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Tomorrow can be different from today.
Our lives often leave us feeling hopeless—like nothing will ever change. But perspective is everything. When you know where to look, hope can be found in the spaces and places you least expect.
Join Jason Gore (Lead Pastor of Hope Community Church) for a fresh perspective, practical steps, and weekly encouragement that hope really is possible… even in real life.
Even though you're trying to teach people, you still need
to be teachable yourself.
Yeah. Um, and whether
that's being taught from those you're leading
or just in general always getting better.
Um, because I don't think people wanna follow somebody
who seems like they know all the answers.
That doesn't, you know, it's, you can't resonate
with somebody who, 'cause I remember thinking that.
It's like, why did I, why I can't resonate with somebody
who I feel like knows everything.
Welcome to the Hope and Real Life podcast with Jason Gore.
Our team is passionate
and committed to bringing you more hope in the everyday
real areas of your life.
If this conversation and content is valuable for you,
please do us a favor, like, subscribe, and even share.
You never know how valuable it could be
to share a little bit of hope with someone else.
Let's get the conversation started.
Well, hello to our Hope in Real life listeners.
So excited to be here this week, uh, with a special guest
and is actually a friend of mine as well.
Runs by the name of Bradford Mitchell.
Hello, uh, how's it going, Bradford? Welcome to the show.
Thank you. Yeah, man.
We are here today to talk about using your influence.
And really this is all about how do you use the platform
or the gifts or the talents
or the abilities that, um, might be God given to you
or that you've worked hard to build up,
or some combination between how do you use those
to influence others.
Yeah. Which, which for this podcast is a big deal.
'cause this podcast, it really is all about
how do we influence point other people towards hope.
Sure. And so, for this to topic, man,
how do we use our platform to influence other people?
A little bit about Bradford.
He is, um, really one of the primary minds behind, uh,
at worship tutorial, which is, you know, among other,
I tell you what, let me let you let tell other people
about worship tutorials.
Okay. How you got into it,
and just what's the vi overall vision
behind worship tutorials? Yeah.
Uh, so my buddy Brian
and I have known each other for,
I don't know, about 11 years now.
Um, and before I met him he kind of,
he had a lot of time to kill.
His wife was in like med school, or she was getting her PhD.
I guess that's different. Um,
and he, he just started making videos on YouTube,
like playing worship songs.
I feel like I've heard this before though.
There's a story before, like there's a musician Yeah.
Who married someone way smarter than him. Oh yeah. Somehow.
Okay. Yeah. I mean, he's
Sounds pretty normal. Well,
what's wild is as smart as she is.
He's like very smart too.
He double majored in biology and Chemistry. Okay.
And he got his master's in business.
And so if you like,
watch worship tutorials from the beginning to
where it is now, everything that you see, like
how things sound and look
and everything we teach on all of this stuff is like,
basically like this journey in the story of
how Brian learned how to do everything.
Yeah. Photography, video, audio,
playing guitar, all of that.
It's, it's wild. And I love telling people that.
'cause I love bragging on that dude.
'cause he's super smart and he has put
a lot of effort into it.
Um, but that's how it started.
He just started like playing songs acoustically.
And this was like when YouTube was still rather young
and it wasn't flooded with content.
And he just started doing, I guess a lot of people resonated
with it because they'd hear a song, um, from a church
and it's like this, the, like anthemic
or like arena, arena rock or whatever.
Like, it just sounded big always.
And there's nothing wrong with that,
but it would just be very hard for a small church
to understand how they could do that song in their context.
So he would just be playing a, a popular worship song,
just him on acoustic guitar and just singing it.
And people resonated with it.
And they're like, this, this song Mighty to save.
Like this seems way more approachable to me than hearing
how Hill Song did it.
So he started doing that, and then he started teaching
and people latched onto that.
And, um, I, I met him couple, uh, maybe about three
or four years into him doing it pretty randomly.
Not super intentional.
Um, and we both worked at the same church.
We were part-time, so we just took Fridays
to when we had our days off.
We work Sunday Thursday kind of thing.
And we started making content
and figuring out like, okay, we have volunteers on our team
who don't know how to do X, Y, Z.
Yeah. So we could hold a session
on a Saturday and that's great.
We could do that. And that's personable
and that's encouraged also, obviously.
But it was like, there are other churches
who are gonna have the same hole.
Like how do we, you know,
you could play grow up playing guitar in a garage band
and like Absolutely.
You can still play worship, but there's parts about it
that people are scratching their heads
and you're like, how do I, how do we do this?
Yeah. Or they haven't played guitar
in 10 years and they want to.
And so we started making content that from the perspective
of how does it gonna help our people?
And it resonated with other people.
So, um, and that's, we just kept going
and kept finding, you know, as we did that more,
you get more comments, people telling you what the need is.
