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Welcome to Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada’s podcast series that explores the freshest ideas in agriculture and food. Each episode explores a single topic in depth—digging deep into new practices, innovative ideas, and their impacts on the industry. Learn about Canada’s agricultural sector from the people making the breakthroughs and knocking down the barriers! Farmers and foodies, scientists and leaders, and anyone with an eye on the future of the sector—this podcast is for you!
Chris White: The innovation was the fact that we now have an office. So we're not just saying that we want to be here. We're actually demonstrating that we want to be here. It's a great signal to industry the government has listened to us because we have said to government, this is an important part of the world for us and for our commodities. And while we appreciate the work that takes place at the embassies, we think you need to have a larger footprint. And this is a very tangible, example of that. And what we are looking at potentially is, can you use this as a template in other markets that are growing.
Kirk: That’s Chris White, president of the Canadian Meat Council speaking about Canada’s first-ever Indo-Pacific Agriculture and Agri-Food Office in Manila, Philippines.
Marie-France: And the plans for that new office had been in the works for many years. The goal to diversify our markets is not a new thing. As Chris said, industry has been advocating for this.
Kirk: And if we look at our exports from a 30,000 foot view, we see why the industry has been asking for it. Last year, for the first time in our history, Canadian agriculture and food exports topped $100 billion doll=ars.
Marie-France: And with our two largest customers accounting for almost three-quarters of our ag and food exports – Canada has been running the risk of having all our eggs in one basket, so to speak.
Kirk: We often hear the phrase 'diversifying or opening new markets', but what does it really take to break into new countries or expand in others in the Indo-Pacific? Today, we’re going to explore what that all involves.
Marie-France: And to help us understand what’s involved, we’re speaking to two experts who are at the forefront of expanding and diversifying Canadian agricultural trade.
Kirk: Our guests are Chris White from the Canadian Meat Council, and Diedrah Kelly, Executive Director of the new Indo-Pacific Agriculture and Agri-Food Office.
Marie-France Welcome to the First Sixteen, a podcast about innovators and innovation in Canadian agriculture. I am your co-host Marie-France Gagnon.
Kirk: And I am your other co-host Kirk Finken.
Maire-France: Kirk, before we jump into my conversation with Diedrah, I wanted to give a quick snapshot of the Indo-Pacific region. We are not talking small potatoes here. This area includes 40 economies, over four billion people, and $47 trillion in economic activity. It’s the world’s fastest-growing region and home to 11 or Canada’s top 20 trading partners.
Kirk: It’s huge potatoes, huge commodities, you know out wheat, our oilseeds, our beef, our pork and big opportunities for packaged foods and beverages. So let’s hear from somebody in the middle of it all.
Marie-France: Diedrah, welcome to the First 16. So can you tell me what’s unique about this Indo-Pacific Agriculture and Agri-Food Office?
Diedrah: Thank you for that question. I think there are a few characteristics that are unique about the Indo-Pacific Agriculture and Agri-Food Office, which we tend to call IPAAO -- because in government we do like acronyms. I think what's interesting is how the office originated, and that is from Canada's Indo-Pacific Strategy. So there was a recognition by the government that the Indo-Pacific region is a crucial part of the world to Canada's ongoing prosperity and security. The industry said, listen, agriculture is important to Canada. Our agricultural exports to this part of the world are important, and we need to have more support by the government in terms of getting the story of Canadian agriculture out in terms of assisting with our regulatory relationships and heightening the Canada brand.
Now, in terms of the footprint, what is unique is that we consist of both Canadian Food Inspection Agency technical experts and Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada market development and market access officers. So we're double hatted. The team is meant to be a mobile team of technical experts and trade commissioners that are agile and keen to explore opportunities around the Indo-Pacific region, as well as to strengthen regulatory cooperation with counterparts and troubleshoot as issues arise, with a regional responsibility. So that would be something unique in terms of the mandate. It's the only office that has regional responsibility.
