, you cannot have a dish prepared even when your staff changes in a different way because your guests are getting so used to either the people that serve them or the dishes that they consume or the cocktails that they drink or, you know, certain ways. It'd be the same way if you have restaurant and all of a sudden you completely change the interior design, and somebody walks back in and they're like, well, where's my table? I always sit in this corner. Like, I love this booth, or I love the fact that I'm sitting so close to the door or whatever it might be. Right?
Zana DeVine:And so with dad, I learned very early on to, you know, very fundamental principles of the world of hospitality, like, really when it comes to business, what to do and what not to do. But then also, you know, how to really maintain of really always the same dish going out the same way even though 10 different people prepare it maybe behind the scenes, but you as the guest would never notice. Because that's really important. You know? That recognition factor from, you know, our staff to our guests is really important, but then also the recognition factor, the dishes that we consume as guests is really big too because sometimes we seriously only go back for that one specific dish.
Zana DeVine:That's very true. For that one specific waiter, you know, that was just so kind or she was just so kind, and we had such a great evening. And so that's kinda like where all it started for me. And then when I was old enough, I almost really never thought about what I will be or what I will do in my life. It was kinda like an automatic execution of, like, I'm gonna be in hospitality.
Zana DeVine:I will obviously gain my degrees, and then I'll just maybe go and explore the world. And so that's basically what happened. You know? And, you know, for a long time, I wanna be very honest. You know, when I would have interviews with people, me trying to be in a different position because, you know, in the hospitality industry, it's very known that you when you wanna climb up the ladder, you wanna have good good things, good homes on your resume.
Zana DeVine:But then you also wanna have different positions on there that really qualify you to speak on certain things and to be really understanding of every department. And so that's exactly what I did. And, you know, sometimes I would run across people that would ask me, well, can't you just keep a job? It seems like you're hopping a lot. Every year and a half, every two years, you're somewhere else.
Zana DeVine:And I'm like and, you know, at the beginning, I didn't know in my twenties, I didn't know how to take that because I thought maybe there's something wrong with me. Because Right. I'm like, maybe it is me. Because, you know, another truth fact, back in the days, my attitude was not the same way as it is now. Right?
Zana DeVine:A hundred years later. Right. And so, you know, I was really, you know, debating in my internal self. I'm like, well, maybe oh my god. Maybe I do need to change or maybe something has to whatever.
Zana DeVine:But so come to find out that actually that part of me that traveled so much and changed, you know, homes and and really worked for upscale hotels only turned out to be the most best thing that I've ever chosen to do in my life because it gave me such a fantastic platform of really understanding what true hospitality is from different cultures and different countries and different homes that all have their own standards and rules. And so by me creating my own company, you know, I had the privilege of really taking every rule where I saw was amazing and now incorporate that in my own business and and teach it the way I think every home had their really amazing things, but they also have kinda, like, things where I'm like, I don't know if I like that. And so now I was able to, you know, create a plan where it's like everything that I really thought that can really work and was beneficial to people, to guests, to staff, but also to upper mid management is now something that I can share. And so that's in a nutshell how I really started. You know, I lived in seven different countries.
Zana DeVine:You know, the fact that I speak four languages was always something really cool just because it helps me so to to connect with other people on a different note. Because, you know, when you when you connect with another person on their own native tongue, it's just really that feeling that you feel as a guest and you as their as their server or as the person that is executing some service to them is you just you just you just feel that different kind of energy bond. You know? And so it's just another welcoming tool that I'm so privileged that I have given by my parents because, you know, my dad was Hungarian. My mom was Serbian.
Zana DeVine:But I was born and raised in Germany. So I have these three cultures ingraded in me. And, you know, later on in life, it was wonderful. How and then I learned English in school, obviously. And so, you know, those languages play a big role in my life.
Zana DeVine:You know? And they play a big role in my business too. So yeah.
Vikki:Love that. I was just gonna ask you. I was just gonna ask what languages. So Hungarian, Serbian, German, and English. Wow.
Vikki:That was great. Yeah. That was great. And I bet there's some crossovers where you could probably understand certain other languages, right, a little bit. It does has that helped you in other countries too?
Zana DeVine:Yeah. It did. I mean, there's crossovers for sure because, you know, if you, for instance, speak Italian or Spanish, it's really easy for you to pick up on one or the other language. They're very similar to each other. Right.
Zana DeVine:Right. But, also, you know, in the world of hospitality, sometimes you just pick up with you know, it really depends for what restaurant idea you work for. Like, let's say, you know, when I work, I work for a lot of upscale Italian restaurants. And so there was a part of my life, you know, where I learned Italian words that we use in hospitality to communicate with the busboys or to communicate with the food runners just to make it quicker. And, obviously, we would have a lot of Italian guests too.
Zana DeVine:So, you know, I would make it a habit to really learn some phrases that kinda, again, give me the baseline of connecting with the guests, but also because Italian is literally my most favorite language that is out there. I am obsessed with the language. So yeah. I love that. I love hearing that.
John:Is it is it that I can
Zana DeVine:hold a conversation? No. But, I mean, is it some phrases understand that I know how to make you feel welcome when I say that in the world of hospitality? Yeah. You know?