We would just kind of gauge the room.
Man, a lot of people are asking about this lately.
Let's do this. And Yeah.
Felt needs, like just how can we, and it's all free.
Um, we sell products,
but we also give away a free version of
that product that's just as good.
Yeah. So like, we don't even,
you don't even need to pay us anything.
Um, you know, if you want to have something, I mean,
you could have really good stuff, but,
or we make lots of different things and it's like,
but the, the free thing is' in any less
good just 'cause it's free.
Right. So that's all for guitarists.
The products are, um,
but the, the vision is, is pretty to the point
to help people, to help churches have
excellent and authentic worship.
And that's the, the one vision statement.
And the idea here is that doesn't even require money. Yeah.
What I love is, you, you guys have, you started out
really by just starting Mm-Hmm.
And you hear that so much when you listen,
whether it's entrepreneurs
or people who are starting something new.
I mean, you just gotta start. Yeah.
And you're gonna figure that out along the way. Yeah.
Like what's the actual need, what my passions really are.
And then at some point those things come together. Yeah.
And then some magic happens, which we'll talk about what
that magic kinda looks like for you guys here in a moment.
But I can you talk just for a minute, like,
what is specifically your role within worship tutorials?
What's the value add that you
bring and, and how do you serve?
Yeah. Um, Brian
and I now kind of just do everything together really.
Um, there's like a, like one of our good friends,
Nick is our, is our videographer and he's amazing at that.
But he also plays guitar.
Um, we have various other people who've been
a part of the channel and do stuff.
Um, I kind of, the, the thing I kind of focus on the most is
how do I listen to a worship song
and I listen to all the guitar parts
and how can I make it work for one guitar player?
Average Church of America is like, what, 70,
80 people I think is the number.
That's right. So it's like the chances
of them having multiple guitar players is,
is slim. And even then, like,
Do you want five electric guitars in the church?
No, I don't. People don't.
I have a hard time with two. Yeah.
Sometimes I'm like, can it just be me? Yeah.
That's just selfish. But, um, so I'd say
that's the, like, the primary thing.
But together we make the digital product that we sell
to, uh, guitar players.
And him and I both come up with content ideas
and for videos we can, we can make to just help people.
And, you know, especially if,
if God's been teaching me something
or helping me figure something out, I'll, I'll,
I'll share a video, uh, and we'll just sit down
and kind of like, people just resonate with you being real
and sharing what's, what's going on.
And so even if it doesn't feel like it's something
that people have been asking for,
it still goes over really well when you're just
real and you're just yourself.
Yeah. So you guys, right now, you're well on your way.
And I probably should have said this right outta the gate,
you're well on your way
to a million subscribers on YouTube, which is a lot.
Yeah. That's pretty Crazy. Like a a million is more
than a hundred thousand
or 500,000 just
for the people out here who aren't good at math.
Right. I mean, that's a lot. Okay.
I think that checks out. Yeah.
How did you get there?
Like how did you gain that following?
That is a good question.
We ask ourselves that all the time. Yeah.
Um, so our part of it also, we, we know
that our augment our audience is pretty segmented.
Um, we have people who watch just 'cause they enjoy music.
Um, and whether it's Christian
or not, um, whether they are a Christian
or not, sometimes that's the case.
Um, sometimes as worship leaders, sometimes
as guitar players, um, we have people,
we do stuff like gear reviews also,
which is really helpful for musicians.
And a lot of times, even though people will,
people will blatantly tell us, I don't believe in God,
but I still love what you guys do.
And that actually is like a great honor to me to know
that somebody like that, like,
it just means I have some form
of say at some point maybe I could say
or do something that helps 'em know God is real.
Um, but that, like, we just do so many different things
that I think that put, that's another conversation
that wasn't what you asked, but we have so many different,
like, things that we do that I think draws people in.
And we really love covering a lot wide variety of topics.
So I think just being consistent
and we got in really early with YouTube
nowadays it's pretty saturated.
There are, like, you look at any of the top worship songs,
for example, and you type that in
and then add the word guitar to it.
And you may see like eight videos, 12 videos,
30 videos Right.
Of people playing that song.
Um, but I think part of it
for us is we were just consistent over a long period of time
and just kept going and
Had Yeah. Being first
to market
and then consistent over an extended period of time.
Yeah. Is is what I'm hearing. Yeah.
Another thing that jumps out is, I mean, you,
you guys really, you add value, right?
I mean, and this is, so we're talking about worship
tutorial, what it means to lead worship
and the context of a church,
most likely essentially in Western context in America.
Yeah. Yeah. Um, and
but that's not really,
that's not really what we're talking about.
What we're talking about is how to build influence
and how to influence others.