Marie-France: And why did we choose Manila for the location?
Diedrah: The Philippines is strategically located. It's very easy to access the other countries for which we are responsible for in Southeast Asia and beyond. It is well positioned to be a staging area for food and beverage processors seeking to penetrate this part of the world, and it's also a strategic staging area for us to be able to support all of the markets in the region.
Marie-France: You mentioned CFIA is co-located with AAFC in Manila. How does that help?
Diedrah: There are clear advantages to having AAFC and CFIA co-located. It provides a better understanding of the challenges and opportunities that the other faces. And I'll give you an example. In the region, there are significant pork exports, but there is not pork access in each of the countries in Southeast Asia or the broader Indo-Pacific. So from a market development perspective, the goal would be to support the pork industry and the pork exporters that are seeking to gain access to those markets, or to sustain their access to those markets. On the regulatory side, CFIA has finite resources, just like all government departments do, and as the technical experts, they would be responsible for negotiating and liaising with their counterparts on those market access issues to show the robustness of Canada's food safety systems, to explain Canada's export requirements for Canadian exporters, so that if a company is looking to import a product like pork from Canada, they could be assured of our food safety and the quality of the items that that country would be receiving.
And so if you have the regulators that are being faced with multiple requests to support market access, being co-located with their counterparts that are doing market development work and being able to have those conversations to say, listen, we know you're very busy, but I have, you know, 20 exporters that are seeking access into these five countries. Whereas on this particular issue, you have one company that is seeking to export, and the value of that particular export is considerably less. And helping them understand why pork verses this other item, you know, should be prioritized, those can be very useful exchanges
Marie-France: I imagine your job is rather unique, so give me some insights, what are your days like?
Diedrah: No two days are alike, really, because of the fact that we are an asset for the region. So if I would pick an example of the type of days that we have. If there is a company that is looking to invest in value-added processing then we would go out and we would have meetings with those potential investors. Similarly, if there are companies that we are aware of that are going to be expanding their product line or they're interested in new innovations, then we would be meeting with those companies to provide them with information on Canadian agriculture and agrifood, to talk about the innovations that are taking place, to give them information on companies that are already active in supplying in their regions, and companies that we can connect them with in Canada that can meet their needs.
I would have meetings with government counterparts, and those government counterparts would either be regulators or they would be policymakers or legislators, and we would be talking about different market access issues. So, for example, if they were going to be putting up non-tariff barriers on agricultural products, maybe just for Canada, maybe for a set of countries. We would be trying to explain how that wouldn't be beneficial to them, or to their populations, how it would not be beneficial to food security.
And then usually the end of the day would be topped off with an event to highlight the Canada Brand. So we would work with organizations like Canada Beef and Canada Pork and the Canada Lobster Council, the whole brand of partners that are active in the region. For example, most recently I was in Taiwan and we organized an event and it was for importers of agriculture and agrifood products. So beef and pork and, uh, wild rice. And we had also included companies that are involved in making snack foods, and in Taiwan they're very conscious of health and nutrition. So we made sure we had partnered with the private sector and the industry associations to be able to source locally those Canadian products. We worked with a chef at the venue to put together a menu that would highlight those Canadian ingredients. And then, uh, we gave the opportunity to those importers and, uh, decision makers from the hospitality industry to try Canadian food and to give them, uh, you know, that opportunity to experience firsthand the quality and the taste that we were describing. Sometimes it's new ingredients, sometimes it's ingredients they're familiar with. But sourced Canadian, uh, and that's how the day goes.
Marei-France: Very interesting and a very long day. When I was listening, I was thinking it's kind of a matchmaking activity that you do on the day-to-day.
Diedrah: I like that, we’ll say that, we are matchmakers for Canadian agriculture. Kind of like a dating show. So maybe that's what we can do. I'll start new formats for the meetings and do 30 second introductions. Like, uh, speed dating. It's actually not a bad idea. I'll let you know if it works out.