Zana DeVine:So it's Right. It's always so cool.
Vikki:The only Italian I know is prego. Is prego welcome? Right?
Zana DeVine:Yay. Mhmm. Yeah. And thank you.
Vikki:Yeah. What is like thank you?
Zana DeVine:Oh,
Vikki:yes. Yes. I love that. Oh, that's so cool. Well, you were saying you worked at at at many luxurious, locations, restaurants.
Vikki:What were some of them? Can you rattle off some can you name drop?
Zana DeVine:Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, I collaborated with the Hilton, the Four Seasons, the Ritz Carlton, Intercontinental. Yeah. Big and Olive was a great restaurant.
Zana DeVine:Mar A Lago, for instance, was was another location that I worked for for a a season. Yeah. Really good restaurants like Il Pastaio in Beverly Hills was another really great fantastic restaurant. O'West in Berlin is a really good restaurant too. You know?
Zana DeVine:And so there there's several restaurants and several hotels that gave me baseline of really understanding what fine dining really means and how detailed it really is. And so, you know, it's so interesting because when people tell me, like, oh, I don't have restaurant. I don't have a five star hotel. I can, you know, cannot hire you. And I'm like, this isn't about five star or or Mickalene stars or anything.
Zana DeVine:This is about you wanting to provide your guests, like, a really good service. And you don't have to have white tablecloth or consider yourself a fine dining restaurant in order for your for your staff to really provide good service to your guests. It's really about just Yeah. Being detail oriented and understanding how kindness on the floor really works. And really understanding that you are, at the end, a servant.
Zana DeVine:You know? And I know this word sounds so I don't even know if this is politically correct to say, but you are serving a need.
Vikki:Yeah.
Zana DeVine:Right? Which is the guest in this moment that either needs water or needs a menu or needs attention or their dog need attention or their children need something to be occupied at the table or they're not happy with something or there's something that they need attentiveness towards too. Right? And same with the hotel
Vikki:Right.
Zana DeVine:Aspect. Right. And so that really is hospitality. You know? It doesn't matter if the hotel where you enter has a name or a reputation.
Zana DeVine:It really doesn't matter like that. And, you know, I feel like we came to a place in this current industry where, unfortunately, it almost became like that. And if you don't pay an x amount of money or you don't check-in into a hotel with a previous really good reputation, you can't even you're not even allowed to have any expectation as a guest. And so Yeah.
John:And that's shouldn't be And
Vikki:that's where my angst and that's why I I said at the beginning that America needs to listen to you because that's exactly how I feel. I go into so many restaurants. Yes. They're not five star like you were saying, but there are still excellent restaurants and you're ignored. You're made to feel like second class citizen.
Vikki:Like, it's awful. It is actually awful, and you're almost made to feel like you're doing them a favor coming to their restaurant and stuff. The other way around.
Zana DeVine:Yeah. And so Yeah. It very transactional. You know? It became very transactional, and it became very aloof.
Zana DeVine:Kind of like, oh, yeah. Oh, you entered my my my establishment. I'm not even gonna take the time to say hello. Excuse me? What do you mean?
Zana DeVine:You know? Or, like, the explanation fact of it, you know, if I'm, for instance, having some food allergies or something, the fact that I really have to bring that out to the table, which I'm not saying is a is is necessarily a wrong thing to do because, obviously, every human inside of them knows their body the best. And, of course, they know how to express what is going on with allergies or, you know, food restrictions better than anybody. But I think it's still an act of kindness from every person that they interact with to be asked if there maybe are some food dietary restrictions. Is there maybe any allergies that we can watch out for?
Zana DeVine:Because, you know, sometimes you just simply forget because you had a full day, and then, oh, man. I didn't say I have an allergy against this. Oh my god. You know? Like, life happened.
Zana DeVine:And so those are standard questions that should be just not made the guest feel like you have to say that, but those should be presented to you. You know? Same way when you see the guest run. You you don't need to you as a guest, you don't need to be asking for more refill of iced tea or water or Coke or anything. Like, you should you should be offered from themselves, not having you to remind them, oh, by the way, my cup is completely empty.
Zana DeVine:Do you mind giving me more water? Like
Vikki:Exactly. That's what drives me nuts. They walk past two and three times, and it's been empty for a half an hour. You know? That's what's so shocking all the time.
Vikki:Yeah.
Zana DeVine:But, you know, but really, I wanna add to this very quick, is it's it's most of the time, it's not that those the staff members that do that, what you just said, that they walk by three times and they ignore it. It's not because they're rude people or they don't they would not bring it to you. It's simply that they're not being trained to be attentive towards those things to look for those things, what is actually really happening on the floor and how to manage correctly their stations. Because every station on the floor is broken down in stations, and so at least a a halfway good managed restaurant, let's just say. Right.
Zana DeVine:And so every, you know, and every waiter in that on that floor has their own little section with so and so many tables. Now you as the manager who runs that floor, if you happen to have a manager on your floor, because I understand budgets are really tight too, and I understand, and I have solutions for that too. But if your manager, you know, is really in control of the entire floor and you have a really good host that really understands that aspect of running a floor too, it's really easy to understand who of your waiters can handle and who of your waiters cannot handle many tables where those kind of things will not be ignored. You know what I mean? Because Yeah.