And what I'm hearing is you guys add value.
You actually have an issue figuring out, okay,
what are the value adds?
What are the questions that people are asking?
And then how can we address that? Yeah.
And so I, from my vantage point, when I check out
what you guys do, I'm like, I can't believe people are
doing this for free.
Yeah. Because it's something that's desperately needed.
Yeah. Um, which kinda cues up the next question.
He, so if you don't know, so Bradford, again, I mentioned he
and I friends, he plays guitar at our church, um, has some
of the best guitar tone around, by the way.
That's good. 'cause that's how I make my money.
So to hear you say that means I feel like I'm,
Yeah, it's, it's, it's a, it, I mean, very,
very good topnotch.
Um, but you could, with your,
and you're not just a electric guitar player,
mean worship leader.
We could throw you up with an acoustic guitar
and just you in a room and you'll point people to God and,
and, and do phenomenal job.
So you could, you're with your talent,
with your giftings, with your experience.
You could be the guy, uh, at, at a number
of churches in America on a big stage
and everything revolving around you.
And you've chose to not go that route.
Um, and to, uh, to go this route
and invest a bit more heavily in worship tutorials.
Can you talk just a little bit about that?
Like what led you to do that and why that is? Yeah.
Um, And it could just be
because none of those churches
are willing to pay you enough.
I don't know. But there could,
I think there's more to it than No,
No. I, I have
always kind of felt a pull
to leadership in general.
Yeah. I don't, I remember back in like high school,
being in scouts, I was in Boy Scouts
and I wanted to be, they called like the, like the, the,
the boy that was overall
You wrote more like a boy scout than a guitar
player, to be honest with you. You, you're
Big. I don't know if Iard
Appreciate that beard. No. That
big old bird. I,
I look like a boy scout with a beard.
We're gonna watch a YouTube clip in a minute. That's true.
That's weird. Boy Scouts an adult scout.
We're gonna see a clip in a minute.
Don't forget how you were answering the question. Okay.
But the, I mean, you've got straight lumberjack swag, Owen.
I just love flannel. Okay.
All right. Okay. So back to you. Why?
Uh, yeah. I remember just even being in,
in like high school, I wanted to be like
the senior patrol leader is what they called it.
So that was like the boy who kind of like ran the troop.
Um, and I just really felt this draw to
helping these boys.
You know, I mean, I was 16, 17 at the time
and I had, you know, young, young boy scouts with me too.
And I just wanted to like, influence them.
I didn't really know how, I think,
I just really thought it was cool, cool.
To be in charge. Um, but that's true.
As I, as I got older, I realized the, the science
and the idea behind leadership
and like what that means, like that just fascinated me.
And then I realized
that leadership is not just the guy in charge, it's to use,
you know, to kind of what we've been talk about.
I mean, it's like the person who has influence over things,
whether it's influence, how, how an organization moves
to begin with or just influence, like to be able
to help people become better people.
Yeah. Um, and so I, when I got this opportunity
to start doing stuff with Brian
and I started realizing, I actually kind of like,
this is like kind of my, my outlet.
I enjoy it. I don't like, I like people,
but I also like being by myself.
I don't know. I'm not really an extrovert.
I guess maybe I am, I don't know.
So like, the idea of like teaching a class is not
as much like, it's fun,
but I feel like I'd rather just hang out with people at
that point so I can like teach and then I can make a video
and it's, I can be succinct
'cause I can talk for hours and hours on end.
Um, and so I was like, this is actually kind of more,
I can sit on things more.
I can stew more, I can really hone it in
and I can feel like I can be more impactful if I
can like, make a video.
'cause he put me in a room, I could, I get very distracted.
Um, so a video, I can be more intentional.
And it just was really fun.
And we saw people actually engaging with it. Yeah.
And people were, it was, subscribers were growing up.
People were telling us they like, they, um,
every once in a while, even at,
at Hope someone would be like, so a friend
of mine told me they watch your channel.
And like, so stuff like that was like, okay,
so maybe we got something here.
Right. Like there's, we should just keep doing it.
And I don't know, it just really resonates with me more.
You know, it's in this day and age, it's all video. Yeah.
Um, and I don't know why, but it just, I've always wanted
to do that kind of thing and I found how to do it, I guess.
Well it's, it's clearly making an impact
and there's a need, uh, little known fact here, um, about,
uh, my backstory, I actually, when I first got, came out
of the business world into, uh,
what some people would call ministry.
Yeah. Um, I have a musical background.
And so I started out essentially as a worship leader. Hey.
And so, yeah. And so, uh, that,
and then man all kinds of ended up on staff here at Hope
as a college pastor and worship leader.
And then we planted a church out of hope.
And really it was all things creative, um,
that I was responsible for.