Marie-France: Haha. So if I was one of those potential matches and you are talking about this market, tell me what’s the pitch for Canadian companies in the region?
Diedrah: So the Indo-Pacific is the fastest growing economic region in the world, and it is Canada's largest regional export market. If we look at agriculture and agrifood exports, specifically last year so in 2024, Canada exported $22 billion worth of agriculture and agri-food products to the Indo-Pacific region. That represents about a quarter of our overall agriculture and agrifood exports. So it's an important part of the world and a key destination already for agriculture exports. But there is significant potential to grow that because of the changing demographics and the population. They are looking for high quality nutrient rich foods. They would like more grains and more pulses and more meats and more processed items.
And at the same time, while you have this growing middle class, there are over 1 billion people in the region who suffer from severe or moderate levels of food or nutritional insecurity. And so there's opportunities to share knowledge and technical exchange, both at the industry level and at the government level, to help them adopt more innovative practices to either reduce food waste or adopt new crop practices. And again it’s not threatening to Canadian agriculture it’s to help alleviate the suffering and insecurities that exist.
Marie-France: So can you tell me a little more about the food insecurity part?
Diedrah: You know, when you see that light bulb moment take place. So when you're at a meeting and whether it's a company talking about how their big challenge is to provide more nutritious food to their populations, but that their populations, you know, are price sensitive. And then when you're able to say, aha, but, you know, Canada can be part of that success story. And we do have ways to provide ingredients that can fortify those less expensive food items like noodles or rice, so that it's all segments of your population that is getting healthy, nutritious food. You know that those are the feel good moments.
Marie-France: I like that, that sounds very fulfilling. Are there any other examples of opportunities you see in the market?
Diedrah: There are opportunities to increase beef exports, to increase pork exports, to increase halal certified products. We do have halal certifiers in Canada that are recognized by Muslim majority countries in the region like Indonesia, like Malaysia. So we can meet the import requirements of those countries. And there are, again the most populous countries in the world. And so the scalable market opportunities that exist for Canadian companies and Canadian exporters are tremendous. Right now we're seeing tremendous opportunities in pet food. So saying to both the plant and animal associations and exporters, listen, don't only think of, you know, traditional applications but also look at potential opportunities in pet food, this particular product is just exploding all over the region.
Marie-France: And what are some challenges you have come across in the region so far?
Diedrah: What I have found surprising is that in Canada, we tend to assume that everyone is aware of the quality of Canadian agriculture, that everybody knows that Canadian crops, that Canadian meat are the best in the world, and that the crops follow sustainable practices, that the food safety is science based and that food will be nutritious and it will be safe when it's received. Surprisingly, Canadian agriculture is not well-known in many markets we are discovering. When we're talking about crops, these markets don't necessarily realize that much of the wheat that they're using in their flour milling is Canadian. So there's a lot of work that has to be done on brand awareness.
Marei-France: You know, I heard you were involved in an interesting initiative to increase that awareness of Canadian farmers. Can you tell me about the trip to Saskatchewan?
Diedrah: So in addition to the Team Canada trade missions and the high volume of activity that we have seen coming into the Indo-Pacific region, there's also been a lot of effort made to bring potential buyers into Canada to see firsthand for themselves the value of Canadian agriculture, because it's something that you don't truly appreciate until you see it firsthand. And so, in terms of the activities that I've been fortunate enough to participate in with the government of Saskatchewan, is that every year they organize what they call an Asia to Saskatchewan visit, where they bring buyers from the region to Saskatchewan to visit the farms, to look at value-added processing for companies that are packaging and exporting goods like flaxseed and oats and wheat.