Zana DeVine:What we make in is a mistake in in the in this industry, especially if we are waiters, hostesses, cocktail waitresses, bartenders. Sometimes we feel I gotta have so many tables to make so much money. Right? Because the more tables I have, the more checks I will have and the more tips I will get. Right?
Zana DeVine:Like, that's like the normal thinking. And it's not wrong. Right. But Right. What is wrong is to assume that you have to have as many tables in order to make money, which you really don't.
Zana DeVine:Because I tell you one secret when I used to be a waiter, and I used to be an excellent waiter. I would get sometimes tables from my upper mid management on purpose the rudest section in the entire restaurant. Okay? Mhmm. And even there, I would make enough money or even more money than all others on the floor because I understood the art of selling, and I understood the art of connecting with people and combining those two from an emotional point of view, but also from a selling point of view.
Zana DeVine:Right? Right. And so once you understand how that really works, then it's really doesn't matter who put you in what section, how many tables you have, because you get to sell to the tables that you serve. And I'm not saying it's all the time like that, because trust me, there was times in my serving career too when I walked away with really little tips. And I'm like, well, this was a bad day, but it's just part of the game.
Zana DeVine:You know? Like, it just sometimes it just comes with it. You know?
Vikki:Yeah. No. That makes that makes total sense. And I'm just thinking, you know, that what you said, how they're not bad people. They may just not have been trained well.
Vikki:And and they not that they don't want to help. They and that's exactly how my husband and I look at it. They clearly haven't been trained well. But then then I started thinking that we definitely don't wanna come back to this establishment if the managers aren't training them their staff well. What else is going on in the kitchen that may not be trained well?
Vikki:So my brain as a business owner starts thinking all of that too. So Mhmm. So yeah. How do we get the word out about what you do? Like, would it be appropriate if I were at a restaurant that I loved, for example, and I love their food Mhmm.
Vikki:But I can see some things that are lacking as a as a patron. Would it be insulting that I say, you know, you really could use some would I ask for a manager and recommend they see somebody like you? What what should I do?
Zana DeVine:Yeah. I think, you know, I think we really got to a point, in the stage of global living where we all are that authenticity really is big. Right? Like, see people all of a sudden that really for years didn't speak up, always kept quiet, always, you know, didn't really say much. Now you see those people really rise up and really speak truth, what they feel inside.
Zana DeVine:And I also feel like that a lot of people are now more receptive to that because we're we're in that change of, like, we don't want the cookie cutter. Everything is okay, and let's just pretend if it's okay. We're we're really rising up to a place where it's like this I don't like that, and I'm going to say it in a calm, respectful way, but I will speak that I didn't like it, and here's what I didn't like about it. Now if the person who we're speaking to is ready to receive, then that's great. And we will run into people that are not, and then that's okay too.
Zana DeVine:But my suggestion is absolutely that when guests are dining somewhere or checking into any hotel or at a casino or a resort, a cruise, a private jet, anywhere where they really interact and receive any kind of service and they did not like it and they feel they got shortened by the amount that they have to pay to even have such service, it's always a good thing to say, like, you look, I really enjoyed this and this and this, and I love your ambiance, and I love the lighting, and I love your music or whatever you really truly love. But this really you fell short here. And if ever, you know, you think maybe this is something you can consider, and you're more than welcome to, you know, give them my my website or my email or anything. Because, I mean, at the end of the day, I'm not here to shame anybody. I'm not here to down talk anybody because we all started our establishments because we had a dream.
Zana DeVine:And so I am the girl that wants to remind those people on that dream. But, you know, when we get so busy building a business, we are sometimes forgetting to live life, and we sometimes forget why we actually started. And then once in a while, somebody like me comes along and just reminds them on, like, hey. Remember when you drew your business plans and what feeling you felt when you're like, oh my god. You know?
Zana DeVine:Or, like and so that's kinda, like, the feeling I'm really wanting to bring back to the owner, to the investor, to the manager because they started in this industry for a purpose, for a reason. Right. And whatever that reason might be. You know? And so I think when I would enter, I always look at so many things that already are working.
Zana DeVine:And I'm just really there to help polish them a little bit in a different way where, you know, their staff feels like I don't necessarily have to have three jobs to survive because we have enough clients coming in. We have enough guests coming in. And then, you know, also the employer that that gives these jobs feels like that they or she or whoever is being respected on giving this to their staff. You know? So it it respect goes both ways.
Zana DeVine:Right? Like, I mean, I cannot expect my staff to show up on time and to do the most for me when I don't even have any kind of connection to them or when I never come out of my way to make things work for them too and ignoring that they're here every day building my dream instead of their own. You know? That deserves that really deserves respect and and acknowledgment and kindness on daily basis. Right?
Zana DeVine:But I also cannot expect staff to have the attitude of, like, okay. Well, if I break a glass, so what? Oh, I lost my apron. Oh, I didn't have I didn't bring my wine key, or I don't know the menu. I have no idea.