So you learn, you know, you gotta learn Oh yeah.
How to do everything. But the truth is,
I would say the secret, the the little known secret,
but anyone who heard me lead worship,
it wouldn't be a secret anymore.
Uh, uh, vocals were not my strong suit.
Hey, uh, I think pitch is all right.
Uh, but, but tone is probably leaves a bit to be desired.
But I did have this, like, I had this desire for people
to experience like, and encounter the goodness of God.
Yeah. And to be reminded, like, as a worship leader,
you have this opportunity to put words on people's lips
that are true, that they
otherwise in the busy busyness of life would not
take the time to say, or even though they need to say
or be reminded of.
And now you got a room of Mm-Hmm.
Whether it's 70 people, a thousand people,
15 people all reminding one another.
So like I was passionate about that. Yeah.
Um, but what I realized was
I was better at equipping people to do that.
Yeah. And then getting the heck outta the way
and letting people that were way more gifted at it
carry most of the weight.
Um, and so, you know, that's kind of
how I shifted my role back then.
But what I've seen you do here is you've almost taken
that up even another level.
'cause you've realized we live in a day
and age where the world is digital and people are online,
and you have access to people
that are far more than could potentially show
up at your church.
Yeah. And like, you're literally now equipping leaders
and influencers that are making a difference in the,
the church overall, which I believe ultimately at the end
of the day is the hope of the world.
Yeah. Through Jesus. And so pro man for doing that.
Thank you. And yeah. And you're getting it done,
but we are gonna interrupt this episode
for some breaking news.
If you have been tracking with us
as the hope in real life family for any length of time,
you have heard us talk about an up
and coming resource
that we have been calling the Hope in Real Life app.
I could not be more excited to let you know
that the app has dropped and is now available for download.
Just so you know, we approach this, um,
with a true masterclass type approach.
Like what are the areas in other people's lives
where they're looking to find hope, areas like marriage,
parenting, finances, what does it really mean
to grow in my life spiritually?
And so we have these growth tracks set up for you.
There's also different communities that you can be a part of
inside of the app, or you can ask for prayer request
and know that somebody else is praying
for you in the specific areas that you need.
Download this app, check it out.
Share it with other people who, you know,
need a bit more hope in the everyday moments of their life.
Back to the show. Let's do this.
We got a clip here from, uh, one of the worship tutorials.
Why don't we roll this and please note again the beard
and the fantastic flannel as we watch it.
But I had started leading worship at my high school
during the week and I was like really into it.
And I didn't know that you could do it as a job
and I didn't know that you could go
to school for it and all this.
And I remember my dad breaking down a few ideas.
So number one, what do you enjoy doing?
Like, what is it that that brings you joy? Is there fishing?
I like to fish the Way you can
actually do that for a living.
And don't, don't sell yourself short here.
Like you could, like in my instance, I didn't realize
that a phish YouTube channel, I could do Now
that thing, it's no different.
Do you get opportunities to do that?
Like do people invite you
or ask you if you can come do that for them?
Um, do you get paid to do it?
'cause if you do, that's kind of helpful.
Already get paid in this, you know, process and all this.
That's really cool. Um, you don't need to get paid
to do it now, but just, I get free
guitars, some questions along that lines.
If you get opportunities to do it, I mean,
you could just be doing it in your church every single week,
you know, and, um, your pastor says, Hey,
we really, we really need you.
You do a great job at it.
And that's actually point number three.
Do you, do people tell you that you're good at that thing?
I, I think it's great. I, I like that clip
because number one, you're, you see worship tutorials,
you're not just talking about leading worship.
Mm-Hmm. I mean, that seems like you're
answering a much bigger question.
Oh yeah, yeah. Which was something like,
how do you discern God's will for your life?
Or how Yeah.
Basically. Yeah.
So I mean, that's a really big question.
But what I love, and I, how I think that applies to
what we're talking about is, you know, if somebody says,
I want to be an influencer,
like in today's world with, you know, Mr.
Beast and all these people, it's like, man, I want
to make a living just making YouTube videos.
Like that's okay. Um,
but do you have anything
that others want to be influenced to buy?
Yeah. Right. Like, just the idea of just being an influencer
isn't really big enough to make someone an influencer.
Yeah. And so I love how you were just kinda
walking people through Okay.
If, if you're gonna do something, like
what do you enjoy doing?
And then, and I kind of made the joke, like, I'm,
I really enjoy fishing.
And then like somewhere in there was number two
or number three is like, are you good at it?
Yeah. You know, and just, well, I'm actually not as good
of a fisherman as I wanna be.
And you said, well, you should just do a YouTube show.
I'm like, I don't know that I'm gonna be able
to help people be a better fisherman.
I just like to fish myself.