They have an opportunity to see the farms and for people that have never been to Saskatchewan before, you know, it blows their mind, we talked about the blue skies and the golden sheafs of wheat that go on for miles and the efficiency of the sorting facilities and the innovation and technology that exists at the packing facilities and the infrastructure that exists to get their items by rail, you know, directly from the facilities to the port. So that makes a big impression when they can see it firsthand.
Marie-France: Kirk, we live in a world full of virtual meetings but I imagine those really tangible experiences on the ground can be really powerful when working on trade relationships.
Kirk: Exactly. And when I talked to Chris White he also emphasized just how crucial Canada’s physical presence is in these markets. Chris is the President and CEO of the Canadian Meat Council. He speaks for a sector that is a major employer and exporter– over 60,000 jobs and $10 billion in exports. He is in the Indo-Pacific region frequently. I asked him to describe his role when it comes to helping a company bring their products to a new market.
Chris: The trade association that I represent is the Canadian Meat Council so our companies are both on the beef and the pork side. Usually what will happen is the companies themselves will make a business decision and they will send their people out. They will make an assessment in terms of what product are they looking to sell? Where is a market that they can get that product to relatively quickly? Where do they think there's growth potential and all of those things?
What they're looking for the trade association to do is to make sure that there are no issues from a market access perspective, you know, that the government is challenged with or that they're not aware of. So essentially, we're the interlocutor for these companies in many respects. At the same time, from a government perspective, we go back to the companies to say the government is looking at, you know, having either a bigger presence in this country, having more trade commissioners, whatever that may look like. Is that anything of interest to you? Because if so, let me connect you with our high commissioner or our embassy or the Trade commissioners. So essentially, you're sort of brokering those two parties to come together. We're not the subject matter experts, the Government of Canada is. We're not the business experts. That's what the companies are there for. But our job is to make sure that everybody understands what the other critical actor is doing so that they can make an informed decision and conversely, if the government is saying we think there's a lot of opportunity in country X and then we test that with our companies, we can then go back to the government and say, we understand why you think that, but here are the reasons why at this time, it's not as attractive for industry as you might think. So, you know, my job is as much as possible to give people that sort of perspective from both sides. I hear what you’re saying but here’s what they’re saying and here is where they intersect.
Kirk: So speaking about the Indo-Pacific Agriculture and Agri-Food Office, what is it that you think is unique about the offering from the government?
Chris White: The fact that there is an offering by the government, right. I think it's a terrific signal. One of the really interesting things that we see when we travel is how dynamic many other governments are and the investments that they make in other markets. And it's not sufficient to just go and do and sit at a trade show once or twice a year, or have a flying visit in and then you're out. So the investment of the government and having somebody of Diedrah Kelly's calibre leading the office, it's a really, really positive signal for industry. And I think certainly in talking to people within the industry, what they're hoping is that this becomes a bit of a not just a placeholder, but they can use it as a bit of a template for other markets where we want to be more competitive particularly when you look at the EU as an example.
Kirk: That makes total sense. So when you are traveling around the region what do you see as the Canadian advantage?
Chris White: I would say a couple of things. One is Canada -- not just with respect to red meat, but in, you know, essentially any commodity that we export --we're a very reliable trading partner. The second thing and the one I always stress particularly when I'm in in Asia, is how we benefit from the fact that we work so closely with CFIA. So any product that we sell, not only is it a high quality product, but it is underpinned by world class science. And for most jurisdictions, as you would appreciate, food safety is such a critical issue that if you're importing a Canadian product, of all the things you have to worry about, food safety is not one of them compared to some of the other places that they might import from. And thirdly, I would say that it's just we're an easy country on balance, to trade with. Right? We want it to be fair trade. You know, we're not looking to gouge people. We're looking to get the product there on time. We are looking to make sure there's no, you know, sloppy mistakes so that you can get it into the port and you can clear it out of the port as quickly as possible. It’s the world class science to my mind. Without it, it would be much more difficult for the Canadian industry to sell the volume of product that it does.