Zana DeVine:What? Wines by the world? I don't know. So it goes both ways. Right?
Zana DeVine:It it has to be, like, a respectful give and take because if you are working in my home, I I will have expectations on you. And that's not because I'm strict. That's because I'm running a business. Right? Right.
Zana DeVine:Right. Absolutely. Right? But if you do what you're supposed to do and you follow the request that I have and you clearly say that you can meet these respects because we're gonna have a clear, open, authentic conversation in our interview process, and you say that you can, you know, fill these requests, and I can fill yours because you tell me maybe you're a single mom, and I meet every Thursday off, and we find an agreement, then that's just what it is. Right?
Zana DeVine:But, like, to categorize everything and to be like, oh, we need this all the time from you, but, no, we're not gonna come your way at all. I don't know. I I think those times are really are over. You know? It's really about reciprocity, and it's really about people understanding that people matter.
Zana DeVine:Everybody matters. Every every person and every situation that they're going through is as equally bad, worse, good, amazing as anybody else's. Like, we're not no different. Right. You know?
Zana DeVine:Right.
Vikki:Right. I agree with you. %. Yes. Yeah.
Vikki:And, gosh, I just want you everyone to know about you. I want more and more people to take advantage of what I can tell you know what you're talking about. Just hearing you, you know, talk about the wine key, the you know, just the thing. I can tell you've lived in this industry, and it's it's so cool. Now this is an interesting question, I think.
Vikki:Mhmm. What do you see what do you see, as the difference between a European experience in hospitality is in The United States? Because I see I see huge differences. But what would you what are a couple maybe let's give me give us three things you could pinpoint that you would really wanna hone in on in The United States to fix. Do you have, like, three, or is that too many too little?
Zana DeVine:No. I think, you know and and I just wanna say this prior. Nothing is better here or there. There's always amazing things in this place, and there's always amazing things in this place, and there is not good things in here, and there's not so good things in there too. Right?
Vikki:Yeah. But for the most part, I feel like they've got it figured out over anyway, sorry. But yeah.
Zana DeVine:It's you know, I mean, there I I think, like, this is really individual, you know, from really every every restaurant owner, every hotel owner. It's really individual. Have they did do they have any any history in hospitality? Did their parents come from hospitality? Did they learn the path of hospitality, or did they just stumble in?
Zana DeVine:That's really a big part of so many things. Right? But, you know, if I would have to point fingers, it's like, product knowledge is big in general. Like, if you don't know your product as a waiter or as a person that works either at a hotel or a restaurant, that's a problem. Right?
Zana DeVine:And what do I mean by product is really the menu items that you serve. The ingredients that are inside a sauce, a salad dressing, inside a salad, inside a dish, those are your products that you really need to understand and know because that's the best way for you to sell them. So if you don't know wine and you don't know what wine tastes what way, what pairs good with what food or with what dish or how to even decant wine or how to even talk about wine if you've never had any interactions with wine, then that's a missing product part that you don't have. And when you then don't have a manager or somebody in your team that can educate you on how to stir wine, how to open up a wine bottle, how to decant a wine bottle, how to do proper champagne service. Because listen, there's wines and champagnes are really expensive.
Zana DeVine:Not all. But, you know, and so and so the guest that is ordering such such beverage understands the value of it, and they don't care that the bottle cost thousand dollars. What they care about is how it's being presented and how it's being served to them and what the feeling they receive when they're enjoying that nice glass of wine. That's what this is really about. Right?
Zana DeVine:And so product knowledge is definitely one thing that is big. And I think attentiveness is really big too. Like, just really understanding how to be really attentive by nature to the smallest details. Like, a lady enters a restaurant and we pull up her chair, and we do that for every single person. That's just one attentiveness.
Zana DeVine:If you have a host at the door and the door is closed, go have your host go and open the door to every single person.
Vikki:Hello? And that's
Zana DeVine:good. I don't see
Vikki:that a lot. I don't see that a lot. Yeah.
Zana DeVine:You know, it's it's really or like you have a lady sitting and you have a table and there are just two people. There's two extra chairs. Pull up the chair for her purse right away before
John:they sit down. Find love that.
Zana DeVine:Pull up the chair for her purse. And, again, this doesn't have to be a fine dining restaurant. This could also just be a sports bar or a very casual burger joint or a mom and pops pancake, but it's a nice gesture in general. Yeah. It doesn't cost you anything extra.
Zana DeVine:Your server is already there. Just tell them to start implementing the back.
Vikki:Yeah. That would make me wanna go back again and again. Like, I would remember that. Even though like you said, a pub. I'd go let's go there.
Vikki:They really catered to me.
Zana DeVine:But it's true. I tell you and and, you know, I'm I'm just gonna say one more example, and then I will move on to the last part. But, like, one example, I was at a really, really, really beautiful hotel in London. And what they did is it was cold outside. And what they did, they took a coat.
Zana DeVine:Before they brought you the coat, they took the coat and heat it up by the fireplace so that when you go inside the coat, that you're really warm walking out. I understand I understand that those requests are very outrageous, and they might be unrealistic. All I'm after with this example is the attentiveness that could be translated in smaller ways, like just simply pulling up a chair for somebody's purse. Right? Right.