But I, but I appreciate that,
like, helping people understand.
And what I heard in that is, if you're gonna influence
people, um,
or if you want to, you need to actually take an inventory.
Like one, what do you enjoy doing?
'cause it needs to be something you enjoy doing.
But then do you have some value to add to others
that others might seek out?
And uh, I think a lot of times
we can get excited about ideas
but might, it might just not be our wheelhouse.
Yeah. Um, clearly you found yourself
and, uh, you guys are doing that.
Let me ask you this. So with the influence
that you've gained, um,
with influence comes responsibility Mm-Hmm.
And so can you just talk about that a little bit for you?
How that kinda gets played out in
your life and how you handle that?
Uh, there have been numerous times,
especially over the last few years,
there's just been a lot of stuff.
I think social media has made us more aware
of stuff that's going on.
Yeah. In the country or just in the world in general.
I think that's part, we think things are
really, really bad and they are.
Um, but I, I think, I think we know more about it
'cause we have access to it within seconds.
Right. Like, that's a little different.
Um, and I, I find often that people expect anybody
with some sort of influence
to have some sort of stance on things. Right.
Yeah. And it's, it's, it's hard
because it's like you could mean, well, you know, let's just
for the sake of this, you know, uh, example here,
there's typically like two
Sides. Careful. We're not gonna
edit this out. Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
There's typically, you know,
there's an issue and there's two sides.
Yeah. And you may be leaning more towards one side.
I'll be careful not to use directions.
'cause that also confuses people.
You start saying left and right, confuse people.
Um, you're on one side
and you're trying to actually speak in their favor.
If you don't say something just right.
The people who you are actually in agreement
with will still take what you say and blow outta proportion.
Yeah. Um, but I mean,
in Proverbs it says even a fool is considered wise wise is
fee remain silent, basically.
Yeah. Like, it's kind of crazy.
And so I've, I've learned
I don't have to have an answer for everything.
Yeah. Because it's kind of weird.
I don't, the term influencer has like a negative in like a
cheesy connotation in some ways.
But I also take it rather, I, I it's an honor
to be considered that to some people,
but it also can be a heavy burden to wear
if you don't just like, think about what you say.
And my whole goal always, I mean, I never wanna say this
to people, but people want to talk smack on the internet.
And I'm like, you would never ever say that to my face.
Right. It doesn't matter that I'm
six four burly with a beard.
That doesn't matter. I just don't think
people act real big and
Tough. See more boy scout than
musicians. See
People act big and tough behind a camera.
'cause they're not saying anything to anybody's face. Right.
I think, think of plenty of times I've been ticked to no end
or disliked something somebody said.
And I, I can sit back after the fact
and be like, I never would've said anything to that person.
In person, in person. Yeah.
I never would've said those things. And so I try to just
be like a voice of reason.
And that's something I regularly do is I just try
to call people to hire standards.
It's like, we're not, we're not here to prove a point.
We're here to love people
and we're here to point people to Jesus.
And if all you're doing in this comment is
to prove your point, you're not, you're,
you're not accomplishing anything.
You know, like in Corinthians it says, if I have love
or if I'm like, if I, I, if I speak in the, the tongues
of man, but I don't have love,
I'm just a noisy clashing symbol.
Right. And it's like,
And drummers are the worst.
Just kidding. Am I right? Just kidding. I got a drummer.
Am I right? I'm kidding. We got a drummer in here.
Just kidding. Mind. Just kidding. Just kidding.
Oh man. Uh, let's see.
Where, how do you recover from that? Um,
Look at the outline. Yeah.
No, I do know. You know what?
No, I wanna, I wanna point this out, uh,
because this is not, that's,
that's a good leadership nugget in general.
Yeah. I mean, whether you're influencing people online
or you oversee a team of three people, um, there's a lot
of wisdom sometimes in just keeping your mouth closed.
Mm-Hmm. And, uh, I, I, I have, um, zero
times in my leadership walk where I thought, man,
I'm really glad I gave it to that person.
Yeah, absolutely. It just, it just doesn.
It just doesn't happen. It doesn't even
If you win. Right?
Yeah. Yeah. So, um, yeah, that's great man.
That's with, with influence comes great
responsibility. And I think that's a good one.
Realize it's, uh, the Spider-Man wisdom.
That's what I say. There you go.
It's Uncle Ben that's with Great Power Comes great
Responsibility's. Uncle Ben or Aunt May
that said that.
I thought it was Uncle Ben.
So I've said that a lot of times. That's,
It's Probably funny, but, but it's,
I think it's biblical also
to whom much has be given much will be required.
That that's true. There you go.
So Uncle Ben quote the Bible, that's,
that's where they got, that's where they got it.
There is a man, uh, an artist, quite famous artist
by the name of Stephen Curtis Chapman
that actually commented on one of your posts.