Kirk Finken: Back to that presence you were talking about. Not just being at the trade show. How does the Indo Pacific Agriculture and Agri-food office contribute to it?
Chris White Well, I mean, you know, tangibly, it's the line of sight, right? So I think with any trade association that is, is outward facing, you are always challenged to know what's taking place in real time in other markets. So to have the Indo-Pacific Office focus on agricultural issues and, you know, it's invaluable from that perspective. But the other issue is that they're building up a network of other agricultural experts or other trade people within the region. So, you know, they may come and talk to you, Kirk, about one issue, but if you're having a conversation about one issue, it often will then, you know, bleed into another issue that might be relevant to what we're doing. But if you're not having those conversations, then you don't know what's taking place. Having people on the ground in the region, building up the confidence, building up the trust, building up the network. But building up that line of sight again is invaluable because it’s to show to that region of the world the investment and the commitment on the part of both the Canadian government and the Canadian industry. It's not enough to come in once or twice a year because our competitors are not doing that. They are on the ground in a sustained, uh, and that there's a presence. So we need to be present.
Kirk: What challenges do you see entering a market like this?
Chris White: I think the challenge, like any market, is it's going to be a business decision from the member companies. What product do they have? Where are they able to make the most money? Where are they prepared to invest, knowing that they're not necessarily going to make as much money today as they will, you know, five years from now. Because Canada hasn't been in that region of the world as much as others, those mature relationships, those are hard to penetrate as a new company. And you know, that market share isn't as readily available that you can then take. So it's quite a process to get market share, to manage it, to maintain it and then not to also be looking. What, uh, where else? You might, uh, take your product because, you know, uh, not a big surprise, but most companies, you know, are challenged because it's a very competitive global market. And, uh, you need to go where you can make the most money.
Kirk: I can see how that can be difficult to manage. And again it goes back to having people on the ground who can see that timing.
Chris White: I know from an industry perspective we have a number of companies that have been through Manila and have used the services of the Office. And obviously, you know, there's a high degree of professionalism at the Office, and they have found them to be quite agile as well. And in some of these markets, um, you know, you need to be as flexible as possible because you're trying to grow the relationships or it's not as mature a market for Canadian products. So you're trying to make people understand at a more, um, not basic in a negative way, but just as a starting point right. And it's hard for, uh, member companies who are just through for a couple of weeks to build those foundational pieces. But the advantage of the officers working at the Indo-Pacific Office is, you know, they can have those conversations with me in those meetings, but then they can do the follow up and the follow up and the follow up and build a layer upon that foundation so that when I do come back, you know, the second or third quarter, a lot of that level setting has already taken place.
I think the work that Diedrah and her team has done so far has been terrific. And I think certainly the support from Ag Canada has been great in international trade. And there was as you may recall, as you may know, an initial, um, I'm not sure what the right word is, not hesitancy, but no, not everybody could understand why are we opening this office? I think what's happened over the last 18, 24 months is there's been a really important clarity brought to how important it is to have people on a day-to-day basis solely focused on Canadian ag products in this region.
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Marie-France: So we got some great and valuable insights today. Diedrah highlighted how important it is to build strong, long-term relationships in the Indo-Pacific, and how being physically present is crucial to truly understanding the region. And Chris, on the other hand, reminded us how much work goes into opening a new market—it’s not just about showing up; it’s about having a consistent presence and building trust over time.
Kirk: Exactly. Going back to the relationship matchmaking thing, You have to put in the effort. And both Diedrah and Chris emphasized the need for Canada to be active in these regions, be there, do the work.
Marie-France: Thanks to both of them for sharing their insights on the challenges and the hard work involved in expanding Canada’s agricultural trade.
Kirk: Ya a big thanks to them. And as always, going to our motto, try something new.
Marie-France: Yeah, but make sure you have people on the ground, building trust, and gathering intel before you make that first sale.
Kirk: Great advice
Marie-France: Allons-y