Zana DeVine:And so I think that's really big. If we train our staff to really pay attention to small details, like, the small detail can also be an appropriate way removing plates from the table. That's my if anything, that's my biggest pet peeve. If I see waiters just stacking everything and then walking away like that or those bins that they have. Like, honestly, that's something I I just cannot.
Zana DeVine:And it doesn't matter again what type of restaurant you have. It just doesn't look appealing to the eyes of others that are sitting around or on the patio or inside the restaurant having to witness this while they're eating their food. It's just not an appealing idea to do that. Absolutely. I'm with you.
Zana DeVine:Yeah. Yeah. And I think the last part is really just great, great, great communication. You know, having really good communication between your staff members and all of your departments. Like, if you have a restaurant, it's really imperative that the waiters really understand how to properly, on the check, not by verbally, communicate to the kitchen.
Zana DeVine:Anything that they need, write it on the check. If there's maybe a misunderstanding, go speak to your manager. Let the manager go speak to the kitchen because what you don't wanna do is you don't wanna just barge into the kitchen and interrupt because they have their own flow. They have their own routine. They have their own stuff going on.
Zana DeVine:Because trust, it's not easy to have a hundred million tickets in front of you in rush hour for, like, three hours within maybe four people to bang out. That's a lot of pressure. You know? So the last thing those people need is some waiter coming in and yapping or complaining. You know?
Zana DeVine:But a good communication between the different outlets and the different departments and also between staff and management. Like, they have to have the allowance to speak to speak. Right. Right? Either in private or in a staff meeting, they cannot be fearful of voicing what it is that they need on the floor.
Zana DeVine:And that could be more attend more attention from their upper management, more help, more tools, more trays, more more napkins that they serve the guests, more silverware, more espresso spoons, because they always seem to be missing in every restaurant I worked on this globe. Espresso spoons was one thing. I don't know how, but they're always disappear. They
Vikki:already they are. Yeah. They're never there. They're never there. Yeah.
Zana DeVine:You know? Yeah. That's a
John:good point.
Zana DeVine:A good communication circle is really important, you know, for you also to have like that. And you know that as a business owner, like, the more clear and and really precise you are in your communicating ways with them and the more you really clarify in really clear kinda like, this is really what I'm needing from you, and this is kinda like my request on you. Can you handle this? Yes. You can.
Zana DeVine:Okay. Great. Then this is really what I need moving forward from you. You know?
Vikki:Yeah.
Zana DeVine:Not be afraid of if I address that, oh my god. Will she leave me? I cannot run my business without this person. They have been twenty years here. I don't wanna offend them.
Zana DeVine:Blah blah. None of that should play a role because it's not about it's really about the guest at the end of the day.
Vikki:Yes. It is. It is. And I I'm gonna ask you a couple couple deeper questions too, but I wanna throw in something kinda quirky and funny, but is is my pet peeve. And the quirky funny thing is what happened to when I, as the guest, say thank you so much.
Vikki:And what happened to say someone the server saying, you're welcome or my pleasure. I personally like my pleasure. Yeah. Why are they now saying, no problem? Or, I think it's that I think that of course.
Vikki:Of course. Of course. And I'm like, of course, what? What about thank you and and my pleasure? That kills me.
Vikki:Like, why is that come up? And does that bother you too, I'm assuming?
Zana DeVine:It does. So so, you know, to me, really, hospitality verbiage has to be has to be aligned with what the establishment the concept of the establishment is. Right?
Vikki:Right. So I will give you
Zana DeVine:an example. If if there is, for instance, a sports bar, like, a very, very casual sports where we can go into flip flops and we just come from the beach and we just wanna grab a cool ice cold beer at the bar and, you know, have some cool, nice tasty wings. If it's an establishment like that, the verbiage obviously can be a little bit more casual Yeah. Versus an establishment where we enter, like, really, we are already nicely dressed because we're gonna go to the piano bar. You know?
Zana DeVine:There's gonna be a live piano player, and we're gonna have a glass of champagne. And, you know, we're gonna have valet our car. And you know what I mean? Like, the the verbiage can be a little bit differently in each establishment. But it has to be, again, trained of what the concept really is.
Zana DeVine:Because I don't think any guest would be offended if in a sports bar or in a very casual place somebody says, yeah. No problem, man. Okay, mate. See you later. You know?
Zana DeVine:Exactly.
Vikki:Bar. That's true. Right.
Zana DeVine:Or, like, a beach bar. Nobody is gonna take offense to that if if the response will be, oh, no problem, mate. You know? Yeah. For instance.
John:Right.
Zana DeVine:But if you use type of same verbiage in a really in a really restaurant where you, I mean, you possibly have a dress code to even get in, or like I said, you have all these extra elements, then the expectation would not necessarily to hear that. The expectation would be more of a hello and welcome and hello and good evening, and even better to take it to the next level as soon as you drop your name because you you put your name down for the reservation either when you called or when you needed online. So whoever checks you and the host has your name. Now imagine that name travels right away to the waiter even though you've never seen the waiter. You're just being brought to your table.