What was that post about? And then what was his comment?
And did, did it make you happy or did it make you sad?
It made me very happy. There it is.
Look, we got it up on the screen right now. Yes.
Um, I, I grew up Episcopalian.
Okay. And I, I say this 'cause I was one, I basically
A lot of, lot of rock and roll music
and Episcopalian. Exactly.
Yep. Yep. Um, big pipe organs. Yeah.
Um, it, it, it's like lazy Catholicism.
It is very reverent in the way that I like know Catholicism
to be, but they take away all the extra stuff.
So there's no like confession. I
Would like to announce that Hope in real life does not
necessarily support the comments of our guests on the show.
I'll say, from my experience, from my experience,
Please leave a comment at worship tutorials on Instagram.
But it was, it was very similar.
Um, and so at the, at at the time in our, my family's life
where we were kind of figuring out like there was
something more we were missing.
Yeah. Um, we started listening to Christian music
and my dad was listening to it
and like, I wasn't able to listen
to like, the stuff on the radio.
'cause it wasn't bleeped when you buy the cd. Right.
Um, and my dad was like, able to act, that was
before you could look up the lyrics, you know, like you had
to like buy the CD to do it
before the internet, which it makes me feel very old saying
that it's, I'm dating myself, I suppose.
Um, but we started listening to Stephen Kirsch Chapman.
And so he is like one of the big influences just for me
and my desire to like, play music in my love of music.
Um, and I had gotten a new guitar
and I was just messing around for whatever reason that song
that morning in the gym hit me.
And, uh, it's, it's Speechless by Steven Curtis Chapman.
And so I just recorded a little video
and I wrote the, I posted it
and I wrote a little comment, um,
or I wrote a caption about it and I went back
and I edited like 10 minutes later
and I was like, Stephen k Chapman's not gonna see this if I
tag him, but whatever.
I'll just like tag him and I'll say, if you happen
to see this, yeah.
Just know that like how big of an impact, you know,
musically, like just, that's cool.
But like how he was like the first person
that helped me understand how to be a worship leader,
which was, which may be weird to some people
and we could unpack that and be here all day.
But basically just the way he led a song
with such conviction really helped me kind of like,
I remember being in high school being, whoa, I'm not,
so I tagged him and I gave a little spit
and I don't know how he happened to see that notification.
I'm sure he gets tagged in people's terrible covers
of his songs all the time.
Right. So I don't know how, I don't know.
But, um, yes, he saw my comment
and as I mentioned, I I was deceased
to use the Gen Z jargon, so
I was just c Got it.
Okay. At first I was like, wait, what? Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah.
I found I have high schoolers. Yeah.
Um, I
Get it. So I was, I was
beside myself.
Like it was, it was, uh, overwhelming.
Uh, and it was, it was very cool to, to see that he,
and it was very, very kind.
He don't, he doesn't need to do that. Right.
Um, he's a busy man, you know, loads of followers
and the fact that he, I don't know if he actually
watched, but, you know,
Funny, funny story.
So, uh, funny to me, I was at this many, many, many,
many moons ago, um, decade, literally decades ago.
I was at this Worship leader conference
and, um, they had these smaller breakouts
and there was a, a worship leader there that I've,
that deeply influenced me as a worship leader
by the name of Matt Redmond.
Mm. And, uh, Matt was leading this breakout
and it was on songwriting.
And he, uh, he said, man, he, he kind
of got off on a tangent as Matt does.
And, uh, he was telling about how he has people come up
to him regularly with like, demos, you know,
back then it was demos right.
On a cassette. And he said people would come up to him
and uh, and give him these demo tapes.
And it would be so hard because they would say things
to him like, I believe God gave me this song
and I want to give it to you.
And he said, it's all you know, in his accent. Right.
It's like, it's all I could do,
but I won't even, I'm not gonna attempt his accent,
but it is like, it's all I could do to tell them,
if God gave you that, it's only
because he doesn't want it anymore.
It's not because it's,
I was, I was trying to decipher where this was going.
Yeah. I kind of felt that was coming. I,
I thought that's, it's only
because the Lord doesn't want to have it anymore.
That was his. Uh, so I thought that's, that's good.
He's a truth teller. We
gotta be the, we gotta tell the truth. So
That's leaders. Leaders
define reality.
Leaders define reality. Hey.
Alright, well on that one then, uh,
you talk about leadership principles in a lot of your, your,
uh, a lot of your clips.
In your opinion, what's the most important
quality a leader can have?
I think, I think it's probably obvious
and probably the cliche answer,
but I think it's humility really.
Um, and being like even though you're trying
to teach people, you still need to be teachable yourself.
Yeah. Um, and whether
that's being taught from those you're leading
or just in general always getting better.
Um, because I don't think people wanna follow somebody
who seems like they know all the answers.
Yeah. That doesn't, you know, it's, you can't resonate
with somebody who, 'cause I remember thinking
that it's like, why did I, why I can't resonate
with somebody who I feel like knows everything.
Right. When you see that they're a person too,
they're trying to learn you like, you feel more compelled
to wanna follow and, you know, go after them or go
after the same vision with them.
Um, and so, yeah. I mean, I think it's the answer.
A lot of people probably give,
but leading people humbly
is probably the best thing you can do.
Yeah. And I, I'll tell you, IBI see that in your life.
I mean, you're, you're a talented guy, gifted guy,
influence over here through worship tutorials.
Um, you know, I would say at the, you know, at the top,
near the top of your game of what it is
that you do on a stage with a guitar
and leading worship, it would be easy for you to not be.
And I, and you know, in the years that I've known you, I've,
I've always been impressed that I've never gotten this sense
of better than I deserve this No prima donna
electric guitar, you know, EG one vibe
that you normally get from,
Well, RET knows I always want stereo, but that's about it.
Need a stereo mix. Need a stereo mix.
Um, but, but, but if humility is the most important,
and it seems like to me that you represent that well,
how do you stay grounded given the success
that you've had in what it is that you do?
We talked earlier about like, why, why do I feel called
to do this this way as opposed to being at like a,
a large church as a worship leader or something.
Um, one thing is, and I've heard someone else say this and
because I'm, I don't know what, but I guess having a dad
or having a dad, well, having a dad too,
but becoming a dad, having a kid Yeah.
Really like softens your heart in weird ways. Yeah.
But I think one thing is my kid does not care.
Like, he doesn't care about
how many views a video does or doesn't get.
He doesn't, he's he'll be four in a couple months.
Um, he doesn't care if we're making lots of money or none.
Yeah. And there's something about one reason why it's kind
of cool to do things the way I do is
I don't really get direct feedback about how it's going.
And so I just went to like a big music
conference convention thing called Nam.
It has something to do with, I don't remember what it stands
for, but basically a bunch of,
I think it's North American missions,
North American music merchants, I think. Oh,
Okay. Fair.
Remember Something like that. But it has something
to do with like, music equipment.
And we, people know me there, but I go there once a year
and, um, people see like, oh, I love the channel.
You know, I've seen your videos. That kind of thing.
Um, and it's, it's like, it's kind of cool 'cause I go home
and I could just write, done a video up in my studio
upstairs and think it was awesome.
Right. And my kid comes running in, you know, sighted
to see me at the end of the day, you knocks
over my camera or whatever.
It's, you know, and like yeah. He, all he cares about is me.
Yeah. Like, he doesn't care about any
of those other things that I do.
Um, I have lots of guitars.
I mean, he thinks they're cool, but
he doesn't care about those.
Um, and I think one thing is just like, what,
that's what's most important
to me is my wife and, and my son.
Yeah. Um, and providing for them and,
and us walking in step.
And I think it's, it's an interesting thing
to be on the internet because I don't
directly get that feedback.
And I think that's helpful.
It's also hard to be by yourself at times.
'cause I work by myself now.
My partner Brian actually moved to Alabama.
So like, I don't, I don't see him all that often.
Um, and I think that's, that's actually helpful in a way.
So being online can be depressing.
And I've seen people talk about that.
It can be very hard to you,
you feel like you gotta keep up this persona,
but I think that's what wears you out also. Yeah.
Yeah. That's great, man. I mean,
and that's whether you're online with millions
or you're in front of a congregation of thousands
or leading a company, leading an organization, a department.
Uh, I, the leaders that I have seen,
and I'll just use the word
burnout, but I don't mean burnout.
I mean like, you know, something toxic happens
because of, you know, overtime, you know,
you take small steps in a certain direction
and man, how the heck did I get here?
Yeah. And, uh, man, I'm telling you, nine outta 10 times,
it seems like somewhere along the way someone
forgot about the people that were in their life
that were the most close to him,
whose voices should matter the most.
And then we start buying into
what we believe the masses are saying.
The reality is the masses don't know us. Yeah.
It's easy to come behind a microphone Yeah.
And pretend to be somebody else. And so that's great.
That's great feedback. I appreciate that. Yeah.
Um, if somebody out here is listening
and they are thinking about starting a business
or they want to gain influence,
what advice would you give to 'em outta the gate?
Uh, well we, our situation
with a business is not like most, I think.
So I can't speak directly to that.
It was a, it was a long play.
Um, but I think that's one thing too is be prepared
to put a lot of time and energy into it.
And with not a lot of return at the beginning.
Um, and to, to, I think a lot
of people see the hustle, the glorified hustle.