Zana DeVine:But now you sit at the table, and the waiter approaches you and says, hello. Good evening, mister and missus Downey. How are you? And you're like Yes. Yes.
Zana DeVine:Hello. Right? And what happened here? Nothing happened that cost me any extra money as an owner. Right.
Zana DeVine:I didn't spend any extra anything except for I changed my procedure.
Vikki:Right. Right. That's so Yes. Yes. And I have to say, that, the montage in Laguna Laguna Beach, if you've been there, My husband and I stayed there for five days, just did a little getaway, and we they've got it right.
Vikki:They called us mister and missus Downey from the minute we walked in. We in fact, we felt like there must be cameras or something around because we literally would check-in. Thank you, mister and missus Downey. Then we went to get something to eat, and the when we walked we didn't even have a reservation. We were just walking in, and we think they must put photos of the guests somewhere in, you know, in in their employee meeting because everybody at that resort.
Vikki:Mister and missus Downey, how's your saving so far? And we were like, we felt so special. Clearly, they've got it right. Is that something people do? Do they sometimes take pictures so they tell the whole staff you gotta know who these people are or no?
Vikki:Or is that, like, our brain was thinking?
Zana DeVine:Any anything is possible, but I think what really happened here is just really proper good communication between all different departments. Right? Because you have list at the end of the day. Every housekeeping every housekeeping department gets a whole list of whose guest is in what room because they need to know when to clean, when to check-in, when to check out, when to do a cleanup, when to bring new towels, when do all of those things. And the same list can travel around the entire hotel premises.
Zana DeVine:So that list can also be sent over to the hotel pool bar or to the tennis courts or to the concierge or you know what I mean? And so it's really just a really good show of great, fantastic internal staff communication from from the top down to every single member because they know who's in house for that day. All they have to do is just print out the list of who is in our home today, what guest is where. And, you know, and you need you need people with good memories too. You know?
Zana DeVine:Like, the people that really do wanna remember is the same thing when you go to a bar and the the the bartender already knows your drink, but you haven't been there for three weeks. But he remembered the drink that you had the last time, and he comes up to you and says, hi. Hi, Vicky. Would you like to have the, you know, and then he says the drink that you had last time. That's not because this
Vikki:person is a
Zana DeVine:genius, but the person took the time because it it matters to them because he's he or she wants to reconnect with his guest and her guests, and they understand the core of hospitality. Now either they figured that out for themselves, or it has been taught to them that way.
Vikki:Right. Right. Yeah. So that's a great segue. I just I love that.
Vikki:And we should get the montage to sponsor our podcast because we just gave them that big shout out. But, you know, this is a perfect segue to start asking you a couple questions about, what if somebody hired you, what would they what is one of the first things that you bring to the table that you would go over with them? You know, say it's a restaurant. Let's just say a restaurant hires you. What is something that owner would, first notice is happening, with his staff or what have you?
Zana DeVine:So it really depends what the outgoing issue is with the restaurant. Like, is it because we're not getting enough revenue through our staff? Because, really, our staff is really our money making bank in a sense, if you wanna call it like that all bluntly. I mean, you know, if if our waiters don't know how to sell, then that's a problem. Right?
Zana DeVine:Because, I mean, those are the people that need to sell our products on the floor and understand the menu and understand the wine list and all of that in order to bring it to the guest. And so I think it really depends what issue lays in what type of staff because it's not always that issue, but that's always certainly a part. Because, you know, whenever I ask, are you happy with your revenue? I hardly ever heard, oh, I'm great. I don't need more money.
Zana DeVine:I'm fine. Right. Right. I love that. Happen.
Vikki:Yeah. So part of your, conversation with restaurant would be you're gonna talk to them about what they're looking for, sounds like. Right? Yeah.
Zana DeVine:I mean, all honesty, I can already tell by myself because what I like to do is I go out so often for lunches and dinners and all of that. So I I'm I'm a complete observer the entire time. But once I'm really connecting with an owner or with a manager that is ready kinda, like, to make some changes, I always go first to the restaurant and have, like, a dinner or a lunch or something without the staff even knowing who I am. Like, I don't wanna be right away introduced. I would like to go you know, I usually like to go and and, you know, have, like, a dinner or have, like, a lunch, take a girlfriend or you know what I mean?
Zana DeVine:Like, just to really Like, secret shopper.
Vikki:We call it kind of a secret shopper. Yeah. Where they don't really know. I love that.
Zana DeVine:Right. Yeah. And so for me and it doesn't have even have to be a long out drawn dinner. It could also be literally just a quick little coffee. Like, I can see things very fast of where I am thinking.
Zana DeVine:And then, you know, I like to throw in branches. You know? I like to ask questions that should be standard for me for them to know. You know? Like, what what is your soup of the day?
Zana DeVine:What is it made If it is it is it vegan based? Is it what you know? Little things for me to see already, like, where they're standing. And some waiters are excellent, and some are like, I don't know. Oh, I don't know.
Zana DeVine:I I will come back to you. Will give you the answer. You know? And so that already shows me that whatever revenue this specific person is producing, obviously, is not cutting it. Not again because they wouldn't they couldn't do it.