And it's like, I was working six, seven days a week.
I didn't really, like, I took time off on a day,
but it wasn't like I took whole days off.
Right. Like, I was in my room at night.
Um, you know, my wife and I first got married.
I was upstairs in our,
my little office studio space working, prepping for trying
to get stuff ready so we could make the most
of our time on Fridays and Yeah.
Um, you know, it seemed like normal.
'cause some people think, well, Sunday's church
and then you work Monday through Friday.
But it's like, well, yeah, that equated
to working six days a week.
Um, and I didn't work anywhere near as much as people,
but it's gonna take, you know, my wife, I had to kind
of get, tell her at, you know, and get her on board
and say, this is what I feel like I'm supposed to do.
The return isn't gonna be seen for a while.
And when I brought home like $300,
she was like, huh, that's cool.
Brought home a thousand. She's like, whoa.
And we're like, so I mean, like
that took, it took a lot of time.
I mean, I've been at it since 2013
and it wasn't until like 2021
that I stepped into it full time.
Um, and it takes a lot of work and it can be scary. Yeah.
Um, but it's just, I think it's just,
you've gotta be consistent
and don't, if you can pace yourself,
you're gonna last longer.
Right. Um, but if you're just, you know, the,
I guess it depends on the industry and all too,
but I mean, that's just pacing yourself and being consistent
and getting your your spouse on board,
any support you can get is very important. Yeah.
Um, so what I'm hearing from you is
know it's gonna take work.
Yeah. Be ready to put in the work.
But what I heard in our time together also is start Mm-Hmm.
Like, you gotta start, like, you just gotta start. Just do
It. Just
Do it. Yeah. Just do it. I said, I've
got some friends
that work in the, uh, in the entrepreneurship space
and the startup space,
and they talk about sometimes you gotta ship the ugly baby.
Like, it's not ready. You don't want people to see it.
Not so I you gotta start.
But the third that, that really jumps out to me about you,
what you guys are doing is you need to be adding value.
Mm-Hmm. And, uh, there is a difference in trying
to build an empire versus trying
to add value to other people's lives.
Mm-Hmm. And so I'm hearing you talk a lot about the value
that you actually do look to bring to those
that are engaging what it is that you do.
Yeah. Bradford, I appreciate your time.
I got one more question for you. Absolutely.
And then I think we've got a question
that's coming in from the outside as well,
but my question for you is, you know,
this is hope in real life, right?
We wanna bring hope, uh, to the everyday moments of,
of everyone's lives.
I'd love to hear from you, what are you hopeful for, uh,
in the life of worship tutorials over the next
2, 3, 5 years?
We are, because we're now separated
Other than now, and all these listeners have heard you're
clearly gonna surpass a million at this point.
Well that, that's, they're gonna jump over and
Subscribe. I'm, I'm hoping. So
What's Next? Please like, and
subscribe and be notified
and I'll let YouTube jargon.
Um, we're one thing that this separation,
I guess restructuring, I know separation is a weird way
to call it, but like now that this restructuring is, is kind
of like been forced upon us.
We're, we're really dialing in our methods
because it's not easy to work when you're not sure
where stuff is when we're together.
I was always at his, his house
and it was just like we did stuff together.
It was very efficient. Um, so we're looking forward
to restructuring 'cause we have to,
but also to kind of just like add more of a team behind us
to help us keep going.
Um, yeah. And just be more impactful, um,
because I mean, it'd be great to, to make a million dollars.
Absolutely. Who would, would not want that. Right.
But we feel very passionate, like we've talked about,
just about helping people, um,
and adding value and just doing that.
So we're hoping to be able to do that.
One big thing, I'm, I'm wanting to work on a guitar course,
um, and I think there's lots of courses,
but you know, you can't, you know, you go on YouTube
and type a guitar, you're gonna find millions of videos.
But I want to add a, do a course
that helps worship guitar specifically.
There's no like, have
to do it this way, have to do it that way.
But there's still techniques
that I think people don't really
understand and they want help with.
And so if we do something very focused on that, um,
I'm hoping to be able to help people in that way
and, um, just continue to help people be better.
Awesome. Well, Brad Freeman, thank you
so much for your time.
My pleasure. Thank you for what it is. My pleasure.
That you do. It's been great to hang out you again.
Your beard's looking great. Thank you. I applaud you.
You didn't bring any flannel in the studio
today, but No, I did not.
But man, so good to, to spend the time with you.
Thank you to our listeners for tuning in with us.
Uh, make sure that you like, subscribe, share with others
who, you know, could use a little bit more hope in the
everyday moments of their life.
And we look forward to seeing you back next week
with episode 14.
Thanks for tuning into this episode
of The Hope in Real Life podcast.
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