Zana DeVine:It's because they don't have enough knowledge just yet.
Vikki:Right.
Zana DeVine:Right. So I think that's big. You know? Like, really because it's very it's very unique. It's very customized.
Zana DeVine:Not every restaurant has the same issue. Not not every hotel has the same issue. But in general, I feel like pumping up everybody's revenue and really polishing everybody's staff on just providing and executing hospitality services to their guests can never be wrong because there were so so many things. It's the verbiage. It's the body language.
Zana DeVine:It's the observation of guests. It's the it's the product knowledge. It's the upscaling techniques that people don't necessarily have. It's the talking about the wine. If they don't have any clue about wine, how is this person supposed to sell a really expensive bottle of wine?
Zana DeVine:They have no idea what wine, but they can. You know? It's it's absolutely possible. And Right. It's like you were Sorry.
Vikki:I was gonna say, do you recommend teaching your if or is it customary that a restaurant, since I'm a novice, I don't know this, would teach the staff about the different wines? Do they have a class for that?
Zana DeVine:Some do and some don't. You know, some just say, you know, these are the glasses by the wine that we have. Memorize them and just know them by heart. Sometimes that's that's one way. Sometimes, you know, I worked in places where honestly it was mandatory for you having to try every single thing on that menu for you to really have your own personal opinion about it in order then to authentically speak to a guest and say, look.
Zana DeVine:This is how it tasted to me. It was not my favorite. My favorite is this. Fuck.
Vikki:I like that. Yeah.
Zana DeVine:If it's ordered a lot, it's not a bad thing to say. But, you know, a lot of our guests really love it. But me, personally, my favorite is more this. And it's completely okay to be authentic instead of wanting to make the sale because, again, it's about connection. A guest will remember that much more.
Zana DeVine:They will they will remember not what you're selling them. They will remember how you made them feel. That's fact.
Vikki:It is. It is. I just think of our personal experience. Yeah. My husband and I walk away, and we'll talk about that as we're walking to the car.
Vikki:I really loved how when I asked what his favorite dish was, he told me, and then I ordered. I really love that confit, and it was good. Yeah. We always
Zana DeVine:talk about that. Right. And now imagine whoever is expressing that has the proper language to actually paint you visually a picture of how that dish really tastes. Right? Oh, yes.
Zana DeVine:We're talking. Now we're going into upselling techniques because now that's the time for the waiter really to hone in and be, like, without even a menu. Like, I mean, I know I worked at places where I never used a menu, presenting a menu to a guest ever.
Vikki:Right. Right.
Zana DeVine:Yeah. I knew everything that we had, and I just from face to face, how do you feel tonight? More heavy? More lighter? Are you hungry?
Zana DeVine:More lighter today? More pasta? More salad? More meat? More veggies.
Zana DeVine:But what's kinda your taste? And then we went from there. Oh, actually. Oh, I I was thinking a salad, but now that you mentioned, you know, nice fresh veggies, I what do you have? Love
Vikki:that. Love that. You're making me wanna go to a
John:nice place. You know?
Zana DeVine:Okay. And so you gotta you gotta understand that this is really I mean, this is we're talking food. We're talking amazing wine. We're talking cocktails. We're talking ambiance.
Zana DeVine:We're talking laughing and fun and cheers thing and being happy in a sense, forgetting what we have going on. And so when we have staff that are not only waiters, but they are entertainers at the end of the day, At the end of the day, every staff on this floor is an entertainer to come to you to the table to make you feel welcome, to make you feel like whatever happened today, I will make it better for you. Because now I'm your waiter. I will be taking care of you this evening, and you will have the most amazing time where you don't have to ask for anything.
Vikki:I love it.
John:You know?
Vikki:You've already painted the picture for me that I wanna hire you. You're painting the picture, and I don't even own a restaurant. That is awesome.
Zana DeVine:I love it. But that's that's really important. You know, when people ask me, what can you do so different? What what can you what difference can you make versus me having a manager? Right?
Zana DeVine:And I I had this a lot, people asking me. I mean, listen. Right. If you have a manager that is fully on point and that has the revenue part down and it has the being personal thing down with your staff and that drives revenue and is fantastic in solving problems fast, probably you don't need me. In all honesty, you don't.
Zana DeVine:Right. But if you don't have that, right, I can bring to the table, I'm not in your emotional bubble. I'm not part of your daily routine. I'm somebody that comes in with a fresh pair of eyes, with a fresh breath of air, with an opinion that probably you never considered or have not heard before because your own staff members are maybe not wanting to voice staff because, again, we're still in that transitional breaking phase of wanting to step and speak truth. But we're still holding back of, like, well, if I say that, will I get into trouble?
Zana DeVine:Yeah. Right. You know? And so those are the things that are make me a little bit different because I'm an outsider looking into your glass home. I'm not part of the glass home.
Zana DeVine:And since I really know hospitality and I see what can really be benefiting when we would polish certain things, I think nobody in your team will even get the idea of being threatened too because it's one thing if somebody just steps into your establishment and just really stays there for a moment and then leaves versus a manager constantly being on you to the point where it's being either micromanaging or it's being rudely delivered or it's being bullied or whatever because I experienced all of that in my career at one point myself. So I know how challenging sometimes it could be to really have one manager and have all the things on that one manager on their shoulders. They have to take care of it all. And it's a lot of responsibility. You know?
Zana DeVine:So it's it's it's helping everybody in your team to have an outside force like myself come in to just take a load off, collaborate, come up with fresh ideas, brainstorm, just polish the whole thing from another perspective, and just bring in a little bit more of a different type of magic than you what you already have. You know? And I'm not there to to change your home. I'm not there to change your dream. I'm just there to remind you and just there to to help you carry the load.
Vikki:Love it. I love it. I think we have time for one last question, and that is after somebody hires you and because I'm just trying to think of as a business owner, and you've given us great tips how to increase revenue, how to drive this, how how to, you know, get better at the hospitality portion. Do you stay on board with with that restaurant or hotel, kind of as a as a consultant for a time, or is it just kinda like, okay. There you go.
Zana DeVine:Work on it. No. It's it's exactly the opposite. So I really love to so once my trainings are observed and executed, I usually always stay side by side with the team, physically side by side by the team. And then it depends, you know, where is the team at?
Zana DeVine:Is it in my backyard? It's no problem. I will be side by side. Are you in Florida? Are you in Arizona?
Zana DeVine:Are you in Ohio? Where are you? It doesn't matter. I mean, I can fly anywhere. There's planes.
Zana DeVine:They go everywhere every day. But I would prefer to stay side by side just because, you know, when you when you have that energy interaction with the team and you build that real bond with them, they feel more secure when somebody is shadowing them for two, three, four days after the training is observed. Because we gotta remember, just by speaking one time on a topic to somebody, and this could be for any industry, does not mean that they understood it right away ready to execute. They may be understood logically and logistically in their mind, and it makes sense, and they understand. Yes.
Zana DeVine:But if they've never done that execution on the floor, then they're gonna be like, oh, wait. What did she say? When is this happening? What is this process? When is this procedure?
Zana DeVine:Like, it's a lot, right, in in in in training. Lot. Right. And so me being on the floor with them and helping them and shadowing them and barging in, of course, in a very calm and friendly and kind way and just helping them out when it's really needed is something that Right. Makes them really feel secure to then be like, okay.
Zana DeVine:She was standing next to me when I opened my first bottle of wine or this really expensive wine that I needed to decant or, like, debone a fish or whatever it might be. Right? And though those are just really high examples. It could be other things. But staying on on staying with them for a few days, I think it's it's I don't know why why anybody else not does it that way.
Zana DeVine:Because just you dropping your knowledge and you dropping your your training and then just removing yourself, I don't know if that's beneficial.
Vikki:Yeah. I think what you do, it takes learning from here to here. Right? Because you're staying on reinforcing what you trained on. And like you said, shadowing them, helping them, adjusting when they need adjustment in a kind way.
Vikki:That that that's just brilliant to me. That makes total sense. Yeah. Well, gosh. This has been amazing.
Vikki:I could talk to you forever on, this subject. I just find it fascinating and a real need a real need in the marketplace for it. So tell us, Jonna, how do people get in touch with you? I know we're gonna put it in the show notes, but how would somebody book a call, if that's something you do, or how would they get in touch?
Zana DeVine:Yeah. Totally. They can book a call with me. You can find me on LinkedIn. You can find me on Instagram.
Zana DeVine:You can go on my website. You can call Vicky.
Vikki:That's right. And it's JahnaDivineHospitality.com. Is that your website? Perfect. Perfect.
Zana DeVine:And we're gonna have all of that Yeah. I know that my name and I know that my name is very unique, so my parents thought they gonna be very fancy when they created my name. So I know that Zana is spelled z a n a, and then Divine Hospitality, or it also can just be z d hospitality. That's probably the easiest way to find me.
Vikki:Love it. Love it. Mhmm. Thank you so much. Thank you.
Vikki:I wanna go out to eat with you and see if we notice the same things. I'm sure you'll notice way more. But
John:Yes. But that would that would be fun.
Vikki:We'll have to schedule that. Yeah.
Zana DeVine:I so appreciate being your guest. I'm I'm so grateful, and I'm very appreciative of you for you to to open your doors for me. I'm very, very grateful.
Vikki:Aw. And we've enjoyed having you on Dig the Well. So if you love this episode, please make sure to review it. Give us five stars. If you're watching on YouTube or Rumble, leave a comment.
Vikki:We love to hear from you. And, we hope you all have a fantastic day. And get some fine dining in, and we'll see you at the next restaurant. Thank you so much. Bye, guys.
Vikki:Thanks for joining us on Dig the Well.
John:We hope you feel empowered and ready to take on new challenges.
Vikki:Remember, if we can do it, so can you. Keep learning, keep believing, and going after your dreams. And if you enjoyed
John:this episode, share it with someone who needs a little inspiration or maybe a nudge in the right direction.
Vikki:Help us grow this community of go getters. Together, we can achieve greatness and get back to family. Thanks for
John:listening, and let's keep digging the way.